Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Next week we might be getting a new main series game announcement.

Completely irrelevant to Smash DLC.

Because Smash DLC is downloadable now and a new game announcement won't be available for months on end.

They're entirely different situations in every way.

Smash DLC was only competing with Pokemon DLC this week, nothing else. Key term being "DLC".

 

[3BitSaurus]

Next week we might be getting a new main series game announcement.

I don't really see it happening now. They've barely launched Isle of Armor and we haven't even got Crown Tundra yet. GF is relatively small when you consider they make games for literally the biggest media franchise ever.

I don't see a new mainline title until after Crown Tundra, at the earliest. That's when SwSh will really be done and they might move on to other projects.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I don't really see it happening now. They've barely launched Isle of Armor and we haven't even got Crown Tundra yet. GF is relatively small when you consider they make games for literally the biggest media franchise ever.

I don't see a new mainline title until after Crown Tundra, at the earliest. That's when SwSh will really be done and they might move on to other projects.

I think he's referring to the Let's Go Johto, which are mainline titles too. Let's Go is basically the "casual mainline series" while we have normal Pokemon for the "competitive mainline series".

...It's awkward. But that's basically how they're doing it.

Called it. Wouldn't make a difference, though. Smash DLC is no longer competing with Pokemon DLC, so it's super easy to have them both the same week. Or even the same day. Smash DLC is most likely this Thursday instead, or Tuesday. I could see them doing it the day after so people can sink their teeth into the all new games, though.

 

[RileyXY1]

I don't really see it happening now. They've barely launched Isle of Armor and we haven't even got Crown Tundra yet. GF is relatively small when you consider they make games for literally the biggest media franchise ever.

I don't see a new mainline title until after Crown Tundra, at the earliest. That's when SwSh will really be done and they might move on to other projects.

I could see them announcing a new Let's Go.

 

[3BitSaurus]

I think he's referring to the Let's Go Johto, which are mainline titles too. Let's Go is basically the "casual mainline series" while we have normal Pokemon for the "competitive mainline series".

...It's awkward. But that's basically how they're doing it.

I mean... I get it, but wasn't that only a rumor? I think the project they want to announce next week might be something else entirely, related to those new partnerships TPC had been making.

...Regardless, I don't see even a Let's Go Johto affecting (or being affected by) Smash news in the slightest. And if TPC or Nintendo somehow think it does... hoo boy.

 

[TheCJBrine]

According to this:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

The new Pokémon project probably isn't Let's Go at all. iirc the Daniel Ahmad guy is an insider, and he liked the person's quote-retweet too.

Of course, I guess Let's Go could still be a thing they're working on too. Just probably not the "big project."

-didn't find this myself, Z25 shared it in the general Social thread.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Since it's been a little slow today due to the only news begin that there will be no news for a few weeks, I have created a moveset speculation topic for you all to discuss. A moveset that I have made for none other than:

Torkoal!

Why Torkoal? I dunno. I don't even particularly like Torkoal but here we are.

Spoiler: Overview

Torkoal is a heavy character that wants to juggle the opponent to death. It’s oddly quite fast, and the smog coming from Torkoal’s back will always produce a windbox (unless it has is or has just used Iron Defense) which can catch its opponents landings. It’s primary K.O. attacks all hit above it.

Spoiler: Normal Attacks

Neutral attack ​

Torkoal sweeps its head down, blowing white smog from its nostrils. It can serve as a decent anti-air, as it hits above it first.

Forward tilt ​

A quick bite attack. Torkoal stretches its neck out when using this move, so it has decent range, and is safe on shield.

Up tilt ​

Torkoal blows a gust of smoke from its back, extending the windbox. Can be used as an unconventional anti-air, which can even be followed up with an aerial attack.

Down tilt ​

A quick low bite attack.

Dash attack ​

Rapid Spin
Torkoal retreats into its shell and spins as it comes to a stop. This attack gets rid of traps like Smog and C4 without harming Torkoal. It’s also a decent KO move if the player lands the last hit of the attack.

Forward smash ​

Body Slam
Torkoal leaps forward, and comes crashing down on its belly. This attack has a lot of startup, but is a powerful KO move, and can be used to avoid lower attacks.

Up smash ​

Torkoal breathes fire at an upward 45° angle. This attack is deceptively powerful, but has a very specific range.

Down smash ​

Torkoal rears up before stomping on the ground. This attack has some startup, but buries any fighter standing in front of it.

Neutral aerial ​

A cartwheel attack. Torkoal’s go to combo move.

Forward aerial ​

Torkoal spews white smog from its nostrils as it swings its head forward.

Back aerial ​

Torkoal spins around and breathes fire behind it. Another of Torkoal’s KO moves.

Up aerial ​

Torkoal spews white smog from its nostrils as it swings its head upward.

Down aerial ​

Torkoal flips upside down and fires lava from its back. This attack can spike opponents.

Grab ​

A decently long range grab albeit with a bit of end lag.

Pummel ​

Torkoal bites down on its opponent.

Forward throw ​

Throws the opponent forward.

Back throw ​

Spins the opponent around a few times, then lets go.

Up throw ​

Throws the opponent upward. Combos at low persentages.

Down throw ​

Throws the opponent downward. The opponent flies a bit forward after bouncing on the ground.

Floor attack (front) ​

Spews white smog around itself.

Floor attack (back) ​

Blasts fire from its shell, propelling it to its feet.

Floor attack (trip) ​

Spews white smog around itself.

Edge attack ​

Gets up and bites forward.

Spoiler: Specail Attacks

Neutral special ​

Eruption
Torkoal causes magma to spew out the top of its shell. This attack starts out slow, but strong, and becomes weaker and faster as Torkoal takes damage.

Side special ​

Smog
Torkoal belches black smoke that stays in place, and continually damages enemies caught in it until it dissipates. The smoke lingers for quite a while, and Torkoal can have up to two smoke clouds at a time.

Up special ​

Flame Wheel
Torkoal spins, creating fire around itself as it propels in any given direction. This move doesn’t go too far, but it can be angled, causing Torkoal to change ark toward the desired direction. The move can even be used on the ground.

Down special ​

Iron Defense
Torkoal retracts all of its limbs, and becomes encased in metal. This grants Torkoal the metal property for a few seconds, but stops Torkoal from using any fire attacks (except Up Special) for longer, and its smoke dwindles considerably. Torkoal cannot use this move again until it recovers from the debuff.

Final Smash ​

Inferno
Torkoal summons a huge flame pillar around it, dealing massive damage, and burning opponents next to it for damage over time.

Spoiler: Some Extra Fluff

On-Screen Appearance
Torkoal slams to the ground, and stands up.

Taunts

• Looks up, and a question mark appears over its head.
• Blows white smoke out of its nostrils that travels behind it.
• Picks up a piece of coal, and eats it.

Idle Animations

• Looks around.
• Wobbles a bit to shift its weight.

Victory Poses

• Assumes a proud pose as white smoke billows from its nostrils.
• Spins around in its shell before hopping with joy.
• Finds a pile of coal, and happily starts eating.

Victory Theme
A snippet of Lavaridge town’s theme.

So have I sold you on Torkoal yet? No? Well at least we're on the same page. Feel free to make suggestions on what would be more interesting or tell me to get a life.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I mean... I get it, but wasn't that only a rumor? I think the project they want to announce next week might be something else entirely, related to those new partnerships TPC had been making.

...Regardless, I don't see even a Let's Go Johto affecting (or being affected by) Smash news in the slightest. And if TPC or Nintendo somehow think it does... hoo boy.

It wouldn't affect Smash DLC, no. The only way one could overshadow the other is if it's a Downloadable game right then and there, and it has to be a massively big Pokemon game immediately ready. Which is pretty unlikely to begin with. We got our big DLC this week, and more than just Isle of Armor.

I mean... I get it, but wasn't that only a rumor? I think the project they want to announce next week might be something else entirely, related to those new partnerships TPC had been making.

...Regardless, I don't see even a Let's Go Johto affecting (or being affected by) Smash news in the slightest. And if TPC or Nintendo somehow think it does... hoo boy.

It wouldn't affect Smash DLC, no. The only way one could overshadow the other is if it's a Downloadable game right then and there, and it has to be a massively big Pokemon game immediately ready. Which is pretty unlikely to begin with. We got our big DLC this week, and more than just Isle of Armor.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

"Hey guys, guess which Capcom rep it will be!"

This would be such a headache. Personally and in general. Capcom has one of the biggest pool of potential characters and personally I have a lot of stakes in this too as it would make me be like "Is it Phoenix's time or will it be someone else like Dante or maybe Monster Hunter, Amaterasu or even Frank West?"

Just like ZelDan said, there would be several fanbases yelling at each other and people are already anxious about speculation as it is. So they better not do anything like this again.

"We will include a Square Enix rep!"

oh boy.........

"The next character will be yet again from Fire Emblem".

Imagine the salt.

 

[SNEKeater]

The new Pokémon project seems like could be related to Tencent.

Imagine if they pulled a "Guess the Capcom character!" stunt.

All the various Capcom fanbases would be at eachothers' throats as I'm just sitting in the sidelines watching with popcorn, happy that I got Megaman in Smash 4.

That would be funny and terrifying at the same time. I'd be so on board with something like that lol

 

[ZelDan]

"Hey guys, guess which Capcom rep it will be!"

This would be such a headache. Personally and in general. Capcom has one of the biggest pool of potential characters and personally I have a lot of stakes in this too as it would make me be like "Is it Phoenix's time or will it be someone else like Dante or maybe Monster Hunter, Amaterasu or even Frank West?"

Just like ZelDan said, there would be several fanbases yelling at each other and people are already anxious about speculation as it is. So they better not do anything like this again.

"We will include a Square Enix rep!"

oh boy.........

Doing a guessing game with Capcom is one thing.

Doing it with Square Enix would probably result in this entire website being locked down and other Smash forums becoming (bigger) warzones. Nobody would be safe.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Doing a guessing game with Capcom is one thing.

Doing it with Square Enix would probably result in this entire website being locked down and other Smash forums becoming (bigger) warzones. Nobody would be safe.

We did have the Seven Squares leak, which was leakbait created by SE. So... it wasn't actually all that bad as it could be.

It might be worse, but it'd actually be the same as it is now. A lot of "just because" answers to try and battle for who has the best chance.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

That would be funny and terrifying at the same time. I'd be so on board with something like that lol

I'll be into it for about a week until everyone settles on Dante, and we just argue about whether or not they'll try and smoosh Nero and Vergil in with him as alternate costumes.

Doing a guessing game with Capcom is one thing.

Doing it with Square Enix would probably result in this entire website being locked down and other Smash forums becoming (bigger) warzones. Nobody would be safe.

Geno vs. Lara wars intensify. Crono fans sit in a corner and hope he gets picked instead.

EDIT: Actually, this would be a great way to get as many people as possible to hate Geno out of spite regardless of the outcome.

 

[Speed Weed]

Imagine if they pulled a "Guess the Capcom character!" stunt.

All the various Capcom fanbases would be at eachothers' throats as I'm just sitting in the sidelines watching with popcorn, happy that I got Megaman in Smash 4.

AMINGO GANG LET'S ****ING GO

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Doing a guessing game with Capcom is one thing.

Doing it with Square Enix would probably result in this entire website being locked down and other Smash forums becoming (bigger) warzones. Nobody would be safe.

As a Neku stan I would find the nearest fallout shelter immediately

 

[ZelDan]

We did have the Seven Squares leak, which was leakbait created by SE. So... it wasn't actually all that bad as it could be.

It might be worse, but it'd actually be the same as it is now. A lot of "just because" answers to try and battle for who has the best chance.

I dunno, I feel the finality of FP2 plus the fact that it would be guaranteed one of them would get included and ONLY one, would definitely escalate things substantially.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Honestly having them go "next up is a Square Enix character" is a great way for me to enjoy the community going to war for months while I'm confident that whoever wins I win.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I dunno, I feel the finality of FP2 plus the fact that it would be guaranteed one of them would get included and ONLY one, would definitely escalate things substantially.

...It's been like that for a while, actually.

That's why fanbases easily get up in arms. You know, before ARMS come out.

 

[ZelDan]

...It's been like that for a while, actually.

That's why fanbases easily get up in arms. You know, before ARMS come out.

True, the finality has been getting to everyone.

Mix that salt with the kind of salt we got from the "Seven Square list" situation, and we're all going to have a bad time.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

AMINGO GANG LET'S ****ING GO

Perhaps I should have made an Amingo moveset instead...

Mix that salt with the kind of salt we got from the "Seven Square list" situation, and we're all going to have a bad time.

Seven Square list?

 

[Cosmic77]

You really want to see a fight break out?

"There were a lot of great characters who became ATs in this game. One of them really stood out to us, and we've decided to make them into a full-fledged Smash character. This character will eventually be F7."

The Assist Trophy alliance will fall apart faster than the Grinch leak on November 1st, 2018.

 

[RileyXY1]

You really want to see a fight break out?

"There were a lot of great characters who became ATs in this game. One of them really stood out to us, and we've decided to make them into a full-fledged Smash character. This character will eventually be F7."

The Assist Trophy alliance will fall apart faster than the Grinch leak on November 1st, 2018.

Or something even worse, "The new fighter will be a Pokemon introduced in Pokemon Sword and Shield".

 

[Rie Sonomura]

You really want to see a fight break out?

"There were a lot of great characters who became ATs in this game. One of them really stood out to us, and we've decided to make them into a full-fledged Smash character. This character will eventually be F7."

The Assist Trophy alliance will fall apart faster than the Grinch leak on November 1st, 2018.

Or something even worse, "The new fighter will be a Pokemon introduced in Pokemon Sword and Shield".

You are like little babies, watch this:
“The next fighter will be from the Xenoblade series”

 

[SneakyLink]

You really want to see a fight break out?

"There were a lot of great characters who became ATs in this game. One of them really stood out to us, and we've decided to make them into a full-fledged Smash character. This character will eventually be F7."

The Assist Trophy alliance will fall apart faster than the Grinch leak on November 1st, 2018.

As a bonus, Poké Ball Pokémon are included in this.

That said, I think the assist thing will be not that bad because most seem to gravitate towards the same 10 or so assist trophies.
That, and who is clamoring for Color TV Game 15 to become a fighter?

Spoiler

me

 

[Cosmic77]

Or something even worse, "The new fighter will be a Pokemon introduced in Pokemon Sword and Shield".

You're replying to the wrong user if you think I'd believe that would be a worse scenario.

Seriously, I don't think people would even have the energy to argue over Pokemon. More likely that not, everyone would just say they don't care and that Nintendo should hurry up with the reveal and get it over with.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

As a bonus, Poké Ball Pokémon are included in this.

That said, I think the assist thing will be not that bad because most seem to gravitate towards the same 10 or so assist trophies.
That, and who is clamoring for Color TV Game 15 to become a fighter?

Spoiler

me

You think that's bad? There's a legit topic for Moon. Color TV Game 15 at least has a semblance of limbs. XD

 

[RileyXY1]

You're replying to the wrong user if you think I'd believe that would be a worse scenario.

Seriously, I don't think people would even have the energy to argue over Pokemon. More likely that not, everyone would just say they don't care and that Nintendo should hurry up with the reveal and get it over with.

Well, I can see Rillaboom and Inteleon supporters attacking Cinderace supporters.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Well, I can see Rillaboom and Inteleon supporters attacking Cinderace supporters.

They'd be a pretty small group though, as Cinderace and Urshifu would be generally agreed to be the only realistic choices.

 

[Speed Weed]

Perhaps I should have made an Amingo moveset instead...


Seven Square list?

yes

do that

that is the final piece i need to finish my magnum opus.....THE AMINGO SUPPORT THREAD.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Overall I think the "Who is it?!?" approach kinda sucks and I hope they never do it again.

I once was a dude who happened to think it was a good idea. For ARMS, it only kinda worked, but it got boiled down to like 3-4 scenarios by the end of it all. I have no doubt that Pokemon would have the potential to be just as bad.

I would prefer they just reveal who it is. It's not always possible given the circumstances, I get that. But I hope from here on out they can get into some sort of trend where they reveal the fighter, and then at the end of their presentation they can hint at what else is coming. I feel like that's a stronger approach, to always have your consumer knowing what's coming next once one pick is out of the way.

But eh, I'm mostly just cranky over the lack of news. I'll get over it.

 

[Megadoomer]

Max carnage scenario: Character from EA Games.

I'd actually be okay with that if it means that we got Commander Shepard from Mass Effect.

 

[Speed Weed]

Overall I think the "Who is it?!?" approach kinda sucks and I hope they never do it again.

I once was a dude who happened to think it was a good idea. For ARMS, it only kinda worked, but it got boiled down to like 3-4 scenarios by the end of it all. I have no doubt that Pokemon would have the potential to be just as bad.

I would prefer they just reveal who it is. It's not always possible given the circumstances, I get that. But I hope from here on out they can get into some sort of trend where they reveal the fighter, and then at the end of their presentation they can hint at what else is coming. I feel like that's a stronger approach, to always have your consumer knowing what's coming next once one pick is out of the way.

But eh, I'm mostly just cranky over the lack of news. I'll get over it.

i think it says a lot when the reveal format, the wait, and the 3 months of nothing but arms speculation have managed to suck all the hype out of me: someone who was a diehard spring man supporter in base game and got super upset at him being assist'd

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Overall I think the "Who is it?!?" approach kinda sucks and I hope they never do it again.

Same.

 

[DanganZilla5]

I don't know about you guys, but I'm more excited about which ARMS character its going to be in terms of whether it will break fan rules, more than what fan favorite(s) we will get. This is going to be the endgame of the fate of assist trophies and spirits.

The mascot of the game, Spring Man, is an assist trophy. Ribbon Girl, Min Min, Twintelle, and Ninjara are all spirits. They are significant characters and are all highly requested. They are the most clear cut choices for a playable rep, but many people insist on assist trophies and spirits deconfirming characters. I don't want to get into that debate since it's not the point I'm trying to make, but overall the choice of the rep is going to either rekindle a lot of dreams, or absolutely crush them. There are 3 scenarios I can see.

1. One or more of the spirits are chosen to be playable. This would be awkward since it wouldn't exactly answer our question of if assist trophies deconfirm, though it would be suspicious if say multiple characters were chosen but not Spring Man. But I imagine if this scenario played out, Sakurai would say why Spring Man didn't make it into battle. Another interesting thing about this is that it would break the "main character/mascot gets in first" fan rule.

2. Spring Man and at least one of the other spirit characters. I don't think they would go with just Spring Man since he's the obvious choice and the "guess who" game would seem pointless if it was the obvious choice. But this would be the best scenario. That means that a lot more characters are definitly possible and that would be super hype.

3. A character who isn't represented yet becomes playable. This would be the worst case scenario and it wouldn't look good for either assist trophies or spirits. This would probably go to either Max Brass or Dr. Coyle as they are recognizable and relevant to the story characters.

Overall, I'm betting on number 2 to happen. I'm still holding onto my theory that it will be multiple ARMS characters in one and the alts will have some different animations.

I'm confident that assist trophies and base game spirits don't deconfirm, but we just have to wait and see. We will get our answers by the end of this month. Anyway we look at this, this character is going to set a new precedence for Smash. Assist trophies and/or spirits are on the table, or side or villain characters can get in first.

Let's pray for the best outcome. One of my many mottos is: Hope for the best and prepare for the worst.

 

[Perkilator]

They'd be a pretty small group though, as Cinderace would be generally agreed to be the only realistic choice.

Slight fix, but otherwise I agree.

 

[Aetheri]

Keep in mind...even if Spring Man is chosen, and assist trophies are back on the table. That doesn't mean the other dlc fighters will be existing assist trophies.

Regardless what happens take things with a grain of salt.

Its not over until the fat baby sings!

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Its not over until the fat baby sings!

Is that you, L from Xenoblade X?!

 

[Jomosensual]

Honestly having them go "next up is a Square Enix character" is a great way for me to enjoy the community going to war for months while I'm confident that whoever wins I win.

Same for me with Capcom, probably at least.

 

[AceAttorney9000]

Keep in mind...even if Spring Man is chosen, and assist trophies are back on the table. That doesn't mean the other dlc fighters will be existing assist trophies.

People here keep bringing this up as a "don't get too excited" warning for those who want Assist Trophy/Spirit promotions... but even if Spring Man is the only Assist Trophy promotion this time around, that still doesn't change that, from that point on, the floodgates will have been opened. For any future Smash game that still features them, Assist Trophies will no longer be a straight-up death sentence that forbids second chances after the base game (or they were just never death sentences to begin with, depending on how the developers feel)... and I for one think that's worth at least a little bit of excitement.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

New famitsu column translations

Here are some notes from Sakurai's column #606. The summary leaked a little earlier, but now we have the full column. This translation is sponsored by @japaneseswitch. Please give them a follow!

1/8 pic.twitter.com/zLkIk2RRuh

— Will (PushDustIn) (@PushDustIn) June 17, 2020