Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[ZelDan]

Out of curiosity, did Sakurai actually specifically say there were only 6 characters left and that's it, or that each fighters pack will only have 1 characters? or did he just simply say that FP2 was going to be it for DLC and just left it at that?

because these statements do kind of differ or imply different things from eachother.

 

[Cosmic77]

Out of curiosity, did Sakurai actually specifically say there were only 6 characters left and that's it, or that each fighters pack will only have 1 characters? or did he just simply say that FP2 was going to be it for DLC and just left it at that?

because these statements do kind of differ or imply different things from eachother.

No, but they're selling this pass for $30; that's $5 per bundle just like the first.

Let's just assume we're getting exactly what they advertised. People who put too much stock in "free surprise character at the end" or "Echoes as bonus" are setting themselves up for disappointment that could've easily been avoided.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Out of curiosity, did Sakurai actually specifically say there were only 6 characters left and that's it, or that each fighters pack will only have 1 characters? or did he just simply say that FP2 was going to be it for DLC and just left it at that?

because these statements do kind of differ or imply different things from eachother.

He only said FPV2 was gonna be it for DLC. it’s a possibility some packs may have a bundled echo or something, there ARE four empty WoL slots remaining if there were just 6 more after all

 

[wynn728]

...Because it was planned for DLC and got an amiibo ready... within a year of it being developed? You are aware they don't take that long to plan for 1st party characters right? It was released around the same time as PP, who takes longer to make overall in comparison. It released at the same time as PP, and amiibo generally don't take that long to make beyond 3rd party ones. 3rd Party amiibo take longer to make because of licensing issues. Take a look at how long most took to come out. Any time you use someone's IP, especially for amiibo, they have details that are extremely important to remember. Making sure the coloring is right. Making sure the pose is exact. The quality of it. And so on. 3rd parties are very fickle. Why do you think Cloud and Bayonetta got 2? Why do you think they took a long time to come out too? Because they needed more planning around them. 1st Party amiibo(note that this doesn't apply to Pokemon who 3 companies have to work together) take far less shorter, including PP, cause there's no real issues to deal with. There's nothing to suggest PP took ages to be created, so it's a moot point. You are again missing any actual details for them to be actually strong evidence in your favor. Yes, these are just as easily coincidences. You need to have actual data to back up these points. Which there is none whatsoever that make it clear and obvious.

No, he can just as easily be a bonus character because they had enough time on their hands for that. As a priority over game modes, which were cut anyway due to a lack of development time. PP wouldn't have changed that, really. They put HRC as the last mode as is, low priority. That's not a PP factor. That's a "too many characters as is to work on" factor.

Sakurai stated back in November 2018 "It is a project after all, so we take into consideration things like labor, man-hours, the time in which the title will be sold. We decide on the fighters from the very early planning stage, and from there, we calculate and begin production. We don’t add or remove any characters during the project." That 100% means that Piranha Plant wasn't some stupid bonus character that they could've made since they had time, this was a character that was thought of including since the early stage of development. This was the character that Sakurai wanted to include in Smash Bros Ultimate in the very beginning! Accept the fact that this isn't some character that they were just able to make due to being a head of schedule, that instead Sakurai rather have had Piranha Plant because every other fan requested character are ones that Sakurai don't want to work on like Waluigi and Isaac.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Sakurai stated back in November 2018 "It is a project after all, so we take into consideration things like labor, man-hours, the time in which the title will be sold. We decide on the fighters from the very early planning stage, and from there, we calculate and begin production. We don’t add or remove any characters during the project." That 100% means that Piranha Plant wasn't some stupid bonus character that they could've made since they had time, this was a character that was thought of including since the early stage of development. This was the character that Sakurai wanted to include in Smash Bros Ultimate in the very beginning! Accept the fact that this isn't some character that they were just able to make due to being a head of schedule, that instead Sakurai rather have had Piranha Plant because every other fan requested character are ones that Sakurai don't want to work on like Waluigi and Isaac.

That means nothing.

He was talking about base game. What that actually means is just one of two things;

Piranha Plant was base and moved to DLC later on.
Piranha Plant was never base game and was always DLC. That's not a new part of the project plan. That's separate DLC being a separate plan in the project.
Don't forget that DLC was decided upon in the first place before the game went gold. They had a separate plan to begin with, with Piranha Plant likely being the top.

Frankly don't care about your hatred of PP over other charracters, and it's not really a good point. But I will note that Isaac was from an actually dead series and still got an AT, Spirit, and Costume, so he wasn't forgotten. Waluigi is harder to make than Daisy at the time. He can't be an Echo. That's his only real competition at best among the Super Mario series. PP wasn't a fan request like Waluigi, so they have nothing in common. Instead, it was a fun idea Sakurai came up with to show another side of things, the neat characters who are just your typical enemy.

You also seemed to miss the amiibo point. They are not consistent due to licensing issues. Of course a first party IP is faster to make than others. 3rd party ones take way longer. Pokemon take almost as long as 3rd parties to come out sometimes. They made a priority of who to actually release and when, and it has no consistency. The amiibo point has nothing to go on. There's nothing really clear about it beyond at best licensing factors. And that's just a guess. Some Echoes were grouped together as well, but some weren't.

 

[Rsrex]

Out of curiosity, did Sakurai actually specifically say there were only 6 characters left and that's it, or that each fighters pack will only have 1 characters? or did he just simply say that FP2 was going to be it for DLC and just left it at that?

because these statements do kind of differ or imply different things from eachother.

I'm not 100 percent sure but I think that Sakurai meant there will be 6 more characters with stage and music, and then he is done making new dlc characters for a WHILE, but, that might not mean forever. there will only be FP2 characters for a certain amount of time, but who knows? Maybe when the game is decreasing in popularity Sakurai could pull another DLC character from the video game world. That's just what I gathered from what Sakurai said, but it could mean something different.

 

[ZelDan]

No, but they're selling this pass for $30; that's $5 per bundle just like the first.

Let's just assume we're getting exactly what they advertised. People who put too much stock in "free surprise character at the end" or "Echoes as bonus" are setting themselves up for disappointment that could've easily been avoided.

Well sure, I'm not saying that I expect or am confident that echoes will be part of fighter packs or whatever, so I'm not exactly going to be disappointed if it doesn't happen, I guess I'm also just not outright dismissing the idea either.

I guess to add onto what I previously asked, has it ever been stated what each pack will specifically have? Do we know that each pack will come with spirits, a stage, and music? because I could maybe see a situation where a series that already has spirits or a stage will get a character and thus not need those things, so maybe they'll throw in a Daisy-tier echo or something to try and balance things out.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

But then the question becomes "if not Sakurai, then who?".

The people who worked on Kirby Star Allies.

 

[Curious Villager]

Well sure, I'm not saying that I expect or am confident that echoes will be part of fighter packs or whatever, so I'm not exactly going to be disappointed if it doesn't happen, I guess I'm also just not outright dismissing the idea either.

I guess to add onto what I previously asked, has it ever been stated what each pack will specifically have? Do we know that each pack will come with spirits, a stage, and music? because I could maybe see a situation where a series that already has spirits or a stage will get a character and thus not need those things, so maybe they'll throw in a Daisy-tier echo or something to try and balance things out.

I think in Japan it was stated somewhere that they will come with stages and music again. like the first pass.
I think Pushdustin mentioned that in one of his tweets if I'm not mistaken.

 

[ZelDan]

I think in Japan it was stated somewhere that they will come with stages and music again. like the first pass.
I think Pushdustin mentioned that in one of his tweets if I'm not mistaken.

Okay. TBH I vaquely recall a Pushdustin tweet like that too but wasn't completely sure so I firgured I'd ask.

I guess I am curious how Sakurai views echoes or how he compares them to other forms of content in Smash. because an echo character in my eyes is WAY more valuable than a bunch of JPEGs, but maybe Sakurai feels differently on the subject.

 

[Rsrex]

This might not be related to the discussion at the moment, and I do apologize for that. I am new here and this is my first day, so please forgive me. I feel like I know who the next DLC fighters will be. I may be a little biased, but I am trying to keep it as reasonable as possible. Again, I apologize. Since we already had an Arms rep be announced ( most likely min min) I feel like this will focus more on Nintendo characters and will have the following: 1 Character from the Kirby series, 1 character from Pokemon (sword and shield), 1 character from the Mario series, one from an entirely knew series, and a Third party character. Obviously, the character from the Kirby series, and the second FP2 character will be Bandanna Dee. I feel like since we already half two kind of villains from the Kirby series, (D3 and MK) we don't NEED a villain, and Bandanna Dee is the last of the dream squad from the Kirby series to be in smash. Second, and we all knew this was coming, but a Gen.8 Pokemon. I mean, its Nintendo we are talking about, so It will probably be Urshifu to promote the DLC. I think Geno might take the spot Mario spot. Because of Arms being announced Waluigi might have a chance, but Geno has Fans to back him up, is a character to appeal to the older fans, and has been asked for since Melee. This is where I had the most trouble, because there are so many possible characters to say here, but if try and think of one character that even non-Nintendo fans know, popular with older generation AND newer generations, and got has been a Nintendo mascot for a long time. It has to be Toad. Now I know a lot of you may be thinking he is a waste of space, and some might be thinking, isn't he a Mario character? But He has his own game. Sakurai decided to put Yoshi under his own game line for smash, same with Wario, even though they are part of the Mario series. But Toad (Captain Toad) is a great addition to Super smash bros. Ultimate, and has been a strong candidate,ever since he got his own game, and became more popular. ON TOP OF THAT, Toadette is becoming more and more of a fan favorite now, and Captain Toadette would be an amazing alt costume. Lastly, Crash Bandicoot. Nintendo put in a Microsoft Rep. and since this is a celebration of all gaming, a Sony rep. should be in the roster too. Plus crash has games on the switch, so he would be a great addition too the team. I decided to go with more Nintendo characters for this one, because The new Virus might make it harder to negotiate with other companies, and the last FP was focused on Third party characters. thank you for reading

 

[Rsrex]

Okay. TBH I vaquely recall a Pushdustin tweet like that too but wasn't completely sure so I firgured I'd ask.

I guess I am curious how Sakurai views echoes or how he compares them to other forms of content in Smash. because an echo character in my eyes is WAY more valuable than a bunch of JPEGs, but maybe Sakurai feels differently on the subject.

With the topic of Echos, Captain Toad for FP2 and Captain Toadette for FP Echos?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

This might not be related to the discussion at the moment, and I do apologize for that. I am new here and this is my first day, so please forgive me. I feel like I know who the next DLC fighters will be. I may be a little biased, but I am trying to keep it as reasonable as possible. Again, I apologize. Since we already had an Arms rep be announced ( most likely min min) I feel like this will focus more on Nintendo characters and will have the following: 1 Character from the Kirby series, 1 character from Pokemon (sword and shield), 1 character from the Mario series, one from an entirely knew series, and a Third party character. Obviously, the character from the Kirby series, and the second FP2 character will be Bandanna Dee. I feel like since we already half two kind of villains from the Kirby series, (D3 and MK) we don't NEED a villain, and Bandanna Dee is the last of the dream squad from the Kirby series to be in smash. Second, and we all knew this was coming, but a Gen.8 Pokemon. I mean, its Nintendo we are talking about, so It will probably be Urshifu to promote the DLC. I think Geno might take the spot Mario spot. Because of Arms being announced Waluigi might have a chance, but Geno has Fans to back him up, is a character to appeal to the older fans, and has been asked for since Melee. This is where I had the most trouble, because there are so many possible characters to say here, but if try and think of one character that even non-Nintendo fans know, popular with older generation AND newer generations, and got has been a Nintendo mascot for a long time. It has to be Toad. Now I know a lot of you may be thinking he is a waste of space, and some might be thinking, isn't he a Mario character? But He has his own game. Sakurai decided to put Yoshi under his own game line for smash, same with Wario, even though they are part of the Mario series. But Toad (Captain Toad) is a great addition to Super smash bros. Ultimate, and has been a strong candidate,ever since he got his own game, and became more popular. ON TOP OF THAT, Toadette is becoming more and more of a fan favorite now, and Captain Toadette would be an amazing alt costume. Lastly, Crash Bandicoot. Nintendo put in a Microsoft Rep. and since this is a celebration of all gaming, a Sony rep. should be in the roster too. Plus crash has games on the switch, so he would be a great addition too the team. I decided to go with more Nintendo characters for this one, because The new Virus might make it harder to negotiate with other companies, and the last FP was focused on Third party characters. thank you for reading

First of all holy **** please paragraph your stuff, second, the virus has no impact on who's in the pass as negotiations were made before they announced anything about V2, at most it'll slow down development

 

[Idon]

This might not be related to the discussion at the moment, and I do apologize for that. I am new here and this is my first day, so please forgive me. I feel like I know who the next DLC fighters will be. I may be a little biased, but I am trying to keep it as reasonable as possible. Again, I apologize. Since we already had an Arms rep be announced ( most likely min min) I feel like this will focus more on Nintendo characters and will have the following: 1 Character from the Kirby series, 1 character from Pokemon (sword and shield), 1 character from the Mario series, one from an entirely knew series, and a Third party character. Obviously, the character from the Kirby series, and the second FP2 character will be Bandanna Dee. I feel like since we already half two kind of villains from the Kirby series, (D3 and MK) we don't NEED a villain, and Bandanna Dee is the last of the dream squad from the Kirby series to be in smash. Second, and we all knew this was coming, but a Gen.8 Pokemon. I mean, its Nintendo we are talking about, so It will probably be Urshifu to promote the DLC. I think Geno might take the spot Mario spot. Because of Arms being announced Waluigi might have a chance, but Geno has Fans to back him up, is a character to appeal to the older fans, and has been asked for since Melee. This is where I had the most trouble, because there are so many possible characters to say here, but if try and think of one character that even non-Nintendo fans know, popular with older generation AND newer generations, and got has been a Nintendo mascot for a long time. It has to be Toad. Now I know a lot of you may be thinking he is a waste of space, and some might be thinking, isn't he a Mario character? But He has his own game. Sakurai decided to put Yoshi under his own game line for smash, same with Wario, even though they are part of the Mario series. But Toad (Captain Toad) is a great addition to Super smash bros. Ultimate, and has been a strong candidate,ever since he got his own game, and became more popular. ON TOP OF THAT, Toadette is becoming more and more of a fan favorite now, and Captain Toadette would be an amazing alt costume. Lastly, Crash Bandicoot. Nintendo put in a Microsoft Rep. and since this is a celebration of all gaming, a Sony rep. should be in the roster too. Plus crash has games on the switch, so he would be a great addition too the team. I decided to go with more Nintendo characters for this one, because The new Virus might make it harder to negotiate with other companies, and the last FP was focused on Third party characters. thank you for reading

Hey welcome, the boards.

Just a few pointers- one there's no need to be so formal so don't feel the need to write an essay with an introductory and closing statement. Two, you really wanna format your paragraphs better so that they're broken up into individual parts rather than just glued together in a giant text box.

With the topic of Echos, Captain Toad for FP2 and Captain Toadette for FP Echos?

Oh yeah, and don't post a comment before someone else has posted. If you want to do that, just use the edit button on the bottom left.

 

[Rsrex]

First of all holy **** please paragraph your stuff, second, the virus has no impact on who's in the pass as negotiations were made before they announced anything about V2, at most it'll slow down development

sorry for the long paragraph, but it is harder to meet with someone now than to do it before the virus. Sure, there is electronic meetings, but still, I do think they will go primarily 1st party on FP2.

 

[Rsrex]

Hey welcome, the boards.

Just a few pointers- one there's no need to be so serious, so don't feel the need to write an essay with an introductory and closing statement. Two, you really wanna format your paragraphs better so that they're broken up into individual parts rather than just glued together in a giant text box.

Oh yeah, and don't post a comment before someone else has posted. If you want to do that, just use the edit button on the bottom left.

Ok thank you! I'm glad everyone is nice to me on my first day here

 

[DarthEnderX]

Ok thank you! I'm glad everyone is nice to me on my first day here

Don't double post. Edit your previous post instead.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

sorry for the long paragraph, but it is harder to meet with someone now than to do it before the virus. Sure, there is electronic meetings, but still, I do think they will go primarily 1st party on FP2.

Ok but the meetings have already happened, negotiations were already done since before September, meaning if we get a primarily first party pass, it's merely a coincidence

 

[PeridotGX]

sorry for the long paragraph, but it is harder to meet with someone now than to do it before the virus. Sure, there is electronic meetings, but still, I do think they will go primarily 1st party on FP2.

I'm pretty sure they met with all the companies earlier (probably last year). Development takes a lot of time, they probably want to make sure everything's good to go legally before they start coding. I could see delays happening, but I really doubt character choices will change.

(off topic, but you're not supposed to double post. If you want to add something after you posted, use the edit feature)

 

[YoshiandToad]

With the topic of Echos, Captain Toad for FP2 and Captain Toadette for FP Echos?

You. I like you.

All I can say is: yes please. And welcome to Smashboards.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

So... new Sakurai column... this makes me nervous

Sakurai's Column #602 begins by discussing how current events are difficult to discuss in this publication, as he often writes in advance of any topical news.

Translator's Note: the following translation is regarding COVID-19 and is more somber than any prior Sakurai column. pic.twitter.com/o2ZdygjJa0

— Robert Sephazon (@Sephazon) April 15, 2020

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

So... new Sakurai column... this makes me nervous

Sakurai's Column #602 begins by discussing how current events are difficult to discuss in this publication, as he often writes in advance of any topical news.

Translator's Note: the following translation is regarding COVID-19 and is more somber than any prior Sakurai column. pic.twitter.com/o2ZdygjJa0

— Robert Sephazon (@Sephazon) April 15, 2020

We’re in a global pandemic and you weren’t nervous before?

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

So the results of my final poll are in and Crash Bandicoot is the winner.....

Spoiler

Actually the true winner is Phoenix Wright . I’m surprised Mr. Wright managed to dominate so much in these polls, you guys just really like Nick, huh?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

So the results of my final poll are in and Crash Bandicoot is the winner.....

Spoiler

View attachment 269279

Actually the true winner is Phoenix Wright . I’m surprised Mr. Wright managed to dominate so much in these polls, you guys just really like Nick, huh?

Keep in mind it's a tournament with semi-random participants in each round. He's not likely everyone's first choice. That being said though, he does seem to be quite popular here, as he was one to of most talked about characters when leakers were disconfirming everyone.

 

[ZelDan]

So... new Sakurai column... this makes me nervous

Sakurai's Column #602 begins by discussing how current events are difficult to discuss in this publication, as he often writes in advance of any topical news.

Translator's Note: the following translation is regarding COVID-19 and is more somber than any prior Sakurai column. pic.twitter.com/o2ZdygjJa0

— Robert Sephazon (@Sephazon) April 15, 2020

So...J.J & Jeff for one of the fighter packs in the pass?

In all seriousness though, that certainly wasn't the type of stuff I ever thought I'd see Sakurai talk about (granted, I don't follow this stuff as much as others so maybe he has before), but I largely agree with his message and points.

 

[Cosmic77]

So the results of my final poll are in and Crash Bandicoot is the winner.....

Spoiler

View attachment 269279

Actually the true winner is Phoenix Wright . I’m surprised Mr. Wright managed to dominate so much in these polls, you guys just really like Nick, huh?

Even though I really don't care about either of these characters getting in Smash (MvsC sort of killed the magic of Phoenix getting in Smash), I'm glad Crash didn't win. His games are fun, but as a character, I really can't stand him. Stinks that Spyro probably wouldn't get in first.

 

[Krankees]

So the results of my final poll are in and Crash Bandicoot is the winner.....

Spoiler

View attachment 269279

Actually the true winner is Phoenix Wright . I’m surprised Mr. Wright managed to dominate so much in these polls, you guys just really like Nick, huh?

We take those

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

Keep in mind it's a tournament with semi-random participants in each round. He's not likely everyone's first choice. That being said though, he does seem to be quite popular here, as he was one to of most talked about characters when leakers were disconfirming everyone.

What do you mean? It is now from this point on an objectively true fact that Phoenix Wright is the most desired Smash character of all time.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

So the results of my final poll are in and Crash Bandicoot is the winner.....

Spoiler

View attachment 269279

Actually the true winner is Phoenix Wright . I’m surprised Mr. Wright managed to dominate so much in these polls, you guys just really like Nick, huh?

Victory for Wright!

 

[Michael the Spikester]

So... new Sakurai column... this makes me nervous

The health and safety of everyone comes first. As much as we want to see the rest of the DLC, I honestly think it'd be best they put it on hold until things blow over.

Sakurai finally had his chance for a break but given how much he cares for us fans goes out of his way to continue to work from home when he could be relaxing.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

His games are fun, but as a character, I really can't stand him.

You're just jelly of his EXTREME SKILLS!!!


...Why did they let him say anything other than "woah"?

 

[SmashChu]

...Because it was planned for DLC and got an amiibo ready... within a year of it being developed? You are aware they don't take that long to plan for 1st party characters right? It was released around the same time as PP, who takes longer to make overall in comparison. It released at the same time as PP, and amiibo generally don't take that long to make beyond 3rd party ones. 3rd Party amiibo take longer to make because of licensing issues. Take a look at how long most took to come out. Any time you use someone's IP, especially for amiibo, they have details that are extremely important to remember. Making sure the coloring is right. Making sure the pose is exact. The quality of it. And so on. 3rd parties are very fickle. Why do you think Cloud and Bayonetta got 2? Why do you think they took a long time to come out too? Because they needed more planning around them. 1st Party amiibo(note that this doesn't apply to Pokemon who 3 companies have to work together) take far less shorter, including PP, cause there's no real issues to deal with. There's nothing to suggest PP took ages to be created, so it's a moot point. You are again missing any actual details for them to be actually strong evidence in your favor. Yes, these are just as easily coincidences. You need to have actual data to back up these points. Which there is none whatsoever that make it clear and obvious.

I think I slightly misunderstood your amiibo point, but we can't really say how long some 1st party ones took in comparison. You might notice the new amiibo were 1st party, then 2nd/3rd party, regardless of DLC. So I don't think it means all that much. The priority seems to relate to licensing, not order of the characters reveealed.

No, he can just as easily be a bonus character because they had enough time on their hands for that. As a priority over game modes, which were cut anyway due to a lack of development time. PP wouldn't have changed that, really. They put HRC as the last mode as is, low priority. That's not a PP factor. That's a "too many characters as is to work on" factor.

I sincerely doubt they just had time to kill and said "Oh lets make this goofy plant." More often, games have to cut details, especially when they are trying to make a tight deadline. Plant came out about 2 months after Ultimate so was worked on even before the game went gold (which is about a month before).

Also, they can't just make amiibo regardless of if its a third party or first party. They have to be manufactured, approved and shipped. Moreover, the licensing isn't that much of an issue as Snake was released with some of the other Nintendo ones, so it being first or third party isn't the issue persay.

Again, PP was likely planned early on and wasn't something they made with extra time (probably wasn't any).

 

[Ridrool64]

I have a few fighter concepts I'd like to see in Smash, can you guys give me a character that could fit these? It's a semi-"sell me on" concept.

1. Somebody who starts out overpowered at the beginning of a match, for whatever reason, but over time gradually loses steam. Maybe a character who starts with amazing range, over time slowly getting worse. Maybe a character who has really good bursts of speed and atrocius sustained speed, be it in movement or attacks. A loss of non-renewable resources for fantastic moves: basically Wonderwing, the character?
2. The opposite concept to the first one; starts relatively to very underpowered, but through either skilled play or gathering resources, becomes much more powerful. (This is actually how I envision Arle playing, though she's relative and not very.)
3. A more fundamentals focused character who has a pretty good everything, but no major x-factor ability or move that defines them. They just do what they do really well.
4. Somebody who's focused on edgeguarding, being really bad at getting outright kills but having a lot of tools to cause gimps or dunk opponents offstage. Would likely be packaged with a good recovery, but that's not important.
5. Somebody who can't get blast zone KO's, or edgeguard very well, but can straight up instakill with a move when the opponent is at a high enough percent. Likely a special move, but it could be any move you want.
6. A supporter character built for team matches, having moves to heal teammates and immobilize or otherwise pacify opponents, but being not very good in one-on-one matches.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I sincerely doubt they just had time to kill and said "Oh lets make this goofy plant." More often, games have to cut details, especially when they are trying to make a tight deadline. Plant came out about 2 months after Ultimate so was worked on even before the game went gold (which is about a month before).

Also, they can't just make amiibo regardless of if its a third party or first party. They have to be manufactured, approved and shipped. Moreover, the licensing isn't that much of an issue as Snake was released with some of the other Nintendo ones, so it being first or third party isn't the issue persay.

Again, PP was likely planned early on and wasn't something they made with extra time (probably wasn't any).

There was extra time because he was made during development of the base game. Otherwise that wouldn't have been possible. It was worked on before the game went gold, which is evidence of extra time. The game was not actually finished until it "goes gold", which is the rest of extra time being spent on small things, including the development of a bonus character.

He was worked on far before September alone, which is just when we found finished data, not when it was start.

And yes, they can make certain amiibo faster because of 1st party and 3rd party. One takes longer to license. That's why PP can easily take a year, but 3rd parties take longer. One requires more details. PP got one at a reasonable pace, as did others. All the 3rd parties took way longer to release, same with the Pokemon. Licensing absolutely is part of the issue.

You forget that characters take a bare minimum of 6 months to make for unique ones. PP, to come out "2 months later", has to be started at least in September, when there's extra time, but it's also far more unique, and those can often take a full year to complete. It was likely started on during the Summer, not September. Even then, September outright proves it was worked on with leftover time.

One interesting thing is we found data of it in September. Data doesn't come out of nowhere. More than likely it really was started during the summer after the core game was done and the rest was polish. This is months after all the Spirits were decided, and Banjo-Kazooie was decided upon. This is also when it's easy for them to fully decide DLC, or start to figure out, as not everything was finalized till November as is. PP was obviously decided before B-K, but a ton of time before? Probably not. Just enough because they had time to really work on a character before the game was actually released. If PP didn't have that, they'd have released later. And they clearly had time to work on it before the DLC period started(which technically is after the game releases). The first DLC took 6 months bare minimum to release from proven creation of the character. And 6 months is just a guess of when it was started. Realistically PP took a lot longer to make. Probably started in July or August, really.

 

[Cosmic77]

You're just jelly of his EXTREME SKILLS!!!


...Why did they let him say anything other than "woah"?

Him being a Tazmanian Devil ripoff who likes to dance is the closest we have to a real personality. Seeing how I never really cared for the latter, I guess it's not surprising why Crash has never clicked with me.

Again, his games are fun to play, but I've never been a fan of Crash himself.

 

[Wunderwaft]

I have a few fighter concepts I'd like to see in Smash, can you guys give me a character that could fit these? It's a semi-"sell me on" concept.

2. The opposite concept to the first one; starts relatively to very underpowered, but through either skilled play or gathering resources, becomes much more powerful. (This is actually how I envision Arle playing, though she's relative and not very.)

This is my idea for how Steve could be incorporated in Smash. He starts off weak but gets stronger by collecting resources he beats off opponents and as a result he can use these resources to upgrade his weapons and craft items.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

I have a few fighter concepts I'd like to see in Smash, can you guys give me a character that could fit these? It's a semi-"sell me on" concept.

1. Somebody who starts out overpowered at the beginning of a match, for whatever reason, but over time gradually loses steam. Maybe a character who starts with amazing range, over time slowly getting worse. Maybe a character who has really good bursts of speed and atrocius sustained speed, be it in movement or attacks. A loss of non-renewable resources for fantastic moves: basically Wonderwing, the character?
2. The opposite concept to the first one; starts relatively to very underpowered, but through either skilled play or gathering resources, becomes much more powerful. (This is actually how I envision Arle playing, though she's relative and not very.)
3. A more fundamentals focused character who has a pretty good everything, but no major x-factor ability or move that defines them. They just do what they do really well.
4. Somebody who's focused on edgeguarding, being really bad at getting outright kills but having a lot of tools to cause gimps or dunk opponents offstage. Would likely be packaged with a good recovery, but that's not important.
5. Somebody who can't get blast zone KO's, or edgeguard very well, but can straight up instakill with a move when the opponent is at a high enough percent. Likely a special move, but it could be any move you want.
6. A supporter character built for team matches, having moves to heal teammates and immobilize or otherwise pacify opponents, but being not very good in one-on-one matches.

I'm not usually one for major gimmicks, but some characters can do it well.

#1 we've had and the community resoundingly rejected it. Along with the type effectiveness, had the stamina mechanic that weakened them if they were out too long without switching. Most people seem really happy that that mechanic is gone.

#2 sounds a bit like Lucario's Aura, except based on time and not damage. #3 is basically looking at Mario as a jack-of-all-trades.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I have a few fighter concepts I'd like to see in Smash, can you guys give me a character that could fit these? It's a semi-"sell me on" concept.

1. Somebody who starts out overpowered at the beginning of a match, for whatever reason, but over time gradually loses steam. Maybe a character who starts with amazing range, over time slowly getting worse. Maybe a character who has really good bursts of speed and atrocius sustained speed, be it in movement or attacks. A loss of non-renewable resources for fantastic moves: basically Wonderwing, the character?
2. The opposite concept to the first one; starts relatively to very underpowered, but through either skilled play or gathering resources, becomes much more powerful. (This is actually how I envision Arle playing, though she's relative and not very.)
3. A more fundamentals focused character who has a pretty good everything, but no major x-factor ability or move that defines them. They just do what they do really well.
4. Somebody who's focused on edgeguarding, being really bad at getting outright kills but having a lot of tools to cause gimps or dunk opponents offstage. Would likely be packaged with a good recovery, but that's not important.
5. Somebody who can't get blast zone KO's, or edgeguard very well, but can straight up instakill with a move when the opponent is at a high enough percent. Likely a special move, but it could be any move you want.
6. A supporter character built for team matches, having moves to heal teammates and immobilize or otherwise pacify opponents, but being not very good in one-on-one matches.

1. Arthur could do a decent job with this. He could start as a heavyweight character who's abilities and attributes are more fitting for the projectile zoner that he is. After taking 100%, the armor falls off, and he becomes quite light without any other bonuses added.
   • Alternatively you could do Archen or Archeops, who's attacks would be quite powerful, but if you hit 100%, they're heavily nerfed.
2. So...Lucario.
   • Jokes aside, I think Quote would be the most direct implementation of this. He starts out with "meh" abilities that level up as you hit opponents with them. You would also level down if you get hit so I suppose his power could yo-yo quite a bit depending on how even the match is.
3. I'd argue this is how Pit and Dark Pit work. Mario as well to a lesser extent.
4. This is how Piranha Plant works.
5. Little Mac. KO Punch isn't technically an instakill, but it effectively is one at higher percents.
6. This would probably be how Ness would play if he used more of his own PSI. Pretty much any other RPG healer could probably work like this as well. I wouldn't want a character like this to be bad in 1v1s though. Just more scary in team matches.

 

[Will]

Somebody who starts out overpowered at the beginning of a match, for whatever reason, but over time gradually loses steam. Maybe a character who starts with amazing range, over time slowly getting worse. Maybe a character who has really good bursts of speed and atrocius sustained speed, be it in movement or attacks. A loss of non-renewable resources for fantastic moves: basically Wonderwing, the character?

That's like starting off with Arsene and then just sucking

also everything after 2 is already a character, except i guess 6, but then every doubles is just gonna have a 6

 

[wynn728]

There was extra time because he was made during development of the base game. Otherwise that wouldn't have been possible. It was worked on before the game went gold, which is evidence of extra time. The game was not actually finished until it "goes gold", which is the rest of extra time being spent on small things, including the development of a bonus character.

He was worked on far before September alone, which is just when we found finished data, not when it was start.

And yes, they can make certain amiibo faster because of 1st party and 3rd party. One takes longer to license. That's why PP can easily take a year, but 3rd parties take longer. One requires more details. PP got one at a reasonable pace, as did others. All the 3rd parties took way longer to release, same with the Pokemon. Licensing absolutely is part of the issue.

You forget that characters take a bare minimum of 6 months to make for unique ones. PP, to come out "2 months later", has to be started at least in September, when there's extra time, but it's also far more unique, and those can often take a full year to complete. It was likely started on during the Summer, not September. Even then, September outright proves it was worked on with leftover time.

One interesting thing is we found data of it in September. Data doesn't come out of nowhere. More than likely it really was started during the summer after the core game was done and the rest was polish. This is months after all the Spirits were decided, and Banjo-Kazooie was decided upon. This is also when it's easy for them to fully decide DLC, or start to figure out, as not everything was finalized till November as is. PP was obviously decided before B-K, but a ton of time before? Probably not. Just enough because they had time to really work on a character before the game was actually released. If PP didn't have that, they'd have released later. And they clearly had time to work on it before the DLC period started(which technically is after the game releases). The first DLC took 6 months bare minimum to release from proven creation of the character. And 6 months is just a guess of when it was started. Realistically PP took a lot longer to make. Probably started in July or August, really.

No... that's not how it works. Why are you so stubborn to accept that Piranha Plant was decided from the very beginning?
It take 10 months to make a character and a lot happen in the background of other development. They didn't just make all these characters and just say "yeah, let's sneak another character in since we got these done," they planned ALL OF THIS OUT! If they had extra time you think they would actually focus on getting Joker out faster. If anything they ran out of time when it came to Piranha Plant and agree to put it on hold for DLC. This stuff happens all the time when it comes to game development. If Piranha Plant was made on a whim why did they bloody bother making a Palutena's Guidance for it but didn't do it for all the other DLC characters that would've been decided upon before Piranha Plant?
You're so desperate for the possiblity of bonus DLC that's never going to happen. Accept that we're only getting six Fighters and that it. With everything going on in the world Vol 2 will be the last thing ever to be added to Ultimate.