New Smash Bros for WiiU

[OmegaXXII]

Yeah, pretty much the only way we can keep it a secret to ourselves is to PM discussions in regards to the translation of the site.

But I don't want ---/shinhed-echi/xIblisx to have to deal with the trouble in the first place.

Yes, that would probably be the best solution, doubt it would ever happen though.

 

[Oasis_S]

Ridorii for Sumasshu.

 

[Deleted member]

Yes, that would probably be the best solution, doubt it would ever happen though.

Which sucks because Sakurai needs to have a worldwide focus in regards to characters in SSB4. He would be able to see potential choices to influence him in not only Japan but all across the planet.

 

[---]

For the record I only know basic Japanese (2 years of High School, and many imported FE games ).

Hopefully when I start college for the 1st starting on the Sep. 1; I will begin to learn more, but I at least know enough to do basic translations.

Still it's nice to know there are others, much less pressure that way.

Gotta go, dinner time, back in 45.

 

[Starphoenix]

@Starphoenix: I'd like to see your write-up of all the characters you made in the SSB4 discussion. I'd be willing to debate with you on some characters even if you're up for it.

I'm finishing my last character now. So once I finish I'll repost them from the discussion group.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm finishing my last character now. So once I finish I'll repost them from the discussion group.

Alright, I am very much looking forward to it.

You should post your thoughts on Saki on the social group (I'll set-up the debate thread in regards to his chances).

 

[Artsy Omni]

This is totally random, but how do you guys feel about introducing a new standard attack with sliding crouches and sliding crouch attacks? It would essentially allow for a second running attack.

It's a game mechanic that's obviously more derived from Super Mario Bros. games, which I would welcome, because it's not Kirby. =P

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Would be little hard to implement, we might get characters going all the time skidding on the ground.

 

[Artsy Omni]

Would be little hard to implement, we might get characters going all the time skidding on the ground.

Perhaps if you can only crouch while pressing straight down?

 

[Luco]

Memory

Sorry if you want this can be my last one from SPM but the reason i posted it is because it's one of the few songs that has ever made me cry.

Memory 2

I think this one plays at the end, also made me cry, but it's pretty much the same, just slight differences.

 

[OmegaXXII]

@Hex: wow, nice new blog you have there, you definetly opened my mind a little more about character franchises and overrepresentation, good job.

 

[Shorts]

Alright, I am very much looking forward to it.

You should post your thoughts on Saki on the social group (I'll set-up the debate thread in regards to his chances).

Me too, I'm actually in the mood to stretch the old debate legs and have some fun :3

 

[Starphoenix]

Alright guys, get ready for a wall of text. Apologize for my poor grammar, did not have the chance to proof read everything:

Toad - A great deal of injustice ihas been done to Toad. Most of the arguments against him I've seen are fueled more by personal bias than legitimate issues or concern. All that is said of him aside, he has been and still is a large aspect of Mario's history. As a race and as a character. After New Super Mario Bros. Wii re-introduced a playable Toad into the mainstream, and with the Toads set to appear again if New Super Mario Bros. Mii is ever established as a legitimate title, there won't much in our little fungi's way.

BTW, here is photo evidence that the Toad Bros. return in New Super Mario Bros. Mii:

Medusa - With Project Sora coming off of development for Kid Icarus Uprising, it is understandable if the team is sentimental and decides to incorporate some of the content they have spent the past few years working on. I feel the team, along with Sakurai would have no qualms making another Kid Icarus character playable.

Whether it be Palutena, Medusa, both or someone else; I am not sure. Magnus doesn't really appear as much of an option, but I guess this could change depending on his involvement in Uprising and whether he is a character that is given a ticket to return in a sequel? Still, Palutena and Medusa have the most history behind them and I feel will receive more priority because of it. Medusa has a slight edge as she could probably bring something more interesting in terms of design. This would also mean that another villain is within the game, which would benefit another story mode if Project Sora decided to pursue that avenue again. Perhaps with the 3DS?

Ridley - This one doesn't even really need much more of an explanation. I think the Space Pirate leader's time to shine will finally be here. Looking back at Melee's E3 reveal, during the announcement trailer (which was an early version of what would become Melee's intro) I saw the crowd's reaction when the scene of Samus and Ridley battling came up. It sounded as though many people believed this was indicating his status as a playable character. It was something interesting...

An offhand comment, if Ridley is indeed playable I expect him to be one of the very first newcomers shown off.

Samurai Goroh - I'm not really a fan of his, nor is he exactly the choice I would most enjoy from F-Zero. But I cannot deny that he has had a steady stream of support stemming from the Melee days. There were some people that also assumed he'd be playable in Melee because of his appearance in the intro. Here is a hint Sakurai. Next time, give them a name badge that reads "NPC" so we can avoid future confusion.

Another off hand comment. Out of the three NPCs that appeared in Melee's opening. Only Wolf has become playable.

Starfy - This is where I begin to differentiate from the pack. While being an AT can either be a pro or con depending upon whom you ask. I'm not really getting into that discussion here as that is not the purpose..

Starfy has had a relatively extensive history, with 5 titles in total for his series as of now. Audiences overseas are now able to play a Starfy game as his series has begun to expand overseas, which still shows a future. The director of his series has expressed interest in developing a console title as well as more games. He tends to get thrown into the "lack of moves" camp, but just viewing some of his games on Youtube alone will portray his flexibilty versus how he may have appeared in Brawl.

Another common misconception is that Sakurai somehow hold's a juvenile grudge against this series? The truth is, he doesn't. He is a grown man that isn't extraordinarily obsessed or proud so as to hold a grudge over a game that is only similar in difficulty and "cuteness". "What about that Brawl update"? The way I see it, he probably has some vague knowledge of the rumours also. Chances are he was just playing along with it. The biggest thing hurting him at the time was the series not having a presence beyond Japan, now that this no longer appears an issue I see no reason why our cute little yellow fellow cannot join the rough tough pink puff?

Roy - This one will probably be more controversial. It doesn't appear that we are going to see another Fire Emblem title soon. They have been redoing the Marth saga for the DS and recent comments by members of Intelligent Systems have pointed towards the next new title being a joining of forces between various existing characters throughout the series. This benefits Roy considerably.

As of now every playable character has been a lord, as they are usually the characters that receive the most story and character, obviously. Roy was and still is considered one of the more popular lords. With his game being considered one of the best. So other characters such as Caeda, Sothe, Black Knight, and Micaiah are hurt by this. Only Caeda stands as the most viable option for a non-lord character.

I've always perceived Mewtwo and Roy as being victims of "priorities". Sakurai had probably intended for them to be playable, but was unable to for various circumstances. Whether or not Sakurai has any interest in bringing back either is unclear. But Roy has the least opposition compared to that of Mewtwo.

Fun Fact: Before Brawl was released many people reported hearing the track "The Kingdom of Bern" on Castle Siege, This track appeared in numerous demos but was mysteriously dropped in the final release.

Little Mac - Along with Pit he has always been a retro character with a lot of support behind him. Although Little Mac has an advantage this time, his series was revived prior to the next Smash Bros (Punch Out!!). On top of that there is a possibility of him having a future as the developers (can't remember who at the moment) have expressed an interest in developing a sequel. So this is a character I cannot see why he wouldn't be able to be playable unless Sakurai deem's him too "punchy" or something along those lines. But given how most characters movesets are only loosely based on their series anyways, I don't think it is as much of an issue as I have seen some portray it.

Saki Amamiya - This one is a little bit tougher, because he does have some things holding him back. Right out of the gate I'll begin with his biggest obstacle, that is his series. His series, out of most all of the series in the game, is among the smallest and least selling. His being an Assist Trophy probably had much too do with the fact that the original 64 title was available only to Japan. So during the time of development they could have been implementing him without knowledge of it's release on the Virtual Console (though I doubt this). Which, the Virtual Console title did sell well overseas. It was because of the sales of the VC title that Treasure even decided to go to Iwata and ask about developing a sequel (Sin and Punishment: Star Successor). To which Iwata allowed them to develop.

Being in Brawl has probably helped him the most out of any character. Even for people who have never played Sin and Punishment, they will be able to loook and Saki and say "wasn't that that guy from Brawl? That trophy thing?". In fact they put so much detail into his AT that Sakurai was practically teasing how playable he looked against the other characters. Also admitting he had been a popular request in Japan. Now with Saki having fans beyond the border of Japan, coupled with those same fans that made him a popular request to begin with. Sakurai may decide to go ahead and flesh him out. Possibly even integrating some elements of the sequel into him.

Shulk - Shulk is an interesting choice to me. He isn't one who get's a lot of attention, but yet comes up every now and then. There isn't much I can say outside of I just see Sakurai gravitating towards this title and want to represent the "Wii RPG trifecta". Xenoblade has become the new "Earthbound". What I mean by this is that it is another Nintendo RPG that the core fans are very rabid and very vocal. If Western gamers put their money where their mouth is (yes I think eventually North America will see a release) I see him being one of the more surprising additions.

Mii - Love them or hate them, they are here to stay. Say what you will but the Mii is Nintendo's largest promotional icon they have at the moment. Only three characters in Nintendo's history have transcended pop culture, and those are Mario, Link, and Pikachu. Add Mii to that list now.

But that raises the question, can Mii be considered a character? Want to know my honest answer? I don't know and I really don't care. I'm not going to rack my brain trying to come to some mental understanding of what exact window Mii falls under. All I know is if the thing is good enough for Mario Kart and other titles, it should be good enough for Smash Bros. The one problem is this comment:

"Of course, I think there was a possibility of taking Smash Bros. in a more casual-gaming direction. For example, we could make the art style simpler or make it possible to use Miis. However, with the various titles that the Wii was to offer, I felt that people were looking for something different. That’s the reason I decided in very early stages of development that the Wii pointer and motion movements would not be a primary feature of the game."

Is it possible Sakurai may end up finding a way to incorporate them? He may. But we will just have to wait and see.

Mewtwo - I know we are going to get an inevitable 5th Generation Pokémon. Whether it is Zoroark, Victini, Pokémon Trainer style N or even N riding on the back of Reshiram. I have no idea what to expect, but I do hope for one thing. That is for Mewtwo to return.

To be honest this character hasn't ever lost popularity. I can talk to 20-something year olds who have never touched a Pokémon game in years yet they can recall Mewtwo and how cool of a character he was. Over at IGN they held a massive Pokémon poll where, they claim, 14 million votes (though taking into consideration multiple votes lower that, but even if you assume on average a vote was cast ten times it would still leave you with 3-4 million votes) were cast. Placing second in this poll was Mewtwo, only beat out by Charizard. So I think the issue of popularity is moot.

The problem he faces comes from the issue of how high will they go wtih Pokémon characters. Pikachu and Pokémon Trainer are staying, A 5th Generation character is inevitable, Jigglypuff will likely stay. Lucario is the only Pokémon in a tough spot, he has the chance of staying or leaving. In an ideal world no one would be cut and we could include both a 5th Generation character as well as Mewtwo. Saying this usually invokes of a response of "that is too much" or "the first generation is over represented". Let me talk about those two complaints.

1: Too many

Who defines this? I mean really are there caps that I was not aware of? Is it impossible for the development team to work on multiple characters at once? When you break it down this argument is quite silly and goes to a fundamental problem with people when the topic of characters arise. They see the roster like we see The House of Representatives. There is nothing to substantiate this as, on the contrary, Sakurai has indicated more towards looking at characters themselves and not "collectively".

2: Over Represented

Again, who defines this? The only thing we are certain of is that Game Freak and The Pokémon Company will push Sakurai for a 5th Generation Character and content. That is it. HeartGold and SoulSilver will likely be represented in a stage and other things. So character wise it is a non-issue. People assume that every generation HAVE to be, but that is something that is neither necessary nor true.

In addition they seem to forget that a playable character is not the only way to represent things. The largest representing entity of Pokémon in Smash Bros are the Pokéball Pokémon.

Mewtwo, along with Roy, was likely also a victim of "priorities". We don't know that to be the case but there are little pieces that point to that. Outside of that, though there are a few more obstacles in his path. There really is no valid reason he should not return, even if we keep everyone from Brawl.
_______

Only characters left needing a write up are Warioware character (leaning towards Orbulon at the moment) and Paper Mario.

 

[Artsy Omni]

@Hex: wow, nice new blog you have there, you definetly opened my mind a little more about character franchises and overrepresentation, good job.

Glad it could be influential, if even for one person. =)

 

[OmegaXXII]

Memory

Sorry if you want this can be my last one from SPM but the reason i posted it is because it's one of the few songs that has ever made me cry.

Was there a such song in SPM? I don't want to know why lol..

 

[Pachinkosam]

spm is cool my favorite song is mexican radio.lol

 

[Luco]

There is. Memory plays a few times. It plays at the end of every chapter, when you learn about Blumiere and Timpani, of different clans, finding each other on the beach where one has washed up. You listen to that, and at first, it seems completely unrelated to the rest of the story. But then...

And it also plays at *sniff* the end, the very end *sniff*. You find out things at the very end, so keep watching until the very end of the credits Omega, the end of the credits is an important part.

 

[OmegaXXII]

spm is cool my favorite song is mexican radio.lol

Lol...not that SPM, I meant Super Paper Mario.

 

[Pachinkosam]

ooo **** my bad!

 

[OmegaXXII]

Ha! It's cool!

@Star:Massive wall you have there, nice summarazation regarding Pokemon inclusion such as Mewtwo as well.

I'd suggest you make a blog or something so it won't get lost in this thread, just sayin'.

 

[Shorts]

Meep. I've already read this :I

Roy - Intelligent Systems have pointed towards the next new title being a joining of forces between various existing characters throughout the series. This benefits Roy considerably.

As of now every playable character has been a lord, as they are usually the characters that receive the most story and character, obviously. Only Caeda stands as the most viable option for a non-lord character.

Doesn't the joining of characters throughout the series benefit every character? While I definitely agree with you that Roy has the best chances out of any Fire Emblem hopeful, I think that this point was sort of silly. I would also like to point out that characters who aren't main characters still can have depth within their own background and story. I don't know much about this game series, but Caeda I would assume has some depth behind her. Well, I'm pretty sure she would.

Toad - A great deal of injustice ihas been done to Toad. Most of the arguments against him I've seen are fueled more by personal bias than legitimate issues or concern. All that is said of him aside, he has been and still is a large aspect of Mario's history. As a race and as a character. After New Super Mario Bros. Wii re-introduced a playable Toad into the mainstream, and with the Toads set to appear again if New Super Mario Bros. Mii is ever established as a legitimate title, there won't much in our little fungi's way.

I bear no grudge against the little guy but don't you agree that popularity can only take you so far? I mean, importance wise, almost every Mario hopeful destroys Toad in this catagory. Junior, Paper Mario, and Fawful even have an upper hand on him. On top of the lack of actual role, he himself has said he's pretty useless in battle, which is something Sakurai isn't interested in. Pacifism just isn't the answer when it comes to this series. Look at poor Tom Nook. Toad has never left the mainstream, this is true. But everything he has done, Bowser Junior does better. With the exception of NSMBWii, which the only reason they became playable was because the creators were too lazy to make Peach and Wario models. If you look at it, the only thing he has up on Junior and PM, is popularity. They take the cake in almost every other aspect.

 

[Kantrip]

Lol at Fawful having an upper hand on Toad.

 

[Artsy Omni]

With the exception of NSMBWii, which the only reason they became playable was because the creators were too lazy to make Peach and Wario models.

They wouldn't have made Peach a playable character in NSMBWii. The joke about having to make dress physics was just a joke: it didn't mean the only thing stopping Peach from being playable was dress physics. Peach wasn't playable because by design, she's the damsel in distress for SMB games.

They selected two different color toads because they are roughly the same size as Mario and Luigi, whereas Wario and Waluigi are much larger, and don't fit into the grid-based level design, which relies on your character being 1 gridsquare tall when small and 2 when large.

 

[Luco]

Been trying to find this for a long time, i'll make it my last one:

Mansion Patrol

Perfect for a Luigi mini game!

 

[Pachinkosam]

ssb4 list of characters. ridley, shadow, solidsnake, knuckles, paper mario, paper bowser, james mcloud, toad ,little mac, eggman, metal sonic, jovany, team rocket, gary, mew. out of ideas.

 

[Oasis_S]

"Toad is a filler character" doesn't exactly help him anyway.

 

[Pachinkosam]

but there alot of toad fan out there.they want him in ssb4

 

[Luco]

I'm thinking if anyone wants to hear whole lot of my old favourite tunes i'll go dig up that post i made a long time ago with like 30 songs in it.

 

[Oasis_S]

but there alot of toad fan out there.they want him in ssb4

For terrible reasons.

 

[OmegaXXII]

Doesn't the joining of characters throughout the series benefit every character? While I definitely agree with you that Roy has the best chances out of any Fire Emblem hopeful, I think that this point was sort of silly. I would also like to point out that characters who aren't main characters still can have depth within their own background and story. I don't know much about this game series, but Caeda I would assume has some depth behind her. Well, I'm pretty sure she would.

Which brings up a good point, since Sakurai did indeed acknowledge that Nintendo is "lacking" new franchises ATM it can be said that Sakurai could indeed be looking at a "lesser" character as well, not necessarly just Roy because of his "Lord" status, if Caeda or The Black Knight are popular in Japan, by my assumption then I'd say they would pretty much be at the very least be considered, just because Roy was or is popular doesn't necessarly mean Sakurai will want him back in, not to say that it won't but it's a big possibility that he might go with any other FE characters if the fans show interest plus if Sakurai himself is interested in that particular character, with that said any FE character that is pretty relevant or popular has a good shot it it, regardless if they are hurt by another character possibly getting the spot. Heck, we might even get a new FE Lord altogether, if that happens we should just kiss goodbye to any of the older FE reps since Marth and Ike are most likely to stay, but again overrepresentation wouldn't take effect if Sakurai deems the franchise to be in favor of more reps, in this case Roy.

 

[Artsy Omni]

ssb4 list of characters. ridley, shadow, solidsnake, knuckles, paper mario, paper bowser, james mcloud, toad ,little mac, eggman, metal sonic, jovany, team rocket, gary, mew. out of ideas.

On the fence about what I think Ridley's chances are
Shadow... doubt it. I doubt Sega will get a second Sonic character in, or even a second character from any franchise
Snake... prolly. I won't say definitely, but the chances are high
Knuckles... doubt it for same reason as above
Paper Mario... maybe? I dunno how Sakurai feels about it.
Paper Bowser... I'm fairly confident he won't be in
James McCloud... Doubt it as well. He has such a small role.
Toad... On the fence.
Little Mac... I hope so. He deserves a spot
Eggman... see above
Metal Sonic... Seriously, man, Sonic isn't going to get that many characters in
Giovanni... doubt it. If pokemon trainer is still in, you can only have so many pokemon
Team rocket... see above
Gary... see above
Mew... doubt it.

 

[Pachinkosam]

ridley got to be ssb4 no answer

 

[---]

I'm back from eating corn.

Anyway, I like the character list, and have no complaints except about Roy.

While I would like his return I don't think it's very realistic:

1. His popularity is less then that of most other FE lords, even lower than his Dad or possible mother Lyn. He's also known in the FE community as one of the worst lords in the series, do to poor stats, skills, and only being semi-useful late game. In fact the only real place his popularity shines is in Smash, but even that has gone done since Brawl and being a clone.

2. I know I will get flammed for this but, to tell the truth, Caeda is the most likely FE character to make it in.

3. She has appeared in just as many games as Marth, including the most recent games in both the U.S. and Japan. She is seen as the 2nd main character, and in the FE community is used all the time due to high popularity and the fact she kicks*** in-game (she's stronger than Marth). Just like Marth, she has also appeared in most FE media, such as the cartoon, TCG, and manga books, meaning she is quite well known in Japan.

I understand your point, and will more then likely be flammed for this small rant, but oh well. But before it begins, for the record I'm for any FE character including Roy.

 

[Artsy Omni]

ridley got to be ssb4 no answer

....what? Grammar?

 

[Luco]

If i copy paste links will they still be in link form?(no pun intended). So if i were to copy paste the post it would still show up here as links, right?

 

[CalvinWars]

Alright guys, get ready for a wall of text. Apologize for my poor grammar, did not have the chance to proof read everything:

Insert Wall of Text.

Toad: Agree with you but I would much prefer to see Bowser Jr. or Paper Mario over Toad. Personal Bias (Like you said) is the main factor due to me playing both Super Mario Sunshine and Paper Mario almost religously when I was younger. Still support him much more than Waluigi or Daisy (I'm pretty sure it was a troll who mentioned her which led to the debate)

Medusa: Agree fully. I don't think we need another Icarus rep but one is bound to happen because of Uprising being done by Sakurai.

Ridley: Only people who don't want him are trolls. Most deserving possible newcomer.

Goroh: F-Zero deserves another rep, but I haven't played them. No comment.

Starfy: No comment.

Roy: Wish they hadn't cut him. One of my favorite Melee characters. Agree with bringing him back (Speaking of bringing him back, have you read Chrono's posts on Roy? They will convince you)

Little Mac: Agree. He deserves it.

Saki: No comment.

Shulk: No comment.

Miis: I think I might be one of the few people who support Miis. As a new face of nintendo, I can see them in. May be a WTF character.

Mewtwo: Agree. I would much rather have him over Lucario (Again, personal bias comes back. I stopped playing pokemon after gen 4, and was a huge fan before that. I still own both of the mewtwo movies on VCR.)

Those are my opinions. Personal bias and not playing games plays a big part. Haven't played F-Zero, Sin and Punishment, Starfy. Haven't followed Xenoblade or the Last Story. Inversally, played a lot of Super Mario Sunshine, PAper Mario, Pokemon, etc.

 

[Starphoenix]

Doesn't the joining of characters throughout the series benefit every character? While I definitely agree with you that Roy has the best chances out of any Fire Emblem hopeful, I think that this point was sort of silly. I would also like to point out that characters who aren't main characters still can have depth within their own background and story. I don't know much about this game series, but Caeda I would assume has some depth behind her. Well, I'm pretty sure she would.

No, it benefit's Roy the most.

I never said the side characters couldn't have character, but the characters with the most of it are lords. Let's be frank here, there is no comparison to her and Roy. I've played Shadow Dragon, own the game on my DS. Roy also has the benefit of Smash behind him.

I bear no grudge against the little guy but don't you agree that popularity can only take you so far? I mean, importance wise, almost every Mario hopeful destroys Toad in this catagory. Junior, Paper Mario, and Fawful even have an upper hand on him. On top of the lack of actual role, he himself has said he's pretty useless in battle, which is something Sakurai isn't interested in. Pacifism just isn't the answer when it comes to this series. Look at poor Tom Nook. Toad has never left the mainstream, this is true. But everything he has done, Bowser Junior does better. With the exception of NSMBWii, which the only reason they became playable was because the creators were too lazy to make Peach and Wario models. If you look at it, the only thing he has up on Junior and PM, is popularity. They take the cake in almost every other aspect.

That still does not negate Toad's history with the series. He is ALWAYS associated with Mario, as a species and character. It goes beyond just the mainline games, but the RPG series and Sports series too. As for New Super Mario Bros. Wii reasoning doesn't change the result, the Toads were playable.

As for the pacifism comment that really is a moot issue. Toad technically beats up characters in SMB2 and New Super Mario Bros. Wii, and seemed to have no problems carrying explosives in Wario Woods. Some of the joking aside Luigi is often portrayed as a coward reluctant to get involved in anything dangerous, does that limit his ability to fight? No. Do you think Mr. Game and Watch or R.O.B had any more of a propensity too fight? No.

 

[Big-Cat]

Perhaps if you can only crouch while pressing straight down?

BlazBlue has the 3C input as the universal tripping attack, and some of those characters have a slide as a tripping move.

In Smash, this would have to be a down-forward A input.

 

[Artsy Omni]

If i copy paste links will they still be in link form?(no pun intended). So if i were to copy paste the post it would still show up here as links, right?

Highlighting text generally only keeps the characters. Not the markup. However, URLs are automatically made into links I believe... could be wrong.

Edit: http://www.google.com

Yup

 

[Luco]

Is there any way i can keep the markup? I don't want to have to go searching for 30 songs again.

Ahh cool, i might be able to do that then.