Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[TheBeastHimself]

Now I know nobody wants 4th parties getting into Smash because of the havoc they'd cause, but let me give a hypothetical for a moment:

Sakurai adds either himself, Miyamoto, Reggie, or Iwata to the game as playable fighters. Technically it's more possible than not; Dr. Kawashima is an assist trophy, and that's a real life person (in video game form of course) but a real life person nonetheless.

How would you guys feel about this happening as a last minute bonus "WTF" character?

 

[AceAttorney9000]

Now I know nobody wants 4th parties getting into Smash because of the havoc they'd cause, but let me give a hypothetical for a moment:

Sakurai adds either himself, Miyamoto, Reggie, or Iwata to the game as playable fighters. Technically it's more possible than not; Dr. Kawashima is an assist trophy, and that's a real life person (in video game form of course) but a real life person nonetheless.

How would you guys feel about this happening as a last minute bonus "WTF" character?

I'll gladly take Charles Martinet as a Mario Echo Fighter.

 

[Idon]

Now I know nobody wants 4th parties getting into Smash because of the havoc they'd cause, but let me give a hypothetical for a moment:

Sakurai adds either himself, Miyamoto, Reggie, or Iwata to the game as playable fighters. Technically it's more possible than not; Dr. Kawashima is an assist trophy, and that's a real life person (in video game form of course) but a real life person nonetheless.

How would you guys feel about this happening as a last minute bonus "WTF" character?

I love these men and what they've done.
I am about as interested in playing as them in a fighting game as I am in drinking seawater.

Honestly I should stop answering these dumb hypotheticals they're the worst kinds of discussion.

 

[SharkLord]

Now I know nobody wants 4th parties getting into Smash because of the havoc they'd cause, but let me give a hypothetical for a moment:

Sakurai adds either himself, Miyamoto, Reggie, or Iwata to the game as playable fighters. Technically it's more possible than not; Dr. Kawashima is an assist trophy, and that's a real life person (in video game form of course) but a real life person nonetheless.

How would you guys feel about this happening as a last minute bonus "WTF" character?

My body would very much be ready for this.

 

[DarthEnderX]

And of course, a newcomer from Pokémon Sword & Shield would at the very least keep the games in people's minds for longer so it's still promotional in that regard.

Yeah, cause if there's two games people might forget exist...it's Pokemon and Smash Bros.

Let's say this hypothetical person plays Smash but doesn't play Fire Emblem.

Marth doesn't interest them.
Roy doesn't interest them.
Ike doesn't interest them.
Lucina, Chrom and Robin don't interest them.
Corrin doesn't interest them.
But Byleth does. They enjoy Byleth and find them fun. They want to find out more about Byleth.

That seems like a pretty unlikely hypothetical. If the first 7 didn't interest you, why would the 8th? Byleth isn't even the most unique FE character. And it's not like Smash does anything to teach you about the character.

Well, Smash DID kinda get Fire Emblem noticed.
Hell, outside of Japan, Melee was the first time anyone had even heard of Fire Emblem.
But now I think everyone's got the message.

That's my point. Who's just getting into FE now, specifically because of Byleth in Smash?

 

[Aetheri]

That seems like a pretty unlikely hypothetical. If the first 7 didn't interest you, why would the 8th? Byleth isn't even the most unique FE character. And it's not like Smash does anything to teach you about the character.

That's my point. Who's just getting into FE now, specifically because of Byleth in Smash?

Don't get me wrong as I'm feeling the Fire Emblem fatigue as much as many others, but to play devil's advocate.....

not everyone has been playing Smash since Melee. Especially now since more people have bought Ultimate than any other game in the series.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Ok so here's an interesting idea, take your current backlog and put some protags from them in Smash when applicable. For me, that'd be Rayman, Kiryu, Miriam/Zangetsu, Deus Ex protag (I know nothing about this franchise lmao), Gordon Freeman, Lara Croft, Master Chief, Kain from Legacy of Kain, Adol Christin and Estelle Bright. Looking at my list, I'd say I'd be happy if a few of these got in

I'll 2nd Estelle. I only got a few hours into Trails in the Sky before I put it on the back burner.

not everyone has been playing Smash since Melee. Especially now since more people have bought Ultimate than any other game in the series.

Even if you started with Ultimate, there's still 7 FE characters that, if none of them hooked you, the 8th probably won't either.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

That seems like a pretty unlikely hypothetical. If the first 7 didn't interest you, why would the 8th? Byleth isn't even the most unique FE character. And it's not like Smash does anything to teach you about the character.

Smash does a lot to teach people about characters.

And well, the only Star Fox character I like on the roster is Falco.

There are two other characters right there, but I'd be much less invested if Falco wasn't there.

That's my point. Who's just getting into FE now, specifically because of Byleth in Smash?

People get into different franchises at different times. Moreoever, people have different people have different reasons for getting into other franchises.

I didn't get into Metroid because of Samus in Smash, I got into Metroid because Smash showed me all the cool monsters and what not.

 

[Cosmic77]

It's easy to see why Byleth was chosen, and it might've convinced a few people to buy 3H.

I just wish they had done this with a different franchise instead of FE, especially since Corrin got in the previous game's DLC cycle for almost identical reasons. If you count Roy, this is the third time a FE character was decided upon before the respective character's game was released. That's even more than Pokemon, which to my knowledge has only done this once (Greninja). Incineroar was chosen after USUM, and I think DP was out before Lucario was chosen. If not, then the Mystery of Mew movie certainly was, so that's something at least.

Min Min softened the blow a little, even if her game had already been out for three years. Still, I really wish they would've opted for something else instead of choosing FE a second time for their "character from recent game" choice.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I love these men and what they've done.
I am about as interested in playing as them in a fighting game as I am in drinking seawater.

Besides, we got Miis for that.

Even if you started with Ultimate, there's still 7 FE characters that, if none of them hooked you, the 8th probably won't either.

You act like they're all the same though. I know Smash fans are all like "ugh, blue haired swordsman" but Byleth is really quite distinct from the other characters in terms of visual design what with the more modern coat, and for the girl, the crop top and leggings. I could easily see someone not caring for Marth and the gang (maybe they find them generic or whatever), but being intrigued by Byleth. They play pretty distinctly too so there's that.

EDIT: And let's not forget the music they brought with them. Fire Emblem: Three Houses's style is incredibly distinct, and a lot of the tracks they picked are great.
EDIT EDIT: Also I think their stage is the first and only Fire Emblem stage that is actually based on a specific location, which means players can get a feel for the game's setting instead of being like "yup. That sure is a castle".

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Now I know nobody wants 4th parties getting into Smash because of the havoc they'd cause, but let me give a hypothetical for a moment:

Sakurai adds either himself, Miyamoto, Reggie, or Iwata to the game as playable fighters. Technically it's more possible than not; Dr. Kawashima is an assist trophy, and that's a real life person (in video game form of course) but a real life person nonetheless.

How would you guys feel about this happening as a last minute bonus "WTF" character?

But we already have that.

 

[7NATOR]

Now I know nobody wants 4th parties getting into Smash because of the havoc they'd cause, but let me give a hypothetical for a moment:

Sakurai adds either himself, Miyamoto, Reggie, or Iwata to the game as playable fighters. Technically it's more possible than not; Dr. Kawashima is an assist trophy, and that's a real life person (in video game form of course) but a real life person nonetheless.

How would you guys feel about this happening as a last minute bonus "WTF" character?

The Definitive List of Unused Fighters in Smash

A comprehensive update to the Definitive List of Unused Fighters in Smash! A fully sourced list of every statement made by Sakurai on potential fighters for each entry in the Smash series.

sourcegaming.info

Go to the Smash 4 section. Reggie, Miyamoto, and Iwata were actually considered, but they were said to be "Uninteresting" for the Wide Audience.

So even into Smash 4 Non-video game origin charactters were considered. I don't think Reggie, Miyamoto, and Iwata would be it (they'll stay as Miis) But Honestly I could see a non-video game Origin character making it in, provided that they have Easy Licensing, Popular, and more of a video game connection despite their origin

 

[Perkilator]

EDIT EDIT: Also I think their stage is the first and only Fire Emblem stage that is actually based on a specific location, which means players can get a feel for the game's setting instead of being like "yup. That sure is a castle".

There's also Arena Ferox from Fire Emblem Awakening, which debuted in Smash 3DS.

 

[CrusherMania1592]

So it's time for the age old question.

Will we get a direct or reveal this week?

I'm willing to bet mid-Sept at latest unless they surprise us outta nowhere

 

[JCKirbs]

It's easy to see why Byleth was chosen, and it might've convinced a few people to buy 3H.

I just wish they had done this with a different franchise instead of FE, especially since Corrin got in the previous game's DLC cycle for almost identical reasons. If you count Roy, this is the third time a FE character was decided upon before the respective character's game was released. That's even more than Pokemon, which to my knowledge has only done this once (Greninja). Incineroar was chosen after USUM, and I think DP was out before Lucario was chosen. If not, then the Mystery of Mew movie certainly was, so that's something at least.

Min Min softened the blow a little, even if her game had already been out for three years. Still, I really wish they would've opted for something else instead of choosing FE a second time for their "character from recent game" choice.

Imagine if Xenoblade is still stuck with only one character and one stage after all of the DLC has been completed, after Fire Emblem got their 8th character handed to them on a sliver platter, just for a game's mere existence from that franchise (and timing, sure).

Like, it's pretty easy to accept Byleth in their own right until you start to compare them to other Nintendo properties who are arguably on or around the same level as them.
Granted, you can imagine that it's pretty tempting to opt towards a franchise which (in comparison to certain other Nintendo IPs) always introduces new protagonists for just about every entry in the series.
But then you realize that's probably the sole reason why Byleth was even picked in the first place, and that there really isn't any meaningful merit for choosing a character from a game which hadn't even been released to the general public yet. It was a shot in the dark which could've ended even worse if Three Houses/Byleth was as poorly received as Fates/Corrin.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

So even into Smash 4 Non-video game origin charactters were considered. I don't think Reggie, Miyamoto, and Iwata would be it (they'll stay as Miis) But Honestly I could see a non-video game Origin character making it in, provided that they have Easy Licensing, Popular, and more of a video game connection despite their origin

So here's how Mickey can still win...


Jokes aside, this is honestly how I'd handle it if I were to add Sora or Amingo or whatever. If non-video game characters are an integral part of the video game, then just stick it in there. Not allowing Captain America or Wolverine's themes to play on a Marvel Vs. Capcom stage just because the characters didn't originate from a game and their names appear in the song titles is just silly. This goes for Sora too but I've never played Kingdom Hearts so I don't have an example handy there.

Also I'd add The Moon as a song because it's pretty.

Imagine if Xenoblade is still stuck with only one character and one stage after all of the DLC has been completed, after Fire Emblem got their 8th character handed to them on a sliver platter, just for a game's mere existence from that franchise (and timing, sure).

Oh I hope not. After Byleth and Min Min, I really believe Rex & Pyra/Mythra should be added.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

That seems like a pretty unlikely hypothetical. If the first 7 didn't interest you, why would the 8th? Byleth isn't even the most unique FE character. And it's not like Smash does anything to teach you about the character

Actually, I can kinda speak from experience in that regard. Most of my Smash circle friends hate FE solely for getting so many characters and constantly whined about it for years, they whined about Byleth but from the beginning, Byleth whining was "My issue is how blatantly they're shilling the game". A month or so later, only 1 person I regularly play Smash with doesn't regularly play Byleth, one guy even asked if he could borrow my 3H copy out of curiousity and when they announced Min Min's presentation, the loudest whiner of my grouo said "I'd prefer another FE character **** ARMS". Sometimes a moveset clicking with you is all you need

 

[Cosmic77]

Imagine if Xenoblade is still stuck with only one character and one stage after all of the DLC has been completed, after Fire Emblem got their 8th character handed to them on a sliver platter, just for a game's mere existence from that franchise (and timing, sure).

Like, it's pretty easy to accept Byleth in their own right until you start to compare them to other Nintendo properties who are arguably on or around the same level as them.
Granted, you can imagine that it's pretty tempting to opt towards a franchise which (in comparison to certain other Nintendo IPs) always introduces new protagonists for just about every entry in the series.
But then you realize that's probably the sole reason why Byleth was even picked in the first place, and that there really isn't any meaningful merit for choosing a character from a game which hadn't even been released to the general public yet. It was a shot in the dark which could've ended even worse if Three Houses/Byleth was as poorly received as Fates/Corrin.

What happens happens. Honestly, it's a miracle ARMS didn't miss out. The game itself and the franchise as a whole can be kept alive so long as Min Min stays in future games.

I agree though, it's probably very irritating if you're a fan of a different franchise like Xenoblade or Astral Chain and you're seeing FE get it's second promotional DLC character when the first wasn't even recieved positively.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

The best choices for a non videogame character in smash would have to be Spongebob, Wolverine and Batman.

All of them proved that you can make timeless and fantastic games staring these characters.

So here's how Mickey can still win...


Jokes aside, this is honestly how I'd handle it if I were to add Sora or Amingo or whatever. If non-video game characters are an integral part of the video game, then just stick it in there. Not allowing Captain America or Wolverine's themes to play on a Marvel Vs. Capcom stage just because the characters didn't originate from a game and their names appear in the song titles is just silly. This goes for Sora too but I've never played Kingdom Hearts so I don't have an example handy there.

Also I'd add The Moon as a song because it's pretty.


Oh I hope not. After Byleth and Min Min, I really believe Rex & Pyra/Mythra should be added.

The Disney original tracks wouldn't really fit into smash, since they are all overworld tracks and smash mostly just uses battle music for it's RPG reps.

 

[Animegamingnerd]

I think its very likely we are getting a partner showcase in September, most likely before Tokyo Game Show. As there will likely be a number of Japanese third parties revealed there, plus some ones we already know about like No More Heroes 3, Rune Factory 5, Shin Megami Tensei 5. Bravely Default 2. There is also the Monster Hunter rumors that have been resurfacing these past few days and Monster Hunter games on Nintendo tend to be reveal at or around TGS, so I can see Nintendo having that be their big one more thing at a partner showcase just before TGS.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

There's also Arena Ferox from Fire Emblem Awakening, which debuted in Smash 3DS.

Oh yeah I forgot. Probably because I never play on that stage...I need to play on the casual stages more often. They're good stages and they've got some great music. I guess the B.S. of it all is just not as fun without other human players.

The Disney original tracks wouldn't really fit into smash, since they are all overworld tracks and smash mostly just uses battle music for it's RPG reps.

Well, all my examples were about music since that's what I knew, but I'd imagine the non-video game representation for Kingdom Hearts would have more to do with cameoing in the stage and perhaps with Sora's moveset and/or Final Smash and/or win screens and stuff.

 

[SharkLord]

The best choices for a non videogame character in smash would have to be Spongebob, Wolverine and Batman.

All of them proved that you can make timeless and fantastic games staring these characters.

If we're operating on that logic, I'd say Spider-Man and especially Geralt should be counted too. They check those boxes as well.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

If we're operating on that logic, I'd say Spider-Man...should be counted too. They check those boxes as well.

Ah yes. Who could forget such a classic.

 

[Mamboo07]

The best choices for a non videogame character in smash would have to be Spongebob, Wolverine and Batman.

All of them proved that you can make timeless and fantastic games staring these characters.


The Disney original tracks wouldn't really fit into smash, since they are all overworld tracks and smash mostly just uses battle music for it's RPG reps.

If I had to pick one, it would be Godzilla himself!

 

[DarthEnderX]

Sometimes a moveset clicking with you is all you need

But a moveset clicking with someone translate to them buying the character's source game. Especially if, ya know, one is a fighting game and the other is a strategy RPG. So none of that moveset they like is going to be usable in the other game. Meaning it doesn't work as promotion.

Yeah, people are always going to play a character if it's high tier or if they like the moveset regardless of the source of the character. The question was, how many NEW FE players did having an 8th FE character in Smash actually generate and/or how many NEW Smash players coming from FE did it generate.

I don't think it's very many, and frankly, it seems to have turned more Smash players AGAINST FE than it drew in.

 

[Staarih]

Imagine if Xenoblade is still stuck with only one character and one stage after all of the DLC has been completed, after Fire Emblem got their 8th character handed to them on a sliver platter, just for a game's mere existence from that franchise (and timing, sure).

After XC2 put the series on the map and made it what seems to be a staple million seller with a bright future, it better get another character.

In regards to FE and XC, sometimes I feel that if they had opted with Elma instead of Corrin back in the day, things would at least feel a bit more balanced today, even if we still got Byleth. XCX and Fates were released around the same time, and XCX was clearly the game that would’ve gained more from the promo... but FE was probably just a safer choice.

 

[StrangeKitten]

Can't wait for us to get the Babymetal character!

Or would a Mahjong tile be more ideal?

Spoiler

And yes, those were actual costumes in Mario Maker.

Shaun the Sheep or bust

You both have such funny ways of spelling Hello Kitty.

As for non-video-game characters, well I just discussed him yesterday but I'd have to give the nod to Goku. He's got a good number of successful games to his name, particularly FighterZ at the moment. Being an anime character helps him fit in well, design-wise; especially now that we have Hero. Moveset practically builds itself. And his popularity in the west rivals his popularity in the east

 

[osby]

You both have such funny ways of spelling Hello Kitty.

Finally, someone in this thread is spitting facts.

 

[PSIGuy]

In regards to FE and XC, sometimes I feel that if they had opted with Elma instead of Corrin back in the day, things would at least feel a bit more balanced today, even if we still got Byleth. XCX and Fates were released around the same time, and XCX was clearly the game that would’ve gained more from the promo... but FE was probably just a safer choice.

Funny how the only games that get promotions are the ones that would do well even without them. It's like not wanting to spend money to advertize something unless it sells more, but things need advertisement to properly reach their full sales potential.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

But a moveset clicking with someone translate to them buying the character's source game. Especially if, ya know, one is a fighting game and the other is a strategy RPG. So none of that moveset they like is going to be usable in the other game. Meaning it doesn't work as promotion.

Yeah, people are always going to play a character if it's high tier or if they like the moveset regardless of the source of the character. The question was, how many NEW FE players did having an 8th FE character in Smash actually generate and/or how many NEW Smash players coming from FE did it generate.

I don't think it's very many, and frankly, it seems to have turned more Smash players AGAINST FE than it drew in.

Oh I misunderstood it as people getting interested in the character, not the source game. That's fair, only 2 of my friends got interested and one didn't like the slow paced beginning

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Honestly speaking, with , the fact that they were respectively the only Smash 4 DLC and Fighter Pass 1 Nintendo characters didn’t help their reception. had better reception not just because she came from a new franchise, but also because of how unique she was.

 

[CureParfait]

Now I know nobody wants 4th parties getting into Smash because of the havoc they'd cause, but let me give a hypothetical for a moment:

Sakurai adds either himself, Miyamoto, Reggie, or Iwata to the game as playable fighters. Technically it's more possible than not; Dr. Kawashima is an assist trophy, and that's a real life person (in video game form of course) but a real life person nonetheless.

How would you guys feel about this happening as a last minute bonus "WTF" character?

I'll be extremely hype about it since I don't really mind 4th parties as much, as long they are associated with videogames.

 

[RileyXY1]

Another thing to note about Pokemon getting a new character: Pokemon is actually underrepresented in the music department. Pokemon only has 32 songs, which is less than Super Mario Bros., Fire Emblem, Legend of Zelda, and even Kirby.

 

[Calamitas]

Another thing to note about Pokemon getting a new character: Pokemon is actually underrepresented in the music department. Pokemon only has 32 songs, which is less than Super Mario Bros., Fire Emblem, Legend of Zelda, and even Kirby.

Oh please, like they'd actually fix any of the glaring soundtrack omissions for Pokémon if they were to bring in a new character. A new Pokémon character would be a Gen 8 mon with Sword/Shield tracks only, and no Vs Ho-Oh, Vs Iris, or Vs Ultra Necrozma in sight.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Another thing to note about Pokemon getting a new character: Pokemon is actually underrepresented in the music department. Pokemon only has 32 songs, which is less than Super Mario Bros., Fire Emblem, Legend of Zelda, and even Kirby.

I thought a Pokemon was among the thousands of characters you were doubtful about getting in.

 

[RileyXY1]

I thought a Pokemon was among the thousands of characters you were doubtful about getting in.

Just wanted to point out how lacking Pokemon's music selection is, considering that it's the world's most profitable media franchise.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

But a moveset clicking with someone translate to them buying the character's source game. Especially if, ya know, one is a fighting game and the other is a strategy RPG. So none of that moveset they like is going to be usable in the other game. Meaning it doesn't work as promotion.

Except it does though. Getting hooked on a character's moveset is another way that a person can take a liking to the character themselves. If you can get people to like a character and know which game they're from, there's a good chance they'll be interested and pick up the game unless they already know they hate the genre or something.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Uh oh, guess what time it is?

Another installment of "Almost always fake 4chan Nintendo Switch Rumors"

I don't know why, but I always enjoy reading them haha. pic.twitter.com/sfxGWXWEEO

— Stealth (@Stealth40k) August 30, 2020

Honestly, the one that kills this leak for me is the Xenoblade X port. Not only is there still that statement from Monolith Soft about porting it and the fact we just got XCDE, but this leak acts like it was already announced. If that were the case, someone (probably Rie Sonomura , no offense) would be freaking out over it for the next several days. Plus the usual overreliance on piggybacking, of course.

Don’t do that

don’t give me hope!!!

 

[SpectreJordan]

The Definitive List of Unused Fighters in Smash

A comprehensive update to the Definitive List of Unused Fighters in Smash! A fully sourced list of every statement made by Sakurai on potential fighters for each entry in the Smash series.

sourcegaming.info

Go to the Smash 4 section. Reggie, Miyamoto, and Iwata were actually considered, but they were said to be "Uninteresting" for the Wide Audience.

So even into Smash 4 Non-video game origin charactters were considered. I don't think Reggie, Miyamoto, and Iwata would be it (they'll stay as Miis) But Honestly I could see a non-video game Origin character making it in, provided that they have Easy Licensing, Popular, and more of a video game connection despite their origin

I think that would only apply to Geralt then. He’d be the only one I’d be okay. The Witcher games have become far more popular than the books; to the point where most people think the series started out with the games.

I can’t really think of anyone else like that. Goku is associated with the manga/anime... & doesn’t have that many good games anyway lmao.

 

[CapitaineCrash]

Now I know nobody wants 4th parties getting into Smash because of the havoc they'd cause, but let me give a hypothetical for a moment:

Sakurai adds either himself, Miyamoto, Reggie, or Iwata to the game as playable fighters. Technically it's more possible than not; Dr. Kawashima is an assist trophy, and that's a real life person (in video game form of course) but a real life person nonetheless.

How would you guys feel about this happening as a last minute bonus "WTF" character?

A non video game Nintendo character I could think of is Nester, who is the mascot of the Nintendo Power magazine. He could fight using the Nes zapper and the Power glove. Honestly I'm not a fan of my own idea but if you want to add something close to Nintendo but non video game he's the one that comes to my mind. But please not as a DLC, this kind of joke character should be in the base game.