Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Evil Trapezium]

And what if you lose?
Pay another 6 bucks and try again?

Uh sure, why not? I think that'd be pretty hilarious in a bad way.

Just imagine Geno finally being playable but he becomes a near impossible to beat CPU! People will keep paying the money to try again but still praise Sakurai like this was the best idea ever.

 

[NoOtherPersona]

And what if you lose?
Pay another 6 bucks and try again?

The game resets all your data and you have to buy everything again

 

[3BitSaurus]

On the Chief/Steve thing, I wanted to give my two cents since I don't think anyone said this yet:

From the "icon" standpoint, Minecraft is bigger than Halo, but when it comes to Steve and Chief, there's a big difference as to why. As far as I understand it, the appeal of having Steve in Smash isn't "oh, cool, Steve is in Smash", it's "oh, cool, Minecraft is in Smash". Meanwhile Chief's is basically the same as Mario showing up on Xbox - the poster boy of a rival company, a memorable character in his own right, being introduced to a mascot fighter.

So basically, both would make waves, but for different reasons. Chief would make waves because he's Chief, Steve would make waves because he's from Minecraft. That's the difference in my eyes. I also second the anecdotal experience of not knowing Steve even had a name until very recently, despite seeing his face plastered around in merch.

That said, none of this affects whether or not they'd be fun to play and would affect their chances very little, if at all. So... yeah.

 

[Deleted member]

Uh sure, why not? I think that'd be pretty hilarious in a bad way.

Just imagine Geno finally being playable but he becomes a near impossible to beat CPU! People will keep paying the money to try again but still praise Sakurai like this was the best idea ever.

Eh, at least I could get used to the matchup or it's an indication that the character is unbalanced lmao. I'll just lab 'em and...

say that to the people genuinely complaining about Leroy Smith in Tekken 7

 

[Extremmefan]

And what if you lose?
Pay another 6 bucks and try again?

I like to think that if you lose, then the fight is just always available for a rematch (the same way as if you missed a base game unlockable, except they're available immediately and all the time until finally defeated, because you already spent money on them)
That way it solves the issue of having paid for it but still makes it more like a traditional unlock.

 

[Deleted member]

On the Chief/Steve thing, I wanted to give my two cents since I don't think anyone said this yet:

From the "icon" standpoint, Minecraft is bigger than Halo, but when it comes to Steve and Chief, there's a big difference as to why. As far as I understand it, the appeal of having Steve in Smash isn't "oh, cool, Steve is in Smash", it's "oh, cool, Minecraft is in Smash". Meanwhile Chief's is basically the same as Mario showing up on Xbox - the poster boy of a rival company, a memorable character in his own right, being introduced to a mascot fighter.

So basically, both would make waves, but for different reasons. Chief would make waves because he's Chief, Steve would make waves because he's from Minecraft. That's the difference in my eyes. I also second the anecdotal experience of not knowing Steve even had a name until very recently, despite seeing his face plastered around in merch.

That said, none of this affects whether or not they'd be fun to play and would affect their chances very little, if at all. So... yeah.

To give my two cents on the subject...I'd say that both of them are impactful BUT it is up to the developers to decide who will be the one. If one want to garner hype from a "longtime gamer" standpoint, go for Chief. If you want to appeal to a more casual audience yet not lose sight of the longtimes, go for Steve. It's a good 50-50.

 

[Faso115]

And what if you lose?
Pay another 6 bucks and try again?

Dont give the AAA industry more ideas

 

[Deleted member]

Dont give the AAA industry more ideas

Unless someone reading this thread or board is an employee at EA..

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I do think it’s worth discussing the difference between characters being more known for the game they come from, or the character themselves.

I think Steve and Master Chief would have interesting reactions, but at different levels. While I do agree that Steve would generate a reaction, people don’t play Minecraft for the same reasons they play Halo. They’re not nearly as invested in the character Steve itself, they’re invested in building things and creating their own world.

With Master Chief there’s a story that comes with him. Lore. A world built around him. There’s an investment in the story for the character, but Halo and Master Chief don’t have that same “worldwide” impact that Minecraft does. There is a distinction between character and video game though.

I think both are definite “icons” of the industry, just in different ways and for different reasons.

I haven’t played Minecraft, and I frankly just don’t know how well Steve’s model would transition to Ultimate. I would very much prefer Master Chief, largely for my nostalgia of playing the original trilogy.

That said, I don’t actually expect either character. If I’m wrong, cool.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

So given the recent announcement for why and how Banjo got into Smash. Does this increase Master Chief's and Steve's chances likelier for the game?

 

[zeldasmash]

So given the recent announcement for why and how Banjo got into Smash. Does this increase Master Chief's and Steve's chances likelier for the game?

What recent announcement? What be happenin'?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

What recent announcement? What be happenin'?

Rare explained why and how Banjo got into Smash. Minecraft being ported onto the Switch played a crucial part.

 

[Herocin]

Rare explained why and how Banjo got into Smash. Minecraft being ported onto the Switch played a crucial part.

I confused Minecraft for Microsoft. Anyway it boosts Steve’s chances more than Chiefs tbh but I don’t expect Steve or Chief

 

[ZenythSmash]

Hey so

Elma/Fiora/Black Shadow/Octoling intensifies

holy **** does Classic Ganon own a chance now??

 

[Deleted member]

I confused Minecraft for Microsoft. Anyway it boosts Steve’s chances more than Chiefs tbh but I don’t expect Steve or Chief

That was rare talking about it. Not sakurai or Microsoft

also this doesn’t increase ether Steve or chiefs chances

 

[ZeldaPlayer87]

I don’t know. Minecraft doesn’t exactly have the best music. It’s all serene or slow; not really good for Smash, in my opinion.

I think if ATs were to be promoted, it would be something post pass, like do it Fighter Ballot style or voting where you pick who you want to see as a character and the Top *2* will become player, and then 2 more ATs will be added to take their place.

 

[ZeldaPlayer87]

Delete this.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Just so that I say it on the record, but don’t actually want to have a full blown discussion of it: I think people are putting a little too much faith in the Spirit names changing. That doesn’t actually move the needle all that much when the “they can’t rename spirits” was a terrible argument in the first place.

At least to me, the guy people probably mostly associate spirit arguments with, I thought that was a terrible argument.
—
Currently watching my fiancé play Ring Fit Adventure, and honestly? The Ring Fit Hero would probably be super cool in Smash, and play ideally nothing like Wii Fit Trainer.

The exercises work like projectiles. The ring itself sucks in items with a whirlwind type of thing while running, which could work as a grab. Part of combat is defending with “Ab Guard” which could be used as a sort of “counter” I guess.

Not my first choice, but I think it could definitely be a cool character concept.

 

[Herocin]

That was rare talking about it. Not sakurai or Microsoft

also this doesn’t increase ether Steve or chiefs chances

I feel like you are saying it doesn’t increase Steve’s chances just because you know it doesn’t really increase chiefs chances. And I’m fully aware that Rare was the ones discussing it. I just misread the first word Minecraft for Microsoft.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

After the Fire Emblem music we got with Byleth, I can only hope we continue to get characters that can bring excellent soundtracks with them.

Though, I suppose Joker did as well. Hero would have been amazing if they weren’t MIDI. Banjo is great...and uh, 55 songs from Terry?

I guess we did pretty good with music.

Joker getting better music treatment than Sonic and Bayonetta to run ****
Hero being...lackluster
Banjo with the good country music
Psycho Soldier
Three Houses owning ****
****ing Sans and Cuphead

music has been on a roll

 

[CapitaineCrash]

I don’t know. Minecraft doesn’t exactly have the best music. It’s all serene or slow; not really good for Smash, in my opinion.

The same thing could be said about Animal crossing and most of Wii fit music. The Smash team could do some good remixes, I don't think they would stop adding Steve because of music problem.

 

[Simnm]

That was rare talking about it. Not sakurai or Microsoft

also this doesn’t increase ether Steve or chiefs chances

I still think this somewhat boosts steves chances as it shows that minecraft played a big part in banjo being in smash

I do think it’s worth discussing the difference between characters being more known for the game they come from, or the character themselves.

I think Steve and Master Chief would have interesting reactions, but at different levels. While I do agree that Steve would generate a reaction, people don’t play Minecraft for the same reasons they play Halo. They’re not nearly as invested in the character Steve itself, they’re invested in building things and creating their own world.

With Master Chief there’s a story that comes with him. Lore. A world built around him. There’s an investment in the story for the character, but Halo and Master Chief don’t have that same “worldwide” impact that Minecraft does. There is a distinction between character and video game though.

I think both are definite “icons” of the industry, just in different ways and for different reasons.

I haven’t played Minecraft, and I frankly just don’t know how well Steve’s model would transition to Ultimate. I would very much prefer Master Chief, largely for my nostalgia of playing the original trilogy.

That said, I don’t actually expect either character. If I’m wrong, cool.

Well there is this video that shows how steve would work in smash

 

[Deleted member]

I feel like you are saying it doesn’t increase Steve’s chances just because you know it doesn’t really increase chiefs chances. And I’m fully aware that Rare was the ones discussing it. I just misread the first word Minecraft for Microsoft.

I know that I’m just saying it doesn’t increase both and they’re just sharing what made banjo likely.

 

[Herocin]

I know that I’m just saying it doesn’t increase both and they’re just sharing what made banjo likely.

I wouldn’t really say that it made Banjo likely. The people at Rare aren’t a tonne of trigger happy smash speculators who look at what goes in a Character’s favour and label them likely. Pave the way generally means just to abide by a checklist so something can happen. This is more of a nitpick though

 

[Garteam]

Let's be real, everyone thought Dragon Quest's music would get the Final Fantasy treatment during the time between the Erdrick rumours and E3. Getting 8 tracks is still really impressive, even if they are crusty midis from Sugiyama's basement.

Speaking of which, do we have a concrete reason why Final Fantasy got no new content in Smash Ultimate yet?

 

[NoOtherPersona]

After the Fire Emblem music we got with Byleth, I can only hope we continue to get characters that can bring excellent soundtracks with them.

Though, I suppose Joker did as well. Hero would have been amazing if they weren’t MIDI. Banjo is great...and uh, 55 songs from Terry?

I guess we did pretty good with music.

honestly with hero i feel happy we got more then two

 

[Diddy Kong]

Honestly after Byleth's reveal, I don't even know what to expect for newcomers anymore. Byleth was the ONE pick I was 100% confident in. Right now? No other character really seems to stand out to me.

 

[Invisible Shiny Bulbasaur]

What recent announcement? What be happenin'?

Here's an article with relevant excerpts from the interview in question.

Some highlights:
"Minecraft had paved the way for that relationship between Nintendo and Microsoft. I met with Nintendo at the E3 before we announced it. And then we connected our teams, because we thought it seemed like a great opportunity."

"We had an initial kick off call with Sakurai-san and some of his team. There was myself, Gregg Mayles... who is the father of Banjo, even though he hates it when we call him that. Andrew Wensley, who runs our business team. And a chap called Paul Cunningham, who runs our partnerships. Those people had a conversation, [Nintendo] talked through what their approach would be, and then that process started."

 

[Garteam]

Honestly after Byleth's reveal, I don't even know what to expect for newcomers anymore. Byleth was the ONE pick I was 100% confident in. Right now? No other character really seems to stand out to me.

This is something that I really agree with. It feels like there's no 100% sure option right now. Even characters who have a lot going for them have at least some blockade in their way.

-Crash has to deal with a language barrier and an owner that could be potentially difficult to work with.
-Same deal with Sora.
-Heihachi, Lloyd, and KOS-MOS have to compete with each other (assuming we only get one character per company). Likewise, Heihachi may also be competing with other FG characters if there's only one in the pass.
-Same deal with the Capcom Class (Dante, Amaterasu, Phoenix Wright), the Microsoft Militia (Master Chief, Steve), and the Square Squad (Geno, 2B, and possibly Sora).
-Doom Marine doesn't seem to have an NDA up, so he's out.
-Gen 8 Pokemon have that spirit event, which may or may not deconfirm them.
-Ring Fit Trainer is from a very new series, when Sakurai has traditionally been unwilling to add "unproven" IPs to Smash.
-Ayumi may still be Japan-locked, if the Famicom Detective Club remake doesn't get localized.
-Legacy Nintendo characters are potentially spirit-locked and have to deal with a precedent that has yet to include them.

Now, that's not to say any of this is a deal braker (with the exception of Doom Marine, that seems to be a pretty hard blow.), but it makes it difficult to put all my money on any one character.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

This is something that I really agree with. It feels like there's no 100% sure option right now. Even characters who have a lot going for them have at least some blockade in their way.

-Crash has to deal with a language barrier and an owner that could be potentially difficult to work with.
-Same deal with Sora.
-Heihachi, Lloyd, and KOS-MOS have to compete with each other (assuming we only get one character per company). Likewise, Heihachi may also be competing with other FG characters if there's only one in the pass.
-Same deal with the Capcom Class (Dante, Amaterasu, Phoenix Wright), the Microsoft Militia (Master Chief, Steve), and the Square Squad (Geno, 2B, and possibly Sora).
-Doom Marine doesn't seem to have an NDA up, so he's out.
-Gen 8 Pokemon have that spirit event, which may or may not deconfirm them.
-Ring Fit Trainer is from a very new series, when Sakurai has traditionally been unwilling to add "unproven" IPs to Smash.
-Ayumi may still be Japan-locked, if the Famicom Detective Club remake doesn't get localized.
-Legacy Nintendo characters are potentially spirit-locked and have to deal with a precedent that has yet to include them.

Now, that's not to say any of this is a deal braker (with the exception of Doom Marine, that seems to be a pretty hard blow.), but it makes it difficult to put all my money on any one character.

While we’re on Japan-locked: Lip is also this, as Panel de Pon was always localized as Yoshi’s Cookie (first game) or Puzzle League (future games) and they remove all references to Lip and the other fairies, giving the games a Yoshi/Pokémon themed coat of paint. Lucas only made it to Smash because Sakurai was sure Mother 3 would be localized at the time.

Even if Lip wasn’t Japan locked, she has one major competitor for a Puzzle game character who’s probably more likely: Arle from Puyo

 

[NoOtherPersona]

I hope we get 2 assist upgrades one being Issac and the other being Alucard Issac because at this point he and his franchise deserves it and Alucard because of so much potential

 

[waddledeeonredyoshi]

Made my prediction/wish list into a presntable image form. Took me a few hours to download and learn Gimp for this but I'm happy with how it turned out.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I hope we get 2 assist upgrades one being Issac and the other being Alucard Issac because at this point he and his franchise deserves it and Alucard because of so much potential

Alucard doesn’t have a reflection though; his AT won’t appear on the Wii Fit stage. How will his playable version handle that...?

I think if we get two AT promos it’s Isaac and Spring Man; as Sakurai apologized for not being able to make the latter playable as well. I feel like Sakurai might keep Waluigi as an AT as Waluigi being the “Loser” is kind of a running gag in Smash at this point

 

[Guynamednelson]

Speaking of which, do we have a concrete reason why Final Fantasy got no new content in Smash Ultimate yet?

Wasn't it having to simultaneously acquire licenses for the 3DS, Wii U, and Switch games?

Alucard doesn’t have a reflection though; his AT won’t appear on the Wii Fit stage. How will his playable version handle that...?

If he was playable, I think they'd go the extra mile of ensuring the mirror can't render him.

 

[NoOtherPersona]

Alucard doesn’t have a reflection though; his AT won’t appear on the Wii Fit stage. How will his playable version handle that...?

I think if we get two AT promos it’s Isaac and Spring Man; as Sakurai apologized for not being able to make the latter playable as well. I feel like Sakurai might keep Waluigi as an AT as Waluigi being the “Loser” is kind of a running gag in Smash at this point

honestly they could figure it out haha

 

[SirCamp]

I think you answered your own question. You don't recognize a character all that easily if you briefly saw the design. But there's some context lacking here. For that matter, when did you play it? When it just came out? Did you play it for a few days and that was it?

Keep in mind that Halo came out way before Minecraft(8 year difference). So your exposure is likely the cause of it. Not the general recognizability. Nowadays Steve is way more out there in merchandise, worldwide.

If you want more anecdotal factors. a lot of non-gamers can easily recognize Steve but not Chief. It's cause one is specifically on all the boxes with a specific face while the other can be confused with multiple similar character designs and doesn't have as unique of a factor. While Minecraft has a ton of skins, they are only the same bodyshape. They're actually a lot more distinct. Master Chief looks very similar to your general suit in Halo, with the biggest thing being a specific color. Another thing is only one has a literal face.

I... didn’t have a question. It was simply an anecdote. My overall point was simply that assumptions about who is more iconic, or rather recognizable if you prefer, is context based and your assumptions about that won’t hold up for everyone.

The context that I played Minecraft in though was on a friends server at a LAN party. I don’t own the game and have only played it on a couple occasions, mostly just plopping in and running about doing whatever for a while. And this was 3 years ago maybe? Not entirely sure tbh.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Waluigi as an AT as Waluigi being the “Loser” is kind of a running gag in Smash at this point

That's what I keep saying too. Keeping him as such represents his loser status and that's what makes him Waluigi.

That and I'll miss the fun fanart that involves around it.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Alucard doesn’t have a reflection though; his AT won’t appear on the Wii Fit stage. How will his playable version handle that...?

I think if we get two AT promos it’s Isaac and Spring Man; as Sakurai apologized for not being able to make the latter playable as well. I feel like Sakurai might keep Waluigi as an AT as Waluigi being the “Loser” is kind of a running gag in Smash at this point

I hope he never gets promoted if it means he’ll forever be memed to death as a loser

 

[Flyboy]

Made my prediction/wish list into a presntable image form. Took me a few hours to download and learn Gimp for this but I'm happy with how it turned out.

Edit: Well hopefully it won't be broken tomorrow

Hey, this is neat!

The Knight is a really interesting character to me. I think he's definitely going to be the next premium Mii costume, but I also feel like with Nintendo's working relationship with Team Cherry he's not an impossibility.

Obviously I'm biased as Travis and Arle are two of my most-wanted but this is a fun pass.

 

[Pinguino21v]

So here's a new game. Pick your 6 predicted characters, but give 4 of them an echo to make a perfect 10.

- Sora (+ Roxas)
- Steve (+ Alex)
- Isaac (+ Felix)
- Phoenix (+ Edgeworth)
- Travis
- Elma