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New Smash Bros for WiiU

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N3ON

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@ Aaven
Most of the series' sales are in Japan, as well as the popularity of the series. That's 1 country that probably will account for 1/6th-1/8th of Smash Bros' sales. If this was America (where probably more than half of smash bros sales come from), then that would definitely make Layton a leading candidate. However, as it stands, that doesn't do much for Smash, unless Sakurai wants to aim specifically for Japan (again?).
Actually the greatest portion of Layton's sales come from Europe. Which is ironic, considering usually European popularity has the least amount of impact on the future of a series (unfair though it might be). Nevertheless, with Layton still being a big deal in Japan, where like it or not, it matters most to Smash (even if sales are less). Coupled by the fact that Nintendo has a very good relationship with Level-5 and Sakurai and Akihiro Hino (Layton creator and Level-5 prez) are personally friends, I wouldn't dismiss Layton as a contender right away.

Plus I think western Smash fans will be appeased by Ridley and Little Mac, whose popularity is almost solely western. With that considered, two of the three main regions (sorry Australia - I have no data on you) vehemently support Layton's series. And even though it's disproportionate to sales, Japan matters most for character popularity.
 

Johnknight1

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@ Metal
That's a cool Donkey Kong alternate outfit. :p

@ Chaos
Okay, thanks for the correction. :) Still, I doubt Layton would "contend" for a spot with Mega Man or Pac-Man if they are considered or offered by their companies. I am pretty dang sure Mega Man wants pitch Mega Man to Nintendo for Smash, given how much they've referenced smash.
Lolol but he can Quick Draw into the wall and continuously jump off of it to gain vertical momentum, that's already unheard of for Ike, his Quick Draw was buffed too much from my perspective.
Yeah, but it makes counter-picking stages against him easy. Choose stages without a bottom to jump off. Plus really, it can be pretty easy to counter. On a side note, I would like something similar to this to be in Smash Wii U/3DS for Ike, along with an axe for a neutral B.
He can also combo into his Fsmash, that just seems ridiculous to me.
That was the part that irked me a bit, too. Maybe if that was possible only at higher %'s the forward smash being used in combos would make sense, but anytime was a bit crazy.
 

Aaven

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Lol. Yeah I felt a little dirty pulling it off, every time I was behind in stocks I'd just combo into the Fsmash and I'd be caught up.

Other than that I guess you have a point, his recovery was **** before P:M so I can see why they'd buff it so much.
 

N3ON

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@ Chaos
Okay, thanks for the correction. :) Still, I doubt Layton would "contend" for a spot with Mega Man or Pac-Man if they are considered or offered by their companies. I am pretty dang sure Mega Man wants pitch Mega Man to Nintendo for Smash, given how much they've referenced smash.
Yeah Layton would be small news compared to either of those two. I just meant to say that he stands a fairly good chance compared to other 3rd parties (except Megaman).

Plus, I don't think Pac-Man has ever been requested enough that Sakurai would look into getting him. Though I'm sure he wouldn't be turned down if Namco offered.
 

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@ Aaven
Yeah as long his recovery is still somewhat predictable (like Captain Falcon and Ganondorf), it's all good. Although Ganondorf and Captain Falcon need (slightly) better recoveries. And Ganon needs POWER!

Even though Wolf was weak, I liked how he played. It was very Smash 64-ish, and reminded me of Smash 64 Fox. My favorites were Lucas and Ness, especially Ness. That down air of Ness' is SO FAST!!! And I love how they made him not suck, although I wish he actually had grab range! :laugh:

@ Chaos
Agreed. Layton has become a popular series, but sadly Europe's opinion seems to be cast aside.

As for Pac-Man, he wouldn't be turned down, because it would excite Miyamoto to have Pac-Man in Smash. Miyamoto has stated Pac-Man is his favorite character ever. He also made a Pac-Man game once (with Mario's/Luigi's/Wario's/Waluigi's voice actor serving as the announcer) on the Gamecube. Pac-Man was also in 2 Mario Kart arcade games.
 
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Since when did Sakurai state that Japanese were the most important audience when considering popularity? If anything, him saying he doesn't want to focus on Japan-only characters as much directly contradict this and shows that he is putting more emphasis on the West for newcomers.
@SSBF:
You really don't read, do you.
I said that NOW, Sin & Punishment, Starfy, and Punch-Out!! are likely to have proven their worth.
Golden Sun, given the poor reception of Dark Dawn, (reception is a better key than sales, especially when you consider the reception for Golden Sun is only decent in the West) is not likely to have "changed Sakurai's mind" about the series.
But even then, Sakurai has already shown interest in a Sin & Punishment character. The game getting a sequel might be enough to add one.
Um, go look at it's Metacritic/Game Ranking scores again. The reception is good for Dark Dawn. Also, the Golden Sun series have been very positively received.

Isaac is also very popular in the West (definitely in the Top 10) and does get mentioned a few times in Japan as well (more than Little Mac and Ray). He can be one of those newcomers who can get in mainly by popularity in the West like Little Mac and Ridley.
 

Johnknight1

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Dark Dawn's reception was good because the game is good. It's just the 1st 2 games got great receptions and are seen as classics.

It's like the Godfather Part III following the Godfather Part I and II all those years later. Sure, it was a good film, but it paled in comparison to the 1st 2 (althoug the 1st 2 Golden Sun games aren't anywhere near the greatness of the 1st 2 Godfather films). Plus the director's daughter (who played a key actor) couldn't act worth a crap, which was annoying; just like how the points of no return and easy difficulty was annoying in Dark Dawn).
 

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SSBF: The game reviewers may have liked it.

But the fan didn't that much. A lot were very disappointed in Dark Dawn. I even think it was quite lacking. It's fun, but the fact you can miss a lot of stuff beyond easily is a huge downside.

@Metal Overlord: Fulgore Wins. Always. Gladius is not bad, I admit. I like his Teleport Ice Punch.(name withstanding)
 

ChronoBound

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Isaac is also very popular in the West (definitely in the Top 10) and does get mentioned a few times in Japan as well (more than Little Mac and Ray). He can be one of those newcomers who can get in mainly by popularity in the West like Little Mac and Ridley.
The problem is that both Punch-Out and Metroid are series that are known by both Japanese developers and fans to have most of their popularity be Western, whereas Golden Sun pretty much saw a huge decrease in sales worldwide from Lost Age to Dark Dawn.

The series is also a second-party one, of which I think Sakurai probably likes to avoid their inclusion. Shulk might actually fare better since Monolith Soft is actually owned by Nintendo, not just a second-party.
 

N3ON

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Since when did Sakurai state that Japanese were the most important audience when considering popularity? If anything, him saying he doesn't want to focus on Japan-only characters as much directly contradict this and shows that he is putting more emphasis on the West for newcomers.
I would imagine Jigglypuff, Ness, Marth, Roy, and Lucas were added primarily because of Japanese popularity and support, as opposed to... really no character that has yet been added due to primarily western support. (Sonic is more popular in the west, true, but the poll where he placed 1st was a Japanese poll, and Samus was added to a game that was originally never going to make it out of Japan). I guess one could make the argument for Zero Suit Samus, though, if that truly counts as a separate character.

That and Sakurai's polls gauging popularity are only released in Japan.

This time I feel that characters with near western-exclusive popularity will be considered though. (Ridley, Little Mac, .... maybe Isaac? Please?) lol

Isaac is also very popular in the West and does get mentioned a few times in Japan as well (more than Little Mac and Ray). He can be one of those newcomers who can get in mainly by popularity in the West like Little Mac and Ridley.
I really hope this happens. There's a little voice in my head that's saying he won't get in, but I keep telling it to shut up. :awesome:
 

Johnknight1

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It's pretty hard to figure out whether Isaac will make it or not. He's got a lot going for him, and a lot going against him. However, I got a "gut feeling" that in the next Golden Sun game, Isaac will be playable, and probably a/the main character.

Still, I think it's pretty safe to say that Isaac will be on the long list of "initially considered characters" for Smash Bros. Wii U/3DS.
 

ChronoBound

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I think the expulsion of Rare might have served as part of the reason Sakurai might be hesitant on including second-party characters such as Starfy, Isaac, and Ray as playable characters.
 
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I suppose we should try and finish this game no? Well, let's start now! So we can play again, with a little twist on it.

Okay, here we have our current roster of characters:



At this point, I want people to point out a few they think SHOULD be cut, with REASONING behind it. Just saying "cut x, y, and z" won't count as much. Especially since we're coming down to the wire. Your reasoning is going to be judged by me, so let me tell you right now. "They are boring/will be a clone" are bad reasoning.

You can cut veterans, it's just harder to do. We've had people so far try and cut Toon Link, Ike, and Lucario.

This isn't what Smash is PROBABLY going to look like, it's what WE think it SHOULD look like.

If you see a character not up here that you would like to be, please, write up a small paragraph explaining why they should be added to the roster. If it's good, I'll slap them back on here.

Do not have the VS. mentality This is not Mewtwo vs. Lucario vs. Zoroark, or Krystal vs. Goroh, or even Ghirahim vs. Toon Link. Just tell me who you would like to see cut, and why.

If someone is gunning after your character, defend them. Give me reasons for them to stay. I have a list, containing pros and cons for some characters people have brought up.

Remember, it's ust for fun, so relax. If you be a *****, you might as well not play.

Now, without FURTHER DELAY, here is the current roster:
Keep

[collapse=Toad]He should stay. Just because there are haters around bashing him with their opinions (Not Holder, he's cool), doesn't mean he does not deserve to get in. Heck, there are more fans than haters. You obviously know that. Lol

He also is prominent in the Mario series appearing in almost every Mario game despite it being not obvious. He may got the smallest roles from the N64 to the GC era but in the Wii to Wii U era, Toad has noticeable and major roles. In Mario Galaxy, he appears in almost in EVERY galaxy trying to find the power stars. Heck, he even finds them first to mario at times. In New Super Mario Wii, he was also planned to be playable BUT since Peach, Wario and Waluigi could not become playable, Nintendo was left with Toad so they made 2 toads of different colors and made them playable.

Toad, like all candidates, has the huge potential to be unique. His standard attacks can be based on his super strength and super speed however, he'll have short range of course (Cannot predict if Toad will have disjointed range). As stated in Mario bros. 2, he has horrible jumping ability which could mean that he has low jumps in Smash Bros. which may balance his strong and quick attacks. He also has power over spores and mushrooms and use them as shields or weapons as seen in Smash bros., Mario tennis 64 and Mario Sports Mix. He can also jump from walls (Galaxy) and run on walls (Wario Woods). Lastly, Toad can do what Mario can do as shown in New Super Mario Bros. Wii. and Super Mario 3D which might make him have a quite similar moveset as the Mario Bros. Hehe...

So yeah, Toad can be the most or the least unique character in your eyes however, I honestly think he should not be cut from the roster because he's one of the more requested and *cough*... Likely characters. He was missing one thing during the brawl speculation. Big guns = Roles. Now he has 'em.[/collapse]
[collapse=Ghirahim]Ghirahim has a huge *** fanbase. So the popularity **** is pretty covered. Some people say that he might end up like Vaati or Midna. It might actually be true but who knows?

Anyway, the reason why you should keep Ghirahim is because he's fabulous one of the candidates that have the potential to be unique. His normals are based on his sword skills and his kicks. He also has magic darts, teleportation and (I don't know what you call this) a hand that can hold swords.

And that's about it. For more reasons, maybe ask Holder. I think he too wants Ghirahim to be kept in.[/collapse]

The rest of the newcomers are kept. Too lazy to post reasons since it was probably posted in the past. Lol.

Cut:

[collapse=Bowser Jr.]OKAY. He's still one of the slightly likely characters however, him being a sub boss in the recent games kind of made him not so important. Looking at how he's used as a sub boss, he can be a boss in Smash bros. 4. His moveset potential is also great but he might be a semi clone or a clone of his dad. After all, he's known for being the little bowser right? The only thing that makes him unique is the paintbrush. His paintbrush can be used in his specials while he possibly may have the same moveset as his dad only with different attributes. Despite that, he does not have much differences compared to his dad. Lastly, he has a fanbase although it's dying down from what I or most people have seen.[/collapse]
[collapse=Slime and Layton]They're both highly requested... However, the main problem is that they are not as requested as Megaman and obviously, Sonic. I think that's it. That's what should keep them from getting in the roster other than them being 3rd party.[/collapse]
[collapse=Tom Nook]He would be an interesting addition however, he's not all that deserving to get in since not much people request him to become a fighter (I'm one of them). Unlike the crosser who's been... CROSSED OUT ALREADY :awesome: (Ba-dum-tsing), Nook has a slight chance of getting in. Unfortunately, the thing that keeps him off his the fact that he DOES NOT FIGHT.[/collapse]
[collapse=Zoroark]He's pretty much the same as Jr. He's one of the slightly likely characters however, he has problems that halt him. The possibility of a 6th gen character.... The 6th gen might come first but who knows? If it won't come then expect Zoroark. His fate POSSIBLY may lean on this problem which no one probably cares about (Only me, I think).[/collapse]
Now I am off :)
 

Johnknight1

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@ Chrono
I assume it is easier to add 2nd party characters in Smash the 2nd or 3rd time around you have had them in/their series in. I mean, once you get the legal mojo down, it's a lot easier to have it done again now that you've got the paper work of a previous iteration of smash handy.

@ berserker
DAT COLLAPSE TAG!
 

yani

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I think the expulsion of Rare might have served as part of the reason Sakurai might be hesitant on including second-party characters such as Starfy, Isaac, and Ray as playable characters.
This is a pretty interesting point, and I'd definitely say it's valid for Starfy and Ray (Camelot has been with Nintendo forever, but anything is possible of course)

Imagine Banjo-Kazooie in Melee getting cut for Brawl. OH THE PAIN.
 

N3ON

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It's pretty hard to figure out whether Isaac will make it or not. He's got a lot going for him, and a lot going against him. However, I got a "gut feeling" that in the next Golden Sun game, Isaac will be playable, and probably a/the main character.

Still, I think it's pretty safe to say that Isaac will be on the long list of "initially considered characters" for Smash Bros. Wii U/3DS.
I'm hoping the stuff for him outweighs the stuff against him. I'd love a psynergy-based moveset. Plus the sales of his series is higher than most of the competition from newer series (Starfy, S&P, Xenoblade), and I know sales aren't the main component, but if a game sells more than more people would be familiar with it and its characters, though the bulk of the sales are from games over a decade old by now.

Why do you think Isaac will be the main protagonist in the next Golden Sun? Not that I wouldn't love it, but Camelot stated that the first two games were a prologue to what was to follow, making me think that Matthew (or maybe someone new) would be the next protagonists. I would love a game that revolves around playing as Epic Beard Isaac though.
 

ChronoBound

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@ Chrono
I assume it is easier to add 2nd party characters in Smash the 2nd or 3rd time around you have had them in/their series in. I mean, once you get the legal mojo down, it's a lot easier to have it done again now that you've got the paper work of a previous iteration of smash handy.
I am talking about when second-parties to Nintendo no longer become second-party, hence some of the second-party Nintendo characters end up becoming third-party characters (or first-party characters to another hardware developer as was the case with Rare).

Silicon Knights is another example of a second-party developer to Nintendo that became third-party.

The thing is, Sakurai might not want to risk including a second-party character on the roster, and then having to cut that character as a result of the company owning that party going third-party or becoming first-party to a competitor.
 

SmashChu

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@Chrono: Yeah, that's what I've been thinking too. Something to note was Nintendo only owned 49% of Rare.
 

Chico113

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sounds cool, can't wait for more info! but please make sure to have an improved matchmaking speed. also, i hope i don't run into a lot of taunt parties, i don't wanna resort to play with tourneykids trying to turn smash bros into street fighter, lol try-hards....
 

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@ yani
It is better to have had Banjo in Smash, than to have never had him at all. Pls we could have used hacks to create Banjo in Brawl to be based off him in Melee if he was in it, anyways! :laugh:

@ ChaosMANWICH
I'd love a psynergy-based and Earth element-based move set, too. As for Isaac being the main protagonist, I just think given how he is older and stronger, there is no reason not to use him more in the story. I mean literally in Dark Dawn he was basically "just there." It felt like Camelot were going to use him for much more, but Isaac was never really used in the story.
 

N3ON

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I think the expulsion of Rare might have served as part of the reason Sakurai might be hesitant on including second-party characters such as Starfy, Isaac, and Ray as playable characters.
That's a good point I never really thought about, but Rare was in the relatively unique situation of looking to be bought out, either by Nintendo, Activision, or Microsoft (there might have been one more company too), and Microsoft had the highest offer.

I don't think this applies to any of Nintendo's 2nd parties currently (especially fairly independent ones like TOSE or Treasure), although anything could happen with parties not 100% Nintendo-owned.

And although I don't know the legal business, I'm fairly sure Nintendo owns (or at least co-owns) many of the second-party IPs (such as S&P), unlike B&K, which would allow the characters to be used even if the studio was no longer with Nintendo (like Eternal Darkness characters and Silicon Knights).

That's alot of stuff I don't have references on though, I'll try to find some.
 

Johnknight1

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@ Chrono
I assume that fear would only be associated with 2nd party companies that haven't been around too long or Nintendo doesn't own much of a claim of them. If it's a 2nd party that's been around for a long time (think Retro Studios or Intelligent Games), then Sakurai will probably have no hesitation.

Also, Silicon Knights was much better as a 2nd party than they are now as a 3rd party developer.
i don't wanna resort to play with tourneykids trying to turn smash bros into street fighter, lol try-hards....
LOL at randoms talking about things he has no knowledge of in order to sound cool.

Edit: My 6,666th post, w00t! It's like 666 times 6 smash hoes! :grin:
 

Chico113

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@ Chrono
I assume that fear would only be associated with 2nd party companies that haven't been around too long or Nintendo doesn't own much of a claim of them. If it's a 2nd party that's been around for a long time (think Retro Studios or Intelligent Games), then Sakurai will probably have no hesitation.

Also, Silicon Knights was much better as a 2nd party than they are now as a 3rd party developer.

LOL at randoms talking about things he has no knowledge of to sound cool.
whatever you say man.
 

Johnknight1

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You assume competitive players want Smash to be like Street Fighter. We don't.

We want Smash to be competitive, require at least some technical and strategic skill, not encourage players to camp all day (which is something everyone should agree on), not have a competitive gameplay that is basically an advanced form of rock-paper-scissors, not have over half the the roster be offensively non-existent, and not have the same 4 characters win every major tournament because they are so much better than the rest.

A lot of those things I listed were things pretty much everyone wants. Seriously, who wants 1 character (Pikachu in Smash 64, Meta Knight in Brawl) to have no match up weaknesses, and to dominate everyone else like its' nobody's business=???
 

ChronoBound

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@ Chrono
I assume that fear would only be associated with 2nd party companies that haven't been around too long or Nintendo doesn't own much of a claim of them. If it's a 2nd party that's been around for a long time (think Retro Studios or Intelligent Games), then Sakurai will probably have no hesitation..
Retro Studios and Intelligent Systems are not second-party. They are both first-party studios.
 

Johnknight1

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Retro Studios and Intelligent Systems are not second-party. They are both first-party studios.
I know they are now. But didn't they used to be 2nd party studios=???

That's what I was referring to. Sorry if I didn't make that more clear.

Edit: Isn't Sora a 2nd party studio of Nintendo=??? :awesome: (I'm not sure, which is why I am asking)
 

N3ON

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I know they are now. But didn't they used to be 2nd party studios=???

That's what I was referring to. Sorry if I didn't make that more clear.
Retro used to be, but I think IS was always a first-party studio. I could be wrong, but I don't think they've ever made a game not published by Nintendo, although I'm not sure if they were always a subsidiary or at one time just a partner.

If I'm wrong here, someone please correct me, I'd like to get my facts straight.

edit: the majority of Project Sora is owned by Nintendo, but part of it is owned by Sakurai's company Sora Ltd. This makes them first party, but not 100% owned by Nintendo.
 

N3ON

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The Project Sora and Sora Ltd. company thing is confusing. Two companies, same guy running them, different names... :psycho:
I know, Nintendo's parties have always hurt my head. I think I've got the 1st-parties sorted out by now, but the 2nd-parties and which parties are and aren't actually a 2nd party still confuses me.

Things were much more simple back in the days I assumed Nintendo themselves developed and published all their games.
 
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@ChaosKid: Sakurai stated that he recognized that most of Sonic's popularity and requests came out of the West. Had he not looked towards the West, Sonic may not have gotten in Smash 4. He also recognized that Pit was highly requested in both Japan and in the West and noticed he was the only retro rep that accomplished such a feet. Also, Sakurai did state that he does look towards it for popularity on newcomers (---, could you give me the link for it? Thanks).

I feel that the Japanese not wanting newcomers nearly as much as they want to may lead to Sakurai releasing his polls in the West for Smash 4. Little Mac and Ridley's massive popularity in the West is precisely why they have such a good shot of being in and I believe that it can help for Isaac as well.
HyperFalcon said:
But the fan didn't that much. A lot were very disappointed in Dark Dawn. I even think it was quite lacking. It's fun, but the fact you can miss a lot of stuff beyond easily is a huge downside.
Checking Metacritic, people liked it as well. Could someone link me to a place where more people voted on Dark Dawn as a title?
ChronoBound said:
The problem is that both Punch-Out and Metroid are series that are known by both Japanese developers and fans to have most of their popularity be Western, whereas Golden Sun pretty much saw a huge decrease in sales worldwide from Lost Age to Dark Dawn.
The same can be argued for Metroid and Punch-Out!!. Other M's sales were considerably less than that of Prime 3 and Punch-Out!! sales are less than that of the original (much less). Also, Donkey Kong was not doing very well as a series pre-Brawl and it still got Diddy Kong in Brawl.
ChronoBound said:
I think the expulsion of Rare might have served as part of the reason Sakurai might be hesitant on including second-party characters such as Starfy, Isaac, and Ray as playable characters.
I don't see why this would be a problem.

We saw a lot of second-parties series gain representation in Brawl and Camelot has a good relationship with Nintendo (they've made a lot of Mario sports titles). I think Camelot won't be going anywhere soon.

And isn't Sora Ltd. a second-party company?
 

SmashChu

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@ChaosKid: Sakurai stated that he recognized that most of Sonic's popularity and requests came out of the West. Had he not looked towards the West, Sonic may not have gotten in Smash 4. He also recognized that Pit was highly requested in both Japan and in the West and noticed he was the only retro rep that accomplished such a feet. Also, Sakurai did state that he does look towards it for popularity on newcomers (---, could you give me the link for it? Thanks).
Gonna need a source on that one, since it's been confirmed that Sonic was #1.
 

yani

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What's interesting is that in the Smash64 credits, it says Rare gave permission to use Donkey Kong in the game. Just imagine if Rare had their way and kept the DK series. No more original 12. GASP~
 

Johnknight1

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Livermore, the Bay repping NorCal Smash!
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@ SmashChu
The point he was making is that most of the people who wanted Sonic lived in North and South America, Europe, and Australia (if you are referring to the 1st part of his post). I can't prove it, but I can say he is completely right. A high number of Japanese smash fans wanted Sonic, but not in overwhelming droves like people did in the continents I listed.

@ yani
They couldn't have kept Donkey Kong, since he was created before that. The copyright was for the Donkey Kong music most likely, given that the song on Congo Jungle 64 was from DKC. Also, Donkey Kong's profile references Diddy Kong, who was owned by Rare. However, Nintendo owned the intellectual property rights with all things involved with Donkey Kong (Country).

Still, Donkey Kong or Donkey Kong characters not in Smash Bros. after Smash 64 or Melee is a scary thought.
 

ChronoBound

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 20, 2006
Messages
8,998
What's interesting is that in the Smash64 credits, it says Rare gave permission to use Donkey Kong in the game. Just imagine if Rare had their way and kept the DK series. No more original 12. GASP~
No. They were just giving Rare credit for designing the design for Donkey Kong (as well as the stage and music) that was used for Smash 64. Rare at no point had the rights to Donkey Kong as a character.
 

N3ON

Gone Exploring
BRoomer
Joined
Jan 6, 2008
Messages
21,444
Location
Vancouver
@ChaosKid: Sakurai stated that he recognized that most of Sonic's popularity and requests came out of the West. Had he not looked towards the West, Sonic may not have gotten in Smash 4. He also recognized that Pit was highly requested in both Japan and in the West and noticed he was the only retro rep that accomplished such a feet. Also, Sakurai did state that he does look towards it for popularity on newcomers.
I think the west may have influenced Sonic's popularity to be requested in Brawl poll in Japan, but the fact is Sonic still showed up 1st on a Japanese poll. And yes, like Pit, there are alot of characters that are popular in both the west and the east, but none so far have gotten in based solely on the popularity from the west.

I feel that the Japanese not wanting newcomers nearly as much as they want to may lead to Sakurai releasing his polls in the West for Smash 4. Little Mac and Ridley's massive popularity in the West is precisely why they have such a good shot of being in and I believe that it can help for Isaac as well.
I really hope so, I felt left out during the Brawl poll. :sadeyes:
(And it would help Isaac alot)

And isn't Sora Ltd. a second-party company?
Sora Ltd. is an independent company that co-owns Project Sora with Nintendo. Both Sora Ltd and Project Sora are run by Sakurai though, so I understand why it's so confusing. So to answer your question, I guess Sora Ltd would be third party, while Project Sora would be first party
(which evens out to second party :laugh:)
 

yani

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 9, 2008
Messages
1,936
Location
New York
Oh yes you're right, I didn't notice the design part. They did try to take the franchise though, as everything that isn't the big ape himself was made by them
 

N3ON

Gone Exploring
BRoomer
Joined
Jan 6, 2008
Messages
21,444
Location
Vancouver
Oh yes you're right, I didn't notice the design part. They did try to take the franchise though, as everything that isn't the big ape himself was made by them
I think this was the real reason Diddy didn't show up anywhere in Melee, as they were in legal negotiations with Rare at this point. Why Dixie and K. Rool still had trophies though, I don't know. It kinda ruins my theory, lol. Law is hard.
 
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