Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Thegameandwatch]

Okay, let's say each game (4 WiiU/3DS have diferent stages, so i'm counting them as separate here) has two returning stages in Smash 6, which ones do you think are the most likely to return?
2 stages from Smash 64
2 stages from Melee
2 stages from Brawl
2 stages from 4WiiU
2 stages from 43DS
2 stages from Ultimate

I avoided 3rd Party since they are unpredictable

64: Dream Land, Kongo Jungle

Melee: Temple, Onett

Brawl: Pokémon Stadium 2, Smashville

3DS: Arena Ferox, Magicant

Wii U: Flat Zone X, Palutena's Temple

Ultimate: New Donk City Hall, Great Plateau Tower

I picked Palutena's Temple only because they could return the conversations.

 

[fogbadge]

Don’t forget Vaporeon and possibly Lopunny. For those who don’t know, it’s for the better.

I was trying to forget

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Don’t forget Vaporeon and possibly Lopunny. For those who don’t know, it’s for the better.

It's funny how y'all focus on the memed ones and yet I bet you don't realize the unfortunate knowledge that I was made aware of in regards to a Pokémon already in Smash.

You think something Gardevoir has it bad?
Not even close.

And no, it's not Incineroar.

 

[Pupp135]

It's funny how y'all focus on the memed ones and yet I bet you don't realize the unfortunate knowledge that I do in regards to a Pokémon already in Smash.

You think something Gardevoir has it bad?
Not even close.

And no, it's not Incineroar.

I assume you mean Lucario (I forgot until you just brought it up)

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

I assume you mean Lucario

Ding ding.

We got a winner.

EDIT: Though it seems my cursed knowledge is heavily outdated.

 

[dream1ng]

I like Totodile more but I might pick Chikorita just because MegaMeganium is funny.

 

[SPEN18]

I've been seeing a lot of this sentiment going around and while I don't really like Pignite all that much, Tepig is cute and Emboar is pretty cool imo, super excited to see what it gets for a regional if the starters get those this time around.

Now from the other end of it, I don't like Emboar's design but maybe if it gets a variant form I'll like that better...maybe the bar being lower for the variant to be considered an improvement is better in a certain respect.

 

[SharkLord]

On the topic of Pokemon... I'm sure this has been discussed already, but how would Eevee and/or it's Eeveelutions go? Eevee's been treated as basically a separate mascot now, but much of it's appeal is the ability to evolve into a variety of different forms. But then that becomes tricky, because we'd have to integrate multiple movesets just to cover the evolution aspect. And if we cheat by having Eevee swap between multiple elements, we'll have to make multiple models just for a couple moves.

Checking the PotY poll from back in 2020 (Which is admittedly a bit skewed, being five years old now and having people vote for one Pokemon per region possibly skewing the votes, but it's still the biggest official poll we've got), Umbreon and Sylveon rank very highly at 5th and 6th place respectively. The next highest Eeveelution is Eevee itself, at 20th. After that you have to dig into the regional results to see the votes, but the highest-ranked Eeveelution outside the top 30 is Espeon. Hmm...

The obvious choice would be the classic Vaporeon/Flareon/Jolteon trio, but three whole movesets might be a bit tricky, up to four if Eevee is playable. I think the simplest option, short of just Eevee on it's own, would be an Umbreon/Espeon duo. They have relatively similar body types, are connected by similar evolution requirements, debuted in the same generation, and are both fairly popular (though Umbreon is way more popular overall). Though, that's all just me rambling here. I might be off with something.

 

[RouffWestie]

On the topic of Pokemon... I'm sure this has been discussed already, but how would Eevee and/or it's Eeveelutions go? Eevee's been treated as basically a separate mascot now, but much of it's appeal is the ability to evolve into a variety of different forms. But then that becomes tricky, because we'd have to integrate multiple movesets just to cover the evolution aspect. And if we cheat by having Eevee swap between multiple elements, we'll have to make multiple models just for a couple moves.

I can't imagine the Eeveelutions being anything more than simple one-use specials you get from filling a meter like Cloud, just expanded to Smash Attacks and one other input like Sheild+B to utilize the other 4 Eeveelutions.

 

[BrawlX10]

Asuming the series continues and gets new games after Ultimate, do you guys think people in 15-20 years from now will see Ultimate as the "golden age" of Smash Bros.?

 

[DarthEnderX]

Asuming the series continues and gets new games after Ultimate, do you guys think people in 15-20 years from now will see Ultimate as the "golden age" of Smash Bros.?

If it's the only time we get EiH, yes.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Asuming the series continues and gets new games after Ultimate, do you guys think people in 15-20 years from now will see Ultimate as the "golden age" of Smash Bros.?

......we aren't already seeing it as that?

 

[ninjahmos]

Asuming the series continues and gets new games after Ultimate, do you guys think people in 15-20 years from now will see Ultimate as the "golden age" of Smash Bros.?

I think that depends on what you would define as "golden age."

Lots of people who played Melee probably think that may have been the "golden age" of Super Smash Bros., since it's also one of its console's bestselling games. Then again, lots of people also played Ultimate and that's one of the Switch's bestselling games.

…So possibly.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I think that depends on what you would define as "golden age."

Lots of people who played Melee probably think that may have been the "golden age" of Super Smash Bros since it's also one of its console's bestselling games. Then again, lots of people also played Ultimate and that's one of the Switch's bestselling games.

…So possibly.

I don't think any Smash game could scream "golden age" as loudly as the one which brought back everyone, shocked the world with Joker, had a reveal that outright broke Twitter with Steve (back when it wasn't breaking itself) and managed to pull something most of us assumed was impossible; Sora.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

I think that depends on what you would define as "golden age."

I define it as any age I was part of.

 

[Dukefire]

Ultimate is the peak of Smash Bros has ever achieved. It won't be the same for sequels due to the impact.

Let us see what the next one will present once it is ready.

 

[Perkilator]

I’ve seen a lot of discussion about whether or not the next Smash game should reveal the characters of its DLC pass ahead of time, like how games like Street Fighter 6 have done. And honestly…it’s a topic I’m a bit conflicted on.

On one hand, ideally, it would help mitigate the tunnel vision in the speculation scene. But on the other hand, what if certain 3rd party companies don’t want their characters revealed too far in advance? Would you then settle for only revealing a few of the DLC characters in advance?

 

[Laniv]

The game Super Soccer on Super Famicom will be removed from NSO in Japan on March 28th at 1am UTC.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

This is, to my knowledge, the first game to be delisted from NSO. This is not a great sign.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

The game Super Soccer on Super Famicom will be removed from NSO in Japan on March 28th at 1am UTC.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

This is, to my knowledge, the first game to be delisted from NSO. This is not a great sign.

I don't think anyone here would cry the loss of Super Soccer in Japan but this sets a precedent that was present in any other streaming service; we can LOSE games now.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

On the topic of Pokemon... I'm sure this has been discussed already, but how would Eevee and/or it's Eeveelutions go? Eevee's been treated as basically a separate mascot now, but much of it's appeal is the ability to evolve into a variety of different forms. But then that becomes tricky, because we'd have to integrate multiple movesets just to cover the evolution aspect. And if we cheat by having Eevee swap between multiple elements, we'll have to make multiple models just for a couple moves.

Checking the PotY poll from back in 2020 (Which is admittedly a bit skewed, being five years old now and having people vote for one Pokemon per region possibly skewing the votes, but it's still the biggest official poll we've got), Umbreon and Sylveon rank very highly at 5th and 6th place respectively. The next highest Eeveelution is Eevee itself, at 20th. After that you have to dig into the regional results to see the votes, but the highest-ranked Eeveelution outside the top 30 is Espeon. Hmm...

The obvious choice would be the classic Vaporeon/Flareon/Jolteon trio, but three whole movesets might be a bit tricky, up to four if Eevee is playable. I think the simplest option, short of just Eevee on it's own, would be an Umbreon/Espeon duo. They have relatively similar body types, are connected by similar evolution requirements, debuted in the same generation, and are both fairly popular (though Umbreon is way more popular overall). Though, that's all just me rambling here. I might be off with something.

Imma just throw my stupid earlier idea into the ring again and say that since usually Smash takes from the Pokemon anime maybe they can take from the Pokemon Manga for once and use Red's Eevee who can use the abilities of the Gen 1 eeveelutions due to Team rocket forcing horrible science experiments onto the little thing.

So just assign a water/electric/fire type moves in each button, then for it's final smash use the Z move where it calls the rest of them for an attack

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I don't think anyone here would cry the loss of Super Soccer in Japan but this sets a precedent that was present in any other streaming service; we can LOSE games now.

Interesting that Super Soccer is the only Spike Chunsoft game in the entire NSO service.

I can only assume it's some kind of licensing thing since it's a third party title, but I wonder what would've changed for it to affect this 34 year old game.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Interesting that Super Soccer is the only Spike Chunsoft game in the entire NSO service.

I can only assume it's some kind of licensing thing since it's a third party title, but I wonder what would've changed for it to affect this 34 year old game.

Maybe Sony being Kadokawa's largest shareholder now actually did something?

Probably isn't the case but still something I'm paranoid about if it could mean Danganronpa is off-limits for Smash now.

 

[Guynamednelson]

I don't think anyone here would cry the loss of Super Soccer in Japan but this sets a precedent that was present in any other streaming service; we can LOSE games now.

First they came for Super Soccer, and I did not speak up, for I did not play Super Soccer

 

[ninjahmos]

You know who's another composer I'd love to hear at least one or two Smash remixes from?

Naofumi Hataya

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Maybe Sony being Kadokawa's largest shareholder now actually did something?

Probably isn't the case but still something I'm paranoid about if it could mean Danganronpa is off-limits for Smash now.

I did see people talking about it a bit and apparently Super Soccer has ads in-game on banners and stuff for like Human Entertainment who made the game (they're defunct so it's not them unless it's part of the Spike Chunsoft thing since a lot of them moved over there or like if someone else owns the logo or name) and also apparently SimCity?

For all we know this could just be a really weird late EA response to that (they have no games on the service I don't think? page searching "electronic" didn't give me any results), since we don't have an actual reason listed, but I imagine Spike Chunsoft/Kadokawa/Sony is more likely since it's actually a game they own lol

 

[Guynamednelson]

and also apparently SimCity?

Looking at gameplay footage on YouTube, SimCity ads are all over the stadium. They literally alternate Nintendo-SimCity-Nintendo-SimCity

Yeah I can see EA being way more upset about that compared to Dr. Wright trophies saying he's from SimCity.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

The game Super Soccer on Super Famicom will be removed from NSO in Japan on March 28th at 1am UTC.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

This is, to my knowledge, the first game to be delisted from NSO. This is not a great sign.

This is why i don't use streaming apps.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Looking at gameplay footage on YouTube, SimCity ads are all over the stadium. They literally alternate Nintendo-SimCity-Nintendo-SimCity

Yeah I can see EA being way more upset about that compared to Dr. Wright trophies saying he's from SimCity.

People mentioned ad licensing being the reason the ads were changed in Wave Race 64's Virtual Console versions to be Wii and DS Lite ads, so it's probably POSSIBLE, but I dunno. Super Soccer is a 34 year old SNES game and apparently Wave Race 64's NSO version has the original ads intact, so unless EA is being really weird about SimCity when Super Soccer's been on NSO for 5+ years, I think Spike Chunsoft and its parent company and largest shareholder are more likely lol

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

First they came for Super Soccer, and I did not speak up, for I did not play Super Soccer

Not surprising why they added Genesis games a few years back, Robotnik has been running the show this whole time.

 

[smashkirby]

A bit of a weird question, but it's one that's been on my mind a lot as of late. What does the next game need to have for you to be satisfied? There's often a lot of talk of what we think is likely or what unlikely addition we'd want included, but I wanna gauge a little just what the bar is for people to be happy with the game.

Aside from the miracle of EiH again happening? I'd be happy with either the sequel of Subspace (with EiH being a thing or not) and/or (more likely) and improved Smash Run.

I’d be pretty satisfied, aside from Funky Kong and Galacta Knight as Echoes. Alternatively, how would you guys feel about these characters?

• Unique fighters
  1. Waluigi
  2. Toad or Pauline
  3. Skull Kid
  4. Bandana Waddle Dee
  5. Meowscarada, Tinkaton, or Gholdengo
  6. Tom Nook
  7. Octoling
  8. Takamaru
  9. Ayumi Tachibana
  10. Isaac
  11. Officer Howard
  12. Ring Fit Trainee
  13. Alucard
  14. Ryu Hayabusa
  15. Crash Bandicoot
• Echoes
  1. Dixie Kong
  2. Ninjara
  3. Jeanne

Ngl, aside from Dixie being Diddy's Echo (I'm in the semi-clone Dixie camp), this would be my dream Smash 6 newcomer roster. Well, for the most part. At least you have both Bandana Waddle Dee AND Dixie Kong.

 

[Dukefire]

I always believe to maintain content you have in your own library physical and/or digital. Games in the cloud via live services can disappear for various reasons. All without your control. (Unless you done something to breach Terms of Service or anything else.)

 

[SPEN18]

On the topic of Pokemon... I'm sure this has been discussed already, but how would Eevee and/or it's Eeveelutions go? Eevee's been treated as basically a separate mascot now, but much of it's appeal is the ability to evolve into a variety of different forms. But then that becomes tricky, because we'd have to integrate multiple movesets just to cover the evolution aspect. And if we cheat by having Eevee swap between multiple elements, we'll have to make multiple models just for a couple moves.

Checking the PotY poll from back in 2020 (Which is admittedly a bit skewed, being five years old now and having people vote for one Pokemon per region possibly skewing the votes, but it's still the biggest official poll we've got), Umbreon and Sylveon rank very highly at 5th and 6th place respectively. The next highest Eeveelution is Eevee itself, at 20th. After that you have to dig into the regional results to see the votes, but the highest-ranked Eeveelution outside the top 30 is Espeon. Hmm...

The obvious choice would be the classic Vaporeon/Flareon/Jolteon trio, but three whole movesets might be a bit tricky, up to four if Eevee is playable. I think the simplest option, short of just Eevee on it's own, would be an Umbreon/Espeon duo. They have relatively similar body types, are connected by similar evolution requirements, debuted in the same generation, and are both fairly popular (though Umbreon is way more popular overall). Though, that's all just me rambling here. I might be off with something.

Yeah I have discussed it several times before but there doesn't seem to be an obvious solution that lets you actually play as the evolutions without taking up a lot of resources on a multi-fighter and still forcing you to make quite unfortunate choices in terms of which evolutions actually get to be incorporated. Though if you were to do something like that, I agree the Umbreon/Espeon thing is probably the most tractable. Summoning or evolving for singular moves also seems very awkward.

That said, not being able to play as the evolutions directly doesn't diminish the appeal of Eevee on its own. Eevee itself is the mascot after all, and moveset-wise it can be a cutesy little NFE that playfully messes with its opponents using adorable tackles, tail whips, sand attacks, swifts, and the like. Maybe it taps into its latent elemental powers for some of the moves even if it's not directly summoning or evolving. Maybe there's some gimmicks in there involving Last Resort or something. And the FS is the perfect place to let all the evolutions show up at once and get their time in the limelight.

 

[BrawlX10]

How do you guys feel if Yuffie was the FF Assist instead of Tifa?

Also i just realized tomorrow is my 1st month anniversary in SB

 

[Gengar84]

Yeah I have discussed it several times before but there doesn't seem to be an obvious solution that lets you actually play as the evolutions without taking up a lot of resources on a multi-fighter and still forcing you to make quite unfortunate choices in terms of which evolutions actually get to be incorporated. Though if you were to do something like that, I agree the Umbreon/Espeon thing is probably the most tractable. Summoning or evolving for singular moves also seems very awkward.

That said, not being able to play as the evolutions directly doesn't diminish the appeal of Eevee on its own. Eevee itself is the mascot after all, and moveset-wise it can be a cutesy little NFE that playfully messes with its opponents using adorable tackles, tail whips, sand attacks, swifts, and the like. Maybe it taps into its latent elemental powers for some of the moves even if it's not directly summoning or evolving. Maybe there's some gimmicks in there involving Last Resort or something. And the FS is the perfect place to let all the evolutions show up at once and get their time in the limelight.

I think the solution is to base the moveset off of Let’s Go Eevee and give it elemental attacks representing each of its Eeveelutions. You could take a page from its Z move and have a spectral version of the Eeveelution for that elemental attacks representing each appear during the animation of that move. That way, you’re still referencing all its forms without having it evolve mid battle.

How do you guys feel if Yuffie was the FF Assist instead of Tifa?

Also i just realized tomorrow is my 1st month anniversary in SB

Congratulations! I think Yuffie could be pretty cool. I like the whole cast so I’d be happy with any of them. My favorite of the playable party members is Vincent.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

If Smash wanted to makeup an Eevee that could change between its multiple evolutions for attacks without being a full on stance switch fighter, I'd be down to pretend that's a thing it can do. Maybe do a Bylethesque thing where the neutrals and tilts are normal type attacks and the Smashes, Aerials, and Specials all involve transforming and doing an element attack with the corresponding evolution.

Not a perfect idea, but I think it sounds fun.

 

[SharkLord]

Yeah I have discussed it several times before but there doesn't seem to be an obvious solution that lets you actually play as the evolutions without taking up a lot of resources on a multi-fighter and still forcing you to make quite unfortunate choices in terms of which evolutions actually get to be incorporated. Though if you were to do something like that, I agree the Umbreon/Espeon thing is probably the most tractable. Summoning or evolving for singular moves also seems very awkward.

That said, not being able to play as the evolutions directly doesn't diminish the appeal of Eevee on its own. Eevee itself is the mascot after all, and moveset-wise it can be a cutesy little NFE that playfully messes with its opponents using adorable tackles, tail whips, sand attacks, swifts, and the like. Maybe it taps into its latent elemental powers for some of the moves even if it's not directly summoning or evolving. Maybe there's some gimmicks in there involving Last Resort or something. And the FS is the perfect place to let all the evolutions show up at once and get their time in the limelight.

It's also probably worth mentioning that Leafeon and Glaceon are in similar situations - Debuted in the same generation, are only a duo and not a trio so there's less resources needed to make the dynamic work - but Espeon and especially Umbreon seem to be more popular overall. Sylveon is also pretty darn popular, but it's not part of a set of Eeveelutions. You could easily spin something out of Eevee evolving into Sylveon to still cover the evolution gimmick, but I'm not sure if it covers the full range of options. And like I mentioned before, the Kanto trio are arguably the most iconic set, but since there's three of them, it might get a bit messy trying to cover the full range of options.

I think the solution is to base the moveset off of Let’s Go Eevee and give it elemental attacks representing each of its Eeveelutions. You could take a page from its Z move and have a spectral version of the Eeveelution for that elemental attacks representing each appear during the animation of that move. That way, you’re still referencing all its forms without having it evolve mid battle.


Congratulations! I think Yuffie could be pretty cool. I like the whole cast so I’d be happy with any of them. My favorite of the playable party members is Vincent.

That's probably the most realistic option, but I dunno, it feels a bit... Underwhelming? Eevee's cute, don't get me wrong, but I think the Eeveelutions are more visually interesting and can lend themselves to more cohesive movesets.

 

[Kirbeh]

Just do solo Eevee with one attack from each Eeveelutions type. Either that and/or just pick one. Including every single one shouldn't be a requirement.

 

[Gengar84]

It's also probably worth mentioning that Leafeon and Glaceon are in similar situations - Debuted in the same generation, are only a duo and not a trio so there's less resources needed to make the dynamic work - but Espeon and especially Umbreon seem to be more popular overall. Sylveon is also pretty darn popular, but it's not part of a set of Eeveelutions. You could easily spin something out of Eevee evolving into Sylveon to still cover the evolution gimmick, but I'm not sure if it covers the full range of options. And like I mentioned before, the Kanto trio are arguably the most iconic set, but since there's three of them, it might get a bit messy trying to cover the full range of options.


That's probably the most realistic option, but I dunno, it feels a bit... Underwhelming? Eevee's cute, don't get me wrong, but I think the Eeveelutions are more visually interesting and can lend themselves to more cohesive movesets.

Oh I definitely agree. I don’t particularly care about Eevee but I do really like several of its Eeveelutions. I just think the moveset would get way too complex having it transform into so many different forms. Pokémon Trainer is already complex enough. I can’t imagine a character with 8 different transformations. I feel like it either has to be Let’s Go Eevee or just go with one Eeveelution. My favorite is Vaporeon.