New Smash Bros for WiiU

[Johnknight1]

Can we all just agree that the Red Battle in the 2nd Generation of Pokémon (especially the remakes) was the most epic event in Pokémon history=??? Seriously, that battle still gives me goosebumps...

I wish more games had awesome final opponents like that, especially in such an epic location...

 

[---]

Red is awesome. Read the manga. That is all.

Thank you and good night.

 

[Drclaw411]

Red is awesome. Read the manga. That is all.

Anybody remember those Electric Tale of Pikachu manga/comics that came out in between gen 1 and gen 2? I always thought those were really good. Still have most of them somewhere around here. I remember that you could see the Pokemon inside the Pokeball...the red half of the pokeball was transparent.

 

[Luco]

Yes, so he could gain CHARCTER DEVELOPMENT. Using red exactly from the games wouldn't have made for an interesting adventure because he'd be as dull as a stone. they didn't want that. Apart from that, they wanted basically the same person with minor differences to keep the story INTERESTING.

Look, i have no time left, i seriously have to go. We can have fun arguing next time, or we can comprimise. I have no time, you decide.

Sorry to be such a pain hyper, it's just it's something i never really got and seriously wanted it straightened out, although as you can see i lean to one side more than the other.

Anyway, i had fun for the most part, so i'll see you later. Byyyyyeeeesss! ^^

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Bye, Luco. Sooo... they didn't use Red then. Either way, similar, but widely different overall.

@Johnknight1: No disagreements here. Red is the ultimate badass.

 

[Drclaw411]

So on Pokemon Ranger...I just dug this up. Somebody posted this in the old Pokemon Ranger character support thread during the days of Brawl speculation. I hardly skimmed this, but just to give an idea as to how he/she might play...

B - Capture Stlyer Ground - Solana (who is the default, Lunick is a costume change) throws her Capture Styler foward which can either hook onto a foe and damage him with rock type moves or fall to the ground and leave a trail of rocks behind, if you fall onto the rocks you get damage, you must jump over them. They last for about 10 seconds.

B ^ - Capture Styler Gust - Solana uses her capture styler on herself pointing it towards herself and blowing upwards into the wind. On some levels such as the Pokémon Stadium 2 Flying field it has extra wind so she goes twice as high but on normal fields she goes the regular height. If she does hit a foe it does minimal damage to them.

B > - Capture Styler Psychic - Solana uses her Capture Styler on her foes expelling a purple like cloud which will paralise foes if they touch it. They can't move for 5 seconds, each second that goes by it does 5% damage, it has very small reach.

B V - GO PLUSLE - Solana throws out her Pokéball with her very own Plusle. This gives her a "new moveset" ala Sheik but doesn't actually transform her.

B ^ - Cross - Plusle jumps up really high and Solana jumps up to follow him. She grabs onto his feet, if anyone else touches Plusle while he is up there they get zapped with electricity. Plusle has a slow falling rate whilst doing this move, and I mean very small.

B > - Spark - Solana instructs her Plusle to do spark. Plusle tackles his foe in front with an electric shock, this does about 15-20% damage and may paralize you however Plusle will not stop until it hits something whether it's a wall, foe, AT or Pokémon from a Pokéball.

B - Discharge - Solana uses her Capture Styler to get Plusle to use Discharge, which stuns foes for 10 seconds but does no actual damage, during this time they cannot move at all, after it wares off for about 5 extra seconds they will be slower than normal.

B v - RETURN PLUSLE - Solana brings out her Pokéball and returns Plusle to return to her regular moveset.

NOTE: During the time when Plusle is out then it acts like Nana does for the Ice Climbers when not instructed to do anything.

Costumes:
Red: Solana (Default)
Black: Solana has a Black Jacket and her Plusle is like a shadow Pokemon.
White: Solana has a White Jacket and boots and her Plusle is a darker Red (shiny)
Blue: Lunick (but with Blue Jacket) has Minun instead of Plusle.
Green: Lunick has a Green Jacket and boot and his Minun is shiny (Green)
Yellow: Lunick has a Yellow Jacket and boots and a Pichu instead of Minun.

Taunt one: Solana plays with her Capture Styler before putting it away.
Taunt two: Solana smiles and winks (like all stupid girls do in "anime")
Taunt three: Solana does the horribly cliche peace sign.

Winning Pose 1: She grabs Plusle and hugs him.
Winning Pose 2: She jumps up and yells I did it! Plusle yells it's name.
Winning Pose 3: She giggles and smiles, with Plusle also giggling.

Losing Pose 1: She returns Plusle to his Pokeball and sulks.
Losing Pose 2: She claps with a solemn look on her face.
Losing Pose 3: She turns around and starts to cry.

Also she would be voiced by Rhonda Krempa.

 

[Oasis_S]

Oasis how do YOU feel about Pokemon Trainer? I don't recall you having a strong feeling on him. Unlike me. WELL, it's not him, it's how he ended up. I still like Red, just not the Smashy Red

NOW WHY'D YOU HAVE TO GO AND ASK THAT. I think you're silly for thinking he'll be removed, or that it would be best to remove him (BECAUSE YOU CAN'T JUST LIKE WHATEVER YOU WANT). Your main gripe is that he wasn't executed well, but I'm not sure that's fair since Sakurai probably made him exactly as he wanted. I mean, not being able to be ONLY CHARIZARD sucks, and stamina is annoying, but it all fits with the idea that a Trainer has to be able to use all of his Pokemon as a team.

AND even if he were executed NOT WELL, that's still not a good reason to REMOVE HIM COMPLETELY. I mean, in one character you're showing off MAJOR aspects of Pokemon. Red, for one, the starting Pokemon (which also sort of gets into the type differences), as well as evolution (I think it's funny people think Ivysaur is the weird choice. I mean, he's hardly much different than Bulbasaur or Venusaur, so having him representing the 2nd stage of evolution works perfectly).

Now, I guess it's a possibility that we'll get the Unova trainer with his respective starters (WHICH ONES HE WOULD USE IS A DIFFERENT DEBATE...), but I feel the Pokemon Trainer as a concept, if you will, will remain a mainstay in Smash.

...For "neone" else, I'm not saying I think the Unova trainer will get in and take Victini/Zoroark's spot.

Spoiler

ImeanImeanImeanImeanImeanImean

 

[Big-Cat]

I know I am being uber obvious, but it is true.

I'm not so sure about the star power of Marvel, though. Sure, their movies make a crap ton of money, but just about any movie with lots of explosions (and minimal plot) makes a crap ton of money. The comic book industry isn't doing that well last I checked.

I still think part of the appeal of Smash Bros. is that most of the characters in Smash Bros. are not in fighting games, or at least not many. As the old business phrase goes, "Less is more."

The comic book industry's state of being has no relevance here. What I'm getting at is that the Marvel fanbase is different from the Capcom fanbase just by the fact that they are in separate mediums. Therefore, it's more likely for a gamer to play a Vs. game as opposed to a Marvel fan.

I think the appeal is just in the fact you can have Mario fight Link and nothing more. Technically, it's no different than Ryu fighting Dmitri, it's just that Mario and Link are way more famous than those two.

 

[Shorts]

I don't THINK he will be removed, I WANT him removed. Add six Pokes, and the Javacroc Trainer Idea. I PERSONALLY think on Paper, PT is a cool idea, but after seeing Brawl's interp, it's not MY cup of tea.

But I do find it silly that you think he's going to FOR SURE be a mainstay. *Looks at Mewtwo* That cat went missing.

It's not TRAINERS I have a problem with, I like Java's idea. It's the three in one "You have to be Ivysaur because I want it that way <3 Sakurai " That I don't like. Honestly, he's one of the few characters who I think is severly flawed in terms of concept. The only other one I can think of was Pichu.

It's all personal, and what I WANT, not what I THINK will happen. Silly Oasis~ Although I'm still not sure if Lucario and Red are as safe as we think. They could BOTH go. It has happened before.

he intended him to be one character with three different movesets.

You're acting like I don't get his intention. I do. I just don't like it.

Technically, it's no different than Ryu fighting Dmitriit's just that Mario and Link are way more famous than those two.

*Looks at Melee sales vs. Capcom Fighting Evolution*

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Anybody remember those Electric Tale of Pikachu manga/comics that came out in between gen 1 and gen 2? I always thought those were really good. Still have most of them somewhere around here. I remember that you could see the Pokemon inside the Pokeball...the red half of the pokeball was transparent.

I'm not particularly fond of the manga

 

[Drclaw411]

NOW WHY'D YOU HAVE TO GO AND ASK THAT. I think you're silly for thinking he'll be removed, or that it would be best to remove him (BECAUSE YOU CAN'T JUST LIKE WHATEVER YOU WANT). Your main gripe is that he wasn't executed well, but I'm not sure that's fair since Sakurai probably made him exactly as he wanted. I mean, not being able to be ONLY CHARIZARD sucks, and stamina is annoying, but it all fits with the idea that a Trainer has to be able to use all of his Pokemon as a team.

AND even if he were executed NOT WELL, that's still not a good reason to REMOVE HIM COMPLETELY. I mean, in one character you're showing off MAJOR aspects of Pokemon. Red, for one, the starting Pokemon (which also sort of gets into the type differences), as well as evolution (I think it's funny people think Ivysaur is the weird choice. I mean, he's hardly much different than Bulbasaur or Venusaur, so having him representing the 2nd stage of evolution works perfectly).

Now, I guess it's a possibility that we'll get the Unova trainer with his respective starters (WHICH ONES HE WOULD USE IS A DIFFERENT DEBATE...), but I feel the Pokemon Trainer as a concept, if you will, will remain a mainstay in Smash.

...For "neone" else, I'm not saying I think the Unova trainer will get in and take Victini/Zoroark's spot.

Spoiler

ImeanImeanImeanImeanImeanImean

I agree with pretty much everything you said, Oasis. To me, it seems that people that dislike Red do so because they look at it as a Zelda/Shiek or Samus/Zamus character. Sakurai, I believe, didn't intend Red to be three different characters as much as he intended him to be one character with three different movesets. Sakurai designed the character specifically and intentionally so he WOULDNT be used the way people who dislike the character want to use him. Sakurai wanted you to play as Pokemon Trainer-not just one of the three Pokemon. If he wanted that, those three Pokemon would be separate and Red wouldn't be in the game.

Sure, he could have had Red fight directly by throwing Pokeballs, riding a bike, and using a fishing line. But the way he is designed, he might be the truest to his game of ANY Smash character. He fights his opponents with his Pokemon, just like he does in the Pokemon games. The character was designed so that even while you're fighting with Charizard, you're playing as Red.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I gotta agree with Kuma on the last paragraph specifically.(although I think there's more than just Mario VS Link, but yeah)

Mario VS Sonic definitely helped sales too.

As did Pokemon being playable directly(outside of Trainer) instead of in an rpg setting where you choose moves because you're a Trainer doing it.(although they did remedy this later on with the Mystery Dungeon games a bit)

Likewise, being able to play as Zelda and Ganondorf in a legit game helped.(obvious CDi doesn't count.)

 

[Kantrip]

I've been thinking that implementing a Mii that you can customize is unlikely.

Would people be really disappointed if there was just the default Mii (the one that is shown when you create a new Mii from scratch)? I'm not really sure if I would be or not. The "Wii" games series is very popular and deserves representation, and it's not as if it goes without moveset potential.

Just these two costumes (like Wario) with different pallete swaps and identical movesets/animations.

 

[Johnknight1]

If Smash removed characters that were executed poorly continually, Fox, Falco, the Ice Climbers, Marth, and Peach would be removed for being overpowered or high tier repeatedly, while Bowser, Zelda, Ness, Zelda, and Yoshi for always being bottom feeders, or Luigi, Link, and Mr. Game and Watch for always being average or below average in each of their smash bros. appearances.

 

[Oasis_S]

@Kuma: I wonder what kind of Vs. type game would bring in the most money. Maybe religious icons Vs. music superstars.

@Shorts: WELL FINE. If it's all personal then what can be said. >8

 

[Big-Cat]

*Looks at Melee sales vs. Capcom Fighting Evolution*

Hell, you could look at the quality of the two.

But you missed my point.

 

[Johnknight1]

The comic book industry's state of being has no relevance here. What I'm getting at is that the Marvel fanbase is different from the Capcom fanbase just by the fact that they are in separate mediums. Therefore, it's more likely for a gamer to play a Vs. game as opposed to a Marvel fan.

I think the appeal is just in the fact you can have Mario fight Link and nothing more. Technically, it's no different than Ryu fighting Dmitri, it's just that Mario and Link are way more famous than those two.

The comic book sales and popularity impacts the sales of Marvel Vs. Capcom (of course those super hero movies do help raise awareness for them... a bit). I guess that kind of proves your point...

Again, Mario isn't in fighting games that aren't smash. And if he is, I haven't heard of them. Although you are right about Mario and Link being more popular than anyone in Marvel vs Capcom. Plus playing as "Nintendo's All-Stars" is pretty friggen sweet.

Also, the Pokémon Trainer just needs a few tweaks. Get ride of stamina, make each of the Pokémon have noticeable weaknesses that the other two Pokémon cover up. Sheik and Zelda were done similarly (to an extent) in Brawl, albeit both characters sucked even when paired together.

 

[Drclaw411]

I've been thinking that implementing a Mii that you can customize is unlikely.

Would people be really disappointed if there was just the default Mii (the one that is shown when you create a new Mii from scratch)? I'm not really sure if I would be or not. The "Wii" games series is very popular and deserves representation, and it's not as if it goes without moveset potential.

Just these two costumes (like Wario) with different pallete swaps and identical movesets/animations.

I've actually been calling for this. I personally prefer one specific, generic Mii with a "Wii series" based move set to the potential four player match between Chuck Norris, Peter Griffin, Michael Jackson, and a body with a toilet for a head.

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

BTW, I never got how people hated the Dojo.

Enabled people's Smash addictions, which inevitably bring out the worst in people.

And by worst, I mean mostly ********, but you get the idea.

 

[Kantrip]

I've actually been calling for this. I personally prefer one specific, generic Mii with a "Wii series" based move set to the potential four player match between Chuck Norris, Peter Griffin, Michael Jackson, and a body with a toilet for a head.

Yes. Not only would I advocate for the generic characters, I would even go to say the only chance the Mii has is in the generic characters.

 

[Shorts]

Hell, you could look at the quality of the two.

But you missed my point.

I know I did. Do you think Fighting Evo was done well? Essentially that game is a mix of all of Capcom's fighters right? SF, SFIII, SFA, DarkStalkers, and Red Earth and Ingrid. Well, I guess Final fight wasn't added.. but still, it poses similarties to Smash's basic concept.

If Smash removed characters that were executed poorly continually, Fox, Falco, the Ice Climbers, Marth, and Peach would be removed for being overpowered or high tier repeatedly, while Bowser, Zelda, Ness, Zelda, and Yoshi for always being bottom feeders, or Luigi, Link, and Mr. Game and Watch for always being average or below average in each of their smash bros. appearances.

Blahblah. No. I was talking about the CONCEPT Sakurai had created for Pokemon Trainer is flawed. It runs deeper than Tier list crap. The second he said "Three in one, have no fun!" It was flawed. Same with Pichu's "LOL HE WILL HURT HIMSELF!"

 

[Johnknight1]

I've been thinking that implementing a Mii that you can customize is unlikely.

Would people be really disappointed if there was just the default Mii (the one that is shown when you create a new Mii from scratch)? I'm not really sure if I would be or not. The "Wii" games series is very popular and deserves representation, and it's not as if it goes without moveset potential.

Just these two costumes (like Wario) with different pallete swaps and identical movesets/animations.

I agree on the two different "Basic" looks. That just seems fit for smash bros!

Chuck Norris vs. Chuck Liddell
George Washington vs. Benito Mussolini (hint: The American wins!)
Paris Hilton vs. Ray Lewis
Joe Montana vs. The Man With No Name
Brad Pitt vs. Michael Jordan
Eddie Murphy vs. Waluigi (who can annoy your mother quicker=???)
An egghead vs. A conehead (from the famous Saturday Night Live skits)
Arnold Schwarzenegger vs. Harry Potter
Goku vs. the Hulk
Superman vs. Jesus Christ
Babe Ruth vs. Captain America
Michael Jackson vs. Mike Tyson
Indiana Jones vs. a Metroid face thing
Yoda vs. Barry Bonds

The possibilities are endless!!!

 

[Drclaw411]

I know I did. Do you think Fighting Evo was done well? Essentially that game is a mix of all of Capcom's fighters right? SF, SFIII, SFA, DarkStalkers, and Red Earth and Ingrid. Well, I guess Final fight wasn't added.. but still, it poses similarties to Smash's basic concept.



Blahblah. No. I was talking about the CONCEPT Sakurai had created for Pokemon Trainer is flawed. It runs deeper than Tier list crap. The second he said "Three in one, have no fun!" It was flawed. Same with Pichu's "LOL HE WILL HURT HIMSELF!"

I doubt he said "Three in one, have no fun!". I think he instead decided to make Pokemon Trainer battle the only way he ever has. Honestly, it makes sense. At least to me.

 

[Shorts]

Nope. On the Melee blog.

CHECK IT.

Honestly, it makes sense. At least to me.

It makes sense. I don't like it.

 

[ToiseOfChoice]

toooo bad


did you beat Castlevania yet?

 

[Deleted member]

@Kantrip. Not being able to use your own Mii's defeats the purpose of having them. They have done it in so many other games, why should this be an exception?

I want to be able to play as Kid Goku. The only way I can realize this in even a partial manner is if we get to use our own Mii's. If we're forced to use a generic Mii while fighting, then that is so much potential wasted.

 

[Johnknight1]

Blahblah. No. I was talking about the CONCEPT Sakurai had created for Pokemon Trainer is flawed. It runs deeper than Tier list crap. The second he said "Three in one, have no fun!" It was flawed. Same with Pichu's "LOL HE WILL HURT HIMSELF!"

The way the Pokémon Trainer plays is flawed, but fixable. All you got to do is make them more reliant on each other like Sheik and Zelda. It is a lot easier to fix than you make it out to be. Removing the stamina system was as easy as removing tripping.

I would argue Zelda requires a lot more fixing than the Pokémon Trainer. A lot of her aerials "freeze," her sweet spots are stupid, her specials are near worthless, and the rest of her moves are unsealable (due to lack of reward for the risk of using them), aside from the repetitive 4 or 5 moves that are actually useful. None of Zelda's moves are even remotely stable from game to game. Zelda's overall character is absolutely useless in 2 vs. 2 matches (in both smash bros. games). Sakurai would need to re-create and start over with Zelda's overall play style in order to totally "fix" these issues.

Plus last I checked, who plays Zelda, and enjoys playing Zelda=???

 

[Oasis_S]

Did Toise post a picture of... Serious Geese?!

@Mii: Not being able to pick the face does kind of defeat their purpose. Still, none of that HyperFalcon customizable character crap.

 

[Drclaw411]

@Kantrip. Not being able to use your own Mii's defeats the purpose of having them. They have done it in so many other games, why should this be an exception?

I want to be able to play as Kid Goku. The only way I can realize this in even a partial manner is if we get to use our own Mii's.

Personally, my opinion is that having customizable Mii's waters down the entire concept of Brawl: the characters. Do NAH-roo-TOE, Ross Perot, and Sammy Sosa really have a place in Brawl? Personally, I'd say no. That being said, the Wii games series are extremely popular and, again personal opinion, i'd say they should be repped. Generic Mii's with movesets based on the Wii games is what i'm hoping for.

 

[Johnknight1]

@Mii: Not being able to pick the face does kind of defeat their purpose. Still, none of that HyperFalcon customizable character crap.

I agree that one move set, one weight (basically like a regular character idea) with Mii-related moves would be fine.

Having a Roid Rage battle between Sammy Sosa, Arnold Schwarzenegger, Brian Cushing, Mark McGuire, and Barry Bonds with an actual steroid (Captain Falcon) would be epic!

 

[Kantrip]

Sure Miis would work pretty alright if you could customize, but tell me: How would it work.

Oh I know, you would go through a list of them like you do in Wii Sports and the like, or maybe view the ones stored on your controller. The fact is, you would have tons stored on your Wii U, most likely. When you select the Mii icon, you would then browse through them and pick the face you want, right?

This is dumb, and think about it and imagine yourself playing this game until you see why. If you insist: No, because you'd only store one! Then I ask you: How are you doing it on multiplayer? Oh, you're not, you say? Huh.

I just don't see it happening.

 

[Shorts]

toooo bad


did you beat Castlevania yet?

It lost it's appeal when I was given the choice to use Maria. She's so cheap. Who was that girl with the wolf based attacks/design/whatever you posted about?

I see the Mii's working fine.

 

[Oasis_S]

Perhaps you would assign one to a name? If you had not, you'd be given a generic Mii.

I still see more problems with Miis, though.

 

[Johnknight1]

It's easy to change the Miis' appearance. The game would have an automatic link to various Miis, and you could scroll down a list to choose the one you want, just like the names in Melee and Brawl.

Problem solved son!

 

[Kantrip]

Perhaps setting to name might work. The whole concept is just problematic for the smash brothers series, though.

Best to let the fish be fish and the birds birds.

 

[Johnknight1]

Perhaps setting to name might work. The whole concept is just problematic for the smash brothers series, though.

Best to let the fish be fish and the birds birds.

What about flying fish=???

 

[Shorts]

I agree with Kantrip. Look what happened with Pokemon trainer when we let fishbirdplant interbeeding?

 

[Oasis_S]

Perhaps setting to name might work. The whole concept is just problematic for the smash brothers series, though.

Best to let the fish be fish and the birds birds.

[collapse="Balls."]

[/collapse]

I still see a big problem with the Miis is their having to overcome their graphical style. If the system in place simply copypastas the Wii's model of them, then that just won't work. Sm4sh would have to have some kind of Mii generator of it's own to update the style. I GUESS? I'm really not sure.

This assumes the Wii U would keep the same style of Miis.

 

[Kantrip]

I laughed.

 

[augustoflores]

Ingrid.

I'm drawing Ingrid right now... although, im not allowed to post it anywhere on the net until february 11 or something, idk.

as for the miis... i never liked them... i like the thought of customizable characters as a whole utilizing miis but i dont like miis...

i have this quality vision when i see the X avatars and compare their cartoonyness with the miis cartoonyness... frankly, i hope the miis get an overhaul at sometime in the future... the MAIN thing i don't like about them is their non customizable clothing and their limited bodies (ie no fingers, cruddy arms, cruddy legs, etc)