Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Kotor]

Oh yeah I forgot the first one.

Also people hated him for not being Decidueye? Was Decidueye that popular?

I remember quite a couple of people only wanted Decidueye because it was a grass starter. To "complete the starter trio." To fulfill a non-existent quota

 

[Deleted member]

Battle of the underrepped franchises.

Winner gets a new character in Fighter's Pass #2

God I wish.

.

 

[andree123]

【トーナメントイベント】
5/1(金)から3日間、「シリーズ対決！ ドンキーコング VS カービィ」を開催！ 両シリーズのファイター限定のトーナメントで、勝ち進むほど豪華なスピリッツが手に入ります。#スマブラSP pic.twitter.com/0YHbqvBa2K

— 大乱闘スマッシュブラザーズ【スマブラ公式】 (@SmashBrosJP) April 29, 2020

It's a Donkey Kong vs Kirby event!?

Oh, I guess that the next tournament like that one will be Star Fox vs Kid Icraus!

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I mean, I'll put it this way. I meant it when I said character prospects should be treated individually in terms of why they get into Smash. It's worthless to try and force the square shape into the triangle hole when it just isn't going to fit. Joker was added in a different situation from Hero, from Banjo, from Terry, from Byleth. There wasn't a pattern aside from 4 of them being 3rd party.

This is the same reason why I think it's too early to call anything based on ARMS. ARMS is in a very specific situation, with a potential ARMS 2 announcement coming and good ad potential, ARMS makes sense here. I'm not sure yet that the same could be said for somebody like Rex, and the same definitely can't be said for Waluigi.

I, personally, am predicting Spring Man because something to note: We've never gotten a series playable debut without the mascot/protag. I believe I mentioned this some time ago. It is certainly a rule that could be broken, but Smash is a mascot fighter. That would be a strange sudden shift just because a character is already an AT. The fact that ARMS is a "special request" seems to suggest something like that as well.

Anyway, I will probably be hyped for whoever we get, so really I'm just sharing my preferences I suppose.

 

[Ben Holt]

God I wish.

.

I agree with these, but the most underrepresented franchise by far is Sonic the Hedgehog.

 

[DarthEnderX]

I remember quite a couple of people only wanted Decidueye because it was a grass starter. To "complete the starter trio."

Mostly that. But also he was a really COOL grass starter.

 

[Zinith]

Only the platforming games with "Super Mario" in the title are canon.
This includes Yoshi's Island: Super Mario World 2.
The only noncanon Mario games to include "Super Mario" in the title are Super Mario Kart, Super Mario RPG, and Super Mario Party.
But don't worry. I'm largely ****ing with you. Waluigi, Paper Mario, and Geno are noncanon, but they are in my list.

Is that the definitive "official" stance Nintendo has made, or is that just your interpretation?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I agree with these, but the most underrepresented franchise by far is Sonic the Hedgehog.

Also Final Fantasy. 15 huge mainline titles and still only one character.

This is why we need Bla-*get's decapitated by Cutie Gwen*

 

[Powerman293]

With how popular the series is, and how many potential candidates there are, I think it's good that the series is guaranteed to get a spot. I just wish they would pick a cool existing Pokémon instead of the future hot new starter.

Hopefully in the future, reserved slots are for popular characters that don't exist yet like Rex was to Super Smash Bros. Ultimate.

They should have used Incineroar's spot for a Gen 3 pokemon and the inevitable Gen 8 slot for a Gen 5 pokemon.

Nothing against Incineroar, he's great. But he comes from a legit bad game.

 

[Megadoomer]

Also Final Fantasy. 15 huge mainline titles and still only one character.

This is why we need Bla-*get's decapitated by Cutie Gwen*

I can only think of one character who would best represent as many Final Fantasy games as possible.

...or a Chocobo/Moogle, but by my understanding, Gilgamesh is the same character in every single appearance.

Spoiler

I'd love to see Terra or Kefka as a playable character, though

 

[Goombaic]

Final Fantasy is THE most underrepresented series. At least DK and Kirby have spirits, music, and stages that acknowledge other games in the series as well as the most important characters with very few exclusions. Final Fantasy's content is miniscule compared to that.

They should have used Incineroar's spot for a Gen 3 pokemon and the inevitable Gen 8 slot for a Gen 5 pokemon.

Nothing against Incineroar, he's great. But he comes from a legit bad game.

What was so bad about Sun and Moon? I can understand being underwhelmed by Sword and Shield, but Sun and Moon were improvement from X and Y in every way.

 

[kirbsmash]

Incineroar fan here, hi, but yeah, I was so hyped to see that 'leak' burned REAL good.

 

[Ben Holt]

Also Final Fantasy. 15 huge mainline titles and still only one character.

This is why we need Bla-*get's decapitated by Cutie Gwen*

Ok. Sephiroth, Barret, Noctis, Zack Fair (Cloud Echo), Black Mage, Chokobo, Zidane.
That's 8 to match Fire Emblem, since Final Fantasy is a bigger JRPG than Fire Emblem and deserves at least as many reps.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

I suspect two 1st parties, 1 fan favorite, 1 wildcard and two middle grounds.

Does that sound about right?

 

[Cosmic77]

They should have used Incineroar's spot for a Gen 3 pokemon and the inevitable Gen 8 slot for a Gen 5 pokemon.

Nothing against Incineroar, he's great. But he comes from a legit bad game.

I don't really think it's fair to deny a character from getting in Smash just because their game is "bad".

Not only is that subjective, but it has absolutely nothing to do with the character themselves or their moveset potential.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

They should have used Incineroar's spot for a Gen 3 pokemon and the inevitable Gen 8 slot for a Gen 5 pokemon.

Nothing against Incineroar, he's great. But he comes from a legit bad game.

I wouldn't say being from a bad game should keep you from being in Smash if the character's good. But they should let the character exist for a while to judge whether or not people like it.

What was so bad about Sun and Moon. I can understand being underwhelmed by Sword and Shield, but Sun and Moon were improvement from X and Y in every way.

Not really. It was more handholdy, the cutscenes droned on and on (knew a guy who's battery nearly died because of them), and the Island Trials repleced Gyms with fetch quests and quizzes you can't even get wrong.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

【トーナメントイベント】
5/1(金)から3日間、「シリーズ対決！ ドンキーコング VS カービィ」を開催！ 両シリーズのファイター限定のトーナメントで、勝ち進むほど豪華なスピリッツが手に入ります。#スマブラSP pic.twitter.com/0YHbqvBa2K

— 大乱闘スマッシュブラザーズ【スマブラ公式】 (@SmashBrosJP) April 29, 2020

It's a Donkey Kong vs Kirby event!?

Winner gets a new character in Fighter's Pass #2

God I wish.

.

Oh, I guess that the next tournament like that one will be Star Fox vs Kid Icraus!

We can continue that pattern then.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Battle of the underrepped franchises.

Lol Sakurai's not even putting Zelda stuff in with the underrepped franchises. I guess it's fine that they've had the same roster since Melee, right?

I agree with these, but the most underrepresented franchise by far is Sonic the Hedgehog.

I really wish we could have gotten our EGM April Fools 2002 finally. We got Green Greens back, and we have . All we needed was a little orange fox...

 

[Mushroomguy12]

【トーナメントイベント】
5/1(金)から3日間、「シリーズ対決！ ドンキーコング VS カービィ」を開催！ 両シリーズのファイター限定のトーナメントで、勝ち進むほど豪華なスピリッツが手に入ります。#スマブラSP pic.twitter.com/0YHbqvBa2K

— 大乱闘スマッシュブラザーズ【スマブラ公式】 (@SmashBrosJP) April 29, 2020

It's a Donkey Kong vs Kirby event!?

Fixed. Virgin 3 rep series vs Chad 4 rep series.

Here you go! pic.twitter.com/6TPlfAIRf7

— Bondforged TinTinfinite (@TinTinfinite) April 29, 2020

 

[Rie Sonomura]

【トーナメントイベント】
5/1(金)から3日間、「シリーズ対決！ ドンキーコング VS カービィ」を開催！ 両シリーズのファイター限定のトーナメントで、勝ち進むほど豪華なスピリッツが手に入ります。#スマブラSP pic.twitter.com/0YHbqvBa2K

— 大乱闘スマッシュブラザーズ【スマブラ公式】 (@SmashBrosJP) April 29, 2020

It's a Donkey Kong vs Kirby event!?

It’s literally Splatfests: Smash Edition at this point

watch as F-Zero vs Xenoblade is next: franchises with only the one playable rep

 

[Fluttershy64]

We can continue that pattern then.

Gosh that would be awesome. Krystal is my most wanted character in Smash.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Mega Man also has tons of historical value as a video game character. Rayman was... just successful. I don't really know what Rayman added to the gaming world compared to other characters like Ryu or Pac-Man. His games are good, and he's a fun character. But he didn't do anything that any other great series hasn't done.

That's not to say I wouldn't love to have Rayman in Smash. I would. But lets be honest here. He's not even close to the other legends we have on here. Continuing to compare Rayman to Mega Man is not fair.

 

[Knight Dude]

Ken and Richter are the second characters from their franchises to be in Smash. So there's bound to be more leniency with them anyways. Even without that, Ken's probably more well known than Rayaman in the same way Luigi, Tails or Protoman most likely are, as far as the general gaming landscape goes. Though yeah, most people would probably only know Richter from the "What Is A MAN?" meme at first unless they were already a Castlevania head. Whereas Simon and Alucard are kind of the faces of the series.

Terry's debatable, KOF/Fatal Fury has had a lot of influence on the fighting game genre as a whole, but I don't think you see many platformer games trying to take after Rayman's established tropes and mechanics like you do with Mario or Metroid. But Rayman's one of Ubisoft's more prolific original franchises. Other than AC.

I agree on Bayo, since she's a fairly new-ish character by comparison. So Rayman's probably reached more people and had more direct impact on the industry. Though again, not nearly to the extent of Mario/Sonic/Metroid/Mega Man/Castlevania/DKC.

EDIT: Not that it'd matter. Rayman would still probably be a pretty decent character on the whole.

 

[Powerman293]

I don't really think it's fair to deny a character from getting in Smash just because their game is "bad".

Some people define what "deserves" to get in Smash as iconicity, which is a hard measure to define to begin with. Since Smash is the All Stars of gaming, I prefer the standard to be if the games are good or not.

Do bad football players get into the hall of fame?

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

I can only think of one character who would best represent as many Final Fantasy games as possible.

...or a Chocobo/Moogle, but by my understanding, Gilgamesh is the same character in every single appearance.

Spoiler

I'd love to see Terra or Kefka as a playable character, though

If Gilgamesh ever gets in, my only requests are that two of his weapons are a knockoff Keyblade and a Geno doll with real springloaded firing action.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

As I’ve said before sometimes it isn’t really about how iconic something is or how it did something for gaming as a whole. Sometimes all it takes is a specific relationship. I figure if Rayman does get in this is what it’ll be from. How Nintendo and Ubisoft’s relationship spawned the idea.

It’s clear that Rayman is their Nintendo centric franchise. Rayman Legends: Definitive Edition is actually the Nintendo Switch exclusive version. One with extra content and work from Michel Ancel himself. Taking into account that Legends sold best on Wii U when it first released despite having FAR less users than PS3 and 360 and the fact that they’ve come back to Legends to add even more with the Switch version I think says it all. I think Rayman, as a choice, is the mutually beneficial choice that Nintendo might be looking for. Is the most successful? No. That’s Assassin’s Creed. But how successful Rayman really is is actually a bit of a mystery with Legends definitely breaking a million around launch and still being ported, and then there’s the mobile games to take into account. We really don’t know.

Is Rayman in? Probably not but to say that because he’s not as iconic as iconic as others he can’t get in is a bit disingenuous. And despite that Rayman 1 is the #1 best selling PlayStation game in the U.K. ever. Beating a ton of more “iconic” franchises. Some of which are actually already in Smash.

 

[pupNapoleon]

C'mon now, really? You are aware that the period where Rayman was the face of Ubisoft and the period where they are one of the most prominent developers in gaming isn't the same, right?

Like, you can apply your statement to Alex Kidd, that should serve as an indicator of how flawed that argument is.

Rayman is still considered the face of Ubisoft.
You can ask that of Ubisoft itself.
So whether or not you agree doesn't matter.

 

[AEMehr]

I, personally, am predicting Spring Man because something to note: We've never gotten a series playable debut without the mascot/protag. I believe I mentioned this some time ago. It is certainly a rule that could be broken, but Smash is a mascot fighter. That would be a strange sudden shift just because a character is already an AT. The fact that ARMS is a "special request" seems to suggest something like that as well.

The context of the "special request" phrasing could be a variety of things.
The mere fact that they were tasked to implement a character from ARMS is a "special request". It could also be to infer the mechanics incorporated to the fighter were requested too, since the existence of them stands out from the translation of his statement.
I think without any context, it's not very wise to infer a suspicion like that on such an open phrase. As far as we are aware, the context that a new character could already be a game element may not be a huge deal to Sakurai and his team.

I also believe it is worth noting that ARMS, unlike the majority of other fighters selected in the past from "new titles", is in a rather unique position. Fighters that are usually looked as "promotional" in nature, are usually decided when that game is in development. With that in mind, the character selected is usually the one designed the earliest, and whoever they choose to use in promotional material. This is not only because it assists the brand recognition, but it's because they have no data and what characters are popular with the playerbase (as they have no playerbase at that time).

ARMS has been out for two years at the time of this decision to add a character, and they have plenty of resources to measure which characters are used and popular through the game's online (as they've gone on to say that Ninjara was the most popular character used online a couple months after launch) as well as the party crashes to see which characters have the player support as well (Granted, this is also based on wins / loses but it is still something worth considering).
So unlike before, the team knows what characters are popular. I don't think this information would be overlooked if the ARMS team was approached about selecting which fighter should be added.

- - - -
And I mean, sure, they could still just say "add the cover man obviously" but i feel like given that we know what characters have been publicly commented on by the game's director Kosuke Yabuki there is a lot of reason to raise a brow to this character just being a simple "mascot" addition here.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Do bad football players get into the hall of fame?

The analogy doesn't quite work. The football players are more parallel to the characters in a video game.

I think a better analogy would be that if a person played a sport you don't like, would you still like that person?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Rate this Fighter Pass.

76: Minmin (1st party)
77: Crash Bandicoot (Fan Favorite)
78: Paper Mario (1st Party)
79: Neku (Wild Card)
80: Travis Touchdown (Middle Ground)
81: Ryu Hayabusa (Middle Ground)

 

[Shroob]

I mean, I'll put it this way. I meant it when I said character prospects should be treated individually in terms of why they get into Smash. It's worthless to try and force the square shape into the triangle hole when it just isn't going to fit. Joker was added in a different situation from Hero, from Banjo, from Terry, from Byleth. There wasn't a pattern aside from 4 of them being 3rd party.

This is the same reason why I think it's too early to call anything based on ARMS. ARMS is in a very specific situation, with a potential ARMS 2 announcement coming and good ad potential, ARMS makes sense here. I'm not sure yet that the same could be said for somebody like Rex, and the same definitely can't be said for Waluigi.

I, personally, am predicting Spring Man because something to note: We've never gotten a series playable debut without the mascot/protag. I believe I mentioned this some time ago. It is certainly a rule that could be broken, but Smash is a mascot fighter. That would be a strange sudden shift just because a character is already an AT. The fact that ARMS is a "special request" seems to suggest something like that as well.

Anyway, I will probably be hyped for whoever we get, so really I'm just sharing my preferences I suppose.

The only way I could see it NOT be Spring Man(Or Ribbon Girl) is either:

If they actually use that popularity contest, which would make it Min Min

OR

The supposed ARMs2 makes the protagonist anyone but Spring Man/Ribbon Girl.


There is, of course, the third option of "Sakurai throws a curveball", but that's something that no one can reliably prepare for.



My current guess is also it's Spring Man, BUT with a Ribbon Girl echo fighter. I just don't see us getting yet another pass after this one, and I'm also not convinced that those 4 World of Light spots will go unused.


I guess Min Min is definitely my fall-back character of choice.

 

[pupNapoleon]

The only way I could see it NOT be Spring Man(Or Ribbon Girl) is either:

If they actually use that popularity contest, which would make it Min Min

OR

The supposed ARMs2 makes the protagonist anyone but Spring Man/Ribbon Girl.


There is, of course, the third option of "Sakurai throws a curveball", but that's something that no one can reliably prepare for.



My current guess is also it's Spring Man, BUT with a Ribbon Girl echo fighter. I just don't see us getting yet another pass after this one, and I'm also not convinced that those 4 World of Light spots will go unused.


I guess Min Min is definitely my fall-back character of choice.

Not to mention- Spring Man is on the cover of the first game, and as far as we know, that is solely because he explains what the game is to people who don't understand the concept. And parents, who buy the game for their kids.

A character based game, like Pokemon (with Pikachu), Animal Crossing (with Isabelle), or Mortal Kombat (with Scorpion) are all characters who have been made mascots after the first game, and were not on the original cover.

As of right now, ARMS is one title, one point on a graph. A trajectory cannot be made from one point.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Rate this Fighter Pass.

76: Minmin (1st party)
77: Crash Bandicoot (Fan Favorite)
78: Paper Mario (1st Party)
79: Neku (Wild Card)
80: Travis Touchdown (Middle Ground)
81: Ryu Hayabusa (Middle Ground)

Min Min and Neku are solid choices. Largely indifferent to the rest tho

on a side note, pic of the day:

pic.twitter.com/kqfCHnPOPR

— 桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai (@Sora_Sakurai) April 29, 2020

Insert JoJo “to be continued” meme here

 

[Droodle]

I like that there are no "obvious" DLC characters in Smash.

If you went back to the reveal of Smash Bros Ultimate and stated the first pack of DLC for Smash would contain Joker/Hero/Banjo/Terry/Byleth, no one would really believe you because it is simply so far away from "expectation". Out of all those characters, the only one that was commonly discussed at reveal would have been Banjo. All the others were definitely under discussed, comparatively to when they got revealed.

Now with FP 2 on the coming up, no one was really expecting ARMS to be the first fighter of the pack. If there's anything the last year of Smash has taught me, it's that its unrealistic to even predict more than 1 character coming in as DLC. Even when we discuss character's that are likely (due to demand or iconicity or other reasons) there are at least 20 characters that I can list of the top of my head. At most only 5 of those 20 can make it, and that is off the top of my head. And then you get to the niche or "impossible" picks that are also totally possible, and suddenly no character really seems that obvious.

No character/series is guaranteed, no matter how "deserving" they may be. Highly requested fighters may not get in over barely requested ones. It's fun to predict who the next fighter's will be but it's never healthy to think that "Isaac/Geno/Waluigi/Sora/Rex/Crash/(insert character here) are pretty much guaranteed, and if they aren't in then Nintendo is terrible and the FP is trash".

And for my parting words, Helix/Saber/Big the Cat/Sonic-man/Bubsy/Segata Sanshiro are pretty much guaranteed at this point due to leaks. If this is true I will be VERY happy, but if it's not true then Nintendo literally hates me and my wrath will never end.

 

[Garteam]

Extremely late for this but, as of today, we have a 40 year old character in the Smash roster. Ball, the first Game and Watch game, released on April 28, 1980 in Japan.

Here's to 40 more years of bleeps and bloops

 

[N3ON]

Extremely late for this but, as of today, we have a 40 year old character in the Smash roster. Ball, the first Game and Watch game, released on April 28, 1980 in Japan.

Here's to 40 more years of bleeps and bloops

What's especially impressive is despite only being created in 1996, this is the fifty-third consecutive year Geno fans are requesting his inclusion in Smash.

 

[Powerman293]

What's especially impressive is despite only being created in 1996, this is the fifty-third consecutive year Geno fans are requesting his inclusion in Smash.

I mean, 1 year irl is about 4 internet years? So that adds up.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Extremely late for this but, as of today, we have a 40 year old character in the Smash roster. Ball, the first Game and Watch game, released on April 28, 1980 in Japan.

Here's to 40 more years of bleeps and bloops

Let's celebrate with a Ms. Game and Watch echo.

Spoiler

Credit goes to klunsgod on Deviantart and winkymulti on Twitter.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Chances are, if you want someone like Crash or Sora... you're already here. You've probably bought Ultimate already.

I don't get why this is being used to argue why more third parties is pointless as the argument works both ways, if you want a Nintendo character, chances are you already bought the game

 

[Shroob]

Wait, Cygames of all company did some of the Fire Emblem Three Houses arranges for Smash?


....well alright then. A bit odd but, ok.