New Smash Bros for WiiU

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

King's correct. That's why Ganondorf was like Falcon.

But since you mean Brawl... they still share the same body structure. Ganondorf is still one of the most powerful Nintendo characters due to pure power. He rarely used Magic outside of OoT.(I'm not referring to Ganon) He did use a Sword, yes, but it doesn't change that Power is what he's based upon.

Also, you didn't answer my question earlier: Name one Fighting Games without clones, please.

Honestly, his Specials weren't that bad. Wizard's Foot was nerfed for no reason. Warlock Punch was pointless, but it was still a hard-hitting move, something a musclebound man of great power would have. As for Faithful, this is Smash Bros., not Zelda Fighting. Moves can be made up. Let's keep in mind that none of Falcon's moves were faithful to his own series. Which means that why should Ganondorf be faithful by default? The argument works both ways.

As I said, I hope he's a lot different from Falcon in SSB4. But other than him being not viable at all in Brawl, I wasn't heavily bothered. I don't hate clones, and never will. They're just part of games with too many characters.

 

[SmashChu]

As I said, I hope he's a lot different from Falcon in SSB4. But other than him being not viable at all in Brawl, I wasn't heavily bothered. I don't hate clones, and never will. They're just part of games with too many characters.

Aside I guess, but Ganondorf is viable in standard play. Not tournament play.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

What is standard play?

 

[Deleted member]

What is standard play?

He is referring to casual play with your friends and (the god-awful) online.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

He is referring to casual play with your friends and (the god-awful) online.

I play mostly for fun with my friends. I can assure you, he would not be playable.

By instinct, we all played high tier characters.

 

[Shorts]

Sakurai did say he wants to make SSB4 competitively balanced,so you competitive cats can meow for that~

Psycho Innyoutty, It's weird, whenever I play with my friends, I always end up maining characters playstyle I enjoy, or the character themselves I enjoy. I love Zelda in Melee, and Bowser in both....do you just pick high tiers because you want to win..? :<

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Ganondorf wasn't great for regular play either. And he's one of my secondaries. Ugh, he was horrible in Brawl. Fun to play, not good as is. Horrible in one-vs-one, even if not playing competitively. Not viable at all. Oy.

And that sounds awesome, Shortie. Melee did it right, honestly. It did have some crappy characters, but even then, nobody was so bad beyond the point that they couldn't get a few lucky games in. Even Pichu could. Ganondorf in Brawl? Everybody easily walks all over him unless you go to a casual locals where nobody knows the match-up, and you're extremely lucky. He's the bottom tier for a reason, heh.

 

[OmegaXXII]

Well, I do agree with broserker, Ganon shouldn't be a clone since he has already established himself within Smash, it's about time he got his own moveset with Dark Magic, and maybe sword based? But I guess a further luigification wouldn't hurt?

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Sakurai did say he wants to make SSB4 competitively balanced,so you competitive cats can meow for that~

Psycho Innyoutty, It's weird, whenever I play with my friends, I always end up maining characters playstyle I enjoy, or the character themselves I enjoy. I love Zelda in Melee, and Bowser in both....do you just pick high tiers because you want to win..? :<

By instinctively, I meant we didn't even know there was a tier list

We picked characters we thought we could beat eachother up wtih

 

[SmashChu]

What is standard play?

He is referring to casual play with your friends and (the god-awful) online.

Which is standard because that is what the majority of Smash Brothers players play.

Ganondorf wasn't great for regular play either. And he's one of my secondaries. Ugh, he was horrible in Brawl. Fun to play, not good as is. Horrible in one-vs-one, even if not playing competitively. Not viable at all. Oy.

Again, your looking at tournament play, which is fantasy land and not in-line with the regular game at all.

Ganondorf does fine and works as you'd expect. Just press your hits and go big. It's the same reason why Ike works.

 

[OmegaXXII]

Hehe, I just hope online doesn't turn god-awful once more, the LAAAAAAG!!!!!

 

[Berserker.]

King's correct. That's why Ganondorf was like Falcon.

I already know that but the reason is still unreasonable. So what if he had the same structure as Captain Falcon? Does that mean he HAS to be cloned? At least give him something that he actually does.

But since you mean Brawl... they still share the same body structure. Ganondorf is still one of the most powerful Nintendo characters due to pure power. He rarely used Magic outside of OoT.(I'm not referring to Ganon) He did use a Sword, yes, but it doesn't change that Power is what he's based upon.

He never used his fists actually if you think about it. He only used magic and his swords. Make use of his power in his normals at least but not in his specials. Seriously. He never did Warlock punch or wizrad's kick or even dark dive. The only reasonable and awesome special he has is the murder choke.

Also, you didn't answer my question earlier: Name one Fighting Games without clones, please.

None BUT I still dislike clones

Honestly, his Specials weren't that bad. Wizard's Foot was nerfed for no reason. Warlock Punch was pointless, but it was still a hard-hitting move, something a musclebound man of great power would have. As for Faithful, this is Smash Bros., not Zelda Fighting. Moves can be made up. Let's keep in mind that none of Falcon's moves were faithful to his own series. Which means that why should Ganondorf be faithful by default? The argument works both ways.

If you read the blog of Hex, Falcon's playstyle was still faithful to him despite the unfaithfulness and Captain Falcon's moves came from the anime from what I remember. Ganondorf's moves came out of no where BUT I will admit Sakurai caught Ganondorf's playstyle. Just not the right specials though. It's only the moveset I dislike. That's was you missed.

As I said, I hope he's a lot different from Falcon in SSB4. But other than him being not viable at all in Brawl, I wasn't heavily bothered. I don't hate clones, and never will. They're just part of games with too many characters.

I guess that's just you. As for me, I'm heavily bothered by clones. I hope the same anyway

Replies are in blue

Sakurai did say he wants to make SSB4 competitively balanced,so you competitive cats can meow for that~

Meow

 

[OmegaXXII]

Meow, I want Meowth!!!

 

[Berserker.]

Isn't that....

*Remembers about being dumb in Pokemon*

*Attempts to guess*

Diglett?

HEY YOU EDITED IT

Hehe, I just hope online doesn't turn god-awful once more, the LAAAAAAG!!!!!

Better than envisioning Melee wifi with lag

I mean. WHO WANTS TO PLAY MELEE WITH LAG?

 

[---]

Hmm, well I'm bored, so I'm going to go work on some things in my own batcave.

@Shorts: You can can the roster I sent ya. I'd didn't put any effort into it and I'm going to redo it. So hopefully this saves you some work for now.

 

[OmegaXXII]

Yup, it was Diglett!!

Hopefully, Smash 4 will be more balanced, no Meta-Knight **** again!!

 

[Shorts]

Tryhynatar, send me it. I haven't done any yet, and don't plan to till I am actually in the mood.

 

[OmegaXXII]

Better than envisioning Melee wifi with lag

I mean. WHO WANTS TO PLAY MELEE WITH LAG?

Dude, no ONE wants this, Melee doesn't ever deserves the treatment that Brawl's online turned out to be, if they ever do a remake of it, I hope to see SSB4's online running like MKWii or better.

 

[---]

Tryhynatar, send me it. I haven't done any yet, and don't plan to till I am actually in the mood.

Alright I'll send it to yea when I'm done.

Also what's with the "Tryhynatar?"

 

[Berserker.]

Yup, it was Diglett!!

Hopefully, Smash 4 will be more balanced, no Meta-Knight **** again!!

Wow... Lol. Can't believe I got that right.

Honestly, I didn't find MK so..... Erm.... Meh. He IS overpowered but I have no problems with him at all..... Because I use Snake (But the match up is still slightly in MK's favor but to be honest, it's NOT as hard as what people say).

Anyway, this moveset wins due to the Silver-ness in it.

 

[OmegaXXII]

Tyranitar? Whose that?

 

[Berserker.]

It's Try-hi (---)

 

[OmegaXXII]

Wow, that silver moveset son!!! Hehe, is that what you've been working on? Knuckels would be boss IMO.

 

[Berserker.]

Lolwut?

That's not my moveset. It's from MYM.

Did you even read it? I thought it takes 10 minutes to read something like that.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Berzerker, multiquote me next time. I cannot quote quotes on this part of the board.

Falcon has no official fighting style. You cannot say it fits him any better than it fit Ganondorf. Likewise, Fox's fighting style was made up, loosely based upon ideas from StarFox. The only thing he ever did on foot was fire a Rocket Launcher-like weapon. Also, the Anime came out AFTER Smash Bros. All of that was a Shout Out to SSB, not the other way around.

Clones are not bad. If you have 100 characters in a game, having no clones without really crappy movesets is pretty much next to impossible. Clones will always exist. You're going to have to accept that.

@SmashChu: I don't play competitive, only casual one-on-one. Ganondorf still sucks there too. He's the worst character in the game. It's not the tier list, it's how badly he was made.

 

[OmegaXXII]

Yeah, I assumed it was yours then I clicked it and was like.

that's pretty hardcore stuff man.

Welp....back to my batcave!!

 

[OmegaXXII]

Yeah, DBZ Budokai Tenkaichi is a GREAT example of clones, it has over a jillion characters after all.

 

[JavaCroc]

Well, thanks to the old SSB4 thread, I'll be posting an idea for another All-Star type stage based loosely on a "Survival Mode" concept suggested by Spydr Enzo.

How about All-Star mode is not a single, small stage with boundaries like the one we've seen in Melee and brawl? What about an All-Star rest station that would function more like the Race to the Finish mode?

Basically, players enter the stage from a door on the far left end. The player will progress across this maze to the far right side. As he moves, he will find his path is blocked multiple times, and near each obstruction is a door. Each door enters into an All-Star battle, with the enemies identified by a flashing sign above the door. After the players completes battle, he returns exiting the door to find the obstruction gone. This process continues all the way to the end. Instead of just ending with the final battle, the player's ultimate goal is to reach the end of the level by completing the battles. At the end of the level is something significant, although IDK what.

To add onto the "Race to the Finish" aspect, the course itself could be a test of the platforming skills of all characters with various obstacles outside the basic gates and battle-activated doors blocking progress. I have a feeling this would just unnecessarily increase time in the mode and grow more redundant over time than a basic rest station, though, but it's an idea.

Finally, as per my previous All-Star rest station ideas, the stage would change over time. However, since this is one long level the player must finish instead of a simple rest station, the changes are implemented as separate sections of the maze, each separated by a gate or obstruction and each containing a door and accompanying melee. So, for example, the player starts in a forest-type area and completes the first battle. They then move on into a more sci-fi zone - perhaps an abandoned space port, for example. These sections could also be character-themed assuming we face characters in an order akin to Brawl's All-Star mode. For example, you enter a dense jungle as part of a Donkey Kong section of the maze before you face the Donkey Kong characters.

Credits to Spydr Enzo again for providing the original concept from his Survival Mode idea on the old SSB4 thread.

 

[Berserker.]

Berzerker, multiquote me next time. I cannot quote quotes on this part of the board.

Falcon has no official fighting style. You cannot say it fits him any better than it fit Ganondorf. Likewise, Fox's fighting style was made up, loosely based upon ideas from StarFox. The only thing he ever did on foot was fire a Rocket Launcher-like weapon. Also, the Anime came out AFTER Smash Bros. All of that was a Shout Out to SSB, not the other way around.

Clones are not bad. If you have 100 characters in a game, having no clones without really crappy movesets is pretty much next to impossible. Clones will always exist. You're going to have to accept that.

His fighting style is a "chase" or "run and hit" style. Meh. I'll just quote it:

Characters like Captain Falcon have never been playable outside of their vehicles. Yet when you play as Captain Falcon, you see the very same characteristics in his play style as you see in F-Zero games: he moves extremely fast and there is a lot of risk in his attacks. This perfectly reflects the nature of F-Zero: high-speed, high-risk racing.

I never said anything about his playstyle fitting Ganondorf. Lol

Then again, you can't convince about clones not being bad. It's just my perspective/opinion that clones are bad. It's true that clones will always exist. To be honest though, I'm fine with some characters being clones (Like Falco) but Ganondorf is just plain "wut?".

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I don't honestly care where Race to the Finish is.(Classic, All-Star, Adventure) It just needs to come back. Same with the other mini-games. They were all awesome.(except Generic Target Tests. And arguably the Coin Launcher)

 

[Shorts]

Screw coin launcher. I want to GAMBLE. Gimme a slot, and I will play Multiplayer for an hour just so I can spend that cash at the slots.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

His fighting style is a "chase" or "run and hit" style. Meh. I'll just quote it:

I never said anything about his playstyle fitting Ganondorf. Lol

Then again, you can't convince about clones not being bad. It's just my perspective/opinion that clones are bad. It's true that clones will always exist. To be honest though, I'm fine with some characters being clones (Like Falco) but Ganondorf is just plain "wut?".

That's not what I meant. I meant that they're both powerful bruisers. Ones fast, one's slow. That's really the key difference between them. Albeit, there's more depth to it than that.

And you're correct that Falcon was never playable outside of his vehicle. The only time we knew he could fight was from the Comics(but not the Anime, which came later). So yeah, made up.

The only reason Ganondorf seems "wut" is because he's not from the same series. I already explained why the strength-based moveset fits him. It may not be his moves, but it's based what he is. One of the most powerful men in the universe. Frankly, I'd just call him He-Man without the sword at this point.

Honestly, would it have bothered you the same amount if they chose Black Shadow instead with the same moveset as Melee's Ganondorf?

Screw coin launcher. I want to GAMBLE. Gimme a slot, and I will play Multiplayer for an hour just so I can spend that cash at the slots.

Totally agreed. I didn't enjoy that thing at all. And it's STILL hard to get Trophies with it. The only decent way to pick up Trophies is All-Star or SSE(by playing new games). I never liked that. Trophies shouldn't be THAT hard to pick up, really.

 

[JavaCroc]

I don't honestly care where Race to the Finish is.(Classic, All-Star, Adventure) It just needs to come back. Same with the other mini-games. They were all awesome.(except Generic Target Tests. And arguably the Coin Launcher)

Did you read the whole post? Although the concept is similar to Race to the Finish, it's a little different since it's used in the context of All-Star.

Personally I enjoyed the Coin Launcher and can see lots of potential with it. The only real fix needed for it is for it to be less generic in it's enemies and table and more Nintendo-ified. Think of changing between various tables inspired by Nintendo games fighting Nintendo enemies for Nintendo.

Anyways, heading to a friend's house for a party. See ya guys.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Did you read the whole post? Although the concept is similar to Race to the Finish, it's a little different since it's used in the context of All-Star.

Personally I enjoyed the Coin Launcher and can see lots of potential with it. The only real fix needed for it is for it to be less generic in it's enemies and table and more Nintendo-ified. Think of changing between various tables inspired by Nintendo games fighting Nintendo enemies for Nintendo.

Anyways, heading to a friend's house for a party. See ya guys.

I did. As I said, I don't care how it's brought back. It's something that's fun. Is it linear? Yes. But is it fun? Definitely.

 

[---]

Well I've got to go do some laundry.

Also if anyone is wondering, the best parts of the old thread would be between pages 1800-1970. Yes, I skimmed through all that. That's how bored I was.

 

[Berserker.]

That's not what I meant. I meant that they're both powerful bruisers. Ones fast, one's slow. That's really the key difference between them. Albeit, there's more depth to it than that.

And you're correct that Falcon was never playable outside of his vehicle. The only time we knew he could fight was from the Comics(but not the Anime, which came later). So yeah, made up.

The only reason Ganondorf seems "wut" is because he's not from the same series. I already explained why the strength-based moveset fits him. It may not be his moves, but it's based what he is. One of the most powerful men in the universe. Frankly, I'd just call him He-Man without the sword at this point.

Honestly, would it have bothered you the same amount if they chose Black Shadow instead with the same moveset as Melee's Ganondorf?

I already know that.

I never said anything about his playstyle being unfit. I only said it seemed boring (As seen from pages back). His playstyle fits his personality but the specials and some moves plus the fact that they're just recycled from Captain Falcon still annoy me to the end. It's just the moves that annoy me.

Blackshadow instead of Ganondorf? Actaully, No. It wouldn't bother me at all (Since I wasn't a huge Ganodorf supporter).

So um... Yeah. I was only talking about the specials of Ganondorf all this time so this playstyle talk did nothing. I only posted the playstyle of Falcon to show that he actually had an "official" playstyle which is like Fox's. His moves are based on his racing game.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I already know that.

I never said anything about his playstyle being unfit. I only said it seemed boring (As seen from pages back). His playstyle fits his personality but the specials and some moves plus the fact that they're just recycled from Captain Falcon still annoy me to the end. It's just the moves that annoy me.

Blackshadow instead of Ganondorf? Actaully, No. It wouldn't bother me at all (Since I wasn't a huge Ganodorf supporter).

So um... Yeah. I was only talking about the specials of Ganondorf all this time so this playstyle talk did nothing. I only posted the playstyle of Falcon to show that he actually had an "official" playstyle which is like Fox's. His moves are based on his racing game.

But they're only loosely based upon them. Only moves really is basically the Boost and ability to ram into the opponent, and that's stretching it at best. Moves were pretty much made up on the spot.

And that's the problem. You're only hating on Ganondorf because he's not an F-Zero character. That shouldn't matter. His moves still fit his super strength based persona. As for his Special Moves, his Down B really isn't that unbelievable. I'd like to note that Magic is not only throwing off high-powered Fireballs or Lightning(etc.) Magic can also be levitating, turning your fists on fire, and so on. All those moves are definitely possible by Ganondorf to use. They're not actually unrealistic to the character at all. Which is what you're insinuating.

Anyway, he needs to be de-cloned, or atleast not suck like in Brawl. That's all I think he needs.

 

[Berserker.]

But they're only loosely based upon them. Only moves really is basically the Boost and ability to ram into the opponent, and that's stretching it at best. Moves were pretty much made up on the spot.

And that's the problem. You're only hating on Ganondorf because he's not an F-Zero character. That shouldn't matter. His moves still fit his super strength based persona. As for his Special Moves, his Down B really isn't that unbelievable. I'd like to note that Magic is not only throwing off high-powered Fireballs or Lightning(etc.) Magic can also be levitating, turning your fists on fire, and so on. All those moves are definitely possible by Ganondorf to use. They're not actually unrealistic to the character at all. Which is what you're insinuating.

Anyway, he needs to be de-cloned, or atleast not suck like in Brawl. That's all I think he needs.

At least they were loosely based. Better than having a non-existent, unfitting playstyle right?

And I don't hate Ganondorf. I only hate his specials. His playstyle fits him. I obviously know that. Still, I wasn't a rabid supporter for him during the melee days.

Like I said, despite what you say, the specials are still un-fitting and they should be given to Black Shadow. That's something you can't change and like you, I wish Ganondorf was de-cloned. That's what matters.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

But Ganon's magic never does that.

He moves slowly, NEVER fast. While he does teleport occasionally.

His most common thing is throwing energy balls.

 

[Berserker.]

http://nsider2.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=590720

*Checks*

Cloaked Shadow?

Kanan?

.......

Oh it's Star. Lol.

@Psycho: I agree with ya but the playstyle is fitting. The specials still annoy me though.