Mods lock please

[RoboticSithDrone]

So, with MIB coming up, I think it's time to get some good old fashioned SSB:B action going!

Results:

WAAA 1 (Singles): http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=4995200&postcount=86
WAAA 2 (Singles): http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=5051395&postcount=137
WAAA 3 (Singles): http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=5105301&postcount=219
WAAA 4 (Singles, hosted by Omniswell): http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=5210426&postcount=372
WAAA 5 (Singles): http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=5303615&postcount=487
WAAA 6 (Singles, 2-stock best of 5): http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=5441541&postcount=657

Earliest start date: Sunday, July 12, 2009
Reg starts at 12:15
Tournament starts at 2 PM (2:30 if less than 12 people have signed up by 1, or if more are confirmed to be coming)

Location:
TBD

Double elimination - 3 stock - 8:00 time - Best of 3 (Losers, Winners, and Grand Finals are best of 5) - Items off - Singles - Bring Your Own Controller

$10 entry fee + possible venue fee (TBD) per entrant

1st place - 60% of entry fees
2nd place - 30% of entry fees
3rd place - 10% of entry fees

For the opening game of each set, blind character picking is in place.

Starter stages:
* Battlefield
* Castle Siege
* Final Destination
* Halberd
* Smashville
* Yoshi's Island (Brawl)
* Pokémon Stadium 1

From those starters, a coin is flipped. The loser of the toss gets to strike a stage, followed by the winner. This continues until there is one stage left, where the first game is played.

Counterpicking is done by Advance Slobs (Loser picks stage - Winner picks character - Loser picks character)

Each entrant is allowed ONE CP ban per round, and a stage cannot be used twice in a set.

Counterpicks are the starters PLUS:
* Distant Planet
* Delfino Plaza
* Frigate Orpheon
* Luigi's Mansion
* Lylat Cruise
* Norfair
* PictoChat
* Pirate Ship
* Pokémon Stadium 2

* Green Greens
* Jungle Japes
* Brinstar
* Rainbow Cruise
* Yoshi's Island (Melee)

Only stage differences from last year are Hanenbow, Port Town Aero Drive, Mario Circuit, and Onett now being banned for CPs.

--
Excessive stalling is banned.

MK's infinite cape is also banned (another change from last year!).

If a pause is required, the other player will pause. Pausing in certain circumstances (such as a PK Thunder recovery or a chaingrab) is not permitted.

If Bowser and Ganon initiate a suicide move and it would remove their opponent's last stock, sudden death or any other result is ignored and the win is awarded to Bowser/Dorf. Keep in mind that Kirbycide and D3cide are NOT protected this way, and if it goes to sudden death, a 1-stock runoff will be played on the same stage. If it results in a loss for D3 and Kirby, that result stands.

Otherwise, in the event of sudden death, the winner is the player with the most stocks remaining. If both players have the same amount of stocks, the lowest percentage wins. If both players are tied for stock and percent, a 1-stock runoff will be played on the same stage.

Venue fee WILL BE WAIVED if either a CRT television OR Wii + Brawl OR recording equipment is brought! Four TVs and four Wii+Brawl setups are preferable.

NO WEED NO ALCHOL NO PIPES NO BAD STUFF (CIGARETTES ARE OK THOUGH) THIS RULE WILL BE ENFORCED IF YOU HAVE BAD **** ON YOU YOU WILL BE DQ'D

 

[RoboticSithDrone]

Hm, was just made aware that Chill Zone is closing (I feel very very smart right now...). Anyone know of good venues in Oakland County?

EDIT: Scala and I are trying to get Lawrence Tech as a possible venue. Other suggestions are certainly welcome.

 

[Scala]

D'oh


10chars

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

if we could talk some god **** sense into gamerz live lounge.

 

[DarkLouis331]

I may come, but can't make any promises. I think I'm going to the tourney in Flint on the 17th. Find a venue nao! :D

If I do come, I may be able to bring a TV, but no Wii.

 

[TheWildcard]

were not using those stages. no one will come with those stages

 

[Juggleguy]

Don't feel like going to this.

 

[clowsui]

were not using those stages. no one in michigan will come with those stages

fixed, omnzy

 

[TheMann]

Is doubles happening at this?

 

[Mr.E]

From those starters, a coin is flipped. The winner of the toss gets to strike a stage, followed by the loser. This continues until there is one stage left, where the first game is played.

The loser should strike the first stage. That way, the winner gets to choose between the final remaining two stages and ultimately decide which stage is played on.

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

for those reading, these rules ARE out of date. We pretty much used our own stage list at the tournies anyways, and did everything the normal way to begin with. RSD has never been hellbent on his ruleset.

 

[RoboticSithDrone]

None of the stages are on the SBR ban list. Every stage that is legal is either on starter, CP, or borderline CP.

 

[TheWildcard]

no the stage list needs to be redone. use and EC stagelist they know how to set stages

 

[RoboticSithDrone]

11 or 12 legal stages does not a fun tournament make. "Ban everything" is something I try to avoid, and even with Onett and Hanenbow legal last year there weren't any complaints about stage legality. Stagelist is the only part of the rules I'm standing by 100% in addition to the obvious (no MK infinite cape, for instance).

 

[TheWildcard]

..... there was alot of complaints kids just didnt pick them.

how and why is mario circuit allowed that is ridiculous.

 

[clowsui]

omni just pick MK on gay stages and gay them out lol
not that hard, just kinda boring

 

[RoboticSithDrone]

Mario Circuit I noticed and fixed about an hour before you brought it up.

Also, if you want to say that a stage makes the game worse off by being allowed, prove it.

 

[TheWildcard]

* Distant Planet - not a problem
* Delfino Plaza- not a problem
* Frigate Orpheon- not a problem
* Luigi's Mansion- not a problem
* Lylat Cruise- not a problem
* Norfair- iffy but no problem here
* PictoChat- not a problem
* Pirate Ship- water camping is a huge problem here, it forces kdis to switch ot a character than can dela with water camping http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIIDH_WzCis
* Pokémon Stadium 2- not a problem
* Port Town Aero Dive- horrible. car kills at 40 give certain characters a huge advantage and makes bad characters worse
* Green Greens- lol you're asking for someone to run time here with mk.
* Jungle Japes- debateable but its legit
* Brinstar- not a problem
* Rainbow Cruise- not a problem
* Yoshi's Island (Melee)- pipes is a horrible stage it has a walk off and dumb **** can happen here

 

[Notra]

Mario Circuit I noticed and fixed about an hour before you brought it up.

Also, if you want to say that a stage makes the game worse off by being allowed, prove it.

its already been proved hence why the lvls are normally banned. dont be a duche and try to do stuff no one wants to do. i mean u guys dont have a venue yet. have anymore reasons for ppl not to come?

 

[clowsui]

i'm not coming to this tourney so take my reasoning with a grain of salt but:

i agree with omni's reasoning, in order to attract more attendants...it'd be different if you had a venue, but since other regions don't run stage lists like this, it's just more competitive to ban the stages as a TO because you have to play by their rulesets...this isn't melee where there was only one to two choices of tournament each weekend LOL the tournament goer's opinion is now way more important and stuff. sorry speedmaster

PTAD gives HUGE stage bias to people with multiple jumps along with floaty up b + makes light characters worse if you want specifics

 

[Gates]

* Luigi's Mansion- not a problem

How is it not a problem? MK ***** here. Olimar ***** here. Light characters in general have an advantage here because of the gigantic ceiling. As long as the first floor of the mansion is in tact, people playing against MK here will get destroyed by the Tornado. Same thing with Olimar and his utilt/uair/nair. It's almost impossible to play larger characters like Dedede, Snake, Wario, and Donkey Kong here for that exact reason, not to mention the fact that a lot of the more highly used characters in the game kill off the top. This stage isn't as bad as, say, Big Blue, but it's still a bad stage because of those characters.

* Norfair- iffy but no problem here

I like Norfair (platform layout is soooo good) but at the same time I'm leaning towards its banning simply because of the ridiculous planking/camping that can be done here with MK, Wario, and others. This is basically MK's easy win stage since they can either use the platform layout and ledge canceling drill rush to their advantage to move about the stage at blindingly fast speeds that are impossible to keep up with or they can plank like ******s and win that way. If you don't ban it I'll be fine with it since I don't plank, but if it becomes a problem don't say I didn't tell you so.

* Green Greens- lol you're asking for someone to run time here with mk.

Don't forget about Dedede. Green Greens has 4 walls, so unless Wispy Woods ****s it up, one grab means 1 stock for over half the cast. It's also got a small ceiling which makes it easy for Dedede to deal with light characters as well.

Also, it's interesting that you have Lylat Cruise as a counterpick and Castle Seige as a neutral when most people would have it the other way around. Castle Siege is widely considered a gayer stage than Lylat because of walk-offs, stage transformations, low ceilings, etc.

tl;dr - Your stage list is bad and you should feel bad.

 

[Zankoku]

Haha, very doubtful he'll change it, but also doubtful that the tournament will get large enough out-of-state attention for something like this to matter.

(12:39:38 AM) RoboticSithDrone: Fine, if you want a stage banned at WAAA, prove the game is worse off with it legal
(12:40:04 AM) Ankoku: Why bother when everyone will just keep playing without ever counterpicking them anyway, and we get the same effect?
(12:40:21 AM) RoboticSithDrone: Then why bother banning it?
(12:41:28 AM) Ankoku: Generally people want a legitimate ruleset. If there were rules saying "You may instead choose to play 5 minute Coin Battle" and nobody did Coin Battle, the effect is the same but the rulelist is still better off without.
(12:41:50 AM) RoboticSithDrone: You do realize all stages are legal by SBR ruleset 2.0
(12:43:03 AM) Ankoku: I realize that, and I ask why you choose to run as many stages as possible against the normal standard of MI tournaments, whether it is a priority on your philosophy of "not banning anything" or just to prove some point.
(12:43:45 AM) RoboticSithDrone: My philosophy is that if it doesn't turn a given tournament degenerate and if the stage is legal by a commonly adapted ruleset, it's very likely not deserving of a ban
(12:44:22 AM) RoboticSithDrone: And that having more options to consider will in the end be a better barometer of who is the better player than just "I know all 12 stages that are legal"
(12:45:31 AM) Ankoku: Given that all the top players in the state know each other and you aren't exactly drawing out-of-state attendance, it's more like "I know all 3 stages that he might counterpick."
(12:45:57 AM) RoboticSithDrone: So, my question to you is why should I ban everything except for 5 starters and 7 other CPs.
(12:46:39 AM) Ankoku: I just find it odd that you'd leave stages legal when they are largely requested to be banned, and when nobody is counterpicking it in the first place so there would be no difference whether or not it was banned, except by leaving it legal you're pretty much just spiting everyone.
(12:47:14 AM) RoboticSithDrone: Largely requested being just you and Omni so far
(12:47:30 AM) Ankoku: I haven't made any request.
(12:47:44 AM) RoboticSithDrone: Then just Omni
(12:48:27 AM) RoboticSithDrone: I honestly think that the response to the stagelist is more reflexive than "I know why it's a bad idea."
(12:49:48 AM) Ankoku: If you say so.
(12:49:59 AM) Ankoku: But hey, it's local, so like I said, it probably won't make a difference.

 

[DarkLouis331]

**** it, I can't come to this. I just found out that my cousin's graduation party is happening that day. I'd rather come to this, but its my cousin. (Graduation parties are pointless >.<)

But I'll probably see some of you at the Best of Michigan tournament on the 17th.

 

[Gates]

**** it, I can't come to this. I just found out that my cousin's graduation party is happening that day. I'd rather come to this, but its my cousin. (Graduation parties are pointless >.<)

But I'll probably see some of you at the Best of Michigan tournament on the 17th.

He doesn't have a venue so it doesn't matter.

Also...

Why Norfair should be banned:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MkvLt2fM97c&fmt=18
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzdKALKnTog
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKVaYbC1SuE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0nc8l0XKEY&feature=channel_page

Why Pirate Ship should be banned:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTkjItgz5c0&fmt=18

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

keep pirateship

 

[TheWildcard]

Luigis mansion isint that bad imho because you can break the house, and it gives bad characters a good counterpick. Mk dosent rule LM ic's **** him there so does oli and snake even lucario.

 

[Vayseth]

I'm not coming if this stage list continues to suck. BTW, if he doesn't have a venue, we can just find one, and TO it ourselves, and avoid this issue altogether.

 

[The Sauce Boss]

In response to ankoku's conversation, more people than omni think the stage list is wack. For instance, I do.

 

[Juggleguy]

Norfair, port down aero dive, and yoshi pipes are all terrible stages. I'm not really sure what has kept them on some stage lists for this long.

 

[TheWildcard]

midwest is wack, that is why

 

[WOMBO_COMBO]

yeah bro id change the rules unless u only want 1 person to show up. vayseth wanna host a tourney? i can help if u want.

Sry this is NOTRA. Im at a friends house and forgot to change accounts.

 

[Vayseth]

I don't really wanna host. The problem with hosting is you don't get to really have fun and play friendlies and stuff.

 

[TheWildcard]

Id host. I dont play much friendlies anyway

 

[JustKindaBoredUKno]

the whole problem is a venue.

 

[TheWildcard]

and stages

 

[RoboticSithDrone]

A couple things:

-Port Town Aero Drive has been removed from the stage list (this seemed like the one arousing the most complaints on its own), with Yoshi's Pipes being next pending future tournament results;
-I've been calling around, and I might have a couple venues who are interested. The key word here is might, so don't get on me over who they are.

 

[TheWildcard]

* Pirate Ship
* Port town Aero Dive
* Green Greens
* Yoshi's Island (Melee)

Until these stages are banned i doubt anyone will come.

 

[Ori_bro]

yeah id be down if u guys get a venue

 

[Notra]

Id host. I dont play much friendlies anyway

i can help u host if u want me to. just have to show me some stuff. and get your game on would probably let us use their basement or digital ops.

 

[TheWildcard]

we cant advertise in someone else tourney thread wel ltake it to the big MI discussion.