New Smash Bros for WiiU

[Conviction]

I still want Magnus from KI.

 

[OmegaXXII]

When did Star become "head honcho" fall back with that mess.

Anyways it's ridiculous for anyone to actually doubt Kuromu having a chance to come in. You can't downplay him, you can't backtrack either on this either.

Your logic says that relevency doesn't matter, correct. Then why do you use the relevency clause in the pokemon case? Either you believe in relevency factors or not? It's well, "it only works for this because it helps my argument."

Wow, I actually never thought about this, seriously, incredible.

I hope Star or SSBFan() answers this.

 

[Berserker.]

I still want Magnus from KI.

I'm fine with that Jetch rip off. As long as he can't kick boulders.

Oh and I want Silver since he isn't a recolor like Shadow

DACFT for Snake only in sm4sh

 

[OmegaXXII]

Silver is Trunks lol...

 

[Conviction]

@beserk: you derp, silver looks more like sonic and more of a sonic personality than does.

@my rant on revelency : its up for anyone to answer. I'm just tired of the contradictions.

 

[---]

@Omega: I commented on this yesterday, so anyway this does give support to both Palutena and Medusa. This further increases Palutena's already strong hold but it also gives Medusa her first true sign of Sakurai's support outside of being a villain.

Still there is the very high chance of getting them both. As IMO, having one get in is like having Mario without Luigi, and I don't think Sakurai will do that.

As for Magnus, he so far looks like nothing more then an anti-hero and side character at the moment. The real attention seems to being going towards Pit and the Goddesses. Throw in Sakurai's statements about over representing his series and lack of support, chances are Magnus is very much AT material.

Of course this will all change for sure once Uprising comes out.

 

[Berserker.]

@beserk: you derp, silver looks more like sonic and more of a sonic personality than does.

@my rant on revelency : its up for anyone to answer. I'm just tired of the contradictions.

@iookie: you derp, shadow looks more like sonic and more of an overrated bad*** personality.

Silver is more heroic. He let Blaze die by not doing anything to save her, he gave the chaos emerald to princess elise making the other sonic games err... look like they're not canon, he let Shadow beat him in a fight. Shadow got lucky because Silver went easy on him later while he was kicking Shadow's *** by doing the infinite throw glitch of doom. Lol. Shows how kind he is

@Omega: I commented on this yesterday, so anyway this does give support to both Palutena and Medusa. This further increases Palutena's already strong hold but it also gives Medusa her first true sign of Sakurai's support outside of being a villain.

Still there is the very high chance of getting them both. As IMO, having one get in is like having Mario without Luigi, and I don't think Sakurai will do that.

As for Magnus, he so far looks like nothing more then an anti-hero and side character at the moment. The real attention seems to being going towards Pit and the Goddesses. Throw in Sakurai's statements about over representing his series and lack of support, chances are Magnus is very much AT material.

Of course this will all change for sure once Uprising comes out.

If that's the case then let the Magnus fanboys make a PSA of him in Sm4sh

 

[Conviction]

@derp: silver has no value in this world coming from the game that everyone wish would fade away. Silver is the epitome of derp.

 

[Sunnysunny]

God hoodie wright, why are you so awesome?!

 

[OmegaXXII]

@Omega: I commented on this yesterday, so anyway this does give support to both Palutena and Medusa. This further increases Palutena's already strong hold but it also gives Medusa her first true sign of Sakurai's support outside of being a villain.

Still there is the very high chance of getting them both. As IMO, having one get in is like having Mario without Luigi, and I don't think Sakurai will do that.

As for Magnus, he so far looks like nothing more then an anti-hero and side character at the moment. The real attention seems to being going towards Pit and the Goddesses. Throw in Sakurai's statements about over representing his series and lack of support, chances are Magnus is very much AT material.

Of course this will all change for sure once Uprising comes out.

So..what you are saying is that Paletuna and Medusa are inseperable like Mario is to Luigi?

Hmm..I don't know if we will get both, I do agree that they are both very likely, but also consider that KI is under Sakurai's direction, meaning Kirby didn't get both Meta-Knight and DDD until Brawl even though they could have been in Melee, I'm not entirely sure though.

 

[Berserker.]

@derp: silver has no value in this world coming from the game that everyone wish would fade away. Silver is the epitome of derp.

O rly nao?

Sorry man. Shadow went first due to his terrible game, Shadow the hedgehog, due to the guuunz and guuunz and terrible controls.

He went first. Shadow the hedgehog (Game/Character) = Disappointment.

Hehe....

 

[OmegaXXII]

@derp: silver has no value in this world coming from the game that everyone wish would fade away. Silver is the epitome of derp.

Implying broserker is definetly derpier.

Confirmed.

 

[Berserker.]

Implying broserker is definetly derpier.

Confirmed.

Your username is derp you know? Oh and, you were always a derp. Forgetting a lot of stuff like 125x125 Phoenix avy I stole but didn't use as an icon.

Shadow's in love with some Maria girl which is gross. Worse.... Event... In sonic..... Ever

 

[Conviction]

@derp: Shadow the Hedgehog>Sonic '0glitch

 

[Berserker.]

@derp: Shadow the Hedgehog>Sonic '0glitch

Sonic '06 > Maria X Shadow

Worse than a "terrible game".

Everyone's getting scared soooo.... I'll stop

 

[---]

So..what you are saying is that Paletuna and Medusa are inseperable like Mario is to Luigi?

Hmm..I don't know if we will get both, I do agree that they are both very likely, but also consider that KI is under Sakurai's direction, meaning Kirby didn't get both Meta-Knight and DDD until Brawl even though they could have been in Melee, I'm not entirely sure though.

My Mario and Luigi example was just something I came up with, as a major KI fan (you wouldn't believe how happy I was when they announced it) having only one would be just plain weird to me. One's light, one's dark, yin yang, stuff like that.

As for Sakurai over reppresenting his own series, I know, and since I don't want to be a hypocrite this is how I see it. Pit, Palutena, and Medusa, are all the creations of the "legendary" Gunpei Yokoi, not Sakurai. So if anything this effects Magnus more then any of them seeing as he's Sakurai's true character for the game.

Throw in the fact that both Pit and Palutena were both redesigned for Brawl back in 05-06. 5-6 years should have given Sakurai plenty of time to probably come to terms with his redesigns. And either way being "the" game specifically designed and promoted for the 3DS, chances are Nintendo may also influence their inclusion as well.

 

[Conviction]

@derp: shadow x maria>silver existance

 

[OmegaXXII]

Your username is derp you know? Oh and, you were always a derp. Forgetting a lot of stuff like 125x125 Phoenix avy I stole but didn't use as an icon.

Shadow's in love with some Maria girl which is gross. Worse.... Event... In sonic..... Ever

You got that avi in 125x125? It's 100x100 though?

I realized when you posted it in the thread the other day, duhhh mr. Derp.

 

[Berserker.]

You got that avi in 125x125? It's 100x100 though?

I realized when you posted it in the thread the other day, duhhh mr. Derp.

Wut. I never posted something like that.

@derp: shadow x maria>silver existance

@Derp: Shadow's life, purpose and existence < Silver's existence

Okay okay lol.... Lets stop now. We just scared everyone away

@SSBF: You saw what I posted in your profile?

 

[Starphoenix]

I haven't really seen a strong case made for that despite ChronoBound trying to push it as such. And as we've seen with Lucario and Ike, new faces have priority over the old. It's a formula that just WORKS, in my opinion. You mention fanbases, but they didn't matter much for Mewtwo, did they?

LET'S SEE THOUGH... With Roy and Ike, he wanted to add more FE characters. Is the more important question whether or not he will say to himself "I want more FE characters?" Because he will probably know Roy is wanted. If he never has to ask himself who to add, Chrome probably wouldn't come under consideration.

Even beyond Chronobound it was something I had heard and knew about before. One interesting thing worth noting, and I can back this up, is that Marth was almost removed from the American version of Melee in favor of Roy. As far as the pre-Brawl support for Mewtwo and Roy a lot of people did not think either character would be cut, especially Mewtwo. Which in turn is the very reason why so many people were shocked to find out they were. Even then there is credible reason to believe they were not intended to be cut, but make of that what you want to.

When did Star become "head honcho" fall back with that mess.

Anyways it's ridiculous for anyone to actually doubt Kuromu having a chance to come in. You can't downplay him, you can't backtrack either on this either.

Your logic says that relevency doesn't matter, correct. Then why do you use the relevency clause in the pokemon case? Either you believe in relevency factors or not? It's well, "it only works for this because it helps my argument."

I don't believe relevancy is as great of a factor. I have held the same standard with every character including Pokémon. The only reason I have thrown Pokémon into the possible exception category is because of Game Freak and The Pokémon Companys' heavy handed involvement. Even then I think do not believe it is as bad as stated.

 

[Oasis_S]

Wouldn't Roy be an even more extreme example of Chrome? He had no fanbase, no moveset potential. There were other popular lords out there like Sigurd, Celice, and Leaf (I think? lol). Yet Roy still made it SEEMINGLY due to relevancy.

 

[Starphoenix]

Wouldn't Roy be an even more extreme example of Chrome? He had no fanbase, no moveset potential. There were other popular lords out there like Sigurd, Celice, and Leaf (I think? lol). Yet Roy still made it SEEMINGLY due to relevancy.

Remember, it was Sakurai's interest that led to the decision to include him. When you are a developer you have the privilege to be able to like a character and include them for the heck of it, which is what happened with Roy. It paid off in the end because Roy was, and still is, one of the most popular lords despite being one of the weaker in the series.

 

[Ussi]

he's only popular BECAUSE of smash

 

[Starphoenix]

he's only popular BECAUSE of smash

Popularity is popularity.

 

[Oasis_S]

I don't suppose you have a source to where Sakurai says he had an interest specifically in Roy? Can't help but think the meaning of it got all twisted up. I mean, he was looking to add a clone. He wanted it to be from Fire Emblem since he's a fanboy. He knew who people wanted for Melee, but I think he would have had to have gone to IS for information about Roy. I'm sure the inclusion of Roy was his idea, but I do think it had more to do with him being the newest lord than anything special about Roy himself. As an advertisement, Roy's inclusion clearly helped the series since I've heard his game was the one of the best-selling. AS AN FE FANBOY, surely that was one of his intentions.

 

[SmashChu]

I don't suppose you have a source to where Sakurai says he had an interest specifically in Roy? Can't help but think the meaning of it got all twisted up. I mean, he was looking to add a clone. He wanted it to be from Fire Emblem since he's a fanboy. He knew who people wanted for Melee, but I think he would have had to have gone to IS for information about Roy. I'm sure the inclusion of Roy was his idea, but I do think it had more to do with him being the newest lord than anything special about Roy himself. As an advertisement, Roy's inclusion clearly helped the series since I've heard his game was the one of the best-selling. AS AN FE FANBOY, surely that was one of his intentions.

Kind of jumping to conclusions. The most likely answer is he wanted another FE character and picked Roy. No need to think into it too much.

Also, Star is right in that popular is still popular. People try to hard to discredit Roy, but he was one of the most popular characters and I wouldn't doubt he was also one of the most played. People love their FE characters.

 

[Starphoenix]

I don't suppose you have a source to where Sakurai says he had an interest specifically in Roy? Can't help but think the meaning of it got all twisted up. I mean, he was looking to add a clone. He wanted it to be from Fire Emblem since he's a fanboy. He knew who people wanted for Melee, but I think he would have had to have gone to IS for information about Roy. I'm sure the inclusion of Roy was his idea, but I do think it had more to do with him being the newest lord than anything special about Roy himself. As an advertisement, Roy's inclusion clearly helped the series since I've heard his game was the one of the best-selling. AS AN FE FANBOY, surely that was one of his intentions.

It is difficult to find the exact source itself as it came from one of his post-Melee blog entries, but I'm sure a little digging will probably make it turn up. I don't care enough to do it myself as I'm not really pro-Roy as much as I'm against a line of reasoning here. Characters do not just get in because they are new, and on top of this there is little precedent to even claim that there is a pattern that can be followed. All we do know is Sakurai has favored the series and as such it has had quite a prominent place in the Smash Bros series.

I also think we need to understand that people are capable of having different reasons for making a decision (as obvious as this may sound). I'm not trying to reduce each decision to one over arching bullet point, rather my only point is relevancy is not as much of a factor as others make it to be.

About popularity. A great example are Strider Hiryu and Captain Commando; they are beloved despite their practical non-existence within their respective company, Capcom.

 

[Oasis_S]

Well the line of reasoning was the main point. I just find it hard to say relevancy is not a factor (or not a big one). I mean, Ness was going to be replaced by Lucas in Melee. Ike and Lucario took priority over Roy and Mewtwo...

I DUNNO. WHUTEFFERS It's time for school. Also, I don't think that was aimed at me but I'm not trying to discredit Roy or anything. Pretty sure he's coming back no matter what, lol. And currently I'm siding with Ike returning, but that's mostly on the point that I think FE13 may not see an international release.

 

[Aurane]

Hey guys just wanted to let you know that I'm going to take a break from this thread for awhile. I'm getting back into playing Pokemon more, so I made a new Social Group called ~Close Combat Club~, whic is a chat group about Fighting-Types. If u wanna join PM me. Neways I lost the Starfy and Wario adventure idea I had, so that's not done..

 

[Starphoenix]

Ahh but you see, there is some potential inconsistency. While Ness may have intended to be cut, he wasn't. Just the same Roy and Mewtwo may have not had been intended to be cut, but they were. Sakurai admitted that he had intended on adding more characters into Brawl but was not able to due to time constraints. Whether Roy or Mewtwo fell into this category I cannot and will not say, but it is a possibility.

Fun fact, Sonic's standard A combo string is a subtle reference to the Virtua Fighter series.
Fun fact 2, apparently Sakurai wanted to include DLC with Brawl but couldn't.
Fun fact 3, Sakurai was the first one to use Snake's Down Special as a recovery.

 

[---]

We're still arguing about Roy and that Sakurai adds the newest lord?

I think you're all forgeting the big counterpoint to that arguement.

I have class in a half hour and have to go, but my hint is to go back to Brawl speculation.

 

[Starphoenix]

The discussion was how much of a role does relevancy play into character selection? That is at least what I was attempting to discuss.

 

[---]

The discussion was how much of a role does relevancy play into character selection? That is at least what I was attempting to discuss.

???

O.k., I thought with all the FE examples it was another FE disscusion. My bad.

Neat facts though.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I'd say relevancy does indeed play a role, just not as the only reason. Pokemon shows this easily. Pichu and Lucario had both relevancy on their side. And if we're discluding the Anime as a reason, their popularity isn't nearly as high.

Also, "popular is popular" doesn't work for Roy in this case. If he's only popular because of Smash, he wouldn't have been added (in Melee) because of popularity. Sorry, but that makes zero sense.

Also, to note about Sonic's A Combo, Sonic the Fighters used the Virtua Fighter engine, so it had a few similar moves here and there. It's not really a subtle reference. It's a pretty clear one if the research is shown.

@Yani: Confirmation of that?

 

[yani_]

Ahh but you see, there is some potential inconsistency. While Ness may have intended to be cut, he wasn't. Just the same Roy and Mewtwo may have not had been intended to be cut, but they were. Sakurai admitted that he had intended on adding more characters into Brawl but was not able to due to time constraints. Whether Roy or Mewtwo fell into this category I cannot and will not say, but it is a possibility.

Fun fact, Sonic's standard A combo string is a subtle reference to the Virtua Fighter series.
Fun fact 2, apparently Sakurai wanted to include DLC with Brawl but couldn't.
Fun fact 3, Sakurai was the first one to use Snake's Down Special as a recovery.

I remember seeing somewhere that Sakurai didn't even know what DLC was

 

[Shorts]

Currently on the KI front it is heavly in Palutena's favor to get in. Medusa, however, still has a very good chance though. Overall though it really comes down to how the anime and Uprising is received. Thankfully there is still the chance of 2 KI characters of which, IMO, the roster can handle.

Well if people would stop and think for a second they would realise that in Smash, villians usually get in at either the same time as the "Second Banana" character, or after. Cases in point, Luigi, Jigglypuff, and Falco. UNLESS Sakurai is like, "Yo dis ***** can't fight", I would expect to see her in before Medusa, or they both get in at the same time. Although I'm skeptical about that series IN GENERAL.


Waaaaah. School again. >:/

Popularity is popularity. It doesn't have to make sense. Ridley and Goroh are two of the most deserving Smash characters, but I wouldn't be too suprised if we end up getting Toad and not one of them. Why you may ask? Because he's a beast in terms of popularity. Everyone loves him for being cute and lame.

 

[Starphoenix]

I'd say relevancy does indeed play a role, just not as the only reason. Pokemon shows this easily. Pichu and Lucario had both relevancy on their side. And if we're discluding the Anime as a reason, their popularity isn't nearly as high.

Also, "popular is popular" doesn't work for Roy in this case. If he's only popular because of Smash, he wouldn't be added because of popularity. Sorry, but that makes zero sense.

Also, to note about Sonic's A Combo, Sonic the Fighters used the Virtua Fighter engine, so it had a few similar moves here and there. It's not really a subtle reference. It's a pretty clear one if the research is shown.

Pichu is not really as good of an example as Lucario.

It does and it can. Look at a character like Strider Hiryu, it obviously works for him. It does not matter where a character derives their popularity from, if they are popular they are popular. It really is not that complicated.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Pichu is not really as good of an example as Lucario.

It does and it can. Look at a character like Strider Hiryu, it obviously works for him. It does not matter where a character derives their popularity from, if they are popular they are popular. It really is not that complicated.

No, it does make a difference. If Roy was only popular because of Smash, he wouldn't have gotten in because of popularity, because it didn't exist BEFORE Smash. That's why the statement makes absolutely no sense. If he was popular before Smash, sure, fine. But that wasn't proven the case at all.

Obviously, I'm referring to Roy getting into Melee, not SSB4.

And yes, Pichu is. They both were popular in the Anime. Pichu was also a reasonable 2nd Gen rep(being a clone just made it easier to put him in). He had both things going for him. Same with Lucario being a 4th Gen rep and being popular in the Anime. The only difference between the two is that Pichu wasn't nearly as popular in the games as Lucario is.

 

[Shorts]

And yes, Pichu is. They both were popular in the Anime. Pichu was also a reasonable 2nd Gen rep(being a clone just made it easier to put him in). He had both things going for him. Same with Lucario being a 4th Gen rep and being popular in the Anime. The only difference between the two is that Pichu wasn't nearly as popular in the games as Lucario is.

I would be willing to go out on a limb and say PICHU Pre-Melee was more popular than Lucario Pre-Brawl. You need to look at the time frames and where Pokemon was at those points. Pokemon had a significantly higher number of fans GS days then they did during DP. Anyways off subject, but I just felt like pointing that out. I also don't see why you brought up popularity in game, when discussing Pokemon, considering it has almost no effect on the roster outcome.

 

[Le vieux lapin]

Anyone else notice that HyperFalcon's post 5 posts up is post #0?
Or is that just my computer?

Oh and Pichu is no joke character.