Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Deleted member]

If Sora does happen to make it in, I'm very excited to swap my arena lobby music from Ring-a-Ding to Swim This Way.

That is if the devs are willing to include it.

 

[cj.]

I just want a retro spirit event with Space Invaders, Pong, Asteroids, Missile Command and Breackout or Arkanoid

 

[GoodGrief741]

If that sounds fun to you I highly recommend KH. Even the lesser praised titles are still solid, fun games, and KH2FM is considered one of the best ARPGs to exist.

Heh heh, played them all except for Coded, BBS and 0.2. Oh yeah and X if that counts.

The top 12 most wanted newcomers:

Bandana Dee
Geno
Waluigi
Marx from Kirby
Decidueye
Isaac
Sora
Shadow the Hedgehog
Shantae
Mimikyu
Paper Mario
Dixie Kong.

Well Waluigi, Marx, Isaac and Shadow aren't coming because they're assist trophies or, in Marx's case, a boss. Sora's already been done with other characters and many people don't want another sword user. Shantae and Bandana Dee are spirits. Paper Mario's just a clone.

So I'mma say Decidueye, Dixie Kong or Geno, but preferably Decidueye.

Characters I personally want:

Bandana Dee
Marx
Magolor
Waluigi
Geno
Mimikyu
Chandelure
Decidueye
Dixie Kong
Octoling as Inkling's echo

That's a great list right there!

So, with all this Ace Attorney discussion that's been happening lately, I've been thinking, should I give the series a go? I know next to nothing about it beyond Objection! memes.

Does anyone mind giving me a rundown on the series and what it has to offer?

Edit: When I say "what it has to offer" I don't mean that in the context of smash but as its own series.

Late, but the main draw to me is that it's you who's solving the mystery. You need to think things through, interrogate witnesses, and use logic to find contradictions. The story and gameplay are very married in that regard.

And also like others have mentioned the writing is great and the different tones are very well balanced, so you have a great time, laugh at some things, but then feel tense when it counts, and by the end you do have a strong connection to the characters (it helps that they're so well developed).

So if it sounds like your speed I'd seriously suggest giving it a try!

Boulderousness suggested skipping Rise from the Ashes until later, not really sure why, I played them in order and enjoyed them very much.

 

[Izanagi97]

Wish searching on Fireden wasn't such a pain in the ass

 

[KatKit]

Thinking on Morrigan a bit more I realized that Sakurai would not likely chose her if she was on a list of candidates for a very simple reason:
Mechanically, she’s basically another Ryu.
She has attacks that are certainly flashier and more thematic, but at the end of the day she still has a standard fireball and dragon punch. She has some tools Ryu doesn’t have, like a command grab and utility supers, but she’s still just a slight side step from standard fighter man. This is one of the reasons Capcom can stick her in basically everything while Ken has to sit out occasionally, She’s another Ryu type character disguised as a diversity pick.

Just about any character from Street Fighter, or any character from any of Capcom’s other franchises could provide more diverse mechanics and abilities to work with than Morrigan would.

Before Ryu's inclusion, we had Mario, Dr. Mario, Luigi, Megaman, and arguably Zero Suit Samus (and not long after Ryu we got Corrin) with archetypical Shoto-inspired attacks, but they're very distinctive from him, and Morrigan would be as well. The role is common in fighters because it is just good game design. It's straightforward and accessible and usually balanced.

Aside from Soul Fist (projectile) and Shadow Blade (uppercut), Morrigan plays nothing like Ryu. And even those two moves operate differently because of her aerial game (different speeds, height, trajectories, and her ability to hover/cancel her uppercut to remain airborne). Every other attack she has is comparatively unique. Like you mentioned, she has a command grab. She also has her shell kicks, various normal attacks with multi-hitting properties, her body/wings transform, she fights with her hair, etc. Mechanically, she'd also have an air dash, which is a completely new form of movement that isn't present in the game. She's also capable of mid-air flight, similar to Peach. Since she's starred in so many MvC games and is one of the faces of its franchise, she'd also most likely have its signature air launcher attack (and consequently, a high jump, in exchange for a double jump).

I think that your complaint is similar to the ones people made about Terry; Morrigan would bring her own style on a solid archetype and she wouldn't fight anything like Ryu. Don't get me wrong, I definitely wouldn't mind other characters, but Morrigan can still bring a lot to the table.

 

[Deleted member]

I think that your complaint is similar to the ones people made about Terry; Morrigan would bring her own style on a solid archetype and she wouldn't fight anything like Ryu. Don't get me wrong, I definitely wouldn't mind other characters, but Morrigan can still bring a lot to the table.

Smash players definitely need to play more fighting games.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Oh god no, not the finny fun

When I get to that part in KH2 replays I legit just mute the TV.

Makes things kind of harder, but at least I can spare my ears the trouble.

 

[Souless_shadow]

If Sora does happen to make it in, I'm very excited to swap my arena lobby music from Ring-a-Ding to Swim This Way.

You are the absolute maddest of lads

 

[Izanagi97]

I think I'm getting to the point where I wonder what 7.0.0 will have in store

 

[Ben Holt]

Smash players definitely need to play more fighting games.

I mean, Smash is kind of a fighting game by accident.
It's the only genre where all these characters in one place makes sense.
MAYBE if it were made today, it could work as a Skylanders type of game, but fighting games are infinitely more replayable with multiplayer.
Skylanders style Smash would be like, "Oh! Doom Slayer's playable now. I can replay the Mushroom Kingdom missions, but with Doom Slayer!" Whereas fighting game DLC brings an entirely new playstyle, a new threat in multiplayer matches, and new music pieces.

 

[Izanagi97]

Smash players definitely need to play more fighting games.

Or just games in general.

 

[Idon]

Smash players definitely need to play more fighting games.

Nah, fighting games are inherently going to be extremely niche and hard to access to the casual fanbase, and that's not necessarily a bad thing, after all the more depth you give to any genre the harder it is to get into for newcomers. I'm not really surprised when I hear someone hasn't played a fighting game.

I think being more open-minded about the genre and other genres in general could go a long way though.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Nah, fighting games are inherently going to be extremely niche and hard to access to the casual fanbase, and that's not necessarily a bad thing, after all the more depth you give to any genre the harder it is to get into for newcomers. I'm not surprised if someone hasn't played a fighting game.

I think being more open-minded about the genre and other genres could go a long way though.

I'd say that's the biggest issue that ought to be addressed within this fandom.

Even in this thread I notice a lot of close-minded speculation. Certain characters (typically those favored by users here) are focused on with near tunnel-vision and outside characters are shoved to the side or straight up denounced. I feel like if people were willing to seriously look at the many different series that have been brought up, like Tohou, Guilty Gear, Darkstalkers, Fortnite, Minecraft, Halo, Kingdom Hearts, etc. etc. etc., speculation would become more open. It'd be more about "here's why this character would be cool and here's why I think they have a chance" instead of "here's why your character doesn't have a chance and you should stop talking." I'll admit I'm a bit guilty of spreading the former myself, but I think a little effort could go a long way here.

Sakurai does it, so why can't we?

 

[Tako Tuesday]

So I completed the first trial in Ace Attorney: Phoenix Wright. Holy ****, this game is amazing. The suspense, the humor, all of it. Truly a brilliant game so far.

 

[Ben Holt]

Nah, fighting games are inherently going to be extremely niche and hard to access to the casual fanbase, and that's not necessarily a bad thing, after all the more depth you give to any genre the harder it is to get into for newcomers. I'm not surprised if someone hasn't played a fighting game.

I think being more open-minded about the genre and other genres could go a long way though.

Agreed. Smash is not a traditional Fighter like Street Fighter, Tekken, Mortal Kombat, or Fatal Fury.
That being said, I 100% love the way Ryu, Ken, and Terry have commands. Fits their characters.
But I don't want to see that for all characters. I'm not sure I'd want in input a Hadouken to get a stronger fireball for Mario.
Though semi-inputs like Bayonetta's aerial Hadouken input to angle her Side-B downwards is A-ok, and I wouldn't mind othrr characters having something similar.

 

[Night Gale]

Nah, fighting games are inherently going to be extremely niche and hard to access to the casual fanbase, and that's not necessarily a bad thing, after all the more depth you give to any genre the harder it is to get into for newcomers. I'm not surprised if someone hasn't played a fighting game.

That and if you get your ass beat in a fighting game you have no one to blame but yourself.

They take commitment, and although the replay value is endless if you have at least one other person to compete with, there usually isn't that much side s*** to do except for fighting.

 

[TheYungLink]

So I completed the first trial in Ace Attorney: Phoenix Wright. Holy ****, this game is amazing. The suspense, the humor, all of it. Truly a brilliant game so far.

You're gonna looooove the second case.

 

[GoodGrief741]

So I completed the first trial in Ace Attorney: Phoenix Wright. Holy ****, this game is amazing. The suspense, the humor, all of it. Truly a brilliant game so far.

One of us! One of us!

 

[I.D.]

So, yeah. If you want a game series that will make you laugh, please check the Ace Attorney games out.

Tales of Game's Presents Chef Boyardee's Barkley, Shut Up and Jam: Gaiden, Chapter 1 of the Hoopz Barkley SaGa has ruined me. No game seems even remotely funny to me after that experience.

 

[Ben Holt]

I'd say that's the biggest issue that ought to be addressed within this fandom.

Even in this thread I notice a lot of close-minded speculation. Certain characters (typically those favored by users here) are focused on with near tunnel-vision and outside characters are shoved to the side or straight up denounced. I feel like if people were willing to seriously look at the many different series that have been brought up, like Tohou, Guilty Gear, Darkstalkers, Fortnite, Minecraft, Halo, Kingdom Hearts, etc. etc. etc., speculation would become more open. It'd be more about "here's why this character would be cool and here's why I think they have a chance" instead of "here's why your character doesn't have a chance and you should stop talking." I'll admit I'm a bit guilty of spreading the former myself, but I think a little effort could go a long way here.

Sakurai does it, so why can't we?

Holy ****. You just reminded me that Jonesy exists.
He's certainly possible and not out of left field.
I already said my piece about Reimu. Not my cup of tea, but I wouldn't be surprised.

 

[Deleted member]

Holy ****. You just reminded me that Jonesy exists.
He's certainly possible and not out of left field.
I already said my piece about Reimu. Not my cup of tea, but I wouldn't be surprised.

Ah, Fortnite in Smash...is the pinnacle of negative reception through association.

Not the biggest Fortnite player, but the game has been more associated with negative connotations and stuff, such as the toxic fandom, Wolverine publciity, etc. It's probably the reason why so many of the Smash community are willing to gatekeep it. And I would not blame the people.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Holy ****. You just reminded me that Jonesy exists.
He's certainly possible and not out of left field.
I already said my piece about Reimu. Not my cup of tea, but I wouldn't be surprised.

Too bad it's important a character is fun to play as, not just recognizable.

 

[Ben Holt]

Ah, Fortnite in Smash...is the pinnacle of negative reception through association.

Not the biggest Fortnite player, but the game has been more associated with negative connotations and stuff, such as the toxic fandom, Wolverine publciity, etc. It's probably the reason why so many of the Smash community are willing to gatekeep it. And I would not blame the people.

Stinky bois say hi.

 

[Deleted member]

Stinky bois say hi.

Point is, what is the first thing that comes to your mind when one hears Fortnite?

 

[I.D.]

Too bad it's important a character is fun to play as, not just recognizable.

*If it's a character favored by Sakurai

 

[Ben Holt]

Point is, what is the first thing that comes to your mind when one hears Fortnite?

A fun multiplayer game enjoyed by fans of all ages and backgrounds.

 

[Kokiden]

Too bad it's important a character is fun to play as, not just recognizable.

The longstanding problem with this is, the fanbase has this problem where any character that they don't like, or find annoying, is not fun.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Ah, Fortnite in Smash...is the pinnacle of negative reception through association.

Not the biggest Fortnite player, but the game has been more associated with negative connotations and stuff, such as the toxic fandom, Wolverine publciity, etc. It's probably the reason why so many of the Smash community are willing to gatekeep it. And I would not blame the people.

It's not just that, but people shouldn't just be focusing on what's the most normie friendly character when the most normie friendly fighter in the pass is only that way in Japan, and Undertale is the subject of a Mii costume rather than a whole challenger pack.

 

[Zinith]

Point is, what is the first thing that comes to your mind when one hears Fortnite?

The only game my nephew will play on his Switch despite everyone else in the household wanting to play Smash on it

 

[Ben Holt]

The longstanding problem with this is, the fanbase has this problem where any character that they don't like, or find annoying, is not fun.

I hated Incineroar for screwing Decidueye, the coolest Grass starter EVER, out of a spot.
But I enjoy Incineroar's playstyle. He is very fun.

 

[Deleted member]

A fun multiplayer game enjoyed by fans of all ages and backgrounds.

What else?

To me, much of the gaming community is memeing about "gaming community vs fortnite" and that is where my association comes from.

 

[Ben Holt]

What else?

To me, much of the gaming community is memeing about "gaming community vs fortnite" and that is where my association comes from.

Most people just play games they like and aren't very keen on meme culture.

 

[KatKit]

Another thing I forgot to point out that Morrigan (or any Darkstalkers rep) would bring is outright silliness. I mean... Morrigan's walking animation is literally just her standing there menacingly, as she slowly floats towards you.

In hindsight, it's probably to make her seem unreal/dreamlike, which is kinda clever. That series was so good. Every character was a joke character in the best way possible. It was filled with tons of visual gags.

Too bad it's important a character is fun to play as, not just recognizable.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: although I haven't played Fortnite, the concept of a shooting character that builds stuff would be cool in Smash.

 

[GoodGrief741]

I don't really feel like Smash should reward okay games that only became massive because of being viral rather than by their actual quality.

 

[Deleted member]

Most people just play games they like and aren't very keen on meme culture.

But even though you say "most", it is not necessarily all of the people.

 

[Ben Holt]

I don't really feel like Smash should reward okay games that only became massive because of being viral rather than by their actual quality.

 

[I.D.]

I don't really feel like Smash should reward okay games that only became massive because of being viral rather than by their actual quality.

Fantastic! When do we start removing shillmons?

 

[DrifloonEmpire]

Smash players definitely need to play more fighting games.

A lot of Smash fans (such as myself) aren't really interested in traditional fighting games, and a good chunk of Smash players play it as a party game or are here for the sheer amount of content and fanservice it provides. Just because you play one game in a genre doesn't mean you have to like the whole genre.


Also, as speculation for FP5 narrows down to less obvious choices, what does everyone think of a Civilization rep? It has two main series games (one of which is on the Switch) and a spinoff on Nintendo systems. Furthermore it's also pretty popular in Japan, would introduce a new demographic, and represents a mostly unrepresented genre, Strategy/4x. The series has legacy and, as the game coins itself, has stood the test of time. The only major obstacle is that most of the characters are actual historical figures, though some of their Civ incarnations have their own looks and quirks.

 

[TwiceEXE]

A lot of Smash fans (such as myself) aren't really interested in traditional fighting games, and a good chunk of Smash players play it as a party game or are here for the sheer amount of content and fanservice it provides. Just because you play one game in a genre doesn't mean you have to like the whole genre.

Totally fair. But it would help prevent people from making statements like "Morrigan is just Ryu with breasts" or "Terry is just Ryu with a hat".

 

[Izanagi97]

Point is, what is the first thing that comes to your mind when one hears Fortnite?

Memes about "Kids these days" and, lately, Ninja making stupid posts and getting mocked for it (like his comments regarding NFL kickers, I don't actively search for Ninja crap because I'm not a fan of him or Fortnite, but I do follow NFL stuff and comments mocking him did show up in my Twitter feed)