New Characters for Project M Discussion Thread (Voting Closed)

[ChronoBound]

This used to bug me, too, but then Playstation All stars happened. That roster was atrocious, and gave me nightmares. : > I was so excited for that game, and I loved it when it came out, but I'm pretty sure the bizarre roster cost them a ton of sales and single-handedly buried that potential franchise.

Ever since that game, I've really appreciated how fair Sakurai is, when he could just as easily be really biased and only put in the games and characters he likes. A good example of this is Kirby - he waited until Brawl to get MK and Dedede in the game, even though he'd made those guys and probably really wanted them to be part of the game. Meanwhile, in PSASBR, the devs pretty much added any character they'd worked on/liked, including really obscure ones like Fat Princess that nobody asked for or wanted. XD

Sorry, not trying to make this a Playstation All Stars issue. It just made me realize that Sakurai, for all his quirks and silly tendencies, is still the right man when it comes to roster creation.

Now as far as balance/gameplay tuning goes... MMMMMM NOT SO MUCH

Sakurai is still very good. He just has a few blindsides just like any other developer.

 

[Fortress]

This used to bug me, too, but then Playstation All stars happened. That roster was atrocious, and gave me nightmares. : > I was so excited for that game, and I loved it when it came out, but I'm pretty sure the bizarre roster cost them a ton of sales and single-handedly buried that potential franchise.

Ever since that game, I've really appreciated how fair Sakurai is, when he could just as easily be really biased and only put in the games and characters he likes. A good example of this is Kirby - he waited until Brawl to get MK and Dedede in the game, even though he'd made those guys and probably really wanted them to be part of the game. Meanwhile, in PSASBR, the devs pretty much added any character they'd worked on/liked, including really obscure ones like Fat Princess that nobody asked for or wanted. XD

Sorry, not trying to make this a Playstation All Stars issue. It just made me realize that Sakurai, for all his quirks and silly tendencies, is still the right man when it comes to roster creation.

Now as far as balance/gameplay tuning goes... MMMMMM NOT SO MUCH

Ah, man, Sakurai. That crazy *******. You either love to hate him, hate to love him, but his heart's in the right place.

 

[Celestis]

This thread is becoming so angry. Can you really get viable feedback from all of this for an exclusive character?

 

[ChronoBound]

This thread is becoming so angry. Can you really get viable feedback from all of this for an exclusive character?

You should see the Smash 4 threads. This place is civil compared to those.

 

[Anti Guy]

This thread is becoming so angry. Can you really get viable feedback from all of this for an exclusive character?

Despite all the rage here, there's still enough data to work with. Maybe a few more votes and we can start tallying things up.

 

[shinhed-echi]

It'd be great to bump up several francihses that only have 1-2 to 3, or get completely new IP characters represented in P:M such as Isaac or Saki.

But I'd be quite content if just Pichu shows up and they call it a day.

 

[Chzrm3]

It'd be great to bump up several francihses that only have 1-2 to 3, or get completely new IP characters represented in P:M such as Isaac or Saki.

But I'd be quite content if just Pichu shows up and they call it a day.

Yeah, I'm totally good with the PMBR putting in Pichu and pushing the clone engine to a point where the modding community can all jump in and start making new guys. As much as I'd love to see characters like Dixie and Isaac, it's asking soooo much of the PMBR, and I'd be really excited to see what'd happen if all these different modding teams suddenly had access to a legitimate clone engine.

 

[Fortress]

This thread is becoming so angry. Can you really get viable feedback from all of this for an exclusive character?

Check out the discussion boards of GameFAQs sometime. Despite all of the arguing back and forth, we're not name calling or flaming; we're passing back legitimate points from both sides of the argument. I mean, the whole Black Shadork/Ganondorf thing? It's not just "you're stupid because this opinion is ********" or something like that. We're actually validating our opinions here.

 

[Chzrm3]

Check out the discussion boards of GameFAQs sometime. Despite all of the arguing back and forth, we're not name calling or flaming; we're passing back legitimate points from both sides of the argument. I mean, the whole Black Shadork/Ganondorf thing? It's not just "you're stupid because this opinion is ********" or something like that. We're actually validating our opinions here.

I'm not gonna lie, I've been trying to talk up PM on gfaqs to get more people into it, and that board is just... >_O

http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/633202-super-smash-bros-for-wii-u/67503633

Ugh.

 

[Fortress]

I'm not gonna lie, I've been trying to talk up PM on gfaqs to get more people into it, and that board is just... >_O

http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/633202-super-smash-bros-for-wii-u/67503633

Ugh.

Who cares. It's GameFAQs. You're just pissing in a big kiddy pool of piss.

 

[Xermo]

+1 Votes
Issac
Saki
The only 2 characters who REALLY need any actual representation from the list. People's hopes and expectations for some of these characters are really ridiculous.

1/2 Votes
An Advance Wars character. - For roster diversity purposes, but really, we don't need a gun toting character like Sami, who, according to a lot of people in the thread, wants her moveset to be based around just that. PSASBR had an infamous gun heavy roster and that was just ****. Of course, this may just be bias against lack of creativity towards a moveset.

A metroid character that is neither Ridley nor Dark Samus - Sure, let's scale down Ridley like back in the old days and make him another Charizard, or have a DARK SAMUS. As much as I dislike the hype for ridley and the fanbase surrounding him, he is Samus's only decent, viable enemy. Metroid also needs another rep that isn't Samus.

Sukapon - I wouldn't mind. But I can't say I've even heard of the guy.

- Votes
Anyone else.
Pichu? Really? Ha. Another Starfox character? Who's even more useless than Slippy? Ha ha. More Sonic characters? Those shouldn't even be up for debate, sonic is the only one who should be in the game as it is. More mario reps? Nah. The Mario franchise isn't pokemon, y'know. A 4th Fire Emblem rep? Yet no third MOTHER rep? Bull****. Ganon pretty much has established himself as the second F-Zero rep, though I wouldn't be opposed to another F-Zero cast member.

Personal hopes:
A third MOTHER rep.

 

[Dark Sonic]

In regards to your signature, Joshua would win in that fight, and you know it. I WENT THERE. Let's break it down:

+Better base stats and growths than Marissa
+Larger potential since you acquire him earlier
+Back story takes us on a feels trip
+Personality-wise; just perfect

Joshua > Marissa.

Joshua would lose because he's unlucky and would eat a critical hit Q_Q

 

[loganhogan]

Sami: While she is definitely far less known that any of the characters mentioned thus far, she no less would make a valuable addition to Project M. As in the detailed post linked to in the opening post under Sami's entry, she could very feasibly become a Snake clone. More importantly, she would serve to represent the Famicom/Advance Wars franchise, a series dating back to 1988, and has at least six games under its belt. Also, although Sami is much less known than many other choices, neither was Marth and Roy back when Melee was released (though Marth was known to Japanese players), yet they became among the most popular additions to Melee. The fact is that Sami, despite being a relative unknown, would basically pull a Marth/Roy with many of the people playing Project M because who wouldn't want to play as a rough and tumble soldier girl? Secondly, Sami would serve to bring in a very valuable niche by representing the Advance Wars franchise, especially considering it likely won't receive a playable character in Smash 4 or possibly any other notable content (the franchise is so niche in Japan that Days of Ruin/Dark Conflict was never released there despite being developed by Intelligent Systems, which is Japanese developer). Its also fitting that Sami would basically be the return of the Marth/Roy principle considering that Famicom/Advance Wars is basically the sister series to Fire Emblem.

Ridley: I saved the best for last. Ridley is in a class all his own. He is probably the single most important character from a veteran Nintendo franchise (a franchise that already has playable characters in Smash Bros.) not yet playable in Smash Bros. People have been howling for a playable debut for the Space Pirate Commander (or the Cunning God of Death as he is also known) ever since his cameo in the background for Planet Zebes back during Smash 64. He has been among the Top 5 most wanted characters for Smash Bros. among Western fans of the franchise for well over a decade. No other character could bring hype to Smash 4 or Project M (at least in terms of "true" newcomers) like Ridley could.

Unfortunately for Ridley fans, Sakurai has been making hints that Ridley may be a stage hazard for the Metroid arena for Smash 4 Wii U, which is the Pyrosphere. For those who don't know, the Pyrosphere is where you fought Ridley in Other M. In the update unveiling the Pyrosphere, Sakurai made a cryptic comment that "an enemy from Samus's past could appear at any moment". In a later update, Sakurai showed a very large hole (literally the entire update was simply showing the large hole and nothing else) from where Ridley could enter and exit the Pyrosphere. While Sakurai could simply be trolling Ridley fans, these things are very disconcerting, and no Ridley fan should be surprised if we end up being greeted with Stage Hazardley one morning.

That is where Project M comes in. Like with Advance Wars, Metroid is simply a series that is not popular in Japan, and as such Sakurai probably does not give it the consideration it truly deserves. Project M, being a team of mostly Western developers, could finally give Ridley the recognition he long deserves, and make him entered the hallowed halls of Nintendo All-Stardom, Super Smash Bros.

Ridley would certainly be a difficult character to develop, and I think the team should only begin development on him once they already built up their experience completing four other characters. However, the payoff for bringing the world a Sakurai-developed quality playable Ridley to the world would be immense! It would definitely steal some thunder from Smash 4 that's for sure. It would truly be a dream come true for many to finally see Samus's arch-nemesis fighting her nemesis on the field of battle in Smash Bros.

I overlooked Andy and Sami so I give credit to you for bringing them up, they gained plenty of my interest. Advance Wars would get deserved credit as a long standing series if it were to be given a character and I really liked your idea of handling Sami as a Snake like character and essentially the reason I bumped my vote towards her than Andy although either of them would be perfect. I think it would be fitting to Ridley to have Pit's flight ability because as far as I can tell in the demo they took that away from Pit.

 

[Anti Guy]

I overlooked Andy and Sami so I give credit to you for bringing them up, they gained plenty of my interest. Advance Wars would get deserved credit as a long standing series if it were to be given a character and I really liked your idea of handling Sami as a Snake like character and essentially the reason I bumped my vote towards her than Andy although either of them would be perfect. I think it would be fitting to Ridley to have Pit's flight ability because as far as I can tell in the demo they took that away from Pit.

A little off topic, but I fully support the bottom row of your signature

Half-serious/Half-joking idea: Anna as a high-speed Ike clone that makes money sound effects with all her specials $$$$$ (Also, if there's ever a TRUE FE mascot, it's Anna)

 

[loganhogan]

A little off topic, but I fully support the bottom row of your signature

Half-serious/Half-joking idea: Anna as a high-speed Ike clone that makes money sound effects with all her specials $$$$$ (Also, if there's ever a TRUE FE mascot, it's Anna)

Thank you Anti Guy . I fully support Anna and the entire row reserved for her is a light joke to her many appearances in Fire Emblem games. I love that sound effect you're proposing. It would make a perfect match with her saying Cha-ching! while doing it.

Back on topic an Ike clone could be interesting actually. Black Knight is the very first character that comes to mind because he uses the twin blade Alondite but he may be too slow.

 

[geno]

+1 Votes
Tetra (no transforming) - Part of the forbidden 7, a female character! She could just have a very Wind Waker Tink esque moveset with the skull hammer, bombchus, deku leaf, etc...
Ridley - Iconic Metroid character; very popular and highly requested. Obvious choice if possible.
Dixie Kong - Female with wide moveset potential and clonability. Part of the forbidden 7 so that seems like that should get her a little bit of an advantage too,
Paper Mario - Great moveset potential, and a franchise that hasn't been represented yet (Mario, yes, but I'm talking Paper Mario). Definitely deserves a character, or at least a stage *hint hint*
Bowser Jr. - SO, so much potential, if they can properly incorporate that paintbrush. Otherwise, not really sure it'd be very exciting.

½ Votes
Pichu - Just because Pichu was lame in the last game doesn't mean he's doomed forever. The PMBR could do so much with Pichu! (Hesitant because of so many Pokemon reps already, but it could very well be worth it!)
Young Link - Give Young Link Tink's current move set and give Tink a Wind Waker revamped moveset (complete with Deku Leaf and Skull Hammer)
Tom Nook - Maybe it's my inner fanboy speaking, but why has nobody mentioned this yet? Sure SSB4 has Villager, but Nook is the one we all wanted anyways! So many dreamy moveset potentials!
Plusle & Minun - Not sure if coding would be a nightmare, but if no Pichu, then Plusle and Minun would be perfectly acceptable! Seriously getting giddy just thinking about it.
Micaiah - I don't get what all the hype about Lyn is about. It's yet ANOTHER sword fighter that would be ther 4th addition to represent FE! If they're going to take up 2 precious Clone engine spots just for FE, at least make them unique from one another!
Palutena - Kid Icarus rep which would be good. She also would bring in another magic element to the game which is good.

-1 Votes
Lyn - Fire Emblem already has 3 reps. Lyn would be cool and all, but if we have a 4th FE rep, I'd want someone who wasn't another sword fighter at least.
Shadow - IF we have another Sonic rep, I'd rather have Knuckles or Tails. Shadow looks exactly the same, and moves the same, it'd just be a lackluster addition.
Dark Samus - Ridley is much more iconic, so unless Ridley is completely impossible, or if both Ridley and Dark Samus are planned, I'm not a fan.


Honorable Mentions
♪!?...

 

[Xinc]

I gave a short explanation for my choices:

Voting fors: +1
Pichu. Reasons: Melee Veteran, move overhaul, interesting character, glass cannon Pikachu.
Lyn: FE Support, diversity, female and a female swordsman
Isaac: Definitely very original and a fan favorite. Also, based off the assist trophies, the model's built already.
Hector: Axes. Fire Emblem? Period. There are no axe users in any smash franchise. That might be rather interesting (as well as Hector's great defense, which is quite the opposite for other Fire Emblem characters) I can imagine a heavyweight titan.
Sukapon: Fluid, NES robot. Kind of like ROB, but different. Not a bad idea.

Partial Vote: .5
Plusle/Minun: Kind of like Pichu, but ice climbers esque. I wouldn't mind having them around, and they could be used with an IC base.
Ganondorf/Black Shadow: Cool idea. You can get two characters (or 1 and 1/2) for the price of one.
Krystal: Hm... a different moveset. Probably wouldn't be a dominating spacey character, in my opinion. She's a supporting character as well.
Dark Samus: Though I can't really say if an alternate costume may be better suited, it's hard to decide.

Anti-Votes: -1
Waluigi: Okay, I see the importance but do we really need this many Mario characters?
Ridley: Too big and probably an awkward moveset
Paper Mario: See Waluigi
Shadow: Third party character.
Dixie Kong: I personally cannot see this happening.

Also, your Saki link is borked.

 

[Eisen]

-Scoffing-

Really. Reeaaally. Pichu in the above post upvotes and Plusle/Minun in the half-votes? Not that the latter is going to happen, but I mean... it's stuff like this that makes me all the more reluctant to support Pichu. It's like, there's a ton of potential here for future releases but nobody cares because "I liek pekemen". Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge Pokemon fan just like many others here. I GREW UP with that stuff, partly with Smash Bros. It's so sad though how greedy people get. Anyway....

People are also assuming that Pichu is going to turn out to be any good or any fun. Remember how I mentioned that many other unrepresented characters have a bigger fanbase? That's a thing still. Remember that and then look at how many people play Pikachu. Since I started playing Project M in April (and I played for like a week after the releases of demo 1 and 2) I've not encountered a single Pikachu main or sub-main. Yeah, I get that Pichu is different, but there's a similar, more popular Pokemon to Pichu in the game who's not even touched really.

How many people do you think will play Pichu once he's actually legit? Because I feel that part of his appeal in Melee is that.... well, he's terrible. If you win with Pichu, you get bragging rights. People will just gravitate to Roy or Mewtwo or Mario or Fox or another popular Smash choice.

I wasn't implying Pikachu and Pichu would play exactly the same; rather that their moves function very similarly. Usmash is a kill move, nB projectiles, thunder shenanigans I'm assuming would be similar. I'll admit I have no deep grasp of Pikachu, Pichu, or any character really because I just haven't come that far yet. What I can say for sure is, though, there seem to be much better alternative routes to picking Pichu.

As others have brought up; if Pichu weren't in Melee, who'd give a ****? Like, nobody. I GUARANTEE Raichu would be the Pokemon more requested in this thread if history were the same, sans Pichu being in Melee. But you don't see Raichu hardly in this thread at all, because Pichu's there. (some) People realize it's already ridiculous that Pichu has potential on top of Pikachu, so requesting Raichu is submitting the insane.

We can speculate all we want, but you know what, the only way to know would be by giving Pichu a "test" moveset to see if he'd really play all that differently while remaining true to his old moveset. Like I have mentioned twice now though, unless you want who'd probably be the most cloney-of-all-clones, Pichu would have to recieve a decent number of changes.

Call it crazy to outcast a Melee vet, but Pichu really was just a useless marketing character, and the only (real) reason people want him in is because of his Melee inclusion. Which in my opinion is a poor reason. I mean, ESPECIALLY if (IF) the PMBR is in fact considering filling the extra slots. In my opinion, that'd make an appealing Smash game, right? Brawl's cast + characters who won't even be included in Smash 4? Heck yes. Especially when one considers how long people have been waiting for characters like Ridley or ANY Metroid rep, an F-Zero rep...whom probably won't even show STILL in Smash 4. Because Sakurai.

To give Pichu's best aspects to Pikachu would completely compromise P:M Pikachu's character design. Pikachu was taken in a good direction and has acquired many good things from all the smash games. Pikachu would not be Pikachu anymore if what you keep suggesting was done.

Uh. That's why I said "scratch that" immediately afterwards.

People keep making the same connections between Roy and Pichu. Let's just let that soak in a minute. Thing is... FE doesn't have 7 reps already, it has 3 AR (After ). I don't see how the number of representatives isn't a valid point when we keep in mind that PMBR hasn't announced how many slots they're filling in this clone engine. If they're going the easy route and just adding in all the characters from Melee, then it'd be inevitable that Pichu would come in and that'd be the end of it. We'd have a Pokemon-heavy Smash game with no new fighters despite there being open slots. Doesn't that sound kind of lame, considering how much work PMBR has put into this thing already? "Yeah, we spent like 3-4 years making this game, but we won't fill it with all the possible characters, just put in Roy, Mewtwo and Pichu and call it a day." I mean, they could? But it'd be a very lame move on their part. Not that they're obligated to do the extra work per se, but I assume all this work wasn't to stop just short of full victory.

I could go on and on and on, repeating the same stuff about the many reasons Pichu shouldn't return, but ultimately I'm just going to get refuted equally as much by "b-but muh Melee" because that's like literally the only reason I see people have to include Pichu. Try to convince me he'd bring a fresh smash experience. Try to convince me he'd represent Pokemon well. Try to convince me that 7 Pokemon isn't enough and that it's not "our place" to determine the roster, when the option is sitting in front of our faces. To me, that right there is favoritism. Oh though I almost forgot, Pichu "doesn't play exactly like Pikachu". Okay, but again, the differences between Melee and PM incarnations of some characters is about as different. It doesn't make for an interesting or fresh experience. If they revamped Pichu, then you don't really satisfy "but muh playstyle" desire. You have an unpopular Melee vet whose superior isn't even used, whom was also a marketing character, and whom eats up the spot for a much better character.

I'm done wasting hours a night on this though. Either you (meaning anybody) agree or disagree, but if at this point you disagree, neither myself nor nobody will change your point of view. You'll probably just beg and beg and beg for that Pokemon the game so ~desparately~ needs until you get it, and then be pretty much the only person to realistically use him. Gg.

Also if Pichu gets in I'm calling him Boner Kill or **** Block. Like, I'll put it on my own CSS and BPs. Legit. Cuz I'm a h8r.

 

[Chzrm3]

I think I actually want Pichu in more now. : >

Doesn't that sound kind of lame, considering how much work PMBR has put into this thing already? "Yeah, we spent like 3-4 years making this game, but we won't fill it with all the possible characters, just put in Roy, Mewtwo and Pichu and call it a day." I mean, they could? But it'd be a very lame move on their part. Not that they're obligated to do the extra work per se, but I assume all this work wasn't to stop just short of full victory.

Easy, man. The work they've done on this project is above and beyond what anybody ever expected. There'd be nothing lame or wrong with them not wanting to go miles further than that by filling up every empty slot.

 

[geno]

Also if Pichu gets in I'm calling him Boner Kill or **** Block. Like, I'll put it on my own CSS and BPs. Legit. Cuz I'm a h8r.

Spoiler

 

[Fortress]

-Scoffing-

Agreed. Pichu was terrible. Pichu was just plain terrible. I see no reason why it needs to come back to the game. Being a Melee vet isn't enough. Pichu was not a viable character in the game it starred in, and you'd have to so-drastically change its properties to not be tripe that it wouldn't even be the same character that the die-hards are clambering to have back. Ganondorf and Cap. Falcon are different enough. Their differences stand out enough and require their own skillsets and playstyles that the inclusion of the dynamic duo is a given. Pichu, who appeared for only one game and didn't even move on to Brawl, does not deserve a spot. At all. Period. Besides, we have a cast of seven Pokemon already, and the underplayed Pikachu is already there. Pichu die-hards can deal with it and go play Melee. There's absolutely no reason why people here with legitimate suggestions should potentially have their own slot taken up by a terrible carbon copy of an otherwise good character.

tl;dr: Pichu was *****.

 

[androgynus]

+1 Votes
Isaac - Yes another sword character, but from a game that hasn't been represented yet. Why not giving fighter that we may never see in our favorite fighting game a chance to be played?
Ridley - Indeed, like most of us said already, samus has nothing of a rival in smash. The only thing we got is ZSS. Ridley might be complicated for the backroom, but if they managed to bring back roy and mewtwo, there is no reason on earth that they could not do this other than unwanted character from the players.
Dixie Kong - Since she was already planned on early build of brawl, she was surely able to fight kn her own. If kirby got 2 other friends in one new smash, why DK could'nt get another?
Hector. - As most of you wrote it in previous post, hector has an axe, which no one has in this game/mod. We got magic,swords,dynamite,lasers guns,hammer, but no such thing as axes. Lyn would be a great + to this mod, but obviously not as great as hector.



-1 Votes
Lyn - AS geno posted earlier :" Fire Emblem already has 3 reps. Lyn would be cool and all, but if we have a 4th FE rep, I'd want someone who wasn't another sword fighter at least.".
Sonic Rep/Metal Gear rep (Tails/shadow/knuckles,ect....) - why would PMBR would even bother making another sonic rep? To get hate from players? seriously dont go do such a fatal mistake.... Sonic was there at first because they wanted to promote the mario and sonic at olympics games. Second reason one of them should not get in those "clones slots" is that that could reaaaaaaally attract some unwanted attention.... Like Sega. Do you really think that they are gonna let this one go? Except if PMBR want to take the risk of getting a Cease & desist letter from either sega or nintendo, those should really not get in there (or should be removed if this would had been a supported character). This is a dangerous zone guys, dont go in there...

 

[Tofer Dallah]

I give my main vote for Pichu ! I think if Roy, Mewtwo and Doc (and YLink via Toon Link) come back, Pichu must be there too, all the removed Melee character got their chance, so why not Pichu ? And I'm sure this character can be buffed in a realy great way to be viable and luigified !

After, as a Fire emblem Fan: I realy want another FE character ! Maybe Ephraim or Lyn ?

But, I'm against Sonic or non-nintendo character because of copyright... And I'm not especialy fan about the sonic serie.

 

[the_suicide_fox]

Just because I felt like putting more thought into this.

MASTER HAND!!
-He would loses some of his boss-like charm and essentially become just another fighter in Smash.
-Instead of flying he could walk around like Glover.
-Neutral B = Gun attack, a standard projectile than can possibly be canceled on landing. It would have a bit of an arc to it.
-Side B = Hover plus laser fingers. MH would float something like Peach but with a little less left/right mobility. While doing so he would shoot lasers from his fingertips. This would probably be like a multihit attack.
-Down B = Ground smack. Think Bowser's down B but with a giant hand smacking the ground. Would have a lot more lag, but benefits from good horizontal knockback.
-Up B = Jet (where he makes that weird plane shape). For recovery, it would work something like MK's Up B.
-F Smash = Flick
-D Air = Poke. It would only hit once and probably work something like Sonic's in vanilla Brawl with a bit more horizontal movement. Might spike
-Grab = Grabs you in his big hand and just throws you, like the MH we all know and love.
-Run Attack = "Kick". Almost like the Flick fsmash but more like the boss version MH.
-D Smash = Floor Roll. You know, when he lays on the ground and rolls around. Maybe act something like Peaches dsmash.

+Iconic Smash character
+Makes anyone that uses him feel like a boss
+Character model already exists and some moves can be pulled from the boss version
-Custom move set
-Might look weird fighting like normal characters

 

[Solbliminal]

@Anti-Sonic Supporters:

Can someone pass the salt? My tears are not salty enough.

 

[820]

@Anti-Sonic Supporters:

Can someone pass the salt? My tears are not salty enough.

Sonic doesn't deserve another rep. Not sure what's salty about saying that.

 

[Hungry Headcrab]

Serious question here: Are there any truly objective reasons for the consensus that the inclusion of a Sonic/Metal Gear character is a ridiculous notion aside from them being third party characters?

I would agree that Nintendo characters should be under the most consideration, but I don't think it should be so looked down upon to want a third party character.

I myself would be pretty hyped to see Tails or Liquid Snake in the game.

Edit: In my mind, there are still plenty of characters that should probably be added before those two or any other third party characters. I'm just wondering if there is any objective reasoning beyond them being third party.

 

[DayLaMike]

-Scoffing-

Really. Reeaaally. Pichu in the above post upvotes and Plusle/Minun in the half-votes? Not that the latter is going to happen, but I mean... it's stuff like this that makes me all the more reluctant to support Pichu. It's like, there's a ton of potential here for future releases but nobody cares because "I liek pekemen". Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge Pokemon fan just like many others here. I GREW UP with that stuff, partly with Smash Bros. It's so sad though how greedy people get. Anyway....

People are also assuming that Pichu is going to turn out to be any good or any fun. Remember how I mentioned that many other unrepresented characters have a bigger fanbase? That's a thing still. Remember that and then look at how many people play Pikachu. Since I started playing Project M in April (and I played for like a week after the releases of demo 1 and 2) I've not encountered a single Pikachu main or sub-main. Yeah, I get that Pichu is different, but there's a similar, more popular Pokemon to Pichu in the game who's not even touched really.

How many people do you think will play Pichu once he's actually legit? Because I feel that part of his appeal in Melee is that.... well, he's terrible. If you win with Pichu, you get bragging rights. People will just gravitate to Roy or Mewtwo or Mario or Fox or another popular Smash choice.

I wasn't implying Pikachu and Pichu would play exactly the same; rather that their moves function very similarly. Usmash is a kill move, nB projectiles, thunder shenanigans I'm assuming would be similar. I'll admit I have no deep grasp of Pikachu, Pichu, or any character really because I just haven't come that far yet. What I can say for sure is, though, there seem to be much better alternative routes to picking Pichu.

As others have brought up; if Pichu weren't in Melee, who'd give a ****? Like, nobody. I GUARANTEE Raichu would be the Pokemon more requested in this thread if history were the same, sans Pichu being in Melee. But you don't see Raichu hardly in this thread at all, because Pichu's there. (some) People realize it's already ridiculous that Pichu has potential on top of Pikachu, so requesting Raichu is submitting the insane.

We can speculate all we want, but you know what, the only way to know would be by giving Pichu a "test" moveset to see if he'd really play all that differently while remaining true to his old moveset. Like I have mentioned twice now though, unless you want who'd probably be the most cloney-of-all-clones, Pichu would have to recieve a decent number of changes.

Call it crazy to outcast a Melee vet, but Pichu really was just a useless marketing character, and the only (real) reason people want him in is because of his Melee inclusion. Which in my opinion is a poor reason. I mean, ESPECIALLY if (IF) the PMBR is in fact considering filling the extra slots. In my opinion, that'd make an appealing Smash game, right? Brawl's cast + characters who won't even be included in Smash 4? Heck yes. Especially when one considers how long people have been waiting for characters like Ridley or ANY Metroid rep, an F-Zero rep...whom probably won't even show STILL in Smash 4. Because Sakurai.


Uh. That's why I said "scratch that" immediately afterwards.

People keep making the same connections between Roy and Pichu. Let's just let that soak in a minute. Thing is... FE doesn't have 7 reps already, it has 3 AR (After ). I don't see how the number of representatives isn't a valid point when we keep in mind that PMBR hasn't announced how many slots they're filling in this clone engine. If they're going the easy route and just adding in all the characters from Melee, then it'd be inevitable that Pichu would come in and that'd be the end of it. We'd have a Pokemon-heavy Smash game with no new fighters despite there being open slots. Doesn't that sound kind of lame, considering how much work PMBR has put into this thing already? "Yeah, we spent like 3-4 years making this game, but we won't fill it with all the possible characters, just put in Roy, Mewtwo and Pichu and call it a day." I mean, they could? But it'd be a very lame move on their part. Not that they're obligated to do the extra work per se, but I assume all this work wasn't to stop just short of full victory.

I could go on and on and on, repeating the same stuff about the many reasons Pichu shouldn't return, but ultimately I'm just going to get refuted equally as much by "b-but muh Melee" because that's like literally the only reason I see people have to include Pichu. Try to convince me he'd bring a fresh smash experience. Try to convince me he'd represent Pokemon well. Try to convince me that 7 Pokemon isn't enough and that it's not "our place" to determine the roster, when the option is sitting in front of our faces. To me, that right there is favoritism. Oh though I almost forgot, Pichu "doesn't play exactly like Pikachu". Okay, but again, the differences between Melee and PM incarnations of some characters is about as different. It doesn't make for an interesting or fresh experience. If they revamped Pichu, then you don't really satisfy "but muh playstyle" desire. You have an unpopular Melee vet whose superior isn't even used, whom was also a marketing character, and whom eats up the spot for a much better character.

I'm done wasting hours a night on this though. Either you (meaning anybody) agree or disagree, but if at this point you disagree, neither myself nor nobody will change your point of view. You'll probably just beg and beg and beg for that Pokemon the game so ~desparately~ needs until you get it, and then be pretty much the only person to realistically use him. Gg.

Also if Pichu gets in I'm calling him Boner Kill or **** Block. Like, I'll put it on my own CSS and BPs. Legit. Cuz I'm a h8r.

Alright your anti-pichu rampage was cute the first couple of pages but now you should really just stop. You just seem very angry for no reason. People want him back? OMG stop the presses, call the national guard and get Obama on the phone. You're making a huge issue out of nothing. Please calm yourself. The whole point of this thread was to see who people wanted to come in P:M and that's exactly what's being shown.

Also This. You're already proclaiming to be butthurt over something that hasn't even been confirmed. Stop, this is embarrassing.

Edit: On topic I guess I'll cast my votes as well since I'm here I'm already here.

+1 vote Pichu: I main'd him in Melee and I enjoyed his character design/playstyle. However I know he was lacking. Similar to Roy & Mewtwo I feel this would be a good opportunity to turn a low tier character from melee into something truly remarkable. After watching how the SDR crew handled him I feel you guys would have an interesting take on the character.

+1 vote Lyn: She was the first lord I had come into contact upon first playing the FE franchise. I love her character and based on how she fought in combat scenes I feel she would being a very unique Sword character to have in smash. She doesn't fight like the royals like Marth or Roy and she doesn't just slam her sword and kill things like Ike. She's much like a samurai with her own style, very different from all the sword users currently in smash. I think she'd add a lot.

+1 vote Issac: Based on what I've read about him he'd definitely be very unique. I believe he has some affinity with earth element so that could go a long ways in terms on play style. He was definitely one of the assist trophies that I felt got cheated out of a spot in the game.

I don't really have any negative or half votes. I feel most all these characters would bring something interesting to Project M but these three are the ones I personally would like to see the most.

 

[FalKoopa]

So much Pichu hate, Eisen? While I can't say I disagree, you're going overboard. Calm down.

 

[Fortress]

Pichu sucks. The world owes us a rant in regards to that.

 

[Solbliminal]

Sonic doesn't deserve another rep. Not sure what's salty about saying that.

Real Talk? I'm only salty because of this thread being composed of haters. That being said, who are you to say Sonic doesn't deserve rep? You and the combined entirety of this thread does not speak for the majority that will vote when P:M throws up an official poll. And if you want to be like that, take a good hard look at brawlvault and tell me who has been at the top of that Top Downloads section as well as retained a position in the Popular Downloads for God knows how long. If you want to treat this thread as a majority, I'll treat my statement the same way. My numbers are bigger than yours.

And for that 3rd party crap. If Sega or Sonic Team even cared about mods, they would have stopped Sonic Generations mods ages ago. I can understand the caution though.

 

[820]

Real Talk? I'm only salty because of this thread being composed of haters. That being said, who are you to say Sonic doesn't deserve rep? You and the combined entirety of this thread does not speak for the majority that will vote when P:M throws up an official poll. And if you want to be like that, take a good hard look at brawlvault and tell me who has been at the top of that Top Downloads section as well as retained a position in the Popular Downloads for God knows how long. If you want to treat this thread as a majority, I'll treat my statement the same way. My numbers are bigger than yours.

And for that 3rd party crap. If Sega or Sonic Team even cared about mods, they would have stopped Sonic Generations mods ages ago. I can understand the caution though.

It's not about numbers or this thread. I'm just saying my opinion. I don't thinkeither tthird party rep deserves another spot. It's a Nintendo game first and foremost, and Sonic does fine as full representation for his franchise. Adding more Sonic characters is overkill in a Nintendo gam , and I believe those last seven spots should be for Nintendo characters.

 

[MLGF]

Who cares. It's GameFAQs. You're just pissing in a big kiddy pool of piss.

I'm a lurker on Gamefaqs and there are a few redeemable people. I believe there's a lot of people from every different group of Smashers in there and when they mesh... yeowch.

 

[Xebenkeck]

There's absolutely no reason why people here with legitimate suggestions should potentially have their own slot taken up by a terrible carbon copy of an otherwise good character.

I think this is the most egocentric sentence ever posted on smashboards.

For someone to discredit a legitimate possible character like Pichu, and then claim that a roster spot is THEIRS as if it entitled to them. From someone NOT in the PMBR, nor ever really contributed to the creation of this game. I don't even............................

 

[Fortress]

legitimate

Pichu

Choose one.

I'm not trying to claim a roster spot is mine or anybody else's (I mean, come on, I suggested Primid; do you think that I should have a say?), but I am entitled to my opinion that Pichu was trash and that a spot shouldn't belong to Pichu. Besides, do you have to be a part of the PM:BR to share your thoughts? That's how I understood what you were saying.

-Roster of seven Pokemon already
-Was a bad Pikachu in the one game it starred in
-Did not make it to Brawl
-People only want it back for the 'muh maylaaaay'-nostalgia factor
-Pichu is garbage

There's an entire four paragraphs broken down into neat little snippets. I hope this saves us some time.

 

[Chzrm3]

For someone to discredit a legitimate possible character like Pichu, and then claim that a roster spot is THEIRS as if it entitled to them. From someone NOT in the PMBR, nor ever really contributed to the creation of this game. I don't even............................

^^^^ Thiiiiis.

I think the point of this thread has gotten away from people a bit. : >

People really shouldn't be viewing this as a forum for deciding/rejecting characters that the PMBR will then implement. That's their decision, and it always has been. They've put thousands of collective hours of work on the project at this point, and they're obviously enormous smash fans, which means if you asked them "hey, can you think of 5 characters you'd like to add to Smash?", they could come up with an answer in ten seconds.

The most important reason for the PMBR to pick the characters they want, and not the characters we want, is because it's a passion project at the end of the day. If they held an official poll or something, and a character won that none of them cared about, that passion would dry up pretty quickly. Imagine being told to work on a character that you hated for 300 hours? >_O That character would probably never get finished, because how can you devote that much free time to something you hate?

There are a lot of legit points as to why Pichu shouldn't return. People have made interested cases for characters like Ganondorf's new moves, Isaac, Lyn, Ridley, etc etc etc.. but at the end of the day, the only metric that matters is "how passionate would the PMBR be about implementing this character?"

If they're super stoked about bringing Pichu back, but they're not at all interested in adding Isaac or Dixie, then nothing else matters. They should pursue the characters that'll make them the happiest and most excited - if not, they'll burn out real quick.

So this thread is fun, because we get to discuss/argue/defend/debate the characters that we love and those that we hate. But some people have started taking it really personally, as though the PMBR is sitting here taking notes and deciding which characters to put based on the points we raise.

Sorry, this got really long. O_o

tl;dr - If you were part of the PMBR, wouldn't you already have a list of characters that you'd passionately love to add into the game? I guarantee you they all do too. : ) So have fun with this thread, but don't worry about things like Pichu 'stealing' Isaac's roster spot because Pichu got a few votes from people. If any new characters are being added beyond Mewtwo and Roy, the PMBR probably already decided on them years ago.

 

[Fortress]

tl;dr - If you were part of the PMBR, wouldn't you already have a list of characters that you'd passionately love to add into the game? I guarantee you they all do too. : ) So have fun with this thread, but don't worry about things like Pichu 'stealing' Isaac's roster spot because Pichu got a few votes from people. If any new characters are being added beyond Mewtwo and Roy, the PMBR probably already decided on them years ago.

I agree that the only opinion that matters in the end are those of the PM:BR, as they're the ones making the plans, calling the shots, and putting the effort in. We, as the playtesters of sorts of the game, can only do so much to voice our input and help them along their way, but ultimately, it's going to be their decision. If Pichu gets in, fine, whatever; it's not going to be a game-breaker for me, and I wouldn't hate to see him in the roster. My opinion is just that he was bad in Melee, hardly anybody played him outside of a 'fun' game, and that some other characters could prove to bring more to the table.

 

[DayLaMike]

^^^^ Thiiiiis.

I think the point of this thread has gotten away from people a bit. : >

People really shouldn't be viewing this as a forum for deciding/rejecting characters that the PMBR will then implement. That's their decision, and it always has been. They've put thousands of collective hours of work on the project at this point, and they're obviously enormous smash fans, which means if you asked them "hey, can you think of 5 characters you'd like to add to Smash?", they could come up with an answer in ten seconds.

The most important reason for the PMBR to pick the characters they want, and not the characters we want, is because it's a passion project at the end of the day. If they held an official poll or something, and a character won that none of them cared about, that passion would dry up pretty quickly. Imagine being told to work on a character that you hated for 300 hours? >_O That character would probably never get finished, because how can you devote that much free time to something you hate?

There are a lot of legit points as to why Pichu shouldn't return. People have made interested cases for characters like Ganondorf's new moves, Isaac, Lyn, Ridley, etc etc etc.. but at the end of the day, the only metric that matters is "how passionate would the PMBR be about implementing this character?"

If they're super stoked about bringing Pichu back, but they're not at all interested in adding Isaac or Dixie, then nothing else matters. They should pursue the characters that'll make them the happiest and most excited - if not, they'll burn out real quick.

So this thread is fun, because we get to discuss/argue/defend/debate the characters that we love and those that we hate. But some people have started taking it really personally, as though the PMBR is sitting here taking notes and deciding which characters to put based on the points we raise.

Sorry, this got really long. O_o

tl;dr - If you were part of the PMBR, wouldn't you already have a list of characters that you'd passionately love to add into the game? I guarantee you they all do too. : ) So have fun with this thread, but don't worry about things like Pichu 'stealing' Isaac's roster spot because Pichu got a few votes from people. If any new characters are being added beyond Mewtwo and Roy, the PMBR probably already decided on them years ago.

Super agree'd. We have someone who understands! This thread is only to see where people's interests are and maybe spark a few ideas on who to but in. Ultimately the decision for any character getting is up to them. The thread is just for fun. To think one character caused this much controversy.

 

[Fortress]

Super agree'd. We have someone who understands! This thread is only to see where people's interests are and maybe spark a few ideas on who to but in. Ultimately the decision for any character getting is up to them. The thread is just for fun. To think one character caused this much controversy.

H'ooooooooooooooooh boy, where were you for the Ganondorf talk?

 

[trojanpooh]

-Roster of seven Pokemon already
-Was a bad Pikachu in the one game it starred in
-Did not make it to Brawl
-People only want it back for the 'muh maylaaaay'-nostalgia factor
-Pichu is garbage

There's an entire four paragraphs broken down into neat little snippets. I hope this saves us some time.

-This isn't an official release "representation" is Sakurai's job for Smash 4. PM isn't obligated to properly show off Nintendo's history.
-Wavedashing, L-Cancelling, and lots of other good things didn't make it into Brawl. What's your point?
-People want him back because they played as him in Melee and enjoyed it. That's like saying people only wanted Mewtwo or Roy or, hell, Samus and the rest of the cast back because 'muh maylay'. It doesn't matter if the reason they like the character is how he played in Melee, we still liked playing as Pichu in Melee and want him back.
-Mewtwo, Kirby, Roy, and Bowser are garbage too, but that didn't stop people from playing as them in Melee and Brawl and didn't stop people for being excited to play as them in Project M.