Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[KingBroly]

I feel like if they add Waluigi, which I don't think they should, it'll just be the DK trailer again, this time with Banjo in the House instead of K Rool, and when Waluigi arrives, there won't be a troll, they'll just be unimpressed and go back to sleep.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

If you ask me, I still don't think Waluigi's happening, much less so Frisk or anyone from Undertale. With regard to the latter, it doesn't seem like something Toby Fox would do. He's always been a rather humble indie dev.

 

[Polan]

Thought I’d share Source Gaming’s viewpoint on the Frisk and Waluigi situation. Spazzy seems unconvinced that it’s real.

wait did this paragon guy really pull the "nintendo is coming after me!" card? cuz if he did then throw this one on the trash.

 

[Vycoul]

wait did this paragon guy really pull the "nintendo is coming after me!" card? cuz if he did then throw this one on the trash.

True. They bring up some great points regarding that in that SG video.
I hadn't really thought about how unlikely it is that a cease and desist would be sent out from Nintendo to... a random guy on discord.

They also mention that we haven't heard rumblings of a huge amount of C&Ds going out to a bunch of leakers. It was just Sabi, who is very prominent and in the public view. It's a really hard to buy that they would have also pinpointed this guy too.

 

[Nquoid]

So does anyone have an idea of how to stop ourselves going insane chasing fake leaks?

Like its obviously going to be a dry spell until at least Hero has a release date. But theres definitely a lot of depth we can still discuss in the mean time.

 

[Vycoul]

So does anyone have an idea of how to stop ourselves going insane chasing fake leaks?

They say there is a first time for everything. But not for this.
This'll be going on until the end of Smash.

 

[ES. Dinah]

Everyone and their mother were buzzing about a Dragon Quest character. Again, I know hindsight is 20/20, but plenty of people were already hating on Erdrick for being perceived as inevitable.

There is one thing though, did this supposed leaker say that the DQ character's name was going to be Hero?
If that's true, then I guess I was wrong about the chances of that being a lucky guess. They are still acting like most trolls right now though, that is undeniable.

As for the Paragon leak, everyone should try to resist the urge to dismiss it as fake simply because it has Waluigi in it. There are some really strange circumstances around it. I think it calls for more looking into before disregarding it.

I mean he said DQ protagonist which is pretty much the hero, yeah. Look, I'm not trying to say the leak is real but it's very impressive for an ordinary guess. I think what makes me start to somewhat believe it is the fact his tweets were only translatedby the smash scene as of late and he's now tweeting in English which means he probably wants to be known to the West. I mean he even said a few days ago in his first English tweet that he knew DQ hero and that he was surprised too as a joke since he knew since December 2018.

 

[GoodGrief741]

So does anyone have an idea of how to stop ourselves going insane chasing fake leaks?

Like its obviously going to be a dry spell until at least Hero has a release date. But theres definitely a lot of depth we can still discuss in the mean time.

Just discuss whatever characters you think have a chance. We can do whatever we want. Create our own bandwagons. We are free from the chains of the expectations that others lay upon us.

If you support a character that makes a lot of sense, now's the time to build that support. All the Banjo fans have to find a new home, after all.

 

[3BitSaurus]

Just discuss whatever characters you think have a chance. We can do whatever we want. Create our own bandwagons. We are free from the chains of the expectations that others lay upon us.

If you support a character that makes a lot of sense, now's the time to build that support. All the Banjo fans have to find a new home, after all.

If I may, let me reccommend the threads for Phoenix and Klonoa. I'm way more hopeful for the former than the latter, but you never know.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

If you support a character that makes a lot of sense, now's the time to build that support. All the Banjo fans have to find a new home, after all.

Alright then lets discuss the chances of a Rhythm Heaven character.

I give them a solid 5%.

 

[Deleted member]

About female with projectiles, would a bird count as a projectile?

Spoiler: Image might be big

Edit btw, Im just speculating for fun. Doubt on the dude's but its great to fit characters into puzzle leaks just for fun.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

About female with projectiles, would a bird count as a projectile?

Spoiler: Image might be big

That would be more of a "familiar" tbh

Not quite the same thing

 

[A.G.L.]

I think Ryu Hayabusa has a really good shot at this Fighter Pass for the following reasons.

There’s an Assist trophy and spirits in Smash Ultimate by Koei Tecmo, they are from the Fatal Frame series. Yuri Kozokata is the assist trophy and Mío and Maya Amakura are spirits. Not to mention Koei Tecmo appears in the end credits of Smash Ultimate. Due to the high relationship of Koei Tecmo and Nintendo and how iconic the poster boy of Koei Tecmo is. I think Ryu Hayabusa of Ninja Gaiden has very good shot at a DLC spot, not to mention he’s a NES classic character.

Personally I would love to see his inclusion in Smash Bros Ultimate, not to mention how many weapons he has, and character legacy, I believe would be a great addition.

Koei Tecmo in the credits of Super Smash Bros!?!? We've got a couple of things hidden in this game, have you found them yet? pic.twitter.com/GjLk6RIHjJ

— KOEI TECMO EUROPE (@koeitecmoeurope) December 10, 2018

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

About female with projectiles, would a bird count as a projectile?

A projectile maybe but I don't think it could be mistaken for a weapon.

I think Ryu Hayabusa has a really good shot at this Fighter Pass for the following reasons.

There’s an Assist trophy and spirits in Smash Ultimate by Koei Tecmo, they are from the Fatal Frame series. Yuri Kozokata is the assist trophy and Mío and Maya Amakura are spirits. Not to mention Koei Tecmo appears in the end credits of Smash Ultimate. Due to the high relationship of Koei Tecmo and Nintendo and how iconic the poster boy of Koei Tecmo is. I think Ryu Hayabusa of Ninja Gaiden has very good shot at a DLC spot, not to mention he’s a NES classic character.

Personally I would love to see his inclusion in Smash Bros Ultimate, not to mention how many weapons he has, and character legacy, I believe would be a great addition.

Koei Tecmo in the credits of Super Smash Bros!?!? We've got a couple of things hidden in this game, have you found them yet? pic.twitter.com/GjLk6RIHjJ

— KOEI TECMO EUROPE (@koeitecmoeurope) December 10, 2018

Would he be kinda like Simon, but with different weapons as his special attacks?

EDIT: I feel like that's a dumb question. He clearly wouldn't have Simon's range.

 

[KingBroly]

A projectile maybe but I don't think it could be mistaken for a weapon.

Would he be kinda like Simon, but with different weapons as his special attacks?

I think he'd be a crossover of Link and Sheik with Kunai, Swords, Bow/Arrows, along with the Ultimate Technique as his Final Smash.

 

[A.G.L.]

A projectile maybe but I don't think it could be mistaken for a weapon.


Would he be kinda like Simon, but with different weapons as his special attacks?

EDIT: I feel like that's a dumb question. He clearly wouldn't have Simon's range.

He could have Simon's range if he uses his kusarigama, which is a chain sickle. He also uses bows, shuriken, kunai, his dragon sword, ninjutsu spells and his famous Izunu drop (where he grabs his opponent in the air and slams them to the ground).

These are just some of his weapons that he can use, as he is known to also use claws (kind of like wolverine) scythes, flails, dual katanas etc.

So the possibilities of his moveset are really up to Sakurai and team, as he has a lot to choose from.

Not to mention Ninja Gaiden has so much amazing music, that if he was included we would get some really interesting music from it.

Heres an example of a fan remix

 

[Deleted member]

I think Ryu Hayabusa has a really good shot at this Fighter Pass for the following reasons.

There’s an Assist trophy and spirits in Smash Ultimate by Koei Tecmo, they are from the Fatal Frame series. Yuri Kozokata is the assist trophy and Mío and Maya Amakura are spirits. Not to mention Koei Tecmo appears in the end credits of Smash Ultimate. Due to the high relationship of Koei Tecmo and Nintendo and how iconic the poster boy of Koei Tecmo is. I think Ryu Hayabusa of Ninja Gaiden has very good shot at a DLC spot, not to mention he’s a NES classic character.

Personally I would love to see his inclusion in Smash Bros Ultimate, not to mention how many weapons he has, and character legacy, I believe would be a great inclusion.

Koei Tecmo in the credits of Super Smash Bros!?!? We've got a couple of things hidden in this game, have you found them yet? pic.twitter.com/GjLk6RIHjJ

— KOEI TECMO EUROPE (@koeitecmoeurope) December 10, 2018

I'm banking on Ninja Gaiden being the 4th Fighter Pack really hard. Finally getting 1 of the last NES all stars in Smash would make the Fighter Pass incredible, but I don't think Nintendo would save Ryu Hayabusa as the last DLC fighter. If they did, then my God I'd be flabbergasted with pure joy while at the same time feel pissed that I had to wait over a year to finally play as him. Other than that, I strongly believe Koei-Tecmo and Team Ninja would want Sakurai to design Ryu Hayabusa off of the modern Ninja Gaiden games with some callbacks to the NES games (like his classic costume being an alt and remixed versions of the NES tracks).

 

[Robdelia]

In regards to the female fighting game rep with throwing weapons thing, I only want Mai Shiranui in just for how crazy of a pick she would be.

 

[Nemuresu]

Athena has a projectile.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Fiolina Germi has projectiles, loads of them. Granted, she'd need to be part of a package deal with Marco Rossi, but still...

 

[A.G.L.]

I'm banking on Ninja Gaiden being the 4th Fighter Pack really hard. Finally getting 1 of the last NES all stars in Smash would make the Fighter Pass incredible, but I don't think Nintendo would save Ryu Hayabusa as the last DLC fighter. If they did, then my God I'd be flabbergasted with pure joy while at the same time feel pissed that I had to wait over a year to finally play as him. Other than that, I strongly believe Koei-Tecmo and Team Ninja would want Sakurai to design Ryu Hayabusa off of the modern Ninja Gaiden games with some callbacks to the NES games (like his classic costume being an alt and remixed versions of the NES tracks).

Agree Ryu Hayabusa is the last of the big NES stars. As for how much people love the classic Ninja Gaiden games all we have to do is look at how well The Messenger sold. It just goes to show how much people still love Ninja Gaiden. And the excuse of Ninja Gaiden is not on the Switch can't be used because it is. With Koei Tecmo and Team Ninja working so close with Nintendo, I think Ryu Hayabusa has a huge chance.

I also agree that if Ryu Hayabusa gets into Smash Ultimate, he will be like Cloud. In that he has his classic NES design and his modern design. And unfortunately I can see Nintendo and Sakurai making him the 5th and last DLC character of this Fighters Pass.

 

[ramon_zer0]

So out of curiosity, since I think this might be the best place to ask given the board's subject matter: who are the general frontrunners for newcomers we have right now? Just looking for names to consider and all.

 

[A.G.L.]

So out of curiosity, since I think this might be the best place to ask given the board's subject matter: who are the general frontrunners for newcomers we have right now? Just looking for names to consider and all.

These seem to be the frontrunners

2nd Bandai Namco rep: Heihachi Mishima, Lloyd Irving, KOS-MOS, Nightmare/Siegfried

1st Koei Tecmo rep: Ryu Hayabusa

3rd Capcom rep: Jill Valentine, Phoenix Wright, Amaterasu, Leon Kennedy

1st Activision rep: Crash Bandicoot

1st SNK rep: Mai Shiranui

1st Bethesda rep: DoomSlayer

 

[Deathcarter]

These seem to be the frontrunners


1st SNK rep: Mai Shiranui

Kyo and Terry would be ahead of her by default given they're the protagonists of the franchises she actually appears in.

 

[A.G.L.]

Kyo and Terry would be ahead of her by default given they're the protagonists of the franchises she actually appears in.

Agree, I just put her as she seems to be the highest in DLC speculation right now.

 

[Deleted member]

Agree Ryu Hayabusa is the last of the big NES stars. As for how much people love the classic Ninja Gaiden games all we have to do is look at how well The Messenger sold. It just goes to show how much people still love Ninja Gaiden. And the excuse of Ninja Gaiden is not on the Switch can't be used because it is. With Koei Tecmo and Team Ninja working so close with Nintendo, I think Ryu Hayabusa has a huge chance.

I also agree that if Ryu Hayabusa gets into Smash Ultimate, he will be like Cloud. In that he has his classic NES design and his modern design. And unfortunately I can see Nintendo and Sakurai making him the 5th and last DLC character of this Fighters Pass.

Seriously, Koei-Tecmo [and Team Ninja] would be doing someone wrong to not have a fighter in Smash when they've been trusted to co-develop 3 Houses and various spinoffs for other Nintendo IPs.

3rd Capcom rep: Jill Valentine, Phoenix Wright, Amaterasu, Leon Kennedy

3rd

Ken: Am I a joke to you?

 

[A.G.L.]

Seriously, Koei-Tecmo [and Team Ninja] would be doing someone wrong to not have a fighter in Smash when they've been trusted to co-develop 3 Houses and various spinoffs for other Nintendo IPs.



Ken: Am I a joke to you?

Agree not to mention Team Ninja is making Marvel Ultimate Alliance 3, and Team Ninja is owned by Koei Tecmo. Given how much Nintendo has been trusting Koei Tecmo to handle their games lately, it would be kind of shocking if Ryu Hayabusa did not appear in Smash Ultimate.

Lol no Ken is actually my main so he's definitely not, I just don't consider echo's their own actual character. Even though Ken fights very differently from Ryu, and is the echo fighter that is the most unique in having their own moves.

 

[Wyoming]

Seriously, Koei-Tecmo [and Team Ninja] would be doing someone wrong to not have a fighter in Smash when they've been trusted to co-develop 3 Houses and various spinoffs for other Nintendo IPs.



Ken: Am I a joke to you?

Well, Ubisoft...

 

[A.G.L.]

Well, Ubisoft...

Im still curious why Ubisoft is the odd one out in this, had they not had Rayman as a spirit in Smash Ultimate. I would have thought he had a good chance at one of the DLC spots. Why put their mascot as a Spirit? Unlike Koei Tecmo who only has one of their characters as a Spirit and not their mascot. Its a very interesting and odd situation that Ubisoft is in.

 

[Flyboy]

Fiolina Germi has projectiles, loads of them. Granted, she'd need to be part of a package deal with Marco Rossi, but still...

I love Fio so much. I know her only shot is as a Marco echo but she is my favorite SNK pick.

Im still curious why Ubisoft is the odd one out in this, had they not had Rayman as a spirit in Smash Ultimate. I would have thought he had a good chance at one of the DLC spots. Why put their mascot as a Spirit? Unlike Koei Tecmo who only has one of their characters as a Spirit and not their mascot. Its a very interesting and odd situation that Ubisoft is in.

My hot take is that Ezio is more iconic than Rayman overall, and that it wouldn't surprise me to see him make it in especially if there are future passes.

 

[StormC]

Im still curious why Ubisoft is the odd one out in this, had they not had Rayman as a spirit in Smash Ultimate. I would have thought he had a good chance at one of the DLC spots. Why put their mascot as a Spirit? Unlike Koei Tecmo who only has one of their characters as a Spirit and not their mascot. Its a very interesting and odd situation that Ubisoft is in.

I don't think any of Ubisoft's IPs are popular or well known in Japan but Rayman was probably somewhat popular on the ballot so he got a Spirit for it.

 

[Ridrool64]

Honestly, that leak does actually make sense to me (UT Rep + Waluigi), and while I'm going to say I'm neutral until we get solid evidence that this leak is fabricated, the reveal of somebody other than those two, the reveal of Sans, or the reveal of Waluigi after Frisk/Papyrus (the leak said it won't be Sans more than likely), I can see where Waluigi and the Undertale character come from.

Waluigi is, believe it or not, massively popular among casuals by mere virtue of being a Mario character; I really think people in the Smash speculation scene don't understand just how well-known Mario spin offs are, and how beloved they are by casuals worldwide: Waluigi is in one of the best selling Mario games ever, Mario Kart Wii. And, to be honest, when it comes to something as legendary and popular as Mario, I'm not quite sure Sakurai would have the same apprehension as with Corrin. Plus, while it would be a waste to scrap Waluigi's Assist Trophy, there's plenty of ways around it (disable the AT when Waluigi is played as, put AT Waluigi in a new outfit, replace it with a character who can do what he did, and there might be some solutions I didn't think up).

Personally, I think that even if you don't like, or even outright hate Waluigi (unless he is your least wanted by a country mile and a half), you have to admit the prospect of a character who effectively disconfirms DISCONFIRMATION AS A WHOLE (killing AT, Mii Costume, and Spirit disconfirmations in one fell swoop) would be very enticing to the Smash Bros. fandom, who would probably buy him en masse to prove to Nintendo they want more Assist promotions and Spirit promotions, while Waluigi practically sells himself to casuals.

Meanwhile, we have Undertale. I've previously discussed this at-length for the RTC thread, so I'll keep it short. I think I might have new information to go off of.

• Undertale is extremely popular and iconic for an indie game, being one that will shape the lives of the next generation.
• All of the DLC characters so far cater to old-school gamers (Three out of the four variants of Hero, Banjo & Kazooie) and adults (Luminary, Joker): there are no characters who are popular among children. Undertale would easily remedy this.
  • This may not be true in regards to Japan, but at least seems to be accurate for the United States. Anybody who wants to contend this point can.
• The relationship between Nintendo and indie developers has become one of the things Nintendo wants to push the most, making it likely that Undertale made the list.
• Toby Fox is a known fan of Smash Bros., as he was more preoccupied with the Ultimate teaser than the teaser for his own game, and Deltarune includes a reference to Smash Bros.
  • As an anecdote, another series that would get a fighter in Smash, Persona (specifically Persona 5 sub-series), includes a reference to Smash Bros. as well (unless this is fabricated). However, that doesn't mean it's an intentional hint.
• Sakurai is familiar with Undertale and has played it.
• As for why it wouldn't be Sans... (limiting myself to just Frisk and Papyrus).
  • Frisk is the primary hero, villain, and protagonist of the game. Sakurai may have been enticed by a moveset that could represent all of Undertale as opposed to only one third.
  • The Human has a back-up name to go by if Toby Fox does not want spoilers, though given Groove Coaster I won't hold it against Sans too much. Sans' primary combat abilities are spoilers.
  • Papyrus can do everything Sans can, sans Gaster Blasters, while these traits are not spoilery.
  • The most likely Undertale stage, the Last Corridor (official name of Judgement Hall), could feature Sans in the background, or even as the main element of the stage.
    • Other Undertale stages could feature Sans as an NPC.
  • It's possible Sans is among the DLC Spirits and Mii Costumes.
  • While Sans is more popular than Frisk and Papyrus, the gap is not that big, and all of them are very iconic and memorable characters to many people (Frisk is contentious about this, but Papyrus certainly is not that far away from Sans). Sans is simply the most memetic.

Even if the leak itself is fake, then I still believe at least Undertale is not off the table, and it would be very, very easy for Toby to just say "no lol i'm not involved with smash. just a fan" or something to that effect. I don't recall this ever happening, though. Waluigi is more contentious, but hey, everything's a rule until it's broken.

I'm very not certain in the idea that the Fighter's Pass, barring leaks, is a "one per company" deal, mostly because it feels like something that'd only be done to complete a quota and it doesn't sound like Sakurai cares about quotas. It's not a rule, but more likely than not it could come to pass that it's one character per company. One per series, on the other hand, is even more likely to be true because then you're not forging new ground, and as far as we've seen, second uniques are very unlikely as there seems to be a preference for new series, though not impossible until somebody says something.

I don't have anything to say on the "female with a projectile" other than if it were... you know who... I'd be a happy camper. But given the guy seems to be Japanese, he (and his source?) would know who Arle is. (Also, in the next game/pass I would say Arle's easily the likeliest puzzle game rep hands down, but right now I think Layton has a better argument. If Jibanyan gets in, though, Arle will be the likeliest again.) Spreading my wings so far that I can't talk about the current point.

 

[Deleted member]

I think Ryu Hayabusa has a really good shot at this Fighter Pass for the following reasons.

There’s an Assist trophy and spirits in Smash Ultimate by Koei Tecmo, they are from the Fatal Frame series. Yuri Kozokata is the assist trophy and Mío and Maya Amakura are spirits. Not to mention Koei Tecmo appears in the end credits of Smash Ultimate. Due to the high relationship of Koei Tecmo and Nintendo and how iconic the poster boy of Koei Tecmo is. I think Ryu Hayabusa of Ninja Gaiden has very good shot at a DLC spot, not to mention he’s a NES classic character.

Personally I would love to see his inclusion in Smash Bros Ultimate, not to mention how many weapons he has, and character legacy, I believe would be a great addition.

Koei Tecmo in the credits of Super Smash Bros!?!? We've got a couple of things hidden in this game, have you found them yet? pic.twitter.com/GjLk6RIHjJ

— KOEI TECMO EUROPE (@koeitecmoeurope) December 10, 2018

Since you brought him up, i have a crazy theroy.

Have you ever noticed similarities between characters? I don't mean echoes or clones or characters re-ussing animations, but as it tropes and ideas a character uses. Back in Melee, we had Shiek, a ninja-like character, and another one in 4 with Greninja. Those characters tell us some of the ideas Sakurai is interesed that he revisist from time to time, and sometimes it feels like it gives us a picture as to what Sakurai wants from a character.

Shiek's Chain pre-Smash 4? That's like Simon's whip from SCIV (Sakurai said himself that Castlevania made a big impact of him, so i wouldn't be surprised he took inspiration from the franchise and made nods to it before Simon's debut in Ult, after all Sakurai referenced Street Fighter in Super Star with the Fighter copy ability) Yoshi's Side B and Jiggly's rollout? Basically Proto-Spindash (Sonic was conisdered in Melee even) Some characters as a whole embody ideas that are similar to other characters. Smash 4 Zero Suit Samus gives Bayonetta vibes with all the things they added to her, from the Heels to the Beauty Mark, to the new Side Smash and Up Special. So much so that her All Star Congratulations Picture is a Bayonetta reference (before Bayo herself was even confirmed). Duck Hunt is basically Proto-Banjo at this point in my eyes, it would explain why the Duck is always mounted on the Dog, which is an idea i have only see Sakurai use, other pre-Smash 4 fan movesets i have seen for Duck Hunt used the Duck to much lesser extents (and especially not in the way they are used in Smash officially)

Where im going with this, is that Sakurai likely wants a Ninja Character in Smash, no only he has toyed with this idea, but now he has a basis for said Theorical Ninja character thanks to Shiek and Gren, so development time could go smoother than usual (Hero clearly takes attacks from other sword users like Link's Dash attack, and Joker takes a lot of character animations, as a tweet once showcased)

That's why i think Ryu could stand a chance, because his archetype a Ninja warrior is something that Sakurai likes (he even added a Ninja Copy Ability in Super Star) and he has used this idea before, but only in the more superficial "super agile fragile character" style, he probably would like to go full Ninja with everything that embodies one like Ninjutsu abilities or other Ninja Weapons, and Ryu fits the bill.

And no i don't Shiek and Greninja "already beign Ninjas in Smash" hurt his chances, if anything they make him more likely (plus if an archetype makes a character more unlikely i seriously dobut we would have so many sword users)

 

[Deleted member]

I don't think any of Ubisoft's IPs are popular or well known in Japan but Rayman was probably somewhat popular on the ballot so he got a Spirit for it.

By the comments of Ayumi, neither Halo nor Doom either but people speculate about them.

 

[RileyXY1]

I don't think any of Ubisoft's IPs are popular or well known in Japan but Rayman was probably somewhat popular on the ballot so he got a Spirit for it.

Ezio did get in Soul Calibur 5, so the Japanese are probably aware of him.

 

[Vycoul]

Kyo and Terry would be ahead of her by default given they're the protagonists of the franchises she actually appears in.

Yeah, as much as I would love Mai, ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Sakurai has been completely consistent with giving a series' main character upmost priority.

I've seen some arguments against this citing Pikachu. But... really, who doesn't view Pikachu as the main Pokemon character? Not the main character of Pokemon, but the main Pokemon people think of when they think of the series.

 

[Robdelia]

I'm still kinda banking on Monster Hunter being DLC but I think it'll probably be Phoenix.

 

[Flyboy]

Since you brought him up, i have a crazy theroy.

Have you ever noticed similarities between characters? I don't mean echoes or clones or characters re-ussing animations, but as it tropes and ideas a character uses. Back in Melee, we had Shiek, a ninja-like character, and another one in 4 with Greninja. Those characters tell us some of the ideas Sakurai is interesed that he revisist from time to time, and sometimes it feels like it gives us a picture as to what Sakurai wants from a character.

Shiek's Chain pre-Smash 4? That's like Simon's whip from SCIV (Sakurai said himself that Castlevania made a big impact of him, so i wouldn't be surprised he took inspiration from the franchise and made nods to it before Simon's debut in Ult, after all Sakurai referenced Street Fighter in Super Star with the Fighter copy ability) Yoshi's Side B and Jiggly's rollout? Basically Proto-Spindash (Sonic was conisdered in Melee even) Some characters as a whole embody ideas that are similar to other characters. Smash 4 Zero Suit Samus gives Bayonetta vibes with all the things they added to her, from the Heels to the Beauty Mark, to the new Side Smash and Up Special. So much so that her All Star Congratulations Picture is a Bayonetta reference (before Bayo herself was even confirmed). Duck Hunt is basically Proto-Banjo at this point in my eyes, it would explain why the Duck is always mounted on the Dog, which is an idea i have only see Sakurai use, other pre-Smash 4 fan movesets i have seen for Duck Hunt used the Duck to much lesser extents (and especially not in the way they are used in Smash officially)

Where im going with this, is that Sakurai likely wants a Ninja Character in Smash, no only he has toyed with this idea, but now he has a basis for said Theorical Ninja character thanks to Shiek and Gren, so development time could go smoother than usual (Hero clearly takes attacks from other sword users like Link's Dash attack, and Joker takes a lot of character animations, as a tweet once showcased)

That's why i think Ryu could stand a chance, because his archetype a Ninja warrior that Sakurai likes (he even added a Ninja Copy Ability in Super Star) and he has used this idea before, but only in the more superficial "super agile fragile character" style, he probably would like to go full Ninja with everything that embodies one like Ninjutsu abilities or other Ninja Weapons, and Ryu fits the bill.

And no i don't Shiek and Greninja "already beign Ninjas in Smash" hurt his chances, if anything they make him more likely (plus if an archetype makes a character more unlikely i seriously dobut we would have so many sword users)

I always said to my friends that it felt like Greninja was only added because they couldn't get the rights to Hayabusa. Look at that final smash and tell me it isn't perfect for him.

That said, I feel that this go around they're trying to make unique gimmicks for each fighter. We have the Rebellion Gauge and comeback mechanic for Joker, the menu and MP system for Hero, and what seems to be ammo for Banjo.

It's a good post and theory.

 

[N3ON]

These seem to be the frontrunners

2nd Bandai Namco rep: Heihachi Mishima, Lloyd Irving, KOS-MOS, Nightmare/Siegfried

1st Koei Tecmo rep: Ryu Hayabusa

3rd Capcom rep: Jill Valentine, Phoenix Wright, Amaterasu, Leon Kennedy

1st Activision rep: Crash Bandicoot

1st SNK rep: Mai Shiranui

Activision but no Bethesda? I see how it is.

 

[StormC]

By the comments of Ayumi, neither Halo nor Doom either but people speculate about them.

Doom's creator has at least been namechecked by Sakurai as an influential game designer. I personally think the chances of Doom in Smash are low though.

Ezio did get in Soul Calibur 5, so the Japanese are probably aware of him.

Soul Calibur V flopped in Japan with 69k units sold, so I don't think that would matter much.