Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[DarthEnderX]

So let's try this. Nintendo announces 2 more passes, one for 5 more 1st party characters and one for 5 echoes. What are your dream picks?

Hmm...there kinda...like, aren't 5 more Nintendo characters I actually give a **** about at this point. But, if I had to pick:

Nintendo Pass
King Hippo
Captain Toad/Toadette
Spring Man
Uhh...
...I got nothing else.

Echo Pass
Bass [Mega Man]
Black Shadow [Captain Falcon]
Shadow [Sonic]
Impa [Sheik]
Ninten [Ness]

 

[SpectreJordan]

You know what we should discuss right now? Literally anything apart from whether the content of mature rated video games should preclude them from being in Smash.

So let's try this. Nintendo announces 2 more passes, one for 5 more 1st party characters and one for 5 echoes. What are your dream picks?

(feel free to make up who the last two pass fighters will be if you want to echoes of them)

Nintendo Pass:
Impa (Based off of Hyrule Warriors)
Dixie Kong
Ribbon Girl
Chibi Robo
Astral Chain Protagonists

Echo Pass:
Akechi ()
Octoling ()
Zack ()
Tom Nook ()
Black Shadow ()

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

Crash would be boring movesetwise.

 

[ze9]

Crash would be fun, but it kinda feels like his most unique possible moves already appear in other movesets, like Yoshi having the ground pound, Meta Knight having the tornado, Banjo having the wonderwing, which works kinda like full-powered Aku Aku... Though I'm sure Sakurai would come up with something unique.

 

[SirCamp]

Hmm...there kinda...like, aren't 5 more Nintendo characters I actually give a **** about at this point. But, if I had to pick:

Can't relate. In fact, I want way more Nintendo characters than 3rd party characters at this point. I mean as of now I still want:

Isaac, Dixie Kong, Captain Toad, Impa, Tingle, Kamek, Ashley, Captain Syrup, Rex, Elma, Andy, Mallo, Karate Joe, Chibi-Robo.

And while I don't personally care about them, Bandana Dee, Waluigi, Porky, and Krystal are all reasonable choices. As are various retro reps like Takamaru, Lip, or Mach Rider. In fact I'm kind of sad we didn't get a retro Nintendo rep this go around, since I think it's always fun to learn a bit more about games/characters I'm not familiar with.

In comparison 3rd parties I really truly want include:

Bomberman, Farmer Pete, Goemon, Sora, Crono, and Tails. Possibly more, but that's what I can think of off the top of my head. I'd be fine with characters like Rayman, Professor Layton, Phoenix Wright, Ryu Hayabusa and whatnot, but they aren't huge wants or anything.

So definitely more 1st party wants on my end. Always interesting to see how vastly people's perspectives differ. I suspect it is partly due to how I view Smash as well, since I definitely prefer to see it/think of it as a Nintendo crossover first and foremost and as such I'm not as enthused about the idea of 3rd parties just based on how epic they are as a character/franchise (note for example I didn't include anything from Monster Rancher despite it being my avatar). I'd rather 3rd parties remain a smaller part of the game and for them to be focused more on characters with close ties to Nintendo.

Note that I realize this is not necessarily how it works, but that still informs my wants.

Anyway, I suppose I could try and actually make a top 5 like everyone else was doing so here goes:

1st party pass:
1. Isaac
2. Dixie Kong
3. Captain Syrup
4. Impa or Tingle or even just more LoZ rep
5. Karate Joe

Though in reality, my 1st party wanted characters are all pretty equal after Captain Syrup.

 

[AmphabulouSnake]

As I've said in the past, my main picks for a Nintendo Fighters Pass are :

1. Bandana Dee
2. Akira Howard (Astral Chain)
3. Min Min
4. Gen 8 pokemon (or other character I don't know)
5. Rex and Pyra/Mythra

I feel like doing a Fighters Pass dedicated to Echo Fighters is really cheap and not exciting, ESPECIALLY if you have to pay for them when really they're just a skin on top of an already existing moveset, save for certain animations and victory animations.
Release them as free updates and I'm fine with it lol

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Tom Nook ()

Sorry to be that guy but these two can't be echos.

Reason Isabelle couldn't be an echo to Villager is due to body dimension and proportion which was stated by Sakurai himself hence why she was a semi-clone.

Also for people listing Black Shadow as an echo to Captain Falcon. Same here who since he is clearly much bigger then Captain Falcon so he too would be a semi-clone at best. I can see him having some of Captain Falcon's moves with a few original ones to boot like his neutral B being a charge attack given the theme of his costume

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

He tweeted about how this was the first time to ask an overseas composer to work on an arrangement, and he was uncertain with the language barrier, how it would end up working, but was happy with the end result. Wouldn't necessarily say it was a hassle, but did present some challenges. Grant also mentioned in an interview the legal difficulties of working overseas--how Sakurai would have to send something through Nintendo of Japan to Nintendo of America to Grant's agent, and then going back through that loop, which took about a month to work out the NDA. Since Rare hasn't talked about their experience working with Nintendo, I can only assume the greater difficulties of working on the IP rights, characters and all that goes into making a single character, with those logistical issues. It's one of the reasons Sakurai mentioned in the past that it was difficult to work out even getting trophies in Melee.

Sounds like the issue lies in how long it takes to do something overseas rather than the language barriers. I don't think it will stop western third parties entirely or even Banjo & Kazooie from coming back in the next game, but it will definitely limit the western third parties to the best of the best for a while (characters like Master Cheif, Lara Croft, etc.).

 

[RileyXY1]

Sounds like the issue lies in how long it takes to do something overseas rather than the language barriers. I don't think it will stop western third parties entirely or even Banjo & Kazooie from coming back in the next game, but it will definitely limit the western third parties to the best of the best for a while (characters like Master Cheif, Lara Croft, etc.).

Lara Croft is a Japanese character, as she is owned by Square Enix, although she was created in the West.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Lara Croft is a Japanese character, as she is owned by Square Enix, although she was created in the West.

Oh yeah. Must have slipped my mind.

 

[Door Key Pig]

All the Nintendo pass suggestions that were lacking a Rhythm Paradise character smh

Would you say with Crash, aside from being a Japan-respected Western third party, maybe benefits from not being owned by its certain original creators or something? Crash doesn't have that mandatory, iconic composer needed like with Banjo, at least.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Can't relate. In fact, I want way more Nintendo characters than 3rd party characters at this point.

Can't relate. I'm the COMPLETE opposite.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Lara Croft is a Japanese character, as she is owned by Square Enix, although she was created in the West.

She used to be a Western one, didn't she? I forget who made her first. Before Square bought the character.

It's interesting, cause many characters are basically of different things. There's who create them, who owns them, and the character's actual design(nationality and such). I think Lara was European in some way? I don't remember as I didn't really play the games. I just saw the movies, and a lot of it is in European locations. Doesn't mean much, though. But that's all the data I got.

 

[Playstation Guy 1000]

She used to be a Western one, didn't she? I forget who made her first. Before Square bought the character.

It's interesting, cause many characters are basically of different things. There's who create them, who owns them, and the character's actual design(nationality and such). I think Lara was European in some way? I don't remember as I didn't really play the games. I just saw the movies, and a lot of it is in European locations. Doesn't mean much, though. But that's all the data I got.

well Lara Croft was created by Core Design,owned by Eidos Interactive until Square-Enix bought eidos in 2009 and renamed them Square-Enix Europe and now the reboot series is now made by Crystal Dynamics.

 

[lordvaati]

To tie up the loose end, Lara is a western character, but her studio(Eidos) was bought by Square.

 

[Renjamin]

So let's try this. Nintendo announces 2 more passes, one for 5 more 1st party characters and one for 5 echoes. What are your dream picks?

Nintendos
1.Chibi Robo
2.Professor Egad
3.Labo Man
4.King Boo
5.Bandana Dee
Echoes
1.Our gelatinous overlord Gooigi (Obviously)
2.Funky Kong
3.Ms Pacman
4.Dry Bowser
5.Leo Luster

 

[Inawordyes]

So let's try this. Nintendo announces 2 more passes, one for 5 more 1st party characters and one for 5 echoes. What are your dream picks?

In no particular order:

1st-Party:

• Toad
• Elma
• Savvy Stylist
• Wonder Red
• Bandana Dee

Echoes:

• Dixie Kong (Diddy w/ Donkey Kong's Up-B)
• Impa (Sheik w/ some Ike moves [based on Hyrule Warriors Impa with the giant sword])
• Glass Joe (Little Mac but a glass cannon)
• Octolings (Inkling using different Splatoon weapons)
• Medusa (Ken-esque Palutena using same normals but her specials are from Palutena's custom moves in Smash 4 that didn't come back)

And a bonus Assist Trophy pack just for fun:

• Skull Kid
• Isaac
• Ashley
• Dillon
• Spring-Man
• Waluigi (bonus fighter)

 

[GoodGrief741]

She used to be a Western one, didn't she? I forget who made her first. Before Square bought the character.

It's interesting, cause many characters are basically of different things. There's who create them, who owns them, and the character's actual design(nationality and such). I think Lara was European in some way? I don't remember as I didn't really play the games. I just saw the movies, and a lot of it is in European locations. Doesn't mean much, though. But that's all the data I got.

To complete the info, Lara's British.

 

[volbound1700]

Sounds like the issue lies in how long it takes to do something overseas rather than the language barriers. I don't think it will stop western third parties entirely or even Banjo & Kazooie from coming back in the next game, but it will definitely limit the western third parties to the best of the best for a while (characters like Master Cheif, Lara Croft, etc.).

I work with a major global company and it is a pain getting NDAs with overseas division. Europe is the worse. I have had some ****ty NDA negotiations with English Suppliers. I definitely see the issues for Sakurai. The Japanese don't take legal terms as serious and focus more on reputation of a company. United States and Europe are very focused on legal terms and contracts.

 

[Door Key Pig]

I just realised, if Resident Evil does get into Smash Bros, the ending of this Robot Chicken skit will no longer be a parody. Sure, Mario's already in the same game as characters who've said **** in their home series, but still.
(WARNING: Obviously adult content like strong language inside)

 

[Curious Villager]

I just realised, if Resident Evil does get into Smash Bros, the ending of this Robot Chicken skit will no longer be a parody. Sure, Mario's already in the same game as characters who've said **** in their home series, but still.
(WARNING: Obviously adult content like strong language inside)

I remember a long time ago when some kids did a school play based off this video. It was hilarious.

 

[Playstation Guy 1000]

what's the one franchise do you want to get in the fighters pass because of the music.(mine's is Killer Instinct).

 

[ROBnWatch]

I know this is going back quite a bit and it’s unlikely in the first place but...

How about a mechanic where she can put down two portals on the ground and use that to get around big maps fast. Her recovery could be an angled one like Rosalina, where an ASLP spawns and launches her up. Her final smash could involve a bunch of turrets spawning everywhere. And her stage could be just one of the many testing rooms with GLaDOS saying stupid s**t in the background.

“Player 1 just taught Player 3 a valuable lesson in life-threatening situations. Player 1 has earned 13 science collaboration points.”

(Used after a kill with a Final Smash.)

 

[Guynamednelson]

what's the one franchise do you want to get in the fighters pass because of the music.(mine's is Killer Instinct).

Guilty Gear.

I would especially like it if one of its mirror match themes was utilized during Sol dittos, or on whatever stage he comes with, dittos in general.

 

[SpectreJordan]

How would you guys feel about characters that debuted in games but their series wasn’t originally a game? So characters like Darth Revan from Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic or Android 21 from DragonBall FighterZ.

I honestly don’t know how I’d feel about this, but I’d accept it more than Goku or Darth Vader getting in. This will NEVER happen but it’s fun to speculate this possible loophole.

 

[Deleted member]

How would you guys feel about characters that debuted in games but their series wasn’t originally a game? So characters like Darth Revan from Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic or Android 21 from DragonBall FighterZ.

I honestly don’t know how I’d feel about this, but I’d accept it more than Goku or Darth Vader getting in. This will NEVER happen but it’s fun to speculate this possible loophole.

Issue would be that a few characters like these are not as popular as the faces of the franchise, so you would be pretty much making the fanbase question themselves about why we got these instead of Goku or Darth Vader.

 

[Wigglerman]

I've still be sad about Sakurai stating they tried to make Excitebike work but just couldn't figure a move set for him. I still want that. Was one of my favorite games on the NES and I wasted so many hours on it. Still, it'd probably best suited remaining just an assist trophy from Smash 4.

I also still want Bomberman or Krystal to be playable but with them as assists currently, I just don't think Nintendo will reverse their status in this game (would be weird for their assists to show up as you're playing them. Unless they added new assists that would take their 'slots' while being played by someone so they don't show but still retain the same pool of assists).

 

[GoodGrief741]

How would you guys feel about characters that debuted in games but their series wasn’t originally a game? So characters like Darth Revan from Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic or Android 21 from DragonBall FighterZ.

I honestly don’t know how I’d feel about this, but I’d accept it more than Goku or Darth Vader getting in. This will NEVER happen but it’s fun to speculate this possible loophole.

I would be equally against that.

 

[Sari]

what's the one franchise do you want to get in the fighters pass because of the music.(mine's is Killer Instinct).

King of Fighters so I can fight to Goodbye Esaka.

How would you guys feel about characters that debuted in games but their series wasn’t originally a game? So characters like Darth Revan from Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic or Android 21 from DragonBall FighterZ.

The only time I'd be ok with this is if we got Lee Everett or Clementine from TellTale/Skybound's TWD game. Aside from that I'm against us getting any character from a non videogame series.

 

[Guynamednelson]

would be weird for their assists to show up as you're playing them.

Go to training mode and try to get a Palkia Poke Ball on Spear Pillar.

 

[lordvaati]

Let's try an interesting query: Characters you think are underrated in the community in having a chance of being among the Last 2 Challenger Pack choices. Not gonna do Overrated because that is a well best left untouched but the flipside seems more fun.
I'll start.

 

[Freduardo]

You know what we should discuss right now? Literally anything apart from whether the content of mature rated video games should preclude them from being in Smash.

So let's try this. Nintendo announces 2 more passes, one for 5 more 1st party characters and one for 5 echoes. What are your dream picks?

(feel free to make up who the last two pass fighters will be if you want to echoes of them)

Alright, game time

Nintendorama pass

1) Mike Jones
2) Spring Man
3) Fawful
4) Nester/Lark
5) Vaati

Echo Pass
1) Akuma (yeah, Ryu gets another echo)
2) Dixie (Diddy with DK’s up B.)
3) Gooey (Kirby with Yoshi’s tongue for inhale)
4) Metal Sonic
5) Springtron (springman in the nintendo pack)

And I’m taking it a step further. Not only does the echo pass have straightforward echos, it has echoes that are just universally worse than their original versions. Joke/handicapped echoes.

1) Glass Joe (Lesser Mac with no KO punch, less speed, and a worse final smash)
2) Bonkers (Dedede that can’t float, isn’t as strong, is just as slow)
3) Dry Bowser (All the Bowser, none of the weight)
4) Zack (Cloud with no limit break meter)
5) Igglybuff (smaller, weaker, and lighter Jigglypuff)

 

[Wigglerman]

Alright, game time

Nintendorama pass

1) Mike Jones
2) Spring Man
3) Fawful
4) Nester/Lark
5) Vaati

Echo Pass
1) Akuma (yeah, Ryu gets another echo)
2) Dixie (Diddy with DK’s up B.)
3) Gooey (Kirby with Yoshi’s tongue for inhale)
4) Metal Sonic
5) Springtrong (springman in the nintendo pack)

And I’m taking it a step further. Not only does the echo pass have straightforward echos, it has echoes that are just universally worse than their original versions. Joke/handicapped echoes.

1) Glass Joe (Lesser Mac with no KO punch, less speed, and a worse final smash)
2) Bonkers (Dedede that can’t float, isn’t as strong, is just as slow)
3) Dry Bowser (All the Bowser, none of the weight)
4) Zack (Cloud with no limit break meter)
5) Igglybuff (smaller, weaker, and lighter Jigglypuff)

i'd play the crap outa Glass Joe for the lols. Same with Igglybuff. But Glass Joe has to have a really goofy run animation. He can't have that quick, precise dash Mac has. And when he gets KO'd you hear shattering glass.

 

[YoshiandToad]

Let's try an interesting query: Characters you think are underrated in the community in having a chance of being among the Last 2 Challenger Pack choices. Not gonna do Overrated because that is a well best left untouched but the flipside seems more fun.
I'll start.
View attachment 235074

Chris Redfield. Everyone's jumping on Jill Valentine or Leon Kennedy, but I personally think Chris is the most likely Resident Evil candidate.

 

[Freduardo]

i'd play the crap outa Glass Joe for the lols. Same with Igglybuff. But Glass Joe has to have a really goofy run animation. He can't have that quick, precise dash Mac has. And when he gets KO'd you hear shattering glass.

He keep’s Mac’s run... but it is slower and Tripping returns as a mechanic just for him if he runs too much.

 

[Wigglerman]

He keep’s Mac’s run... but it is slower and Tripping returns as a mechanic just for him if he runs too much.

Alt costume has his head protector. I also demand squeaky sounds when he punches people. Make him as pathetic as possible :3

 

[Freduardo]

Alt costume has his head protector. I also demand squeaky sounds when he punches people. Make him as pathetic as possible :3

Done.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Let's try an interesting query: Characters you think are underrated in the community in having a chance of being among the Last 2 Challenger Pack choices. Not gonna do Overrated because that is a well best left untouched but the flipside seems more fun.
I'll start.
View attachment 235074

KOS-MOS, anyone from Nintendo (barring ATs but including Spirits), Geno, Neku, any indie character

 

[Deleted member]

what's the one franchise do you want to get in the fighters pass because of the music.(mine's is Killer Instinct).

Music is 1 of the strongest reasons to why I'm so down for a Warriors character in Smash. Say what you will about the games, but the music in them are great, and I'd like to see it and the people that worked on the music get recognition in Smash.

Plus I'd love to hear Arena and Lu Bu's theme get a Smash remix if a Dynasty Warriors character gets in.

Spoiler: Arena from DW3

Spoiler: Various Versions of Lu Bu's theme

 

[volbound1700]

what's the one franchise do you want to get in the fighters pass because of the music.(mine's is Killer Instinct).

Elder Scrolls