Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[SMAASH! Puppy]

This is honestly why Partners played such a big role to be fair. In Paper Mario, oddly, the most bland character, is Mario. Mario has no personality besides "The Hero" and remains a near-silent protagonist through the game, while Partners had life to them, giving the party a quirky voice and personality.


It's why the Mario&Luigi series was soo vibrant. Mario on his own is dull, Mario WITH someone to play off of is enjoyable.

Spin-offs like the RPGs, Luigi's Mansion, and Super Princess Peach are pretty much always a treat since pretty much everyone has the same personality as Mario in all the mainseries, kart, and sports games. These spin-offs let them shine on in ways they can't (or just don't) in the main series. Super Smash Bros. is probably the only platformer where this happens too. EDIT: Where this happens for all of the characters in the same game. Luigi is characterized in the galaxy games and Peach is characterized in her own platformer.

Wild Guns is definitely not obscure lol

Well I've never heard of it so it must be obscure even though. Well, I wasn't alive during the NES days so I wouldn't know anyway but still! Obscure!

 

[ZelDan]

Interesting selection of games for the NES/SNES channels for NSO. Honestly, it's the more obscure but still good games that help to make the NSO service more worth. Games like SMB3, ALttP, Super metroid are obviously great but they are still games most of us have already played or have various other platforms to play them through.

That said, where the hell is Star tropics 2 Nintendo?

 

[KillerCage]

Panel De Pon is getting released in US.

Finally I get to play Panel De Pon!
My only experience with this series was with this game.

 

[Arcadenik]

Finally I get to play Panel De Pon!
My only experience with this series was with this game.
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I only played two Puzzle League games. Tetris Attack for the SNES and Pokémon Puzzle League for the N64.

So Panel de Pon finally comes to North America... could Lip get in Smash soon?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I only played two Puzzle League games. Tetris Attack for the SNES and Pokémon Puzzle League for the N64.

So Panel de Pon finally comes to North America... could Lip get in Smash soon?

I feel like Lip’s chances have increased a fair amount for next game at least. Or at least, replace the Lip’s Stick with a Lip AT if they still don’t wanna make her playable. At least AT appearances will increase interest in her series, I became interested in the Sin And Punishment series with Saki’s AT

 

[Shroob]

I found the sticker system the first good inventory system in the game. You had actual space to pick up items. Of course, yeah, the battles were poor. They had an interesting idea, but the game is really unbalanced. The Sticker system was however ingenious, outside of the inability to attack for free. The card system requiring paint, though? That felt very tacked on.

That said, TTYD is fun, but the badge system is broken as hell in that game. You were able to be 99% invincible effectively and it wasn't even hard to get to. You just had to avoid leveling up enough so you never had to level up HP. There's too many special badges, and that was an issue in itself. It was a fun game, but balanced? No. Super Paper Mario had more balance in comparison, and I felt the enemies got a bit too tough near the end of the game(though the Dark Challenge was meant to be highly difficult, but it was only a bit overwhelming with a bad inventory. A few more items and it would be still difficult but not too much in general).

Something people aren't realizing is Miyamoto did tell them outright to stop using OC's as is, as well as change up the battle system. The stickers/cards were already intended to be in, so the battle system was going to see changes. More than likely, the "free attack" with your hammer/boots wasn't even going to be a thing, partners or not.

Of course it lost some of its charm. It was effectively forced to do so. The lack of a story isn't Miyamoto's fault, nor is the sticker system.

Besides, it sucks, but they already made it clear this is the core direction the series is going in and intends to stay there. I'm sure we can get better characters again once Miyamoto no longer is at the helm. But to be frank, the Badge System went too far. It shouldn't be that abusable in a balanced game. There wasn't even a better option over Danger Mario. My guess is part of why the badge system is gone is to help separate it from the Mario & Luigi series, by focusing more on the Paper after TTYD made it a pretty important thing. As for the paper abilities, I feel this is the reason Paper Mario truly stands out as a person over Mario. They're two different people, one from more of a storybook while the other from the real world. Paper Jam I won't argue is a great game, but I felt they massively improved the character with that. Paper is his identity.

I'm not too cut up about the badge system being gone to be frank.

While it had its flaws, ever evidence by Danger and Peril strats, it was effectively the replacement for equipment like in other RPGs. Yes, it definitely had glaring issues but, I'm sorry, I can't agree that the sticker system was good in any ways.


There was just zero reason to engage in battle in Sticker Star, like, none, and the fact that your basic attacks were tied to Stickers, sure, stickers were literally EVERYWHERE, so the chance to run out was almost non-existant, but the fact that was even a possibility was TERRIBLE game design.


Imagine if Cloud's Buster Sword broke mid fight, thus leaving him helpless and afterwards he'd have to run to a shop to go buy a ton of Swords to replace that sword that broke. That's not fun or innovative, which is, IMO, one of the best things that recent Fire Emblem titles have done, and what was a huge gripe of mine in BotW. Weapon durability is ass. The feeling of being unable to fight back in a game with combat is one of the worst feelings in the world for a player, and having that soo easily possible in a game like Sticker Star just can't be overlooked.


Not only that but, from when I ran through Sticker Star, TWICE mind you, certain bosses were almost impossible to fight without EXTREMELY specific Thing stickers, and if not "Impossible", then extremely difficult, meaning backtracking was painful as hell.

 

[Just a random scrub]

Alright then, I just personally think he’d be very cool. Admittedly I’m not sure what differences he’d have aside from weight, some move differences, and his personality, I just thought it was a cool idea and I think he could be a fun Mario alternative...

Though, I would also love Paper Mario, I just said the three-Mario thing as a bit of a joke because some people seemed to dislike even him for it...

IMO, It'd be interesting if Metal Mario got Mario's old moveset from Smash 64 (like his drill kick forward air, beefy back air, punch forward smash, etc), and if most of his other moves were tweaked to resemble 64 more. I thought of that idea a while back, and I think it could make an interesting callback fighter.

 

[Cosmic77]

I feel like Lip’s chances have increased a fair amount for next game at least. Or at least, replace the Lip’s Stick with a Lip AT if they still don’t wanna make her playable. At least AT appearances will increase interest in her series, I became interested in the Sin And Punishment series with Saki’s AT

Even if Lip became an AT, I don't expect her to make the roster any time soon. Sakurai said he rejected Takamaru in Smash 4 because he was afraid the West wouldn't recognize him, and that didn't change in Ultimate.

I know Lip has a fair amount of support on this site, but I rarely see her brought up anywhere else. If things stay the way they currently are, I don't see Sakurai going out of his way to give Lip one of the precious limited spots on the roster.

 

[RouffWestie]

jk I don't think Arle's chances are genuinely going anywhere, just a joke I wanted to make
I don't know why they just now localized it, but hey, people had been asking for it a lot more than a few years ago so I guess Nintendo actually listened this time. To be honest, the Puzzle League gameplay is fun no matter who they make the face. Personally I recommend the DS game because of it's touch mechanics.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Imagine if Cloud's Buster Sword broke mid fight, thus leaving him helpless and afterwards he'd have to run to a shop to go buy a ton of Swords to replace that sword that broke. That's not fun or innovative, which is, IMO, one of the best things that recent Fire Emblem titles have done, and what was a huge gripe of mine in BotW. Weapon durability is ass. The feeling of being unable to fight back in a game with combat is one of the worst feelings in the world for a player, and having that soo easily possible in a game like Sticker Star just can't be overlooked.

You've got options in BotW should your weapon break. Plus with the amount of options you get to replace weapons and unconventional attack methods you should be fine. I honestly found it similar to higher levels of difficulty in Halo and other FPS where you're made to keep swapping weapons as you progress due to ammo constraints.

Even with the what if example for FFVII, you've got two other party members and a bunch of MP to use. I've played the first SaGa game (Final Fantasy Legend) which is a traditional turn based RPG with weapon durability and it honestly worked fine. The difference there, however, is that there's incentive to fight battles.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I'm not too cut up about the badge system being gone to be frank.

While it had its flaws, ever evidence by Danger and Peril strats, it was effectively the replacement for equipment like in other RPGs. Yes, it definitely had glaring issues but, I'm sorry, I can't agree that the sticker system was good in any ways.

I don't see any actual issues with the Stickers beyond the dumb idea you can't perform any move without them. And Badges are equipment, but they went too far in TTYD. You can't generally min max that much in your general rpg. Even SMRPG, where you had some powerful items, didn't make you that broken. Culex could still kick your ass.

There was just zero reason to engage in battle in Sticker Star, like, none, and the fact that your basic attacks were tied to Stickers, sure, stickers were literally EVERYWHERE, so the chance to run out was almost non-existant, but the fact that was even a possibility was TERRIBLE game design.

I already spoke of this flaw in it. But it's the only flaw I see. An immensely huge inventory after how tiny the first three games? That's a giant leap in good game design. The Things were absolutely dumb as puzzles, but were awesome as items. The stickers having a size factor was also good inventory design as it means you had to think carefully about how to build your options.

Imagine if Cloud's Buster Sword broke mid fight, thus leaving him helpless and afterwards he'd have to run to a shop to go buy a ton of Swords to replace that sword that broke. That's not fun or innovative, which is, IMO, one of the best things that recent Fire Emblem titles have done, and what was a huge gripe of mine in BotW. Weapon durability is ass. The feeling of being unable to fight back in a game with combat is one of the worst feelings in the world for a player, and having that soo easily possible in a game like Sticker Star just can't be overlooked.

Again, I covered this already. A complete inability to attack is the core flaw with the sticker system as an inventory, but it's the only actual flaw overall. It made for a cool idea to have Kamek temporarily disable certain stickers, which means you could have a proper game challenge during a fight. I found this an excellent way to handle it. Things being stickers aren't the issue with them, it's the completely poor roadblocks that got confusing as hell without paying someone for a hint.

Battles being pointless isn't a sticker problem in the same way(the sole issue comes from a lack of a basic non-consumable attack to begin with). It's them outright not using proper RPG level up mechanics at all. It wouldn't have been that hard to gain HP and Defense after a few battles, like Super Paper Mario did. That's more than good enough. And makes sense since inventory upgrades were story-based. I honestly found that the story being hyper bland and SMB3 at best a far bigger problem. The actual battle system worked pretty well, being a good callback to the classic one. You just didn't get free badge defenses like Zap Tap, which to be honest, was actually... overpowered.

Not only that but, from when I ran through Sticker Star, TWICE mind you, certain bosses were almost impossible to fight without EXTREMELY specific Thing stickers, and if not "Impossible", then extremely difficult, meaning backtracking was painful as hell.

You see, I don't consider this an issue with the sticker system in itself. I consider this an issue with how dumb it was to make bosses having only one weakness which you had to go out of your way to find. Some where a Thing can be somewhat effective, even if it's not their hard weakness. This is a poor design idea around the bosses being all "I have no way to be beaten except by that oddly specific thing", which isn't inherently a battle system problem or a Sticker problem in itself. It's a dumb idea on how to do the bosses. It's the same thing as needing a Thing to remove a roadblock. Extremely confusing and pointless. This is basically what they did to make it a "puzzle" game, except despite the Things being kind of cool in itself as normal battle items, they were really poorly executed in Sticker Star. I'm pretty sure Color Splash handled it better, at least.

 

[Mamboo07]

If Lip gets into Smash, I wanna see her beat up Yoshi and Pikachu.

 

[Shroob]

You've got options in BotW should your weapon break. Plus with the amount of options you get to replace weapons and unconventional attack methods you should be fine. I honestly found it similar to higher levels of difficulty in Halo and other FPS where you're made to keep swapping weapons as you progress due to ammo constraints.

Even with the what if example for FFVII, you've got two other party members and a bunch of MP to use. I've played the first SaGa game (Final Fantasy Legend) which is a traditional turn based RPG with weapon durability and it honestly worked fine. The difference there, however, is that there's incentive to fight battles.

My point is though that a game really shouldn't remove your ability to do something as simple as throw a punch. While weapon durability in BotW sucks yes, you still have things like bombs or magnetism if push comes to absolute shove.


It's HIGHLY unlikely that will happen in Sticker Star, due to how many stickers they vomit at you, but that even being an option is just not good game design, on top of an already bad game.

 

[Koopaul]

Like clockwork. Anytime a new thing is announced from Nintendo you'll see people jumping on the idea of it getting added to Smash.

 

[Shroob]

I don't see any actual issues with the Stickers beyond the dumb idea you can't perform any move without them. And Badges are equipment, but they went too far in TTYD. You can't generally min max that much in your general rpg. Even SMRPG, where you had some powerful items, didn't make you that broken. Culex could still kick your ass.


I already spoke of this flaw in it. But it's the only flaw I see. An immensely huge inventory after how tiny the first three games? That's a giant leap in good game design. The Things were absolutely dumb as puzzles, but were awesome as items. The stickers having a size factor was also good inventory design as it means you had to think carefully about how to build your options.


Again, I covered this already. A complete inability to attack is the core flaw with the sticker system as an inventory, but it's the only actual flaw overall. It made for a cool idea to have Kamek temporarily disable certain stickers, which means you could have a proper game challenge during a fight. I found this an excellent way to handle it. Things being stickers aren't the issue with them, it's the completely poor roadblocks that got confusing as hell without paying someone for a hint.

Battles being pointless isn't a sticker problem in the same way(the sole issue comes from a lack of a basic non-consumable attack to begin with). It's them outright not using proper RPG level up mechanics at all. It wouldn't have been that hard to gain HP and Defense after a few battles, like Super Paper Mario did. That's more than good enough. And makes sense since inventory upgrades were story-based. I honestly found that the story being hyper bland and SMB3 at best a far bigger problem. The actual battle system worked pretty well, being a good callback to the classic one. You just didn't get free badge defenses like Zap Tap, which to be honest, was actually... overpowered.


You see, I don't consider this an issue with the sticker system in itself. I consider this an issue with how dumb it was to make bosses having only one weakness which you had to go out of your way to find. Some where a Thing can be somewhat effective, even if it's not their hard weakness. This is a poor design idea around the bosses being all "I have no way to be beaten except by that oddly specific thing", which isn't inherently a battle system problem or a Sticker problem in itself. It's a dumb idea on how to do the bosses. It's the same thing as needing a Thing to remove a roadblock. Extremely confusing and pointless. This is basically what they did to make it a "puzzle" game, except despite the Things being kind of cool in itself as normal battle items, they were really poorly executed in Sticker Star. I'm pretty sure Color Splash handled it better, at least.

My argument to this is:

An inventory is only as good as the items necessary to progress, and the necessity for them.


Sure, you have a big inventory now, but you don't need it. Battles outside of boss fights are 99% pointless, so even though you have a much larger inventory space, it's pointless outside boss fights since you have, again, 0 reason to fight common enemies.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

My argument to this is:

An inventory is only as good as the items necessary to progress, and the necessity for them.


Sure, you have a big inventory now, but you don't need it. Battles outside of boss fights are 99% pointless, so even though you have a much larger inventory space, it's pointless outside boss fights since you have, again, 0 reason to fight common enemies.

Yeah, I find an inventory only good if it gives you tons of options. I never found "progress only" a good thing. I vastly dislike linear rpg's that only have one hard route. I want tons of consumable options. I prefer big inventories(as long as they're easy to scroll through).

I feel it's needed enough for its purpose. I feel the first three games had beyond awful inventories and should've been way bigger as is. The problem is they just poured on the stats too high in TTYD/SPM to not encourage min-maxing/extremely strong items. The difficulty jumped up way too fast. Having more items is good.

I also vastly prefer random battles that aren't just about progression. I still agree battles should stick to more CS or better, where battling gives you actual experience, though.

I get what you're saying, but I do consider the larger inventory a massive step in a good direction. Battles sucked. The stickers didn't suck, though.

 

[Ace C.R.O.S.S.]

Paper Mario
Lanky Kong
Dhalsim
Bravoman
Mr Fantastic
Elastigirl

They could have a thing going there

Woah! Someone remembered Bravo Man?

 

[chocolatejr9]

Like clockwork. Anytime a new thing is announced from Nintendo you'll see people jumping on the idea of it getting added to Smash.

One of the few universal constants.

 

[PeridotGX]

Like clockwork. Anytime a new thing is announced from Nintendo you'll see people jumping on the idea of it getting added to Smash.

New Paper Mario: "They should add Paper Mario!"

New Animal Crossing: "They should add Tom Nook!"

PMD Remake: "

".

 

[slrigeigdew]

Yup, I'm thinking he's in

Spoiler

 

[PLATINUM7]

New Paper Mario: "They should add Paper Mario!"

New Animal Crossing: "They should add Tom Nook!"

PMD Remake:

Did you not see people asking for Grovyle again?

 

[PSIGuy]

I keep forgetting that Paper Mario isn't dead just because it's been dead to me for years. Getting Paper Mario in Smash would be more like Banjo-Kazooie than ARMS because I think of the games I liked 15 years ago and not whatever garbage they've actually been in recently.

 

[PeridotGX]

Did you not see people asking for Grovyle again?

to the best of my knowledge, I am the only Grovyle supporter that is particularly vocal.

 

[Opossum]

Can't say I understand the resistance to Paper Mario being our third Mario when he can do all of this.

View attachment 271766

I might be able to understand it if Super Mario hadn't gotten a character in ages and this was Sakurai's answer to that long wait, but I see people all the time bring up "Masked Link", BotW Zelda, and Pig Ganon with a lot of enthusiasm. I also rarely hear people complain about Dark Samus.

What he can do doesn't change the fact that, at the end of the day, he's still Mario. That's my issue. It's the same issue I take with characters like Dr. Mario, Young Link, and Zero Suit Samus.

 

[ZelDan]

What he can do doesn't change the fact that, at the end of the day, he's still Mario. That's my issue. It's the same issue I take with characters like Dr. Mario, Young Link, and Zero Suit Samus.

Same how I feel. Though I can kinda accept ZSS since she looks much different from regular Samus and has a different moveset.

Paper Mario would have a different moveset, so there's that. he would still look like Mario though so Paper Mario would still largely be unexciting to me.

 

[krokotopia101]

What he can do doesn't change the fact that, at the end of the day, he's still Mario. That's my issue. It's the same issue I take with characters like Dr. Mario, Young Link, and Zero Suit Samus.

Ahhh, those good ol' days when Zelda/Sheik & Samus/ZSS were one person.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Panel De Pon is getting released in US.

**** yeah! Rygar and Wild Guns!

I wish these releases got Spirit Events the way new game releases do.

 

[Garteam]

If Paper Mario gets into Smash, his spotdodge should just be leaning slightly back so the top half of his body bends into the z-axis.

I'm not sure how Origami King really increases his chances (I think it's releasing a little too early to justify getting a / promotional pick), but Paper Mario would still have a super fun and unique moveset that could be taken in a million different directions.

I kinda get the "He's another Mario argument", but he'd be so dramatically different that it would really only be the same character in name and general appearance only. I personally think double dipping on an individual character is fine if they bring a completely new angle to the way the character acts, which Paper Mario definitely does. I could see it bothering some, but if the decision can be justified in gameplay then its not a huge deal.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Yup, I'm thinking he's in

Spoiler

View attachment 271798

Already has his theme too.

Spoiler

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

What he can do doesn't change the fact that, at the end of the day, he's still Mario. That's my issue. It's the same issue I take with characters like Dr. Mario, Young Link, and Zero Suit Samus.

How dare you bad mouth The Doc and Young Link and HOW DARE you make a fair argument about them.

 

[Vintage Creep]

I don't feel like Paper Mario needs a game releasing close to his announcement to justify his inclusion. His games already sell well so he would get in simply because of his legacy. Surely Origami King helps his chances though.

 

[Shroob]

I don't feel like Paper Mario needs a game releasing close to his announcement to justify his inclusion. His games already sell well so he would get in simply because of his legacy. Surely Origami King helps his chances though.

"Sell well"

I mean, that's a bit debatable, sadly.

Sticker Star is the 2nd best selling game in the series at like 2.7 million or something.



It's not bad but, when you see colossal sales of Switch games in the 10 million range, it's hard to call shy of 3 mil "Well", though, maybe my standards are just unreasonably high. Color Splash sold like **** though.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I don't feel like Paper Mario needs a game releasing close to his announcement to justify his inclusion. His games already sell well so he would get in simply because of his legacy. Surely Origami King helps his chances though.

Being a unique character that stands out massively from regular Mario helps too. Dr. Mario unfortunately does not, but he does play differently in the end.

I do like our Link setup, while we're on the subject. They're all entirely different people at that point(the only two that were the same were during Melee specifically). The issue is that they didn't flesh out their movesets much. Young Link and Toon Link could use a bit more divergence. It doesn't have to be a massive change, though, as they should still feel more like updates, not entirely different movesets. This was never an issue with the two Samus(Dark Samus is a different issue) nor the two versions of Zelda. They always stood out.

What I'd like to also see is two versions of Charizard. Pokemon Trainer's version, and an Echo overall, that focus on its Smash 4 moveset. Not sure the best way to do it, besides Mega Charizard X being the Final Smash.

 

[Spongeboob]

I've seen a surge in regards to Lip and I don't get why. I understand that "OOO SHE GOT A GAME ON SWITCH". It makes sense on the surface, but once you start looking back at characters previously speculated because "they had games on Switch", Things Fall Apart. I have listed them down below. I don't have a problem with Lip getting in, nor am I going to accuse anyone in particular of thinking this, but methinks to think "being on Switch" is more 'evidence' of a character getting in is hogwash, especially when only appeared as a costume in Sonic Forces, whereas had absolutely none, not even after release. (Yes, I have been found guilty of having this mindset before.)

Spoiler: "B-b-but they had a game on Switch!"

Yeah, and so did...

• Doomguy
• Arle Nadja
• Crash Bandicoot
• Dante
• Freddy Fazbear
• Tracer
• Jonesy (from Fortnite)
• Scorpion
• Chosen Undead
• Ryu Hayabusa
• (insert Resident Evil character here)
• Steve (from Minecraft)
• Shantae
• Rex (from Xenoblade Chronicles 2)
• Cuphead
• Phoenix Wright
• Spyro the Dragon

Yup, I'm thinking he's in

Spoiler

View attachment 271798

 

[Goombaic]

Paper Mario's a hard sell for me. It's hard for me to care about Paper Mario when the only things that really separate him from regular Mario are the paper aesthetic and the partners, at which point I'd rather see one of the partners instead. I would prefer a Mario rework over another Mario.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I kinda get the "He's another Mario argument", but he'd be so dramatically different that it would really only be the same character in name and general appearance only. I personally think double dipping on an individual character is fine if they bring a completely new angle to the way the character acts, which Paper Mario definitely does. I could see it bothering some, but if the decision can be justified in gameplay then its not a huge deal.

Pretty much this. For the "duplicate" characters we have on the roster, I think some of them are pretty big missed opportunities.

• Dr. Mario is a puzzle game, but nothing in his moveset reflects that. I guess you could say "It's Dr. Mario, who cares?" but if you're going to add a character, the thing that makes them distinct should be their focus (or in the case of an Echo Fighter, what makes them distinct from their base character).
• At the time, Sheik made sense as a part of Zelda's identity. They're unfortunately never used in the main series again so they seems a bit archaic now, but I don't think they was ever a bad edition. Being that Sheik is supposed to be a disguise, they give off major different vibes from Zelda, and the two play nothing alike. Aside from the two not really being cohesive as a transforming character, I think Shiek's implementation is very solid. Now if only they could pick a gender and stick to it rather than saying they're a boy in one game and a girl in the next.
• Like Hero, Link is a character with so much of history and abilities and such, that it's difficult to condense it into one design. Having more Links can make it so you don't really have to by having each one represent the very different games the come from. The problem is that none of them really do this. The only one that does is Link, and his attempt is pretty halfhearted at that.
• Zero Suit Samus is certainly a weird choice for a Metroid character since she's not really all that important to the series nor is the character who's point is to show the character's weakness without her iconic suit my first choice for a fighting game character, but here we are. She kind of conveys her purpose with a punish based gameplan, but it's still odd. Still, she is a very different experience from Samus, which is honestly more important.
• The Miis are multiple characters out of necessity as create-a-character, and whether or not you think that has a place in Smash, they do their job adequately so there's not too much to complain about here. In essence, more could be done to make these characters more interesting, but eh.

 

[MeteoRain]

Yeah sure, but you still have to consider that time goes on, so of course back in Melee and arguably Brawl retro was restricted to the two first generation of consoles. 20 years later, that timing restriction has naturally extended and could include other consoles.

I guess much more interesting and weird of a check box is that it's a one-time or almost one-time kind of deal, and that they never came back later. But if Glover for example, or Geno, or Saki Amamiya got in, I would consider them in the same group of weird choices like Ice Climbers and Duck Hunt. They're old, appeared in one or two games at the most, and totally forgotten by the mainstream (you could argue not for Geno but it's only the Smash community that is very vocal about it, outside of it nobody cares at all).

Yep, Saki has a Wii game, which is now retrogaming. Two games in total, forgotten, obscure, old... It checks basically all the boxes you said except that it's not a NES/SNES character but that's again extremely arbitrary and I don't think it ever was a rule.

The only two characters that are part of the group you described are Ice Climbers, Duck Hunt and R.O.B. basically, with the last one being reaching it since he's not even an actual character.

I personally don't think it's exactly how old it is. 10 or 20+ years per se.

I think it's more about whether or not it harkens back to Sakurai's youth.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I do like that Dr. Mario technically represents the Puzzle Game Genre. I mean it ain’t like we’re getting L or J block from Tetris. I am surprised we never got a Tetris stage though at least.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I don't mind alternate selves as long there's something unique about the version whether it representing something different, different playstyle or even just showing a different part of the character.

I guess that's why I dig characters like Paper Mario, and even .

Meanwhile is just sorta...there.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

• Freddy Fazbear

Oh yeah, I forgot about that. Wait, did people actually think he had a chance because he was on the Switch? Nintendo doesn't even advertise the games. lol Honestly, I'd be willing to bet that 90% of the people who know about the Switch ports are already fans of the series.

Doesn't change the fact that he'd be a cool character though. It's just not happening. Not in a million years.