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Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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Rie Sonomura

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The other options just weren't that great. Noctilum is the best alternative, but a jungle can't compete with whatever the **** Sylvalum is. Oblivia and Cauldros' aesthetics wouldn't be great for Smash stages, and Primordia would just be Gaur Plain. NLA's setting is already covered by New Donk City, Fourside, and plenty of other stages. Sylvalum is the best choice.
hopefully Sylvalum would have varying weather settings too - minus the spore fog. **** the spore fog

oh yeah, what template do you use for the packs? And think you'd be willing to make a pack for Octoling Girl & Boy (Octo Expansion)?

for tracks, must include Nasty Majesty, Fly Octo Fly ~ Ebb & Flow (Octo), Splattack (Octo), Tidal Rush (if only because it wasn't in base), and a remix of #8 - regret
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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The other options just weren't that great. Noctilum is the best alternative, but a jungle can't compete with whatever the **** Sylvalum is. Oblivia and Cauldros' aesthetics wouldn't be great for Smash stages, and Primordia would just be Gaur Plain. NLA's setting is already covered by New Donk City, Fourside, and plenty of other stages. Sylvalum is the best choice.
I still think a traveling stage would be better since Xenoblade Chronicles X prides itself on exploration. I mean, so does The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, but even though its stage doesn't travel you can still see nearly every area in the game from there.

EDIT: You wouldn't be able to do that with Xenoblade Chronicles X because mountains separate each region; you couldn't get a good look at one and still be able to see the others.
 
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Cutie Gwen

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I still think a traveling stage would be better since Xenoblade Chronicles X prides itself on exploration. I mean, so does The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, but even though it's stage doesn't travel you can still see nearly every area in the game from there.
Ok but Noctolim gave me war flashbacks with all the overleveled enemies literally everywhere, could we PLEASE not
 

Phoenixio

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The argument that we're making is that characters that use guns all the time like Joker, Bayonetta, and Snake can be adapted into Super Smash Bros. without jacking up the age rating, and this is the case in other games as well.
I do think it's possible too, but those characters are also not solely reliant on guns. Joker barely uses the gun (and is not unlike other neutral B's that use blasters), Bayonetta is really more about the martial arts (even in her games she starts with guns but can forego them quickly, and in Smash they're minor added damage), and Snake has quite an arsenal but only explosives. Master Chief would thus push the boundaries farther than what has been done, since he's from a FPS after all, so almost exclusively gun reliant. The closest is Samus (which they really nailed, I'll give you that), but does Master Chief have an arsenal that could fill everything, feel like his actual original self, and not have guns that are too realistic? Maybe, I don't think it's fully impossible, but my personal opinion is that it's too far off and will either not feel like Halo, or not feel like Smash.

What do you mean? Aliens are your primary foe. Unless you're talking PvP or something, Chief ain't out here to murder is fellow species.
Yes, I was including PvP, which was a big thing. I haven't played this series quite as much, but the PvP seemed like the biggest thing back in the day. If it turned mostly to PvE since, then I can only believe you when you say it's exclusively aliens in the campaigns.
 

Goombaic

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hopefully Sylvalum would have varying weather settings too - minus the spore fog. **** the spore fog

oh yeah, what template do you use for the packs? And think you'd be willing to make a pack for Octoling Girl & Boy (Octo Expansion)?

for tracks, must include Nasty Majesty, Fly Octo Fly ~ Ebb & Flow (Octo), Splattack (Octo), Tidal Rush (if only because it wasn't in base), and a remix of #8 - regret
I'm not really into Splatoon as much as every other fighter I've made a pack for, but I can take a shot on it. Probably won't have a lot of spirits, though.
I still think a traveling stage would be better since Xenoblade Chronicles X prides itself on exploration. I mean, so does The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, but even though its stage doesn't travel you can still see nearly every area in the game from there.
Are you suggesting the Ma-non ship overlooking Mira as a stage because I'd actually be fully on board with that.
 

Rie Sonomura

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I'm not really into Splatoon as much as every other fighter I've made a pack for, but I can take a shot on it. Probably won't have a lot of spirits, though.

Are you suggesting the Ma-non ship overlooking Mira as a stage because I'd actually be fully on board with that.
if anything, Off the Hook and Cap'n Cuttlefish's Octo Expansion designs could be used for spirits, as well as Iso Padre, C.Q. Cumber,
Hijacked Agent 3, and the Telephone which evolves into Commander Tartar
 
D

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Yes, I was including PvP, which was a big thing. I haven't played this series quite as much, but the PvP seemed like the biggest thing back in the day. If it turned mostly to PvE since, then I can only believe you when you say it's exclusively aliens in the campaigns.
Yes there is indeed a campaign in Halo, and it was followed quite extensively. So much so where Halo 2's ending is considered one of the most infamous cliffhangers in gaming and Halo 3's commerical featuring aliens vs humans was considered one of the best and dramatic commercials for a game ever.

And as many have pointed out, UMVC3 including Resident Evil into the game, with RE 5 being the one where you shoot up a village of zombified Africans. If you can turn a pistol from that game into a stylized and cartoony action, I can't see how Halo can't make their pistols the same way.



If it helps you visualize, check out this Jump Force mod that put Master Chief into the game and see for yourself how much of a nonissue it is to tone Chief down.

 
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GoodGrief741

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I still don't see Master Chief. Very violent game with real guns and real bullets that create real blood and real deaths, too much of an XBox mascot, XBox is not a thing in Japan, and I still think he has a style issue with the game, much like Goku, and are not in the spirit of it. Doomguy has a much better chance, deconfirmed or not, due to the demonic and sci-fi aspects, and his lengthy history with Nintendo.

People will say "but what about Bayonetta and Snake?". Well having played those games very recently because of the isolation, Bayonetta is far from being realistic violent. There's never a single human injured, and the blood and kills we see are demons vs angels, meaning actually not as gross as Link diving his sword into Ganon's head. And Bayonetta has little to no sexual connotations (at least in the first game), despite undressing for some kills, there's never a sexual tone to it, more that her suit is made of hair and she needs it to summon the demons. Being halfway through the second game though, that one has more sexual references ( a few jokes here and there, usually not fight related), but I don't know if it was as much of a reference for Smash 4 at the time, since I don't know the timeline.



We've known about FF15 for a long time though, at least the first video about it generated a ton of hype, despite being reworked for years to become what it is now. And Final Fantasy 14 was a huge success, getting up to 18 million users by 2019, so that puts a lot of other games to shame. So whoever thinks Final Fantasy was on the low end, I'm not sure that's quite accurate. It might not have made a character as iconic as Cloud, sure, but it certainly isn't dead.
I think this might be the first person on Smashboards to have never played a videogame before. Otherwise the levels of baffling wrongness can't be explained.

Let's break it down, shall we?

1. (Halo is a) Very violent game.
No it isn't, honestly as far as M-rated franchises go it's pretty tame. Much less violent than Bayonetta and Persona.

2. With real guns and real bullets.
Didn't stop Metal Gear, and if you wanna get technical Bayonetta ("real bullets") and Persona (guns that look real), and besides Halo has many non-realistic guns that can be included. Plus as Gwen mentioned the notion of adding real bullets in videogames doesn't exist, bullets aren't modeled and in a game with Smash's perspective you won't see anything more than muzzle flash.

3. Real deaths
I think aside from like, Punch-Out and Wii Fit, there's not a single franchise in Smash where nobody dies. Killing is an intrinsic part of the videogame experience. Even Nintendo games, which are very family friendly, don't shy away from using death - realistically depicted death - as a plot point.

4. Too much of an Xbox mascot
Yeah, that's the point. That's why he'd be so exciting. Microsoft is already in the game so this is a moot point.

5. Xbox is not a thing in Japan
Xbox is accurately very unpopular over there, but Halo is one of the most successful Western franchises there (I think it's maybe like the third after Crash and Assassin's Creed but don't quote me on that). There is a PC audience there, and lo and behold Halo is on PC. People over there know about Master Chief, and it's not like Halo hasn't made enough of an impact so as to not be considered for being Western.

6. I still think he has a style issue in the game
You phrased this as an opinion so I'll give it a pass but most people would disagree that Green Samus isn't a fit for the game

7. Much like Goku
Goku has literally zero style issues considering we got four characters with that artstyle in Smash. Goku isn't getting in because he isn't a videogame character.

8. Are not in the spirit of it
Dunno what this means

9. Doomguy has much better chance, disconfirmed or not
See here's the thing, if a character is disconfirmed you can't have a worse chance, that's impossible.

10. There's never a single human injured in Bayonetta
I don't know if you're not counting the named characters in Bayonetta as human for whatever reason but there are deaths and injuries. If you're talking background NPCs in cutscenes then I dunno, seems improbable but I can't check it.

11. The blood and kills we see are demons vs angels, meaning actually not as gross as Link diving his sword into Ganon's head.
Uh, what? I'm sorry, but even if you don't find those demons and angels exploding into blood gross, the point isn't how gross it is, it's how gory it is, and it's objectively gorier than anything in Zelda. The design of the angel bosses in Bayo 1 by themselves are gross and disturbing.

But ****, if Zelda is gross and gory, then Master Chief absolutely gets a pass.

12. Bayonetta has little to no sexual connotations, despite undressing for some kills, there's never a sexual tone to it
At this point I'm considering the possibility that you're just a troll bored during self-isolation. You're telling me that Bayonetta, introduced wearing a sexy nun costume that rips in all the right places Bayonetta, pole dancing during attacks Bayonetta, spanking enemies Bayonetta, isn't a game with a sexual tone?

13. more that her suit is made of hair and she needs it to summon the demons
Sure pal, and Quiet needs to breathe through her skin.

14. I don't know if [Bayonetta 2] was as much of a reference for Smash 4 at the time
Bayonetta got in Smash because Nintendo was publishing Bayonetta 2, and her default costume is the Bayo 2 one, so you do the math

So there you have it. What will this accomplish? Absolutely nothing, people smarter and more articulate than me have been arguing this point for a while to no avail. But I'm bored so I typed this anyway.

Also I hope that the nonviolent, nonsexual Travis Touchdown gets in Smash as well. But given you found Bayonetta to be a nonsexual game, maybe you just enjoy No More Heroes as the best shonen there is.
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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Ok but Noctolim gave me war flashbacks with all the overleveled enemies literally everywhere, could we PLEASE not
Sylvalum is Noctolim on steroids though; you're just not as easily fooled by that point in the game.

Are you suggesting the Ma-non ship overlooking Mira as a stage because I'd actually be fully on board with that.
That might be cool too. My idea was to use some sort of holodeck like the one you see in the character creator. The stage would then change to reflect various landmarks within the game with at least one for each continent. This way you could show off some of Xenoblade Chronicles X's cool areas without haveing to spend a year modeling the entire planet of Mira for a single stage (assuming it was a stage in which you had a platform flying around an area like in the Skyloft stage).
 

Evil Trapezium

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I still don't see Master Chief. Very violent game with real guns and real bullets that create real blood and real deaths, too much of an XBox mascot, XBox is not a thing in Japan, and I still think he has a style issue with the game, much like Goku, and are not in the spirit of it. Doomguy has a much better chance, deconfirmed or not, due to the demonic and sci-fi aspects, and his lengthy history with Nintendo.
Solution to this problem? Just don't show blood or bullets.

I don't think Master Chief is likely either but that's because I think Microsoft's presence in Smash is a one and done deal just for Banjo & Kazooie. Don't know where Cuphead comes into this but I think that was just between Studio MDHR and Nintendo
 
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GoodGrief741

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Solution to this problem? Just don't show blood or bullets.

I don't think Master Chief is likely either but that's because I think Microsoft's presence in Smash is a one and done deal just for Banjo & Kazooie. Don't know where Cuphead comes into this but I think that was just between Studio MDHR and Nintendo
While Microsoft doesn't own the Cuphead IP, and thus negotiations for Smash were solely between Nintendo and MDHR, Microsoft does have an exclusivity deal in place for Cuphead the game. For it to have been on Switch, Microsoft had to allow (and honestly, maybe even push) Studio MDHR to do it. Even if they had no role in the Smash negotiations, they still opened the door for that relationship to exist in the first place.
 

Captain Shwampy

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So SEGA contacted me personally and were very excited that anyone at all mentioned the Shining series/IP and insisted that I post a large picture of the anime waifu harem.

SEGA of America would also very much like you to be interested in Shining Resonance Refrain available now on your Nintendo Switch for only $30 and in their exact words here:

"This game is a super cool power fantasy and has gameplay. You get all the girls and do magic with the sword just like Kirito in that anime. We've listened to the fans, and you can even dress them up in bikinis! Please care."

At the time of posting, there is no word on whether or not the game is a tactical strategy game. SEGA suggest fans of tactical fantasy google Kai's butt from VC4 and forget about the old times until they re-release their Genesis collection again.
Shining Force 4 but with more cute girls designed by SUEZEN. DO it SEGA.

 

Cosmic77

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The gorey content shouldn't be an issue considering how Bayo got in just fine. Master Chief could get in if Nintendo tried.

And that's part of the reason why I don't think it'll happen. I don't think Nintendo cares enough to try. Yes, Master Chief would be a big addition, but looking back at the previous five characters, I don't necessarily think that helps him as much as people think. Actually, the only reason we even have a Microsoft character in Smash in the first place is because most of the fanbase had to beg for said character.

Maybe if more people united around him. Until then, I feel like people are just rating his chances high because he's arguably the most iconic Microsoft rep.
 

Al-kīmiyā'

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If there could only be one Animal Crossing character in Smash, who do you think it should be?
 

AceAttorney9000

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9. Doomguy has much better chance, disconfirmed or not
See here's the thing, if a character is disconfirmed you can't have a worse chance, that's impossible.
You forgot to mention the fact that they're arguing against the likelihood of Master Chief due to the Halo series being violent... and then they go on to say that Doom Slayer would be more likely, despite the fact that the Doom series is way more ******* violent than the Halo series... and that's even if you purposefully ignore the 2016 game and instead just focus on the original two PC games and Doom 64.
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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You forgot to mention the fact that they're arguing against the likelihood of Master Chief due to the Halo series being violent... and then they go on to say that Doom Slayer would be more likely, despite the fact that the Doom series is way more ******* violent than the Halo series... and that's even if you purposefully ignore the 2016 game and instead just focus on the original two PC games and Doom 64.
It's also like Mortal Kombat in that violence is kinda the point of the game.
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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If there could only be one Animal Crossing character in Smash, who do you think it should be?
Villager easily. Represents the game specifically with the moveset. Anybody else are excellent additions, though, since it's a pretty major franchise and can easily have more characters. Isabelle being the first next option, of course. No reason to omit someone already made for Smash at this point. Also helps she wasn't completely unique and was built off of Villager, making her easy to add than an entirely new and unique character.

(Besides, Isabelle isn't there to represent the series. She's there because she's the current mascot(though Tom Nook might be taking it back due to NH, but who knows) and was very easy to make using Villager's assets. She'd have to be completely different otherwise because throwing in Villager's moves only made sense in context of "semi-clone", not because they fit her specifically. Her more natural things like more focus on the Project Works would make more sense. She's not the player character, after all. Those moves just happen to work fine since it's not like she can't do them and all).
 
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Brindor

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Can't believe we're arguing over wherever or not Master Chief should be in Smash, when we've seen in the past that anything goes with Sakurai and he can make anything work if he put's his mind to it. (I.e. Villager, Plant, Duck Hunt etc)
I don't think MC will get in either but anything that sort of prevents him from getting into Smash has already been covered by past fighters. (i.e. Bayonetta and Banjo.)
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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DarthEnderX

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And unlike most people, I reaaaally like ingame lore and read it all. Good luck finding any non-interpretative evidence that she gets naked just for fun and that it's sexually explicit, when it's heavily censored and you barely even see the more provocative stuff because it quickly focuses on the demons.
...who cares if it's in-game lore?

Just because Kojima writes up a some bull**** reason for why Quiet has to fight in her underwear doesn't change the fact that the reason HE made it that way was so he could have the character run around in her underwear.

Bayonetta is no different. The developers CHOSE to make it so she has to dance around and lose her clothing when she uses her powers. It doesn't matter if the lore reason is for sexy fun-times, because the DEVELOPMENT reason was for sexy fun-times.


Also, ya know, maybe play through 2 now and get to the part where she pole dances over the end credits...

What can that adaptation take to Smash if half of it is realistic violence with guns and headshots?
The other half?
 
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Hadokeyblade

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I personally think most game characters can work in smash with enough effort. Even the most bloody and gory of them all.

Except maybe a GTA character
 

N3ON

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Doesn't matter how much the game sexualizes the character, it matters how much skin gets shown. A character could pop off all their clothes to take a shower, and there's nothing inherently sexual about that, but the rating boards would be having none of it.

Meanwhile you could constantly have tiddy and butt shots, but if the character is fully clothed with no skin showing, you'd probably walk away with an E10, or the equivalent.

I mean it really does demonstrate the hang-ups society has with their own bodies, but it is what it is.

That said, I can't imagine the Bayonetta games don't sexualize Bayonetta at all.
 

RileyXY1

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Well it's the whole reason why they've modified any realistic gun in the game, including Joker. They're always made to look silly, with "energy" bullets and weird behaviors like mini explosions, It's a real thing, even more prominent in Japan where gun violence is really shunned upon. Also a reason why those Yakuza picks are probably not happening (even more so if it promotes the most prominent type of organized crime in Japan). People in America might be in denial about this, but those are definitely things they consider and discuss during those "developer presentation meetings).
As far as I know the Yakuza series has a different title in Japan. It's only called "Yakuza" internationally.
 

Hadokeyblade

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As far as I know the Yakuza series has a different title in Japan. It's only called "Yakuza" internationally.
Yeah the series in Japan is called "Like a Dragon". I never understood why this was changed in the west, it sounds perfectly fine as is.

Kinda makes Fist of the north star lost paradise kinda awkward when in Japan it's called "Like a North Star" cementing itself as a crossover.
 

Idon

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Yeah the series in Japan is called "Like a Dragon". I never understood why this was changed in the west, it sounds perfectly fine as is.

Kinda makes Fist of the north star lost paradise kinda awkward when in Japan it's called "Like a North Star" cementing itself as a crossover.
I imagine the localizers wanted to emphasize both the foreign nature of the game and the heavy involvement in the japanese crime underworld. While "Like a Dragon" is a really cool name, for an unaware ignorant Westerner they wouldn't quite know anything about the game series. Calling it Yakuza makes them think "Oh! it's 1) Japanese, and 2) A crime drama."

Of course, nowadays your average video game fan is quite accustomed to Japanese names and titles.
 

Dalek_Kolt

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Yeah the series in Japan is called "Like a Dragon". I never understood why this was changed in the west, it sounds perfectly fine as is.

Kinda makes Fist of the north star lost paradise kinda awkward when in Japan it's called "Like a North Star" cementing itself as a crossover.
Speaking of, I kind of wish the latest entry, Yakuza: Like a Dragon, did what Resident Evil 7 did and incorporated its original name and localized name into the title for both versions.
1584830130558.png

I get why, Yakuza are kind of taboo in Japan, but still.
 

Schnee117

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1. (Halo is a) Very violent game.
No it isn't, honestly as far as M-rated franchises go it's pretty tame. Much less violent than Bayonetta and Persona.
.
The M rating got dropped for 5 funnily enough,
Coincidentally they have a more colourful, less gritty artstyle and there's no Flood or serious injuries and wounds shown even though some of the assassinations are pretty brutal
 
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