MK banned Tournaments

[AfroQT]

Guess i shoulda said comprehension lol

Nah but if anyone gets a blessing of comprehension it needs to be taylor.

 

[Strawhat64]

sounds grands..as for crew...

it would probaly me, kyon, d-torr, legion...and maybe hbox...
were nkown as...
the KPO krew...

 

[Queen B. Kyon]

I never agreed to that :/

 

[theONEjanitor]

if you banned mk and left stages as they are, snake would drop to mid tier lol snake loses to like every top tier except ic's and diddy (arguable) and he loses to several non top tiers like oli and ddd who were previously scared away by metaknight but will not be anymore

banning dumb stages would do a lot to prevent that though.

mk beats most characters on neutral stages too though, i dont know why everyone pretends that isn't the case. diddy vs mk on fd is still slightly in mk's favor lol

considering what we know about matchups, i think marth would become the dominant character, but unlike MK there are legit options against him.

mk shouldn't be banned necessarily because he's "too good" i think that's kind of a scrub reason to ban a character, but there's no question that banning him will improve the diversity and balance of the game. you really can't dispute that i dont think.

we're banning him in Alabama, but we suck so whateverr.

 

[shaSLAM]

we're banning him in Alabama, but we suck so whateverr.

^
only true statement you made.

but i only feel like arguing that fd is one of mk's weaker stages, it may be his only real kind of weak one, so idk about mk having an advatage over a character whose best stage is fd... on fd. and a top tier at that.
he aint thaaat broken dude lol

 

[HRNUT (Honey Roasted)]

Lol snake does not lose to every top tier where are you guys getting that from lol

 

[AfroQT]

Lol i know bro im sittin here thinkin damn the game must of really ****in changed since last time i played lol.

 

[Queen B. Kyon]

For a while I thought I was bad saying what I said lol. Was I over thinking that snake was good or something lol

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Snake loses to

Pika
Olimar
Marth
(Maybe) D3
(Maybe) Falco
(Maybe) Wario

 

[MVD]

He does not beat any high tier which is what matters

 

[Queen B. Kyon]

I haven't seen a good snake lose to no one but mk in a while ... then again I don't follow snake results.

 

[shaSLAM]

yeah the snake d3 thing really isnt THAT hard.
its ****ing d3

 

[DJ Arcatek]

Snake goes even with Wario and has a VERY slight disadvantage to Falco, imo.


As far as D3 is concerned, I've been reading around and apparently Snake beats D3 in high level play, but I'm not sure if I believe that just yet >__>

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

MVD > Coney at #####
Fatal > Atomsk at Concentrate.

Also...Bizkit and Fatal lost to Dabuz at Concentrate. I know Ally lost to him too, but I'm not sure if he used snake or not. Olimar > Snake, trust me.

 

[Dabuz]

Without MK, ics become the best character, FACT! They have amazing MU spreads even in the top tiers, and function amazingly on all stages except two: RC and brinstar, even then, they aren't bad on either.

also, oli vs. snake is only +1 oli's favor, even that is debatable

 

[DJ Arcatek]

Oh I know Olimar > Snake, I didn't disagree there. Snake loses to Marth, Olimar, and Pika when it comes to high tiers, that's for sure.

 

[OverLade]

Snake loses to

Pika
Olimar
Marth
(Maybe) D3
(Maybe) Falco
(Maybe) Wario

Snake beats Wario, and DEFINITELY loses to D3 and Falco. Imo in order of difficulty.

Olimar/MK
Falco
D3
Marth
Pika
Wario

Pika snake isn't even that bad yall Pika players are just full of yourselves

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

***** not only have I BEAT every Snake player, but I have WRECKED every Snake player. I'm not that much better than them skill-wise since they are also nationally recognized players, but I still destroyed them. That means MU problems >_>

 

[OverLade]

***** not only have I BEAT every Snake player, but I have WRECKED every Snake player. I'm not that much better than them skill-wise since they are also nationally recognized players, but I still destroyed them. That means MU problems >_>

You are a SIGNIFICANTLY better player than all of them. There are 4 tiers of top player

SSS
@lly
Glutonny
Brood
M2K

SS
DEHF
San
ESAM
Ant1
Dojo



S
Ultim@terazer
At@msk
RedHalberd
Fat@l

A tier - Gonna leave this one empty wahaha.

There isn't a single Snake player in the SS tier, except Ally who's above it but doesn't main snake/study matchups.

 

[*Cam*]

Thunder and chaingrabs wreck Snake pretty hard when used effectively, but I am still reluctant to call it more than just even. Snake has superior range, priority, survivability, and kill potential. It could also be argued that he has a better camping game.

I think you probably know the matchup a lot better than they do, ESAM. It's not like there are that many high-level Pikachus to practice against, whereas there are a million Snakes. Also, like RedHalberd said, you shouldn't underestimate your own skill level.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

I know I'm really good. I beat @lly's Snake every time I've played it, even when HE MAINED SNAKE! (Cough MLG).

Also...you think S@n is an SS? Wat.

Pikachu outdamages snake due to his CG and edgeguarding, he outcamps him, he has really good pressure due to Snake being fearful of the grab, and I can juggle him almost better than MK. He can't f-tilt as freely due to us being able to grab it, same with u-tilt. He has to rely on blanket aerials, but we can dash under him and uair. He really can't do much if the Pikachu is patient enough (Which I have to start doing again since I just rush-down since I'm so used to Snake's everything...)

 

[OverLade]

I know I'm really good. I beat @lly's Snake every time I've played it, even when HE MAINED SNAKE! (Cough MLG).

Also...you think S@n is an SS? Wat.

Pikachu outdamages snake due to his CG and edgeguarding, he outcamps him, he has really good pressure due to Snake being fearful of the grab, and I can juggle him almost better than MK. He can't f-tilt as freely due to us being able to grab it, same with u-tilt. He has to rely on blanket aerials, but we can dash under him and uair. He really can't do much if the Pikachu is patient enough (Which I have to start doing again since I just rush-down since I'm so used to Snake's everything...)

You're pretty much impossible to argue with because you look at matchups way too generally. It's the adding up of miniscule calculations of range, speed, damage and weight that determine which character has an "advantage".

I think you probably know the matchup a lot better than they do, ESAM. It's not like there are that many high-level Pikachus to practice against, whereas there are a million Snakes. Also, like RedHalberd said, you shouldn't underestimate your own skill level.

Hopefully 90% of the Pikachu players can agree with this, especially given how much of an outlier ESAM is resultswise...

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

So you mean the actual range which we are even in (d-tilt), the fact that we are faster, the fact that we do damage MUCH faster with a plethora of ways (I'm really not going to go into every intricate detail of our juggling, CGs, and edgeguarding, am i?), and the fact that we can still reliably kill Snake ~130-140%% while Snake kills us at ~110%

And I like how you are pretty much crowding yourselves with the people that agree with you. You could be with 1 other person vs 6, and you would still think the only correct person is the person agreeing with you, even though you are outnumbered/out-experienced.

I have yet to see a legit argument as to why doesn't get -2'd. Everybody who opposes it is just "Oh, all the things Pikachu has against Snake aren't THAT bad, even though ESAM has abused those things time and time again." And it's ****ing ridiculous. That's like saying Olimar doesn't beat Snake because close range Snake wins due to superior spacing and he is infinitely heavier/is faster due to dacus and momentum tricks. The fact that he gets outcamped and his approaches are stopped doesn't mean anything because I'm looking at it too vaguely.

 

[MVD]

Guess I'm not good in lades eyes

 

[DFEAR]

this thread is now about how mvd is definitely better than both UR and fatal

 

[So Fatal]

o: esam does wreck snake even though we went to game 3 when we played last stocks, im itching for a rematch :D

I think Olimar beats snake though but not by much.

You are a SIGNIFICANTLY better player than all of them. There are 4 tiers of top player

SSS
@lly
Glutonny
Brood
M2K

SS
DEHF
San
ESAM
Ant1
Dojo



S
Ultim@terazer
At@msk
RedHalberd
Fat@l

A tier - Gonna leave this one empty wahaha.

There isn't a single Snake player in the SS tier, except Ally who's above it but doesn't main snake/study matchups.

hmm idk about this ive beaten 2 people in SS and 2 in SSS, I don't think san should be above :D

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

But the matches I beat you I 2 and 3 stocked you (trollface even though that is fact)

I'm kinda mad you namesearched F@tal or fat@l lol.

MM AT APEX?!?!

 

[So Fatal]

But the matches I beat you I 2 and 3 stocked you (trollface even though that is fact)

I'm kinda mad you namesearched F@tal or fat@l lol.

MM AT APEX?!?!

I didn't do that lmao. Someone posted this in here:

this thread is now about how mvd is definitely better than both UR and fatal

Wasn't game 1 Three stock for you, game 2 was 2 stock for me on halberd and game three was last stock low percent for you? either way over a year ago so whatever

MM sounds kewl :3

 

[theONEjanitor]

snake sucks lol
that's just one scrub's opinion though.
mk > snake
falco > snake
pika > snake
marth > snake
olimar > snake
wario = snake
ddd > snake

i.e the entire top/high tier besides diddy and ICs and a couple of mid tier.
its like no one is even disputing this really but still we hesitate to say that Snake sucks lol. (i don't mean SUCKS sucks like Samus sucks, but just in terms of tournament viability.)

i'm not saying Snake just gets bodied, the point is, he DOESN'T WIN lol. my theory is that MK scares a lot of his bad matchups out of the game (at high level), and the only characters that people aren't afraid to use against MK, like diddy or wario just happen to be some of Snake's better high tier matchups. that's why i think an MK ban could be mean less success for Snake.

I will say that an MK ban COULD result in even MORE Snake development, however. Because we used to consider Oimar and DDD almost unwinnable, now they're just slight advantages. I feel like this is not the subject of this thread though, so i'll hush

that said, no one in alabama knows how to fight snake except cam and reflex and probably billy but i've never played him in tournament, so i will continue to play him

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Wasn't game 1 Three stock for you, game 2 was 2 stock for me on halberd and game three was last stock low percent for you? either way over a year ago so whatever

MM sounds kewl :3

Nah, I 3 stocked you, it was last hit you won (You had like 85%) and then I 2 stocked you. You got it kinda reversed lol, but it's ok, past doesn't mean anything. Now you won't win a game

How much MM? 5? 10?

 

[So Fatal]

Nah, I 3 stocked you, it was last hit you won (You had like 85%) and then I 2 stocked you. You got it kinda reversed lol, but it's ok, past doesn't mean anything. Now you won't win a game

How much MM? 5? 10?

dat mike ross status,

5 sounds good

 

[VSC.D-Torr]

+ infinite amount of respect points to Fatal just for writing Mike Ross

 

[AfroQT]

He's heard of Mike Ross.

Respect him.

 

[2-DJeff]

We need Brinstar and RC for Falco/ICs if MK is banned lawl.

pretty sure he wont make both legal. thats a free win in most cases. which is not the equivalent to IC on a any other stage even FD

@esam what other snake's you beat that knows the pikachu mu (pikas that are at your level) besides mvd?

IC vs Snake is 55:45 snake or 57:43 at worse
falco vs snake is in snake favor slightly

You're pretty much impossible to argue with because you look at matchups way too generally. It's the adding up of miniscule calculations of range, speed, damage and weight that determine which character has an "advantage".


Hopefully 90% of the Pikachu players can agree with this, especially given how much of an outlier ESAM is resultswise...

this is so ****ing true ROFL

 

[So Fatal]

I hope were talking about the same mike ross :]

 

[2-DJeff]

lol of coarse fatal. do you believe in mike ross

 

[DellSmashman]

Eww at people saying Wario loses to Snake. I feel every time I see this matchup it's only worse and worse for Snake. It's at LEAST even, and some even say +1 Wario, at least majority of the Wario boards do. Oya DDD beats Snake +2.

 

[Strawhat64]

Eww at people saying Wario loses to Snake. I feel every time I see this matchup it's only worse and worse for Snake. It's at LEAST even, and some even say +1 Wario, at least majority of the Wario boards do. Oya DDD beats Snake +2.

I am sure that Snake Vs snake match up is on wario's favor, last time I checked...

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

u should do draft crews

 

[DC]

Lol have you guys ever seen the sunlight