Official BBR Tier List v5

[Z'zgashi]

Yep. Yoshi is not better than Ness Z. I'm just giving you a hard time too, Ryu.

/look at all that Ness bias.

Yoshi has much better results than Ness, in fact, he has better results than every Low and Low-Mid tier aside from sonic: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=284937

 

[ShadowLink84]

If verm can beat decent ICs with Ganon Fox can surely beat decent Sheiks.

Oh look.

=3

 

[Ishiey]

1. Solid as in?... What's Fox's second worst MU in S-A tier? And about the Japanese Fox vs ICs, I agree. It doesn't look that bad, but a lot of the bad MUs in Brawl are like that. If you don't mess up at all, you win; if you make the slightest mistake, you lose your stock. Imagine having to play every game of a tournament like that (I know this will never happen, but yeah), it's mentally taxing and will eventually take it's toll on the player.

2. http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=262480 Atomsk is ranked #5. This is a little bit out-of-date, but still. And I do agree, if Atomsk went all D3 he probably would've won, but he knows enough about playing Wolf and is awesome so did the cool thing to do by starting off with Wolf dittos

EDIT: At Chuee of course.

 

[Coney]

A pocket D3 isn't capable of beating Wolf.

this, essentially

i'm not sure if pocket pikas/sheiks can beat foxes, but pocket ddds DO NOT beat wolfs. by NO stretch.

 

[_Kain_]

Oh lord another one here we go...

lol, it means both of them are bad.
but the thing is Fox does better vs top/high tiers. aka the characters you're going to see often in tourney..

He does? Wolf does the same if not better in most MU's in high tier than Fox what are you talking about? He does better against Marth, Olimar, possibly Pika, ICs. Fox does better against possibly Wario (not even that much better) MK, DDD. The rest are the same sooo...what you talking about?

lol, Fox has beaten his hard counters before. KID's beaten Pikax2, Zeton's beaten Lain before.

Why do people ignore the fact that Lain didn't know the MU the first time they played? He lost, then in Losers bracket wrecked, and has wrecked him everytime since then? Please be more smart you seem like you just like to troll. KID beat Pikax2 ok cool? Was it in tourny? Pika isn't even a top PIka anymore he's been on the downside for a long time so cool story

Except that it does kinda matter LOL.
Mk is like sorta the most common tourney character. Having the best MU with MK in mid tier definitely means something. ..

Wolf does good against MK. All spacies do. Again you don't know what your talkin about, while Wolf doesn't do as good he still does good. I mean if Wolf was bad against MK, why were Atomsk, Anti, and me able to take games off M2K with him?

I don't think they're 70-30. I think the Japanese fox's are the best at fighting IC's from what I've seen, and they don't make it look that bad. ..

You could also argue that Japenese IC's aren't as good as American ones sooo...

Once again, people acting like pika, ic, and sheik are like 80-20 with Fox lmao.


You just have to learn the MUs. Though they all look like stressful MUs.


If verm can beat decent ICs with Ganon Fox can surely beat decent Sheiks. ..

The fact is they are that bad. i mean you like to say Wolf's are as bad...so why aren't Fox's? Not to mention your knowledge of both chars isn't good since...you haven't seen these matches played out? or play either char? kthxbye

Ok.
1. Kain only beat Atomsk because Atomsk goofed off during the set and went wolf game 1 then switched to MK after he had 2 stocked Kain.
2. Kain hasn't won regionals. A regional is something the size of SiiS4. I haven't seen Kain win a tournament that large.
3. I dumb
..

You are dumb, didn't Atomsk get top 8 with MK? Oh word I suck alot, not to mention I've beaten people who have placed high at MLG. Look dumb more

1. Uh, he has solid MUs with entire top tier minus ICs. Even if some of the people Fox beats don't entirely know the MU, Trevonte beating TKD is a good example that Fox vs MK is near even, even when the MK knows the MU.
2. Uh, Atomsk is good but not quite top 10 imo, maybe top 20, but even so Atomsk would've won had he stayed D3.

Still you don't acknowledge the fact while he does good against High tier he still loses MU's in them. Wario isn't that good for Fox, Marth, ICs, Pika, Diddy, arguably others where he loses.

 

[DMG]

When Fox can go even with MK, he can go even with anyone!

Don't question it. Watch your mana.

 

[Exceladon City]

I wasn't saying Fox shuts down anything. I was referring to the players themselves. If they can still go through and shut down (aka beat the rest of the characters they come across) 2-3 bad match-ups that need a secondary shouldn't really make much of a difference.

 

[DMG]

I wasn't saying Fox shuts down anything. I was referring to the players themselves. If they can still go through and shut down (aka beat the rest of the characters they come across) 2-3 bad match-ups that need a secondary shouldn't really make much of a difference.

If we are talking about the player, yes.

If we are talking about the character, no.

 

[Exceladon City]

If we are talking about the player, yes.

If we are talking about the character, no.

The first one.

 

[phi1ny3]

this, essentially

i'm not sure if pocket pikas/sheiks can beat foxes, but pocket ddds DO NOT beat wolfs. by NO stretch.

That's why vinnie used sheik LOL

 

[Coney]

also, just as an aside, how could anyone not consider atomsk top 10 in the country? honestly

it's prolly [in no particular order] m2k, ally, anti, dehf, atomsk, tkd, tyrant, adhd, gnes...um...

shippo

 

[DMG]

Which is fine, but you can't use that to better reflect on the character. Which is something people have been doing for a LONG time, whether it be Wolf or Fox lol

M2K Ally Gnes DEHF Lee Tyrant Anti/Atomsk/ADHD/maybe X/Esam/etc

 

[_Kadaj_]

TOP
S:

HIGH
A:

MIDDLE
B: /tie/

Some of what I think about where the placements should fall. I don't really know too much on the lower characters besides yoshi, luigi, shielda, ness, etc. being under these in some order. I also couldn't decide between Zss/lucario in terms of whose better so that's a bit of a tie.

 

[Deleted member]

2. Kain hasn't won regionals. A regional is something the size of SiiS4. I haven't seen Kain win a tournament that large.
3. I dumb

Brainshock Alpha http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=292410&highlight=Brainshock+Alpha

Seems big enough to be a regional to me.

 

[DMG]

Put Wario above Pika and Oli, and you got a deal.

 

[Coney]

kadaj, i'd say put lucario above zss just because he has players of higher influence, and more of them

btw is it really "smangin' them drawers?" i always thought it was "jaws"

 

[stingers]

rob is better than kirby lol

 

[MJG]

Atomsk is definitely top 10 in the nation.

Top 6 IMO

 

[_Kain_]

Every1 knows that Atomsk is top 10 for sure. Chuee just shows that he doesn't know much again by saying something dumb like that

 

[_Kadaj_]

DMG I can see maybe being over Oli but you really think he's better than Pika?

and yeah Coney lool

 

[Blacknight99923]

I don't think theres a significant viability difference between marth olimar pika and wario.

 

[Goldenadept]

I <3 you wolf mains but you're getting no where fast :l

what has DK/luigi done recently? i think wolf could at least rise above them, mostly from lack of results from either character but luigi is pretty booty.
i dont know much about DK's results but its nothing too steller right?

 

[MJG]

You are dumb, didn't Atomsk get top 8 with MK? Oh word I suck alot, not to mention I've beaten people who have placed high at MLG. Look dumb more

Brainshock Alpha http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=292410&highlight=Brainshock+Alpha

Seems big enough to be a regional to me.

Well...**** lol. Wolf can smd. It doesn't matter who beats me though since I am bad at this game


Served with Extra Salt




WE OUT

 

[Z'zgashi]

DMG I can see maybe being over Oli but you really think he's better than Pika?

and yeah Coney lool

Oli > Pika, so your argument is invalid

@Golden: DK actually places pretty well (although im not sure as of the last couple months) but Wolf > DK when it comes to results. Wolf is going balls out lately.

 

[_Kain_]

Dk's results have been solely on Will lately if I'm correct?

 

[Z'zgashi]

Cable does well.

 

[DMG]

DMG I can see maybe being over Oli but you really think he's better than Pika?

and yeah Coney lool

I don't think theres a significant viability difference between marth olimar pika and wario.

Marth and Wario are safer characters than Oli and Pika. I think Pika's range will always hold him back. Olimar I think he's not bad, but there are some traits of his involving attacks that people haven't abused fully imo. I also think his reliance on proper Pikmin formation (along with luck of the draw concerning Pikmin colors) is a noticeable negative for him.

 

[Chuee]

Oh lord another one here we go...



He does? Wolf does the same if not better in most MU's in high tier than Fox what are you talking about? He does better against Marth, Olimar, possibly Pika, ICs. Fox does better against possibly Wario (not even that much better) MK, DDD. The rest are the same sooo...what you talking about?
Falco and snake, Fox does better imo



Why do people ignore the fact that Lain didn't know the MU the first time they played? He lost, then in Losers bracket wrecked, and has wrecked him everytime since then? Please be more smart you seem like you just like to troll. KID beat Pikax2 ok cool? Was it in tourny? Pika isn't even a top PIka anymore he's been on the downside for a long time so cool story
Uh, how do you even know Lain didn't know the MU? Has wrecked him everytime since then?
lol last time I remembered that they played Fox v ICs it was a close game.



Wolf does good against MK. All spacies do. Again you don't know what your talkin about, while Wolf doesn't do as good he still does good. I mean if Wolf was bad against MK, why were Atomsk, Anti, and me able to take games off M2K with him?
Never said Wolf was bad against MK lol, I said Fox does better.




You could also argue that Japenese IC's aren't as good as American ones sooo...
Japanese ICs are tons better than american ones.





The fact is they are that bad. i mean you like to say Wolf's are as bad...so why aren't Fox's? Not to mention your knowledge of both chars isn't good since...you haven't seen these matches played out? or play either char? kthxbye
wut. both Fox's and Wolf's are bad.
My knowledge of both characters isn't good? I play both of them online lol, even though that doesn't mean anything. though stop acting like Im hating on wolf lmao. I think hes only 1 below fox.



You are dumb, didn't Atomsk get top 8 with MK? Oh word I suck alot, not to mention I've beaten people who have placed high at MLG. Look dumb more
lol, calm down bro.
You act like Im saying you're garbage or something lmao.




Still you don't acknowledge the fact while he does good against High tier he still loses MU's in them. Wario isn't that good for Fox, Marth, ICs, Pika, Diddy, arguably others where he loses.
He loses all of those, though imo they're slight disadvantage (not ICs and Pika)

also, just as an aside, how could anyone not consider atomsk top 10 in the country? honestly

it's prolly [in no particular order] m2k, ally, anti, dehf, atomsk, tkd, tyrant, adhd, gnes...um...

shippo

:/ Hes definetely up there, but I think its hard to get an accurate top 10.

Every1 knows that Atomsk is top 10 for sure. Chuee just shows that he doesn't know much again by saying something dumb like that

but he lost to wolf

 

[_Kain_]

Because I saw Lain wreck him with my own eyes at another tourny after that one...and then another one after. Fox vs IC's is bad. Arty even beat Zeton with his pocket ICs. And fox does better than Wolf at Falco? LOLWUT

 

[Chuee]

Because I saw Lain wreck him with my own eyes at another tourny after that one...and then another one after. Fox vs IC's is bad. Arty even beat Zeton with his pocket ICs. And fox does better than Wolf at Falco? LOLWUT

Kain showing his vast knowledge of Fox

 

[Blacknight99923]

Marth and Wario are safer characters than Oli and Pika. I think Pika's range will always hold him back. Olimar I think he's not bad, but there are some traits of his involving attacks that people haven't abused fully imo. I also think his reliance on proper Pikmin formation (along with luck of the draw concerning Pikmin colors) is a noticeable negative for him.

I do agree on this, but i don't think marth and wario are significantly better.

 

[_Kain_]

Kain showing his vast knowledge of Fox

I already explained it before a couple pages ago why I think Fox vs ICs is bad. All you have is that you play online with them...wow

 

[MJG]

Fox vs ICs is bad. I don't see how ICs would lose to fox regardless of if they knew the MU or not though.

@Kain: Zeton still won the set and I think that Fox does better than Wolf at the Falco MU (in my honest opinion).

 

[_Kain_]

Fox vs ICs is bad. I don't see how ICs would lose to fox regardless of if they knew the MU or not though.

@Kain: Zeton still won the set and I think that Fox does better than Wolf at the Falco MU (in my honest opinion).

Zeton won the set against his Falco and lost the game he CPed ICs. Also gtfo Wolf better

 

[DMG]

I do agree on this, but i don't think marth and wario are significantly better.

I think they are at least on par with Snake. I'd still have them in top tier tbh

 

[MJG]

Zeton won the set against his Falco and lost the game he CPed ICs. Also gtfo Wolf better

awooooooooooo

Fox vs ICs is bad. I don't see how ICs would lose to fox regardless of if they knew the MU or not though.

@Kain: Zeton still won the set and I think that Fox does better than Wolf at the Falco MU (in my honest opinion).

Oh word?

 

[infomon]

M2K Ally Gnes DEHF Lee Tyrant Anti/Atomsk/ADHD/maybe X/Esam/etc

lol

Espy gon hav a fit :D

 

[Chuee]

I already explained it before a couple pages ago why I think Fox vs ICs is bad. All you have is that you play online with them...wow

Not that lol. I was talking about the last part. How you acted like Fox doing better vs Falco was stupid.
though if it makes you feel better I watch Fox vids more than wolf :3

 

[Blacknight99923]

I don't think snake is "top tier" honestly, he has to many flaws one can exploit.

 

[DMG]

lol

Espy gon hav a fit :D

It's only cause he's been able to attend more larger tournaments recently than Espy. If Espy went to... WGF? and placed similar, I'd probably put him there too.

If he goes to Whobo and gets top 5ish, similar scenario.