Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

SNEKeater

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Frankly, while I'm sure I could get roasted for this, it makes me wonder what an "decided earlier than first thought" Volume 2 means for certain characters. I'm not gonna name names or anything, but I truly am curious.
While it's an interesting topic. if Volume 2 was completely planned that earlier (which likely isn't the case, Minecraft talks starting 5 years ago doesn't mean Min Min or other characters in the Pass were also planned that long ago), I wonder the same.

I'd dare to say this might wouldn't be a good sign for character like Dante. At least in our eyes. Characters like him have exploded in the community relatively recently. just like Crash, Doomslayer or Hayabusa. Of course that wouldn't mean they're out. Maybe Smash fans didn't mention those characters a lot, but discussed or not, Nintendo could still have choose them in advance.
 

Scoliosis Jones

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While it's an interesting topic. if Volume 2 was completely planned that earlier (which likely isn't the case, Minecraft talks starting 5 years ago doesn't mean Min Min or other characters in the Pass were also planned that long ago), I wonder the same.

I'd dare to say this might wouldn't be a good sign for character like Dante. At least in our eyes. Characters like him have exploded in the community relatively recently. just like Crash, Doomslayer or Hayabusa. Of course that wouldn't mean they're out. Maybe Smash fans didn't mention those characters a lot, but discussed or not, Nintendo could still have choose them in advance.
I'm not sure that it would mean anything necessarily bad for 3rd parties as much as it COULD (emphasis on COULD) hurt 1st parties more.

With a character like Dante, you could get away with adding him without a game coming up. That said, I personally don't think the entirety of Volume 2 was planned that far in advance, rather as Speed Weed Speed Weed suggested- starting as 1 or 2 additional characters and eventually blooming into a larger product when collaborations continued.

I think base roster content is a weird area right now- we know that having a spirit isn't a hard disconfirm if coming from base. At the risk of sounding biased, I will preface my next thought with this- I frankly think Monster Hunter could have among the coolest movesets in newcomers and I'd be hyped for them even if I don't get Dante. But I do have to wonder what their fate would be given their mii costume (which has yet to be seen) and the Rathalos boss in base roster.

The only major difference with Monster Hunter and Devil May Cry is that one has a fairly visible appearance in Smash already- a series that is largely represented by what we already have. It doesn't mean that a Hunter wouldn't work- quite the opposite. I just think it's a weird situation for a franchise to be in.
 
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LiveStudioAudience

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Y'all asked for it. Hopefully I don't disappoint.

So earlier today I was discussing Smash with a few friends in Discord, and the subject of the Minecraft x Smash conversation popped up. With recent articles coming about suggesting that Minecraft crossing over into Smash has been in the works for roughly 5 years, that kinda took over the conversation. This sounds crazy! 5 years for 1 character? That said I think there's a different way to look at this, as well as some other rumors around as well.

Thinking back to when banjo was first revealed, Craig Duncan (thanks Dinoman96 Dinoman96 ) said the following:



Note how the speaker says, "Minecraft had paved the way". If it's actually even partially true that the plan with Steve was a number of years in the making, then is it possible that Steve was actually acquired before Banjo? The first read we all had, contextually, was just "Minecraft on Switch". This, however, would beg the question as to why Steve wasn't in Volume 1, which I do not have an answer for. At least not yet.

Now, let's change our focus. Ryu Hayabusa has been rumored for quite some time with Smash. His existence in fake leaks has essentially become memetic, showing up in damn near every leak. The most interesting one was from IAmShifty, who first revealed that he had heard Ryu Hayabusa was "in" through a YouTube video. This has yet to come to pass. IAmShifty evidently has a record with correct leaks, including Ken, Incineroar, and Isabelle being the last 3 characters (I myself can vouch for this, as I had been given similar information from sources). Recently, Vergeben himself has claimed that Koei Tecmo has been in talks with Smash, but nothing specifically about Hayabusa himself. With Ryza recently disconfirmed by the developers of Atelier, it seems more likely than not that Hayabusa would be the pick (though there IS still DoA, though I kinda doubt it).

Even more recently, NateDrake Tweeted about Ryu Hayabusa as the "next" Smash pick. This one is shaky, as the person is question has stumbled a bit with information. This is also unknown as either a hint or just idle speculation.

Side note- remember when Bethesda said they'd "been in talks with Nintendo about Smash"? This may be important in a moment. Also, think about how Dragon Quest supposedly got pushed back from base roster (though I'm a bit more shaky on that one and haven't been able to confirm that).

So what does it all mean? Bear with me, because this probably isn't the STRONGEST case, but that's why it's a tinfoil hat Jonespost!

The latest reports, and some speculation, seem to suggest that there were additional plans alongside the original Fighter Pass framework. If Steve was a part of the Banjo deal, but not a part of Volume 1, then it suggests that, at one point, additional fighters were planned outside of the Fighters Pass, potentially having us look at a Fighters Pass + individual packs scenario which has been floated around once in awhile. If rumors are legitimate, that would give us two individual packs of Steve Minecraft and Ryu Hayabusa. Furthermore, if Bethesda was approached by Nintendo in "some capacity" for Smash, that explains why we got Vault Boy in the last update.

But what about Min Min? Well, if you take a look at base game, while we got Spring Man and minimal ARMS content...we never got a stage or music. This raises the possibility that, while it was too late for base game, it might have been saved for eventual DLC if they decided upon a Volume 2, which obviously we now have. This means that Byleth would have never been planned as the "last" DLC character and that Nintendo had an inkling (heh) of continuing DLC past Volume 1 prior to the beginning of development. We have no timeline of events, so we don't really know when Sakurai visited Atlus as opposed to meeting with Microsoft or playing Three Houses, or for that matter acquiring Steve or hypothetically Hayabusa.

Is this to say that ALL fighters were decided at this point? No, actually I don't even think that's my point. I would say my point is more that, potentially, half of this pass was held off, thus suggesting that Volume 2 was in the making earlier than we first thought. What it means for future picks, I can't say. But it explains the 5 year negotiations, the strange comment about Minecraft (a leak in front of our own eyes this whole time?) as well as the constant existence in rumor purgatory of Ryu Hayabusa for like 3 years.

One other thing to note as a reminder from Shroob Shroob : The 16 additional roster slots added in files post-launch also seem to suggest that DLC after Volume 1 was planned far in advance.
If this scenario is largely true, you will definitely have some really combing through to see what elements we haven't gotten from various games (especially first party ones) and guessing that they're being held off deliberately for release with some character in Fighter's Pass and possibly even after.
 

Phoenix Douchebag

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While it's an interesting topic. if Volume 2 was completely planned that earlier (which likely isn't the case, Minecraft talks starting 5 years ago doesn't mean Min Min or other characters in the Pass were also planned that long ago), I wonder the same.

I'd dare to say this might wouldn't be a good sign for character like Dante. At least in our eyes. Characters like him have exploded in the community relatively recently. just like Crash, Doomslayer or Hayabusa. Of course that wouldn't mean they're out. Maybe Smash fans didn't mention those characters a lot, but discussed or not, Nintendo could still have choose them in advance.
Yeah that's something people tend to forget. Crash for instance only became a popular talking point in the community 2 years ago due to Nintendo Direct of March revealing the N.Sane Trilogy beign on the Switch (which funnily enough, was the same Direct that confirmed Smash Ultimate's existence, albeit only as a tease) this is why im not surprised he wasn't in the base game or Fighter Pass 1, and i only see happening in FP2, and that is assuming we get another Western Third Party as i think Steve could easily be the only one.
 

I.D.

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I'm sure this has been asked here before, but I wanted to hear some opinions. Think of your favorite franchise already represented in Smash. Are you satisfied with how much representation it has?
Xenoblade got 1 character, 1 assist trophy, 1 stage, 1 musical arrangement and 1 mii costume in Smash 4.

Xenoblade got 0 characters, 0 assist trophies, 0 stages, 0 musical arrangements and 2 mii costumes in Ultimate.

Not particularly satisfied tbh fam
 

Scoliosis Jones

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Yeah that's something people tend to forget. Crash for instance only became a popular talking point in the community 2 years ago due to Nintendo Direct of March revealing the N.Sane Trilogy beign on the Switch (which funnily enough, was the same Direct that confirmed Smash Ultimate's existence, albeit only as a tease) this is why im not surprised he wasn't in the base game or Fighter Pass 1, and i only see happening in FP2, and that is assuming we get another Western Third Party as i think Steve could easily be the only one.
While this is true, I think it's worth mentioning that without leaks, the same folks who are only now hyping up Crash or Dante (who both probably did reasonably well in the ballot, mind you) probably never said anything about Joker, wouldn't have guessed Hero without Vergeben, and didn't think about Terry Bogard.

Not to say nobody talked about them, that's not true either. But I don't think talking about them prior to the real "explosion" will make much of a difference. Just my opinion though.
 
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MooMew64

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I'm not sure that it would mean anything necessarily bad for 3rd parties as much as it COULD (emphasis on COULD) hurt 1st parties more.

With a character like Dante, you could get away with adding him without a game coming up. That said, I personally don't think the entirety of Volume 2 was planned that far in advance, rather as Speed Weed Speed Weed suggested- starting as 1 or 2 additional characters and eventually blooming into a larger product when collaborations continued.

I think base roster content is a weird area right now- we know that having a spirit isn't a hard disconfirm if coming from base. At the risk of sounding biased, I will preface my next thought with this- I frankly think Monster Hunter could have among the coolest movesets in newcomers and I'd be hyped for them even if I don't get Dante. But I do have to wonder what their fate would be given their mii costume (which has yet to be seen) and the Rathalos boss in base roster.
I'm gonna be honest, I'm kind of with Shroob Shroob here (I think he posted something similar to what I'm about to say, lol) about the Mii Costumes, and this is coming from a Tales of supporter when I say this:

I don't think the Smash 4 Mii costumes that are currently missing inherently point to a character being upgraded, nor do I think other old ones returning instead of them in recent patches means good things for them. In fact, I think it's the opposite: I think the returning Mii Costumes becoming a very noticeable pattern is a concerning development for these characters' chances.

Not saying you're saying the lack of costumes means anything by the way, just thought I'd share my thoughts since they were brought up. TBH as awesome as Monster Hunter is and I personally would prefer it over Dante, I think Dante has a lot more going for him than Monster Hunter does right now. IMHO, if we're getting a Capcom rep, I think Dante pretty much has it in the bag at this point, especially if those MH costumes come back.
 

Phoenix Douchebag

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I mean, considering some of the backlash I've seen on Minecraft being in Smash not because of Minecraft itself, but it's creator,


Yeah, I can see that reality actually. :191:
You know the whole Notch thing makes me wonder how he reacted to Steve beign in Smash. I remember that the name Steve was actually some sort of joke (as in "Steve?", implying he made the name on the spot) and now has become his name going against Mario and ****, controversies aside.

In fact, i wonder how a lot of "Dissconnected" creators that no longer work on their creations feel about them beign in Smash. Hitoshi Akamatsu made Castlevania yet he has dissapeared from the face of the planet so we will never find out how he feels about Castlevania having one of the most healthy representations in Smash. Same goes for Akira Kitamura for Mega Man and others.
 

I.D.

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Going back to "Nintendo actually planned everything all along" is fine and all but it kinda flies in the face of insiders saying season 2 was decided/greenlit months into 2019. Unless you want to selectively believe certain pieces of info and not others.
 

Scoliosis Jones

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Going back to "Nintendo actually planned everything all along" is fine and all but it kinda flies in the face of insiders saying season 2 was decided/greenlit months into 2019. Unless you want to selectively believe certain pieces of info and not others.
If we're looking at it in terms of it was always considered a Volume 2, then sure.

However, if it originally started as a Bonus Pick or 2 and eventually turned into a full on Volume 2, that fits what the insiders say while also explaining certain things.

Granted, I don't necessarily think it's all true. It's just an idea.
 

Guynamednelson

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You know the whole Notch thing makes me wonder how he reacted to Steve beign in Smash. I remember that the name Steve was actually some sort of joke (as in "Steve?", implying he made the name on the spot) and now has become his name going against Mario and ****, controversies aside.

In fact, i wonder how a lot of "Dissconnected" creators that no longer work on their creations feel about them beign in Smash. Hitoshi Akamatsu made Castlevania yet he has dissapeared from the face of the planet so we will never find out how he feels about Castlevania having one of the most healthy representations in Smash. Same goes for Akira Kitamura for Mega Man and others.
He's back on Twitter and changed his profile pic to Steve Kirby. He hasn't posted anything offensive in case you're wondering, unless you're offended by dancing Kirby emoticons.
 
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Dinoman96

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You know the whole Notch thing makes me wonder how he reacted to Steve beign in Smash. I remember that the name Steve was actually some sort of joke (as in "Steve?", implying he made the name on the spot) and now has become his name going against Mario and ****, controversies aside.

In fact, i wonder how a lot of "Dissconnected" creators that no longer work on their creations feel about them beign in Smash. Hitoshi Akamatsu made Castlevania yet he has dissapeared from the face of the planet so we will never find out how he feels about Castlevania having one of the most healthy representations in Smash. Same goes for Akira Kitamura for Mega Man and others.
Here's some thoughts on some of the old prominent Banjo team members that now work at Playtonic:

 

blackghost

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I love Max as much as the next guy but a small game with a smaller budget not being able to get Crash doesn't mean Smash has the same problem. Remember, PSABR failed to get Final Fantasy and Smash just got the literal biggest game on the planet in Smash.
cloud barely happened in ultimate. budget isnt the only issue. the other issues include whether or not Nintendo higher-ups deem crash worth the price and judging by crash 4 sales (80 percent lower than N sane trilogy in UK) someone is right and someone is wrong but its very early to tell.
Nintendo and microsoft relationship is not even close to how rough nintendo and activision have been. also remember banjo and steve both have guys with power advocating on their behalf (phil spencer to name one).
 

Rie Sonomura

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cloud barely happened in ultimate. budget isnt the only issue. the other issues include whether or not Nintendo higher-ups deem crash worth the price and judging by crash 4 sales (80 percent lower than N sane trilogy in UK) someone is right and someone is wrong but its very early to tell.
Nintendo and microsoft relationship is not even close to how rough nintendo and activision have been. also remember banjo and steve both have guys with power advocating on their behalf (phil spencer to name one).
i thought it was cuz cloud was being worked on for both 4 and ult at the same time?
 

Icedragonadam

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It does make speculating more interest if Volume 2 was actually decided much earlier than E3 2019. I guess this ties in to some things. Since Min Min was released on the month of Arm's anniversary and Steve being revealed near Minecon and the presentation being on the same day as it.

  • Like maybe a Tales character if there is a rep in the pass being purposely held back to coincide with the series's 25th anniversary.
  • Or that Ninja Gaiden trilogy rumor being Ryu Hayabusa.
  • Those rumors of Activision's plans.
 

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Look, if Sakurai knew what would be in the second pass from the very beginning, why on earth did Spring Man become an AT and Min Min a Spirit?

Regardless of how long Steve had been discussed, he alone does not represent the entire pass.
Counter argument. Why on earth were there an additional 10 extra DLC slots.

I don't think that he knew there'd be a 2nd pass at first, but look when the slots were added, in Plant's pass, 3 months after the 1st pass went live.

If the Fighter's Pass was a "Huge financial success" in Nintendo's own words, then yeah, I do believe that somewhere early on in 2019 that they considered a 2nd pass, probably as early as Feb.


I could understand 2 or 3 extra spots as a cushion, not ****ing 10.
 

StrangeKitten

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It's a miracle that Banjo is in Smash as is, but part of me will always wonder "what if Rare never left" and yearn for Mumbo and Grunty as fighters. Realistically speaking, I'm baffled that there's no variation of Grunty's theme and wish there were at least Mumbo and Grunty Mii costumes but again, I'm glad for anything.

I won't be happy with Rayman's representation until he's playable but he went from three trophies to one PNG so that sucks.

Like Banjo, I'm just glad Snake is back, but I'll forever want new codecs for every character and DACUS, god I miss DACUS.

Unlike most people, I think Zelda is pretty well represented outside of the glaring flaw of Ganondorf not being true to himself, I don't care about any of the one-off characters enough to actually want them in Smash besides maybe Midna. My other gripe is Link losing his iconic green tunic (no that awful wild set is not an adequate replacement) and clawshot, also unlike most I really miss when the triforce trio all matched, bring back Twilight Princess...

Xenoblade is in a weird spot as well for me where it absolutely deserves another character but I don't care for either option. Only other things I'd have to complain about are the lack of remixes and Shulk being massively out of character even via how he plays, but it works.

The rest of my absolute favorite franchises aren't in Smash and probably never will be and if I started listing smaller favorites I'd be here all day.
Gruntilda is one of my most wanteds, and I'd love Mumbo too! I'm aware neither is happening this game, but there's hope for them in future games
 

Scoliosis Jones

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Not sure if this was communicated, but I don't actually think the entire pass, if this is the case, was planned way ahead of time. I think some picks were potentially planned earlier, while others were brought in when it blossomed from 2 extra picks (or such) and grew to a larger idea of a second Season Pass.

Reasons for this? Well, perhaps ARMS was kept in mind for a future pick which would be based on popularity or some other reason. Given ARMS didn't do poorly, but it dropped off hard, this could play a part as to why Min Min ended up in the roster- the way that ARMS was represented in base roster (no stage or music) lent itself well to a Challenger Pack, and they gave Yobuki (dev's name, right?) the option to choose who he wanted out of respect.

This is entirely speculation, however. But if ARMS became #3 of "extra picks", then for all we know Nintendo decided to add on an additional 3 and make it an entire pack rather than 3 extras and being done with it.

EDIT: Actually one other point- Do we really think Nintendo wouldn't consider another Volume off the bat? Do we really think Nintendo wasn't sure if a Season Pass for Smash would sell? I think it's plain obvious it would, and Nintendo knew it.

Plus, in regards to your point Cosmic77 Cosmic77 , if this were the case with ARMS (not saying it is definitively) my best guess is that it was a way to represent it in the meantime while also not being a major omission for base game content. I think a large portion of fans would be incredibly curious as to why there would be absolutely nothing related to ARMS in base game.

At least, if I know this site well enough it'd be MOST LIKELY commonly talked about. Constantly. MAYBE taking shifts with Geno, lol.
 
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Rie Sonomura

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Counter argument. Why on earth were there an additional 10 extra DLC slots.

I don't think that he knew there'd be a 2nd pass at first, but look when the slots were added, in Plant's pass, 3 months after the 1st pass went live.

If the Fighter's Pass was a "Huge financial success" in Nintendo's own words, then yeah, I do believe that somewhere early on in 2019 that they considered a 2nd pass, probably as early as Feb.


I could understand 2 or 3 extra spots as a cushion, not ****ing 10.
maybe he was that confident in Pass 1 selling so well? I mean u got Hero, which no doubt sold like hotcakes in Japan, and Banjo, the West's biggest hypemaker
 

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I think the extra slots were made to be more than enough in advance as a just-in-case type of thing. Sakurai probably realized "I keep saying this is my last rodeo, and look where I am now" and though there might be a chance he could be working on Ultimate for longer than anticipated, so he made the amount of DLC slots three times that of the first pass.
 

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I think the extra slots were made to be more than enough in advance as a just-in-case type of thing. Sakurai probably realized "I keep saying this is my last rodeo, and look where I am now" and though there might be a chance he could be working on Ultimate for longer than anticipated, so he made the amount of DLC slots three times that of the first pass.
I mean, considering that the bulk of the pass' sales came very early on most likely, I feel like they would have had more than enough sales data to know if a 2nd pass was happening.


Ultimate launched not only during Christmas, but New Years as well.
 

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Counter argument. Why on earth were there an additional 10 extra DLC slots.

I don't think that he knew there'd be a 2nd pass at first, but look when the slots were added, in Plant's pass, 3 months after the 1st pass went live.

If the Fighter's Pass was a "Huge financial success" in Nintendo's own words, then yeah, I do believe that somewhere early on in 2019 that they considered a 2nd pass, probably as early as Feb.


I could understand 2 or 3 extra spots as a cushion, not ****ing 10.
Probably future proofing just in case. Maybe he'd need them, maybe he wouldn't. Doesn't take very long to do, and he may have felt like there wasn't a very high chance that he'd ever need more than 10.

Other Nintendo games have done similar things. The people making the SwSh DLC left some data that suggests they could make a third island/area on the map. That's pretty significant. Why do that if you weren't making a third wave of DLC?
 

blackghost

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I feel Commander Shepard could’ve joined those ranks if EA didn’t absolutely bungle the Mass Effect franchise this gen. The Mass Effect trilogy are some of the most beloved games of the 7th generation. They’re still looked on incredibly fondly to this day, often being included on best games/RPGs ever lists.

But the fact that there hasn’t been a major (good) release since 2012 makes Mass Effect seems like a one-gen wonder, similar to series like Jak & Daxter or Sly Cooper (Damn you Sony). If they had kept the pace & quality up, I feel the series would’ve been one of the gaming giants & perhaps even seen as a likely Smash candidate. I wish Microsoft had bought Bioware instead of EA. 😔


Maybe that was the first mention from a major leaker, but his name was definitely flying around before then. I remember hearing his name a lot in early 2019, alongside Steve.
Mass effect can recover just ike those other franshises did but its a lot more complicated. bioware is not the same company and dev these days. Activision really removed the soul of the company and did not pay people such as writing staff and art directors' money to stay. The result was a dull and lifeless game like anthem. If the rumors of a mass effect collection re true that would go a long way to restoring the franchise. Franchises ony stay dead when theya re either so stuck in a time period (see duke nukem) or because a dev has no idea what to do (i assume Fzero). If you are the later you just need an idea to go with.
 

Ridrool64

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I think we'll get a "breather" character in the pass, somebody who isn't very gimmicky and is relatively straightforward compared to the rule-redefining Min Min and Steve, before returning to gimmicky characters. Mostly because Smash is fun with chaos, but at least a bit of order is necessary or else it becomes a hectic, annoying mess. But also to have somebody easier to play for newer fans. Min Min is very unwieldy for those who aren't that seasoned with Smash, and I have reason to suspect that Steve, too, will be tricky to use.
 

SKX31

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I guess the one question in this case is why Nintendo decided to reveal/release Banjo first. Perhaps because they were easier to make, or just to get good will with their older core fanbase?
I'd guess it was easier to get the rights to. Note that Sakurai / Nintendo couldn't get the rights to the original Minecraft music, while they did manage to get Kirkhope back. Sure, they couldn't get Sutherland (B-K's voice actor, yes, both) back - but they could just reuse his voice clips anyway. As well as most other miscellaneous stuff related to the B-K series.

My thought was maybe a small bundle of Echoes offered for as a free update at the end. They wouldn't be echoes that change the gameplay of their base characters, they'd be like Daisy and Richter and basically be skins.

Dunno how likely this outcome really is, but the extra slots are weird and so specific that I'm half expecting them to do something with them. However, as I posted earlier today, Nintendo doesn't always make sense and they'll just dip from a game's postlaunch support for seemingly no reason sometimes, even though they made it seem like more could come.

For example: Mario Maker having the 3D World level theme be positioned in a way that left a gap in the theme selection screen is still super weird to me. Like...It was so perfectly designed to accommodate more themes, and they just...Dipped out after two updates they dropped a long while after release.
Well, I did read an article on Nintendo's culture semi-recently, which might tie into the reason why Nintendo did that:

There are, of course, millions who want to “live” in a virtual Hyrule or Mushroom Kingdom. However, it’s important to recognize what an enormous change this requires from Nintendo. Today, the company doesn’t make a AAA Zelda or Mario title until they have the mix of technology, story, and ideas required to make it stand out from every prior title in the franchise’s history (or that of gaming at large). This results five-to-seven-year gaps between releases, as well as games that have definitive ends (both to the “story” and the user’s playtime). Shifting to a developmental process around indefinite incremental change requires an enormous cultural shift.
As a good example, we can consider the 2017 title The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild (which is widely considered one of the best games ever made). Breath of the Wild launched with plans for ongoing DLC updates, with two releases taking place in the first release (adding four and ten hours of gameplay, respectively). However, Nintendo promptly cancelled these plans, with franchise producer Eiji Aonuma saying, “Initially we were thinking of just DLC ideas, but then we had a lot of ideas and we said, 'This is too many ideas, let's just make one new game and start from scratch.’” Accordingly, the next update to the Zelda franchise will release in 2021 or 2022, four to five years after Breath of the Wild, per usual cycle times. This is telling.

In addition, the “games-as-a-service” approach requires rethinking a game’s design from day one — not just narratively, but technically, too. Nintendo is not built around game engines or building “platform”-like worlds.
The main point here is worth emphasizing: In order to make full use out of continuos DLC or "games-as-a-service" the game in question needs to be built as one from day one, and then maintained by a constant team. Nintendo doesn't really have the infrastructure to do that, for better and for worse. Nor really the willingness to have a team be consistently at a cash cow of a game.

While Mario Maker doesn't entirely fit into the AAA Zelda / Mario category, it's worth pointing out that they introduced the 3D World theme with a new game; and not as DLC to Maker 1. Also, the reason they might've dipped out after two updates might be either because they had lots of ideas and thus Mario Maker 3 seemed more reasonable, or they pulled the team to work on something else. Or something else entirely.

It's something that's going to take time for Nintendo to get adjusted to (if they want to, and I kinda suspect they might considering they've been more liberal with DLC in recent years): Splatoon is a series that is seeing consistent post-release support, and although Nintendo has been on / off with ARMS there is a certain willingness from Nintendo to continue trying to promote ARMS. It's seen not just through in-game support and the like, but also through official tournaments etc. I do have my criticisms re: how Nintendo runs video game tournaments as marketing tools and nothing else when really, esports thrives best when it's a business of its own, but that's another topic entirely.
 
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Shroob

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Probably future proofing just in case. Maybe he'd need them, maybe he wouldn't. Doesn't take very long to do, and he may have felt like there wasn't a very high chance that he'd ever need more than 10.

Other Nintendo games have done similar things. The people making the SwSh DLC left some data that suggests they could make a third island/area on the map. That's pretty significant. Why do that if you weren't making a third wave of DLC?
Because that's being saved for Ultra Sword and Shield next year. :4pacman:
 

Creeparka Sisters

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feel like Steve's gonna be this pass's moneymaker

Minecraft is a WORLDWIDE PHENOMENON, it's earned its place and im sure FP7 will cause an increase in FPV2 sales as a result
Steve is literally the biggest character in both passes combined too.

Regardless of that, it's already going to make a lot of money before he even got revealed.
 

TwiceEXE

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I think it's pretty obvious that Nintendo always planned on at least some more DLC. There is really no way that they planned and obtained the rights to every FP2 character in the 6 months between the games launch and the finalization of FP2.

Now, what does that mean for our speculation? Honestly, probably not a ton. We don't know how many characters were planned at which point so it doesn't inform us about too much. Was Min-Min planned since the time they put in the Springman AT? I doubt it, but it's certainly possible. When did the ink hit paper for Steve? We have no clue.

What it could tell us is that aligning release dates of games and characters may be more difficult than we imagined, because it's a long time in between this theoretical planning and the release of a game next year.
 

Scoliosis Jones

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I know I've seen that folks are saying that Steve would be the major character of the pass and that we may not get other "big" characters alongside him. I only half agree.

Steve is absolutely huge- the largest, in fact. There's not really a viable argument that they could go bigger than him in terms of influence or size. That said, I do think there's space for a pick or two that could blow up the fanbase in terms of reaction. There's also the fact that while Steve is a major pick, it's not necessarily something that appeals to everybody. My guess is we're sure to get at least one more pick that at least attempts to knock socks off for not just the Smash fanbase specifically but everybody.

There's also the fact that while some of the series we commonly talk about are "big" topics, their relative size isn't as crazy. Devil May Cry, for example, isn't nearly the biggest series Capcom has. NieR, while not as commonly discussed, isn't all that large either. I'm uncertain of what Crash Bandicoot costs, but I would think that if Nintendo thought it'd be worth it, they'd go for it. Min Min didn't cost them anything, so who knows what they're gonna do next.

If Hayabusa really is in this pass, then that's another character that isn't necessarily huge.

Really I kinda think the "budget" thing is overblown. It doesn't mean I think they're packing things with 4 more SSS tier characters, but I don't think it's as though they're in dire straights with budgeting. If they want particular characters, they're gonna get them.
 

Phoenix Douchebag

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feel like Steve's gonna be this pass's moneymaker

Minecraft is a WORLDWIDE PHENOMENON, it's earned its place and im sure FP7 will cause an increase in FPV2 sales as a result
Pretty much. He is the "highlight" of Fighter Pass 2, sort of like how Hero and Banjo were in the eyes of many people for the first one (Terry is a little bit niche in comparison, Latin America's popluarity notwithstanding)

Because of that, i think all the other ones are simply not gonna compare, maybe there will be a character that becomes a "Hardcore Pick" favorite like Banjo was in 1, but the rest i see them beign really niche.
 
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Shroob

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i guess the least we can do is wait for steve's update to drop and check the placeholder slots

in case they frick up again and woop here's another codename

orrrr...if a couple new spots are somehow added too
As much as I'd love that, I'm pretty sure that they learned after Plant.


What'll be fun is learning Steve's codename.
 

spicynun

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IMHO, if we're getting a Capcom rep, I think Dante pretty much has it in the bag at this point, especially if those MH costumes come back.
This is most likely just bias, but I feel like Phoenix Wright is being slept on for the Capcom rep. He has been requested for longer and has the longer history with Nintendo. From what I've seen, the demand for Dante didn't became as massive as it is now until around the Byleth fakeout which was after Pass 2 was finalized. I would be happy with Dante as well, but he might not have it completely in the bag with the Monster Hunter mii costumes returning.
 
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