Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[DarthEnderX]

But are we in agreement on who said character should be?

Most people want Chun-Li. And that's fair. She's iconic.

But I want Bison. Because MOAR VILLAINS!

 

[smashkirby]

Would characters like Lark, Goose, Saki, Ray, Ryota, and Akari count as retro at this point?

I mean, they all originated on the N64. Maybe even the OG GameBoy, in the case of Ryota...

 

[Laniv]

Would characters like Lark, Goose, Saki, Ray, Ryota, and Akari count as retro at this point?

I mean, they all originated on the N64. Maybe even the OG GameBoy, in the case of Ryota...

Well, at this point, it's been over 25 years since the N64 and Game Boy, so, yeah I guess they'd be retro.

...If Smash 6 comes in 2026, does that mean the Wii will be retro by that time?

 

[PeridotGX]

Well, at this point, it's been over 25 years since the N64 and Game Boy, so, yeah I guess they'd be retro.

...If Smash 6 comes in 2026, does that mean the Wii will be retro by that time?

I don't think the Wii is retro. While yes, the NES was considered retro about 20 years later during the Gamecube, and it's been about 20 years since the wii (jesus christ), gaming as a medium has existed for longer, and more time is needed for something to become retro. I mean, Jurrasic Park is 30 some years old, and would anyone consider it "retro"? Imagine a timeline, with the start being the dawn of gaming (in the late 70's or so) and the end being now (or whatever time period we're talking about). Here's how Ice Climber looked during Melee.

Very close to the dawn of gaming. Meanwhile, here's where the Wii is now. A fair bit closer to the present day than the beginning.

I would put the retro cutoff at the 6th generation (GCN/Xbox/PS2) Everything before is "retro", it and everything after is just "old". Not only does it hit at roughly the halfway point on the timeline thing, it's where games start to feel a little more "modern". Game devs are now fully aware of how to handle 3D, graphics are radically better, internet play is starting to be a thing. I have no idea if any of this makes any sense, but I think we have a few more years until the Wii becomes retro.

 

[Dan Quixote]

I think the entire gaming community has to decide whether retro means age or aesthetic. I see this same sort of argument both online and real life all the time regarding the term "classic rock." Is Nirvana classic rock? Smells like Teen Spirit is 30 years old now. Some classic rock stations say yes, while others won't play anything that came after Guns N' Roses. I see people get really worked up about this definition lol. But yeah, we need to decide if we're talking about games with authentic pixel graphics or games that the fell out of the pop culture of the current generation.

Personally I like the second definition because I think a big part of the appeal of retro fighters is the surprise factor. I love the idea of a character with a lot of influence but little staying power being reintroduced through Smash. Plus it leads to stuff like Duck Hunt, one of the most creative and cohesive movesets in the whole game. We sorta got that realized by Banjo & Kazooie being realized with a sort of retro character philosophy. Main problem with that is that the N64 didn't spawn a whole lot of original Nintendo characters lol, especially not ones who weren't part of a bigger still popular series. We'd need to zip to the PlayStation for Oddworld or something for that era.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

But are we in agreement on who said character should be?

I think people would accept just about anyone and it'll work. Street fighters cast just has so many memorable characters to work with.

You got Chun Li, the first lady of the fighting game genre.
Akuma, the legendary final boss.
Sakura the most popular street fighter (according to popularity polls circa street fighter 5)

Im sure people would be fine with any of them, albeit the latter two would be semi clones of Ryu/Ken.

 

[Stratos]

But are we in agreement on who said character should be?

Maybe Akuma.

 

[Mamboo07]

Most people want Chun-Li. And that's fair. She's iconic.

But I want Bison. Because MOAR VILLAINS!

I desire to have B O T H.

 

[Nabbitfan730]

Speaking on that note, i have played some Mega Man X recently and in terms of reps:

Should Mega Man be represented by all era of Mega Man: Classic Mega Man and then Zero or just Classic so Mega Man, Proto,Bass.

Additionally should Final Fantasy should be rep by all Final Fantasy like Cloud and then Black Mage, or just 7 so Cloud, Sephiroth, Tifa, Going forward?

 

[fogbadge]

The only time it got used was for Ice Climbers. Which was purely NES characters. Anyone on the same list would be Retro at least, but anyone else besides an NES character(which is at least a decent guide for its time) are questionable due to a massive lack of information.

A lot that look like it are more "surprise" characters(I.E. Duck Hunt, Mr. Game & Watch, R.O.B.) or are notable 3rd parites(Simon Belmont, MegaMan, Pac-Man).

Being an NES character isn't an actual straight criterium. We don't know what Sakurai means by Retro since it never came up again. Retro Design and "Retro by time" also are different things, making it more confusing. It could mean NES characters, those who are sprite-style 2D characters(3D style sprites do exist. Closely related to pixelart), or just "character from a certain set of generations back"(which the last one has no real set definition. I personally go with 2 back as the bare minimum, heh).

didn't he specifically say he wanted NES from the one off games?

I like how most of us are in agreement that Street fighter is just big enough as a franchise where it deserves a third character in smash.

i say we give ken the boot

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

didn't he specifically say he wanted NES from the one off games?

I think so, but I don't fully remember.

Though at the time, we only had the GameCube, so there wasn't much else besides GB or SNES. Back then, NES might've been the only ideal "retro" in context. That said, it's ill-defined either way, so it's all a guess to a degree.

 

[Mamboo07]

Speaking on that note, i have played some Mega Man X recently and in terms of reps:

Should Mega Man be represented by all era of Mega Man: Classic Mega Man and then Zero or just Classic so Mega Man, Proto,Bass.

Additionally should Final Fantasy should be rep by all Final Fantasy like Cloud and then Black Mage, or just 7 so Cloud, Sephiroth, Tifa, Going forward?

Mega Man - All eras
Final Fantasy - All of it other than 7

 

[TheQuester]

Speaking on that note, i have played some Mega Man X recently and in terms of reps:

Should Mega Man be represented by all era of Mega Man: Classic Mega Man and then Zero or just Classic so Mega Man, Proto,Bass.

Additionally should Final Fantasy should be rep by all Final Fantasy like Cloud and then Black Mage, or just 7 so Cloud, Sephiroth, Tifa, Going forward?

I honestly think FF reps will stick to FF7.
So if we get another FF rep, it will probably be Tifa, and tbh, i think it's likely she's added in the future, she's nearly as iconic as the other two we already have.
I could see the NES/SNES FF games getting some minor representation next game, but i'm not sure if non-FF7 characters will become playable.

 

[Perkilator]

Additionally should Final Fantasy should be rep by all Final Fantasy like Cloud and then Black Mage, or just 7 so Cloud, Sephiroth, Tifa, Going forward?

I think FF reps might stick with 7, but non-playable representation? That aspect should absolutely go beyond 7.

 

[Mamboo07]

I think FF reps might stick with 7, but non-playable representation? That aspect should absolutely go beyond 7.

Here's what I can imagine:
Stages

• Phantom Train (FF 6)
• Big Bridge (FF 5)
• Balamb Garden (FF 8)

Bosses

• Behemoth
• Gilgamesh
• Kefka
• Bahamut

Assist Trophies

• Vivi
• Moogle
• Cactuar
• Sabin (S U P L E X)

 

[Sucumbio]

I'd love a female rep for FF... So many to choose from... Lightning still warms my heart, Terra too. I think more costumes would be nice too or even a Mii Mage with Vivi as the introduction class ... I dunno.

 

[fogbadge]

The correct answer is Cecil

 

[Perkilator]

Here's what I can imagine:
Stages

• Phantom Train (FF 6)
• Big Bridge (FF 5)
• Balamb Garden (FF 8)

Bosses

• Behemoth
• Gilgamesh
• Kefka
• Bahamut

Assist Trophies

• Vivi
• Moogle
• Cactuar
• Sabin (S U P L E X)

I was thinking more along the lines of Spirits and music, but those work too.

 

[Gengar84]

I'd love a female rep for FF... So many to choose from... Lightning still warms my heart, Terra too. I think more costumes would be nice too or even a Mii Mage with Vivi as the introduction class ... I dunno.

If the Final Fantasy IX remake and show happen, I don’t think a character from those games is out of the question. I feel like Zidane and Vivi are probably the most likely but Princess Garnet is also possible. I feel her moveset would probably be more unique in Smash as there are already black mages (Robin, Ness, and Lucas) with others like Hero and Sora also having elemental magic. We also have agile dual blade wielding characters (Pit and Dark Pit). That’s not to say that they couldn’t make Zidane or Vivi stand out but a white mage summoner hybrid would be completely unique for Smash. Garnet and Amarant were my two favorites in that game and Garnet probably has the largest role in the story so that helps too.

 

[fogbadge]

If the Final Fantasy IX remake and show happen, I don’t think a character from those games is out of the question. I feel like Zidane and Vivi are probably the most likely but Princess Garnet is also possible. I feel her moveset would probably be more unique in Smash as there are already black mages (Robin, Ness, and Lucas) with others like Hero and Sora also having elemental magic. We also have agile dual blade wielding characters (Pit and Dark Pit). That’s not to say that they couldn’t make Zidane or Vivi stand out but a white mage summoner hybrid would be completely unique for Smash. Garnet and Amarant were my two favorites in that game and Garnet probably has the largest role in the story so that helps too.

or for a laugh we could go with quina

 

[Gengar84]

or for a laugh we could go with quina

Quinna could be a lot of fun. I imagine she’d have something similar to Kirby’s copy ability because she too can learn enemy skills by eating them.

 

[TheQuester]

Since a lot of you guys want playable FF characters that aren't from FF7, would you guys be upset if Tifa got in? I know Terra, Cecil or Zidane would be cool, but i think Tifa would make sense as a playable character, she's probably one (if not the most) iconic female JRPG characters, plus she's badass.

 

[fogbadge]

Since a lot of you guys want playable FF characters that aren't from FF7, would you guys be upset if Tifa got in? I know Terra, Cecil or Zidane would be cool, but i think Tifa would make sense as a playable character, she's probably one (if not the most) iconic female JRPG characters, plus she's badass.

more disappointed

 

[osby]

Since a lot of you guys want playable FF characters that aren't from FF7, would you guys be upset if Tifa got in? I know Terra, Cecil or Zidane would be cool, but i think Tifa would make sense as a playable character, she's probably one (if not the most) iconic female JRPG characters, plus she's badass.

I wouldn't be upset but I also wouldn't be excited.

FF7 isn't among my favorite Final Fantasy games and even in that game, there are characters I'd like to see in Smash before Tifa like Barret and Aerith.

 

[DarthEnderX]

I desire to have B O T H.

Unless there's a Nintendo/Capcom merger, I don't think you're likely to see 4 characters from a single 3P franchise.

Should Mega Man be represented by all era of Mega Man: Classic Mega Man and then Zero or just Classic so Mega Man, Proto,Bass.

Additionally should Final Fantasy should be rep by all Final Fantasy like Cloud and then Black Mage, or just 7 so Cloud, Sephiroth, Tifa, Going forward?

I mean, I think they should spread it out if they can.

Zero is good because he represents TWO additional eras of Mega Man. The next FF character should definitely NOT be from 7. With Simon/Richter representing the classicVania era, Alucard would be the perfect representative of the metroVania era.

Since a lot of you guys want playable FF characters that aren't from FF7, would you guys be upset if Tifa got in?

Nah, just annoyed. It's not my preference...but I'd GET it.

 

[Gengar84]

Since a lot of you guys want playable FF characters that aren't from FF7, would you guys be upset if Tifa got in? I know Terra, Cecil or Zidane would be cool, but i think Tifa would make sense as a playable character, she's probably one (if not the most) iconic female JRPG characters, plus she's badass.

No, I would be fine with Tifa. Final Fantasy VII has a great cast overall and any of them could be a lot of fun. My personal favorite party member from VII is Vincent Valentine but I’d be happy with any of them. That said, I also think it could be fun to get a FF character from outside VII. Final Fantasy IX and X are my favorites (followed by VII) so a character from either of those games could be fun. My favorites from IX are Garnet and Amarant and my favorites from X are Lulu and Auron. The only one out of those that has a realistic chance in my opinion is Garnet and she’s still a bit behind Zidane and Garnet in terms of her chances.

 

[fogbadge]

No, I would be fine with Tifa. Final Fantasy VII has a great cast overall and any of them could be a lot of fun. My personal favorite party member from VII is Vincent Valentine but I’d be happy with any of them. That said, I also think it could be fun to get a FF character from outside VII. Final Fantasy IX and X are my favorites (followed by VII) so a character from either of those games could be fun. My favorites from IX are Garnet and Amarant and my favorites from X are Lulu and Auron. The only one out of those that has a realistic chance in my opinion is Garnet and she’s still a bit behind Zidane and Garnet in terms of her chances.

im afraid I have to disagree with you there I’d say the party has weak links in tifa Barrett and yuffie

though I also have to agree with you that 9 & 10 are better

 

[Gengar84]

im afraid I have to disagree with you there I’d say the party has weak links in tifa Barrett and yuffie

though I also have to agree with you that 9 & 10 are better

I didn’t care much for Yuffie when I first played VII but she’s grown a lot on me over the years. Barret is a fun character in my opinion and Tifa’s cool too. I do feel like Vincent is a bit under appreciated overall. Maybe it has something to do with Dirge of Cerberus not being received particularly well.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I always thought Tifa and Barret were among the strongest of FF7's cast.

 

[Gengar84]

I feel I tend to gravitate towards characters that are a bit less popular in general. Not because they are less popular, I just think my preferences are different than most fan’s. While I like the whole cast of VII-X, my favorite from VII is Vincent and I never really see many who share that opinion. My favorites from IX are Amarant and Garnet, one of which is the least popular character overall and the other doesn’t have as many fans as Vivi or Zidane. My favorites from X are Lulu and Auron. Those two might be more popular than my favorites from the other games but I feel are still behind Tidus and Yuna for most.

 

[fogbadge]

I always thought Tifa and Barret were among the strongest of FF7's cast.

everyone says things like that and I feel I’m missing something

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Most people want Chun-Li. And that's fair. She's iconic.

But I want Bison. Because MOAR VILLAINS!

M. Bison ****ing up **** like in this trailer but within the Smash cast is something I have always wanted to see.

But I also want to see Kirby with Akuma's hair, eyes, eyebrow, and sadistic grin.

Choices....

 

[chocolatejr9]

M. Bison *ing up * like in this trailer but within the Smash cast is something I have always wanted to see.

But I also want to see Kirby with Akuma's hair, eyes, eyebrow, and sadistic grin.

Choices....

And then there's me, the guy who wants...

inhales deeply

RA-SHI-DOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!

 

[osby]

And then there's me, the guy who wants...

inhales deeply

RA-SHI-DOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!

Finally, some good taste in this thread.

everyone says things like that and I feel I’m missing something

They are introduced very early in the game and stay in the cast until the end - hence you get to see them growing as characters along with the plot advancement the most.

 

[Gengar84]

Finally, some good taste in this thread.



They are introduced very early in the game and stay in the cast until the end - hence you get to see them growing as characters along with the plot advancement the most.

Conversely, that might be the reason that Vincent is less popular. He’s an optional character and one of the last in the game so he doesn’t get nearly as much development as other characters. Same deal with Amarant in that they’re both mysterious and we never really see too much of their backstory in the main games.

 

[fogbadge]

They are introduced very early in the game and stay in the cast until the end - hence you get to see them growing as characters along with the plot advancement the most.

See that’s not the impression I got. Barrett’s character stopped early in the game after we fight the other guy with the robo arm and tifa only seems to be there for cloud’s sake and goes through no arch of her own

 

[osby]

Conversely, that might be the reason that Vincent is less popular. He’s an optional character and one of the last in the game so he doesn’t get nearly as much development as other characters. Same deal with Amarant in that they’re both mysterious and we never really see too much of their backstory in the main games.

Yeah, mystery can make a character more interesting, and cool designs + useful movesets can always sell them to more people.

But in the end, I usually prefer characters who get to influence and grow along with the plot. More screentime isn't always equal to a better character but it really helps, especially in longer RPGs.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Speaking on that note, i have played some Mega Man X recently and in terms of reps:

Should Mega Man be represented by all era of Mega Man: Classic Mega Man and then Zero or just Classic so Mega Man, Proto,Bass.

Additionally should Final Fantasy should be rep by all Final Fantasy like Cloud and then Black Mage, or just 7 so Cloud, Sephiroth, Tifa, Going forward?

Personally if we ever got a second Megaman rep i would want it to be one of the Megamen from the RPG timeline.

So we would have one rep from both sides of the Megaman franchise.

Plus there's a distinct lack of battle network songs in smash for some reason.

 

[Nabbitfan730]

Since a lot of you guys want playable FF characters that aren't from FF7, would you guys be upset if Tifa got in? I know Terra, Cecil or Zidane would be cool, but i think Tifa would make sense as a playable character, she's probably one (if not the most) iconic female JRPG characters, plus she's badass.

Idk. Tifa is one of favorite party members but as a rep ehhh. I've have to go with Gengar and say Vincent would be a better rep. His design and moves do it for me

See this is things get complicated, FF7 is the Final Fantasy i've played and interests me the most compared to other except 13 and probably 9. That, Smash 4 and Kingdom Hearts, i have more connection with FF7 crew than any other in the series but i feel other fans in the series somewhat that just focusing with 7 is bit limiting and fair as whole. Especially when 7 is one that gets most spotlight compared to rest.

Sephiroth was a great addition and more villains, the merrier but idk. I have played SSF2 and their addition of Black Mage had got me interest in seeing him as a rep. Especially as rep originates from the Final Fantasies that come from Nintendo consoles result Nintendo ties already.

 

[DarthEnderX]

M. Bison *ing up * like in this trailer but within the Smash cast is something I have always wanted to see.

But I also want to see Kirby with Akuma's hair, eyes, eyebrow, and sadistic grin.

Choices....

I mean, that's a no-brainer. We don't need a 3rd ****ing shoto from SF.