Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Tako Tuesday]

This talk of music gives me an idea for a new topic: what songs do you think will come with the ARMS character?

I'm personally guessing there will be 17 tracks. The ARMS title theme, the 15 stage themes, and the VS Hedlok Grand Pix theme.

I hope every stage theme gets in, I'd love to hear Ribbon Girl's stage theme in Smash:

 

[Cosmic77]

I hope every stage theme gets in, I'd love to hear Ribbon Girl's stage theme in Smash:

It'd be even better if you were playing as Ribbon Girl when this was playing.

But I think getting every stage's theme is a legitimate possibility. It's only 15 tracks after all.

 

[Koopaul]

There's no reason they can't add all of them. We got 50 for Terry.

 

[N3ON]

There's no reason they can't add all of them. We got 50 for Terry.

On the basis of being a first-party series with less than twenty tracks, sure. But cases like Terry can't be used for precedent, because that's using an outlier to set expectation. Just like it wouldn't make sense to use Cloud as precedent for anything other than future SE additions.

 

[Schnee117]

There's no reason they can't add all of them. We got 50 for Terry.

By the same token we didn't get a few notable tracks like God Shattering Star with Byleth.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

I think Big Boss would be a cool addition. Snake in Smash is demolition expert that bombs the whole stage, which is the opposite of the stealth gameplay from the MGS series. Big Boss could incorporate non-lethal weapons from MGS like the tranquilizer gun or the stun grenades, that's just one idea of how he'd bring new things. I like Raiden the most if we're talking about a second MGS rep but Big Boss is strongly behind him and could overtake him depending on my mood.

Because Big Boss is a cool character and he's pretty important for his series. Plus there's tons of gear in the Metal Gear games that could make for a good moveset (gimme that rocket punch and Fulton command grab).

But the point of Solid Snake is supposed to be the more or less idealized version of the original Big Boss in the first place. They're supposed to be extremely similar by nature even if they end up different people by the end of their own lives (and they still ultimately interwine consistently throughout the series). I just don't really see making Snake and Big Boss separate like that. It's only Smash that separates Snake from what he would be more normally known for.

MGS has a ton of great stuff to pull from that I think would be the natural priority over Big Boss, who I honestly think just works better as a skin because I don't think he himself necessarily represents that much new (also rocket arm isn't even actually Big Boss so like... why that?). You could Raiden, Revolver Ocelot, Liquid, Solidus or any number of other really important characters to diversify that representation I would think in a more interesting and meaningful way.

 

[Tako Tuesday]

Also, I'm just going to bring up how Splatoon only had 9 multiplayer themes, yet they only included 6 of them in Smash. Why not just add the last 3 at that point? It's unfortunate too because the 3 that weren't included were my favorites.

 

[Koopaul]

On the basis of being a first-party series with less than twenty tracks, sure. But cases like Terry can't be used for precedent, because that's using an outlier to set expectation. Just like it wouldn't make sense to use Cloud as precedent for anything other than future SE additions.

ARMS has more than 20 tracks. I'd love it if they included the Replay song (an underappreciated track) but I bet it will be overlooked.

 

[The Rhythm Theif]

I still think we need some more Mega Man or Final Fantasy representatives.

^ Such as. ^

 

[Dragoncharystary]

There's nothing stopping Sakurai and the team from adding all 15 stages themes and potentially the entire soundtrack since it's a first-party in house developed game and there aren't that many songs. It's really just a question of if they want to or not. IMO none of the ARMS songs even need a remix, they can just add them as they are.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

ARMS music is so good, Always felt like a weird exclusion from base, so I'm pretty happy they're fixing their mistake

I swear, by the end of Ultimate's run, it's soundtrack is gonna be untouchable

We already have the absolute GOATs of video game music in the game with the likes of Guile's Theme, Megalovania, and Last Surprise and who knows what the other 5 unknown packs are gonna bring us

 

[Knight Dude]

On the basis of being a first-party series with less than twenty tracks, sure. But cases like Terry can't be used for precedent, because that's using an outlier to set expectation. Just like it wouldn't make sense to use Cloud as precedent for anything other than future SE additions.

Yeah, I think most people would expect around 10+ songs, if Joker, Banjo and Byleth were anything to go by. It wouldn't be too out there for ARMS to at least get as much as Byleth brought, which would at least cover most of the cast.

I wouldn't be too shocked if there was at least one character that got 20 something songs if possible, but I don't think we'll see another Terry/SNK situation where 50 tracks pop op. Of course I'd gladly be wrong about it though.

I still think we need some more Mega Man or Final Fantasy representatives.
View attachment 268248
^ Such as. ^

Personally hoping for MMX or MM.EXE more. I wouldn't mind Zero either. Some songs like Power Bomb, Cannonball, Departure, Esperanto, Falling Down and Nothing Beats would be good if they chose the GBA version though.

MM.EXE could bring, Proof of Courage, And You Will Know the Truth, Virus Busting, Great Battlers, Battle With Myself, Surge of Power, Fire Field, and Blazing Internet off the top of my head.

Not sure who'd I pick for Final Fantasy. Maybe a magic character like Terra?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

There's nothing stopping Sakurai and the team from adding all 15 stages themes and potentially the entire soundtrack since it's a first-party in house developed game and there aren't that many songs. It's really just a question of if they want to or not. IMO none of the ARMS songs even need a remix, they can just add them as they are.

Isn't there a lot of cases where the owner of the IP chooses the music to give, not Sakurai? Albeit, this is done by choice. I don't know if it's just for 3rd parties, though. If it's for potentially anyone, it could go uniquely. I don't remember any 1st party cases specifically, just a general statement. >.<;

 

[wynn728]

This talk of music gives me an idea for a new topic: what songs do you think will come with the ARMS character?

I'm personally guessing there will be 17 tracks. The ARMS title theme, the 15 stage themes, and the VS Hedlok Grand Pix theme.

All of them plus remix of some.

 

[Knight Dude]

Speaking of music, I'm kind of disappointed in the lack of Johto and Unova Pokemon music. How VS Red, Johto Gym Leader, Unova Elite 4, Driftveil City, VS N and Unova Victory Road got skipped, I got no idea. Certified bangers. I can get that National Park would have been too chill though, as great of a track as it is. I can totally understand not getting a Pokemon from each game, not a big deal to me, but I do feel like the music could have been spread out a bit.

Glad Hoenn got more cool stuff though. Steven's theme and it also got a great Victory Road track from Brawl.

For ARMS, I think SSF2 getting tracks for each fighter could be done for them as well. I wouldn't be too surprised if we got a couple remixes, as it's rare to do nothing but ports. As long as I get Dr.Coyle's and Misango's themes I'm happy. But most of ARMS' music is pretty good, so I wouldn't worry too much about the selection, there's hardly any outright bad choices.

 

[CapitaineCrash]

In the base game we got pretty much every character theme from Street fighter 2, so I don't think it's crazy to say that they will try to get every character music from Arms too. This would make 15 music + 1 if you add the main theme, so 16 tracks. This would be more than every fighter pass in the first pass, aside from terry who got 50 but of course we're probably not going to have another SNK situation. 16 is actually a great number and it would be a pretty good selection. They could also add Hedlock theme and something else like the party crash menu and it would be 18 music.

 

[zeldasmash]

You know I just realized that the voice actress for ARMS' Dr. Coyle is the iDROID and singer of "Sins of the Father" from Metal Gear Solid V and she's also Ms. Arrow from F-Zero GX.

Random knowledge, but still. That's interesting to me.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Here's my ARMS song wishlist (Wanted remixes in red, potentially good, but ultimately unnecessary remixes in blue):

1. Grand Prix (Title)
2. Spring Stadium
3. Ribbon Ring
4. Ninja College
5. Mausoleum
6. Scrapyard
7. Cinema Deux
8. Buster Beach
9. Snake Park
10. [NAME REDACTED]
11. Sky Arena
12. VS Headlok (Grand Prix)
13. Grand Prix (Ribbon Girl Ver.)
14. Party Crash (Menu & Lobby Medley)
15. Staff Credits

 

[Hadokeyblade]

I hope every stage theme gets in, I'd love to hear Ribbon Girl's stage theme in Smash:

I'm glad that this is most likely getting in smash now but, like... why wasn't it in base? It's a bop!

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Speaking of music, I'm kind of disappointed in the lack of Johto and Unova Pokemon music. How VS Red, Johto Gym Leader, Unova Elite 4, Driftveil City, VS N and Unova Victory Road got skipped, I got no idea. Certified bangers. I can get that National Park would have been too chill though, as great of a track as it is. I can totally understand not getting a Pokemon from each game, not a big deal to me, but I do feel like the music could have been spread out a bit.

Don't forget Gym Leader's Last Stand!

Also, I unironically love Critical Health.

 

[Krankees]

Here's my ARMS song wishlist (Wanted remixes in red, potentially good, but ultimately unnecessary remixes in blue):

1. Grand Prix (Title)
2. Spring Stadium
3. Ribbon Ring
4. Ninja College
5. Mausoleum
6. Scrapyard
7. Cinema Deux
8. Buster Beach
9. Snake Park
10. [NAME REDACTED]
11. Sky Arena
12. VS Headlok (Grand Prix)
13. Grand Prix (Ribbon Girl Ver.)
14. Party Crash (Menu & Lobby Medley)

No Ramen Bowl or DNA lab?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

No Ramen Bowl or DNA lab?

Don't care for Ramen Bowl. DNA Lab is alright, but it's a bit too low key for my tastes.

That reminds me though. I forgot to add the Staff Credits. It's such a great ending theme. Makes me feel nostalgic for the journey even though it took, like, 10 minutes tops.

 

[GoodGrief741]

But the point of Solid Snake is supposed to be the more or less idealized version of the original Big Boss in the first place. They're supposed to be extremely similar by nature even if they end up different people by the end of their own lives (and they still ultimately interwine consistently throughout the series). I just don't really see making Snake and Big Boss separate like that. It's only Smash that separates Snake from what he would be more normally known for.

MGS has a ton of great stuff to pull from that I think would be the natural priority over Big Boss, who I honestly think just works better as a skin because I don't think he himself necessarily represents that much new (also rocket arm isn't even actually Big Boss so like... why that?). You could Raiden, Revolver Ocelot, Liquid, Solidus or any number of other really important characters to diversify that representation I would think in a more interesting and meaningful way.

Eh, Liquid and Solidus aren't really that important in the grand scheme of things, and Ocelot isn't exactly swimming in moveset potential. I'm all for Raiden though.

That said, just because Big Boss is similar to Snake doesn't mean he can't have his own moveset. I don't think it's likely that we're getting more Metal Gear characters, sure, but if we do, then he's definitely a possibility. We've seen much less faithful things in Smash than a guy and his clone being different.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

We've seen much less faithful things in Smash than a guy and his clone being different.

He's his clone? That explains why every time I ask if Snake and Big Boss are the same person I the response is "...kind of?", especially since Metal Gear's story gives me the impression that it's kinda complicated.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

He's his clone? That explains why every time I ask if Snake and Big Boss are the same person I the response is "...kind of?", especially since Metal Gear's story gives me the impression that it's kinda complicated.

Naked Snake is Big Boss, Liquid and Solid are the clones which make no actual sense

 

[Schnee117]

He's his clone? That explains why every time I ask if Snake and Big Boss are the same person I the response is "...kind of?", especially since Metal Gear's story gives me the impression that it's kinda complicated.

You don't know the half of it buddy

 

[GoodGrief741]

He's his clone? That explains why every time I ask if Snake and Big Boss are the same person I the response is "...kind of?", especially since Metal Gear's story gives me the impression that it's kinda complicated.

Yeah, it's definitely complicated to explain. Though it all makes sense when you play it, it thankfully only gets gradually complicated.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Yeah, it's definitely complicated to explain. Though it all makes sense when you play it, it thankfully only gets gradually complicated.

The spoileriffic explanation for it makes perfect sense to me tho.

 

[Blargg888]

Hard to believe it's been 10 months since I last posted.

oooh adding a Mystery Dungeon-specific Pokemon rep hadn't occured to me until now. That doesn't actually seem like a bad idea.

I was reading this, and now that I think about it, if they were to add a PMD character, would they have them make Pokemon speak noises? Because PMD characters speak human languages. It'd be kinda weird to see Grovyle just speaking his name.

Though at the same time, it'd also be weird to hear him speaking normally, due to the juxtaposition against the other 10 Pokemon characters.

Just imagine comparing Star KOs:
Pikachu: "Pika Piiiiikaaaaaaa!"
Greninja: "Greeeeeniiiiiiiiiiiiin!"
Grovyle: "AAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!"


Although, thinking about it, I suppose Lucario and Mewtwo both have human-like voices, so maybe it wouldn't be as weird as I thought.

Regardless, a PMD character would be cool, though I doubt we'll ever get one. I'd like to at least get music from the games, but I doubt that'll happen either.

 

[DarthEnderX]

especially since Metal Gear's story gives me the impression that it's kinda complicated.

What? Naaah.

 

[Deleted member]

What? Naaah.

Pictured: Snake about to murder Bomberman for his spot in Smash.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Just imagine comparing Star KOs:
Pikachu: "Pika Piiiiikaaaaaaa!"
Greninja: "Greeeeeniiiiiiiiiiiiin!"
Grovyle: "AAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!"

Well...I don't think it'd be too weird...

 

[Will]

Naked Snake is Big Boss, Liquid and Solid are the clones which make no actual sense
View attachment 268261

what if big boss' brown hair was recessive, i'm a brown in a family of blondes and redheads

 

[PeridotGX]

Hard to believe it's been 10 months since I last posted.



I was reading this, and now that I think about it, if they were to add a PMD character, would they have them make Pokemon speak noises? Because PMD characters speak human languages. It'd be kinda weird to see Grovyle just speaking his name.

Though at the same time, it'd also be weird to hear him speaking normally, due to the juxtaposition against the other 10 Pokemon characters.

Just imagine comparing Star KOs:
Pikachu: "Pika Piiiiikaaaaaaa!"
Greninja: "Greeeeeniiiiiiiiiiiiin!"
Grovyle: "AAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!"


Although, thinking about it, I suppose Lucario and Mewtwo both have human-like voices, so maybe it wouldn't be as weird as I thought.

Regardless, a PMD character would be cool, though I doubt we'll ever get one. I'd like to at least get music from the games, but I doubt that'll happen either.

Grovyle would probably speak like a person, that's one of the big things in Mystery Dungeon. I don't think it'd be too weird, because like you said: Lucario and Japanese Mewtwo speak too. It would also solidify "this isn't your everyday grovyle, this is THE Grovyle".

 

[Mamboo07]

Spring Man this, Twintelle that, Min-Min this, Ribbbon Girl that...
These fans having debates on who the ARMS rep will be.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Spring Man this, Twintelle that, Min-Min this, Ribbbon Girl that...
These fans having debates on who the ARMS rep will be.

What else are we to do? It's not going to be obvious until the character is revealed.

 

[PeridotGX]

What else are we to do? It's not going to be obvious until the character is revealed.

To be fair, there are five more slots to talk about. I don't really mind the ARMS talk, but it's not the only thing I want to be doing for the next two months.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

Naked Snake is Big Boss, Liquid and Solid are the clones which make no actual sense
View attachment 268261

Strange thing is that Solid Snake was originally supposed to be blonde too, but they dropped it.

here we see Snake with what seems to be blonde hair in the briefing scenes before going on the mission to Shadow Moses.

It’s mentioned that he cuts his hair before the mission, but I don’t recall anything about him dyeing his hair.

later for MGS2, originally it was planned that Snake was going to have blonde hair again In the concept art at least as Pliskin, but decided against it

anyway it’s never mentioned again, kind of weird that they thought about it, Snake’s hair was brown back in Metal Gear and a Metal Gear 2.

At the end of the day, they chose aesthetics over biology accuracy, which I’m glad since blonde Solid Snake looks weird to me.

 

[Deleted member]

Spring Man this, Twintelle that, Min-Min this, Ribbbon Girl that...
These fans having debates on who the ARMS rep will be.

As long as that's the information given to us, it's all cheese mousse on the platter. Better than endless clamoring with no information to say the least.

 

[Will]

Strange thing is that Solid Snake was originally supposed to be blonde too, but they dropped it.

I mean, it'd be weird to have Snake with brown hair for two games and then suddenly retcon it then again metal gear's middle name is retcon