Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Michael the Spikester]

It'd be nice if we at most got a tease for the 4th fighter. That'd be nice. Doubtful though that's happening either too.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I wouldn't expect anything on Fighter 4 until after EVO, and probably not until we at least get Banjo.

 

[Icedragonadam]

September Nintendo Direct, that's when I expect Fighter #4 to be revealed. Either that or a final Direct revealed alongside #5 in the late fall for Ultimate.

 

[Will]

Fighter 4 comes out during Christmas and we damn well know we're not getting Banjo for another few good months. We're waiting on the long haul.

 

[Cyberfire]

Imagine that both Hero and Banjo drop at Evo. ‘Fall’ was a fake out.

 

[SirCamp]

So I just discovered that Marvelous is the company developing Daemon X Machina. Guess what series is their biggest property? That's right, Story of Seasons!

Legitimately though, I actually do think that is interesting. It's a Switch exclusive game and it's getting pushed by Nintendo. On top of the large amount of screen time rune factory 4 and 5 got in the direct they were in. Seems like the two companies have a good relationship, even if most people aren't terribly aware of Marvelous as a company.

Side note, I also just found out that Marvelous developed God Eater 3? Interesting stuff.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

September Nintendo Direct, that's when I expect Fighter #4 to be revealed. Either that or a final Direct revealed alongside #5 in the late fall for Ultimate.

September Direct for #4, releasing in December.
Game Awards for #5, releasing in February.

That’s where I’m putting my cards in that regard.

 

[Door Key Pig]

September Direct for #4, releasing in December.
Game Awards for #5, releasing in February.

That’s where I’m putting my cards in that regard.

So no final direct where Sakurai concludes and thanks us like last game?

Also, I really doubt that Dead or Alive chick being in the game. She may have other qualities, but to me and many others she'll still just be "a boobs physics character from Dead or Alive". Plus she's not the first traditional fighter character choice we'd get, assuming we'd totally get another and they don't just leave it for Ryu and Ken...

 

[Mega Bidoof]

So no final direct where Sakurai concludes and thanks us like last game?

Also, I really doubt that Dead or Alive chick being in the game. She may have other qualities, but to me and many others she'll still just be "a boobs physics character from Dead or Alive". Plus she's not the first traditional fighter character choice we'd get, assuming we'd totally get another and they don't just leave it for Ryu and Ken...

Maybe swap out Game Awards with a final Smash direct.

 

[Deleted member]

Not expecting a reveal of Fighter 4 during the summer, tbh.

 

[DarthEnderX]

most fans of fps these days arent actually fps fans they only like military shooters (cod, halo, ect). fans of fps games play all of them. unreal tournament, borderlands, rage, doom, Wolfenstein, ect. I've seen a lot of people who were introduced to metroid through prime because it was an fps and the increased sales on the prime series demonstrate this. the prime series alone has sold almost half the series total sales.

It's weird that you consider Halo to be a "military shooter", but not Doom or Wolfenstein...

This just came from the Porky thread. What are everyone's thoughts? Real or fake?

Well, it's a cropped, blurry screenshot, so it's definitely fake.

 

[Deleted member]

Yeah, as a Metroid fan I have to say that Samus does not represent the FPS genre well enough in Smash.

Metroid reps overall seem to mostly mimic or reference the 2D titles for the most part, with the only elements close to Metroid Prime representation being Frigate Orpheon, Dark Samus and Meta Ridley. All of which not being enough stuff for FPS content in Smash.

Someone such as Doomguy, Master Chief or the Wolfenstein protagonist would do it better.

 

[blackghost]

It's weird that you consider Halo to be a "military shooter", but not Doom or Wolfenstein...

why? in doom you ARE the army no one is with you. and you arent fighting other humans. As for Wolfenstein the series isnt a traditional military shooter. its scfi, dystopia, and a whole bunch of things going on. it really varies from game to game.

 

[DarthEnderX]

why? in doom you ARE the army no one is with you. and you arent fighting other humans. As for Wolfenstein the series isnt a traditional military shooter. its scfi, dystopia, and a whole bunch of things going on. it really varies from game to game.

Everything you just said also applies to Halo. My issue wasn't that you weren't including Doom and Wolfenstein in military shooters, my issue was that you WERE including Halo for some reason.

Like, I understand the concept of "military shooter" like Call of Duty, Battlefield, etc. But the only thing that makes Halo one of those games is that he is in A military. In which case, Doom and Wolfenstein are just as much military games as Halo.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I hope we'll get to see some Hero gameplay soon. I wanna know how the character's moveset works together. Oh, and that stage too. What cool things happen on it?

EDIT: And do we get more than two music tracks?

Everything you just said also applies to Halo. My issue wasn't that you weren't including Doom and Wolfenstein in military shooters, my issue was that you WERE including Halo for some reason.

Like, I understand the concept of "military shooter" like Call of Duty, Battlefield, etc. But the only thing that makes Halo one of those games is that he is in A military. In which case, Doom and Wolfenstein are just as much military games as Halo.

Maybe blackghost's thinking about the multiplayer while you're thinking about the single player?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I hope we'll get to see some Hero gameplay soon. I wanna know how the character's moveset works together. Oh, and that stage too. What cool things happen on it?

EDIT: And do we get more than two music tracks?


Maybe blackghost's thinking about the multiplayer while you're thinking about the single player?

The two tracks was only for Final Fantasy VII cause at the time Cloud was announced for 4, Square Enix and Nobuo Uematsu weren’t on the best terms. I think they’ll be more generous with Dragon Quest, and if Square Enix gets a third rep from a different series, whatever music that series has too

 

[Nemuresu]

I'm not sure if I ever commented this, but the wait was definitely the bad part about Hero and Banjo being revealed in this E3.

The former comes somewhere around this month and the next one, while the latter won't be out until September or October. Four months of waiting.

You can say whatever you want, but I seriously doubt Nintendo would want to reveal more characters when they're not even done releasing the ones they announced. So not expecting new reveals until November/December.

 

[3BitSaurus]

I'm not sure if I ever commented this, but the wait was definitely the bad part about Hero and Banjo being revealed in this E3.

The former comes somewhere around this month and the next one, while the latter won't be out until September or October. Four months of waiting.

You can say whatever you want, but I seriously doubt Nintendo would want to reveal more characters when they're not even done releasing the ones they announced. So not expecting new reveals until November/December.

I think the next character will be revealed in a fall Direct, assuming Banjo releases around that time. Probably releases by the end of the year or along with the final character in February.

 

[Izanagi97]

The two tracks was only for Final Fantasy VII cause at the time Cloud was announced for 4, Square Enix and Nobuo Uematsu weren’t on the best terms. I think they’ll be more generous with Dragon Quest, and if Square Enix gets a third rep from a different series, whatever music that series has too

Wait, so the whole music thing was because Square and Nobuo were on bad terms with each other at the time? I wonder if something similar was why there are basically no FF spirits that aren't fighter spirits (artists and Square Enix being on bad terms at the time)

 

[Ridrool64]

I think Hero is coming September and Banjo is coming December, within the first 20 days. Fighters 4 and 5 are revealed in a January Direct, 4 releases day of, 5 releases February 29th 2020.

Yes, this is hyper-cynical.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I think Hero is coming September and Banjo is coming December, within the first 20 days. Fighters 4 and 5 are revealed in a January Direct, 4 releases day of, 5 releases February 29th 2020.

Yes, this is hyper-cynical.

Given the "July"/Summer video Nintendo uploaded, I'd be very disappointed that they screwed up this badly for Hero to be in the video but not coming until September.

 

[ThatOneAnon]

Let's just remember literally everyone assumed Joker was being held off from Smash until PSL2019 and literally everyone was wrong.
Do not assume anything is going to happen at any special events like EVO or the Game Awards or even a Nintendo Direct. For all we know the Hero could release tomorrow.
I feel like the least we'd get at EVO is an announcement of a Smash-oriented Direct or a release date announcement for Hero. No new character reveals, though.

 

[Ridrool64]

You know what’d be nice? More items. I think stuff like extra Assist Trophies could serve as the mode update. Akechi, Healslime or maybe Alena, and Mumbo alongside extra new Assists (given they won’t be in the pass: Lip, Porky, Paper Mario, Elma, return of Saki, return of Kat and Ana, King Hippo, Amy Rose, Aerith, Axel Stone, Lara Croft, Steve, and many more). Beyond that, how about stuff like Sonic’s Elemental Shields or a Mega Man E-Tank?

At least, I think we could see an Assist/Item list expansion at some point as the “mode” update that comes alongside the Fighter, Stage, Music and Spirits data. Given, of course, we get something like this every update. Otherwise, probably not.

 

[tenworldsguy]

Not expecting a reveal of Fighter 4 during the summer, tbh.

The best I see is Hero being released (as stated by Nintendo) and maybe some Banjo news come late September. Maybe a Banjo release in very late September if they're anxious to get 4 and 5 revealed. Def no new fighter tho, the only time they did something like that was with releasing Lucas alongside Roy and Ryu despite Lucas being revealed earlier, and that was entirely for 3DS hardware reasons.

I think Hero is coming September and Banjo is coming December, within the first 20 days. Fighters 4 and 5 are revealed in a January Direct, 4 releases day of, 5 releases February 29th 2020.

Yes, this is hyper-cynical.

That's like an excessive worst-case scenario. It's implied Hero and Banjo are both near complete, if not already done and just being bug tested/withheld to maintain a steady release schedule. There's no real reason why Nintendo would delay Banjo to the end of the year or Hero to the end of september, except as a giant "F U" to smash fans for no real reason.

 

[RileyXY1]

I think that Hero will be released either this month or next month.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

I find Mai Shiranui/Nakoruru to be more likely then Kasumi tbh if the female fighting game character leak is to be true especially given said popularity.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

I don’t know if anyone pointed this out, and this is probably just a baseless pattern, but the third party companies in Smash so far, besides Namco and Capcom, have gotten newcomers this game, whether DLC or otherwise.

Konami got the Belmonts. SEGA got Joker. Square got Hero.
Last two characters being from Namco-Bandai and Capcom would fit into this nicely.

It probably means nothing, but it’s just a thought that crossed my mind while I was thinking about #4 and #5 being Namco and Capcom, which I still think is likely.

If the entire fighters pass does end up being purely 3rd party, which seems probable now, I think the last two will be some combination of a Namco character, a Capcom character, or Crash.
As for who those prior two would be specifically, the big names in my head right now are Heihachi and Lloyd for Namco, and Phoenix Wright, Leon Kennedy, and Dante for Capcom.

 

[Curious Villager]

I don’t know if anyone pointed this out, and this is probably just a baseless pattern, but the third party companies in Smash so far, besides Namco and Capcom, have gotten newcomers this game, whether DLC or otherwise.

Konami got the Belmonts. SEGA got Joker. Square got Hero.
Last two characters being from Namco-Bandai and Capcom would fit into this nicely.

It probably means nothing, but it’s just a thought that crossed my mind while I was thinking about #4 and #5 being Namco and Capcom, which I still think is likely.

If the entire fighters pass does end up being purely 3rd party, which seems probable now, I think the last two will be some combination of a Namco character, a Capcom character, or Crash.
As for who those prior two would be specifically, the big names in my head right now are Heihachi and Lloyd for Namco, and Phoenix Wright, Leon Kennedy, and Dante for Capcom.

Capcom got Ken as well for the base game.

 

[perfectchaos83]

I don’t know if anyone pointed this out, and this is probably just a baseless pattern, but the third party companies in Smash so far, besides Namco and Capcom, have gotten newcomers this game, whether DLC or otherwise.

Konami got the Belmonts. SEGA got Joker. Square got Hero.
Last two characters being from Namco-Bandai and Capcom would fit into this nicely.

It probably means nothing, but it’s just a thought that crossed my mind while I was thinking about #4 and #5 being Namco and Capcom, which I still think is likely.

If the entire fighters pass does end up being purely 3rd party, which seems probable now, I think the last two will be some combination of a Namco character, a Capcom character, or Crash.
As for who those prior two would be specifically, the big names in my head right now are Heihachi and Lloyd for Namco, and Phoenix Wright, Leon Kennedy, and Dante for Capcom.

Capcom got Ken.

 

[Door Key Pig]

So that would JUST leave Bamco without any kind of new character this Smash, which isn't too weird when you remember Sakurai saying there weren't any other strong candidates to go with and Heihachi would be hard to implement.
https://www.sourcegaming.info/2015/06/26/800/

Maybe swap out Game Awards with a final Smash direct.

I have to wonder when it'll be confirmed whether there's more DLC to follow or not. When Cloud was announced last game, they said a special Smash broadcast was coming up, but at the very least in that didn't say it was the final one. Maybe it could be the same case here, or they could outright say it to begin with even. If we suddenly get that answer dropped on us with the titling of "Final Smash direct", only then will it look like it's the endgame for us, with pressure placed on whoever the last reveal(s) is. Maybe it could be about both #4 and #5, or it's after #4 is revealed and it only reveals #5, maybe some weird bonus character if we're lucky. Hopefully it won't end up like last year's disappointing final base game direct as we finally see the fate of several characters for the biggest, once-in-a-lifetime Smash game and the only one for a long while. But you can't please everyone.
EDIT: Oh yeah, and even with just Pac-Man, he kinda also represents Namco arcade games in general, right? So the Namco representation could be worse!

 

[Idon]

Capcom got Ken.

As an echo. He's not exactly on the tier as any of the other 3rd party characters in terms of "hype" or "profitability" or whatever despite having more differences than any other echo.

 

[KillerCage]

I don’t know if anyone pointed this out, and this is probably just a baseless pattern, but the third party companies in Smash so far, besides Namco and Capcom, have gotten newcomers this game, whether DLC or otherwise.

Konami got the Belmonts. SEGA got Joker. Square got Hero.
Last two characters being from Namco-Bandai and Capcom would fit into this nicely.

It probably means nothing, but it’s just a thought that crossed my mind while I was thinking about #4 and #5 being Namco and Capcom, which I still think is likely.

If the entire fighters pass does end up being purely 3rd party, which seems probable now, I think the last two will be some combination of a Namco character, a Capcom character, or Crash.
As for who those prior two would be specifically, the big names in my head right now are Heihachi and Lloyd for Namco, and Phoenix Wright, Leon Kennedy, and Dante for Capcom.

While one could argue for a new Capcom rep, I find the idea of a new Namco Bandai rep difficult to believe. Besides Agumon (who would represent Bandai but falls under a grey area regarding his origins,) the characters most people bring up as a Namco rep are Heihachi and Lloyd and both of them have issues (more so with the former than the latter.) Heihachi's voice actor passed away shortly after recording his lines for Incineroar in August. The Fighters' Pass was finalized during at least early November. There is also the issue of Sakurai stating that he couldn't create a workable moveset for Heihachi during Smash 4's DLC period. Personally, I don't see how Heihachi could be unique enough from Ryu (and Ken.) Lloyd does use dual swords and the combat system from Tales of Symphonia is fairly similar to Smash Bros. Lloyd's real issue is that there are already two JRPG characters on the Fighters' Pass (Joker and the Hero.) Adding a third JRPG character could be seen as overkill and there is also the subjective argument that he would be another "anime swordsman." If I were to predict which between Heihachi and Lloyd would Sakurai pick to create a new Smash Bros character, I believe Lloyd would be his pick. Then again Sakurai did say during Smash 4 that there were no characters under Namco Bandai's umbrella that would work well in Smash Bros

 

[Ornl]

I don’t know if anyone pointed this out, and this is probably just a baseless pattern, but the third party companies in Smash so far, besides Namco and Capcom, have gotten newcomers this game, whether DLC or otherwise.

Konami got the Belmonts. SEGA got Joker. Square got Hero.
Last two characters being from Namco-Bandai and Capcom would fit into this nicely.

It probably means nothing, but it’s just a thought that crossed my mind while I was thinking about #4 and #5 being Namco and Capcom, which I still think is likely.

If the entire fighters pass does end up being purely 3rd party, which seems probable now, I think the last two will be some combination of a Namco character, a Capcom character, or Crash.
As for who those prior two would be specifically, the big names in my head right now are Heihachi and Lloyd for Namco, and Phoenix Wright, Leon Kennedy, and Dante for Capcom.

From another point of view, Nintendo, Konami, Sega and Squenix could be a true surprise. Heihachi Mishima is already in Smash because there is no need any sub-Ryu. There is no need any sub-Hero either (Tales rep). The best choice for Bamco is to give up a slot.

 

[Door Key Pig]

I mean I'd totally be okay with leaving the traditional fighter representation with Ryu and Ken as it is, though Tekken would make me go "oh, neat!".

 

[Idon]

From another point of view, Nintendo, Konami, Sega and Squenix could be a true surprise. Heihachi Mishima is already in Smash because there is no need any sub-Ryu. There is no need any sub-Hero either (Tales rep). The best choice for Bamco is to give up a slot.

View attachment 232221

I'd hardly call Lloyd a "sub Hero." He plays more like an action game like Legend of Zelda does than does a typical JRPG especially with his real time action combat and dual wielding.

 

[3BitSaurus]

From another point of view, Nintendo, Konami, Sega and Squenix could be a true surprise. Heihachi Mishima is already in Smash because there is no need any sub-Ryu. There is no need any sub-Hero either (Tales rep). The best choice for Bamco is to give up a slot.

View attachment 232221

Dunno... Heihachi or other fighting game characters would hardly be "sub-Ryus". Especially if Sakurai could implement different mechanics from another series, like Tekken or KOF.

Same for Lloyd - while I personally would rather have characters from different genres as the last two, I don't think he would be similar to Hero at all.

If these two don't make it, I highly doubt being "too similar" to existing characters would be a reason why.

 

[Megadoomer]

From another point of view, Nintendo, Konami, Sega and Squenix could be a true surprise. Heihachi Mishima is already in Smash because there is no need any sub-Ryu. There is no need any sub-Hero either (Tales rep). The best choice for Bamco is to give up a slot.

View attachment 232221

There's also Nightmare from Soul Calibur, Agumon from Digimon, KOS-MOS from Xenosaga, Jin or Kazuya from Tekken, other Tales protagonists... Namco-Bandai has plenty of other options.

 

[Ornl]

I was referring to the notoriety and the genre (fighting game / heroic fantasy JRPG). Not to the moveset.

 

[GoodGrief741]

From another point of view, Nintendo, Konami, Sega and Squenix could be a true surprise. Heihachi Mishima is already in Smash because there is no need any sub-Ryu. There is no need any sub-Hero either (Tales rep). The best choice for Bamco is to give up a slot.

View attachment 232221

Heihachi isn't a sub-Ryu and Lloyd isn't a sub-Hero anymore than Hero or Joker are 'sub-Clouds' or Banjo is a 'sub-Mario'. You do realize that you prove nothing by insulting those characters, right?

 

[Ornl]

Heihachi isn't a sub-Ryu and Lloyd isn't a sub-Hero anymore than Hero or Joker are 'sub-Clouds' or Banjo is a 'sub-Mario'. You do realize that you prove nothing by insulting those characters, right?

This isn't a judgment, but a sober expression of why Tekken and Tales haven't been upgraded from Sm4sh. And why it's useless to wait for them.