New Smash Bros for WiiU

[JOE!]

It'd either be top tier or bottom tier.

Their damage becomes ridiculous enough after a kill where it's too difficult to recover a stock lead, or their damage is so pathetic that they can't get the kills at a low enough % in order to actually abuse Moxie before dying again.

It's just a bad idea.

how about a 1.25% buff?

meaning, after 1 kill a move that did 10% damage normally would now do 12.5%, keeping all it's other properties such as speed and range however.

get another kill that becomes 16%. (rounded from 15.6%, or just put it as 15)

it's not too ridiculous, and requires gaining alot of momentum, as the buff would go away upon the character using it dying, so they have to last while taking down 2 or more stocks to really benefit.

 

[OmegaXXII]

If anything?

Pikachu/Jiggs/Mewtwo/Lucario/Zoroark for Smash 4. Meowth is a possible plus to that roster.

IS EVERYONE HAPPY NOW?

Insert Pokemon Trainer

Now were Happy!!!

 

[Deleted member]

Keyword: One NEW 1st Gen pokemon. Mewtwo is unlikely, his realm is Melee.

You have a point, which is why I don't think Mewtwo is likely to come back. That said, we could very well see the team cut corners and bring back Mewtwo/keep Lucario in the game. That said, I still think it's likely we'll get five Pokemon rep.

@OmegaXVII: Yeah, as much as I like Lucario, I prefer having Pokemon Trainer in over Lucario since PT is a starter.

 

[L-a-t-e-r-a-l-u-s]

You have a point, which is why I don't think Mewtwo is likely to come back. That said, we could very well see the team cut corners and bring back Mewtwo/keep Lucario in the game. That said, I still think it's likely we'll get five Pokemon rep.

I also believe that 5 pokemon is possible, probably consisting of:
Jigglypuff
Pikachu
Zoroark
Pokemon Trainer
[Possibly Meowth? He has enough personality, moves, etc, though I'd love to see Scyther]

 

[JOE!]

that and PT is just so unique it'd be odd to leave him out

 

[PG-13]

- You're forgetting that each game has brought at least one new 1st gen Pokemon, which Arcadenik brought up yesterday. Mewtwo is still relevant to the Pokemon universe, so he has a chance and so does Meowth for the same reason. I would not be surprise if either Lucario stays, Meowth becomes playable, or Mewtwo makes a return. And with a lot of potential Pokemon characters, five rep isn't too out of realm. Also I've already stated Zoroark is going to be in the game.

I knew how you said Zoroark, I just mentioned how he would get in and Mewtwo would not. Sorry if I confused you.

The 1st Gen Pokemon Rep from Brawl was Pokemon Trainer, who was to represent Fire Red and Leaf Green. Because that Heart Gold and Soul Silver came out as a successor to FRLG, It is likely that Pkmn Trainer Gold(Male character) would replace him due to HGSS being a remake of the 2nd Generation.
And no Mewtwo doesn't have much of a chance. I'm not saying he is never going to get in, but if the Mewtwo-Lucario thing keeps going on, he likely won't be included unless Lucario would be included too.

 

[Arcadenik]

If anything?

Pikachu/Jiggs/Mewtwo/Lucario/Zoroark for Smash 4. Meowth is a possible plus to that roster.

IS EVERYONE HAPPY NOW?

Where's the Pokemon Trainer?

I would be happy with this roster.

- Pikachu
- Jigglypuff
- Meowth
- Mewtwo
- Pokemon Trainer (5th gen)

There. I killed two birds with one stone. Take out 1st gen starters and Lucario and add three 5th gen starters. No need for Zoroark because we already have 5th gen starters. We also added one new 1st gen starter, Meowth, while keeping Jigglypuff and bringing Mewtwo back due to fan demand.

Does anyone here really want Zoroark or are they just putting Zoroark in their wish lists because they expect Zoroark to be in SSB4 whether they want him or not?

 

[L-a-t-e-r-a-l-u-s]

I knew how you said Zoroark, I just mentioned how he would get in and Mewtwo would not. Sorry if I confused you.

The 1st Gen Pokemon Rep from Brawl was Pokemon Trainer, who was to represent Fire Red and Leaf Green. Because that Heart Gold and Soul Silver came out as a successor to FRLG, It is likely that Pkmn Trainer Gold(Male character) would replace him due to HGSS being a remake of the 2nd Generation.
And no Mewtwo doesn't have much of a chance. I'm not saying he is never going to get in, but if the Mewtwo-Lucario thing keeps going on, he likely won't be included unless Lucario would be included too.

If a HG/SS trainer came in to replace Pokemon Trainer, that's no problem, the pokemon would probably have similar moves. However, that still leaves the potentially one open slot.

@Above, I do want Zoroark and I strongly believe s/he will make it in. Also, the 5th Gen starters were only cool when they were fully evolved :\ With the exception of Tepig and the grass thing. That otter was strange.

 

[Deleted member]

The 1st Gen Pokemon Rep from Brawl was Pokemon Trainer, who was to represent Fire Red and Leaf Green. Because that Heart Gold and Soul Silver came out as a successor to FRLG, It is likely that Pkmn Trainer Gold(Male character) would replace him due to HGSS being a remake of the 2nd Generation.

I don't think we'll be seeing Pokemon Trainer being replaced. He is the most iconic Pokemon Trainer in the game, having appeared in the most games. Most people are familiar with him, myself included, plus he's a starter, so no need to replace him.

My argument was not that we could see Mewtwo, but that a 5th Pokemon rep is likely. I understand what you say in regards to Mewtwo.

Does anyone here really want Zoroark or are they just putting Zoroark in their wish lists because they expect Zoroark to be in SSB4 whether they want him or not?

In all honesty, I'm only including Zoroark in my list because he's likely, not because I want him. Unlike Toad, there's pretty much no choice anyway, so I'll accept him into the game.

 

[PG-13]

If a HG/SS trainer came in to replace Pokemon Trainer, that's no problem, the pokemon would probably have similar moves. However, that still leaves the potentially one open slot.

In that case they may or may not bring back Mewtwo...
But that would mean Lucario would have to come back...
Or it could be something completely new. We may see Victini fight Zoroark.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

In that case they may or may not bring back Mewtwo...
But that would mean Lucario would have to come back...
Or it could be something completely new. We may see Victini fight Zoroark.

I don't see how adding Mewtwo back would force them to include Lucario as well.

 

[L-a-t-e-r-a-l-u-s]

In that case they may or may not bring back Mewtwo...
But that would mean Lucario would have to come back...
Or it could be something completely new. We may see Victini fight Zoroark.

Victini will be in a pokeball like the other tiny fairy-like legendaries.

 

[OmegaXXII]

And no Mewtwo doesn't have much of a chance. I'm not saying he is never going to get in, but if the Mewtwo-Lucario thing keeps going on, he likely won't be included unless Lucario would be included too.

Why so?

How does Lucario have "that much more" of a chance than Mewtwo? You'll have to enlightenten me?

Obviously Mewtwo has a greater fanbase than Lucario, Lucario was only included because of his latest movie, and guess whose turn it is now? Zoroark!!!

 

[Deleted member]

I don't see how adding Mewtwo back would force them to include Lucario as well.

Exactly, they have pretty much the same moves and Mewtwo is more iconic then Lucario. Neither are likely to come back, but Mewtwo did appear in HeartGold/SoulSilver, so there's a chance he could come back, which I can't say the same for Roy, Dr. Mario, and especially not Pichu.

 

[PG-13]

I don't see how adding Mewtwo back would force them to include Lucario as well.

Because if the two ends of the Mewtwo chain were to be in(Mewtwo and Zoroark), they should include the middle one, Lucario, or it would be unfair and Nintendo is almost never unfair with things like this.

@Omega Your forgetting that Mewtwo had his movie around Melee's release too.

 

[UltiMario]

how about a 1.25% buff?

meaning, after 1 kill a move that did 10% damage normally would now do 12.5%, keeping all it's other properties such as speed and range however.

get another kill that becomes 16%. (rounded from 15.6%, or just put it as 15)

it's not too ridiculous, and requires gaining alot of momentum, as the buff would go away upon the character using it dying, so they have to last while taking down 2 or more stocks to really benefit.

Or you could have a character that's actually always good. Imagine if Lucario has his 95% (about halfway) boosted damage at all times. Bad gimmicks are bad.

Also Joe how on earth are you a smash researcher if you didn't even know that Smash doesn't round, and that fractions of percent are stored, and not displayed. So if one move does 3.4% damage, and the next does 2.6, the counter would display 6%, or if it did 2.5 because it was staled, it would show 5%, but still be stored at 5.9% for KBG calculation purposes and such. It's why Staled Mach tornado can do damage, where each hit does less than 1%, it builds up.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Because if the two ends of the Mewtwo chain were to be in(Mewtwo and Zoroark), they should include the middle one, Lucario, or it would be unfair and Nintendo is almost never unfair with things like this.

It's not a chain, it isn't about fairness.

It's about fan service

 

[Deleted member]

Because if the two ends of the Mewtwo chain were to be in(Mewtwo and Zoroark), they should include the middle one, Lucario, or it would be unfair and Nintendo is almost never unfair with things like this.

@Omega Your forgetting that Mewtwo had his movie around Melee's release too.

Where does your Mewtwo chain theory come from? That makes no sense to me.

 

[PG-13]

Where does your Mewtwo chain theory come from? That makes no sense to me.

Mewtwo had his movie for Melee. Lucario had his movie for Brawl. Zoroark has his movie for SSB4.

See where I'm going? That's what I mean by chain. Lucario was meant to replace Mewtwo, and Zoroark would be meant to replace Lucario unless they all three were together. That would be fan service for fans alike and would be fair to the Pokemon part of SSB.

 

[L-a-t-e-r-a-l-u-s]

Where does your Mewtwo chain theory come from? That makes no sense to me.

I think he's referring to the similarities of Mewtwo > Lucario > Zoroark

Edit: Mah b. Nevermind.

 

[JOE!]

Ulti, it was just an example.

for the moment, smash registers .5%, and nothing smaller from my knowledge, and how do we know if that aspect wont be changed in SSBU? the % system behind the scenes could be slightly different when it comes to fractions

 

[Deleted member]

Would anyone like to see some Single-Player Modes utilized online for either leaderboard purposes or for online co-op/a battle to see who gets somewhere first? Like for example, Break the Target. You could do Leaderboard, Co-op, or see who breaks all the targets first.

Mewtwo had his movie for Melee. Lucario had his movie for Brawl. Zoroark has his movie for SSB4.

See where I'm going? That's what I mean by chain. Lucario was meant to replace Mewtwo, and Zoroark would be meant to replace Lucario unless they all three were together. That would be fan service for fans alike and would be fair to the Pokemon part of SSB.

Two things:

- Since you brought up that Mewtwo had a movie around Melee (Which you are correct one), since Victini is having two movies that are more or less going to be around SSB4's release date, by your logic, we could also see Victini.

- We don't really know who the replacements for Mewtwo and Pichu were. We know that Pokemon Trainer and Lucario replaced them, we just don't know what those two specifically replaced. There's an argument that Mewtwo was replaced because they wanted a new 1st gen Pokemon character and in comes Pokemon Trainer. Likewise, people argue that Pichu was replaced because they were from the past gen. Since Lucario is from the 4th gen, it makes sense that Pichu was replaced by Lucario. Therefore, if we go by this logic, Mewtwo has a small chance of getting back in.

I'm not saying one of these two are correct, but I am saying that both sides for why Mewtwo and Pichu was replaced have good points.

 

[PG-13]

Two things:

- Since you brought up that Mewtwo had a movie around Melee (Which you are correct one), since Victini is having two movies that are more or less going to be around SSB4's release date, by your logic, we could also see Victini.

- We don't really know who the replacements for Mewtwo and Pichu were. We know that Pokemon Trainer and Lucario replaced them, we just don't know what those two specifically replaced. There's an argument that Mewtwo was replaced because they wanted a new 1st gen Pokemon character and in comes Pokemon Trainer. Likewise, people argue that Pichu was replaced because they were from the past gen. Since Lucario is from the 4th gen, it makes sense that Pichu was replaced by Lucario. Therefore, if we go by this logic, Mewtwo has a small chance of getting back in.

I'm not saying one of these two are correct, but I am saying that both sides for why Mewtwo and Pichu was replaced have good points.

That logic does make sense, but in my opinion the Mewtwo>Lucario one makes more. They both speak in a way(Mewtwo spoke in the Japanese voices), they both have an incredibly similar Neutral B attack(Shadow Ball-Aura Sphere).

As for Pichu, he was merely a clone, and in an interview Sakurai(?) said that he wanted no more clones in Brawl. That is why Dr. Mario, Roy, and Pichu got kicked out. However, Ganon stayed because he said that Ganon actually had a major role in the Zelda franchise, so he would stay, and Falco was merely changed to be different, as he had a more major role than the other clones(Pichu was completely overshadowed by Pikachu in Pokemon, Roy only appeared in 2 games outside of SSBM, Dr. Mario was just a different persona of Mario that appeared in about 2 games). So he was kicked out to make room for PKMN Trainer.

And they did the leaderboard thing on the DOJO.

 

[Deleted member]

@PG-13: In this case, we'll have to agree to disagree on the subject. There's not really any definitive evidence pointing towards what Pokemon Trainer and Lucario replaced., just that it's probably either the main movie Pokemon/getting rid of clones logic or the Generational/1st gen logic.

 

[PG-13]

@PG-13: In this case, we'll have to agree to disagree on the subject. There's not really any definitive evidence pointing towards what Pokemon Trainer and Lucario replaced., just that it's probably either the main movie Pokemon/getting rid of clones logic or the Generational/1st gen logic.

I guess your right, its a little too early to draw conclusions like such right now.

 

[Gamingboy]

Geez, I've got a big list of the characters I THINK will be in it, but it'd just be rude to put it up here, since It'd be so damn long (I'm taking the "I could make 50 characters" thing literally). If anybody wouldn't have a problem with it, let me know.

That said, I predict that (on the Wii U version, at least) we will see the Original 12 still in, all of the characters that were included in both SSBM and SSBB will come back, and most of the characters from SSBB will be back (although I'm not very confident for Lucario, Wolf and sort of unsure if the PKMN trainer would have the same roster at his disposal).

Also, I'm thinking that as far as third parties are concerned we won't see more than 1 per party. So, like, we might get Geno, and we might get Cloud Strife (due to his KH appearances on the handhelds), but we WON'T be getting Geno AND Cloud.

 

[Deleted member]

Geez, I've got a big list of the characters I THINK will be in it, but it'd just be rude to put it up here, since It'd be so damn long (I'm taking the "I could make 50 characters" thing literally). If anybody wouldn't have a problem with it, let me know.

That said, I predict that (on the Wii U version, at least) we will see the Original 12 still in, all of the characters that were included in both SSBM and SSBB will come back, and most of the characters from SSBB will be back (although I'm not very confident for Lucario, Wolf and sort of unsure if the PKMN trainer would have the same roster at his disposal).

Also, I'm thinking that as far as third parties are concerned we won't see more than 1 per party. So, like, we might get Geno, and we might get Cloud Strife (due to his KH appearances on the handhelds), but we WON'T be getting Geno AND Cloud.

Do you honestly think we stand a decent chance of getting Pichu (Ugh), Dr. Mario (Also a very bad chacter), and Roy (Unlikely) back in the game? Even Mewtwo is questionable at best. Pokemon Trainer will almost certainly not lose his spot as he is a starter and starter have yet to be chopped off. Geno and Cloud Strife also stands very little chance of getting in. Slime, Ryu Hayabusa, Travis Touchdown, Ryu from Street Fighter and especially Mega Man all stand a much better chance then those two and even then, the only one I don't doubt much coming is Mega Man.

 

[L-a-t-e-r-a-l-u-s]

Geez, I've got a big list of the characters I THINK will be in it, but it'd just be rude to put it up here, since It'd be so damn long (I'm taking the "I could make 50 characters" thing literally). If anybody wouldn't have a problem with it, let me know.

That said, I predict that (on the Wii U version, at least) we will see the Original 12 still in, all of the characters that were included in both SSBM and SSBB will come back, and most of the characters from SSBB will be back (although I'm not very confident for Lucario, Wolf and sort of unsure if the PKMN trainer would have the same roster at his disposal).

Also, I'm thinking that as far as third parties are concerned we won't see more than 1 per party. So, like, we might get Geno, and we might get Cloud Strife (due to his KH appearances on the handhelds), but we WON'T be getting Geno AND Cloud.

I will kill myself if we get Cloud. He is the most over rated JRPG protagonist I've ever seen. He needs to gtfo. If we get anything from Square it's more than likely going to be Geno. I doubt we'll get anything from square to begin with.

@Above! I agree with your suggestions, particularly Travis Touchdown.

 

[Deleted member]

I will kill myself if we get Cloud. He is the most over rated JRPG protagonist I've ever seen. He needs to gtfo. If we get anything from Square it's more than likely going to be Geno. I doubt we'll get anything from square to begin with.

@Above! I agree with your suggestions, particularly Travis Touchdown.

Geno is most certainly not the most likely third-party character from Square Enix. What about Slime? He's much more important to Square Enix then Geno, can potentially be unique, is Dragon Quest mascot, and that the Dragon Quest series have a long history on Nintendo consoles. I agree that we probably won't get anything from Square Enix, thought.

@Second Paragraph: Thanks.

 

[Zombiesarecool]

Why so?

How does Lucario have "that much more" of a chance than Mewtwo? You'll have to enlightenten me?

Honestly I can shed some light on this. Lucario was practically designed for furries, so was Zorark, I think Sakurai is a furry but putting Krystal in would totally take away his awesome cred so he covered up his fur-love by putting in Pokemon, because Pokemon is badass.

Mewtwo being designed for furries? Not so much. I dare you to google Lucario...it's disturbing.

 

[Gamingboy]

Do you honestly think we stand a decent chance of getting Pichu (Ugh), Dr. Mario (Also a very bad chacter), and Roy (Unlikely) back in the game? Even Mewtwo is questionable at best. Pokemon Trainer will almost certainly not lose his spot as he is a starter and starter have yet to be chopped off. Geno and Cloud Strife also stands very little chance of getting in. Slime, Ryu Hayabusa, Travis Touchdown, Ryu from Street Fighter and especially Mega Man all stand a much better chance then those two and even then, the only one I don't doubt much coming is Mega Man.

I didn't say that I think "everybody from SSBM and SSBB will be back". I said "I think everybody from BOTH SSBM and SSBB will be back". In other words, I think characters like Peach, the ICs, Bowser, G&W, etc will be back.

Pichu, Doc Mario* and Roy will stay out, and probably Mewtwo will also not be in it.

And I said Geno and Cloud Strife just off the top of my head, although I wouldn't be surprised if they got trophy treatment or something.


*That said, Dr. Mario would make a cool alternate costume for Mario. I mean, it's a obvious thing to do, right?

 

[lordvaati]

ummm.....

Pichu wasn't in Brawl because he evolved into the Pikachu you use in that game....

 

[augustoflores]

nah, he didn't get enough love to evolve, lol pokemon jokes

 

[L-a-t-e-r-a-l-u-s]

Honestly I can shed some light on this. Lucario was practically designed for furries, so was Zorark, I think Sakurai is a furry but putting Krystal in would totally take away his awesome cred so he covered up his fur-love by putting in Pokemon, because Pokemon is badass.

Mewtwo being designed for furries? Not so much. I dare you to google Lucario...it's disturbing.

I hope you do understand there are... "graphic" images of basically every pokemon and starfox character.

 

[refugee]

Honestly I can shed some light on this. Lucario was practically designed for furries, so was Zorark, I think Sakurai is a furry but putting Krystal in would totally take away his awesome cred so he covered up his fur-love by putting in Pokemon, because Pokemon is badass.

Mewtwo being designed for furries? Not so much. I dare you to google Lucario...it's disturbing.

...

Please shut up.

Unrelated: How sure are you guys that 5th gen will not get replaced by a 6th gen by the time the next SSB comes around? There wasn't any 3rd gen representative so it's very possible this could happen.

 

[L-a-t-e-r-a-l-u-s]

...

Please shut up.

Unrelated: How sure are you guys that 5th gen will not get replaced by a 6th gen by the time the next SSB comes around? There wasn't any 3rd gen representative so it's very possible this could happen.

The time between Pokemon Diamond and Pokemon White was... 5 years I believe. I think we're safe.

 

[augustoflores]

and we don't even have Gray yet.

 

[Gamingboy]

I have to wonder if the third generation WILL get some love in SSB4. I mean, there is the persistent rumor that Ruby&Sapphire will be getting remakes. Some people think that Plusle-Minun were almost in SSBB, since there was unused data that had the first letters of their Japanese name.



Characters from one game that were shelved have shown up in the next before (Dedede, Mewtwo and Bowser I believe were all supposed to be in SSB64, but couldn't be because of space issues), so maybe Plusle and Minun will be in. Just a thought.

 

[L-a-t-e-r-a-l-u-s]

I have to wonder if the third generation WILL get some love in SSB4. I mean, there is the persistent rumor that Ruby&Sapphire will be getting remakes. Some people think that Plusle-Minun were almost in SSBB, since there was unused data that had the first letters of their Japanese name.



Characters from one game that were shelved have shown up in the next before (Dedede, Mewtwo and Bowser I believe were all supposed to be in SSB64, but couldn't be because of space issues), so maybe Plusle and Minun will be in. Just a thought.

Plusle and Minun would be cool, tag team like Nana and Popo.

 

[gsninja]

I hope 3rd gen gets a rep. It's easily the most under-appreciated line in Pokemon, as evidenced already by being completely skipped over as far as playable characters go. Even if it is a Plusle and Minun duo, 3rd gen should get something.