Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[cothero]

It's funny, actually. I've seen prime examples of people asking for exactly this, characters they do not expect, characters outside the 7 characters discussed on the daily. But suddenly when exactly that happens they get upset that it's not one of the 7 characters discussed on the daily.

Like... "Oh I want an unexpected character in Smash"
Terry: Yo!
"No, not you"

The community behaves in strange ways sometimes.

I think that part of all this butthurt (i'm i allowed to say that here?) comes from the fact that they wanted another SNK character, like Nakoruru or a Metal Slug one, completely ignoring the fact that Terry is SNK's posterboy. Pure childishness.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Sorry for repeating myself, but i'll say it again: the Smash Community is made up of a load of crybabies ****pants.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

You read it right. Some fool kids are trying to boycott a character who's not even released yet, bEcAuSe tHeY dOn'T KnOw HiM. DADDY SAKURAI MEAN! Boohoo!

Mod Edit: Large Image Removed

 

[EricTheGamerman]

It's not for a lack of trying, man. But there's a point when you just can't do no more. Characters like Waluigi, Isaac, and Bandana Dee have followings that are as big as you can get when most people think first party characters are disconfirmed. If the devs don't throw a bone, like saying first parties are in play too, holding another ballot, or promoting an AT to show it's possible, there's only so much that can be done...

I mean, yeah, there is a limit to what you can achieve as fans and to be fair I'm not completely knowledgeable about the details of those fan campaigns. But sending Sakurai meaningful letters with lots of signatures and personal interest is the sort of thing that will go much further than commenting "WAHHHHHH PUT WALUIGI IN" on every single Twitter post relating to Smash for example. They have an extensive ballot that Sakurai knows he can draw from, and I suspect we'll see a couple of those get in through additional DLC (My predictions are Bandanna Dee and Rex/Pyra for example). But when you hit so many points of fan support that have those huge rallying cries of fan support... well you end up with diminishing returns. Like we've gotten a lot directly from the ballot already, and at a certain point, it's of less interest as a company to just keep investing in that same exact some group of people (assuming the 1.8 million voters in the ballot were genuinely all unique people, which they most certainly were not, but for the sake of the exercise we'll assume they are) when there's still 13 million people who didn't vote in ballots playing Smash and that can be potentially sold to as well and would like to see characters.

Like if we theoretically were to get Rex/Pyra, Bandanna Dee, Dixie Kong, Isaac, and Waluigi as DLC... then what? The already drying up well of supported characters is then even more dry than it was before and in the process you've probably not catered to many other fans than that "core" of online pollsters. At that point there's very little direction to go with first party choices outside of representing some more obscure series that are going to be even harder to sale on their own. Like I'm a huge Chibi-Robo fan... but even if all of his buy him in Smash that's barely 300,000 people...

That's why good fan support has to be seen for Nintendo to really invest into them (making a single Smash character can't be cheap when it takes 6-8 months just to develop and implement one). Nintendo knows the well of characters they can motivate people with is low and increasingly risky, especially as individual DLC, so they're going to be much more cautious in their implementation of first party DLC than third party based upon that fact. If you want them in Smash, this feels like exactly the right moment (especially because I think they'll go for another couple of years and they haven't inherently decided what every character is going to be yet... unless Nintendo is pulling another Pass situation).

 

[Aetheri]

Smash fans are disappointed and are acting like crybabies.

More at 11

 

[Icedragonadam]

So here's my selection of #5 and extra character DLC.

Joker(Persona)
Hero(Dragon Quest)
Banjo(Banjo & Kazooie)
Terry(Fatal Fury)
Lloyd Irving(Tales of)

Leon Kennedy(Resident Evil)
Reimu Hakurei(Touhou)
Sol Badguy(Guilty Gear)
Ryu Hayabusa(Ninja Gaiden)
Arle Nadja(Puyo Puyo)

Honestly I'm surprised I'm not seeing Sol mentioned despite being a frontrunner to me for fighters after #5.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Smash fans are disappointed and are acting like crybabies.

More at 11

In other news, water is wet

 

[Deleted member]

Edit: Actually y'know what forget what I said. I have no idea what's going to happen. None. 1st parties could happen but they could also not happen.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Not sure if its been talked about on here but I saw some people bring up how its possible they go for Steve the same way they went with Sans. I feel that'd be a pretty fair middle ground

The mii’s moves don’t fit Steve aside from some sword slashes, and not all of them. It won’t even look as good as Sans without new animations.

And what “fair middle ground?” It’s better than nothing, but a full character is the best for Steve fans and it doesn’t matter to anyone who doesn’t care; a costume would just disappoint. Also, I don’t really get why people are comparing him to Sans; it makes no sense.

Heh, y’all could use this whole “fair middle ground” idea for any character. Anything is better than nothing for every character in existence. A mii costume is only a nice idea for those who don’t even want him and hate him and his fans for whatever dumb reason; otherwise, the people who don’t care wouldn’t even mind a full fighter and may even think he’s cool.

Just make Steve a Swordfighter. They could use either the diamond sword (logical), or the diamond pickaxe (iconic). Make it come with a remix of the default Minecraft music like how Sans came with a remix of Megolavania.

No, don’t just make him a budget swordfighter costume with one remix; bring us the full character with a Minecraft remix, Sweden, Mice on Venus, Stal, Wait, etc.

Steve isn’t just a swordfighter, Minecraft has plenty of stuff that would make his moveset unique.

 

[osby]

*people calling Terry's addition 'shilling'*

Called it. Every character can be a shill pick if you squint hard enough.

As for newcomers, I think if we're going to get a Nintendo character, it's probably won't be the final pass fighter.

 

[Polan]

Sorry for repeating myself, but i'll say it again: the Smash Community is made up of a load of crybabies ****pants.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

You read it right. Some fool kids are trying to boycott a character who's not even released yet, bEcAuSe tHeY dOn'T KnOw HiM. DADDY SAKURAI MEAN! Boohoo!

4chan really needs to **** off and die already

 

[Ridrool64]

Only two things are for certain.

Multimedia characters would be too hard to license (the only official reason given for them being banned, last I checked. You could also argue it's an aesthetic thing but I wouldn't given that licensed games, like it or not, are a major fixture in gaming). Sony is theoretically possible, but very likely to just say "no" because of their standoffish practices and likely still lingering malice towards Nintendo.

Aside from that, the sky's the limit, at least until we get a solid grasp on what post-pass DLC will actually be like (let's say post-pass 3, or DLC fighter 9).

Right now, I think the Fighter Pass will conclude in one of four ways. The second platformer route (Crash), the NES icon route (Ryu Hayabusa), the Capcom character route (Leon or Phoenix), or the guy who can't get out of the leaker's circle (Doom Slayer/Guy). Something tells me that at least one of Namco's costumes are coming back with Terry. I don't expect any female characters out of this pass.

Speaking of, here's my predictions on Mii Costumes for Terry: Terry's Hat (Headgear), Heihachi, Geese Howard, Akira, Jacky (Brawler), Lloyd Irving (bring back SSB4 costumes) or Yoshimitsu (keep with the Fighting Game theme) (Swordfighter), Nakoruru (Gunner, Mamahaha with beak open is the gun).

• If Fighter 5 is Crash, I could see Tracer, Spyro, Arthas, and some characters associated with Platform Games like Shovel Knight.
• If Fighter 5 is Ryu Hayabusa, it'd be an NES classics pack, like Kunio-kun as a Brawler, or Bill Rizer as a Gunner.
• If Fighter 5 is Leon or Phoenix, it'd just be a Capcom avalanche of everything still missing. If that's not enough, a Frank West Mii Costume could finish it, but I dunno what type he'd be.
• If Fighter 5 is the Doom Slayer, it'd probably just be a miscellaneous pack like Banjo's was.
• There's other options for Challenger Pack 5, but I kinda doubt them right now.

After that we have several, several questions. What will the non-pass Fighters come with, if anything? Could new Assist Trophies and Pokéball Pokémon take the place of new modes, even starting with Terry Bogard? Will future updates matter beyond bug fixes, balance changes, and the paid DLC? Are they mostly first or third party? Even the circumstances of their release lie in mystery, though the implication is that they will be handled much like Smash 4's DLC. Then there's how many post-pass are we going to get? It's not just one, otherwise they'd have specified a "one last Fighter" instead of "More Fighters" in general. But it could go from as low as 2, to as high as all slots filled for World of Light, to even flat out triple digit Fighters. I draw the line at 100 Fighters being the absolute highest we'll get. The lowest is still impressive: 77. Are Echo Fighters coming back, or will DLC continue to focus on Fighters that have unique movesets? Do Spirits, (1stP) franchises/(3rdP) companies having a character as DLC, Summons, Boss Fights, Base Game Mii Costumes, DLC Mii Costumes, any of that put a character out of the running? And for Frisk in particular, are they nearly guaranteed or a pipe-dream now that Sans and Megalovania are in, but one is a Mii Costume and the other is in the "Other" section of Music?

There's too many unknowns. I think I've got a fantastic guideline for post-pass DLC, but I have no serious clue as to who I'd bet on being in.

 

[GoodGrief741]

I mean, yeah, there is a limit to what you can achieve as fans and to be fair I'm not completely knowledgeable about the details of those fan campaigns. But sending Sakurai meaningful letters with lots of signatures and personal interest is the sort of thing that will go much further than commenting "WAHHHHHH PUT WALUIGI IN" on every single Twitter post relating to Smash for example.

Many fanbases did or are doing stuff like that. Thankfully we have the Ridley, K. Rool, and Banjo fanbases to use as guidelines. But it's not just people spamming on Twitter.

Like if we theoretically were to get Rex/Pyra, Bandanna Dee, Dixie Kong, Isaac, and Waluigi as DLC... then what?

Well, let's cross that bridge when we get there! Wouldn't complain at all!

For real, what would happen is other characters would step into that vacuum and become the next big demands. Who knows who it'd be? Skull Kid? Lyn? Ashley? Andy? It really could be anyone, but yeah, there won't be a vacuum for long. Hell, get just half of those characters in and the fanbases of the rest would become stronger for the next season or the next game.

 

[Nemuresu]

The fact that Sakurai re-stated the whole "Nintendo chose everyone" thing tells me that they weren't (and maybe won't be) interested in first-party characters to begin with. They probably just wanted Smash to be the "greatest crossover out there" and of course, getting characters of their own doesn't really help that, so instead, they threw money into licenses.

 

[Aetheri]

The mii’s moves don’t fit Steve aside from some sword slashes, and not all of them. It won’t even look as good as Sans without new animations.

And what “fair middle ground?” It’s better than nothing, but a full character is the best for Steve fans and it doesn’t matter to anyone who doesn’t care. Also, I don’t really get why people are comparing him to Sans; it makes no sense.

Heh, y’all could use this whole “fair middle ground” idea for any character. Anything is better than nothing for every character in existence.



No, don’t just make him a budget swordfighter costume with one remix; bring us the full character with a Minecraft remix, Sweden, Mice on Venus, Stal, Wait, etc.

Personally I don't see the problem with Steve being a mii. The idea is for customization options for the miis and like some characters who's proportions get totally changed to fit the miis, making the mii swordsman more blocky is not so much of a stretch, not enough of one that would require a change in animations. Mii costumes are something that you should look at as, actual costumes like how for example the K Rool and Isabelle mii costumes weren't exact representatives of the characters they portrayed.

Either way, it would be easier to make Steve a mii than it would to make him a full fledged character.

For the record, this isn't me saying that he should or shouldn't be added as a fighter but I'm just saying Steve being a mii costume makes sense considering the current context with Microsoft being involved as well as Sans being a popular pick (even if he was considered a meme pick by many for the most part similarly to Steve) that was made into a mii costume as 'fair middle ground.' In fact I do consider Steve as being a liekly pick now that we know Microsoft is contributing but it's really up to Sakurai and co at the end of the day.

 

[Deleted member]

If Fighter 5 is Ryu Hayabusa, it'd be an NES classics pack, like Kunio-kun as a Brawler, or Bill Rizer as a Gunner.

Add a Tecmo Bowl Brawler costume, a Gray Fox Swordfighter Costume, and the DoA 2 Hayabusa Brawler costume and you got yourselves 1 of the more cooler Mii Costume lineup right there.

 

[shinhed-echi]

That seems like a disingenuous attempt to continue painting themselves as a scrappy underdog for a company that make games for the likes of Nickelodeon and freakin' DISNEY.

When the credits for your video games have in excess of 50 people, you are not an indie studio anymore.

I agree. I love WF. But it sounds to me like they want to keep being the moderately big fish in the small pond for as long as they can.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Personally I don't see the problem with Steve being a mii. The idea is for customization options for the miis and like some characters who's proportions get totally changed to fit the miis, making the mii swordsman more blocky is not so much of a stretch, not enough of one that would require a change in animations. Mii costumes are something that you should look at as, actual costumes like how for example the K Rool and Isabelle mii costumes weren't exact representatives of the characters they portrayed.

Either way, it would be easier to make Steve a mii than it would to make him a full fledged character.

For the record, this isn't me saying that he should or shouldn't be added as a fighter but I'm just saying Steve being a mii costume makes sense considering the current context with Microsoft being involved as well as Sans being a popular pick (even if he was considered a meme pick by many for the most part similarly to Steve) that was made into a mii costume as 'fair middle ground.' In fact I do consider Steve as being a liekly pick now that we know Microsoft is contributing but it's really up to Sakurai and co at the end of the day.

The problem with making the swordfighter blocky is that it wouldn’t look as good as him as a full fighter since the body parts would be clipping through each other more than they would be otherwise, and he’d probably have bendy limbs as a mii.

It would be easier to make other characters as miis, too. Literally nobody wants him as just a mii unless they’re against him, the same for other characters people are against. Minecraft has enough stuff for Sakurai to be able to envision a full, balanced moveset with unique stuff, just as fans have done before. He’s made a character out of far less. The current situation with Microsoft and stuff is not comparable to Sans at all. Y’all may as well be saying Master Chief should just be a mii costume.

A mii costume would suck. It’s better than nothing, but, for me, when I’m hoping for Steve, a character that would make me feel the happiest just like Banjo & Kazooie did (and I know some other Steve fans feel similarly as I’ve seen some express distaste in the possibility of a mii costume), a mii costume would frickin suck and I don’t understand why it’s even brought up as if it’s something Steve fans would like when they could’ve had the block boy himself with his own moves. The Sans costume actually fits and looks just like him and nobody expected Undertale to actually get in, even most who wanted it, which is probably why people weren’t as disappointed with it (though I think it’s clear a full Sans fighter would’ve caused even more hype); a Steve costume wouldn’t be the same at all.

 

[Deleted member]

With all the arguments on if we get 1st party characters or not I have a question about that and that's is there any serious reason to believe we'll get any 1st party characters in the first place? Of course I would love for some to appear but I don't believe we have a reason to expect any.

 

[---]

Add a Tecmo Bowl Brawler costume, a Gray Fox Swordfighter Costume, and the DoA 2 Hayabusa Brawler costume and you got yourselves 1 of the more cooler Mii Costume lineup right there.

If Koei Temco is in, I wouldn't be surprised if we see a Bomb Jack or Rygar (Mii Brawler), and Dana (Mii Swordfighter) outfit. A Fatal Frame Mii Gunner outfit could work with a camera gun. An outfit from Nioh could also be a thing.

To lean more on the Koei side, a Nobunaga outfit would make a lot of sense (put him next to Zekrom in a potential trailer).

 

[osby]

With all the arguments on if we get 1st party characters or not I have a question about that and that's is there any serious reason to believe we'll get any 1st party characters in the first place? Of course I would love for some to appear but I don't believe we have a reason to expect any.

It might be hard for Nintendo to keep paying royalties if get more fighters, but that's pretty much it.

All-third party DLC is appearently selling very well, Nintendo has no reason to add one of their own characters or the sake of it. That doesn't mean we won't get any first parties, but most arguments in favor of them feel like wishful thinking than anything.

 

[Deleted member]

It might be hard for Nintendo to keep paying royalties if get more fighters, but that's pretty much it.

All-third party DLC is appearently selling very well, Nintendo has no reason to add one of their own characters or the sake of it. That doesn't mean we won't get any first parties, but most arguments in favor of them feel like wishful thinking than anything.

Well you'd assume Nintendo would refill Sakurai's budget for additional DLC so I don't know how likely that would be. At best and at most I would expect only for Rex and Pyra to get in as the 1st party rep since Sakurai did want them otherwise it's fairly obvious we're getting only 3rd party characters.

Even the royalties thing is kind of a stretch and most of the arguments people make are wishful thinking as you said.

 

[Deleted member]

After the Slime Hat, the real question we should be asking is if we'll see a DoA Mii Brawler costume.

If Koei Temco is in, I wouldn't be surprised if we see a Bomb Jack or Rygar (Mii Brawler), and Dana (Mii Swordfighter) outfit. A Fatal Frame Mii Gunner outfit could work with a camera gun. An outfit from Nioh could also be a thing.

To lean more on the Koei side, a Nobunaga outfit would make a lot of sense (put him next to Zekrom in a potential trailer).

1 of the things I did think about if a character from Koei's side of things gets in like Zhao Yun or Lu Bu, we'd see Mii Costumes for Liu Bei, Sun Quan, and Cow Cow Cao Cao since they were the prominent leaders of their respective kingdom. Nobunaga would also have 1 as well since Nobunaga's Ambition and Samurai Warriors exist, and while the game did come out after the merger, Nobunyaga from Samurai Cats would make for a pretty wild Mii Gunner costume.

 

[RcS735]

Just an off topic question if the next smash game still has Persona or Dragon Quest content in it, do you think that they will add characters from newer games or just keep them the same?

I know not really related to dlc speculation but these questions keep me up at night.

 

[Nemuresu]

With all the arguments on if we get 1st party characters or not I have a question about that and that's is there any serious reason to believe we'll get any 1st party characters in the first place? Of course I would love for some to appear but I don't believe we have a reason to expect any.

The only thing I see working for first-party characters is fanservice, given that the likes of Rex are still requested, and even then, they have to compete with the likes of Sora, who dwarf them by long stretch.

 

[DrifloonEmpire]

Every time someone lists potential Square Enix reps and omits Neku, I die a little bit inside.

I feel the same way when Namco reps are listed and they omit the Prince of All Cosmos.

 

[millsfan]

I would prefer assist trophy upgrades and more nintendo characters. Theres so many popular nintendo and close third party characters (Shadow) that have a huge fanbase screaming for them, and these characters are trapped in assist trophies.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Just an off topic question if the next smash game still has Persona or Dragon Quest content in it, do you think that they will add characters from newer games or just keep them the same?

I know not really related to dlc speculation but these questions keep me up at night.

I think they would keep them the same, but hypothetically if Persona 6 were a thing by the next game they would add P6 music to mementos and give the stage that games color and give Joker the appropriate victory tune.

 

[cothero]

Is it november yet?

 

[Darkmoone1]

There's honestly just so much lining up for Doom Guy right now. Considering:
1. This is the "Year of Doom", or essentially Dooms 25th anniversary.
2. Multiple Doom games have been ported to the Switch, along with Doom 64 for the switch.
3. Pete Hines said "Oh yeah" in response to a question regarding being in talks with Nintendo for Smash Bros.
4. Doom Eternal releases in November, the same November Terry will come out and possibly the announcement of the next DLC character.

At this point, I want to say that Doom has a better chance than most other characters primarily because of the legacy Doom brings along with the relevance he has in today's day and age to back it up. He's marketable with a history to his name.

If there was ever a time to announce a Doom crossover in Smash, it would be this year. There's honestly no better time.

 

[MorbidMiraj]

What do you you think of the possibility of Smash updates adding new alternate costumes that would count as 'characters'? Not Mii Fighter costumes, but standard characters' alts.

It would involve replacing a couple of the alternate colors, but you'd get a good trade off, imo. Think of how Bowser Jr's alts are the Koopalings, or Olimar's is Alph, The Hero's is 4 main characters from various DQ games, plus there's several Male characters having Female alts, characters with various costumes, etc.

Unless I'm missing something, I doubt it'd be a huge amount of work besides a new skin, maybe a bit of voice work like the announcer recording new names. But nowhere near as complex as adding a full new character.

For instance:

Fox's alts could be James and Krystal

Falco's alts could be Peppy and Slippy

Sheik's could be Impa

Palutena's could be Medusa

Shulk's could be Rex

Bowser's could be Wart or Dry Bowser

Yoshi's could be Birdo

etc. etc. etc.

The only reason I could see for them to not want to commit to that is to leave these characters open to be full roster fighters later. But honestly, at this point, it's looking like both the general consensus amongst fans and Nintendo is just to go third party from now on.

I think this would be a good way to include more first party reps without going through the process of making whole new fighters. Would there be a reason they wouldn't even consider this on a technical or work level, or is it actually a viable alternative (no pun intended)?

 

[Hadokeyblade]

James Mc cloud seems like the perfect alt skin and it's weird that it's not a thing.

 

[Geno Boost]

i want Alex Kidd mii costume so bad i have been waiting for it since SSB4 days
With the announcment of Terry we have now 4 gaming consoles mascots & Terry
The ones that are left Bonk (NES), Alex Kidd (SMS), Master Cheif (Xbox), Crash Bandicoot (Playstation) and i think there are few more but idk who

 

[HyruleHero]

I would prefer assist trophy upgrades and more nintendo characters. Theres so many popular nintendo and close third party characters (Shadow) that have a huge fanbase screaming for them, and these characters are trapped in assist trophies.

I know assist trophy characters have fans but lets compare somethings.
Waluigi in the roster or Ryu Haybusa added?
Shadow in the roster or Doom Guy added?
Starfy in the roster or Crash Bandicoot added?
Isaac in the roster or Sora added?
there is no world where I would rather have assist trophies upgraded rather than new characters. (obviously new additions could be something like Rex and Pyra but thats still better than most assists)

 

[Deleted member]

I know assist trophy characters have fans but lets compare somethings.
Waluigi in the roster or Ryu Haybusa added?
Shadow in the roster or Doom Guy added?
Starfy in the roster or Crash Bandicoot added?
Isaac in the roster or Sora added?
there is no world where I would rather have assist trophies upgraded rather than new characters. (obviously new additions could be something like Rex and Pyra but thats still better than most assists)

Hmm.. Out of those I'd choose:
Waluigi (Ironically enough I think Waluigi being added would actually cause a bigger reaction than Ryu Hayabusa cause part legitimate fans wanting him, part being that Assists may not disconfirm which means a ton of characters are available and partly due to the meme factor.)
Doom Guy (I think Doom Guy would cause a bigger reaction anyways)
Crash Bandicoot (Crash would definitely cause a bigger reaction)
and Isaac (I just want my Golden boy to return man. I just want him to return.. Though obviously Sora would cause a bigger reaction.)

 

[Zinith]

I know assist trophy characters have fans but lets compare somethings.
Waluigi in the roster or Ryu Haybusa added?
Shadow in the roster or Doom Guy added?
Starfy in the roster or Crash Bandicoot added?
Isaac in the roster or Sora added?
there is no world where I would rather have assist trophies upgraded rather than new characters. (obviously new additions could be something like Rex and Pyra but thats still better than most assists)

I'm sorry, but this sounds like an attempt to impose your opinions on the user. What if he answers the former on all of those questions? Are you gonna dismiss them and say "Who would POSSIBLY want Waluigi over Ryu?!!!"

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Is it november yet?

November machine broke

I know assist trophy characters have fans but lets compare somethings.
Waluigi in the roster or Ryu Haybusa added?
Shadow in the roster or Doom Guy added?
Starfy in the roster or Crash Bandicoot added?
Isaac in the roster or Sora added?
there is no world where I would rather have assist trophies upgraded rather than new characters. (obviously new additions could be something like Rex and Pyra but thats still better than most assists)

Yeah, Assists are usually cool characters and all but only a few could bring in something new that a newcomer from an unrepresented franchise wouldn't bring with them

 

[HyruleHero]

I'm sorry, but this sounds like an attempt to impose your opinions on the user. What if he answers the former on all of those questions? Are you gonna dismiss them and say "Who would POSSIBLY want Waluigi over Ryu?!!!"

I mean I know that some people want waluigi in the game and many more want Isaac to be playable I was just trying to make the point that having a new world added to smash is more appealing than adding the millionth Mario rep or a lost JRPG character. I understand these characters have fans and thats why they got in the game as assist trophies but its always safer to get vanilla ice-cream over rainbow for a group of people as majority will like it more.

The idea of people wanting assist trophies to be upgraded seems a little disingenuous to Sakurai when he managed to put these characters in the game just for the fans already.

I don't know maybe it does sound like im imposing my opinion but I just think getting hopes up for assist trophy upgrades is a fools errand.

 

[Idon]

I know assist trophy characters have fans but lets compare somethings.
Waluigi in the roster or Ryu Haybusa added?
Shadow in the roster or Doom Guy added?
Starfy in the roster or Crash Bandicoot added?
Isaac in the roster or Sora added?
there is no world where I would rather have assist trophies upgraded rather than new characters. (obviously new additions could be something like Rex and Pyra but thats still better than most assists)

Yeah, but the fact is that applies to literally every other first party character in the roster.

If any of the previous characters never made it to Smash, then any single one of them would be completely overshadowed by the literal infinite pool of 3rd party characters.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I know assist trophy characters have fans but lets compare somethings.
Waluigi in the roster or Ryu Haybusa added?
Shadow in the roster or Doom Guy added?
Starfy in the roster or Crash Bandicoot added?
Isaac in the roster or Sora added?
there is no world where I would rather have assist trophies upgraded rather than new characters. (obviously new additions could be something like Rex and Pyra but thats still better than most assists)

I'd take Isaac over Sora, but that's about it.

When people say they want AT upgrades, it usually just means they want one of Waluigi, Isaac or Skull Kid (maybe Shadow, but that idea was always more for an echo), and I think any one of those would be a very good inclusion. I'm like 99% sure none of those are going to happen (Waluigi is the only one of these with a miniscule shot imo), but I totally get why people want those characters over other options, because they do have a lot of appeal regardless of their current role.

 

[MorbidMiraj]

I mean I know that some people want waluigi in the game and many more want Isaac to be playable I was just trying to make the point that having a new world added to smash is more appealing than adding the millionth Mario rep or a lost JRPG character. I understand these characters have fans and thats why they got in the game as assist trophies but its always safer to get vanilla ice-cream over rainbow for a group of people as majority will like it more.

The idea of people wanting assist trophies to be upgraded seems a little disingenuous to Sakurai when he managed to put these characters in the game just for the fans already.

I don't know maybe it does sound like im imposing my opinion but I just think getting hopes up for assist trophy upgrades is a fools errand.

He's upgraded Assists before. Between games sure, but still, there's precedent. Some are already well on their way to being functional fighters, like Springman or Krystal. That's why people get hopeful. It's like being near the finish line, but not quite making it, and then being told you're lucky to have been in the race at all, so here's a participation trophy. Meanwhile, that guy in the other town in a good runner, so let's invite him to race in your place. Insult to injury! XD

To be honest, reading some of the comments in here, they do kiiiinda come across as some people thinking their opinions matter more if they back third party reps. Maybe I'm reading it wrong, but sometimes it almost seems like "duh, third parties are better, stupid!", which is an opinion ultimately.