Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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D

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My unpopular opinion:
Sakurai's interest in adding Geno as a playable fighter evaporated after the inclusion of Megaman and Mii Gunner.
That explains the Geno Mii costume that included in Smash 4.
That'd be awful but I don't see that making much sense as you could say that for a lot of different characters (Marth > Roy, Ness > Lucas, Fox > Falco, Etc.) and those characters not only have different reasons to be in Smash than Geno but also while all three being gunners all of them equally would have different moves.

I don't see where you're coming from but carry on I guess.
 

KatKit

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I felt like there was some chemistry between her and Link.
There was a ton of chemistry, and it helped that she had an absurdly high amount of dialogue/special interactions. Stare at her picture on the wall? She'll flirt. Stare at her two-seated canoe? She says it's reserved for rides with her boyfriend... if she had one. Snag a heart piece while fishing together? She teases Link about it. Stare at a picture of her sister? She throws shade. Endanger her precious fish by rolling into their tank? She calmly puts up with Link's crap... well, at least until she doesn't. Try to return? She never forgot Link's bullcrap, and she forces him to apologize (in one of three different ways! Link is never that vocal) while having the coolest quip in the series. "If saying sorry solved everything, all the soldiers in Hyrule would be out of jobs." WTF? That's the kind of line you drop before slaying the final boss. Fortunately for Link, she forgives him. She also has a talking bird that voices its disapproval of Link, but she only intervenes and calls it a liar as soon as it tries to embarrass her in front of him. She drops random personal info about herself and her family. Complete her minigame and beat her high scores? She fills Link's entire wallet, then always lets you play for free after that. She even knew when you tried to cheat in said game. And that's only about half of her interactions with Link. The other half breaks the 4th wall and pokes fun of Zelda cliches like rude people not taking off their caps indoors and destroying pots that don't belong to them. She even has a book that's the fishing equivalent of Twilight Princess Link's journey. Then there's the typical fishing hobby stuff.

All this for a missable, non-recurring fishing NPC? It felt like more programming went into that hut than some of the game's dungeons lol. And good Lord, did she have so much depth. She laughed, she got angry, she joked around, she got flustered, she shared secrets, she believed her own hype, she took your money to spend time with her, and she even threw money at you for spending time on her overly intricate minigame. Overall, she just randomly chimed in on any little thing you did in that shop, and it was so endearing.
 
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DarthEnderX

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I've had the opportunity to play Super Mario RPG recently and I think I understand why Geno dwarfs Mallow. Geno is super cool and he's got guns and stuff while Mallow...cries a lot and does no damage without spending precious FP and is outclassed by the other party members.
Uhhh, yeah. We all coulda told you that.
 

Mr. Game + Watch

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Thought i had, It would be super cool to have a character from a smash like game (brawlout, slapcity, rivals of aether)
Orcane or the tree bear from rivals of aether would be awesome, i really dont know the characters that are original from brawlout (the frog maybe?), from slap city the duckman or the money guy would be cool (havent played slap city in a while.)
 

Al-kīmiyā'

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Thought i had, It would be super cool to have a character from a smash like game (brawlout, slapcity, rivals of aether)
Orcane or the tree bear from rivals of aether would be awesome, i really dont know the characters that are original from brawlout (the frog maybe?), from slap city the duckman or the money guy would be cool (havent played slap city in a while.)
Fishbunjin
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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Thought i had, It would be super cool to have a character from a smash like game (brawlout, slapcity, rivals of aether)
Orcane or the tree bear from rivals of aether would be awesome, i really dont know the characters that are original from brawlout (the frog maybe?), from slap city the duckman or the money guy would be cool (havent played slap city in a while.)
Orcane with a Vaporeon skin would be pretty cool.
 
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Nemuresu

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Well, another unpopular opinion:

Obscure characters aren't anything special and Smash isn't losing anything for not including them. Can they be fun to play? Of course they can, but they're as subject to be bad as any other character on the roster. Not to mention, some people here are clearly making it look like including these old characters will grow interest in the games they come from or give them something, but the thing is, it doesn't. Even Kid Icarus Uprising turned out to be a one-off that we won't see grow into something bigger because of Sakurai's statements.

This isn't just a Smash gripe. The Marvel vs Capcom fandom (or rather, the Capcom side of it) has that ideology when talking about different character. They love to constantly praise additions like Jin or Hayato, but I'm left wondering they even played their origin games, and being honest, they're not that fun. Cyberbots and Star Gladiator are rather mediocre titles that released on an era where Capcom thought it could dominate the fighting game market by releasing all sorts of gimmicky fighters that wouldn't work today (greatest example would be Red Earth/Warzard with its terrible RPG elements) and I can see why they're not brought back today. Darkstalkers and Rival Schools are very fortunate franchises to still be remembered fondly by fans, because if they weren't, they'd be in the same spot as all those other obscure fighters.

Overlooked characters don't really serve any purpose other than being interesting pieces of history.
 

RaintheCriminalWhirlwind

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Well, another unpopular opinion:

Obscure characters aren't anything special and Smash isn't losing anything for not including them. Can they be fun to play? Of course they can, but they're as subject to be bad as any other character on the roster. Not to mention, some people here are clearly making it look like including these old characters will grow interest in the games they come from or give them something, but the thing is, it doesn't. Even Kid Icarus Uprising turned out to be a one-off that we won't see grow into something bigger because of Sakurai's statements.

This isn't just a Smash gripe. The Marvel vs Capcom fandom (or rather, the Capcom side of it) has that ideology when talking about different character. They love to constantly praise additions like Jin or Hayato, but I'm left wondering they even played their origin games, and being honest, they're not that fun. Cyberbots and Star Gladiator are rather mediocre titles that released on an era where Capcom thought it could dominate the fighting game market by releasing all sorts of gimmicky fighters that wouldn't work today (greatest example would be Red Earth/Warzard with its terrible RPG elements) and I can see why they're not brought back today. Darkstalkers and Rival Schools are very fortunate franchises to still be remembered fondly by fans, because if they weren't, they'd be in the same spot as all those other obscure fighters.

Overlooked characters don't really serve any purpose other than being interesting pieces of history.
I can agree with this.
 

Sour Supreme

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Well, another unpopular opinion:

Obscure characters aren't anything special and Smash isn't losing anything for not including them. Can they be fun to play? Of course they can, but they're as subject to be bad as any other character on the roster. Not to mention, some people here are clearly making it look like including these old characters will grow interest in the games they come from or give them something, but the thing is, it doesn't. Even Kid Icarus Uprising turned out to be a one-off that we won't see grow into something bigger because of Sakurai's statements.

This isn't just a Smash gripe. The Marvel vs Capcom fandom (or rather, the Capcom side of it) has that ideology when talking about different character. They love to constantly praise additions like Jin or Hayato, but I'm left wondering they even played their origin games, and being honest, they're not that fun. Cyberbots and Star Gladiator are rather mediocre titles that released on an era where Capcom thought it could dominate the fighting game market by releasing all sorts of gimmicky fighters that wouldn't work today (greatest example would be Red Earth/Warzard with its terrible RPG elements) and I can see why they're not brought back today. Darkstalkers and Rival Schools are very fortunate franchises to still be remembered fondly by fans, because if they weren't, they'd be in the same spot as all those other obscure fighters.

Overlooked characters don't really serve any purpose other than being interesting pieces of history.
I can't agree with all of this. Smash introduced me to some of my favorite video games, some of which were far removed from modern times. I think it's inherent that a character would tempt Smash players into experiencing their game. And beyond that, I don't think that, Geno fans, for instance, are begging for him in hopes of it reviving the popularity of SMRPG. (Though I hope it does, as the game is timeless.)

I'm also not even certain how to characterize obscure. Is the basis simply its age or lacking current success? Is Banjo Kazooie obscure? Or is Terry, whose legacy is alive and well yet lacks western popularity, obscure?
 

Nemuresu

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I can't agree with all of this. Smash introduced me to some of my favorite video games, some of which were far removed from modern times. I think it's inherent that a character would tempt Smash players into experiencing their game. And beyond that, I don't think that, Geno fans, for instance, are begging for him in hopes of it reviving the popularity of SMRPG. (Though I hope it does, as the game is timeless.)

I'm also not even certain how to characterize obscure. Is the basis simply its age or lacking current success? Is Banjo Kazooie obscure? Or is Terry, whose legacy is alive and well yet lacks western popularity, obscure?
Banjo was a fan demand thing, which is an entirely different topic from what I was talking about; and Terry is not irrelevant or hard to find in any sort of fashion, since KOF XIV is still recent, and the same goes for his appearance in Fighting Layer EX.
 

GoodGrief741

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Another unpopular opinion (since we're still going with that): I really don't think Terry's obscure in the West. If you're into fighting games or the fourth gen of videogames you're bound to be familiar with King of Fighters.
 

Simplythe1

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Just a wild guess here, but I'm calling it now, we're getting Gran from Granblue Fantasy, I feel like everyone is sleeping on Cygames
 

Sour Supreme

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Banjo was a fan demand thing, which is an entirely different topic from what I was talking about; and Terry is not irrelevant or hard to find in any sort of fashion, since KOF XIV is still recent, and the same goes for his appearance in Fighting Layer EX.
How wouldn't Geno be a fan demand thing?
Another unpopular opinion (since we're still going with that): I really don't think Terry's obscure in the West. If you're into fighting games or the fourth gen of videogames you're bound to be familiar with King of Fighters.
This was part of my point. There's so many levels at which you can categorize a character as obscure.
 

yeet123

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Unpopular opinion:
Just a wild guess here, but I'm calling it now, we're getting Gran from Granblue Fantasy, I feel like everyone is sleeping on Cygames
Unpopular opinion: I dont want any more fighting characters added to Ult (at least for this pass).

part of the fun of a character being added to smash is how they use their abilities from various genres of games in a combat scenario. fighting game characters (like ken and ryu) have a boring transition into smash.
 

Fenriraga

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Well, another unpopular opinion:

Obscure characters aren't anything special and Smash isn't losing anything for not including them. Can they be fun to play? Of course they can, but they're as subject to be bad as any other character on the roster. Not to mention, some people here are clearly making it look like including these old characters will grow interest in the games they come from or give them something, but the thing is, it doesn't. Even Kid Icarus Uprising turned out to be a one-off that we won't see grow into something bigger because of Sakurai's statements.

This isn't just a Smash gripe. The Marvel vs Capcom fandom (or rather, the Capcom side of it) has that ideology when talking about different character. They love to constantly praise additions like Jin or Hayato, but I'm left wondering they even played their origin games, and being honest, they're not that fun. Cyberbots and Star Gladiator are rather mediocre titles that released on an era where Capcom thought it could dominate the fighting game market by releasing all sorts of gimmicky fighters that wouldn't work today (greatest example would be Red Earth/Warzard with its terrible RPG elements) and I can see why they're not brought back today. Darkstalkers and Rival Schools are very fortunate franchises to still be remembered fondly by fans, because if they weren't, they'd be in the same spot as all those other obscure fighters.

Overlooked characters don't really serve any purpose other than being interesting pieces of history.
I get what you're saying. But I think it also kind of misses the point of why people want these characters to begin with.

Yes, people who think a character making it to Smash means they have a chance at showing up outside of Smash is a tad silly. But as depressing as it is, I kind of look at it more as their farewell party.

Obvious example is obvious, Geno. No way in hell Square will use him at any point anytime soon, Smash or otherwise. If he does make it, I honestly expect it to be the last we see of him.

But that's why I want to see him. A way to, for lack of a better word, validate that, yes, this character isn't worthless. They meant something at one point in time or another. So here's one last hurrah for em. I don't doubt it's how Banjo fans felt before he got revealed.
 
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At this rate, you might as well make a dedicated Unpopular Opinions thread since a handful of the posts have nothing to do with newcomers. But at the same, there were many times it does go off topic. I'm very well aware the previous one is locked due to some unfortunate circumstances (seriously, we can't have nice things around here). However, it doesn't hurt for a new one to be around. Plus, I enjoy it.
 

Nemuresu

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How wouldn't Geno be a fan demand thing?

This was part of my point. There's so many levels at which you can categorize a character as obscure.
Never did I say Geno didn't have a case of fan demand. Just that Banjo and Terry don't work as obscure characters.

You may not care or have any interest in KOF or SNK games, but suggesting their games are obscure when they're recent and take presence into other IPs like Soul Calibur is something I can't agree with.

It's like I once mentioned in another thread: many times, it's not Nintendo's fault if people aren't familiar with a character, but rather that said people don't look beyond their comfort zones.

I get what you're saying. But I think it also kind of misses the point of why people want these characters to begin with.

Yes, people who think a character making it to Smash means they have a chance at showing up outside of Smash is a tad silly. But as depressing as it is, I kind of look at it more as their farewell party.

Obvious example is obvious, Geno. No way in hell Square will use him at any point anytime soon, Smash or otherwise. If he does make it, I honestly expect it to be the last we see of him.

But that's why I want to see him. A way to, for lack of a better word, validate that, yes, this character isn't worthless. They meant something at one point in time or another. So here's one last hurrah for em. I don't doubt it's how Banjo fans felt before he got revealed.
Now this, on the other hand is something I can understand clearly. There's no other chance to see these characters shine, so people ask for them.

My point was based mainly on this recent campaign (for the lack of a better term) towards first-party characters being so important because they shed light on obscure titles. But as I mentioned, not much has been done with the ones in Smash outside of NES re-releases, references in other games and Kid Icarus Uprising.
 

Captain Fun

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Another unpopular opinion (since we're still going with that): I really don't think Terry's obscure in the West. If you're into fighting games or the fourth gen of videogames you're bound to be familiar with King of Fighters.
Agreed.

Terry has been in like, 70+ games including crossovers with Capcom, so he gets around a lot more than a lot of other characters in Smash right now. Calling him obscure because you don’t know anything about SNK speaks more about your own ignorance than it does Terry.

Then again I’ve seen people in this community who unironically think Shantae was the first indie game so maybe historical perspective isn’t something I should expect out of the smash fan base.
 

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Just a wild guess here, but I'm calling it now, we're getting Gran from Granblue Fantasy, I feel like everyone is sleeping on Cygames
I feel like we'd get Katalina or Euden before Gran. I personally hope we get Katalina for Luigi The President Luigi The President 's sake.

I definitely think Cygames is a likely company people are sleeping on. Granblue is huge and Cygames is gunning to get into the West. They also have a great relationship with Nintendo, so I definitely think getting a Cygames character is possible, even as Fighter #5.
 
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Sour Supreme

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Never did I say Geno didn't have a case of fan demand. Just that Banjo and Terry don't work as obscure characters.

You may not care or have any interest in KOF or SNK games, but suggesting their games are obscure when they're recent and take presence into other IPs like Soul Calibur is something I can't agree with.

It's like I once mentioned in another thread: many times, it's not Nintendo's fault if people aren't familiar with a character, but rather that said people don't look beyond their comfort zones.


Now this, on the other hand is something I can understand clearly. There's no other chance to see these characters shine, so people ask for them.

My point was based mainly on this recent campaign (for the lack of a better term) towards first-party characters being so important because they shed light on obscure titles. But as I mentioned, not much has been done with the ones in Smash outside of NES re-releases, references in other games and Kid Icarus Uprising.
I know where you're coming from. I don't think any of the obscure first parties have much leverage, Geno being the one who I believe has the most. I never said I find King Of Fighters to be obscure. I simply posed those questions to show that the ways people define an obscure character range and you'll find many people saying Banjo-Kazooie is obscure as well as those who argue Terry Bogard is. I personally find neither of them to be obscure in the grand scheme of things.
 

Ovaltine

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I get what you're saying. But I think it also kind of misses the point of why people want these characters to begin with.

Yes, people who think a character making it to Smash means they have a chance at showing up outside of Smash is a tad silly. But as depressing as it is, I kind of look at it more as their farewell party.

Obvious example is obvious, Geno. No way in hell Square will use him at any point anytime soon, Smash or otherwise. If he does make it, I honestly expect it to be the last we see of him.

But that's why I want to see him. A way to, for lack of a better word, validate that, yes, this character isn't worthless. They meant something at one point in time or another. So here's one last hurrah for em. I don't doubt it's how Banjo fans felt before he got revealed.
As a Banjo-Kazooie fan since I was a little girl, I can DEFINITELY attest to this. This is exactly how I felt and still feel. Even if B-K never come back again, unlike N&B, this feels like a proper send-off. Seeing the duo like this again makes my heart sing so loudly. I felt like a little kid again seeing them revealed, then again seeing they were released, then AGAIN downloading them, and again and AGAIN as I go back and play as them in Smash. That feeling is eternal and will never die. I cannot thank Sakurai enough for bringing my childhood heroes home. They were above even Mario back in the day for me.

(Also have to add, I actually knew who Terry was before he got in and I'm still super pumped that he made it. I LOVE his design and story.)
 
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D

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I feel like we'd get Katalina or Euden before Gran. I personally hope we get Katalina for Luigi The President Luigi The President 's sake.

I definitely think Cygames is a likely company people are sleeping on. Granblue is huge and Cygames is gunning to get into the West. They also have a great relationship with Nintendo, so I definitely think getting a Cygames character is possible, even as Fighter #5.
Just imagine if Katalina was #5 and Hitagi was right in that one.
 

TheYungLink

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The EarthBound games are finished, and while I don't want or expect a sequel, I'm very pessimistic that Mother 3 will ever be officially localized outside Japan. That was the biggest reason I felt so sad when Lucas was initially cut from Smash 4, because while I didn't expect nor want another EarthBound game I still wanted Smash to keep Lucas immortalized.

So it makes me content to see little Lucas here with everyone else, and as DLC for Smash 4. He and his source game should not be forgotten in my opinion, and keeping him and Ness in Smash are the perfect way to carry their legacy if Nintendo won't localize Mother 3. It's a great, eternal "last hurrah" like how some people think of Banjo & Kazooie's inclusion and the possibility of Geno in Smash.
 

KillerCage

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Then again I’ve seen people in this community who unironically think Shantae was the first indie game so maybe historical perspective isn’t something I should expect out of the smash fan base.
Didn't Tetris start off as an indie game? I ask this because I saw an indie games exhibit in the Pop Culture Museum in Seattle and they treated Tetris as one of the most influential indie games of all time. Tetris already has two music tracks in Smash Bros.
 
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Ovaltine

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Didn't Tetris start off as an indie game? I ask this because I saw an indie games exhibit in the Pop Culture Museum in Seattle and they treated Tetris as one of the most influential indie games of all time. Tetris already has two music tracks in Smash Bros.
Technically, yeah. It was all one creation from one dude, Alexey Pajitnov. It became popular to play in his company's downtime. It snowballed from there as an incidental, huge success in the Soviet Union, and then worldwide. I really recommend watching The Gaming Historian's coverage on Tetris' history, because it's a really interesting tale.
 

ze9

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User was warned for this post
You literally said "Pedantic remarks aren't going to make anyone want even more Fire Emblem characters," and claimed people who do should just be happy with the ones we have. It was literally your previous post lmao.
Don't play these games with me, lmao.
My first post said that FE has too many characters, or other series have too few depending on how you prefer to see it. Which is objective: most series are in the 1-3 characters range, while the pop-culture juggernauts Mario and Pokèmon have around 8-10. FE has even more than Zelda, the other pop-culture juggernaut.
If you know something about statistics, you'll agree with me that FE is what we call an outlier. It definetely has more stuff than the average. Way more stuff, at that. Now if it's FE that has too much or the other series that have too few, that's on you.
That's the extent of what I said in my original post.
But of course, everytime you're doing something less than sucking FE's ****, the mob crew has to come in full swing and attack you, so there it was, your very useful post remarking how opinions are subjective (and even then, FE being an outlier isn't even subjective, as I've explained above).
Then I remarked how with this kind of aggressive psychopolicing you're not going to convert anyone to FE's cause. That wasn't me talking about FE but me talking about you. If people not wanting anymore FE stuff bothers you this much, try to be happy with what you have, which is A LOT.

Now stop trolling.
 
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D

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Unpopular Opinion(?): There won't be and never will be as good of an era as Smash Ultimate's base game speculation moving forward we've gotten a lot of good characters that weren't really controversial but were sure as hell hype and exciting with a good mix of third and first party characters making the speculation a good mix of both which is all I want.

Not to mention the leaks and rumors were a billion times more interesting than what we have now: The Grinch Hoax (Best fake leak ever btw), Character render leaks, Vergeben at his prime, Stage/Character leaks, Sassy Geno (that leak was hilarious), Etc and now is just "oh Sabi said that, Vergeben may be right he may be wrong" and little to no leaks outside of that that's worthy of discussion.

Plus Smash 6? Well there's most likely going to be at least a sizable portion of the roster cut so people would be worried more on their current favorites returning than the perfect balance mentioned with the base game speculation of Ultimate's roster. (Also yes this includes the FP speculation)
 
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Fenriraga

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Speaking of the Grinch Leak... was it ever revealed who did said leak? Or at least, the art for it?
 
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