Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Gengar84]

Okay, so…let’s say the next Smash had 50 veterans, 15 newcomers, and 5 Echo Fighters. That’s about 70 characters. What kind of roster would you guys be able to make with those numbers?

I made a roster limited to the same size as Ultimate’s (84 characters). I think that would be a good starting point to work from if I can manage to cut 14 characters.

Based on this, I think I’d cut:

Bowser Jr.
ROB
Wolf
Ice Climbers
Dark Samus
Bayonetta
Kazuya
Joker
Lyn
Rauru
Miraidon
E.M.M.I.
Noah and Mio
Illidan
Lu Bu

I forgot to include Olimar in my initial roster image so I suppose we can cut one extra character for Olimar. Dixie and Impa can both be made to echoes. Scorpion could be added as a semi-echo of Sub-Zero (or vice versa) with different specials as well. This doesn’t exactly match the specifications but it’s as close as I could get.

I know this list definitely tilts closer to a wishlist than a realistic prediction but I tried to avoid being completely biased here with most of the choices. For example, on pure bias, I’d add Illidan over Waluigi. I tried to make the list more of a middle ground between a prediction and my most wanted. There’s definitely a few characters here like Magus and the Battletoads that aren’t particularly likely but I couldn’t leave out my two most wanted characters.

 

[BritishGuy54]

Okay, so…let’s say the next Smash had 50 veterans, 15 newcomers, and 5 Echo Fighters. That’s about 70 characters. What kind of roster would you guys be able to make with those numbers?

Veterans:



()
​

Spoiler: Veteran Reasons

• With this roster, it basically lines up perfectly with who I’m thinking will come back. After this, cuts get very hard. If I had to cut one more, it might honestly be between Ness or Little Mac.​
• Star Fox had the harshest cuts, with 66% of its representation cut.​
• Pokémon had the most cuts at 5 unique characters.​
• Many series that had no characters cut either were single-repped anyway, series that gained more popularity in the Switch era, or Kirby.​
• Konami and Square Enix have been completely cut due to lack of space.​

Newcomers:​

Paper Mario​	Impa​	Ring Fit Trainee​	Noah (or Mio)​
Isaac​	Oatchi​	DJ Octavio​	Chun-Li​
Shadow​	Meowscarada​	Bandana Dee​	Officer Howard​
Tom Nook​	Alear​	Waluigi​	Shy Guy (Bonus DLC)​

Spoiler: Newcomer Reasons

• Many of the newcomers are from the Switch era, besides the debatably nostalgic pick of Isaac (the GBA is retro, maybe).​
• Third party picks are toned down, with some expected characters to give more depth to big names like Sonic and Street Fighter.​
• The only major difference is the addition of Oatchi. I liked the proposal yesterday of his moveset. He could be fun and unique.​
• If Waluigi could be replaced by anyone, it would be Rayman. But maybe he could be DLC.​

Echo Fighters:​

​

​

Funky Kong​

Alvis​

Octoling​

Spoiler: Echo Reasons

• I had to cut two previous echoes. Explorer made sense to let go since Oatchi is joining in its wake.
• And Lucina was one of the weaker links of veteran echoes. We typically get around three newly developed clones every Smash game, like in Brawl or Smash 4.
• Daisy is too easy to bring after Mario Wonder.
• Dark Samus could be seen as future-proofing for Prime 2/Prime 3 remasters.
• Funky Kong is debatable to be an echo, but I think it makes enough sense. Everyone loves Funky Kong.
• If we only get one unique XC newcomer, I think adding an echo makes lot more sense. With Alvis having a major role in XC3’s DLC, he’d make a good echo for Shulk.
• Side Order has white ink. That somewhat alleviates the ‘limited alts’ argument.

In all honesty, I might actually like this roster more now than my previous one. All the difference one more unique face can make is astounding.

 

[NintenRob]

Okay, so…let’s say the next Smash had 50 veterans, 15 newcomers, and 5 Echo Fighters. That’s about 70 characters. What kind of roster would you guys be able to make with those numbers?

Question, how do those veteran echoes fit into this? I'm not gonna count them since it's already too difficult to fit 50 characters (nearly just went **** it and cut every third party since I prefer to keep the focus on Nintendo anyway). So assume Daisy, Dark Samus, Dark Pit, Lucina and Ken are here I guess. Chrom and Ricter were cut because their original was cut. I feel like I left out someone essential though

Anyway, let's see
Veterans

1. Mario
2. Luigi
3. Peach
4. Bowser
5. Rosalina
6. DK
7. Diddy
8. K Rool
9. Link
10. Zelda
11. Ganondorf
12. Samus
13. Ridley
14. Yoshi
15. Kirby
16. Meta Knight
17. King Dedede
18. Fox
19. Wolf
20. Pikachu
21. Pokémon Trainer
22. Mewtwo
23. Lucario
24. Greninja
25. Ness
26. Captain Falcon
27. Marth
28. Robin
29. Byleth
30. Mr. Game & Watch
31. R.O.B.
32. Olimar
33. Wario
34. Pit
35. Palutena
36. Villager
37. Isabelle
38. Wii Fit Trainer
39. Little Mac
40. Shulk
41. Pyra & Mythra
42. Inkling
43. Min Min
44. Sonic
45. Mega Man
46. Pac-Man
47. Ryu
48. Bayonetta
49. Banjo & Kazooie
50. Steve

Newcomers

1. Skull Kid
2. Bandana Dee
3. Dixie Kong
4. Pauline
5. Noah
6. Ashley (WarioWare)
7. Ring Fit Trainer
8. Some Obligatory new Pokémon. Doesn't exist yet, let's say the Gen 10 pseudo who I'll predict is the Champions ace
9. Impa (based on Skyward Sword)
10. Waluigi
11. Raven Beak
12. Squid Sisters
13. Magolor
14. Doom Guy
15. Dante

Echoes

1. Octoling (they could be swapped with Squid Sisters. I think they'll want to make Callie and Marie playable in some way)
2. Shadow
3. Mio (she and Noah use each others weapons in the moveset??
4. Funky Kong
5. Tom Nook (Isabelle or Villager, don't care)

My overall take. We need more 50 returning veterans I cut Jigglypuff when I definitely didn't want to. Ike and Falco were both there but had to be let go. I think cutting Kazuya is odd but I just couldn't fit him (plus I'm meh playing as him) I wanted to keep every first party franchise but still cut Duck Hunt and Ice Climbers. And like I'll admit, some newcomers additions felt like they'd be easy trades for cuts.


This is why I can't make roster predictions

 

[Sucumbio]

Last night I had a dream (or nightmare depending on how you feel) that they announced Smash Ultimate Deluxe for 79.99, it included all previously released fighters, 6 unique newcomers 3 more echoes and for just 20.00 more you can pre sign up for Fighters Pass 3 which includes 6 more newcomers over the next 18 months (one every 3 months). They also showcased a revamped WoL mode, and several quality of life upgrades with better online and they brought back some older modes like target test.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

I was just thinking how smash is so silly, because my two most wanted Nintendo characters look like this

 

[NintenRob]

Raven Beak would honestly be so cool. He's certainly a break out star from Dread. It doesn't seem likely to me unfortunately just because he's only really in one game but I'd love to be surprised

 

[Gengar84]

I’d love Raven Beak as well. Metroid Dread was the first Metroid game I ever beat (with the help of my friend with two particularly tough bosses). I think my top choice is still E.M.M.I. just because I love the idea of a character being able to run up walls and ceilings like an Alien and it just has an awesome design. Raven Beak is great too and is a specific character with a lot of story significance so that’s a strong point in his favor. I guess it comes down to whether they prioritize the marketing for Dread or the story if we get either.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

Raven Beak would honestly be so cool. He's certainly a break out star from Dread. It doesn't seem likely to me unfortunately just because he's only really in one game but I'd love to be surprised

Besides being in awe of how cool it is, 10 seconds into the Raven Beak boss fight my mind immediately went 'Hold up... the developers just gave him a Smash Moveset!"

As sacrilege as it would be to lose Ridley after we just got him in Ultimate, If I had to make the choice between him and Raven beak I would actually go with Raven Beak because he's that cool, although ideally I'd want to have both since they are both great.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Okay, so…let’s say the next Smash had 50 veterans, 15 newcomers, and 5 Echo Fighters. That’s about 70 characters. What kind of roster would you guys be able to make with those numbers?

50 veterans ?






Echoes:

: Echo of Lucina who has a new move set.
: Echo of Fox. Melee style clone like he was in Melee.
: Echo of Ness. Their move sets are merged into one.
: Hi I'm Daisy
+ Funky Kong.

Newcomers:

Impa
Dixie Kong
Isaac
Monster Hunter
Octoling / Splatoon newcomer
Ring Fit Trainer
Noah
Knuckles
Bandana Dee
That Pikmin 4 dog that that dude made a move set for
Garchomp cause he's a Pokemon and cool and a newcomer is inevitable
Waluigi cause a Mario newcomer is inevitable and I can't seem to "sell" Toad so yeah
Cranky Kong
Raven Beak
Takamaru

 

[Gengar84]

The only slight issue might be Raven Beak’s size. He’s pretty massive compared to Samus. They managed to make Ridley, K. Rool, and Bowser work by scaling them down so it’s certainly not impossible. I’m curious how big they’d make him so he still feels imposing. Would you be satisfied with him being Ganondorf sized? I’ve got the same issue with my proposed Noah/Mio Ouroboros fusion. I do wish there was a way we could get bigger characters in Smash without breaking the balance of the game. Bowser’s size in the spirit battles, for example, is pretty much perfect if they can make it work.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

The only slight issue might be Raven Beak’s size. He’s pretty massive compared to Samus. They managed to make Ridley, K. Rool, and Bowser work by scaling them down so it’s certainly not impossible. I’m curious how big they’d make him so he still feels imposing. Would you be satisfied with him being Ganondorf sized? I’ve got the same issue with my proposed Noah/Mio Ouroboros fusion. I do wish there was a way we could get bigger characters in Smash without breaking the balance of the game. Bowser’s size in the spirit battles, for example, is pretty much perfect if they can make it work.

I personally don't mind significant liberties taken with character sizes, the main thing is to me is that they sort of carry the "vibe" of a character. like for example Charizard should actually be shorter than he is in smash but I don't really think anybody would want to see Charizard like that as him being a Pokémon that is big enough to ride like a part of his appeal, so he should still have that appeal when compared to the other characters in smash as a large heavyweight. As long as Raven Beak is taller than Samus and can look down on her (both literally and metaphorically), I think his "vibes" are kept.

 

[Gorgonzales]

I personally don't mind significant liberties taken with character sizes, the main thing is to me is that they sort of carry the "vibe" of a character. like for example Charizard should actually be shorter than he is in smash but I don't really think anybody would want to see Charizard like that as him being a Pokémon that is big enough to ride like a part of his appeal, so he should still have that appeal when compared to the other characters in smash as a large heavyweight. As long as Raven Beak is taller than Samus and can look down on her (both literally and metaphorically), I think his "vibes" are kept.

Plus, I can't imagine a shrunk down Raven Beak looking weirder than the shrunk down Ridley we currently have anyways.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

The only slight issue might be Raven Beak’s size. He’s pretty massive compared to Samus. They managed to make Ridley, K. Rool, and Bowser work by scaling them down so it’s certainly not impossible. I’m curious how big they’d make him so he still feels imposing. Would you be satisfied with him being Ganondorf sized? I’ve got the same issue with my proposed Noah/Mio Ouroboros fusion. I do wish there was a way we could get bigger characters in Smash without breaking the balance of the game. Bowser’s size in the spirit battles, for example, is pretty much perfect if they can make it work.

Ok since I just made an image with of Raven Beak and Oatchi and had the program still open, I went ahead and thought i'd make a very rough potential height comparison if (also Roy is here too to give a comparison to give a comparison to another regular human the same size as Samus.)

Technically we can go even taller, as K. Rool, Bowser and Ridley are taller, although that is is K. Rool's Crown, Bowsers hair/horns and the top of Ridley's Wings

Edit: here is Raven Beak's actual height in Dread height, yeah he is like x2 the size of Samus. Personally doesn't bug me having that drastic of a size change for smash but thought I'd include it.

 

[ScrubReborn]

Bowser, K Rool and Ridley should all be bigger anyways. I've modded them to be about 20% bigger and in my experience it doesn't really break anything. Granted I feel that's pretty much the upper limit, you probably couldn't make characters much bigger than I made them before running into actual problems, so I somewhat understand where the devs are coming from. I just think their upper ceiling's too low.

 

[Will]

It makes sense for Raven Beak to be tall in Metroid, a game where your weapon shoots tiny projectiles.

He should match Ganon’s height if not taller— the difference between that and Samus’ height is staggering enough.

 

[Gengar84]

I personally don't mind significant liberties taken with character sizes, the main thing is to me is that they sort of carry the "vibe" of a character. like for example Charizard should actually be shorter than he is in smash but I don't really think anybody would want to see Charizard like that as him being a Pokémon that is big enough to ride like a part of his appeal, so he should still have that appeal when compared to the other characters in smash as a large heavyweight. As long as Raven Beak is taller than Samus and can look down on her (both literally and metaphorically), I think his "vibes" are kept.

Yeah, that makes sense. I can certainly live with sized down characters even if I’d prefer them to be bigger than they currently are. The biggest immersion breaker for me on size is that K. Rool is actually smaller than Donkey Kong in Smash. I feel like they should have made him at least a bit bigger than DK.

Onto another subject, I’m pretty excited for the Soul Reaver remaster and possible resurrection of that franchise as a whole. I was never very good at them but the story, characters, and aesthetic are so awesome. I hope those remasters generate enough sales and interest to justify a brand new game. The remasters are also coming to Switch so it’s cool to finally see them on Nintendo consoles. I doubt Raziel has much a chance for the next Smash but who knows in the future if this series catches on again? I think Raziel would be awesome in Smash. Darksiders is another similar series with really cool character designs I’d love to see someday.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

Bowser, K Rool and Ridley should all be bigger anyways. I've modded them to be about 20% bigger and in my experience it doesn't really break anything. Granted I feel that's pretty much the upper limit, you probably couldn't make characters much bigger than I made them before running into actual problems, so I somewhat understand where the devs are coming from. I just think their upper ceiling's too low.

It's a delicate balance they have to do since having a bigger hurtbox due to size makes you combo food, to balance this out characters with bigger hurtboxes usually have much higher weights. The problem is smash has to balance to be fun for both for high level 1v1s and casual Free For Alls, and in casual games where people are less likely to do combos, so having more weight is actually much stronger than it is in 1v1s.

unless you're Mewtwo and you get a huge hurtbox and are a featherweight

It makes sense for Raven Beak to be tall in Metroid, a game where your weapon shoots tiny projectiles.

He should match Ganon’s height if not taller— the difference between that and Samus’ height is staggering enough.

"Don't Talk to me or my son ever again."

 

[Louie G.]

Edit: here is Raven Beak's actual height in Dread height, yeah he is like x2 the size of Samus. Personally doesn't bug me having that drastic of a size change for smash but thought I'd include it.View attachment 394879

Yeah, this reminds me a lot of how the conversation around K. Room typically went. Proportions are clearly not an issue but we are working with a character who is noticeably taller than an already fairly tall character. It’s all about keeping that imposing attitude which Smash has managed to do consistently. Inclined to agree that a Ganondorf-sized Raven Beak would do the job just fine, I don’t think his size accuracy is very important outside of simply being “bigger than” others.

 

[Gengar84]

Yeah, I agree that larger characters can be tricky to balance due to their hurtboxes. I’m not entirely sure what the best solution to that would be, if there is one. From a purely casual perspective, there’s just something really cool about playing as huge, hulking characters and a bit of that appeal is lost if you scale them down too much. The same goes for making previously slower heavyweights lighter and faster to make them more competitive. I get that it might be necessary for competitive balance but they lose some of that cool factor in the process.

That said, I’d gladly sacrifice some immersion and accuracy if that’s the only way we can get a particular character in Smash. While I’d prefer these characters be sized up at least a bit from what they are, a scaled down character is much better than not having them at all in my opinion.

 

[Potted Plant]

Okay, so…let’s say the next Smash had 50 veterans, 15 newcomers, and 5 Echo Fighters. That’s about 70 characters. What kind of roster would you guys be able to make with those numbers?

I'll take a crack at this

VETERANS

1. Mario
2. Luigi
3. Peach
4. Bowser
5. Donkey Kong
6. Diddy Kong (RW, now a tag-team fighter with Dixie)
7. King K. Rool
8. Wario
9. Link (Hero of Legend design)
10. Zelda (BotW/TotK design)
11. Ganondorf (OoT design)
12. Samus
13. Ridley
14. Pikachu
15. Mewtwo
16. Lucario
17. Greninja
18. Fox
19. Wolf
20. Kirby
21. King Dedede
22. Meta Knight
23. Yoshi
24. Captain Falcon
25. Ness
26. Lucas
27. Pit
28. Palutena
29. Isabelle
30. Olimar
31. Inkling
32. Mr. Game & Watch
33. Little Mac
34. Wii Fit Trainer
35. R.O.B.
36. Marth
37. Ike
38. Robin
39. Byleth
40. Shulk
41. Pyra/Mythra
42. Sonic
43. Pac-Man
44. Mega Man
45. Banjo-Kazooie
46. Steve
47. Simon
48. Cloud
49. Hero
50. Mii Fighters

NEWCOMERS:

1. Andy
2. Demi-Fiend
3. Dr. Eggman
4. Hisuian Trainer (Cyndaquil, Dewott, Hisuian Decidueye lineup)
5. Impa (Skyward Sword design, Hyrule Warriors moveset)
6. Isaac
7. Noah/Mio
8. Officer Howard
9. Professor Layton
10. Raven Beak
11. Savvy Stylist
12. Tom Nook
13. Vaati
14. Waluigi
15. Yuka

(would've worked in a new Kirby character or Doomslayer if I could)

ECHOES:

1. Bill (Star Fox)
2. Blood Falcon
3. Octoling
4. Proto Man
5. Zack Fair

 

[Kirby Dragons]

I'm fine with decreasing sizes, but it'd be weird to see massive characters like Kraid get scaled down to be playable. It's a bit unfortunate to have someone like Rathalos not be able to be playable because of its size, but it is what it is.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I think Super Metroid Ridley is probably the limit for downsizing a character to a playable size. Any bigger than that and things start to get weird.

Man I sure am glad we're having this discussion after Ridley is already playable, LMAO

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

I'm fine with decreasing sizes, but it'd be weird to see massive characters like Kraid get scaled down to be playable. It's a bit unfortunate to have someone like Rathalos not be able to be playable because of its size, but it is what it is.

Oh yeah, then explain this image /s

Though on the topic of Rathalos you could technically have him be playable size if you went for the Monster Hunter Stories version, but I kinda doubt people really want to play as baby Rathalos

 

[Gengar84]

I'm fine with decreasing sizes, but it'd be weird to see massive characters like Kraid get scaled down to be playable. It's a bit unfortunate to have someone like Rathalos not be able to be playable because of its size, but it is what it is.

I think baby Rathalos and its rider from Monster Hunter Stories could actually work as a character. I think that would probably be the most interesting choice for the franchise personally since it gives you both the protagonist and most popular monster in one character.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

I think baby Rathalos and its rider from Monster Hunter Stories could actually work as a character. I think that would probably be the most interesting choice for the franchise personally since it gives you both the protagonist and most popular monster in one character.

They did get an Amiibo, although that really doesnt particularly mean anything for smash

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

I think Super Metroid Ridley is probably the limit for downsizing a character to a playable size. Any bigger than that and things start to get weird.

Man I sure am glad we're having this discussion after Ridley is already playable, LMAO

Like Honey Queen?

 

[Kirby Dragons]

Okay, so…let’s say the next Smash had 50 veterans, 15 newcomers, and 5 Echo Fighters. That’s about 70 characters. What kind of roster would you guys be able to make with those numbers?

Okay, I'll work with my pre-created roster for this.

Spoiler

For veterans, cut Simon, Kazuya, and Bayonetta.
Add back Lucina as an echo.
For newcomers, cut Pauline, Krystal, Andy, Karate Joe, Amazon Pandora, Shop Assistant, Crazy Dave, Ghirahim, Starfy, Shadow, Morrigan, Kamek, Dixie, Urban Champion, Twintelle, and Okabe.
Then add Alph as an echo, and bring back Dixie and Shadow as echoes. Then we can have Matthew as an echo for Isaac.

So here'd be the roster.

1. Mario
2. Luigi
3. Peach
4. Bowser
5. Daisy
6. Rosalina & Luma
7. King Boo
8. Donkey Kong
9. Diddy Kong
10. Dixie Kong (Echo)
11. King K. Rool
12. Yoshi
13. Wario
14. Ashley & Red
15. Link
16. Zelda
17. Ganondorf
18. Midna
19. Inkling
20. Samus
21. Ridley
22. Dark Samus
23. Marth
24. Lucina (Echo)
25. Ike
26. Robin
27. Shulk
28. Pyra/Mythra
29. Pit
30. Palutena
31. Isabelle
32. Kirby
33. King Dedede
34. Meta Knight
35. Bandana Waddle Dee
36. Little Mac
37. Pikachu
38. Mewtwo
39. Pokemon Trainer
40. Lucario
41. Greninja
42. Dragapult
43. Iron Valiant
44. Fox
45. Mr. Game & Watch
46. Ice Climbers
47. Olimar
48. Alph (Echo)
49. Wii Fit Trainer
50. Takamaru
51. Isaac
52. Matthew (Echo)
53. V-Raptor
54. Sonic
55. Shadow (Echo)
56. Pac-Man
57. Mega Man
58. Ryu
59. Banjo-Kazooie
60. Steve
61. Dovahkiin
62. Snake
63. Cloud
64. Sora
65. Terry
66. Athena
67. Maxwell
68. Scorpion
69. Sol
70. Narmaya

 

[Will]

Yall making my scrolling thumb work hard today with these long ass lists.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Bowser, K Rool and Ridley should all be bigger anyways. I've modded them to be about 20% bigger and in my experience it doesn't really break anything. Granted I feel that's pretty much the upper limit, you probably couldn't make characters much bigger than I made them before running into actual problems, so I somewhat understand where the devs are coming from. I just think their upper ceiling's too low.

Range, armor, disjointed stuff and weight. They could need this all and it would be a massive buff cause heavies are basically always bad.

Only DK manages. Sometimes. Melee, Smash 4 and Ultimate a little. But he should actually be a little smaller, with the same reach. Or something.

 

[Mamboo07]

Okay, so…let’s say the next Smash had 50 veterans, 15 newcomers, and 5 Echo Fighters. That’s about 70 characters. What kind of roster would you guys be able to make with those numbers?

Alrighty, here I go!
Veterans

1. 
2. 
3. 
4. (Promoted from Echo to full-on Fighter with own moveset)
5. 
6. 
7. 
8. 
9. 
10. 
11. (Now a tag-team with Dixie Kong so fans of her don't feel left out)
12. 
13. 
14. (BotW/TofK design)
15. (TotK design)
16. (More updated moveset)
17. 
18. 
19. 
20. 
21. 
22. 
23. 
24. 
25. 
26. 
27. 
28. 
29. 
30. 
31. 
32. 
33. 
    
34. 
35. / (Rex now fights alongside them)
36. 
37. 
38. 
39. 
40. 
    
41. 
    
42. 
43. 
44. 
45. 
46. 
47. 
    
48. 
49. 
50. (//)

Newcomers

1. Waluigi
2. Bandana Dee
3. Noah/Mio
4. Raven Beak
5. Impa
6. Alear
7. Gen 9 Pokémon
8. Tom Nook
9. Excitebiker (Retro rep)
10. Otachi/Pikmin 4 Captain
11. Officer Howard
12. Dr. Eggman
13. Chun-Li
14. Doom Slayer
15. Crash Bandicoot

Echoes

1. Medusa ()
2. Black Shadow ()
3. King D-Mind ()
4. Octoling ()
5. Proto Man ()

 

[Dukefire]

Not to see another potential salt, but when do you think Nintendo will announce the Fall Nintendo Direct in October? At least September had the bigger companies announce their content first, so less competition for the remainder of the season.

 

[CannonStreak]

Not to see another potential salt, but when do you think Nintendo will announce the Fall Nintendo Direct in October? At least September had the bigger companies announce their content first, so less competition for the remainder of the season.

Hopefully next week, though this is just a guess.

 

[Louie G.]

Okay, so…let’s say the next Smash had 50 veterans, 15 newcomers, and 5 Echo Fighters. That’s about 70 characters. What kind of roster would you guys be able to make with those numbers?

Waluigi, Skull Kid, Edelgard, Oatchi, Tom Nook, Off the Hook
Chorus Kids, Isaac, Excitebiker, Ring Fit Trainee
Chun-Li, Arle Nadja, Jill Valentine, Sans
and a new Pokemon, I guess. Ogerpon?

+ Octoling, Leon Kennedy
​

Should go without saying, but this isn't totally realistic. There are some lapses here, infused my personal tastes and biases with my real expectations (see: the Pokemon lineup) but all in all I think this is a roster I could live with. There's another pass of this where I could have managed every first party series to return and cut off supplemental picks like Palutena or Wolf, but this is where my heart was at today. Also yeah, I kept Wolf over Falco just to keep things fresh. I wish all three would come back. I just think Ultimate Wolf is one of the coolest characters in the series and I don't wanna lose him yet.

Also should be apparent from my priorities here but I tend to like to keep the third parties concise. Cutting guest characters loose is far easier for me than removing mainstay / favorite Nintendo characters. I'm personally fine with them treating guests as somewhat of a revolving door with a handful of key exceptions. You can debate me on which guests deserve that role but I feel like these six are agreeable enough.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

My issue with Ravenbeak (and by extension, Sylux) is that he's another character in power armor who fights with an arm cannon. With Dark Samus sticking around, that brings us to three characters with that kind of power fantasy, and I'm not sure that's the best idea for variety reasons, especially if we're cutting a whole bunch of characters.

Although, I suppose what I'm worried about is reception due to repeated concepts on the roster generally being viewed with disdain, which is a little silly considering how many people want him. lol

 

[Gengar84]

My issue with Ravenbeak (and by extension, Sylux) is that he's another character in power armor who fights with an arm cannon. With Dark Samus sticking around, that brings us to three characters with that kind of power fantasy, and I'm not sure that's the best idea for variety reasons, especially if we're cutting a whole bunch of characters.

Although, I suppose what I'm worried about is reception due to repeated concepts on the roster generally being viewed with disdain, which is a little silly considering how many people want him. lol

Mega Man would make that 4 (and another for Zero if we get him). I don’t think that’s necessarily a problem since they’re all cool and have unique moveset potential but I get wanting more weapon variety. I guess that’s another point in E.M.M.I.’s favor if you’d rather see another Metroid character without an arm cannon.

 

[Dukefire]

My issue with Ravenbeak (and by extension, Sylux) is that he's another character in power armor who fights with an arm cannon. With Dark Samus sticking around, that brings us to three characters with that kind of power fantasy, and I'm not sure that's the best idea for variety reasons, especially if we're cutting a whole bunch of characters.

Although, I suppose what I'm worried about is reception due to repeated concepts on the roster generally being viewed with disdain, which is a little silly considering how many people want him. lol

I bet the next complaint is too many power suit characters. Any newcomers that fill in a niche category, many usually don't mind. Until people start bringing it up. Examples.....

Too many Anime Swordman fighters
Too many Fire Emblem characters

 

[Kirby Dragons]

My issue with Ravenbeak (and by extension, Sylux) is that he's another character in power armor who fights with an arm cannon. With Dark Samus sticking around, that brings us to three characters with that kind of power fantasy, and I'm not sure that's the best idea for variety reasons, especially if we're cutting a whole bunch of characters.

Although, I suppose what I'm worried about is reception due to repeated concepts on the roster generally being viewed with disdain, which is a little silly considering how many people want him. lol

I indeed like a variety in fighting styles, but I recognize we can't have an infinite amount of it. When I design movesets, I consider it a fun challenge to differentiate the character from similar characters.

 

[Louie G.]

Although, I suppose what I'm worried about is reception due to repeated concepts on the roster generally being viewed with disdain, which is a little silly considering how many people want him. lol

I don't see Metroid becoming a very controversial series roster-wise, Raven Beak is a very popular character and has a strong "rule of cool" effect. Metroid is also a series that historically is treated with a lot of reverence and perhaps a bit of bias within the community internally. It and Donkey Kong had been essentially the community darlings since post-Brawl and while I think most people are satisfied with where Metroid is at after the addition of Ridley and Dark Samus, I can't see anyone rebelling against the prospect of more.

Besides, Raven Beak would probably be a bit more physical than Samus is, maybe even have some grappler or command grab stuff going on. I can't see him being anything less than an instant favorite among the fans, to be honest.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Mega Man would make that 4 (and another for Zero if we get him).

I never considered Mega Man that way since...well for one, it's not power armor, but also he gives off a very different vibe since he's cartooney and you can see his face (even if it isn't super expressive grumble grumble).

Zero definitely wouldn't fall into this camp since even if they give him the Z Buster, the Z-Saber is going to be the star of the show there. X I think could fit though.

Besides, Raven Beak would probably be a bit more physical than Samus is, maybe even have some grappler or command grab stuff going on. I can't see him being anything less than an instant favorite among the fans, to be honest.

I want the part where he rips off his wing to be an install or something, though in practice that would probably be really clunky...

...This train of thought lead me to picturing the torn off wing becoming an item that you can beat people with. lol

 

[Gengar84]

I never considered Mega Man that way since...well for one, it's not power armor, but also he gives off a very different vibe since he's cartooney and you can see his face (even if it isn't super expressive grumble grumble).

Zero definitely wouldn't fall into this camp since even if they give him the Z Buster, the Z-Saber is going to be the star of the show there. X I think could fit though.


I want the part where he rips off his wing to be an install or something, though in practice that would probably be really clunky...

...This train of thought lead me to picturing the torn off wing becoming an item that you can beat people with. lol

Yeah, I can see that. I’ve always grouped Mega Man, Zero, and Samus together since they’re all futuristic characters with arm cannons and some kind of armor but they’re definitely pretty different. Part of why it wouldn’t really bother me despite sharing similar weapons.

Here’s a question: Do you think we’ll see any currently unrepresented series get more than one character, whether they be unique or echoes? We did get Simon and Richter in Ultimate. If they can work out something for Mortal Kombat, I can see both Scorpion and Sub-Zero make it in as semiclones. I’d also love to see Astral Chain get both Officer Howard and Jenna Anderson too.