New Smash Bros for WiiU

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Heated debates?

1. Mario
2. Pokemon
3. 3rd Party
4. FE

KI may become like this, at least until I put my nerd glasses on...

Yup, that looks about right, in terms of major debates.

Mario: Bowser Jr. vs. Toad
Pokemon: Zoroark vs. Victini
3rd Party: Capcom vs. Square Enix

 

[Deleted member]

A few things:

For those who say there would be problem with fitting Mii's style into Smash, look at Mr. Game & Watch. If he of all characters can get in, so can Mii's.

For Pokemon debate, we'll have to see as xIblisx is right in that Pokemon debates tends to be heated here, although on GameFAQs, they're much more subtle.

Mario is where the debates really lie, unless of course Genesect/Meloetta is in the 2012 movie.

 

[Aurane]

@SSBF Don't expect them to be. I overheard Keldeo making his way into being the 15th movie mascot, with the trio Terrakion, Cobalion, and Virizion. It's got something to do with the order of the Pokedex, which makes sense.

 

[Deleted member]

@asage94: The Pokedex order can't really be used for determining the 15th movie as the pattern was broken. Zoroark is #077 on the Unova Pokedex, yet Victini is the very first on it.

 

[Aurane]

@SSBF True, but Victini was also given away on the release date of the game. Although Zoroark was the first PKMN heard of, he wasn't the first in-game event.

The pattern I see is clear: Darkrai was with Dialga and Palkia, Victini is with Reshiram and Zekrom. Next pattern: Giratina and Shaymin. Keldeo and Kyurem. It's just a guess, though. So it doesn't matter.

 

[SmashChu]

QUOTE JENGA!

Not sure if that's always the best since a lot of the meaning can be lost. I split it better this time, so I'm sure it's not a huge deal. just saying.

I like what they do. Except for possibly not including Rainbow Mika and Karin in Street Fighter X Tekken despite rabid fan demand. And what they did to Jill, Tron, and Hsien-Ko in UMvC3. And choosing to not release AAI2 for some mysterious reason. And canceling Megaman Legends 3 when the first two looked like a lot of fun. And the absurd balance changes in SSF4 AE.

Really, it's just the same as me complaining about Meta-Knight's ******** down smash and Samus weak ball. Aside the point.

Are you saying they're not AAA material because of sales or personal preference or what?

Sales namely. It's an objective measure of how a game does. And I use those and see Smash has done. Brawl sold anywhere between 8-10 million depending on who you ask. Of course, I don't have to look at that. I can the fact that the Dojo dominated the internet and there was crazy excitement at E3 for the game. I mean, people get excited when they mention Smash will happen eventually.

Of course, it's not sales so much as I gave the Vs. series an A when, with sales, it might be a B or CCC. Just that it has very dedicated fans, which is fine.

It wouldn't hurt Nintendo if they took some notes from Capcom. Of course, not every game needs it. It depends on the nature of the game. Zelda doesn't need the MvC3 treatment, but Smash could use some elements from it.

Kind of the point I was making was that Smash doesn't need to do what Capcom does because Capcom needs that hype. Their games don't sell anywhere towards Brawl's level. Like now: we are endlessly discussing a game we know nothing about besides there could be two of them. I think it's pretty clear how big Smash is.

I know you hate sales talk, but here is the deal. Capcom's games, namely the VS games, require a lot of hype. This is because Capcom wants it to to better than it normally would. So they have to be at every event and always have trailers and demos. The demos are fine, but the series has released a bunch of them. Smash in comparison, released about 6, and this is from May 2006 from March 2008. Of course, I'm not counting the other little videos. What I'm saying is that Nintendo doesn't need a marketing machine to move their game. It will do fine no matter what route they take.

You're acting as if the surprise is purely good. What you don't realize is that the worst thing about the pre-Brawl days was the insanely massive and moronic speculating surrounding forums everywhere. Aside from very few trailers, we didn't see a whole lot of footage, and you'd be pressed to find actual match footage provided by Nintendo. Snapshots are great for teasers and showing WIPS, but a video would quell a lot of senseless speculation.

The discussion is one of the fun parts. That's why we are all here talking about it. We didn't care we were seeing footage or not. We just got to see more of the game. It's not about the characters or the fighting. Smash has everything. And this way, we got all the info daily. A trailer would not be the same and if you were active in the Dojo days, you'd know. A lot of the funny lines about Smash came from the DOJO. And it creaated enough hype.

Not only that, but fans get to see the game and action and can make a legitimate decision on whether they like what they see. That was not the case with Brawl, and as a result, we got a very polarizing game amongst the people who played the previous games (before you bring your sales bullcrap into this, need I remind you that Melee sold more proportionally speaking and that Japanese sales mean little to nothing).

You wanna try to avoid sales at every turn. I think it's because you can't argue them and the series you like always do worse. Two things

First how the hell did it sell more "proportionality" This isn't like we are comparing 1985 with 2005. This was 2001 vs 2008. There is no proportion. One did better than the other and one did do better in Japan. The fact that Melee sold the worse of the three is a relevant fact whether you like it or not.

Second, as an aside, you people realize saying Brawl is better or Melee is better is comparing Sonic 2 to Sonic 3 or Mega Man 2 to Mega Man 3. Both are great games.

Kuma, you can't ever have a good discussion is anytime someone brings up a different like of thinking, you go "LALALALALALALALA I'M NOT LISTENING." Kind of kills objective discussion on any subject.

Because You Must Recover! put a smile on my face. If you really need that to keep you busy, you need to get a life. I can live without SSB4 speculation because I have other things to do, be it school, playing videogames, practicing martial arts, etc.

Your trying to twist things. I had a lot of other things to do (I was active in school and Student Government when the Dojo was around). I'm saying it was something nice to wake up to.

 

[Big-Cat]

LALALALALALALALA! I'm not listening!

Praise Smash! Glory be to Sakurai!

 

[SmashChu]

LALALALALALALALA! I'm not listening!

Praise Smash! Glory be to Sakurai!

This is why we can't have nice thing!

 

[Big-Cat]

Your spelling sucks.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Your spelling sucks.

Atta boy, Kuma.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Arcadenik]

Your spelling sucks.

Epic, KumaOso.

 

[---]

I'm just wondering how many casualties there have been in this epic KumaChu war.

 

[Oasis_S]

Some day...

 

[Johnknight1]

I would have to disagree. SSBF has already pointed this out but I will say it again. Right now with Fire Emblem, the only two logical contenders for a third Fire Emblem spot are Roy and Chrome. Perhaps throw in the debate as to whether or not Ike will be cut also into the Fire Emblem mix.

The only two series that which I can see there being a heated debate are Mario (between the Toad, Paper Mario, Bowser Jr., and possibly even Geno fanbases) and Pokemon (of which there are many, many different things that will be debated).

Kid Icarus might also have a heated rivalry if Palutena or Medusa are not unveiled at E3 2012 as playable characters for Smash 4.

Other than that, I don't see much debate in regards to third-party spots. The only third-party character whom has mass support is Mega Man. Every other possible third-party newcomers seems to have more detractors than supporters.

So the heated debate tiers are:
1. Mario: Lots of Bowser Jr., Paper Mario, Toad, and probably Geno supporters (and a few Waluigi supporters). There could be up to 6 Mario spots, and it could get ugly.

2. Pokémon: Always a raging battle. In Brawl it was crazy. In Smash Bros. Wii U and 3DS, this could get interesting...

3. Donkey Kong: The Dixie vs. K. Rool debate will be tamer compared to the others, but the debate will be there. A lot of people don't particularly have a favorite between the two, but it is pretty likely we will get one or both.

4. Third Party: Most of us view Sonic and Snake as a given, and Mega Man as very likely. Yet, something tells me if Mega Man isn't revealed early on that this debate could get heated. Other characters like Pac-Man, Slime, Geno, maybe a few Rare characters, etc. could be heavily and (hopefully not) emotionally debated. This could be very, very, VERY ugly if we don't get a new third party character in a trailer...

5. Fire Emblem: Marth is a given. Ike seems pretty likely. There may or may not be a third Fire Emblem spot battle between Roy and Chrome. There may also be just two spots, and it could be a ridiculously crazy battle between Ike, Roy, and Chrome.

6. Kid Icarus: I don't think Kid Icarus will get a second character. It's a possibility. However, even if Kid Icarus gets a 2nd character, it (hopefully) won't be that crazy of a debate.

I dunno, If I was Sakurai it would be pretty hard to resist updating the Dojo with Tingle's silly face, laughing all the while knowing all the Johnknights in the world will be raging.

Tingle is dead in the Legend of Zelda series.

 

[ChronoBound]

What is interesting is that in recent weeks here, most people here seem to think that if Kid Icarus were to get a second character, it would be Palutena, whereas on other sites, the consensus seems to be Medusa. I think people tend to think that villains>sidekicks in importance, however, for many series in Smash Bros. the sidekick usually is the one that gets in as the second character (Mario, Donkey Kong, Zelda, Star Fox). I think the main problems people have with Palutena is that many are not sure whether or not she can fight (but then again neither did Zelda up until Melee) and also that she already cameos as part of Pit's Final Smash. There is also the matter how many support Medusa since she is a "twofer" (female and villain).

 

[---]

@Chrono: Actually it's more or less my fault that Palutena's more supported here, I can explain if you want.

@Oasis: That may work, although getting them drunk won't help their spelling.

EDIT: I guess not. And here I was prepared for a KI debate. lol

 

[Deleted member]

@ChronoBound: There are also some supporters on GameFAQs. Perhaps a poll will clarify where they stand.

I'm also seeing a similar (and more evident) thing for Zoroark and Victini support. The majority of people here prefer Victini and it looks as GameFAQs is coming to similar conclusion as recent polls done has shown the site has a preference for Victini. However, other sites still primary prefer Zoroark and see him as the only option for a 5th gen rep (and for some people, the only Pokemon with a chance that was not in Brawl).

 

[Big-Cat]

Some day...

These never get old. Only thing I have wrong with this is that I hate the taste of alcohol.

Other than that, now I'm picturing some epic fight with SherrifChu constantly throwing projectiles at me while I try to get around and strike with chi-infused attacks.

 

[Hoots]

Some day...

Hahaha that is so awesome.

 

[Deleted member]

This would be a great irony.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

What about minigames? Ya know, something to do when you wanna stop fighting for a bit? And I don't mean Stadium games, like HRC or BtT. Some unique minigames.

 

[Big-Cat]

Then play another game.

 

[Conviction]

But those are the unique minigames...

Avoid the Projectiles! (until death.)

>.>

<.<

 

[thebaconhawk46]

I just want:

Good physics. Not Melee perfect, but at least better than brawl

Some amount of minor skill to be involved in ANYTHING

Sonic to be kicked in the hedgehog ballz for all the times i heard "Your're too slow!"

waddle dees to be top tier.

hitstun and satisfying knockback along wtih REGULAR recoveries

Ganon. Please. Please. Please just bring Ganondorf back. I miss him

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I just want:

Good physics. Not Melee perfect, but at least better than brawl

Some amount of minor skill to be involved in ANYTHING

Sonic to be kicked in the hedgehog ballz for all the times i heard "Your're too slow!"

waddle dees to be top tier.

hitstun and satisfying knockback along wtih REGULAR recoveries

Ganon. Please. Please. Please just bring Ganondorf back. I miss him

Did I miss something? Ganondorf was never removed from Smash, so...

Unless you meant restore his Melee self, you really have nothing to worry about.

 

[thebaconhawk46]

If you call that lumbering oaf in brawl with the speed of a crippled elderly snail in a broken wheelchair, you are sadly mistaken sir

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

You want the viable Ganondorf back.(Ganon isn't technically playable, heh)

I agree. I loved his Melee self. I think they had the right idea in changing his moves, but they didn't do it right. Now he's a weak character. I mean, even the lowest of the low in Melee... still weren't THAT bad.

Albeit, I just want him to have his own moveset. Toon Ganondorf, two swords, magic. That's already more than good enough. Plus, we don't have a full two sword user. Pit uses two swords sometimes, but that's it.(not that notes couldn't be taken from him)

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

If you call that lumbering oaf in brawl with the speed of a crippled elderly snail in a broken wheelchair, you are sadly mistaken sir

Calm down bro. <(T_T)>
Regardless of what he plays like, he still be Ganondorf.

 

[thebaconhawk46]

You want the viable Ganondorf back.(Ganon isn't technically playable, heh)

I agree. I loved his Melee self. I think they had the right idea in changing his moves, but they didn't do it right. Now he's a weak character. I mean, even the lowest of the low in Melee... still weren't THAT bad.

Albeit, I just want him to have his own moveset. Toon Ganondorf, two swords, magic. That's already more than good enough. Plus, we don't have a full two sword user. Pit uses two swords sometimes, but that's it.(not that notes couldn't be taken from him)

I cannot emphasize how much I agree with you! If not even two swords, give him that dirty broadsword that he flashes in Melee when he wins, he could be a better ike, and more renown

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I cannot emphasize how much I agree with you! If not even two swords, give him that dirty broadsword that he flashes in Melee when he wins, he could be a better ike, and more renown

Replace Ike with Hector(or just give Ike an Axe and appropriate moves), and sweet.

Honestly, I didn't even care Ganondorf was a clone. The moves still fit how powerful he is in Canon. I do think he needs to be de-cloned more regardless.

Personally, I think he should his Broadsword, and his TP Sword.(the one from the Anicents) Or any combinations, but those two have both been noted in Smash, and would fit great.

Presuming we get back OOT or TP Ganondorf, of course. There's so far only three versions of him.

I'll be honest though: I wouldn't mind having Ganon with his Pitchfork as the playable character instead. He's been in more games, and has tons of variable moves.

 

[thebaconhawk46]

Calm down bro. <(T_T)>
Regardless of what he plays like, he still be Ganondorf.

Point is, bro, he's the one, the only, and forever will be, Ganondorf.
At my superior playing ability, I wouldn't be able to beat a 5 year old if they played as MK with my Ganon.

Show him some respect by letting him stand a chance is all i ask

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

...Um, I beat a 14 year old playing as MK with my Ganondorf. I don't think that's really true.

MK is definitely the best character, but he does take some effort to play. Any random person isn't going to win with him. Unless they practice.

I think you're underrating G-Dorf a bit, thebaconhawk46.

 

[SmashChu]

Some day...

This is why Oasis is the best poster in this thread

Your spelling sucks.

..............

I'm like Idra in a way. Just as he wants a nice macro game, I want a good debate. I like the debates with Kuma because I like the subject manner. The problem is that Kuma doesn't want to debate or discuss but have everyone agree with what he says. I'm sure people will disagree(namely him), but he's the only person I know here that says people are closed minded when they disagree with him and quotes himself because everyone ignored his idea. It's sad because I can never get a good debate.

The next response out of Kuma will be A)Say something about how Smashchu is this and that (most likely closed minded) or B)Nothing.

These never get old. Only thing I have wrong with this is that I hate the taste of alcohol.

Then your what we call in the old west a wet ninny.

 

[Shorts]

@Universal rosters: Oh please no.

@Krystal: We could always have Peppy and Slippy show up as a sort of Ice Climber duo. IN SPAAAACE.

Maybe Leon since Leon is to Wolf as Falco is to Fox. Oh, and Panther. He was so broken in Command.

Actually, I was thinking we could FINALLY have Andross! Scale him down, like Bowser!

@BaconHawk Are you a girl? I don't know many straight guys into Destery.

 

[Big-Cat]

The next response out of Kuma will be A)Say something about how Smashchu is this and that (most likely closed minded) or B)Nothing.

Hello, it's me! Ivan Pantsed! But you don't hear me complaining.

 

[SmashChu]

Hello, it's me! Ivan Pantsed! But you don't hear me complaining.

Wanna play that way?

Spoiler

Smash Brothers sells more than any Capcom fighting game

 

[Big-Cat]

You're doing it wrong.

How I make sandvich?

 

[Shorts]

Going through a rough patch I see?

If we got:

Young Link (Mask Set)
Doctor Mario (Costume)
Notch Ear/Pika colored Pichu bros
Mewtwo
Roy (Semi Clone)

Would anyone object?

 

[Oasis_S]

Pichu Bros would be better than Plusle & Minun.

Deoxys - the only choice for Gen III.

 

[Propeller Toad]

Pichu Bros would be better than Plusle & Minun.

@What about Ukelele Pichu