• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

NJ/NY Rankings: New Rankings 9/25/12!!!

Inui

Inui

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Oct 30, 2005
Messages
22,230
Location
Ocean Grove, New Jersey
Dr.Brawl said:
Thank you for clearing that up I see what you mean. Pierce without a question is a horrible president, I would probably place him third on my list of worse presidents , but james buchanan basically let the country go to hell. He was like cool beans when the south succeeded from the union. He should have been like," **** this yo get the army were going to go down and wipe out any traitors ,". Any president that couldn't keep the union together honestly is worse than just moving forward a piece of legislation that started a small scale civil war.

As for the geography part i can now see what you meant by that, obviously it is correct without a shadow of doubt. However that would be filed under ideological differences between the two regions.
Click to expand...
Are you serious? You think the president had a lot of influence on keeping the union together and you think it was possible? Henry Clay and John Calhoun were the two people mostly responsible for keeping the union together for far longer than it would have otherwise, and Andrew Jackson used federal troops once to force South Carolina to stay in the union. Buchanan wasn't terrible; he was a victim of circumstance, much like George H. W. Bush, Herbert Hoover, Jimmy Carter, and other presidents that could have done very well in different eras.

"Buchanan assumed leadership [...] when an unprecedented wave of angry passion was sweeping over the nation. That he held the hostile sections in check during these revolutionary times was in itself a remarkable achievement. His weaknesses in the stormy years of his presidency were magnified by enraged partisans of the North and South. His many talents, which in a quieter era might have gained for him a place among the great presidents, were quickly overshadowed by the cataclysmic events of civil war and by the towering Abraham Lincoln."

What happened was the Republican party assumed a 3/4 majority in both houses of Congress and won the presidency. This meant they had the power to pass an amendment to the Constitution. South Carolina was the first state to secede when they realized a ban on slavery was imminent and what it would do to their economy. It would have created 3.5 million unemployed, uneducated citizens in the south on top of causing billions of dollars in investments to literally disappear into thin air. The south had no choice but to secede for their survival. It wasn't a matter of right and wrong; neither side was more right than the other.

The ideological difference only formed due to a geographical difference, and the Republican party formed to ride a wave of anti-slavery sentiment in the north in order to obtain power. That's the truth of the matter.
 
Atomsk_92

Atomsk_92

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 8, 2006
Messages
6,362
Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama Obama
 
Dr.Brawl

Dr.Brawl

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 16, 2009
Messages
544
Location
In a small cardboard box, NJ
Inui said:
Are you serious? You think the president had a lot of influence on keeping the union together and you think it was possible? Henry Clay and John Calhoun were the two people mostly responsible for keeping the union together for far longer than it would have otherwise, and Andrew Jackson used federal troops once to force South Carolina to stay in the union. Buchanan wasn't terrible; he was a victim of circumstance, much like George H. W. Bush, Herbert Hoover, Jimmy Carter, and other presidents that could have done very well in different eras.

"Buchanan assumed leadership [...] when an unprecedented wave of angry passion was sweeping over the nation. That he held the hostile sections in check during these revolutionary times was in itself a remarkable achievement. His weaknesses in the stormy years of his presidency were magnified by enraged partisans of the North and South. His many talents, which in a quieter era might have gained for him a place among the great presidents, were quickly overshadowed by the cataclysmic events of civil war and by the towering Abraham Lincoln."

What happened was the Republican party assumed a 3/4 majority in both houses of Congress and won the presidency. This meant they had the power to pass an amendment to the Constitution. South Carolina was the first state to secede when they realized a ban on slavery was imminent and what it would do to their economy. It would have created 3.5 million unemployed, uneducated citizens in the south on top of causing billions of dollars in investments to literally disappear into thin air. The south had no choice but to secede for their survival. It wasn't matter of right and wrong; neither side was more right than the other.

The ideological difference only formed due to a geographical difference, and the Republican party formed to ride a wave of anti-slavery sentiment in the north in order to obtain power. That's the truth of the matter.
Click to expand...
James Buchanan may have been a victim of circumstance however he still failed to act as leader. Jackson did so with his right, because the union would have fallen apart. South Carolina, has time and time again failed to listen to the federal government. George Washington did it as well. During the whiskey rebellion when Pennsylvanian failed to pay the whiskey tax Washington sent in troops. The role of the president has some power over the military and he could have gone down and stopped the full scale civil war which cost over 620,000 lives. You are correct in the reason of session, and now that you fully explained geography thing/ how the ideological differences developed. Let me clarify my explanation for his failure to keep the union together. Those two men, Clay and Calhoun, did save the union many times, and the president should also have this responsibility too. The main point I am trying to make is that Buchanan could have saved many lives, by just sending troops to South Carolina to stop it. However his failure to do so allowed the civil war to proceed

IMO worse three 1. Herbert Hoover, 2. James Buchanan 3. Franklin Pierce

On another topic Merry Christmas
 
Inui

Inui

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Oct 30, 2005
Messages
22,230
Location
Ocean Grove, New Jersey
Dr.Brawl said:
James Buchanan may have been a victim of circumstance however he still failed to act as leader. Jackson did so with his right, because the union would have fallen apart. South Carolina, has time and time again failed to listen to the federal government. George Washington did it as well. During the whiskey rebellion when Pennsylvanian failed to pay the whiskey tax Washington sent in troops. The role of the president has some power over the military and he could have gone down and stopped the full scale civil war which cost over 620,000 lives. You are correct in the reason of session, and now that you fully explained geography thing/ how the ideological differences developed. Let me clarify my explanation for his failure to keep the union together. Those two men, Clay and Calhoun, did save the union many times, and the president should also have this responsibility too. The main point I am trying to make is that Buchanan could have saved many lives, by just sending troops to South Carolina to stop it. However his failure to do so allowed the civil war to proceed

IMO worse three 1. Herbert Hoover, 2. James Buchanan 3. Franklin Pierce

On another topic Merry Christmas
Click to expand...
Buchanan couldn't stop the civil war, dude. Nobody could, not even Jackson, Calhoun, and Clay. What part of that aren't you getting? If Buchanan sent troops there, what would that have done? You think the other southern states, knowing their entire economies would crumble and they'd have the burden of educating and employing 3.5 million new citizens, would have just not seceded if Buchanan sent troops to South Carolina?

The civil war was destined to happen as soon as our nation was founded, and the Founding Fathers knew it.

How was Herbert Hoover bottom three? He is almost 0% responsible for the Great Depression. The Great Depression happened because of a huge boom in the 20's turning into a bust. People began buying on credit for the first time and the stock market became large, powerful, and important. When people defaulted on loans (bought cars, houses, etc. they couldn't really afford) and corruption in the stock market (stuff like what Enron did), it caused the economy to go down the tubes, not Herbert Hoover. Hoover just happened to be there. His ideas to fix it were just as ridiculous as Democratic ideas. He wanted to bank on charity, volunteerism and the free market repairing itself on its own. The Democrats wanted massive government spending and to create huge bureaucracies and believe in the government to fix everything and not be wasteful and corrupt. Both were stupid, but sounded nice, and the poor people wanted direct involvement right away, so FDR won.

The president's influence over the economy is very, very minimal. Why do you, someone who did well in AP US History, seem to believe the president has influence over the economy? Congress writes all of the budgets for everything and the Senate controls almost 100% of the country's money. The president doesn't control the economy at all.
 
pwiito

pwiito

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Jun 21, 2008
Messages
1,749
Location
Nowhere lol, Houston
So some random black male came up to me, he said " I betya you don't drop the N word around black people", This hommie clearly doesn't know I say ****** more than an angered black mom
 
Max Ketchum

Max Ketchum

Collegiate Starleague Smash Director
Joined
Dec 9, 2007
Messages
6,216
Location
New Jersey
You guys can insult white people all you want around me and I will have no negative physical or emotional reactions. :D

LOL @ Dr. Brawl vs. Inui
 
Dr.Brawl

Dr.Brawl

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 16, 2009
Messages
544
Location
In a small cardboard box, NJ
Inui said:
Buchanan couldn't stop the civil war, dude. Nobody could, not even Jackson, Calhoun, and Clay. What part of that aren't you getting? If Buchanan sent troops there, what would that have done? You think the other southern states, knowing their entire economies would crumble and they'd have the burden of educating and employing 3.5 million new citizens, would have just not seceded if Buchanan sent troops to South Carolina?

The civil war was destined to happen as soon as our nation was founded, and the Founding Fathers knew it.

How was Herbert Hoover bottom three? He is almost 0% responsible for the Great Depression. The Great Depression happened because of a huge boom in the 20's turning into a bust. People began buying on credit for the first time and the stock market became large, powerful, and important. When people defaulted on loans (bought cars, houses, etc. they couldn't really afford) and corruption in the stock market (stuff like what Enron did), it caused the economy to go down the tubes, not Herbert Hoover. Hoover just happened to be there. His ideas to fix it were just as ridiculous as Democratic ideas. He wanted to bank on charity, volunteerism and the free market repairing itself on its own. The Democrats wanted massive government spending and to create huge bureaucracies and believe in the government to fix everything and not be wasteful and corrupt. Both were stupid, but sounded nice, and the poor people wanted direct involvement right away, so FDR won.

The president's influence over the economy is very, very minimal. Why do you, someone who did well in AP US History, seem to believe the president has influence over the economy? Congress writes all of the budgets for everything and the Senate controls almost 100% of the country's money. The president doesn't control the economy at all.
Click to expand...
Inui if we ever meet in person debate MM?
Topic to be decided, something not too controversial,
opening statement 1 minute
3 times to restate facts 1 minute each
3 times to respond to a persons statement 2 minutes for each statement
1 minute for closing statement .
winner to be decided by someone judging/ someone knowledgeable about the subject.

Of course James Buchanan could not have stopped a civil war, I don't think anyone could have, it was bound to happen. But what he did is where I place him honestly if he had sent troops it would have at least suppressed it for a short time. Also at the time African Americans were not considered to be citizens that was added later with the 14th amendment. The south had no responsibility to educate freed slaves that was given by the freedman's bureau during reconstruction.

The things Hoover did, really, stating that I am not fit to president in the time the country greatly needs your leadership is disgraceful, and even saying that is being too kind. He only made most of the problems worse. He should have looked at the situation and said well if I don't do anything it's only going to get worse but if I at least try it might get better. He sent the army to attack a group of World War I vets because they wanted their benefits. He relied far too much on the hope that the market would turn itself around when he was told to spend massive amount of government money, which when FDR used it, it worked a little bit and eased the pain of the people. Of course FDR's plans did not fix the Great Depression, world war II did. Yes the President's influence on the economy is small however their polices can greatly affect what happens. Congress does control a majority of the money.

As for the AP US thing, I drew a dinosaurs in spaces attacking earth while fighting off space ships. I did this for the essay DBQ response. My teacher flipped out on me when I told him this, he uses me as an example of how people can actually pass the test. :awesome:
 
teh_spamerer

teh_spamerer

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 8, 2006
Messages
4,067
Location
Good luck Mario
Inui said:
What happened was the Republican party assumed a 3/4 majority in both houses of Congress and won the presidency. This meant they had the power to pass an amendment to the Constitution. South Carolina was the first state to secede when they realized a ban on slavery was imminent and what it would do to their economy. It would have created 3.5 million unemployed, uneducated citizens in the south on top of causing billions of dollars in investments to literally disappear into thin air. The south had no choice but to secede for their survival. It wasn't a matter of right and wrong; neither side was more right than the other.
Click to expand...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/36th_United_States_Congress

Please do your homework. Democrats had a majority in the Senate and decent numbers in the House of Representatives. No amendment to abolish slavery could have passed without their consent and Lincoln had openly stated that he wouldn't get rid of slavery because that would antagonize the South.
 
Inui

Inui

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Oct 30, 2005
Messages
22,230
Location
Ocean Grove, New Jersey
Dr.Brawl said:
Inui if we ever meet in person debate MM?
Topic to be decided, something not too controversial,
opening statement 1 minute
3 times to restate facts 1 minute each
3 times to respond to a persons statement 2 minutes for each statement
1 minute for closing statement .
winner to be decided by someone judging/ someone knowledgeable about the subject.
Click to expand...
well, that's nobody in this community, so, no

Of course James Buchanan could not have stopped a civil war, I don't think anyone could have, it was bound to happen. But what he did is where I place him honestly if he had sent troops it would have at least suppressed it for a short time.
Click to expand...
Stopped it for a short time and then...what? It just happens a year later? A few years later?

Buchanan = horrible for not stopping something impossible to stop?

lol

Also at the time African Americans were not considered to be citizens that was added later with the 14th amendment. The south had no responsibility to educate freed slaves that was given by the freedman's bureau during reconstruction.
Click to expand...
So you think the southerners were so dumb that they didn't see the obvious official citizenship of slaves coming after slavery was abolished? They were all born here (importing slaves was actually outlawed way before the civil war) and would have been free, meaning........duh.

It is the responsibility of the states to fund education and typically all citizens had the right to some form of public education.

derp

The things Hoover did, really, stating that I am not fit to president in the time the country greatly needs your leadership is disgraceful, and even saying that is being too kind. He only made most of the problems worse. He should have looked at the situation and said well if I don't do anything it's only going to get worse but if I at least try it might get better.
Click to expand...
Hoover wasn't disgraceful. He was following the policies the presidents before him did, policies that worked and helped usher in an era of so much prosperity that people thought poverty was abolished.

Not doing anything didn't automatically mean it would get worse. Like I said, he wanted to rely on the private sector, charity, churches, and volunteerism.

"Hoover feared that too much intervention or coercion by the government would destroy individuality and self-reliance, which he considered to be important American values." I agree.

"Hoover rejected direct federal relief payments to individuals, as he believed that a dole would be addictive, and reduce the incentive to work." Again, I agree. Look at how most people soak as much as they can out of unemployment, over and over, and even demand more. Look at how people on welfare often do nothing to get out of requiring it because it's easier to stay poor and keep getting in than to move up.

Hoover didn't do nothing; you can go read what he tried to do. Like FDR, it was a mixture of successes and failures, but he had much less time than FDR to do anything.

He sent the army to attack a group of World War I vets because they wanted their benefits.
Click to expand...
He ordered the army to clear out a huge group of people demanding money that wasn't due to them yet, money the government didn't have, because they were disrupting things and setting up illegal shelters.

I would have done the same thing.

He relied far too much on the hope that the market would turn itself around when he was told to spend massive amount of government money, which when FDR used it, it worked a little bit and eased the pain of the people. Of course FDR's plans did not fix the Great Depression, world war II did. Yes the President's influence on the economy is small however their polices can greatly affect what happens. Congress does control a majority of the money.
Click to expand...
What FDR did wasn't much, either. He put tiny bandages on bleeding arteries. Almost every program in the alphabet soup known as the New Deal was a failure, deemed unconstitutional by the Supreme Court, or both. Most created only temporary relief and nothing stable at all, and it was temporary relief caused by deficit spending. Government programs often expand and become corrupt.

FDR helped set the framework for today's welfare programs and the feeling of entitlement people have. It makes people lazy and not aspire for greatness. It makes them settle for whatever. It makes them not self-reliant. It's socialism.

You seem to overrated the influence of presidents too much.


teh_spamerer said:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/36th_United_States_Congress

Please do your homework. Democrats had a majority in the Senate and decent numbers in the House of Representatives. No amendment to abolish slavery could have passed without their consent and Lincoln had openly stated that he wouldn't get rid of slavery because that would antagonize the South.
Click to expand...
my bad

it was the 37th Congress that had that power
 
Inui

Inui

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Oct 30, 2005
Messages
22,230
Location
Ocean Grove, New Jersey
Merry Christmas, Kaila. I hope you have a good one in your new home and that your hair doesn't suffocate you in your sleep while you're drunk.

Merry Christmas, Doom. May you bang many Asian chicks twice your age!

Merry Christmas, Zucco. I hope you have a good time and get spoiled even more, you little brat! =D

Merry Christmas, Atomsk. I'm sure you'll have fun with your small but loving family, my other younger brother that can beat me up in half a second and is a douchebag. =P

Merry Christmas, Pierce. Have fun with your cute white boys you always "train" and stuff! ;]

Merry Christmas, Kai. May the Lord forgive your Squidward, Scrooge, Grinch, homosexual ways.

Merry Christmas, Chibo. May you one day become a real Facebook moderator.

Merry Christmas, Izumi. May your stocking be full of the innocence of flat-chested little girls.

Merry Christmas, Vinnie. I hope you have a good time with your family and that everything works out well for you, and that one day you get to be with your true loves, Daphne, Gaga, Perry, and Kesha.

If I didn't mention you and you believe you have significance to me (lol I guess like...Ally/Vex/Xzax/Prawn/Tant/Phil/PD/some others), I'm sorry, but it's hard to remember everyone ever and doing this got tiresome after a while...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom