Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Hadokeyblade]

I know it might be an alien concept for some of you but game characters usually get merch even when they're not coming to Smash

Although it is kinda weird when it's a character from a dead game

 

[Knight Dude]

I think Sword Bayonetta is more likely, but I'm personally holding out for God Duck Hunt.

That being said, if I could have anyone from Fighting Game Nintendo, it would be Feelings Mega Man.

I was gonna say Tall Mega Man. But Reploids having souls and **** works too. Although even OG Mega Man emotes, I guess Free Will Mega Man would make the most sense.

That said, "Sword Bayo" is gonna piss me off more than Hat Ken, cause you know some dumbass will use the term seriously.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I think Sword Bayonetta is more likely, but I'm personally holding out for God Duck Hunt.

That being said, if I could have anyone from Fighting Game Nintendo, it would be Feelings Mega Man.

ok but Psychic Cloud though???

 

[Eldrake]

How is Amaterasu "God Duck Hunt" if she doesn't have an avian partner? ;P

Eh, Issun is close enough to be her avian partner.

 

[P.Kat]

I know it might be an alien concept for some of you but game characters usually get merch even when they're not coming to Smash

To be fair, the sentence above the quote you have did acknowledge that I was reaching.

Also keep in mind that what I'm about to say may be a reach...

So it's not to say I delusionally believe Ammy is lock and key, but rather a character that shouldn't slept on.

Unless it's cold then by all means snuggle up with the Sun Doggo

 

[snowgolem]

(kind of foolishly, if you ask me)

What you’re not considering is the fact that not everybody cares about who’s one a fighter’s pass. Even if it’s somebody they don’t want or hate a lot, they would buy it anyway. Most people who’ve already bought it are doing it for a complete roster, not for a specific character. That’s why I and a few other I know are doing it, at least.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Eh, Issun is close enough to be her avian partner.

But he's not a bird now is he? ;D

 

[Eldrake]

But he's not a bird now is he? ;D

Still, close enough.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Random question: If you had to pick 3 playable characters and make them Assist Trophies instead, who would you pick? Substitute AT for Pokeball for the Pokemon if you pick one of them. And excluding Little Mac and Isabelle since they already were ATs and made the jump

Hmm...Squirtle, Ivysaur aaaaaand....Duck Hunt.

Yeah he has an completely original moveset but can you find a third party character that has a completely original moveset?

Pac-Man?

 

[blackghost]

That said I wouldn't mind Dante I just prefer Amaterasu or Phoenix Wright regarding another Capcom rep. Still be excited to see Dante if he's the on chosen given his weapons and abilities in his games that could be used in his moveset.

Amaterasu doesn't have valid claim to be the capcom rep. hoping for her is even more of a reach than people asking for geno to be the SE rep. Amatersasu is a very niche character. a game that a lot of people claim to recognize and love but the sales numbers dont support it. for capcom reps is phoenix vs dante.

 

[DarthEnderX]

All of this Dante/Phoenix/Amaterasu talk is hopeless in the face of Arthur!

 

[Knight Dude]

What you’re not considering is the fact that not everybody cares about who’s one a fighter’s pass. Even if it’s somebody they don’t want or hate a lot, they would buy it anyway. Most people who’ve already bought it are doing it for a complete roster, not for a specific character. That’s why I and a few other I know are doing it, at least.

Sure. But I still don't think it's a good idea to buy something if you don't a least a bit of an idea of what it's gonna be about. I get it's for completions sake, but when it gets into spending actual money, I think people should be more weary. Gotta get the bang for your buck and all that.

 

[KillerCage]

Random question: If you had to pick 3 playable characters and make them Assist Trophies instead, who would you pick? Substitute AT for Pokeball for the Pokemon if you pick one of them. And excluding Little Mac and Isabelle since they already were ATs and made the jump

And Dark Samus should be excluded as well since she was also an AT.

Anyway, I would pick Corrin, Bowser Jr., and Incineroar.

 

[blackghost]

Aside for most them having moves that originate from their games, they're all first party characters. Find a third party character that is like them.



Now I can understand the fear. Bayonetta was a new character in Smash 4 and she turned into the most overpowered character in Smash 4 and wasn't made to be complete garbage until Ultimate came around.

It could happen with Dante and the Smash team has made no effort to make big changes to really balance the roster but it should be fine. If he is that over centralising, I think they might do a little extra nerfing on him to make him more balanced... if the outcry is big enough and the balancing team cares enough to do anything about it which I'm sure they will care.

dante shouldn't inspire the same fears as bayonetta. dante doesn't combo in his games like Bayonetta does in hers. bayonetta at high levels of play even in her source games goes vertical. she spends more time in the air than on the ground and she moves erratically through the air. dante brings oponents up but he comes back down and he doesnt spend that much time in the air. they are very different characters also bayo would have been nerfed in 4 if ultimate wasnt the primary focus of the team at the end of smash 4.

 

[P.Kat]

hoping for her is even more of a reach than people asking for geno to be the SE rep.

I feel like that's a bit of an exaggeration. Regardless, Dante would be a pretty cool pick not gonna lie, I just prefer Amaterasu over him. My expectations are in check, but I'm not just gonna not root for a character I like. If we get her great, if not, life goes on, and so will DLC

 

[Bee Card]

All of this Dante/Phoenix/Amaterasu talk is hopeless in the face of Arthur!

Well said !

 

[snowgolem]

All of this Dante/Phoenix/Amaterasu talk is hopeless in the face of Arthur!

Bruh you’re kidding me right? Pakupaku Flower for smash bros

 

[Eldrake]

When it comes to the overconfidence of alleged insiders who were certain we would have a direct for 12/2, here's a quote I like.

Remind yourself that overconfidence is a slow and insidious killer - Darkest Dungeon, 2016.

Also, Darkest Dungeon spirit event/mii costume, when?

 

[Krankees]

I looked at some of the third party original moveset discussion comments. While I can't name a character with a full original moveset like some of the first parties, I can name recent characters that have had some liberties taken. I don't believe Joker can fly with Arsene, I've only played the Dragon Quest XI demo so I wouldn't truly know but can Hero really use that wind move to boost himself, and Terry didn't have a move that worked for an up air so Sakurai made one. Just wanted to add that to the discussion.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

When it comes to the overconfidence of alleged insiders who were certain we would have a direct for 12/2, here's a quote I like.

Remind yourself that overconfidence is a slow and insidious killer - Darkest Dungeon, 2016.

Also, Darkest Dungeon spirit event/mii costume, when?

AAAA! dude i would LOVE a Darkest Dungeon spirit event omg

 

[7NATOR]

I Saw Phoenix was getting Discussion So I will Chime in

Phoenix is Fine, but I think the TWO Big Probelms with him is that

1. It's not just that he doesn't have enough material, It's also that whatever material he had was used all the Way in UMVC3. You look at all the 3rd party characters that have been in Fighting games like Sonic, Snake, Cloud, Bayonetta, Simon, etc.They might take elements from Their fighting game apperance but they still have unique moves that come from their home franchise. In the case of Ryu, Ken, and Terry, the unique parts about them is how they translate their fighting game Mechanics to Smash

With Phoenix, I really don't see a way how he won't just be a Rehash of UMVC3. Compare him to Dante, who still has 3 Whole games worth of material to use (DMC1, DMC4, DMC5), along with adding in mechanics like Delay based combos, Style meter, the Style System, etc. Phoenix's series doesn't lend well to alot of material. It's why alot of stuff in UMVC3 had to be made up/exaggerated

2. There's another character that's Similiar in function to Phoenix; Professor Layton. Both come from puzzle games that have a Long stored history on Nintendo and Solve mysteries and don't really fight much. The thing is that Professor Layton comes from a Series that has sole more than Ace Attorney, Hasn't been in a Fighting game, so he is more fresh, has more material to supplement a moveset than Phoenix does, and Also has a Top Hat. In terms of Smash fanbase, Phoenix might be more consistent in popularity, but Professor Layton also does have a fanbase in the Smash Community and I believe was especially popular during Smash 4 era.

 

[SNEKeater]

Although it is kinda weird when it's a character from a dead game

Not really... it depends on the character/franchise, of course, but it's not really strange for a character to receive some merch.
Banjo had new merch the last 2-3 years I think? And so far no new game for B&K, and nope, Rare Replay doesn't really count when it's a compilation Microsoft made the previous gen.

 

[Curious Villager]

2. There's another character that's Similiar in function to Phoenix; Professor Layton. Both come from puzzle games that have a Long stored history on Nintendo and Solve mysteries and don't really fight much. The thing is that Professor Layton comes from a Series that has sole more than Ace Attorney, Hasn't been in a Fighting game, so he is more fresh, has more material to supplement a moveset than Phoenix does, and Also has a Top Hat. In terms of Smash fanbase, Phoenix might be more consistent in popularity, but Professor Layton also does have a fanbase in the Smash Community and I believe was especially popular during Smash 4 era.

Eh I don't think there is really that much of an overlap between the two other than the fact that they had a crossover with each other once, not to mention that the Ace Attorney series isn't really so much about puzzle solving as it is a visual novel. Whereas the Layton series takes a bit more of an inspiration from the Brain Age series and Sherloc Holmes in terms of puzzle solving and a more story driven narrative (His children probably take more inspirations from the AA series than Layton himself does I suppose)

Also Layton deals with homicidal maniac's in more or less every game, so he actually fights pretty often in his series.

 

[Deleted member]

All of this Dante/Phoenix/Amaterasu talk is hopeless in the face of Arthur!

cries in Morrigan

 

[SNEKeater]

Why people would want Ryu Hayabusa when you have Strider Hiryu, our true Capcom rep.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

Capcom sells merchandise of their dormant series all the time

They do this all the time with Darkstalkers

Just because a character from Captain Commando appeared on a new cover of CAPCOM's ULTIMATE ARTBOOK by Kinu Nishimura doesnt mean CC is coming back

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Why people would want Ryu Hayabusa when you have Strider Hiryu, our true Capcom rep.

Non-video game character. Strider Hiryu started off as an manga. Can't get in.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Non-video game character. Strider Hiryu started off as an manga. Can't get in.

Checkmate.

 

[Bee Card]

Why people would want Ryu Hayabusa when you have Strider Hiryu, our true Capcom rep.

Non-video game character. Strider Hiryu started off as an manga. Can't get in.

He's already in with greninja ^^

 

[AceAttorney9000]

I Saw Phoenix was getting Discussion So I will Chime in

Phoenix is Fine, but I think the TWO Big Probelms with him is that

1. It's not just that he doesn't have enough material, It's also that whatever material he had was used all the Way in UMVC3. You look at all the 3rd party characters that have been in Fighting games like Sonic, Snake, Cloud, Bayonetta, Simon, etc.They might take elements from Their fighting game apperance but they still have unique moves that come from their home franchise. In the case of Ryu, Ken, and Terry, the unique parts about them is how they translate their fighting game Mechanics to Smash

With Phoenix, I really don't see a way how he won't just be a Rehash of UMVC3. Compare him to Dante, who still has 3 Whole games worth of material to use (DMC1, DMC4, DMC5), along with adding in mechanics like Delay based combos, Style meter, the Style System, etc. Phoenix's series doesn't lend well to alot of material. It's why alot of stuff in UMVC3 had to be made up/exaggerated

2. There's another character that's Similiar in function to Phoenix; Professor Layton. Both come from puzzle games that have a Long stored history on Nintendo and Solve mysteries and don't really fight much. The thing is that Professor Layton comes from a Series that has sole more than Ace Attorney, Hasn't been in a Fighting game, so he is more fresh, has more material to supplement a moveset than Phoenix does, and Also has a Top Hat. In terms of Smash fanbase, Phoenix might be more consistent in popularity, but Professor Layton also does have a fanbase in the Smash Community and I believe was especially popular during Smash 4 era.

1. Again, I don't see the problem with Phoenix Wright in Smash taking some cues from his UMVC3 appearance. Sakurai and the Smash development team would likely want him to be mostly unique, yeah, and the Smash moveset would likely be very different. Still, considering Sakurai specifically named "the Versus Series" as the inspiration for one of Ken's Final Smashes, I doubt he has any problem with taking some inspiration from Phoenix Wright's UMVC3 appearance for a Smash moveset.
   • Also, if you're gonna bring up the amount of games a character has to draw from, UMVC3 was released back in 2011, during which there was only the original trilogy, Apollo Justice, and the first Ace Attorney Investigations. Since then, we've had a second Investigations game, Dual Destinies, Spirit of Justice, and the two Dai Gyakuten Saiban games (and since the Smash devs are fine with referencing non-game material with stuff like Mewtwo being based on his movie appearance and Cloud having an Advent Children costume, I'm also throwing in the Ace Attorney live action movie and anime adaptations). If Phoenix Wright were to get into Smash, the Ace Attorney series isn't lacking in material to draw from for a moveset.
2. I doubt Professor Layton would have any effect on Wright's chances. They're owned by separate third-party companies (Layton is owned by Level-5, Wright by Capcom), and their games aren't really in even the same genre (Layton is a puzzle game series, Wright is a visual novel series). I don't even know why you thought Layton specifically would even be a problem at all for Wright's chances. You might as well say that Dante isn't getting in because the game already has Bayonetta.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

Why people would want Ryu Hayabusa when you have Strider Hiryu, our true Capcom rep.

Why have Ryu and Strider when you can have all the Oboro Clan Ninja's from Shinobi as alts

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Non-video game character. Strider Hiryu started off as an manga. Can't get in.

That being said, Capcom still has a joint ownership of Strider Hiryu, and has made multiple appearances in countless other Capcom games with no real issue

I'd say he's kind of in a R.O.B / Segata Sanshiro situation

 

[Lamperouge]

Allow me to toss my hat in the ring:
What can be better than a pizza loving, sword wielding, gun tooting Demon Hunter...

A food loving, sword wielding, high speed bead shooting goddess/Mother to all/Demon Hunter.

If we're talking movesets, Ammy has that in spades, as well as a weapon stance system. Not only that but both Ammy and Dante have style, but out of the two Ammy's the only one with grace.

Don't tell me seeing a trail of flowers and leaves everywhere Ammy goes wouldn't be graceful (let alone her moves), and we still have the fact she can draw anything into existence, the moveset potential is crazy.

Also whether Ammy or Dante makes in, all Sakurai needs to do is base the weapon stance quirk off of Pokemon Trainer. Instead of switching characters you just switch weapons but I'm probably oversimplifing it and maybe it's easier said than done.

Also keep in mind that what I'm about to say may be a reach...

Spoiler

View attachment 261922

But Banjo and Kazooie received new merch before being announced for Smash. Well new merch for Ammy is on the way...

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20...vine_descent_resin_statue_pre-orders_now_live

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20...d_nendoroid_and_figma_at_wonder_festival_2020

So that would mean good things for her in term of relevancy.

This means absolutely nothing for her chances in Smash but damn if I don't need that Ammy right now.

 

[Krankees]

Why have Ryu and Strider when you can have all the Oboro Clan Ninja's from Shinobi as alts
View attachment 261944

I only recognize one and that's from Project X Zone 2 which was the game where he partnered with Strider.

 

[mynameisBlade]

I want Ryu Hayabusa so WHEN we also get Master Chief we can recreate this fight.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

So, another week, another week with no Direct?

 

[Megadoomer]

You're an idiot if you think Dante is Sword Bayonetta, So... shut up.

I'm assuming that it was meant more like Bayonetta's combo potential with the added range of a sword, as opposed to literally thinking that Dante would play the same as Bayonetta but with a sword.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

So, another week, another week with no Direct?

We still have tomorrow.

 

[PLATINUM7]

I want Ryu Hayabusa so WHEN we also get Master Chief we can recreate this fight.

View attachment 261950

But that's not actually Master Chief.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

I only recognize one and that's from Project X Zone 2 which was the game where he partnered with Strider.

Thats Hotsuma

Middle is Jiro Musashi (Joe's father), bottom middle is Hayate Musashi(Joe's Son), bottom right is Joe Musashi the Main Character of the series.

Hotsuma is the protag of the PS2 Shinobi games, the Girl on the left is Hibana who's a distant relative of Hotsuma. Its Unkown where the PS2 games take place in the timeline but you can assume That Hibana and Hotsuma are Joe's Descendants.