Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[TCT~Phantom]

Sakurai talks about Brawl again in his latest video.

Interestingly, he doubles down on how it’s hard to envision Smash without him and he does not have an obvious successor in mind.

 

[Wunderwaft]

Sakurai talks about Brawl again in his latest video.

The last minute of the video is a pseudo-confirmation of sorts that Sakurai is willing to take the director role again for the next Smash. It does make me at least confident in the quality of the next game.

 

[Oracle Link]

Heres Chat GPTs Opinion!
(We Zelda and Kirby Fans Should be Louder!)
(Also its somewhat outdated!)

1. Waluigi (Super Mario series) - Often requested and one of the few main characters from the Mario franchise still not included.
2. Crash Bandicoot (Crash Bandicoot series) - Iconic PlayStation character with a long history and fanbase.
3. Master Chief (Halo series) - The protagonist from the Halo series, representing the Xbox platform.
4. Sora (Kingdom Hearts series) - The main character from the popular Kingdom Hearts series, with a blend of Disney and Square Enix elements.
5. Rayman (Rayman series) - A classic and beloved platforming character.
6. Shantae (Shantae series) - A popular indie game character with a growing fanbase.
7. Geno (Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars) - A highly requested character from a classic Mario RPG game.
8. Dixie Kong (Donkey Kong series) - A prominent character from the Donkey Kong franchise.
9. Paper Mario (Paper Mario series) - A different take on Mario, with a unique art style and mechanics.
10. Travis Touchdown (No More Heroes series) - An eccentric and unique character with a cult following.

 

[DynamicSmasher]

Interestingly, he doubles down on how it’s hard to envision Smash without him and he does not have an obvious successor in mind.

I guess it's not a super pressing concern for now. Sakurai(52) is about the same age as Yoshiaki Koizumi(55), who is seen as the successor to Miyamoto himself. It'll probably be a bigger worry once he starts getting closer to his sixties.

 

[Geno Boost]

The difference is that Wobbufet is just another Pokemon, which would have to compete with Scizor/Umbreon/Ampharos and Pichu as the representative for gen 2, while Rosalina is the Big Woman on Observatory. If you wanted to represent Mario Galaxy, it's her or like... Lubba. That's not to mention the fact that while she isn't seen throwing hands, it's pretty clear that she's pretty powerful, with all of the forcefield and telekinesis business.

i could say same about rosalina she competes with king boo, waluigi, toad, fawful and many other mario characters
claiming Rosalina is powerful while she doesnt show anything beside 1 thing in a mario game which isnt even referenced in smash is funny to me this is why i would rather see Rosalina actually shows that she can actually fight in a mario games before adding her to smash because the only reason i can see why they added her over other mario reps is because they wanted to try a new gimmick using luma not because she had enough moveset potential from mario games

 

[chocolatejr9]

i could say same about rosalina she competes with king boo, waluigi, toad, fawful and many other mario characters
claiming Rosalina is powerful while she doesnt show anything beside 1 thing in a mario game which isnt even referenced in smash is funny to me this is why i would rather see Rosalina actually shows that she can actually fight in a mario games before adding her to smash because the only reason i can see why they added her over other mario reps is because they wanted to try a new gimmick using luma not because she had enough moveset potential from mario games

Dude, just stop. Your arguments are dumb, and it's obvious to anybody paying attention that you're only acting like this because for whatever reason you don't like Rosalina.

 

[Geno Boost]

Dude, just stop. Your arguments are dumb, and it's obvious to anybody paying attention that you're only acting like this because for whatever reason you don't like Rosalina.

i am just giving my opinion I didn’t say I didn’t like Rosalina I just don’t see her as priority that’s the thing at least during sm4sh
And yes I played Mario Galaxy

 

[Sucumbio]

i am just giving my opinion I didn’t say I didn’t like Rosalina I just don’t see her as priority that’s the thing at least during sm4sh
And yes I played Mario Galaxy

Priority means you think a different Mario character was more important? Who?

 

[Perkilator]

Priority means you think a different Mario character was more important? Who?

I’m gonna assume Toad and Waluigi, among others. And to be a little fair, Toad and Waluigi are pretty solid choices. But I consider Rosalina & Luma an equally solid choice.

 

[Sucumbio]

I’m gonna assume Toad and Waluigi, among others. And to be a little fair, Toad and Waluigi are pretty solid choices. But I consider Rosalina & Luma an equally solid choice.

They are definitely solid choices. Even today they're very popular picks. I kinda feel like it's apples and oranges. And I also think tho no one has explicitly said, they wanted to promote Galaxy.

 

[ZephyrZ]

Due to a lack of moveset potential from the Galaxy games, Rosalina will be cut from the next Smash game to be replaced with the canonical combatant....

Cat Rosalina!

With her catlike relfexes and moves such as her cat dive, statue transformation, and even using the Double Cherry, this 3D World Super Star has proven herself to be the purrrrfect combatant!

Preorder today!

 

[SPEN18]

To be fair, I would also rank Waluigi and Toad over Rosa, and I totally get the feeling that Rosa "cut the line" when she was added. I also understand why some people would have issues with the moveset feeling gimmicky and/or finicky for new players, though potential issues with a moveset IMO are not enough reason alone to cut the whole character, as I'd rather attempt a rework if having that character is worth it. So I totally get parts of the Rosa hate but ultimately I don't want her cut myself as she's become popular/recurring far beyond my expectation when she was first added and also well-represents Galaxy, which is a pretty important piece of the Marioverse.

 

[Geno Boost]

Priority means you think a different Mario character was more important? Who?

King boo, toad, Waluigi, fawful, paper Mario even Goomba (got his own game as part MLSSS remake)

 

[Soy_Man]

To be fair, I would also rank Waluigi and Toad over Rosa, and I totally get the feeling that Rosa "cut the line" when she was added. I also understand why some people would have issues with the moveset feeling gimmicky and/or finicky for new players, though potential issues with a moveset IMO are not enough reason alone to cut the whole character, as I'd rather attempt a rework if having that character is worth it. So I totally get parts of the Rosa hate but ultimately I don't want her cut myself as she's become popular/recurring far beyond my expectation when she was first added and also well-represents Galaxy, which is a pretty important piece of the Marioverse.

I understand why you'd think Toad should've taken priority over Rosa, but why Waluigi?

 

[Zerp]

Speaking of Rosalina discourse, the one thing I still hold against her was her reveal trailer. How dare they trick me into thinking Kirby was in Mario Kart, not cool Nintendo lol

 

[SPEN18]

On the Sakurai video, I thought it was interesting that he basically acknowledged that a new Smash is nigh inevitable. To my knowledge he hasn't gone to that extent publicly before.

And of course he would emphasize his own importance...not accusing him of being egotistical or anything, but saying things like "I don't know how Smash would continue without Sakurai" would be more meaningful coming from someone other than Sakurai himself. The state of the series now has evolved far beyond where it was pre-Brawl.

Regardless, I wouldn't take the video to be soft confirmation that he is willing to be director again, just soft confirmation that he is willing to be involved again, at minimum in some advisory role.

 

[Sucumbio]

To be fair, I would also rank Waluigi and Toad over Rosa, and I totally get the feeling that Rosa "cut the line" when she was added. I also understand why some people would have issues with the moveset feeling gimmicky and/or finicky for new players, though potential issues with a moveset IMO are not enough reason alone to cut the whole character, as I'd rather attempt a rework if having that character is worth it. So I totally get parts of the Rosa hate but ultimately I don't want her cut myself as she's become popular/recurring far beyond my expectation when she was first added and also well-represents Galaxy, which is a pretty important piece of the Marioverse.

I wasn't around for 4spec but was she heavily requested or predicted? When she was announced what was the reaction?

King boo, toad, Waluigi, fawful, paper Mario even Goomba (got his own game as part MLSSS remake)

Those are all spin off games though? I mean yes I'd love to see paper Mario or a playable goomba or the addition of waluigi but Galaxy was the mainline title at the time, so it's kinda the wrong point in Nintendo history to be expecting a character NOT from Galaxy, which the leads to who else in Galaxy (which was kinda my point). I think the narrative here is that Nintendo wanted to promote Galaxy and so Rosalina was the obvious choice to do that.

 

[SPEN18]

I understand why you'd think Toad should've taken priority over Rosa, but why Waluigi?

Tbh Rosa and Waluigi I would rank pretty close to each other so I don't wanna argue extensively on this. But Waluigi's resume is just longer and he's massively popular. Though Rosa has the mainline appearances in Galaxy1+2 and 3D World, which are admittedly a big deal and it'd be arguable if you wanted to rank her over Waluigi solely on that.

Ultimately I'd like both characters on the Mario roster.

 

[Geno Boost]

I wasn't around for 4spec but was she heavily requested or predicted? When she was announced what was the reaction?



Those are all spin off games though? I mean yes I'd love to see paper Mario or a playable goomba or the addition of waluigi but Galaxy was the mainline title at the time, so it's kinda the wrong point in Nintendo history to be expecting a character NOT from Galaxy, which the leads to who else in Galaxy (which was kinda my point). I think the narrative here is that Nintendo wanted to promote Galaxy and so Rosalina was the obvious choice to do that.

When Rosalina was added the mainline were Mario 3d world and mario bros u and and Mario 3d land

 

[sal ig]

I know a couple of us have been advocating for Oatchi to join Smash, but would any of us have an issue with Pikmin 4's 'custom character' riding him in battle?

I've seen folks refer to her as either 'Pom' or 'Lisa', and I have to admit, she IS pretty adorable.

I would honestly choose this over oatchi more for the fact that they can finally represent stuff from pikmin 3 + 4 other than alph as a skin and some spirits

They could make her similar to olimar in the fact that she can pull out pikmin (rock, winged, ice, glow and maybe bulbmin) which would have the abilities:

Rock - would do heavy shield damage to you but very slow trowing speed

Winged - they would have an upwards trajectory where if they grab onto someone they would pull then up for about 1 or 2 seconds before letting them go (this could be used for keeping the opponent in a juggling situation, reading someones jump in neutral or even to invalidate their edgeguard attempt)

Ice - after hitting 5/6 of them on the opponent they would be either frozen for abit or go into that iceberg effect that's already in the game

Glow - they would function like either a yellow or a blue because they would normally do basic damage but after collecting three of them you could use the stunning ability they have in 4 but instead of stunning you its functions almost like wii fits neutral B (keep in mind that these little guys would also be way rarer that the average pikmin)

Bulbmin - unlike the other pikmin after trowing them they would stay on the ground just walking around and if you somehow ran into them or pom/lisa combod you into them the bulbmin staying there will bite you and it could either be a combo starter/continuer/ender and at higher percents it would kill you (at around 120/150 depends on the characters weight stat) they would have the gimmick of only being able to be plucked once so that the ground isn't just a stage hazard but to compensate for that they would be hard to kill (8 to 10 hits would be the amount it would take to kill them)

And after that you could add oatchi into the moveset by making him poms/lisas dash attack, jab, tilts, jump animation, idle animation and even recovery if you wanted to do that but yeah bye and hope you enjoyed my pep talk about my love for pikmin and my want for more representation in smash :3

 

[SPEN18]

I wasn't around for 4spec but was she heavily requested or predicted? When she was announced what was the reaction?

Someone else can probably speak better to the state of things on this site in particular, but here's my 2 cents. My sense is that she was not completely off the radar but only one of several potential Mario newcomers considered to be in the running, and certainly not a clear frontrunner. I was not personally expecting her. She had popularity, but definitely not a "fan pick" darling the way Waluigi and Jr were (the latter was at the time the one I was hoping for).

 

[Oracle Link]

I will make some concept pictures for The Legend Of Zelda: Fight of an Era
(Which is smash Zelda BTW)
So here is the Character select screen:

For everyone wondering about the order it starts with the links and zeldas (Normal, Toon and Champion each), than some mainstays (Yes Fi Sorta Counts), Than Race Members, Than GAme Specifics, Than Enemys, Than Bosses, Than Villains and Finnaly The Ganons

Yeah i didnt include any capcom Chars Because Rights and lana is the one Hyrule Warriors Guest Character!
And no CDI Characters cause that would be stupid!

 

[HyperSomari64]

I will make some concept pictures for The Legend Of Zelda: Fight of an Era
(Which is smash Zelda BTW)
So here is the Character select screen:
View attachment 375217
For everyone wondering about the order it starts with the links and zeldas (Normal, Toon and Champion each), than some mainstays (Yes Fi Sorta Counts), Than Race Members, Than GAme Specifics, Than Enemys, Than Bosses, Than Villains and Finnaly The Ganons

Yeah i didnt include any capcom Chars Because Rights and lana is the one Hyrule Warriors Guest Character!

>No CD-i characters
you had one job, dude.

 

[Oracle Link]

>No CD-i characters
you had one job, dude.

There i fixed it! Although maybe Arzette can be a guest character?

Beedles Era Shop It currently has a Dark Toon Link Costume, A Music Track and The Twili Realm Stage
(And If Youre Wondering why Toon Link Lies on his Back ahem thats just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the item behind him!)

 

[Nabbitfan730]

On the Sakurai video, I thought it was interesting that he basically acknowledged that a new Smash is nigh inevitable. To my knowledge he hasn't gone to that extent publicly before.

And of course he would emphasize his own importance...not accusing him of being egotistical or anything, but saying things like "I don't know how Smash would continue without Sakurai" would be more meaningful coming from someone other than Sakurai himself. The state of the series now has evolved far beyond where it was pre-Brawl.

Eiji Aonuma said that, Not Sakurai.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I kinda wanna see Rosalina, Donkey, Diddy, and Pauline all be in Mario Wonder

even tho I’ll mostly use Daisy religiously

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Speaking of Rosalina discourse, the one thing I still hold against her was her reveal trailer. How dare they trick me into thinking Kirby was in Mario Kart, not cool Nintendo lol

Seriously Nintendo should put Kirby in a Mario Kart game. with Splatoon, animal crossing, Zelda and F Zero getting stuff it just makes sense at this point

 

[Speed Weed]

Seriously Nintendo should put Kirby in a Mario Kart game. with Splatoon, animal crossing, Zelda and F Zero getting stuff it just makes sense at this point

The difference is that all of these are developed internally at Nintendo and Kirby is not. Not that "second-party" characters couldn't ever make it, but it's a bit of a different situation

 

[SPEN18]

Eiji Aonuma said that, Not Sakurai.

That was from 2005. I'm talking about post-Ultimate, whether people at Nintendo still hold that opinion.

 

[Nabbitfan730]

The difference is that all of these are developed internally at Nintendo and Kirby is not. Not that "second-party" characters couldn't ever make it, but it's a bit of a different situation

Also the game is called Mario Kart, not Nintendo Kart. How about we focus on the Mario Series and it's characters first

 

[Perkilator]

Also the game is called Mario Kart, not Nintendo Kart. How about we focus on the Mario Series and it's characters first

Eh, I think we can still throw in a few guest characters without taking away focus from the Mario side.

 

[HyperSomari64]

Also the game is called Mario Kart, not Nintendo Kart. How about we focus on the Mario Series and it's characters first

All franchises are invited...
except Pokémon, for reasons. (at least something outside of a driver lke vehicle parts or a track)

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Also the game is called Mario Kart, not Nintendo Kart. How about we focus on the Mario Series and it's characters first

Honestly after Mario kart 8 went beyond the Mario universe with characters and stages i'm all for them going full on with this idea.

Would certainly be preferable to having metal variants or baby variants of Mario characters.

 

[DemifiendEnjoyer]

Excitement.

 

[smashkirby]

Hilariously enough, it would be one way to get a mounted character without the issues of scale that a horse or something would potentially bring.

But idk, if the set is using Oatchi for the vast majority of the moves then IMO may as well just let him be solo. But we could also get a moveset based on the Pom/Lisa protag where Oatchi just pops out for a few specific moves. My opinion may change as I see more of the game, though.

Either way, shoot, Ninty, just give the character a default name, please!

Wow! It's funny, I was just thinking about how funny it would be if Pom/Lisa (Nintendo, PLEASE give her a 'default' name) could end up being the first 'mount' character in Smash, riding on Oatchi and all, instead of the various Fire Emblem candidates I've seen folks suggest over the years, like (but not limited to) Caeda and Elincia.

 

[Zerp]

Ngl I find the Mario Kart v Nintendo Kart thing a little silly. Like, kart characters aren't equivalent to fighting game characters. They require unique models, animations and sounds... but they also don't require an entire moveset you need to code. I get why people would want a focus either direction on Mario or external characters but like, you can also just ask for a really big roster. Ninty would need to set apart time and money for it, but I'm sure they could add a lot more characters than what they currently have. And hey, then there'd be room for both parties, yeah? It'd be a ton of work obviously but it's also nowhere near as big as asking for an equivalent amount of Smash characters. Like, if Nintendo really wants to do so, a roster of 80+ characters wouldn't be implausible at all to create.


That said the current Mario Kart roster is nigh perfect. And it's totally not me being extremely biased for Wiggler that's making me say that, totally not.

 

[fogbadge]

Ngl I find the Mario Kart v Nintendo Kart thing a little silly. Like, kart characters aren't equivalent to fighting game characters. They require unique models, animations and sounds... but they also don't require an entire moveset you need to code. I get why people would want a focus either direction on Mario or external characters but like, you can also just ask for a really big roster. Ninty would need to set apart time and money for it, but I'm sure they could add a lot more characters than what they currently have. And hey, then there'd be room for both parties, yeah? It'd be a ton of work obviously but it's also nowhere near as big as asking for an equivalent amount of Smash characters. Like, if Nintendo really wants to do so, a roster of 80+ characters wouldn't be implausible at all to create.


That said the current Mario Kart roster is nigh perfect. And it's totally not me being extremely biased for Wiggler that's making me say that, totally not.

I think they’ve done it with tour

 

[DynamicSmasher]

Ngl I find the Mario Kart v Nintendo Kart thing a little silly. Like, kart characters aren't equivalent to fighting game characters. They require unique models, animations and sounds... but they also don't require an entire moveset you need to code. I get why people would want a focus either direction on Mario or external characters but like, you can also just ask for a really big roster. Ninty would need to set apart time and money for it, but I'm sure they could add a lot more characters than what they currently have. And hey, then there'd be room for both parties, yeah? It'd be a ton of work obviously but it's also nowhere near as big as asking for an equivalent amount of Smash characters. Like, if Nintendo really wants to do so, a roster of 80+ characters wouldn't be implausible at all to create.


That said the current Mario Kart roster is nigh perfect. And it's totally not me being extremely biased for Wiggler that's making me say that, totally not.

For all that it's probably simpler to make a new Mario Kart character than it is to make a Smash Bros character, there do also generally tend to be less Mario Kart characters than there are Smash ones. In fact 8 Deluxe is the only game to have more playable characters than Smash Bros Brawl.(And just for the record, Kart 64 has less characters than Smash 64 and DD has less than Melee, though DD has less clones lol). And as such, competition for roster spots remains pretty fierce.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

Given the fact that Nintendo has no interest in developing any racing spin-offs besides Mario Kart, I can't blame anyone who wants non-Mario characters in MK. If we were getting Diddy Kong Racing/Kirby's Air Ride sequels then I'd have no problem keeping things a bit more separate, but given that those days appear to over, I'm all for mixing up the rosters for future entries.

Heck of anything non-Mario tracks feels like the next frontier for the Kart series; racing through Crocodile Ilse, Kokiri Forest, and Dreamland? Sign me up.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

They could just do what Sega did with the Sonic all stars racing games.


Games that predominantly focused on Sonic but had other Sega characters from stuff like Shenmue, Skies of arcadia or Super monkey ball.
So you can keep the Mario kart name since the bulk of the cast is Mario stuff but keep the Zelda, Animal crossing and whatever other Nintendo series they want to bring in.