Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[GoodGrief741]

Yo, A Ayumi Tachibana I just read a Nintendo Everything article and they copied your roundup of Sakurai's book. It's an exact transcription and you're not even thanked, so you might wanna do something about that.

Here's the article: https://nintendoeverything.com/smash-bros-masahiro-sakurai-no-goku-ballot/

 

[KniteBlargh]

Yo, A Ayumi Tachibana I just read a Nintendo Everything article and they copied your roundup of Sakurai's book. It's an exact transcription and you're not even thanked, so you might wanna do something about that.

Here's the article: https://nintendoeverything.com/smash-bros-masahiro-sakurai-no-goku-ballot/

"Ayumi Tachibana has rounded up some of the more noteworthy tidbits from the book."
They also linked to Ayumi's post as the source material.

 

[Fenriraga]

So is there a new general consensus on Erdrick now? I feel like I haven't heard a thing about him in a dog's age. It seems like confidence on him is waning a bit.

And I'm glad Sakurai finally confirmed there were other picks before Bayo. We can stop crying that the ballot was rigged now, right?

 

[Will]

So is there a new general consensus on Erdrick now? I feel like I haven't heard a thing about him in a dog's age. It seems like confidence on him is waning a bit.

it's just cause nothings happened yet

the wait for E3 is tantalizing

 

[Deleted member]

So is there a new general consensus on Erdrick now? I feel like I haven't heard a thing about him in a dog's age. It seems like confidence on him is waning a bit.

And I'm glad Sakurai finally confirmed there were other picks before Bayo. We can stop crying that the ballot was rigged now, right?

I think that realizable should have given away that info since her reveal.

 

[Wunderwaft]

it's just cause nothings happened yet

the wait for E3 is tantalizing

At least it's only two weeks away. I'm really hoping that two characters are revealed at E3, although I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Curious Villager]

I think that realizable should have given away that info since her reveal.

I think most assumed that by "realizable" he meant stuff like Goku and Shrek for whatever reason, which wouldn't make any sense anyway since the ballot asked specifically for video game characters. So those type of votes would have most likely been ignored anyway without a second thought....

So I suppose its nice to have full concrete confirmation I guess....

 

[random rendum]

I think the idea is just priority. Ultimately everyone will lose a favorite in the transition, but many think that the roster can be cleaned up a bit as 75 characters from roughly 20 years of titles will obviously lead to some less than favorable characters who are just there now. I really don’t have anything against any characters, but there are some clearly added to pad out roster picks and quite a few time sensitive picks.


Ultimate is also on the Switch, which pretty much guarantees high sales. If they brought them in during the Wii U, than the sales would be lower.


To be fair.. Smash isn’t technically a fighting game.

I think another point is originality, as obviously Scorpion will continue to play like Scorpion because MK is the only thing he’s in. He’s not a character based on outside sources translated to a fighting game. As for the other fighting games, usually new mechanics and/ or story will be present. Other fighters also don’t bring back characters only having half a roster of old typically, while Smash’s has only grown to outweigh the new.


You could really apply this to any big change that happens. I’d even say MK8 was in this same hypothetical situation as that game clearly had less characters and modes than MK Wii, yet it was still received and sold well due to the Racing having a big amount of emphasis placed on it as new mechanics were added. Even Smash Wii U was well regarded even though it took out every big mode from Brawl like Subspace and removed 2 of the Trainer Pokémon, Snake, Ice Climbers, Wolf, and Lucas with 13 new playable characters as compensation (2 of which being clones).

I don’t think people realize how well a reboot could work. We may even be able to have a Subspace again as there aren’t 75+ characters that need to work in the levels and have a place in the story. I’d give Smash room to breathe and try new things because right now, there’s too much content to cypher through to really try much outside of “Smash”.


To conclude this tangent, I guess I’ll say my piece. I think a reboot will become necessary at some point as we cannot possibly go on infinitely by just having the same game with a few new characters. At some point a change to the formula must come or there will be a franchise fatigue. I believe Ultimate is the perfect end to the series in its current form as it is the compilation of everything Smash has built up to. It feels like the proper end to an era, leaving the perfect opportunity for a new direction as fans of the old have their conclusion. Smash is like the MCU to me, and Ultimate is the Infinity War/ Endgame. We got a conclusion, but now a new story can be told with some old faces returning and many new ones.

Yeah no. The lack of good characters was a major criticism of Mario Kart 8. The stages weren't rebooted either. And yes, the same formula for a game can work, as established be Smash, MK, Pokemon, and others. Messing with formulas is what ruined games like Paper Mario. 5 games is too soon for a reboot.

 

[Izanagi97]

That would be pretty cool if Jin from XC2 ended up in the second fighter pass. He might be easier to put in due to that he is both a driver and a blade.

Unlike Rex and Pyra, where you would have to find a way to put them both in the moveset and find a way to balance them.

Speaking of Jin, he pretty much had two separate movesets (the one during Torna and the one when he was an antagonist) and he's an Ice user (we don't have a dedicated Ice user and no, a couple of B moves don't count)

So is there a new general consensus on Erdrick now? I feel like I haven't heard a thing about him in a dog's age. It seems like confidence on him is waning a bit.

And I'm glad Sakurai finally confirmed there were other picks before Bayo. We can stop crying that the ballot was rigged now, right?

All I know about Erdrick is that there was some rumor that he might be leak bait after that one slip up from a podcast regarding SE's handling of leaks. I don't remember where the post was, though.

 

[Deleted member]

Speaking of Jin, he pretty much had two separate movesets (the one during Torna and the one when he was an antagonist) and he's an Ice user (we don't have a dedicated Ice user and no, a couple of B moves don't count)


All I know about Erdrick is that there was some rumor that he might be leak bait after that one slip up from a podcast regarding SE's handling of leaks. I don't remember where the post was, though.

The whole Erdrick thing cant be handled the same way the blufever leaks were handled, especially since the leaks covered the content up to a certain version.

 

[Door Key Pig]

View attachment 224410

Picky Minch
Queen Mary
Giygas (EarthBound Beginnings)
Giygas (EarthBound)
Insane Cultist
Dr. Andonuts
Everdred
Frank Fly
Fassad
Mecha Drago
King Statue / Porky Statue
Pig Mask Army

and to that hypothesis i say bazinga

By that same virtue, there's still plenty of Rhythm Heaven characters they could make as spirits including some of the bigger/host ones. Though like Ace Atorney, that also had a digital only release in the US for its latest title...

I mean hey, it's one viable new 1st party franchise with a cult fanbase (?) to bring content into Smash for this DLC, having only spirits and little music to represent it, nothing significantly damming like an AT, stage or Mii Costume, to which Lip, Chibi Robo, Dixie Kong, and even freaking Custom Robo and Sin & Punishment got some love, though those two were also previous assist trophies in Smash history

 

[RouffWestie]

So is there a new general consensus on Erdrick now? I feel like I haven't heard a thing about him in a dog's age. It seems like confidence on him is waning a bit.

And I'm glad Sakurai finally confirmed there were other picks before Bayo. We can stop crying that the ballot was rigged now, right?

Even if we ignore anything leakers have said, I say the fact that the name Brave was datamined is a solid confirmation.

 

[Icedragonadam]

Even if we ignore anything leakers have said, I say the fact that the name Brave was datamined is a solid confirmation.

And even then, Brave could possibility point to others like Yuri Lowell(Brave Vesperia) or a Bravely Default character. The main reason everyone drew to the conclusion of Erdrick was because of Insiders. If Insiders didn't say anything, Erdrick would still have been suggested because of the translation of hero but he would have been dismissed because Square Enix.

 

[Teeb147]

Even if we ignore anything leakers have said, I say the fact that the name Brave was datamined is a solid confirmation.

It helps it a lot, but it'd be better not to use words like 'confirmation'.

 

[Deleted member]

This thread seems like a timekiller.
The ballot was what I suspected then. It makes sense that someone like Snake would be above Bayo, but Bayo did legit get a high ranking. I also feel like people don't acknowledge that someone who requires a whole ass gimmick would also be 'unrealisable'. Take say, Inklings for example. For their ink gimmick you need to program and bug test the ink for EVERY stage in the game, for every character, for how it interacts, which might not be feasible in the time they had.

 

[Entrr_Username]

To be fair.. Smash isn’t technically a fighting game

To be fair, you’re not the maker of fighting games.

From Wikipedia: “A fighting game is a video game genre in which the player controls an on-screen character and engages in close combat with an opponent, which can be either an AI or controller by another player.”

 

[Icedragonadam]

Velvet and Nakoruru shouldn't be dismissed, since the DLC is trying to bring in new audiences, it's plausible Nintendo put them on their list to draw in female gamers who don't play Smash. I know Tales Of is popular with women, and I think SNK's fighting games has a several percentage of female fans too. Well that's my game theory, if the rumor of Erdrick, Velvet, Nakoruru, and RE is true.

 

[Deleted member]

SNK fighting games are very popular in Asia and Latin America as well, dunno if it makes them likely but at least is worth taking it into consideration

 

[Entrr_Username]

Unless Sakurai specifically says there won’t be any more DLC after the fighters pass, then more of them are still possible.

 

[Guynamednelson]

and I think SNK's fighting games has a several percentage of female fans too.

It's not necessarily about female fans, but rather that Nakoruru is more popular than you think. After all, SNK had the "Nakoruru and Terry Club" and the Capcom vs. SNK series sees her as a counterpart to Morrigan.

 

[Teeb147]

Unless Sakurai specifically says there won’t be any more DLC after the fighters pass, then more of them are still possible

Seems like sakurai isn't a fan of the season passes, but if it's nintendo deciding then maybe there'll be more anyway.

 

[Entrr_Username]

Seems like sakurai isn't a fan of the season passes, but if it's nintendo deciding then maybe there'll be more anyway.

From what I see, Sakurai might ditch the season pass idea and release the DLC packs the same way they did in Smash 4. But we'll have to see.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Lets be honest. Regardless if were only getting one season the roster as it is amazing. 82 (If you ) playable characters. What more could you ask for?

 

[Izanagi97]

Unless Sakurai specifically says there won’t be any more DLC after the fighters pass, then more of them are still possible.

Yeah, one guy on reddit mentioned that Sakurai seemed to talk about the DLC the same way he talked about game development

 

[Icedragonadam]

Lets be honest. Regardless if were only getting one season the roster as it is amazing. 82 (If you ) playable characters. What more could you ask for?

Techinally were nearly to 100 when you factor in: , and Pikachu Libre too.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Techinally were nearly to 100 when you factor in: , and Pikachu Libre too.

Yeah but those characters are costumes though so they don't count.

 

[Teeb147]

Lets be honest. Regardless if were only getting one season the roster as it is amazing. 82 (If you ) playable characters. What more could you ask for?

Of course, and we should try to not be ungrateful, and enjoy the extra stuff we'll get whatever it is. some people have trouble with that unfortunately.

From what I see, Sakurai might ditch the season pass idea and release the DLC packs the same way they did in Smash 4. But we'll have to see.

I guess that's possible. I definitely hope for more dlc after the first year. I'm just not really expecting it at this point. But I do want more characters. fun ones XD

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Of course, and we should try to not be ungrateful, and enjoy the extra stuff we'll get whatever it is. some people have trouble with that unfortunately.

IKR? 82 playable characters and people are still butthurt that characters like Waluigi didn't make the cut especially when you have these guys.

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

I guess I failed to get answer should I not or and where to post this in other thread so I'll just throw it in here.
Things I find interesting from Sakurai's book.

Spoiler: Summary

- He knows some are serious, but he doesn't think characters like Ironman and Goku will happen. (p27)
- DLC could say shortening the life span of its franchise. For Smash those characters could join in next time. But Smash is also not a title to think about continuation so doing his best every time. (p27)
- He wants Smash to be more casual and see non-competitive tournaments. Smash is a party game. But he also knows he is not the one to plan those. (p31)
- In Smash for days, there was restriction of a time span to offer updates and 3DS had a limited number of times to update. So Wii U version had to do the same. This is why Lucas, Roy, and Ryu released at the same time. (p33)
- If it's a one time purchase type of game, then it's more efficient for the company to start making the next game than keep updating. (p59)
- Updates are normal thing these days, but still they are voluntary service. (p59)
- He always thinks it's important to hear voices from people not speaking up. Real beginners don't speak up. (p61)
- The plan of Smash Ultimate completed December 16th 2015. It's a coincidence, but was the same day of the last Smash for direct. (p63)
- He is not thinking of doing Smash ballot again. It was used in Smash Ultimate's development very much. (p63)
- Beyonetta was the first pick among realisable characters. Above her, there were old veterans like Snake and other characters that were already tried negotiating but got rejected. (p63)
- He was making the plans for Smash Ultimate during the vacation he got after Smash for DLC was done. (p69)
- He treats character's individuality as its own game itself. All the unique systems certain characters has are all newly built just for him/her. (p69)
- It's already had proven true that joining as a character in Smash has advertising effect. (p99)
- He played through beta version of Zelda BotW to the end in 2 days during the Smash Ultimate development because he needed to know how new Link works before anyone else. (p125)
- He thinks games should not be created based on researched data alone and saying games only born to imitate other games are misfortune. Those data should be used for marketings or managements, not to plan new games. Old data are old. (p133)
- (Speaking of Super Nintendo World) 60 billion yen is enough to make every Smash game up to Ultimate and more with couple ten billion of changes. Not many Japanese games have budgets over 10 billion yen. (p139)
- He wish there were Smash Area in Super Nintendo World. (p139)
- Smash Ultimate's DLC wasn't a thing at the time around Famitsu column vol. 546 January 11th 2018, and it was planned without the developers will. (p165)
- DLC developments in general take time, so by the time of the release, the market will be much smaller than it used to be. DLC business is very risky than people might think. (p165)
- They are not something sell that much so it's difficult to gather staffs. Sometimes better to move on to the next game. (p165)
- He is not fond of the idea of the season pass. Its a little scary to buy without knowing the contents. (p165)
- Omega and battlefield for every stages take a lot more work than people might think. (p187)
- HAL Laboratory, Inc. is still on the credits list, but not involved in the development anymore. (p188)
- If you think about the completion of the development, bringing back everyone is not something you should do. (p189)
- The team was very careful of leaks at E3 2018. They didn't use printed promotional materials to avoid leaks. "Everyone is here" wasn't known even in Nintendo so the when it happened Nintendo staffs were also screaming. (p190)
- Smash tend to have characters from older series. But just old characters wouldn't make Smash worthy. If there is no new series, then the selection of the characters will be from the old series. (p199)
- People say "why they can't do this easy stuff?" but there is always a reason for that, One correction could cause another bug. (p205)
- The story idea of World of Light was already existed since Smash Brawl. (p208)
- He doesn't follow internets reaction so didn't know all the fan predictions. (p209)
- The idea of the Spirits is kind of the last resort. He is not sure he'll be making another gameplay like the Spirits. (p211)
- There was a plan to include a map like the Spirits to the Adventure Mode in Smash Melee. (p211)
- He said he took a long vacation, but actually he was just taking breaks as the calendar goes. He has a cat so he can't go for a long trip. (p214)
- By the time of the end of March 2019, the online win ratio of every character are very close to each other at the point he almost thinks better not to change anymore. (p216)
- There are metas, so just certain characters were strong at that time is not good enough reason to make them change. (p216)

Well congrats to Ayumi Tachibana for being credited by GameXplain! You've hit the big leagues once again, if "Nintendo Everything" wasn't enough for you.

 

[Teeb147]

IKR? 82 playable characters and people are still butthurt that characters like Waluigi didn't make the cut especially when you have these guys.

Yup it's definitely pretty great. For me the only reason im not satisfied is that no character fits for me enough to have 1 main i want to stick with, but that's my own thing, cuz there's still a lot going good.

 

[Curious Villager]

Techinally were nearly to 100 when you factor in: , and Pikachu Libre too.

If you go by the fighter Spirit list, then we are already past 100 characters. But that counts alternate costumes like Builder and Wedding Mario so...
Make of it as you will I guess...

 

[Knight Dude]

SNK fighting games are very popular in Asia and Latin America as well, dunno if it makes them likely but at least is worth taking it into consideration

It should I think. The sales don't match other fighting game series, but SNK's been around for a long time and are still making new releases. And, in the grand scheme of things, is still popular, just perhaps not with the Nintendo audience.

Terry Bogard in particular would be a great addition to the series I feel.

The dude's got a memorable design too. Although I suppose Kyo's also a valid option.

 

[SmasherMaster]

The next Smash game will be Smash Century, with 100 different playable characters. I can't believe them cutting that many of the characters (Right now is the only one I can really see getting the axe unless development time gets cut short) and it would be a milestone that not many games are able to cross.

 

[Deleted member]

If you go by the fighter Spirit list, then we are already past 100 characters. But that counts alternate costumes like Builder and Wedding Mario so...
Make of it as you will I guess...

Ah yes, my favourite character, Mario but specifically in his wedding outfit.

 

[Knight Dude]

Ah yes, my favourite character, Mario but specifically in his wedding outfit.

We literally got a separate Mario in a Doctor uniform.

Paper Mario on the other hand, technically exists in another universe, if Paper Jam taught me anything.

 

[Curious Villager]

Ah yes, my favourite character, Mario but specifically in his wedding outfit.

The further paradox when you realize that Dr. Mario also exists, and as his own separate character...

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Well congrats to Ayumi Tachibana for being credited by GameXplain! You've hit the big leagues once again, if "Nintendo Everything" wasn't enough for you.

******* finally!

Now will ya people stop asking for Goku? Why that was even a thing to begin with I'll never get just because lolpopularity.

As they say folks.

Video. Game. Characters. Only.

Smash is about celebrating gaming after all.

 

[Dan]

Who the hell ever asked for Iron Man to be in Smash? Is that a Japan thing?

 

[Knight Dude]

******* finally!

Now will ya people stop asking for Goku?

1. What do you mean finally? He shot down Goku and non game characters before.

2. You know this isn't going to stop people asking.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

1. What do you mean finally? He shot down Goku and non game characters before.

2. You know this isn't going to stop people asking.

In b4 "But Sakurai lied before with things like "Ridley is too big! Hurr!".