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It's a hint, of course.
Why is Dark Samus always used to shut people up when the general consensus is that its implementation is quite lacking?
Yeah but that's also the game where she can shoot missiles out of her boobs.
Because Big Boss is a cool character and he's pretty important for his series. Plus there's tons of gear in the Metal Gear games that could make for a good moveset (gimme that rocket punch and Fulton command grab).
You know how these pictures were taken pretty early in development? I just realized that, considering we never see any super early images where the game is unpolished visually, I think that means Battlefield's design wasn't finalized until really close to the "Everyone is Here!" trailer.
Because I wanted Dark Samus unique god dammit
Undodog. As he goes back to Mario Paint. Legacy.
because it really was a poor decision. and dark samus is one of the few characters in smash that really doesnt represent its character compared to the lore. dark samus, bowser jr and kooplings
You joke, but I unironically think that we got Piranha Plant specifically as a Mario Maker rep.
Hey i wanted Shadow as an echo even if that meant having two Spin Dashes and a Spring and all i got was a crappy Assist (and unlike Dark Samus in Smash 4, Shadow isn't even unique because the timer item has the same effect as his Chaos Control)
Which is why I don't understand why "x character shouldn't be an alternate costume or Echo Fighter of y character because their skillset is too different" is always met with "well Dark Samus did it". Nobody likes this decision so why would you use it as an example of why it would be ok?
What a coincidence, I was just watching that video.
Not quite. Shadow will now freeze players in place for a few seconds near the end of his attack, something the Timer never does. It also never backfires on you. Still, I can see why it seems lackluster.
I never said I would like it being done again, now did I?
The point is that you won't like it, but it can still happen anyway.
Ain't gonna lie, would've rather taken the Assist.
So when's Donkey Kong Country Returns: Now with K. Rool coming out? Because K. Rool had it worse by being last seen in Mario Super Sluugers. Rather I think it had to do with her not being as demanded as Ridley, but good enough to make her playable in a cheap way.
I'd agree were it not for the fact, that they went back and redid every single frame of animation to make Dark Samus visually distinct from regular Samus. The amount of work that would have to go into that, not to mention all her unique visual effects and models, makes her have WAY more of an obvious workload than a typical echo like Dark Pit or whatever, and hell, even some semi-clones.
Still, they should have given it a few more attacks from it's source material. Even something simple like replacing Bomb with creating a temporary double that echoes its movements similarly to Zero's Shadow Clone in the Marvel Vs. Capcom series would go a long way into making the character distinct from Samus in more than just aesthetics.
Been marathoning it with all 15 characters at Level 4 Grand Prix. Been going in order of the character select, so I just finished my last character, Dr. Coyle, last night.
That ignores that the point of Echoes is for their gameplay to be similar (or at least similar enough) to their counterpart that they don't have to be properly balanced against the rest of the cast. Back when Sakurai talked about Lucina, he blatantly mentioned that Echoes were time savers since they can reuse the same moveset and be balanced against themselves and their counterparts, which heavily removes a lot of the workload that would otherwise be tied to the character. Animations don't factor into that, Dark Samus looks great and is easily the most impressive echo from an animation standpoint, but her animations barely have an effect on her gameplay and thus she doesn't require much more work on her.
Still, the concept of Echo Fighters is likely what encouraged them to begin working on Dark Samus in the first place. Even if they spent a lot of time on her animations, they were never going to treat her like Isabelle and give her a combination of old and new attacks. That would require way more time and effort than animations alone. Their goal was to make a quick and simple character who wouldn't require much time and could be passed off as a nearly identical copy of an existing character.
That's not ignoring echoes are supposed to be similar at all. You don't need to tell me why echoes exist and what they're supposed to do, everyone already knows. I'm saying the argument used for echoes doesn't work at all to begin with considering even in Smash Bros right now we have characters like Marth and Lucina who have an OCEAN of difference between them in terms of being even remotely on the same power level. I think the concept of Smash foregoing character uniqueness for "balance" sounds absolutely laughable considering since Melee and beyond, clones have had winners and losers. Beyond that, I highly doubt balance is exactly the first thing Sakurai thinks about when we have characters who are on different ends of the viability spectrum just so they can be unique in their own way.
This... isn't true. While Dak Samus has more unique animations than the other echo fighters, it's not "every single frame". You know what? I'll list them all.
IMO all the base game third parties have a great echo option albeit with some question marks:
Yeah. And Nero wouldn't work as an echo fighter either, but I guess that between him and Vergil he would suit better the role of an echo fighter based on Dante.
Gonna split this up between A) characters who come with their own Echo Fighters, and B) characters who come with an Echo Fighter of a base roster character...
There's more complexity behind Marth's placement vs. Lucina in Ultimate (and just Ultimate, 4 they were pretty close) which includes things like the engine not being favorable to him. In terms of the actual differences between the two they only have property differences as Lucina loses the tipper, which didn't require her to get a new move at all.
For Echoes it's all about workload as with these characters you don't have the time to make a full or even semi-full moveset for them, so you reuse an existing one and tweak it so that you substantially cut down the amount of time and resources you have to spend on them. When it comes to balancing you don't want to make too many changes to the point that you have to balance them against 60+ characters and different modes like 1v1 and free-for-all, because then you have to devote more time and resources to that change to adjust it accordingly.
Dr. Mario benefits from being a clone that existed since Melee and thus was able to build off changes from his original base. If he was added in Smash 4 with Dark Pit and Lucina he likely would be in the same boat as them.
But... that song IS in ultimate?
That's not "almost an echo". That's MORE than some echoes actually got to differentiate themselves from their original character.
I don't think it's a good idea for pallet swaps and alternate costumes to play differently from one another since there's not really an indication for this to be a thing, however I do think making the ARMS characters into a custom character like the Mii Fighters would be a great implementation of ARMS's main draw.
The song is in Ultimate, just renamed "Bein' Friends" which is the official name of the song.
you dont even have to get main draw level. the suggestion that arms have that level of customization has no logistical sense or game design merrit. its similair to people thinking Nintendo would modify an existing assist trophy.
nero and dante at least use the similar main weapon and have both been playable main characters. it reminds me of zack being an echo of cloud rather than sephiroth being clouds echo.
