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New Jiggz Tech- Air Dodge Cancel

GeneralWoodman

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 14, 2008
Messages
1,914
Location
Macungie, PA
AIRDODGE CANCELING- HOW TO BE PRO ON THE GROUND WITH PUFF

FIRST OFF LET ME SAY THAT JIGGLYPUFF HAS THE BEST AIRDODGE IN THE GAME, IT PROVIDES THE MAJOR PURPOSE THAT ALL AIRDODGES PROVIDE, ITS LAGLESS, IT LETS U DODGE ATTACKS, AND ITS DI-ABLE,

WUT MAKES JIGGZ AIRDODGE UNIQUE IS THAT U CAN FAST FALL AND DI IT AT THE SAME TIME OUT OF A SHORT HOP. WUT MOST PUFFS DO OUT OF A SHORT HOPPED AND DI'd AIRDODGE IS SHEILD, THIS IS TYPICAL AND IS WUT CAUSED EVERYONE TO OVERLOOK WUT THE MAIN PURPOSE OF THE DODGE IS.

THE TECH: SHORT HOP, AIRDODGE, FAST FALL AND DI DIAGONALLY TOWARD THE GROUND. LET GO OF THE SHEILD BUTTON. iN THIS POSITION U CAN CHANGE THE DIREDTION UR FACING AND ATTACKS AND ARE NOW LAGLESS ON THE GROUND. HMMMMMM POSSIBILITIES?

AIRDODGE TO RUNNING GRAB/ATTACK- RUN IMMEDIATLY AFTER AIRDODGING TO THE GROUBND AND GRABBING, U WILL TRAVEL TWICE THE DISTANCE AS A NORMALO RUNNING GRAB

AIRDODGE BEHIND OPPONENT AND GRAB/TILT- MOST PPL ALREADY DO THIS, JUST AIRDODGE CANCEL BEHING THEM AND HAX PRIORITY

AIRDODGE FAKIE- LIKE A NAIR, THERE ARE MULTIPLE FRAMES IN THE AIRDODGE OF PUFF, ENUF FRAMES THAT U CAN DI TOWARD AND AWAY FROM UR OPPONENT LANDING THE DISTANCE AN INCH AWAY FROM D3S GRAB RANGE. EX: D3 IS CAMPING AND WANTS TO SHEILD GRAB U. HE SEES UI AIRDODGE AND EXPECTS U TO FALL IN FRONT OF HIM, DI TOWARD AND AWAY AND THEN USE UR LAGLESS PRIORITY TO RUBN AND GRAB IN THE SAME FRAME THAT U LAND, COOL HUH?

ROLL MANIPULATION-THE SPEED OF JIGGZ ROLLOUT ON THE GROUND IS CRAZY, THE OTHER DAY I WAS PLAYING SOMEONE WHO CAUGHT ON TO MY GAME, SO HE ROLLED TOWARD ME. WITH AIR DODGE CANCEL, AT MAX U CAN DI THE DISTANCE OF A CHARACTERS ROLL BY AIR DODGE CANCELING IN FRONT OF THEM, LANDING U DIRECTLY BEHIND THEM. OBVIOUSLY U CAN DO ANYTHING FROM HERE.

FULL HOP AIRDODGE TO U-TILT(USED IF OPPONENT IS ABOVE U AND DI'ING AWAY)- DO EXACTLY AS IT SAYS AIRDODGE WITH THEM AND U-TILT RIGHT AS THEY LAND

AIRDODGE CANCEL GAME- A NEW WAY TO STALL, AIRDODGE CANCEL CONTINUOUSLY IN A REPETITIVE MANNER UNTIL UR OPPONENT ATTEMPTS AN APPROACH

INFINITE BAIRS (SEMI-FADED)- BAIR TWICE TOWARD UR OPPONENT, AIRDODGE AWAY, AND DO THE SAME AGAIN, UR OPPONENT WILL BE SUPRISED HOW FAST U APPAEARED IN THE AIR AGAIN, U CAN BAIR AND THEN AIRDODGE THROYUGH UR OPPONENT IF U WANT TO MIX IT UP.

REVERSE POUND- AIRDODGE INTO UR OPPONENT THEN TURN FACING BACKWARD AND POUND DOWNWARD OR STRAIGHT, U SHOULD HIT UR OPPONENT WITH ALL FRAMES OF THE POUND MEANING THEY WILL BE FORCED TO ROLL, AND THEN U CAN PREDICT WUT TO DO NEXT :)

DOUBLE JUMP AND AIRDODGE-IF U EVER FEEL TRAPPED OR JUST UNCOMFORTABLE WITH UR APPROACH THEN AIR DODGE CANCEL THEN DOUBLE JUMP AND AIRDOGE OR NAIR AWAY

AIRDODGE CANCEL TO SIDESTEP-DOUBLE THE DODGING POWER

FINALLY LET ME EXPLAIN THERE ARE MANY MORE POSSIBLILITIES FOR THIS TECH, THIS TECH GIVES A REASON FOR U TO PLAY PUFF ON THE GROUND MOR OFTEN, IVE ACTUALLY REPLACED MY USUALLY STRATEGY FOR A GROUND STYLE PUFF ON SOME CHARACTERS

NEW FIND- AIR DODGE RECOVERY- IF U AIRDOGE AND DI INTO THE STAGE U WILL SLIDE ACROSS IT A GOOD BIT , ABOUT HALF A ROLLS DISTANCE, WHICH IS RIGHT BEHIND UR OPPONENT IF THERE AT THE EDGE

CHARACTERS U SHOULD USE THIS OFTEN ON:

ANYONE WHO CAMPS/SHEILDGRABS ALOT
D3
SNAKE
GAME AND WATCH
MARIO
LUIGI- PREDICT HIS SHEILD KNOCK BACK(SLIDING)FOR COMBOS
BOWSER
OLIMAR
PIKACHU -JUST WATCH THE DOWNSMASH, DONT GO INSIDE THAT CRAP
WARIO
MARF
ICECLIMBERS
PEACH
WOLF
FALCO-

EVERYONE ELSE U SHOULD BE CAREFUL BOUT, FAST RUNNING GRABS LIKE MK, AND LONG RANGE CLOSE RANGE TACTICS, LIKE ZSS AND WUT NOT

SO EVERYONE MAKE USE OF JIGGZ AIRDODGE CANCELING AND INCOPORATE IT TO UR GAME
 

M-WUZ-H3R3

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 1, 2008
Messages
1,793
lol your CAPS LOCK loves the new attention :laugh:. cool, but I cant exactly picture this in my head. Someone should try it and post a vid. nice find
 

GeneralWoodman

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 14, 2008
Messages
1,914
Location
Macungie, PA
Its A Brokn Find If Used Correctly U Can Beat Someone Without Taking Damage At All, Of Cource That Would Take Serious Mind Games But The Tech Gives Jiggz Some Insane Priority
 

GeneralWoodman

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 14, 2008
Messages
1,914
Location
Macungie, PA
Well It Prevents U From Getting Sheild Grabbed If Used Correctly And The Bair Infinite Is Pretty Cool Too
U COULD BAIR TWICE IN FRONT OF UR OPPONENT THEN SLIDE BEHIND AND GIVE EM TWO MORE BAIRS BEHIND THEM, GREAT SETUP RIGHT THERE
 

Judge Judy

Smash Lord
Joined
May 18, 2008
Messages
1,638
Meh, Fox players tried the same thing, it's far from perfect and far from broken. It's an ok tactic but it's not flawless.
 

DJ Kat

Smash Apprentice
Joined
May 30, 2008
Messages
131
Location
Texas!~
Okay, I honestly am having trouble doing this....

Hate to say it, but: Vidz plx.
 

Glick

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 19, 2008
Messages
1,186
Location
Brooklyn, NY
Do you mean like jumping and airdodging to cancel the jump animation and replace it with an airdodge? Because I'm pretty sure all characters can do that.
 

Crazy Cloud

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 15, 2007
Messages
460
Location
Connecticut
Any way you could upload files of some replays demonstrating this Woody? I can download it and upload them to youtube easy enough.

I doubt I'd be able to do this as effectively as you at this moment, so it'd be better to get it from you xD. But if not, I'll mess with this for a few days and see if I turn up with anything good enough to make a video out of.
 

M-WUZ-H3R3

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 1, 2008
Messages
1,793
a video would be nice lol. make a replay, give it to alex or film it yourself, put it on youtube. jiggz is auto-canceled any way, so idk how to picture this tech.
 

illinialex24

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Joined
May 23, 2008
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Discovered: Sending Napalm
um... that is the opposite of the current meta game for jiggz. you dont want to be on the ground much.
Yeah, except against Game and Watch. This I am trying to improve the ground game for because its truly her only shot to do somewhat decent in this matchup because it has the greatest potential on him (she has little but maybe a little bit).
 

M-WUZ-H3R3

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 1, 2008
Messages
1,793
Yeah, except against Game and Watch. This I am trying to improve the ground game for because its truly her only shot to do somewhat decent in this matchup because it has the greatest potential on him (she has little but maybe a little bit).
G&W cant be the only character that can punish jiggz's air ability..... how about marth and MK?
 

Crazy Cloud

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 15, 2007
Messages
460
Location
Connecticut
Been messing around with this for a few days now (been waiting on you to PM back Woody). I'm starting to understand why this is useful and at the same time, situational (like how her ground game already is).

DIing while in the middle of airdodging allows you to be invulnerable while you space yourself for your tilts (I've thrown in a little fsmash here and there) while also buffering it. Pretty much what Woody said in his OP, and giving some ideas and uses. Which I ignored for the time being, I find it better to get used to something new and come up with a few applications to understand it myself, then go back and look at recommendations.

In application, it compensates for three things.

1) Her slow ground movement
2) The bad range on ground attacks
3) The wind-up time on a few of her ground attacks (but dtilt still doesn't seem that useful with this)

Her ground game doesn't suddenly become useful, but less situational than it previously has been. In my experience so far, I've been using either ftilt, utilt or jab atleast once a match (usually more). But like I said, it's been situational for me so far.

The problem lies within the airdodge. Once an opponent sees that you're in the middle of an airdodge (and I can't fastfall in the middle of the airdodge like woody said is possible), it doesn't matter what is coming next. As soon as you're in the airdodge, your opponent knows you have three "core" options. There's a little room for mixing it up, DIing away and towards your opponent, or DIing towards and away, but they're not really that useful.

1) DI towards your opponent
2) Don't DI at all
3) DI away from your opponent

If you go with #1, then your opponent can react accordingly; punish you during the landing frames, run away, charge up a quick needle/charge shot, ect. Maybe if I got the fastfalling during the airdodge down correctly, it'd be different. Fastfalling prior to the airdodge cuts down it's usefulness. It doesn't allow you to DI very far/effectively before hitting the ground, it also cuts down on the invinciblity frames and these two things combined doesn't allow you to space properly or allow any other options out of the airdodge (Jumping again, another jump -> airdodge, aerials). If you could fastfall during the airdodge, it'd allow for more control and setups. I can't do it, maybe I'm missing something.

tl;dr version

It seems like another situational tactic. Or more accurately, another risk to add to the pile of other situational risk tactics Jiggly has going for her. It makes three of her ground moves less situational/somewhat usable and also sets up grabs quite nicely. I've been able to incorporate utilt a bit better into my gameplay, so I'm content. Nice find Woody, thanks for pointing out something that was obvious and yet useful.
 

Thinkaman

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I don't know where to begin.

First, I can't believe I just read a post written in all caps.

Second, air-dodging into the ground does not constitute a "technique" in Brawl. In fact, it's the exact same as landing, except that you just happened to have done a dodge. It's like saying that falling through platforms is a technique, or jumping out of a dash. (OMG dash-canceled full hop new AT guyz)

Third, all characters can DI and fast fall during an air-dodge. You have no idea what you are talking about.

Fourth, this has very little special significance to the Jigglypuff game. The point of air-dodging to the ground is to go through someone's attack and yet not have the lag associated with the full air dodge animation. (Like, you only want to air dodge half the length a normal air dodge.) While Jiggs has great aerial momentum, that same momentum can usually be used to space air attacks anyway; doing ground attacks instead is a waste, especially when you are trying to stale the bair. If you had posted this in say the Yoshi sub-forum, it might have more relevant.

AND ONE MORE TIME, NEVER DO THIS EVER AGAIN.
 

Crazy Cloud

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 15, 2007
Messages
460
Location
Connecticut
Air dodging into the ground buffers a move into being executed the first frame possible. The point of the topic was Woody pointing out Jiggly still has some decent DI during the airdodge animation.

I'm not in disagreement with you thinkaman, but I wanted to atleast try it out and give my two cents on it (I like buffering utilt at low percents). What improvement her ground game gets by buffering her tilts doesn't compare in usefulness to WoPing. But, maybe it could help in her air game. Buffered short hop bairs :confused:?
 

Flamingo777

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 12, 2008
Messages
174
Location
NC STATE UNIVERSITAY
AIRDODGE CANCELING- HOW TO BE PRO ON THE GROUND WITH PUFF

FIRST OFF LET ME SAY THAT JIGGLYPUFF HAS THE BEST AIRDODGE IN THE GAME, IT PROVIDES THE MAJOR PURPOSE THAT ALL AIRDODGES PROVIDE, ITS LAGLESS, IT LETS U DODGE ATTACKS, AND ITS DI-ABLE,

WUT MAKES JIGGZ AIRDODGE UNIQUE IS THAT U CAN FAST FALL AND DI IT AT THE SAME TIME OUT OF A SHORT HOP. WUT MOST PUFFS DO OUT OF A SHORT HOPPED AND DI'd AIRDODGE IS SHEILD, THIS IS TYPICAL AND IS WUT CAUSED EVERYONE TO OVERLOOK WUT THE MAIN PURPOSE OF THE DODGE IS.

THE TECH: SHORT HOP, AIRDODGE, FAST FALL AND DI DIAGONALLY TOWARD THE GROUND. LET GO OF THE SHEILD BUTTON. iN THIS POSITION U CAN CHANGE THE DIREDTION UR FACING AND ATTACKS AND ARE NOW LAGLESS ON THE GROUND. HMMMMMM POSSIBILITIES?

AIRDODGE TO RUNNING GRAB/ATTACK- RUN IMMEDIATLY AFTER AIRDODGING TO THE GROUBND AND GRABBING, U WILL TRAVEL TWICE THE DISTANCE AS A NORMALO RUNNING GRAB

AIRDODGE BEHIND OPPONENT AND GRAB/TILT- MOST PPL ALREADY DO THIS, JUST AIRDODGE CANCEL BEHING THEM AND HAX PRIORITY

AIRDODGE FAKIE- LIKE A NAIR, THERE ARE MULTIPLE FRAMES IN THE AIRDODGE OF PUFF, ENUF FRAMES THAT U CAN DI TOWARD AND AWAY FROM UR OPPONENT LANDING THE DISTANCE AN INCH AWAY FROM D3S GRAB RANGE. EX: D3 IS CAMPING AND WANTS TO SHEILD GRAB U. HE SEES UI AIRDODGE AND EXPECTS U TO FALL IN FRONT OF HIM, DI TOWARD AND AWAY AND THEN USE UR LAGLESS PRIORITY TO RUBN AND GRAB IN THE SAME FRAME THAT U LAND, COOL HUH?

ROLL MANIPULATION-THE SPEED OF JIGGZ ROLLOUT ON THE GROUND IS CRAZY, THE OTHER DAY I WAS PLAYING SOMEONE WHO CAUGHT ON TO MY GAME, SO HE ROLLED TOWARD ME. WITH AIR DODGE CANCEL, AT MAX U CAN DI THE DISTANCE OF A CHARACTERS ROLL BY AIR DODGE CANCELING IN FRONT OF THEM, LANDING U DIRECTLY BEHIND THEM. OBVIOUSLY U CAN DO ANYTHING FROM HERE.

FULL HOP AIRDODGE TO U-TILT(USED IF OPPONENT IS ABOVE U AND DI'ING AWAY)- DO EXACTLY AS IT SAYS AIRDODGE WITH THEM AND U-TILT RIGHT AS THEY LAND

AIRDODGE CANCEL GAME- A NEW WAY TO STALL, AIRDODGE CANCEL CONTINUOUSLY IN A REPETITIVE MANNER UNTIL UR OPPONENT ATTEMPTS AN APPROACH

INFINITE BAIRS (SEMI-FADED)- BAIR TWICE TOWARD UR OPPONENT, AIRDODGE AWAY, AND DO THE SAME AGAIN, UR OPPONENT WILL BE SUPRISED HOW FAST U APPAEARED IN THE AIR AGAIN, U CAN BAIR AND THEN AIRDODGE THROYUGH UR OPPONENT IF U WANT TO MIX IT UP.

REVERSE POUND- AIRDODGE INTO UR OPPONENT THEN TURN FACING BACKWARD AND POUND DOWNWARD OR STRAIGHT, U SHOULD HIT UR OPPONENT WITH ALL FRAMES OF THE POUND MEANING THEY WILL BE FORCED TO ROLL, AND THEN U CAN PREDICT WUT TO DO NEXT :)

DOUBLE JUMP AND AIRDODGE-IF U EVER FEEL TRAPPED OR JUST UNCOMFORTABLE WITH UR APPROACH THEN AIR DODGE CANCEL THEN DOUBLE JUMP AND AIRDOGE OR NAIR AWAY

AIRDODGE CANCEL TO SIDESTEP-DOUBLE THE DODGING POWER

FINALLY LET ME EXPLAIN THERE ARE MANY MORE POSSIBLILITIES FOR THIS TECH, THIS TECH GIVES A REASON FOR U TO PLAY PUFF ON THE GROUND MOR OFTEN, IVE ACTUALLY REPLACED MY USUALLY STRATEGY FOR A GROUND STYLE PUFF ON SOME CHARACTERS

NEW FIND- AIR DODGE RECOVERY- IF U AIRDOGE AND DI INTO THE STAGE U WILL SLIDE ACROSS IT A GOOD BIT , ABOUT HALF A ROLLS DISTANCE, WHICH IS RIGHT BEHIND UR OPPONENT IF THERE AT THE EDGE

CHARACTERS U SHOULD USE THIS OFTEN ON:

ANYONE WHO CAMPS/SHEILDGRABS ALOT
D3
SNAKE
GAME AND WATCH
MARIO
LUIGI- PREDICT HIS SHEILD KNOCK BACK(SLIDING)FOR COMBOS
BOWSER
OLIMAR
PIKACHU -JUST WATCH THE DOWNSMASH, DONT GO INSIDE THAT CRAP
WARIO
MARF
ICECLIMBERS
PEACH
WOLF
FALCO-

EVERYONE ELSE U SHOULD BE CAREFUL BOUT, FAST RUNNING GRABS LIKE MK, AND LONG RANGE CLOSE RANGE TACTICS, LIKE ZSS AND WUT NOT

SO EVERYONE MAKE USE OF JIGGZ AIRDODGE CANCELING AND INCOPORATE IT TO UR GAME
caps much, MATE?
 

GeneralWoodman

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 14, 2008
Messages
1,914
Location
Macungie, PA
caps much, MATE?[/QUO
wut a great find!!!!!! i had no idea it wus all caps!!!!!!
just adding in some stuff on ground game, its not a tech but an airdodge strategy, it works and its effective for mind games. in my opinion its gud if u like bowser, bowser relies on his airdodge for priority, jiggz is different because of the time within the airdodge allowing u to DI in multiple directions like her nair.
 

Veril

Frame Savant
Joined
Jun 20, 2008
Messages
3,062
Location
Kent Lakes, New York
New tech: Caps lock canceling.

Learn this sh**! It's top tier material!

Beyond that this is kinda interesting. I use this with Lucas after FH Lagless PK-fires sometimes to buffer stuff..
 

The_Jiggernaut

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 7, 2008
Messages
649
Alright, I think I get what you are saying (maybe) but I'm going to need a video to understand this at all. Also, dude, just use exclamation marks or something when you are exited. :dizzy: its dumb to have to read something in all caps.

Also, you say its good with bowser too? Now I NEED to learn this. Can someone try to explain what he means if there isn't going to be a video, preferably not it all caps :bee: Is this any different than landing half way through an airdodge?
 

illinialex24

Smash Hero
Joined
May 23, 2008
Messages
7,489
Location
Discovered: Sending Napalm
Alright, I think I get what you are saying (maybe) but I'm going to need a video to understand this at all. Also, dude, just use exclamation marks or something when you are exited. :dizzy: its dumb to have to read something in all caps.

Also, you say its good with bowser too? Now I NEED to learn this. Can someone try to explain what he means if there isn't going to be a video, preferably not it all caps :bee: Is this any different than landing half way through an airdodge?
If someone can get a video only of this and then email the replay to me I can upload it or if you send me the replay over the wii.
 

Crazy Cloud

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 15, 2007
Messages
460
Location
Connecticut
If someone can get a video only of this and then email the replay to me I can upload it or if you send me the replay over the wii.
It's more of a common sense (I don't mean this as an insult) "tech". It's just move buffering and DIing during the airdodge.
 
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