Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Evil Trapezium]

"But guys! What if Sakurai is showing Waluigi as an assist trophy now to play mind games with us so he'll reveal him to be playable later? I mean he was the only one who was shown to be KO'd! I bet next direct will show Waluigi breaking out of his assist trophy guys!"

 

[Extremmefan]

"But guys! What if Sakurai is showing Waluigi as an assist trophy now to play mind games with us so he'll reveal him to be playable later? I mean he was the only one who was shown to be KO'd! I bet next direct will show Waluigi breaking out of his assist trophies guys!"

I have never seen anyone say that, ever, but I wouldn't be surprised if someone out there did.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

So here's a new game. Pick your 6 predicted characters, but give 4 of them an echo to make a perfect 10.

My Fighter's Pass

Lloyd Irving(Tales)
Dante(Devil May Cry)
Sol Badguy(Guilty Gear)
Ryu Hayabusa(Ninja Gaiden)
2B(Nier)
Death(Darksiders)

Echoes

Cless Alvane(Lloyd)
Nero(Dante)
Kasumi(Ryu)
A2(2B)

I would have used Kasumi from P5 Royal as a Joker echo but you said second pass only so

1. Elma (Mecha-Fiora echo)
2. KOS-MOS (T-elos echo)
3. Neku
4. Ryu Hayabusa (Momiji echo)
5. Octoling (NOT AN ECHO. Inkling Semi-clone)
6. Arle Nadja (Amitie echo)

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

Made my prediction/wish list into a presntable image form. Took me a few hours to download and learn Gimp for this but I'm happy with how it turned out.

Hey, another nightmare fan!

also Hollow Knight is my indie character of choice

 

[NoOtherPersona]

I have never seen anyone say that, ever, but I wouldn't be surprised if someone out there did.

this is a thing that has been said alot

 

[CapitaineCrash]

I have never seen anyone say that, ever, but I wouldn't be surprised if someone out there did.

I can confirm I have see that many times on discord and on Jeuvideo.com (french video game board).

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

There's no "name" to focus on. Steve is well-known for his face and design. Not the name. Of course some won't recognize the name. Show them the actual design, and that's very easy for most to recognize.

Chief is known for the name and actions, and he doesn't clearly have an actual direct face to go with. You need to be engaged to the story to realize the differences between him and others. The general Halo spartan design is easy to recognize in that case.

They're different situations. Steve is a Link situation. You can easily recognize the design. But due to being treated like an avatar at first with no core name heavily said(since you could change it), and the name not even being on the title, it got lots of confusion. This changed when they had a lot more dialogue in-game so it's more in-your-face.

 

[Guynamednelson]

5. Octoling

smh rie

this means Octoling is Challenger Pack 10, not 8.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I remember Sakurai saying a character should be fun to play for them to be considered.

Popularity aside, do people genuinely think Steve will be fun and appealing to play as?

That's the real question here.

I've never played Minecraft but I've heard of it. I don't see the appeal of an ugly blocky character, and am underwhelmed at what his moveset could be (probably mix of G&W and Villager tbh).

That's just the perspective of someone who knows squat about the game though.

What do the fans of the game and character see from him gameplay wise?

Because there's too much talk about "iconic" but not enough about what he'd be like to play as in Smash.

I can imagine him definitely being fun:

Spoiler

Entrance animation: *pops into existence with a surprised/spooked look on his face* “Steve joined the battle!”

Neutral B - Build - Steve could select + place certain blocks, which would be limited in amount he can have and place, the damage they can take, and the time they stay on stage. When he runs out, he can get more by attacking opponents.

Up B - Ender Pearl - Steve can throw an ender pearl upwards/at an angle. Wherever the ender pearl lands, he’ll teleport there. He can also teleport to the ledge of the stage if he can, and directly to opponents if the ender pearl hits them.

Side B - Minecart or Elytra Rocket - two ideas. Minecart would send Steve flying forwards in...uh...the minecart. He can’t jump with the cart, and turning around will kick him out and send the cart flying a bit forwards. He can ride offstage, and jump out whenever he wants; a powered rail is spawned under the cart wherever Steve uses it, as an aesthetic feature that’s just the reason why the cart gets launched.

Elytra Rocket would be similar to Charizard’s side-B; Steve puts on a pair of elytra (wings), and readies a firework, launching himself sideways and he’ll spin while in motion, damaging opponents and launching them upwards with the spin. If the thumbstick is held sideways, he’ll stop spinning after a moment and glide downward, but he can’t fly back up; he can slow his descent if you move the thumbstick upwards, however, by facing up and kicking his legs, his elytra still spread out, but doing this hurts his horizontal speed. He’ll automatically stop using it after a couple of seconds, but you can jump out of it before then; at the end, though, he’ll be put into freefall (maybe? I don’t know, maybe it’d be fine without freefall).

Down B - Craft - Steve takes out a crafting table, and can use resources he can get from attacking opponents to craft better gear. He can give himself armor, or better tools for some of his moves. The upgrades would be temporary, disappearing after some uses / hits taken. He can also bring out a brewing stand or enchanting table, letting him make potions/splash potions or further boost his gear. Basically, he starts out a bit weaker than other fighters, and this helps him grow stronger. When he brings out one of these blocks, he’ll throw it on the ground to deal damage to anyone around him, and can deal damage while crafting by quickly moving his arms around.

Final Smash - Withering End - Steve summons an End Portal in front of him, and opponents hit will teleport to the End. He will then quickly summon the Wither next to the opponents, which will create an explosion after a short moment and blast the opponents with Wither skulls. The Ender Dragon will then fly down after shooting a “fire”ball (it’s actually purple and creates a purple AoE cloud that deals damage), breathe its purple, damaging breath on the opponents and finally fly into them, sending them flying back out of the portal.

Steve’s normal attacks could use many different items/blocks from Minecraft. His sidesmash could be a heavy pickaxe swing downwards, which could spike opponents; his side-tilt could be a sweep with a hoe or maybe opening/shutting a chest (could absorb projectiles while open). His down-air could be dropping primed TNT or an anvil...and there’s plenty of other stuff he could use, such as a bow, a crossbow, a trident, potions, splash potions, lingering potions, swords, axes, shovels, pistons (I think pistons could be used in throws), spawn eggs (could summon different mobs), slime blocks, honey blocks, and other stuff.

I do think it’s worth discussing the difference between characters being more known for the game they come from, or the character themselves.

I think Steve and Master Chief would have interesting reactions, but at different levels. While I do agree that Steve would generate a reaction, people don’t play Minecraft for the same reasons they play Halo. They’re not nearly as invested in the character Steve itself, they’re invested in building things and creating their own world.

With Master Chief there’s a story that comes with him. Lore. A world built around him. There’s an investment in the story for the character, but Halo and Master Chief don’t have that same “worldwide” impact that Minecraft does. There is a distinction between character and video game though.

I think both are definite “icons” of the industry, just in different ways and for different reasons.

I haven’t played Minecraft, and I frankly just don’t know how well Steve’s model would transition to Ultimate. I would very much prefer Master Chief, largely for my nostalgia of playing the original trilogy.

That said, I don’t actually expect either character. If I’m wrong, cool.

I still think fans would love Steve, though you’re right in a way, as people love him mainly because he’s the face of their favorite game; he and Alex only have a little bit of personality, which isn’t exactly made clear unless you’re a big Minecraft fan and look at all the different official info and art and whatever else, but people still love them / have grown at least somewhat attached to them because of the game, and there’s lots of fan art and builds featuring them/completely revolving around them. There’s even a fan-animated series about them. There are Minecraft fans who don’t care, but many still do.

Regarding his model, I think he’d translate fine. He even looks good in Smash 4 (that mod that replaces Link with him), although he doesn’t stay true to Minecraft’s style due to the extra joints and stuff. Official animations also show Minecraft characters and mobs emoting perfectly while sticking to the style and looking good, at least imo;

Spoiler

There’s also these two videos fans made for how his animations could look in Smash, one having 175k likes:

Spoiler

Some people easily wouldn’t know his name unless they actively look at stuff from Mojang or fans online, so that’s understandable. Unless you’re playing Bedrock Edition or the old console editions, which have his name on his skins (same for Alex, who is also mentioned in a loading screen message, comparing her hair to Jeb’s), he’s never mentioned. Mojang still recognizes him, though; the official instagram especially, using him and Alex in lots of artwork and talking about what they’re doing.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Let's be real, everyone thought Dragon Quest's music would get the Final Fantasy treatment during the time between the Erdrick rumours and E3. Getting 8 tracks is still really impressive, even if they are crusty midis from Sugiyama's basement.

Actually, DQ DID get the FF treatment. Each character only got 2 songs. It's just that Hero was 4 characters, so there were 8 songs.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

After getting Banjo. I'm all down for Steve's inclusion.

Him or Master Chief. I'm really down for. Be actually nice if we got both.

That or

1. Steve and(Master Chief)

or

2. Master Chief and(Steve)

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

After getting Banjo. I'm all down for Steve's inclusion.

Him or Master Chief. I'm really down for. Be actually nice if we got both.

That or

1. Steve and(Master Chief)

or

2. Master Chief and(Steve)

If we're only getting a costume and Spirit, I'd put Chief as the Gunner costume(since I agree Steve doesn't work well on a Mii model) and Steve as one of many Minecraft spirits. Of course Steve would be a Legend spirit. I'd go into more details if I understood how well they worked. Item gravitation otherwise works as an ability.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

smh rie

this means Octoling is Challenger Pack 10, not 8.

Dammit I totally overlooked the placement

 

[TheCJBrine]

I don’t know. Minecraft doesn’t exactly have the best music. It’s all serene or slow; not really good for Smash, in my opinion.

Some of Minecraft’s music could fit battle, such as Aria Math or Blind Spots (at least, I think they could fit a bit). There’s also battle music, which the console editions used in minigames. Even the main themes/the other calm music in the main game could get remixes, just like Pikmin and Animal Crossing, and here’s a couple of fan examples:

Spoiler

I also have an idea for a Minecraft Smash remix, which would mostly be the theme titled “Minecraft” but also feature motifs from a few others; I don’t have Kontakt, though, and haven’t found the instruments/sounds I’m looking for...I guess something is better than nothing, though...

We definitely need this, though:

 

[ArkSPiTFirE]

So here's a new game. Pick your 6 predicted characters, but give 4 of them an echo to make a perfect 10.

Isaac (+ Felix)
Phoenix Wright (+ Edgeworth)
Shantae (+ Risky Boots -at least if it's the Pirate's Curse moveset-)
Heihachi (+ Jin)
Geno
Crash

That was tricky actually.

 

[StarBot]

I have never seen anyone say that, ever, but I wouldn't be surprised if someone out there did.

I keep seeing LaxChris saying that exact same **** everytime he brings up Waluigi

 

[Slime Master]

On the Steve vs. MC debate: I don't know that saying chief himself is more iconic than Steve himself is a very strong argument in chief's favor; we got Hero so he could rep DQ as a series better, but we could have gotten a slime as the more iconic character. Steve being chosen just to rep a game has some precedence.

 

[Will]

2019: steve vs banjo
2020: steve vs master chief
2021: steve vs that guy from gears of war

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Guys guys guys

what if Octoling was instead FP6? Yeah they’re not FP8 but they come with version 8.0.0 so it’s still valid

ALSO opening the pass on a Spirit Promotion (Octoling Girl & Octoling Boy) thus officially yeeting out the Spirits Deconfirm argument once and for all

I for one welcome our new Veemo overlords

 

[Will]

what if Octoling was instead FP6? Yeah they’re not FP8 but they come with version 8.0.0 so it’s still valid

what kind of arbitrary quota of numbers that totally make sense so its totally happening are we going on about this time

 

[CapitaineCrash]

2019: steve vs banjo
2020: steve vs master chief
2021: steve vs that guy from gears of war

2022: Steve vs The hero of Oakvale (Fable)
2023: Steve vs The agent from Crackdown

But joke aside, if Steve isn't playable I really have the feeling that he's going to get disconfirmed, either by a mii or a spirit event.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

Guys guys guys

what if Octoling was instead FP6? Yeah they’re not FP8 but they come with version 8.0.0 so it’s still valid

ALSO opening the pass on a Spirit Promotion (Octoling Girl & Octoling Boy) thus officially yeeting out the Spirits Deconfirm argument once and for all

I for one welcome our new Veemo overlords

But 8.0.0 is like saying BOO!

That can only mean that we'll get spooky octolings and we'd have to wait until October for that to make sense. :^(

 

[Deleted member]

since I agree Steve doesn't work well on a Mii model

He may not work well as a mii model

but he can work well just being a mii headpiece. for example the Xbox avatars:
images aren’t working but I’ll post the example later

2019: steve vs banjo
2020: steve vs master chief
2021: steve vs that guy from gears of war

I knew this was gonna happen.

 

[Will]

2022: Steve vs The hero of Oakvale (Fable)
2023: Steve vs The agent from Crackdown

2025: Steve vs Voodoo Vince

 

[Guynamednelson]

2025: Steve vs Voodoo Vince

2026: Steve vs. the priest from Age of Empires

 

[Will]

2026: Steve vs. the priest from Age of Empires

2027: Steve VS Clippy

 

[waddledeeonredyoshi]

2019: steve vs banjo
2020: steve vs master chief
2021: steve vs that guy from gears of war

2022: steve vs blinx
2023: steve vs forza car
2024: steve vs voodoo vince

 

[Guynamednelson]

2027: Steve VS Clippy

2028: Steve vs. SkiFree monster

 

[Deleted member]

2027: Steve VS Clippy

2028: Steve vs the battletoads

 

[GoodGrief741]

2028: Steve vs the battletoads

The implication that it took us 8 years to consider the Battletoads as viable candidates is horrifying.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

He may not work well as a mii model

but he can work well just being a mii headpiece. for example the Xbox avatars:
images aren’t working but I’ll post the example later

Fair. ...Makes sense too, considering the majorly recognizable face. But I doubt we'd get anything less than a Deluxe costume for Steve anyway. Franchise is the biggest in the world. Doubt it'll get little content if it gets any(though as I said, MInecraft I predict is guaranteed for content in general. Of course, doesn't mean I'm right, either. But it's easy to have confidence in one of the biggest games in the world making it into Smash in some way. I also feel a Spirit Board works way better if playable isn't on the table. Too much notable content. And as noted, Chief would fit better as a Gunner if you really need a MS-owned costume).

 

[Knight Dude]

None of you guys mentioned the people's champ? 2020 is the year of Chief vs Steve vs Fulgore.

 

[Megadoomer]

2028: Steve vs the battletoads

2029: Steve vs. Raz from Psychonauts

...still a little annoyed by Microsoft buying out Double Fine. Hopefully DF doesn't have the same fate as Rare.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

2019: steve vs banjo
2020: steve vs master chief
2021: steve vs that guy from gears of war

so...Steve will always lose

 

[Renmazuo]

Here's an article with relevant excerpts from the interview in question.

Some highlights:
"Minecraft had paved the way for that relationship between Nintendo and Microsoft. I met with Nintendo at the E3 before we announced it. And then we connected our teams, because we thought it seemed like a great opportunity."

"We had an initial kick off call with Sakurai-san and some of his team. There was myself, Gregg Mayles... who is the father of Banjo, even though he hates it when we call him that. Andrew Wensley, who runs our business team. And a chap called Paul Cunningham, who runs our partnerships. Those people had a conversation, [Nintendo] talked through what their approach would be, and then that process started."

This is pretty interesting, it seems to imply that it was only specific people at Rare who made the initial move to get Banjo. It's not as cut and dry as "oh X company is getting a character so of course their business suits would pick Y"

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

The implication that it took us 8 years to consider the Battletoads as viable candidates is horrifying.

I mean, Banjo was the only character from a series not fully active(barely kept alive via Rare Replay and the most Microsoft advertisement), Steve, Chief, and Fulgore, who were all from currently active games. Banjo also was a massive fan favorite. Battletoads kind of had some harsh competition. They are a darkhorse pick in comparison.

Is it that surprising they didn't get a lot of talk till a new game got announced? Or when KI actually added a Battletoad? It'd be nice if they got more talk even then, especially outside of a Mii costume(which was mostly the talk about them even to this day). Hello, Banjo was often dismissed cause they weren't from an "alive" franchise(which as I noted, is not exactly accurate anyway). Steve was dimissed cause people can't imagine him animating well(to be fair, this isn't a bad point. It's just that the counterpoint shows a clear case he's workable). Master Chief was Xbox exclusive entirely until the Halo Mash-Up Pack for Minecraft came out, and nobody believed he could be possible without a Nintendo appearance(even though that's a fan rule. You can blame Source Gaming for mistranslating that as the actual wording, coupled with people believing too dang much in patterns).

Basically, Battletoads were on a lower scale of things like recency and massive fan demand. I'm sure it still had tons of love, but it's not a thing too active on SB. If you search on Google alone, you'd find some good stuff, like most characters~

 

[Deleted member]

Fair. ...Makes sense too, considering the majorly recognizable face. But I doubt we'd get anything less than a Deluxe costume for Steve anyway. Franchise is the biggest in the world. Doubt it'll get little content if it gets any(though as I said, MInecraft I predict is guaranteed for content in general. Of course, doesn't mean I'm right, either. But it's easy to have confidence in one of the biggest games in the world making it into Smash in some way. I also feel a Spirit Board works way better if playable isn't on the table. Too much notable content. And as noted, Chief would fit better as a Gunner if you really need a MS-owned costume).

Here’s another thing both could end up as mii costumes or spirits or they never appear at all I’m ready for what outcome Chief will get

 

[Dinoman96]

Maybe they'll go ahead and add Steve as a result of how postively received Banjo-Kazooie in Smash was

Minecraft helped Banjo get in Smash, so maybe the bear and bird should return the favour, lol

 

[Deleted member]

2029: Steve vs. Raz from Psychonauts

...still a little annoyed by Microsoft buying out Double Fine. Hopefully DF doesn't have the same fate as Rare.

Introducing:
Psychonauts: nuts & bolts

 

[Cosmic77]

I think it's painfully ironic that Minecraft helped get Banjo in Smash, not Steve.

I know that's what the fans wanted, but I feel bad for Steve supporters.