Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

i'd still go fulgore or chief over banjo/steve

those are just so much more fun concepts for me and they're badass

On the other hand, while Chief is in a bad position(I don't take Frank too seriously, but 343's combined with it made me skeptical of him outside of a Mii costume at best), I'd love Fulgore in. I don't think he's too likely, but he's my top favorite.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Most likely late but

If real more likely DLC expansion for WoL/WoD with Porky likely a boss again.

 

[Knight Dude]

If we get an SNK character I'm pretty confident that it'd be Kyo since he's the protag of what's pretty much their only big franchise plus he'd bring all the other popular SNK characters along with him as spirits even if he isn't the most popular choice. Franchises like Fatal Fury or Samurai Showdown by themselves just don't have that much notoriety even compared to B-tier stuff like Star Fox, Castlevania, Metroid, or Persona.

If we're getting an SNK character, it'll be between Terry and Kyo. Kyo's the main KOF dude for most games, though K', Ash, and I think that Shinei dude from 14 have been main characters, with Kyo in a similar role to Terry, being a famous supporting cast member. The certainly guy has more than enough moves and costumes to make into a full character.

And the case of Terry, he's been around longer, stars in his own series, and is in practically every game that Kyo's in. So while Fatal Fury might not have the same pull as it's spin-off, Terry himself I think has as much as Kyo does.

Or Geese drops in to beat more ass, who knows?

 

[Will]

Most likely late but

If real more likely DLC expansion for WoL/WoD with Porky likely a boss again.

Because...?

Dude, DLC has no Joker piece for him. There's no reason to even expand WoL for DLC at least until every DLC character is shown.

 

[Izanagi97]

Most likely late but

If real more likely DLC expansion for WoL/WoD with Porky likely a boss again.

Didn't someone elsewhere say that Blocked Content kinda went to hell after they stopped doing Codec stuff. Hell, I saw someone say Blocked Content is pretty much around LaxChris levels in terms of leak coverage

 

[Brothanigus]

It was used in Smash Ultimate's development very much.

Yea so many things wrong with what this hypocrite/hack says:
- He is not thinking of doing Smash ballot again. It was used in Smash Ultimate's development very much. (p63)

I call BS here. THere's NO WAY he used the ballot for character choices. Literally just K Rool and Ridley were on any ballot. You cannot say that friggen Piranah plant and JOKER were on any ballot, that's BS.

- He treats character's individuality as its own game itself. All the unique systems certain characters has are all newly built just for him/her.
Yet there are countless amounts of clones and GANONDORF is STILL a clone, as Well as JOKER. Countless characters have samey moves. This is such a stupid, hypocritical point. if every character was unique there wouldn't be clones, and this point still doesn't explain why ROB is in.

_ - He played through beta version of Zelda BotW to the end in 2 days during the Smash Ultimate development because he needed to know how new Link works before anyone else. (p125)
Yet Link still has the same moves from every smash game? So wtf is this?

- - DLC developments in general take time, so by the time of the release, the market will be much smaller than it used to be. DLC business is very risky than people might think. (p165)

No it doesn't, a year for 5 characters isn't a long time. Especially when JOKER is a clone. Literally every one of jokers moves is ripped directly from another character.

- He is not fond of the idea of the season pass. Its a little scary to buy without knowing the contents. (p165)

Than name every character right off the hop. Stop with this friggen holding back and dangling a carrot on a string. ERvery DLC character should have been announced the DAY the Smash pass was announced. There's NO reason not to, especially when he says crap like this.

- - Omega and battlefield for every stages take a lot more work than people might think. (p187)

It really doesn't.

-- Smash tend to have characters from older series

- He doesn't follow internets reaction so didn't know all the fan predictions. (p209)
Wow what a liar. He follows tweets and people asking for Steve or other characters in Smash. There's a Minecraft streamer twitter he follows. What a liar.

- - There was a plan to include a map like the Spirits to the Adventure Mode in Smash Melee. (p211)

He should of made WOL this, but instead it's a glorified event menu(can't believe platforming levels were removed in a platforming fighter.)

This is the MOST BS point on this list. There's BARELY any characters from older series in this game.

 

[Deleted member]

Yea so many things wrong with what this hypocrite/hack says:

Care to elaborate mate? Dont see anything wrong with what Sakurai said in the interview.

 

[Iko MattOrr]

Porky and Sylux are the most important characters that are completely missing in the spirit list and this made the Mother and Metroid series spirits unfinished without them, the FE Awakening spirits are just complete, and there's no need for Frederick to be a playable fighter.

Adeleine is an important character too and she's missing. She's at least more important than Sylux.
Kirby 64 as a whole is missing from the spirits, not just the character; and Kirby 64 is an important game in the franchise.

It may be meaningless, but if we consider Porky and Sylux, Adeleine should be considered as well (especially since Sylux is not even that much important unless they give him an actual role outside of obscure cameos and cliffhangers).

Anyway, I agree that Sylux is the most important of the hunters, and since some of the other less important hunters have a spirit, it's very suspicious that Sylux doesn't.
Though, about Porky, I suppose there is a possibility that more bosses will be added later with an update, just like what happend with the stage builder, so his absence is not necessarily hint of him being playable.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Man I would love for Sylux to get into the game. Another Metroid rep would be nice and I think he makes the most sense to be so.

Tis too bad we'd more likely get yet again another Fire Emblem or Pokemon rep before another Metroid rep as if we don't have enough of those...

 

[Koopaul]

I don't think Adeleine is as important to Kirby as Porky is to Earthbound.

Adeleine has a huge fan following but her importance by the fans is way overblown.

 

[Will]

i dont trust that screenshot or whatever

i dont know if its just me but ness looks too much like ness

man's too chubby and round

 

[Iko MattOrr]

I don't think Adeliene is as important to Kirby as Porky is to Earthbound.

Porky is a main villain, allright.
Though, if we compare her to Sylux, I think she's more important.
She had a decently important role in 3 games, one of which had her on the boxart, being part of the main characters.
Sylux was also kinda a main character in Metroid Prime Hunters (that by the way was a minor spin-off), but he was just one of the many hunters and he has never been the focus in that game, he was just on the same level as the others. He became more popular because of those cameos in other games, but Nintendo has yet to use him for something.

 

[Will]

Sylux was also kinda a main character in Metroid Prime Hunters (that by the way was a minor spin-off), but he was just one of the many hunters and he has never been the focus in that game, he was just on the same level as the others. He became more popular because of those cameos in other games, but Nintendo has yet to use him for something.

i think the whole appeal of sylux right now is him being the main antagonist of MP4

or at least that's what people speculate

 

[Koopaul]

Iko MattOrr

I'm not talking about Sylux. Just Porky.

 

[Wunderwaft]

i think the whole appeal of sylux right now is him being the main antagonist of MP4

or at least that's what people speculate

Yeah, what's interesting about Sylux is that he was speculated to be the main antagonist of the next Metroid Prime game. But MP4's development got rebooted so we won't see that idea for some time.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Iko MattOrr

I'm not talking about Sylux. Just Porky.

Porky is one of the two main villains of the Mother series(the other being Giygas/Giegue). Adeleine's a secondary character overall. There's no comparison of who is more important.

Sylux is debatable, sure. Porky is pretty much the series Ganondorf, if you will. Giygas is more comparable to the transformation of Ganon instead.

 

[Iko MattOrr]

Iko MattOrr

I'm not talking about Sylux. Just Porky.

I know, but the original discussion was about the missing spirits.
People always bring Porky and Sylux, occasionally Poochy (who anyway has a spirit, just not a regular one, a yarn one) and other characters, but people often seem to ignore that Adeleine is in the same position as them.

 

[PeridotGX]

Man I would love for Sylux to get into the game. Another Metroid rep would be nice and I think he makes the most sense to be so.

Tis too bad we'd more likely get yet again another Fire Emblem or Pokemon rep before another Metroid rep as if we don't have enough of those...

Metroid already has 4 newcomers. Adding Sylux is uneccecary (and would put Metroid in the same situation as Smash 4 FE)

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

The Porky leak has me confused. Maybe I'm just desensitized to fake leaks, but I thought it was just some nice-looking fanart, nothing official.

Also I'm surprised that people are still clinging onto Sylux. Guy's biggest appearances were in the less-liked Metroid games, and he has yet to actually do anything.
He's like Thanos, except without being an established character to get people hyped up beforehand, and if Thanos' only post-credit appearances were in Thor: The Dark World and Iron Man 2. Also Infinity War hasn't come out yet, so all we have is people telling us he'll do something cool eventually.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Metroid already has 4 newcomers. Adding Sylux is uneccecary (and would put Metroid in the same situation as Smash 4 FE)

Oh yeah as oppose to seven Fire Emblem characters and 10 Pokemon newcomers. If they add yet again another of those then its 8 or 11.

Technically speaking its three since Samus and Zero Suit are pretty much the same as Mario and Dr. Mario are.

 

[Wunderwaft]

Didn't Sakurai already say that an extensive cinematic won't be used for the DLC fighters outside of Joker?
That kind of kills the Porky leak.

 

[Guynamednelson]

(and would put Metroid in the same situation as Smash 4 FE)

This. Just because SWORD GAME BAD SPACE GAME GOOD doesn't mean Sakurai's concerns about adding a 3rd FE newcomer in one game won't transfer over to a 3rd Metroid one.

 

[Will]

Giygas is more comparable to the transformation of Ganon instead.

Giygas is kind of a tragic villain

so not Ganon, maybe Wind Waker Ganondorf

Metroid already has 4 newcomers.

what

it has 2

 

[Michael the Spikester]

This. Just because SWORD GAME BAD SPACE GAME GOOD doesn't mean Sakurai's concerns about adding a 3rd FE newcomer won't transfer over to a 3rd Metroid one.

Yeah but we already have seven of them. Adding another will lead to 8 as oppose to five Metroid characters.

Insert eighth Fire Emblem character

Insert fifth Metroid character

 

[KahunaLagoona DX]

Pardon my intrusion on this but...

many of the older characters (particularly pre-Brawl) are pretty outdated in design, still harboring moves from games we’ve since moved on from. Even character designs are particularly outdated in many cases or just wrong due to Sakurai’s strict vision of who and what certain characters are.

I think some big examples are...

Mario - Still uses the cape and F.L.U.D.D. along with being a lot angrier than usual
Kirby - Still tied to Super Star in almost every way barring a few victory animations and FS
Sonic - Is only ball attacks, no boost or literally anything else? Just the cheap, time saver Brawl animations
Wario - Literally lacks any references to games
Ganondorf - self explanatory
Peach - Basic damsel in distress parody, but neglects a ton of stuff Peach does in the games
Luigi - why? Just why? No Mansion, just him being the strange brother?

I'd say Mario and Kirby can stay as they are because sure, FLUDD is still a thing, but for the most part Mario still acts the way he does in his games. I mean, if the idea down the line is to update Mario, there really isn't much to change. By the time the next Smash is here, Odyssey's whole capture mechanic would be 'outdated' and really the only things the guy has going for him is his jumping and general acrobatics.

Kirby still utilizes all the moves based on abilities. Yes, most of them are from Super Star, but have you played any recent Kirby games lately? Current Director of the series Shinya Kumazaki STARTED with a remake of Super Star on the DS and has since made every Kirby game a love-letter to Super Star sharing mechanics and everything while doing its own gimmick to set the games apart - Super Abilities, Hypernova, Robobot Armor, Friend Hearts. (I mean, people are begging for Kirby to have a higher air speed, but the air speed issue directly comes from the fact that flight in Kirby is slow...)

As for some others... Wario has the Shoulder Bash back, other than that he's kinda just a 'corrupted Mario' which is fine given his origin - that and Wario Land hasn't really had a new entry since the Wii game, and WarioWare just makes him a MicroGames host.

Ganondorf only appeared in three games, all of them pre-dating Brawl - Unless you want to count Hyrule Warriors and all the rereleases of that - The first one had the fight be about a Dead Man's Volley then he turned into Ganon, the 2nd had a dual-wielding Swords, but by the time Brawl hit, Twilight Princess' actual Ganondorf fight didn't showcase much. People REALLY looked at that Gamecube Demo trailer and the 'in-game lore' of Ocarina and disregarded most of what he's done.

Peach, so what does Smash Neglect? Outside Super Princess Peach whose whole bit is Emotion powers and just being a playable character in other Mario-Spin offs where she and others were built to match Mario's moveset in those games, Super Mario 2 has an accurate point - Floating and Veggies, both of which are in Smash.

Luigi has his new Poltergust from Luigi's Mansion 3 as his grab in Ultimate and Poltergust as his final Smash since Smash 4, other than that we don't need to make Luigi completely into just Luigi's Mansion, especially when there's a stage and everything.

And Sonic? Hate to break it to ya but that's mostly what Sonic does. Sure Boost would be nice but a ton of Sonic's moveset comes from his games. You could even treat his Dair as his stomp from newer games.

So I've been thinking for a while after the recent info that DLC got decided by the NoJ higher-ups without Sakurai's consent, and how advertisement does play a role when choosing a newcomer, and I think this tidbit of information might have made Banjo's chances less likely in my book. If we do get a Microsoft rep, I doubt the higher ups of Nintendo of Japan would choose a character who's presence in the gaming sphere has been non-existent for the past ten years. Obviously I'm not pretending that I know what the higher-ups think or want, but Rare themselves have said they're not planning on bringing Banjo back. So if Banjo has no plans of coming back, why would the higher-ups of NoJ choose a character who's presence in the spotlight has ceased?

Now of course there is the possibility that Microsoft is going to bring him back with the help of another studio that isn't Rare, but there is nothing to hint at such a thing and right now I'm working with what's currently available. Reggie has confirmed that there are no plans for a N64 mini so that's not gonna help Banjo. The more I read and think about the likelihood of Banjo the more he doesn't seem likely at all.

Gotta agree, as stupid as having Steve be in sounds, Minecraft is a bigger ticket for Nintendo of Japan to use as opposed to a character that is virtually an unknown at this time period. Especially since this is Japan we're talking about, where most newcomers many seem to point towards are strictly Western properties that NoJ would have very little knowledge let alone interest in picking as a character.

 

[Will]

Yeah but we already have seven of them. Adding another will lead to 8 as oppose to five Metroid characters.

it's the growth, not the count

FE went from 2 to 6
Metroid already just doubled its own roster size

 

[Michael the Spikester]

it's the growth, not the count

FE went from 2 to 6
Metroid already just doubled its own roster size

Doesn't matter. Fact is there's more Fire Emblem characters that isn't necessary then there are Metroid.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Oh yeah as oppose to seven Fire Emblem characters and 10 Pokemon newcomers.

Technically speaking its three since Samus and Zero Suit are pretty much the same as Mario and Dr. Mario are.

It's 4 characters. There is no "technically speaking". Smash doesn't work that way. Every playable character, as long as they aren't sharing costumes, fully counts as their own character. There's a reason Sakurai made it clear Brawl has 39 characters, not 35. They're different movesets, which is what separates a character. Even some with tiny differences still counts as that.

Giygas is kind of a tragic villain

so not Ganon, maybe Wind Waker Ganondorf

I'm more talking about how Porky is just one guy to fight, while Giygas is often the other one in battle. Ganon and Ganondorf are separate fightable characters in some way. That's what I mean by that. Being the same person wouldn't matter if you still have different characters to fight.

There's probably better examples out there somewhere. Where you're fighting two final bosses at once, not in a row.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Anyways my point is. Fire Emblem and Pokemon already has enough reps. We don't need anymore otherwise may as well call it Super Pokemon Bros. or Super Fire Emblem Bros. guest starring other characters.

As again oppose to 4 and potentially 5 Metroid reps.

 

[Fenriraga]

The Porky "leak" doesn't feel right at all.

The "Not Actual Gameplay Footage" tell seems to be there way too early, as they put that in right at the beginning of every cinematic. Seeing everything we see in that shot- Ness, Gigyas and the shadow of Porky- it's showing way too much for what is normally supposed to be a slow build up to the reveal.

It makes it feel like the disclaimer is more for "GUYS ITS LEGIT SEE I PUT IN THE THING THAT TRAILERS ALWAYS HAVE" than any form of authenticity.

Maybe I'm reaching, but I dunno.

 

[PeridotGX]

Oh yeah as oppose to seven Fire Emblem characters and 10 Pokemon newcomers.

Technically speaking its three since Samus and Zero Suit are pretty much the same as Mario and Dr. Mario are.

Fire Emblem (Smash 4) :
-Popular series in the East, not as much in the west
- 2 characters the game prior
-Unique and Echo in base game, Veteran and Newcomer in DLC

Metroid
-Popular series in the West, not as much in the East
-2 characters the game prior
-Unique and Echo in base game, a hypothetical newcomer as DLC.

aside from the veteran, can yo tell me what the difference is?

 

[Guynamednelson]

Anyways my point is. Fire Emblem and Pokemon already has enough reps. We don't need anymore otherwise may as well call it Super Pokemon Bros. or Super Fire Emblem Bros. guest starring other characters.

Sounds better than Super Quota Bros. Guest Starring Characters People Actually Give a **** About

 

[Will]

Luigi has his new Poltergust from Luigi's Mansion 3 as his grab in Ultimate and Poltergust as his final Smash since Smash 4, other than that we don't need to make Luigi completely into just Luigi's Mansion, especially when there's a stage and everything.

actually there is one thing i want changed about luigi that isn't luigi's mansion related

i want luigi's fireball to be changed to the thunder hand. at least something that takes inspiration from the modern Mario RPGs.

i also want luigi to have visible red-and-white stripe socks for the lore

Doesn't matter. Fact is there's more Fire Emblem characters that isn't necessary then there are Metroid.

same argument could be made for metroid since we have clone samus and ZSS

fully aware that dark samus has a lot to pull from but they simply didn't, the exact same applies to the FE clones and semiclones.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Fire Emblem (Smash 4) :
-Popular series in the East, not as much in the west
- 2 characters the game prior
-Unique and Echo in base game, Veteran and Newcomer in DLC

Metroid
-Popular series in the West, not as much in the East
-2 characters the game prior
-Unique and Echo in base game, a hypothetical newcomer as DLC.

aside from the veteran, can yo tell me what the difference is?

beep boop must hate sword game
beep boop must force in characters because they are not from sword game or monster game

 

[Will]

beep boop must hate sword game
beep boop must force in characters because they are not from sword game or monster game

2025 with sylux and mother brain becoming playable be like:

beep boop no more space game

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Fire Emblem (Smash 4) :
-Popular series in the East, not as much in the west
- 2 characters the game prior
-Unique and Echo in base game, Veteran and Newcomer in DLC

Metroid
-Popular series in the West, not as much in the East
-2 characters the game prior
-Unique and Echo in base game, a hypothetical newcomer as DLC.

aside from the veteran, can yo tell me what the difference is?

One comes from the East, which admittedly Sakurai leans more towards.

The other is that a lot of the characters are able to use Ike or Marth as a base, with Robin appearing to be the only one who didn't need this. Maybe Ike originally didn't either, but I don't remember the development of Brawl.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

An idea I've seen thrown around for a Metroid newcomer is the SA-X. Which I'm not opposed to, it could act as a shapeshifting fighter, maybe transforming into generic Metroid enemies and bosses for attacks.

The only real issue I have with it is that it would have to look identical to Samus while idle, unless it uses the classic Super suit rather than the Other M redesign.

 

[Will]

The Porky "leak" doesn't feel right at all.

The "Not Actual Gameplay Footage" tell seems to be there way too early, as they put that in right at the beginning of every cinematic. Seeing everything we see in that shot- Ness, Gigyas and the shadow of Porky- it's showing way too much for what is normally supposed to be a slow build up to the reveal.

It makes it feel like the disclaimer is more for "GUYS ITS LEGIT SEE I PUT IN THE THING THAT TRAILERS ALWAYS HAVE" than any form of authenticity.

Maybe I'm reaching, but I dunno.

im calling it fake because ness is to round

i know it sounds stupid but like cmon, ness isn't that spherical when you compare the model to the screenshot

Anyways my point is. Fire Emblem and Pokemon already has enough reps. We don't need anymore otherwise may as well call it Super Pokemon Bros. or Super Fire Emblem Bros. guest starring other characters.

As again oppose to 4 and potentially 5 Metroid reps.

this is flawed just by the concept of reps

sakurai chooses who's in the game, and if he feels like a pokemon then he'll grab a pokemon

he said in smash 4 that corrin was the straw that broke the camel and he probably shouldn't bring more fire emblem but whoops heres chrom the mom

 

[Robdelia]

Didn't Itoi comment that Porky was his favorite character in the MOTHER series too? Makes it even weirder that he's not in Ult aside from New Pork City.

actually there is one thing i want changed about luigi that isn't luigi's mansion related

i want luigi's fireball to be changed to the thunder hand. at least something that takes inspiration from the modern Mario RPGs.

i also want luigi to have visible red-and-white stripe socks for the lore

View attachment 224441

On the subject of Luigi redesigns, I think he should get a shell kick as a new neutral special, and his spin down special now has him pull out his hammer from Mario and Luigi while he spins or something.

 

[Will]

Didn't Itoi comment that Porky was his favorite character in the MOTHER series too? Makes it even weirder that he's not in Ult aside from New Pork City.

On the subject of Luigi redesigns, I think he should get a shell kick as a new neutral special, and his spin down special now has him pull out his hammer from Mario and Luigi while he spins or something.

overall more luigi stuff from M&L

he's so goofy and wacky and he has all of these fun super moves solely based on him alone