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New Smash Bros for WiiU

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~ Valkyrie ~

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Got myself imported Rhythm Heaven Fever (BECAUSE NOE HAS TROLLED ME WAY TOO MUCH WITH UNRELEASED OR UNANNOUNCED RELEASE DATES)

Off to play it now. Let's see if Rhythm Tengoku-series have gotten better and what ideas I can come up for representing it in Smash Bros.
 

ChronoBound

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I am curious why Roy detractors constantly have to lie in order to bring down Roy. They say things like Roy's game sold poorly or that he is unpopular in Japan, when there is evidence for the exact opposite.

FE6 was the third highest-selling game in the series:
20/04/90 [NFC] Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon and the Blade of Light (Nintendo) - / 329.000
14/03/92 [NFC] Fire Emblem Gaiden (Nintendo) - / 325.000
21/01/94 [SFC] Fire Emblem: Mystery of the Emblem (Nintendo) - / 776.000
14/05/96 [SFC] Fire Emblem: Holy War Story (Nintendo) - 228.578 / 429.763 (498.000 from sinobi)
28/08/99 [SFC] Fire Emblem: Thracia 776 (Nintendo) - 30.104 / 158.695
29/03/02 [GBA] Fire Emblem: The Sealed Sword (Nintendo) - 126.267 / 345.574
25/04/03 [GBA] Fire Emblem: Blazing Sword (Nintendo) - 109.429 / 265.286
07/10/04 [GBA] Fire Emblem: The Sacred Stones (Nintendo) - 146.026 / 246.719
20/04/05 [GCN] Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance (Nintendo) - 100.357 / 156.413
22/02/07 [WII] Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn (Nintendo) - 73.337 / 171.924
07/08/08 [NDS] Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon (Nintendo) - 147.704 / 252.309

There are also official polls from Japan that show Roy is the most popular character not only in his own game, but in the entire GBA Fire Emblem trilogy as a whole. There are also several unofficial polls that show Roy is one of the most popular characters from Melee, the most missed cut Melee veteran, and the most wanted Fire Emblem character for Smash 4.

With all of this in mind, why do Roy detractors continue to say, "Roy's game sold poorly and he is unpopular"?
 

Sephirothxxx

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I'd love for them to change the name. Even if it's something simple like WII02, as long as it beats WII U I'm okay with it.

Also, Roy is by no means unpopular. I'd know, Roy is my boy. He the reason Fire emblem was ever americanized. And his game did not sell poorly. I dont know why people would say that.
 

Diddy Kong

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His game sold good, in Japan. It's so damn unfortunate that it wasn't localized... Cause otherwise people would DEMAND his return in Brawl. And Roy would've been kinda sweet to have in Brawl... But if he was, I could still see him get cut for this game.

:phone:
 

JavaCroc

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Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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People did demand his return for Brawl, Diddy. Localization not required. He was extremely popular in America... due to Melee, no less. That fire sword is sure popular and all. :p
 

Diddy Kong

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Anyone up for Chrome vs Roy? Or are we just gonna accept that Chrome is the most probable choice for a character?

Nah Roy wasn't nearly as much demanded as the character we got instead: Ike.

Very sad to perhaps see him not return though... But since Fire Emblem will have DLC, maybe Ike and Roy will appear in it as well?? It would boost their chances, but am really not expecting 4 FE Lords. 3 at most. Ike being more likely than Roy.

:phone:
 

Propeller Toad

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I agree that Roy should still be considered as a good returnee to Smash Bros..

Everyone seems to think that it is the flavor of the months that seem to get the upperhand in terms of roster selection, but Roy has had his game and is fairly well known around the world in comparison to other FE characters. I actually wouldn't be surprised if Roy makes a comeback.

@Wii U name changes

It is quite likely to happen after the incident with the 3DS and how people thought it was just an upgraded DS due to the name. I'm sure Nintendo wouldn't want that mistake to be repeated.

I personally want a new and unique name as well for this console.

:phone:
 

ChronoBound

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The funny thing is that Marth got more requests than every other Fire Emblem character COMBINED in Sakura's pre-Melee poll. The funnier thing is how the non-lord Oguma (eight votes) got the same amount of votes as Celice (4), Sigurd (2), and Leaf (2) combined. Needless to say, Sakurai was unhappy about Oguma doing so well in his poll (because his favorite FE character was Nabarl, another mercenary unit from Marth's games).
 

Krystedez

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I would love to see Roy return, honestly it'd make so much more sense to give Ganondorf a hulking mighty sword and have our two epic swordsmen Marth and Roy back :)
 

Diddy Kong

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It's cool you want Roy, but then don't expect Ike. As I'm pretty damn 5000% sure it'll be Marth + Krom as a duo, with MAYBE either Ike (most likely) or Roy (less likely).

Especially if it really indeed is Marth who's the masked man (which I think is about 88% chance it is him) there's more than enough reason to have Marth + Krom. Especially considering it's still Krom as the main character, a long with a My Unit.

So at this point, I'll have to say... Don't expect Roy too soon. Ike most likely will be the 3rd Lord anyway. He's had 2 games, a lot of popularity (both in Fire Emblem and in Brawl) and localization of his TWO games in which he was a main character. He's just better to keep than Roy is to return.

Screw this, am not gonna argue Krom anymore... He's to me as much as a shoo in as Little Mac at this point. Easily. It's now Ike vs Roy at this moment. And even Shiida might be some serious competition for both of them. And frankly, I'd indeed take Marth, Krom and Shiida over anything else.
 

Starphoenix

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I thought the same until I played other fighting games and then came back to Brawl. It's slow, boring, and unrewarding.
That's your problem. You are trying to compare apples and oranges. Even in the Kid Icarus interview Sakurai says Super Smash Bros is supposed to be different than other fighting games. Look I like my fighting games too, but to try and make Smash Bros like Street Fighter or BlazBlu is just not the right avenue.

Sure, perhaps Brawl's gameplay was not executed as well as Melee, but Sakurai is not going to return to either games style of play.
 

Big-Cat

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I would love to see Roy return, honestly it'd make so much more sense to give Ganondorf a hulking mighty sword and have our two epic swordsmen Marth and Roy back :)
I want Ganondorf with Twin Blades.

That's your problem. You are trying to compare apples and oranges. Even in the Kid Icarus interview Sakurai says Super Smash Bros is supposed to be different than other fighting games. Look I like my fighting games too, but to try and make Smash Bros like Street Fighter or BlazBlu is just not the right avenue.

Sure, perhaps Brawl's gameplay was not executed as well as Melee, but Sakurai is not going to return to either games style of play.
Note that I only said that about Brawl though. I love the first two games to death despite their imperfections. The first two Smash games were definitely not slow, boring, and unrewarding.
 

Sephirothxxx

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I want both Mewtwo and Roy back very much, but I want Ike and Lucario to return alongside them
Call me crazy, but I think :roymelee: and :ikebrawl: would go great together in the next smash. But I do think it would be nice if they left :lucariobrawl: out and put :mewtwomelee: back in, but at the same time I dont want any characters cut so maybe it would be cool if mewtwo and lucario were both in it. I dont care what others say, I'm all for the return of :pichumelee: and :drmario: and if they brought back the old :ganonmelee:.

It's cool you want Roy, but then don't expect Ike. As I'm pretty damn 5000% sure it'll be Marth + Krom as a duo, with MAYBE either Ike (most likely) or Roy (less likely).
Roy is one of the most popular Fire Emblem characters. I dont see why they shouldn't bring him back.
 

Metal Overlord

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Yeah, I'm all for the return of Pichu and Dr. Mario

Pichu could be redesigned as the ultimate "high-risk, high-reward" joke fighter of Smash and like Golden suggested a while back, Doc could return as an alternate character (NOT an alternate costume, that's a copout solution) to Mario like the three Gohans were in the first DBZ: Budokai
 

Propeller Toad

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I too am in for the returns of Roy and Mewtwo. If Pichu returned, I definitely would be very happy (even if his chances are not the best). I'd love to see Pichu make its return (since he is one of my favorites in Melee).

:phone:
 

Sephirothxxx

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Yeah, I'm all for the return of Pichu and Dr. Mario

Pichu could be redesigned as the ultimate "high-risk, high-reward" joke fighter of Smash and like Golden suggested a while back, Doc could return as an alternate character (NOT an alternate costume, that's a copout solution) to Mario like the three Gohans were in the first DBZ: Budokai
That sounds like a good idea.... I wish fans could have a little input on smash 4.....
A hope I have for Doc is that they dont nerf his N-air. That sexkick is da bess.

I too am in for the returns of Roy and Mewtwo. If Pichu returned, I definitely would be very happy (even if his chances are not the best). I'd love to see Pichu make its return (since he is one of my favorites in Melee).

:phone:
Pichu is rockin, even if I'm lying to myself. He might suck.... but he sooooo cute. He's one of my favorites.
 

ChronoBound

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Here is an official poll that was done for character popularity in FE4:




The Top 5 were:
1. Fin
2. Ayra
3. Ishtar
4. Lakche
5. Fury

None of the Jugdral lords (Sigurd, Celice, and Leaf) were in the Top 5.
 

BirthNote

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Oh, and a "handful of Pokemon"? It ain't 1st gen no mo, try hundreds of Pokemon
By handful I meant others like Mewtwo, Zoroark, Victini, Genesect etc. Y'know, the pokemon that are usually mentioned on this thread.
 

shinhed-echi

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lol, everytime I come here it's either Pokemon or Fire Emblem talk. XD

Alright let's see...

For Pokemon.. as long as we get Pokemon Trainer back with the same pokemon, I'm pleased. If they could shoehorn Mewtwo in somehow, it'd be great too, but PT is enough for me. By far my favorite character inclusion in the roster (other than Sonic, but as far as Nintendo characters go, PT is my fave).

I don't oppose another trainer idea, seeing as they have so much more pokemon to work with, but I would prefer them taking their time to look at past franchises too. :p


EDIT: Roy needs to return. He could keep his B intact, since Marth pierces forward, and Ike pierces downward... Nothing wrong with Roy slashing vertically like in Melee.

I preferred his dancing blade speed back then too. And the fact that his UP+B could either go more vertically or more horizontally depending on player input.

His counter was kinda useless for the average player though... And that's precisely why it should return. A hard to time counter with an akward knockback angle.
 

Sephirothxxx

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I think Pichu isn't worth the effort and should be left alone. There's a handful of other pokemon to think about.

EDIT @MO: Exactly.
Which takes me back to fire emblem. People say "If Roy was in smash 4, theyd take out ike." But Im pretty sure there is more from the pokemon universe than there is of anything else. Whats wrong with a few fire emblem characters?
 

Bowserlick

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I do not completely understand the desire for Roy. Marth is a good example of a finesse sword player from fire Emblem and Ike is a good example of a brutish sword player. Ike filled the role that Roy was suppose to have.
 

Sephirothxxx

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I do not completely understand the desire for Roy. Marth is a good example of a finesse sword player from fire Emblem and Ike is a good example of a brutish sword player. Ike filled the role that Roy was suppose to have.
Marth and Roy are unique in some ways... and not in others. Roy is also hugely popular, more than Ike.

Of course that not all of the reasons why we want Roy back, just a couple off the top of my head.
 

Diddy Kong

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Gonna voice opinions on the cast as it is now:

:mario2: Revamp slightly. Make him more like his Melee self, with improved F Air and a stronger Fire Ball.
:luigi2: Down B is now Poltergeist. Make it similar to Fludd, but able to charge while walking
:peach: Keep the same more or less like her Brawl self
:bowser2: Boost stats all around. More power, more weight, and make him bigger. Fire Ball option instead of Fire Breath would also be nice. And Melee Up B needs it's return. Badly.
:dk2: Keep his Brawl self, but with an improved Neutral Air, the roll as a dash attack for rush down options and a bit more power on some moves as F Air, F Tilt, N Air and maybe a stronger jab. Love playing as him in Brawl the most still though!
:diddy: Different Down B. Possibly the duo Peanut Pop Gun ground pounding move, with a tripping or stunning effect on impact. A little more power on F Air, and perhaps a different Neutral Air (tail spinning attack). A little more range on U Air to. Otherwise: keep him the same. Please.
:yoshi2: 3rd jump option by holding the jump button. Longer range on tongue attacks as well (like grabs and stuff).
:wario: Less aerial mobility, make him more of a power character. Maybe remove the bike as well for the shoulder charge (and give the bike to say, Mach Rider).
:link2: No more bombs and boomerangs. Say hi to the Shield Bash and Skyward Strike. Better AAA attacks, more speed and definitely bring back (PAL) Melee's Up B. Maybe fuse with Toon Link if he's gone.
:zelda: Down B with a duo tag team attack switching into Impa :awesome: . More balanced stats all around. Change B Air into something else than a F Air carbon copy. Make D Air and D Smash different, and improve her zoning game even more.
:sheik: Remove as a character. Spiritual succesor: Impa.
:ganondorf: Ocarina of Time inspired moveset, further Luigification from C.Falcon. This is a must.
:toonlink: Either remove and replace with the likes of Ghirahim (ugh) or Tingle (double ugh) or chance into something less cloney than Link. Keep the bombs and boomerang for a "Classic Link" playstyle.
:samus2: Less weight, slightly speedier attacks, faster shooting. Chargeable missiles, Morph Ball mode for Down B, uber combo Screw Attack (with double jumping a la Pikachu's Up B)
:zerosuitsamus: Keep her in, and don't change her too much.
:pit: New Side B inspired on Uprising.
:popo: Keep them in, remove wobbling if they can. :/
:rob: Keep him, got an unique moveset and stuffz.
:kirby2: Keep him as his Brawl self basically.
:metaknight: Nerf.
:dedede: No more chain grabs. Distribute his power attacks better to...
:olimar: Less weight maybe.
:fox: Could stay more or less like his Brawl self imo
:falco: Same, just remove stupid stuff like chain grabs and laser locking.
:wolf: Keep him, and let him stay just about the same
:falcon: Make him his Melee self again. Better hitbox on the knee, but not as great as it was in Melee
:pikachu2: Lighter weight, smaller frame, less power, more combos. Static ability: paralyse effect on some attacks which make direct contact with Pika. And, Quick Attack is now 3 jumps, Skull Bash is now... another attack. Iron Tail maybe? Thunder Jolt is more powerful and can stun at higher %.
:squirtle: B is now Bubblebeam and does damage. Side B increases Squirtle's weight, and can be held down to "counter" or block attacks. Can create an oppening. Running side B is still the same attack. Up B is a stronger attack for offensive purpose, and travels a little more distance.
:ivysaur: Side B is faster and stronger. Up B is stronger. If Down B is free: it'll be Poision Powder, Sleep Powder and Stun Powder. Each time a random effect.
:charizard: More speed on his move, far better flying and gliding (think Pit). Flamethrower can be used in the air and lasts longer. Rock Smash is gone for Wing Attack (double tornado version from 3rd gen). Fly goes much higher and automatically goes into gliding mode. If Down B is free: Overheat. Less weight to.
:lucario: Remove the increasing power with higher damage %. Make him play like as if he has around 60~85% damage.
:jigglypuff: Make Sing useful, and Meleeify her a bit like C.Falcon.
:marth: Keep him more or less like his Brawl self, but a little more weight, and a little little slower.
:ike: Up B is now a realistic Aether that can heal damage when all hits connect. B is now a ranged attack. A little less knockback on his moves, but a little faster also.
:ness2: Mortal Damage. Explained this before. Remove PK Fire and PK Thunder for PK Rockin' and PK Teleport. A few more moves need to make use of the bat (think F Tilt).
:lucas: More or less the same as Ness. Except PK Rockin' is PK Love.
:gw: More or less can stay like his Brawl self, but less predictable. Remove some knockback on his Up Smash and F Smash. Make him more annoying and less powerful.
:snake: Less weight... my God. Link / C.Falcon weight at best. Less overpowered hitboxes, less power and more other stuff. Keep his defensive game.
:sonic: I really don't know / care
:mewtwo: Everything I once explained. Basically buff him up, especially in regards of power, priority, range and weight. New B moves for Confusion and Disable.
:drmario: Don't want him back. A possible 6th Mario rep but mehh... :/ Why would they? Make him like his Melee self if he returns. As in: a full clone. Anything else doesn't make sence.
:pichu: Discharge effect on his moves, attacks don't realyl hurt himself unless discharge comes into effect, or Thunder hits himself. Don't really want him to return though... But Pichu at least is cute. And stuff.
:roymelee: Ranged B instead of melee ranged. A few heavy sword swings a la Ike here and there, but more or less would still be a Marth semi clone really. Don't really expect him to return, but maybe as a 4th rep.
:younglinkmelee: No.
 

Sephirothxxx

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@Kirby in the last post I think he should be more like his 64 self.

Meta knight needs to be nerfed.

I hope they keep Sheik...... but if they really end up putting in Impa then I guess I'll have to live with it.
 

Oasis_S

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Why doesn't ChronoBound point out that Roy is the most interesting/unique lord in Fire Emblem.

Sure he's popular, but if people think of him as a Marth clone or that Ike is his replacement, then it's understandable they wouldn't want him back.
 

BirthNote

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Which takes me back to fire emblem. People say "If Roy was in smash 4, theyd take out ike." But Im pretty sure there is more from the pokemon universe than there is of anything else. Whats wrong with a few fire emblem characters?
I don't mind 3 Fire Emblem characters.

@Diddy:
I think a Shield Bash move and Skyward Strike would make for an interesting moveset. I hope they could find a good use for the whip, and I like the bombs. :/
 

ChronoBound

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Why doesn't ChronoBound point out that Roy is the most interesting/unique lord in Fire Emblem.

Sure he's popular, but if people think of him as a Marth clone or that Ike is his replacement, then it's understandable they wouldn't want him back.
Because what is "interesting or unique" is an opinion. You could argue that Ephraim being the only lord with a lance as his main weapon makes him more interesting or unique than other Fire Emblem lords. However, I do think Roy is more interesting than the other sword-wielding lords.

For those who want to appreciate Roy a little more, read the official FE6 manga, Fire Emblem: Hasha no Tsurigi.
 

Oasis_S

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I should have said "most interesting lord CAPABLE OF BEING IN SMASH." Ephraim and Leaf don't have a shot.

But I mean, c'mon, who wouldn't want a FIRE SWORD wielder. RANGED ATTACKS. WITH FIRE. So cool.
 

Diddy Kong

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For all we know Krom indeed has fire effect on his sword. What use would Roy then really have? Especially since you know... Ike suddenly could use fire out of his blade in Brawl. :/

Expecting Roy is asking for dissapointment imo.
 
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