have frozen higher on who's list? i unrawr'd you just now because i want to hear more from him
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Monster Island Mafia- Game over! Town wins!
- Thread starter smashman90
- Start date
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
On your list, sorry. Wording error
You said:
Then this:
Just looks like you oppose FF to me
You said:
This looks to me as you thinking he's scum or at least... an idiot
Then this:
Same story.
Just looks like you oppose FF to me
- Joined
- Jul 9, 2007
- Messages
- 5,164
#306
Frozen is eager to paint Chaco as a townie force to be reckoned with. It is critically important to note that this post comes right after the Chaco wagon on D1 begins and stands in direct contrast to the votes on Chaco without overtly defending him. This is not so much an example of Frozen himself being scummy, but something that would look rather ****ing to me should Chaco flip scum.
He then clams up for a while before making...
#429
...this post. In which he lists a now confirmed town, a nearly confirmed town and Cacti (whom, if I may say, has had very little presence in the game) as his top suspects. Scumfever is not even a blip on his radar. His reasoning for suspecting Cacti over some double voter discussion seems very forced and his suspicion of Macman over his quip about another cop not CC'ing Chaco was just nonsensical. He told Macman it was silly for another cop not to CC Chaco despite the clear and present danger of their being multiple cops in a game.
#477
This one is important. Here, FF admits that he understands the case being made against Scumfever but just isn't "feeling it," so his vote goes to Xiivi over what seems to be nothing. But that's not the important part. The important part is that he specifically says that too many people whom he gets "not-so-town reads from" are willing to lynch Scumfever. This is a problem because...
#469
...^THIS^ was the most recent vote count. You will notice that two of the three names that are listed next to Scumfever are Mentos and Gheb. You may recall from FF's 306 that I listed above that FF mentioned Mentos and Gheb as being two of the towniest players in the game. Inconsistency is inconsistent. You've gotta be pretty desperate to save someone to make a lapse in logic like that.
And it makes sense that FF would be desperate to save Scumfever since...
#581
...in FF's own words, Jungle could have been considered mafia's "ace in the hole" against cops if he did indeed have a GF ability, which FF seems to assume he does. The monkey wrench here is that if FrozenFlame is scum and therefor correct about Scumfever being a GF, then that pretty much ensures the presence of a cop, which in turn looks good for Chaco.
Fair.
Vote: FrozenFlame
EBWOPreview Post: Chaco, thank you very much for those posts. I'll get to them a bit later. Finding all those posts took up a lot of my time and stamina.
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
GF is also tracker immune right? It would fit the game to not have a normal investigative role anyway. Or the cop didnt CC and listened to macman d1, though that's unlikely.
Did circus really just try to indict me for inconsistency when the posts he's comparing are literally over 160 posts apart? On Day 1? What a joke.
Circus, even if you have been casting doubt on the legitimacy of Chaco's cop claim and/or whether or not Mechazilla was a GF, you haven't done it in the same style nor with the same constancy as Xonar. That's the big difference between you and why Xonar came off as scummier.
Marshy, I'm not overtly doubting your claim. I just have some personal reservations about it. I trust you right now, but under certain circumstances I can see that trust blowing up in my face. That's entirely circumstantial however.
I still can't get over the fact that people are more willing to believe that smashman gave the mafia cop as a fakeclaim over Chaco actually being the cop. It's really quite baffling.
Circus, even if you have been casting doubt on the legitimacy of Chaco's cop claim and/or whether or not Mechazilla was a GF, you haven't done it in the same style nor with the same constancy as Xonar. That's the big difference between you and why Xonar came off as scummier.
Marshy, I'm not overtly doubting your claim. I just have some personal reservations about it. I trust you right now, but under certain circumstances I can see that trust blowing up in my face. That's entirely circumstantial however.
I still can't get over the fact that people are more willing to believe that smashman gave the mafia cop as a fakeclaim over Chaco actually being the cop. It's really quite baffling.
smashman90
Smash Lord
Back from Xmas break.
"Godziller" Vote/Rawr Count:
Frozenflame: Marshy (1)
Marshy: Frozenflame (you forgot to unrawr), Cacti, Chibo, Chaco (4)
Chibo: Macman, Xonar (2)
Xonar: Kirbyoshi, (2)
Not Rawring:Mentos, Blue Yoshi, Circus (you didn't rawr), TigerWoods (4)
Since there are 12 people left, it takes 7 votes to lynch.
Remember, it takes 7 votes to lynch a person.
"Godziller" Vote/Rawr Count:
Frozenflame: Marshy (1)
Marshy: Frozenflame (you forgot to unrawr), Cacti, Chibo, Chaco (4)
Chibo: Macman, Xonar (2)
Xonar: Kirbyoshi, (2)
Not Rawring:Mentos, Blue Yoshi, Circus (you didn't rawr), TigerWoods (4)
Since there are 12 people left, it takes 7 votes to lynch.
Remember, it takes 7 votes to lynch a person.
I'm not following some of your points Circus. Tho I feel like its obvious. I like what you had on his 477 and 429[I mentioned before that his suspicions day1 were pretty sucky] but I don't know what the inconsistency you are talking about is. Just clear it up real quick.
Marshy, I also don't get your point about FF talking about your claim. Was FF alluding to a specific antitown role when he was talking about you, or are you suspicious of him because he was saying he thinks yur something that's town but continues to place backhanded suspicion on you. I didn't really get those couple of posts either.
Iono if its cuz i just woke up, but i'm not getting what people are talking about right now.
Marshy, I also don't get your point about FF talking about your claim. Was FF alluding to a specific antitown role when he was talking about you, or are you suspicious of him because he was saying he thinks yur something that's town but continues to place backhanded suspicion on you. I didn't really get those couple of posts either.
Iono if its cuz i just woke up, but i'm not getting what people are talking about right now.
TigerWoods
Smash Champion
Hey. Back for good.
Read all of that... and I realized me and Blue Yoshi tend to misunderstand each other's posts...
I refuse to buddy with you though. I still don't trust you...
After reading I don't like -any- one of Marshy's posts. Especially his vote on frozen, which Circus(who I'm getting scum vibes from) supports.
There's a lot of headbutting and buddying going on and a lot of people that aren't totally off my radar yet... I feel like the next lynch would give me a lot of info... It'd most likely push more people down the list and open up more people.
Just because you're on my radar doesn't necessarily mean I think you're scummy(though it can end up that way)... I'm just scrutinizing your actions more than others since I think it'll lead to more answers.
Thoughts please!
Read all of that... and I realized me and Blue Yoshi tend to misunderstand each other's posts...
I refuse to buddy with you though. I still don't trust you...
After reading I don't like -any- one of Marshy's posts. Especially his vote on frozen, which Circus(who I'm getting scum vibes from) supports.
There's a lot of headbutting and buddying going on and a lot of people that aren't totally off my radar yet... I feel like the next lynch would give me a lot of info... It'd most likely push more people down the list and open up more people.
Just because you're on my radar doesn't necessarily mean I think you're scummy(though it can end up that way)... I'm just scrutinizing your actions more than others since I think it'll lead to more answers.
Thoughts please!
the formating/coloring for that list bugs me so much for no reason
TigerWoods
Smash Champion
o.o
I wanted to make it so Red=Danger... Orange=Warning... Yellow=Alert... Green=OK
I wanted to make it so Red=Danger... Orange=Warning... Yellow=Alert... Green=OK
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
You oppose Frozen, who you think is scum. Scum usually try to get townies lynched, Frozen tries to get me lynched. Why are you opposed to me?
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
Oh sorry, just misunderstood your posts x.x'
On response to Tigerwoods list: Why is Cacti on your radar? Why do you look into Chaco later while he is pretty much the center point of discussion right now?
On response to the votecount: Yeey hidden voter.
About my vote: Chibo is slipping under the radar
On response to Circus' case against FF: It's legit, but I still think FF is just a misguided townie rather then scum. Still keeping an eye on him
On response to Tigerwoods list: Why is Cacti on your radar? Why do you look into Chaco later while he is pretty much the center point of discussion right now?
On response to the votecount: Yeey hidden voter.
About my vote: Chibo is slipping under the radar
On response to Circus' case against FF: It's legit, but I still think FF is just a misguided townie rather then scum. Still keeping an eye on him
I'm not trying to throw backhand suspicion on Marshy at all. I just wanted people to be cognizant that though I'm pretty sure of what he is and what not, I could also see it being a ploy that can turn the situation on its head under the right circumstances. I'm just saying Marshy should not be given a free ride to the end, especially if I don't last, because under certain circumstances I could see reason to doubt the townieness of Marshy's role.
Basically, Marshy is clear in my book for now, but he isn't clear to the point that he'd remain clear under almost any circumstance.
Unrawr: Marshy Rawr: Xonar
I love of Circus calls the tells I built my day 1 cases off of things like "nonsensical" and "forced" when what I brought to the table was far better quality than what everyone else was discussing considering how stalled the game was. I got discussion moving and I didn't tunnel hardcore on whimsical points; all I wanted to do was get people talking and analyzing what little we had to work with.
I also love how he calls the alleged existence of multiple cops in this game a "clear and present danger." What a joke.
At least the double voter doesn't have his head in his ***. Xonar or Circus are the plays today ladies and gents.
Basically, Marshy is clear in my book for now, but he isn't clear to the point that he'd remain clear under almost any circumstance.
Unrawr: Marshy Rawr: Xonar
I love of Circus calls the tells I built my day 1 cases off of things like "nonsensical" and "forced" when what I brought to the table was far better quality than what everyone else was discussing considering how stalled the game was. I got discussion moving and I didn't tunnel hardcore on whimsical points; all I wanted to do was get people talking and analyzing what little we had to work with.
I also love how he calls the alleged existence of multiple cops in this game a "clear and present danger." What a joke.
At least the double voter doesn't have his head in his ***. Xonar or Circus are the plays today ladies and gents.
unrawr rawr scumnar
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
FF what remains of your case against me? I want this solved now.
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
BTW, can't chaco just nameclaim, and we can just check that characters backstory and hope for a CC. This way he is 100% cleared in my eyes.
CT Chia
Smash Obsessed
Unrawr
---
Why would Chaco be scum and fake claim a roleblocked cop?
There is 0 reason to do that. If he is going to claim cop as a mafia, then why wouldnt he give a guilty verdict on someone he knows isn't a mafia. That way he could get him mislynched, then if put under verdict claim insanity and see how that goes. Now if he does this tomorrow all he does is delay us from suspecting him for a day, and for even longer if he continues to be "roleblocked."
---
---
---
I don't understand what you did here at all...
---
Why would Chaco be scum and fake claim a roleblocked cop?
There is 0 reason to do that. If he is going to claim cop as a mafia, then why wouldnt he give a guilty verdict on someone he knows isn't a mafia. That way he could get him mislynched, then if put under verdict claim insanity and see how that goes. Now if he does this tomorrow all he does is delay us from suspecting him for a day, and for even longer if he continues to be "roleblocked."
---
You're just parroting what FF said 3 posts earlier. He said he was 50 50 on me and asked for ppl's thoughts. You didn't give your thoughts and asked other people what they thought of me. This almost feels like you want to get me out, but need to see if people would agree to it first. Instead you and FF (moreso you since you're asking the same deal as FF without offering your insight) are asking people about me before giving your own thoughts (FF gave a very very broad overview but you said nothing), which to me seems as playing it too safe. Like what if you said you were suspicious of me then ppl were like wtf no? Then all of a sudden you don't look to be that great, which seems to me to be what you're avoiding and the position you don't want to be in.
---
How was that WIFOM from Circus?
---
What did you claim?
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
Unrawr
Chibo made sense, I retreat from the Chaco case. Chaco you're clear.
Chibo made sense, I retreat from the Chaco case. Chaco you're clear.
rawr: xonar
yea you can die, not liking any of your recent posts.
Still think circus v chaco is TvS.
so i'm still looking at circus for scum too. Esp if xonar flips scum.
yea you can die, not liking any of your recent posts.
Still think circus v chaco is TvS.
so i'm still looking at circus for scum too. Esp if xonar flips scum.
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
I'll direct this to you too macman, and anyone voting on me. Post your case :/
CT Chia
Smash Obsessed
Yea sry I was away and stuff, busy as most ppl were
I'm holding off on voting anyone until I hear from some ppl as mentioned in my post. I completely missed the Marshy claim and don't see it anywhere. Wasn't it him that said he breadcrumbed it? But with Marshy saying why would he fakeclaim that role is telling me that his claimed role is common knowledge now that I completely missed out on.
I'm holding off on voting anyone until I hear from some ppl as mentioned in my post. I completely missed the Marshy claim and don't see it anywhere. Wasn't it him that said he breadcrumbed it? But with Marshy saying why would he fakeclaim that role is telling me that his claimed role is common knowledge now that I completely missed out on.
no point in me saying "THIS IS MY ROLE" outright 
Marshy never outright claimed. After re-reading I think I figured out what he is though.
Xonar, my case against you is basically unchanged. You continuously undermined what I believe to have been easily understood and accepted realities within this game. It came off to me as highly scummy, and that's that. I don't know what else to tell you, I'm very convinced that you're scum.
Xonar, my case against you is basically unchanged. You continuously undermined what I believe to have been easily understood and accepted realities within this game. It came off to me as highly scummy, and that's that. I don't know what else to tell you, I'm very convinced that you're scum.
CT Chia
Smash Obsessed
If you breadcrumbed it and there are ppl who already know what your role is then just say it
the point of breadcrumbing is to validate a role claim not as a method to tell ppl what it is -_- *sigh*
the point of breadcrumbing is to validate a role claim not as a method to tell ppl what it is -_- *sigh*
CT Chia
Smash Obsessed
Wow marshy you breadcrumb your role then tell ppl u did so ppl can find out what it is...
what is wrong with you
yo calm down
fishing MADDD hardbody
fishing MADDD hardbody
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
NO NO NO
I have not been undermining anything
un·der·mine (ndr-mn)
tr.v. un·der·mined, un·der·min·ing, un·der·mines
1. To weaken by wearing away a base or foundation: Water has undermined the stone foundations.
I have never ever been doing something undermining.
I have been opening options, I never said that what you think is WRONG, I'm just saying that we should think twice.
Because we should.
I honestly think anyone who isn't open for other options is a scrubby player.
Rawr: FF
I have not been undermining anything
un·der·mine (ndr-mn)
tr.v. un·der·mined, un·der·min·ing, un·der·mines
1. To weaken by wearing away a base or foundation: Water has undermined the stone foundations.
I have never ever been doing something undermining.
I have been opening options, I never said that what you think is WRONG, I'm just saying that we should think twice.
Because we should.
This. Is the bolded true for you?
I honestly think anyone who isn't open for other options is a scrubby player.
Rawr: FF
dayyummm. Xonar gettin OFF
- Joined
- Jul 9, 2007
- Messages
- 5,164
WARNING: Monster post will be stomping through your heavily populated city in 5... 4... 3... 2... 1....
I'm afraid you haven't. Not entirely, anyway. Okay, so it seems to you that I scumhunt selectively. In which past games have you found me scummy for this reason?
Not necessarily true. You and he are both capable of being scum without you regarding him at all.
Scumfever would not have been able to "drag you down with him" because at the time, he was not in the spotlight for the lynch. You were. Gheb and a couple of others had mentioned finding him scummy, but he was still not the main focus at the time and he had no way of knowing he would end up being a primary target later in the Day.
Well, to keep this intentionally vague, I think he did a good job of nearly clearing a few people based on the way he interacted with them. I think he was motivated to pump the brakes on your wagon because he didn't want you to be a viable lynch at the end of the Day. Why a mafioso would do this for someone who is not his buddy is beyond me. I think he repeatedly went back to accusing Blue of scumminess because he saw him as an easy target—someone the town wouldn't mind being rid of and seemed to have a hint of a dirty name over basically nothing. Since you also did this, you might call it a mutual connection between the two of you.
What? No. The posts that contradict each other are 429 and 477. That's only 48 posts apart. And if you can show me where in those 48 posts you changed your mind on Mentos and/or Gheb from "most townie" to "scummy," I'll be happy to strike that point.
Yeah, who ever heard of valuing interpersonal relationships over flavor? It's really somethin' else.
Bah! I always forget that. Rawr: frozenflame
He mentions Mentos and Gheb as two of the clearest townies in the game in post 429, then implies that Mentos and/or Gheb are, to some level, scummy in 477 without mentioning a change of mind beforehand.
This is the second time you've combated what I've said with the line "what a joke." As if that's enough on it's own to prove me wrong. Elaborate further or your defense is dead in the water.
Oh. Now suddenly I could be the play because I'm voting for you. Very nice.
Yes, yes you have been undermining things.
TBQH, its the way you expressed your doubts that give me the scum vibes. You SAY that all you're doing is presenting an alternative to what may be true, but in reality, the way you say it is VERY dismissive of what is likely to be the case. Here's what I'm talking about:
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9142158&postcount=593
"Why are you assuming they have a roleblocker? There's no reason to do that. Why don't you assume they have a hitman/ninja too then, and they can just say /care for doc, let's NK Chaco! The chances are the same."
But there IS reason to make that assumption, considering a cop claimed, didn't die at night, and didn't get a result. Roleblocker is the most simple and likely explanation.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9063549&postcount=370
"Wait wait.
Are we really falling for that cop claim?
Ok, I'm a vigilante. Will I never get lynched now? Nah. The mafia will probably also think I'm lying and they won't kill me. BTW this was an example, for the less gifted around here."
Falling for it? What reason to we have to think it's false? You're just casting doubt all over the claim. There's no two sides to this. The way you present it, you act as if you've already concluded that the claim is FALSE. You're not suggesting that it MIGHT be false, your syntax suggests that the MORE LIKELY reality is NOT true.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9145714&postcount=627
"Yes, I want you to step back and reconsider what YOU THINK should be solidly understood right now. You might just be doing what they want you to do.
What's all your evidence? ASSUMING they have a roleblocker and that chaco got roleblocked?"
The bolded is just classic scummy WIFOM language. As for my evidence, I have none, but the situation STILL suggests my belief that the claim is legit and a roleblocker is present moreso than your alternatives, yet you constantly attempt to UNDERMINE that belief.
It's not that I'm not open to other possibilities. Trust me, I know how important it is to have an open mind and not take many things as certainties in mafia. However, you dismissive attitude toward what is likely the true scenario, and constant contention that you're the herald of possibilities when in reality you're actually pushing a pro-less-likely reality agenda, just screams scum at me. You're trying to build yourself up as doing something that you're not doing at all. It just might LOOK that way to a skimmer or someone who simply takes you at your word without further analysis.
yeah chibo should stop fishing **** is ridiculous. hardly "fishing" with how blatant it is
CT Chia
Smash Obsessed
I'm not trying to fish it's just that I'm saying why tell your role to half of us and not the rest I don't get it
Breadcrumbing is used to confirm roles, not reveal them
Breadcrumbing is used to confirm roles, not reveal them
what does it matter?
like i dont get what youre arguing or what point youre trying to make or how this has any scumhunting value
you dont HAVE to know my role since itll be revealed sooner or later. is my claim the only thing keeping you from voting me? you unvoted and continue to question me so why unvote in the first place? just sheeping frozen/macman?
Cacti
Smash Journeyman
I think that Frozenflame is pushing waaaay too hard on this Xonar lynch. All he did was bring up some options, and I don't see what's really scummy about that. Maybe if someone could explain the apparentely scummy things he did lately. Circus' case on FF has merit though, and he's just seemingly dismissing the case away.
Also not liking Marshy. All he's doing is parroting and following around people.
Also not liking Marshy. All he's doing is parroting and following around people.
Nice job tunneling on just the vote count, and not actually reading the thread.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9102506&postcount=470
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9092069&postcount=444
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9096749&postcount=459
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9102604&postcount=471
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9103567&postcount=476
FIVE instances of Macman and Cacti openly expressing their contentedness with lynching Scumfever. I never changed my mind about anything. When I said too many people I'm getting not-so-town reads on wanted to lynch scumfever, I meant it. Just because people i happened to think were pro-town ALSO wanted to lynch him is irrelevant. Macman and Cacti were two of my top 3 suspects at the time, and as such, seeing them BOTH willing to lynch scumfever made me uneasy.
Where the hell did this come from? Are you seriously trying to contend that there is a solid enough connection in place bewteen Chaco and someone else that suggests that he's mafia falseclaiming cop in a game with no cops? Unless you can provide me with that solid of a case, you trying to contend that I'm prioritizing flavor over relationship analysis (which is BS anyway, since this has NOTHING to do with flavor, but rather, a VERY REAL A PRESENT CLAIM and reasonable speculation as to the game's setup) is complete and total crock.
Answered above in first paragraph.
I say "what a joke" because it should be very obvious why the points are ridiculous.
You're suggesting that the existence of MULTIPLE COPS in a game is a CLEAR AND PRESENT DANGER. Where in the world did you get that from?! That isn't a clear and present danger at all! There's nothing that even remotely suggests that we might have multiple cops. In fact, everything we have in front of us suggests otherwise!
Learn the difference between coincidence and causation.