Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[SKX31]

Zhuge and Nate have been incorrect before.

They're still credible, but afaik the other two have better track records.

How dare you -

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Nah, but seriously, IIRC Zhuge (as well as Nate) have been wrong some times in the past. We have to remember that Zhuge's and his firm work as consults for Nintendo and other companies. Thusly, while he has insider information, sometimes he can misjudge Nintendo (and other companies for that matter). I do agree that he's generally correct.

This also goes for Imran, Serkan and other insiders - they work very close to Nintendo, but are not part of the company. They generally get correct information (Serkan was the first to leak the NX IIRC), but sometimes they can misjudge what Nintendo's about to do.

 

[AinsOoalGown]

I still stand by that we should've gotten monster hunter instead of byleth. Giving us monster hunter now would be kind of redundant because they both have very similar functionality in terms of multi weapon fighting when dlc is more focused on having a unique playstyle (yeah yeah functions > characters, but dlc is a different story for the most part)

Wolf Rider: base off the newest incoming one.

 

[Rikarte]

I'm no MH expert but has a whipsword been ever a prominent weapon in the games?

Nope. The way they use lances and axes is also completely different from Byleth. However I do think they would have a somewhat similar playstyle at least.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

But seriously though? I’m curious as to when Nintendo is finally gonna drop CP7 on us. Like, is there something specific holding them back, or are they just waiting for the right moment?

Ah, I knew I recognized the new avatar from somewhere. It's from Bobobo bo bobobo right?

But anyway, it's probably the latter.

 

[N3ON]

Honestly I feel like most of the characters thus far have been picked because of the potential for marketing while Sakurai and Co gets to have a couple oddball/personal picks, like and

If they were picked for potential marketing there are better choices than Joker, Banjo and Terry. Like characters that actually have current mainline games on Switch.

I don't agree with this on the premise that Byleth's moveset is very closely bound to Fire Emblem's mechanics. It's all about knowing which weapon to use at the correct time. Since Monster Hunter is more about preparation and knowing when to strike at all, I'm not sure Byleth's design would be all that fitting.

I fully expect the Monster Hunter to be a heavy character with an emphasis on setup, kind of similar to Snake, but with less Grenade spam and Nikita and more unga bunga greatsword swings.

Every Smash moveset, scratch that, every fighting game moveset is about knowing which attack to use at the right time.

It's not like the lance move is inherently better against sword-wielders in Smash. Plus, Byleth is about knowing when to strike, since many moves are slow and require setup.

 

[Deleted member]

Ah, I knew I recognized the new avatar from somewhere. It's from Bobobo bo bobobo right?

But anyway, it's probably the latter.

Oh I lost a bet lol. That's why I have to use this avatar.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I need smash bros content. Gib Smash bros content
View attachment 285939

But seriously though? I’m curious as to when Nintendo is finally gonna drop CP7 on us. Like, is there something specific holding them back, or are they just waiting for the right moment?

I think Smash's release has been incorporated into a Nintendo plan of doing weekly news. Whether or not it was induced by the early/mid summer grumbling about lack of updates, the past month and a half has definitely felt like a move towards having a significant annoucement each week via partner showcases, twitter drops, or game specific directs. In that sense it might explain that given Smash is not time sensitive (there's no real specific point they must get fighter 7 out by) there is a logic to holding it of until there's a gap in big news that they can pluck it into.

 

[Deleted member]

Am I correct here?

Fan Demand:

Popularity:

Promotional/Popularity:

Promotional:

For Fun:

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Every Smash moveset, scratch that, every fighting game moveset is about knowing which attack to use at the right time.

It's not like the lance move is inherently better against sword-wielders in Smash. Plus, Byleth is about knowing when to strike, since many moves are slow and require setup.

Oh you know what I mean.

Having traps and slow, but powerful strikes would be way more fitting for Monster Hunter than a collection of niche, but still useful attacks.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

Am I correct here?

Fan Demand:

Popularity:

Promotional/Popularity:

Promotional:

For Fun:

What’s the difference between popularity and fan demand?

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I would like to point out that I literally never said Phoenix Wright can’t work as a playable character.

Saying, “I don’t think a character will be playable” doesn’t mean I don’t think it’s possible to make them playable, and I never said as such.

 

[SharkLord]

After seeing people (incorrectly) compare Byleth to the Monster Hunter, I have decided to list off every weapon class in the game so that we are all aware that they won't play like Byleth all that much.

Greatsword-Big, slow, clunky, and strong as ****. It'd be like Ganondorf's D O R I Y A H on steroids more than anything.
Long Sword-Basically a big katana. Favors an iaijutsu-like style that isn't represented in Smash yet.
Sword and Shield-Exactly what it says. Would probably be the closest to Link's fighting style, but a bit swifter and more refined.
Dual Blades-A swift, multi-hit style. The closest match would be the Pits, but would be a lot more direct and less heavy on the twirling.
Hammer-Abandons defense for ludicrous damage output. Would be a lot faster and more wild than Dedede or the Ice Climbers, and wouldn't work like Amyr.
Hunting Horn-A weird, buff-giving weapon. Plays somewhat like a much weaker hammer to act as a supporting fighter.
Lance-A long-range weapon with a heavy shield. It's like stabbing a potato with a toothpick; You have pathetic damage output and the monster has no damage output. It would lack Areadbar's sweetspot and be a lot tankier, too; In other words, it plays nothing alike.
Gunlance-A long-range weapon with cutting damage and the ability to fire off explosive rounds. It would be geared towards mid-range combat and wouldn't work like Areadbar, either.
(Nintendo) Switch Axe-A weapon that can switch between sword and axe, and can gain helpful properties. It could work somewhat like Amyr, but I think it would be a fair bit faster and more aggressive.
Charge Blade-A different take on the Switch Axe, being used for storing up power and delivering explosive bursts. Again, it could work like Amyr, but would probably be a bit faster.
Insect Glaive-A unique weapon that gives you mastery in the air. Much faster and more air-focused than Areadbar, and would probably take up the bulk of the aerial moves.
Bowgun-Long-range weapons that come in Light and Heavy variants. Has a lot of different bullets and shot types, most likely to be used differently than most Smash firearms.
Bow-The closest match to any Smash weapon. Would probably be used similarly to Failnaught, but with some extra utility.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Am I correct here?

Fan Demand:

Popularity:

Promotional/Popularity:

Promotional:

For Fun:

I'd add "intrest in a Microsoft character" to Banjo & Kazooie.

What’s the difference between popularity and fan demand?

You can be popular without being a popular Super Smash Bros. request. See characters like Lara Croft and GLAD0S.

 

[Dinoman96]

What’s the difference between popularity and fan demand?

I mean, it seems fairly obvious to me. Something like Persona is a popular and thriving IP today, whereas Banjo-Kazooie is a long dead IP that needed massive fan demand to be considered for playable status.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

While Terry was certainly popular to certain regions more than others, he almost feels like a character that was "For Sakurai" a fighter from a series that meant a great deal to him as an inspiration for Smash while still working as a fighter for it.

 

[GoodGrief741]

I got a bunch of clown costumes over here, giving them out everytime someone underestimates Phoenix Wright as a Capcom contender.

The conversation already ended a while ago, but I agree that Corrin and Byleth may have never gotten in Smash if they weren't added when they were. I guess Corrin could've been a slightly dated base roster addition like Incineroar, but Smash 4's DLC was his best opportunity.

There's a reason why we're still waiting for Zoroark and Lyn, and that's because their respective franchises keep moving forward. Once that window of opportunity is gone, it's incredibly difficult to imagine Sakurai going back to a game that's several years old instead of representing the newest entry.

Would be way cooler if we didn't always get the newest pick. If, looking back at the latest game in the series, it turns out it wasn't very well received, or the characters aren't too beloved, then they can just, you know, not put them in Smash.

Any criteria that would lead to, say, Smash 6 skipping on Three Houses representation because it's not the newest game, when it's one of the most ambitious, acclaimed, and successful games in the series, that's not criteria worth following imo.

 

[metalhydra273]

I don't agree with this on the premise that Byleth's moveset is very closely bound to Fire Emblem's mechanics. It's all about knowing which weapon to use at the correct time. Since Monster Hunter is more about preparation and knowing when to strike at all, I'm not sure Byleth's design would be all that fitting.

I fully expect the Monster Hunter to be a heavy character with an emphasis on setup, kind of similar to Snake, but with less Grenade spam and Nikita and more unga bunga greatsword swings.

When you put it in that context I guess that makes sense. I still prefer other Capcom options though despite MH having enough content to make sense as a fighter choice.

 

[Deleted member]

While Terry was certainly popular to certain regions more than others, he almost feels like a character that was "For Sakurai" a fighter from a series that meant a great deal to him as an inspiration for Smash while still working as a fighter for it.

Wasn’t SNK the inspiration for smash in the first place?

 

[Wunderwaft]

Dammit do I have to post FeliciaFan's moveset again so people can stop comparing Monster Hunter to Byleth?

 

[3BitSaurus]

To be fair, unlike a lot of people, he only really shows up once in a blue moon, which to me at least means he only alludes to something when he's 100% confident.

This. When Shinobi (aptly) comes out of the shadows, you know he isn't bull******** around.

If I'm remembering right, his Microsoft sources in particular were really strong back then.

I got a bunch of clown costumes over here, giving them out everytime someone underestimates Phoenix Wright as a Capcom contender.

Come on, don't be like that.

People underestimating Phoenix is exactly what makes the turnabout so sweet.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Any criteria that would lead to, say, Smash 6 skipping on Three Houses representation because it's not the newest game, when it's one of the most ambitious, acclaimed, and successful games in the series, that's not criteria worth following imo.

I completely agree, and I hope the series looks back on the Pokémon, Fire Emblem, The Legend of Zelda, and Xenoblade Chronicles series rather than strictly just the present going forward.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Would be way cooler if we didn't always get the newest pick. If, looking back at the latest game in the series, it turns out it wasn't very well received, or the characters aren't too beloved, then they can just, you know, not put them in Smash.

Don't bother arguing with Cosmic's fetish for adding characters when they're new.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Don't bother arguing with Cosmic's fetish for adding characters when they're new.

...

What?

As far as I know he just recognizes that series with rotating casts only get the latest characters if they get anything that all, not unlike to most others.

 

[Guynamednelson]

...

What?

As far as I know he just recognizes that series with rotating casts only get the latest characters if they get anything that all, not unlike to most others.

It's not just that. Haven't you seem him make several posts about how certain characters can't get in because they're not relevant enough, including games that aren't like Pokemon and FE? You'd think Mr. Stop-Believing-In-All-These-Patterns would include the pattern involving .

 

[MooMew64]

Coming from an Ace Attorney fan:

Phoenix is definitely in the running, but the franchise's current stagnation and lack of care from Capcom ATM mixed with MH and DMC's huge push from the company is making me think he's probably a bit more of a longshot. Time will tell, and I really want to be wrong on this, but I just don't think Phoenix has the same strengths Dante and a MH Hunter do right now.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

I got a bunch of clown costumes over here, giving them out everytime someone underestimates Phoenix Wright as a Capcom contender.

This costume in particular.

Got one for the ladies as well.

 

[cosmicB]

It's not exclusive. The Japanese version shows the PS4 logo.

Oh weird, saw people say it's exclusive.

I assume people aren't really entertaining the idea of the free trial somehow meaning Laharal is in Smash, are they?

 

[Deleted member]

Coming from an Ace Attorney fan:

Phoenix is definitely in the running, but the franchise's current stagnation and lack of care from Capcom ATM mixed with MH and DMC's huge push from the company is making me think he's probably a bit more of a longshot. Time will tell, and I really want to be wrong on this, but I just don't think Phoenix has the same strengths Dante and a MH Hunter do right now.

You have a good point. However...

Hopefully he will win someday.

 

[N3ON]

Oh you know what I mean.

Having traps and slow, but powerful strikes would be way more fitting for Monster Hunter than a collection of niche, but still useful attacks.

Having a kit Byleth would actually use in the game and access to their most fitting mechanic, Divine Pulse, would be more fitting for Byleth than the weaponry given so as to represent other characters in a way that isn't even possible in the game.

I agree with the original assertion. You could give Byleth's moveset (with a new coat of paint) to the Hunter and it wouldn't be that weird. Maybe it wouldn't be the best representation of the character, but arguably, the Byleth we got isn't the best representation of Byleth. Just because it's not the implementation you envision or believe to be ideal doesn't mean it can't work.

The question is, if we got the Monster Hunter with Byleth's moveset, would people have batted an eye more than they did over Byleth getting Byleth's moveset?

And before people strawman me, I'm not saying they can't both be unique. Obviously they can.

 

[Deleted member]

View attachment 285943

Oh no, not him.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I think it definitely speaks to both Nintendo's better relationship with third parties and Capcom's recent major comeback that Phoenix Wright is not as favored as he once was. A few years ago, PW was the natural choice after Mega Man and Ryu, especially given Ace Attorney's strong association with Nintendo handhelds. Now, between Devil May Cry truly arriving on Switch and the explosion of MH via World has now rendered someone who felt like a strong candidate circa the Wii U era into the guy who some are considering would be lucky to get a Mii Costume.

I'm certainly not ruling him out, but it is quite change from just a few years ago.

 

[Dinoman96]

Yeah, I don't really see Nintendo being interested in Phoenix considering that AA is basically on its death bed at this point.

Like I said, we only got Banjo & Kazooie because of massive fervent fan demand. I'm not convinced Phoenix Wright is on that level.

 

[Deleted member]

I think it definitely speaks to both Nintendo's better relationship with third parties and Capcom's recent major comeback that Phoenix Wright is not as favored as he once was. A few years ago, PW was the natural choice after Mega Man and Ryu, especially given Ace Attorney's strong association with Nintendo handhelds. Now, between Devil May Cry truly arriving on Switch and the explosion of MH via World has now rendered someone who felt like a strong candidate circa the Wii U era into the guy who some are considering would be lucky to get a Mii Costume.

I'm certainly not ruling him out, but it is quite change from just a few years ago.

What about Banjo-Kazooie?

Master Chief and Steve are far more iconic than Banjo-Kazooie, and Banjo-Kazooie got in.

 

[Dinoman96]

What about Banjo-Kazooie?

Master Chief and Steve are far more iconic than Banjo-Kazooie, and Banjo-Kazooie got in.

Look above.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

I'd add "intrest in a Microsoft character" to Banjo & Kazooie.


You can be popular without being a popular Super Smash Bros. request. See characters like Lara Croft and GLAD0S.

That is what I figured. Then I’d disagree on putting Terry in that category. I think he’d be more of a “Sakurai” pick like some others have mentioned

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

The question is, if we got the Monster Hunter with Byleth's moveset, would people have batted an eye more than they did over Byleth getting Byleth's moveset?

Yes, because it literally would not make any sense on Monster Hunter. Like, at all. No idea why you think it would.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

What about Banjo-Kazooie?

Master Chief and Steve are far more iconic than Banjo-Kazooie, and Banjo-Kazooie got in.

With Smash and Sakurai you can never rule anything out definitely. There's a chance that he and/or Nintendo have a number of factors to consider and think that what Phoenix offers could be more than either a MH or a Dante. Its entirely possible. I just think the public conversation and speculation about him now vs a couple of years ago speaks to how the nature of viable Capcom characters has shifted.

 

[I.D.]

Oh weird, saw people say it's exclusive.

I assume people aren't really entertaining the idea of the free trial somehow meaning Laharal is in Smash, are they?

It's Switch exclusive outside Japan, meaning NISA isn't willing to localize it for anything other than Switch, meaning NISA is probably still angry with Sony after being forced to apologize for saying Sony doesn't care about small publishers.

 

[Arcanir]

I'm no MH expert but has a whipsword been ever a prominent weapon in the games?

It's not even a weapon type, so no.

Having a kit Byleth would actually use in the game and access to their most fitting mechanic, Divine Pulse, would be more fitting for Byleth than the weaponry given so as to represent other characters in a way that isn't even possible in the game.

I agree with the original assertion. You could give Byleth's moveset (with a new coat of paint) to the Hunter and it wouldn't be that weird. Maybe it wouldn't be the best representation of the character, but arguably, the Byleth we got isn't the best representation of Byleth. Just because it's not the implementation you envision or believe to be ideal doesn't mean it can't work.

The question is, if we got the Monster Hunter with Byleth's moveset, would people have batted an eye more than they did over Byleth getting Byleth's moveset?

And before people strawman me, I'm not saying they can't both be unique. Obviously they can.

They can't use half of the moveset considering they don't have a chain sword and the rest are not used similarly. So no, it would be weird.

 

[MooMew64]

What about Banjo-Kazooie?

Master Chief and Steve are far more iconic than Banjo-Kazooie, and Banjo-Kazooie got in.

Banjo had massive fan support and the huge benefit of the head of Xbox, Phil Spencer, not once, but twice publicly throwing his support behind the inclusion. Even if Banjo isn't getting new games, Microsoft is still plenty happy to remind folks he exists and that shows with all the new merch he got recently.

Ace Attorney...Gets the original trilogy ported to a new console and then Capcom largely forgets about it. It honestly makes me really sad as an AA fan, but with AA Investigations 2 and both Great AA games being snubbed for localization, the series director leaving Capcom, and the company's seemingly general disinterest in the franchise at the moment, Phoenix has unfortunate hurdles to overcome compared to the competition.

However, AA isn't dead yet, and there is a strong fan connection to Nintendo systems and a decently sized following in the Smash community, but whether or not that will translate into anything remains to be seen.