Thee Incubus
Smash Journeyman
LOLZ at the misquoted quotes.
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Metaknight Officially Banned In Italy.
- Thread starter Aldwyn McCloud
- Start date
- Status
Meta Knight has NO Infinite comboes (Dedede)
Meta Knight has NO chaingrabs (Falco, Mario, Pikachu, Dedede, Marth, others I can't be bothered to mention)
Meta Knight has NO Grab-release comboes (Marth, Yoshi, wonder who else)
Meta Knight has NO projectile (Crapton of characters)
Meta Knight cannot cancel projectiles with his sword.. swininging attacks, not counting Glide Attack and some others...
Meta Knight has NO 0-death comboes
Meta Knight has NO unescapeable comboes that aren't extremely %-dependant(Lucario, Kirby).
Meta Knight actually IS light.
Meta Knight has close to NONE good kill moves (Glide attack is the only one that comes to mind. Dsmash KOs most characters around 130% or more, unless you DI like down, in which case learn to DI.)
Yes, MetaKnight can gimp. Almost every character can gimp Falco in Melee. How do they get around that? DON'T GO NEAR THE EDGE OR JUMP OFF THE STAGE TO BE GIMPED. MK has no projectile so there's NO REASON for you to be at the edge.
And so on. MetaKnight doesn't have many spammable moves either. If they Dsmash you should be happy that they won't be able to kill you until 150%. If they spam Tornado you should be happy and use your character's best method to punish it. Dair works for most characters.
*Sighs*
Meta Knight is one of the few fair characters in the game with no chaingrabs or infinites or Projectile spam or camping or anything like that. The people I play against probably aren't that good and tornado spam or up B spam doesn't work against them. If you up B their shield, they can release it and run forward. They have ages and ages to punish you before you can glide attack.
Okay, so hes has little lag and fast moves? Annoying? Yeah guess so. Ban-worthy? Gimme a break.
Meta Knight has NO chaingrabs (Falco, Mario, Pikachu, Dedede, Marth, others I can't be bothered to mention)
Meta Knight has NO Grab-release comboes (Marth, Yoshi, wonder who else)
Meta Knight has NO projectile (Crapton of characters)
Meta Knight cannot cancel projectiles with his sword.. swininging attacks, not counting Glide Attack and some others...
Meta Knight has NO 0-death comboes
Meta Knight has NO unescapeable comboes that aren't extremely %-dependant(Lucario, Kirby).
Meta Knight actually IS light.
Meta Knight has close to NONE good kill moves (Glide attack is the only one that comes to mind. Dsmash KOs most characters around 130% or more, unless you DI like down, in which case learn to DI.)
Yes, MetaKnight can gimp. Almost every character can gimp Falco in Melee. How do they get around that? DON'T GO NEAR THE EDGE OR JUMP OFF THE STAGE TO BE GIMPED. MK has no projectile so there's NO REASON for you to be at the edge.
And so on. MetaKnight doesn't have many spammable moves either. If they Dsmash you should be happy that they won't be able to kill you until 150%. If they spam Tornado you should be happy and use your character's best method to punish it. Dair works for most characters.
*Sighs*
Meta Knight is one of the few fair characters in the game with no chaingrabs or infinites or Projectile spam or camping or anything like that. The people I play against probably aren't that good and tornado spam or up B spam doesn't work against them. If you up B their shield, they can release it and run forward. They have ages and ages to punish you before you can glide attack.
Okay, so hes has little lag and fast moves? Annoying? Yeah guess so. Ban-worthy? Gimme a break.
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
Let's chop a few things.
Falco is the only one and his CG only works to a certain percent.
Even then its not unavoidable.
He has alot of other combos!
Ic's are the only ones and they can be avoided too.
Lucario can only Nair~ another aerial which is good.
MK should be at the edge off stage to gimp an opponent.
....
Not gonna touch it.
None of the points are criteria for a ban though.
On 5 characters who are disadvantaged to begin with (except Dk who is harder to grab).
Again not a big deal considering most of teh Cg's are character specific.
Falco is the only one and his CG only works to a certain percent.
Even then its not unavoidable.
Sonic >_>
He has alot of other combos!
Projectile is not eneded.
Airdodge.
Only characters that do use grab releases and those can be avoided.
Ic's are the only ones and they can be avoided too.
Lucario and Kirby can't continue a combo at higher percents.
Lucario can only Nair~ another aerial which is good.
Small and fast though so its not an issue.
He also has his ^B and his kill moves are fast (except for Fsmash) glide toss isn't a good kill move.
melee not Brawl.
Like they have a choice when you smack them off the edge.
MK should be at the edge off stage to gimp an opponent.
This goes for everyone.
Fair?
....
Not gonna touch it.
Agreed.
None of the points are criteria for a ban though.
Please, everyone... Try to understand the meaning of a weakness. A weakness IS NOT a factor that keeps your character from being infallible. It's a factor that may keep your character from winning.
If MK had projectiles, 0-deaths, or CGs he would be completely and utterly broken. Bottom line. The only thing I can see that even resembles a weakness in this list would be MK's lightness, and even that isn't too much of a vulnerability.
Stop saying stuff like this because they are just shallow attempt to make MK seem not-so-good by listing things that, if he had, would make him perfect.
Ginger_Warrior
Smash Apprentice
Yuna, would you care to explain why, as a Smash director, you feel the need to take my words out of context?Ginger_Warrior said:
That's not what I said at all. Reducing others in an intelligent argument to "Scrubs" is hardly an intelligent or mature approach. Instead of saying you're intelligent, I suggest you act it.
I said I don't support this ban. What's your problem?
MBlaze
Smash Champion
Since when the hell does Mario have a chain grab? o_O If your talking about his up tilt then your sadly mistaking that for a chain grab and I lol at that. If your not talking about the u tilt I'd like to know what.
brinboy789
Smash Champion
people talk about italy banning MK here. talk about metaknights weakness on the thread thats named
"metaknights weakness"
genuis name right
"metaknights weakness"
genuis name right
Hell?!? This isn't the NS2 marioblaze i knowSince when the hell does Mario have a chain grab? o_O If your talking about his up tilt then your sadly mistaking that for a chain grab and I lol at that. If your not talking about the u tilt I'd like to know what.
they probably will, I mean.. there haven't been any tournaments yet but.. it's just so good it must be banned
brinboy789
Smash Champion
i like pepperoniMK has on none. Ever wondered why they're disadvantaged?
MK has no character-specific chainthrows. MK has no %-dependant chainthrows. Come on, I know this, what is your point?
But no grab releases. Yawn.
Projectile is a method of making your opponent do what you want them to, Dealing damage and getting them to where they don't want to be. How good a player are you, and how well do you understand the game?
Everyone can airdodge, AND some can in addition cancel projectiles with their attacks. Not MK. I know you can airdodge, and MK not only can, but HAS TO. Geez.
Of course, but MK has none.
Of course no one can. MK can't really combo even at low %'s, and being so broken, it's kind of strange.
He still is light and can be killed early. That's a whole different thing.
Indeed, I meant Shuttle Loop instead of Glide attack. Actually those 2 are almost the only ones that really work, DSmash DIed sends them at about a 50-degree angle and that doesn't really kill unless right at the edge. Fsmash should never hit opponents with brains, at least often enough. I assume everyone has brains.
It's called "a comparsion". Ever heard of the term?
When you are at a % high enough for his small-KB moves to send you to be edgeguarded from the middle of the stage you kind of deserve to die. And even in that case it's not even close to guaranteed, recovery mindgames exist, especially with Brawl's auto-sweetspot.
Why on Earth would you be on the edge of the stage against a Meta Knight? He has no projectiles, stay close to the center, he has to come for you.
Fair is an excellent move, but it can be avoided and possibly punished if you space just right and depending on character. Spamming it doesn't work even against the people I play with, why it works against the best in the world is beyond me.
Too lazy to quote >_> Blahblahblah.
I never said they were weaknesses. It's completely broken things MK doesn't have. That other characters DO have. Shallow attempt at what? Showing that he isn't invulnerable by not having anything unbeatable?
Lulz nuclear bombs exploding in California don't affect you if you don't live near California ^_^
Morrigan
/!\<br>\¡/
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2006
- Messages
- 18,681
It doesn't affect you if you are on Italy either because there are no tournaments there.
well if it was taken seriously it most certainly could effect other countries when deciding on such matters, especially if they had more evidence of him being broken or whatever. like if it was a different metaknight winning every single tournament.. but they don't.. so it is not taken seriously as you can see
pizza<tacos
pizza<tacos
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
I cannot understand this sentence very well explicate.
My point is that this is an invalid point and not part of the criteria of being bannable.
TL is king of spam that wouldn't be what makes him banworthy,
Doesn't need them yawn.
I've been playing melee since 02, won a few tourneys, lost a few.
got ***** by Azen, isai, Ken a few times.
I can go on.
Anyways projectiles are not needed for MK. He has more than enough to make up for it.
Don't question me like that again please. Its rather rude.
Do you not read my responses?
So? he has multiple jumps so he can put those airdodges to best use.
big deal if Marth can break a projectile, he won't have enough time to dodge the incoming arrow or boomerang or bomb.
Again your points?
Not a criteria for banning.
its because what he does are strings.
They aren't true combos but they place the opponent in sucha bad position that even if the opponent reacts well, he cans till continue his attack.
big deal he isn't jigglypuff and he still has a safe game.
Well its not the have as in more like use.
Of course but your comparisons are invalid because they are NOT the criteria for banning a character.
Mindgames are never taken into accounts since it is not a static factor.
I misunderstood what you said it seemed liek you portrayed MK tos tay on stage.
Yes you should stay near the center.
Play M2K's Marth or Ken's Marth in melee.
or Emblem Lord's Marth.
Or M2k"s MK.
The reason the Fair works is because they know how to use it well.
Fair while retreating is very easily done for Marth and MK hence why it is sov ery effective.
it is safe and allows follow ups.
yadda yadda
CG isn't broken. Well DDD's is but that's a whole other story.
Anbyways what you listed are not the criteria for a ban. I recommend reading Sirlin.
Morrigan
/!\<br>\¡/
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2006
- Messages
- 18,681
No...really.
The moment OP said there are no tournaments in Italy it was the moment this thread lost its little importance it had. What's the point? I actually don't understand you people. This is just another version of "MK should/will be banned thread" SamuraiPanda made. It's like starting a "Metaknight is banned in Madagascar!" thread. Who the hell cares, Brawl is not played competitively over there.
I've read Sirlin *yawns*
It means that MK has none of the infinite stuff-whatevers. Then I asked you if you wonder why the match-ups are in the other characters' disadvantage.
Invalid point? No it's not. Having chainthrows > no chainthrows. And if I'm trying to say MK has no chainthrows, it's very valid to say he has none. o_o
But he has none as I said -.- This is getting annoying.
02? Never heard of you? O_o At least that's better than 08 March. I read them, that's why I would ask. >_>
So well... if you didn't know O_o Dunno >_> And btw these are responses to each of your responses since I'm too lazy to quote. Guess the Marth doesn't then <_< How about Aura Sphere?
My point was that MK has none. pretty self-explanatory *sighs*
Yeah indeed, so instead of comboes he relies on mindgames ^_^
Um ok?
I never said it was, it was used as a stepping stone to the method to avoid gimping, which even pros dont seem to grasp. It's so frustrating how you seem to lack common sense.
So you assume people have no mindgames? So Ike is top tier since no one notices his attacks early enough to react. Ever noticed why I questioned how long you had been playing?
Yes you should, and even can. And you seem to misunderstand a lot indeed.
Europe's best Marths don't count? Wow that's so ... well not racist but >_> They aren't bad.
I'd love to play them o.O Wanna have them come over? And people at high level do NOT spam fairs, it just doesn't work. At least in Melee it doesn't. If it does in Brawl, wait a few years for the metagame to improve.
CG isn't broken >_> I never said it is. It's still better than no chainthrow, since it's a foolproof method of getting easy %'s that works always. MK has no chainthrow, all right?
Yawnyawnyawn.
BTW, spamming fair doesn't work at high level play, I'm saying it one more time. -_____-
Since Italy has some awesome players. I don't know how much Aldwyn has played Brawl but I'm guessing he should be one of the best if not the best in Italy by almost pure talent. Some people don't think America is the only country in the world, and it sucks if Aldwyn has to learn another character to beat everyone. It also could affect Europe as a whole, where I happen to live. If you don't care, just stop posting?
Aldwyn McCloud
Smash Ace
the point of the thread is figuring out wheter MK deserved his ban or the Italian community is actually made of noobs. And as for the record unlike almost everyone in this thread I DO am Italian so **** it if I care about it!
Morrigan
/!\<br>\¡/
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- Messages
- 18,681
You got me wrong, it's not that I don't care about the country that bans the character...Why do THEY care if there are no tournaments! That's what I was saying.
It's just like saying: "Making babies in the Vatican is now banned!". There are only priests there so why should they care?
It wasn't a misquote as none of those were quotes.
CALOZ
Smash Apprentice
I dont think MK should be banned he is a good character to main.
The tourneys well be good if they banned MK jk XD
but yea who wants to go to italy boards if you dont want good competitions
The tourneys well be good if they banned MK jk XD
but yea who wants to go to italy boards if you dont want good competitions
It wasn't out of context at all, you ranted on Tier Lists in a highly uneducated manner which shows that you obviously have no idea why Tier Lists are written and what they're for.
I summed up their arguments. And who said this was an intelligent debate? The people whose posts I mocked were not intelligent. At least not their posts. Hence the mocking.
Just because we agree on that, we have to be best friends now?
XIF
Smash Master
Well now for a more serious post
first: Yuna is not someone I would take seriously. anyone who thinks that banning metaknight is not a consideration cannot be taken too seriously... but each to their own opinion I suppose, but I definitely disagree with the notion that banning characters is automatically scrub mentality. In some cases yes, but metaknight warrants a serious discussion, not a volley of vague insults.
second: while I hope that some of the newer members have the capacity to think about this rationally, I really dont care if anyone with a late 2007 or a 2008 join date agrees with me or not. Most of you are only familiar with brawl and have no idea what it was like in melee or what it is like in any other community. I was the same way once upon a time. Even if some of you were responding with something other than trite one liners, you really can't make fully informed opinions. This is insulting I suppose but I wish that to be as serious as possible, and not simply a way to anger people.
I want to post an argument I just posted in the back room about the subject. After strong initial opposition months back the discussion to ban metaknight is a very serious one now. So while everyone was angered by my stance back then, I have a chance to express my opinion and have a real disucssion.
my post:
Now that my initial suggestion of banning metaknight is being taken seriously (albeit prompted by other people than myself and after large initial opposition) I'd like to add my serious two cents here.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
I want to say this off the bat:
Brawl will not grow as a fighting game at all until metaknight is banned.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is why:
Metaknight is certainly beatable. I will not argue this. Metaknight is also far and away better than every other character. I think we can all agree on this, with some leeway on the "far and away." But the idea is that its never a bad idea to use metaknight in every match up, where as every other character can not say that.
What has happened now is that the entirety of the metagame has revolved around not necessarily "my chances of winning are so much higher with metaknight than anyone else" and more so of "my character selection is based solely upon how well I can do against metaknight". This issue is only compounded by the fact is that indeed the answer to the second statement is the first.
A lot of proof and what not has been put forth by others using tournament placings showing this and this character beating out metaknight. Rather than supporting the notion that metaknight is not that broken, I think it does quite the opposite. Look at how you divide it. It's Metaknight versus the entirety of the 35 character roster. You have the combined forces of D3, snake, falco, ROB, and reflex's wario to even equate to the dominance of metaknight. At least in melee, when you think about the dominant characters, you have about a third or so of the tournaments dominated by fox and marth, with the other 2 thirds or so with the other 6 or so characters below them. As it is now its just basically half metaknight alone and then half another 5 or so characters.
But even that in and of itself is not needed to warrant a ban. Simply put, the community has already decided the ban long ago. it seems that everyone's answer to their metaknight woes is metaknight. The scene is slowly devolving into MK vs MK tournaments. Anyone remember kish cubed joking about how melee will slowly turn into nothing more than sheik vs sheik final D only? Its like thats really happening in Brawl. Its scary hearing all of your anecdotes on how this and this talented player dropped their main because of metaknight, and thus started to main metaknight!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
To summarize this main point:
---Metaknight is the best character
---There is no situation where picking metaknight is a bad choice
---On top of that there are plenty of situations where you cannot safely resort to a character because of the possibility of metaknight
---This leads to everyone simply not even bothering with that uncertainty
---This leads to everyone picking metaknight
Conclusion: The metagame has successfully devolved into a one character dominated scene, with very little room for other characters to develop simply because metaknight beats them outright.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
The consequence of banning metaknight is that zero incentive is given into developing his metagame, and thus he will not be explored anymore. But this also gives a very large incentive for 10 to 15 other characters to be explored in much further detail than previously would have been desirable for any one player simply because they have become a viable option.
The difference between this and melee is that in melee, if you remove fox and marth, then the best characters are Sheik and Falco, and not much has changed except for removing 2 characters and allowing maybe another one or 2 viable characters (mario and doc come to mind). If you continue to remove Sheik and Falco... Peach, CF, and IC's become the best and you allow maybe another couple of viable tournament characters (Link and ganondorf are 2 prominent ones that come to mind with the removal of the top 4 characters). Removal of characters in melee would only shift the metagame down a couple characters on the tier list. Essentially, low tier tournaments.
In brawl, removing metaknight certainly makes Snake, Falco, and Dedede the best three, but there are so many characters that are now viable options that it more than outweighs the cost of removing metaknight. Granted Ike still basically has about all the chance of beating Falco as Lyman has of trading at 60 dollars again (lawl stock market) but there are certainly many more characters than stand a chance (read: choosing to play as them is not a complete waste).
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Overswarm mentioned something about the distinction between removing metaknight making the community healthier, and have it follow that we should ban metaknight simply because of that. I really dislike this opinion, although I will admit that of all the fighting game communities, smash is definitely the first I'd say where the opinion of the masses matters the least. I say that simply because of the attraction it has to young players who really don't understand anything and have little knowledge on fighting games at all, thus make poorly formulated opinions on many false assumptions. But in this instance, you need the community in order to live. We certainly aren't going to receive any help from the idiots over at SRK. Allowing everyone to slowly spiral down the slippery slope of a one character metagame is not going to strengthen us in the end. Eventually when people realize the large migration over to metaknight, many will be disinterested. Who wants to play in a tournament where its just metaknight after metaknight? Assuming that I am completely wrong and that metaknight is beatable, that isn't the trend that we are seeing with the community. Ultimately, it is the players and the metagame which decide whats good, bad, outdated, the best, the worst, and so forth. To ignore that in this instance will only hurt all of us and possibly lead to the death of the scene.
I am still probably never going to take brawl seriously, since I think there are many more problems with it aside from metaknight. The game to me is just fundamentally broken and has lost my interest as a serious fighter entirely. But I'd hate to see the community that still supports it screw themselves by not removing what is probably the only chance Brawl has at becoming a serious game.
please discuss.
first: Yuna is not someone I would take seriously. anyone who thinks that banning metaknight is not a consideration cannot be taken too seriously... but each to their own opinion I suppose, but I definitely disagree with the notion that banning characters is automatically scrub mentality. In some cases yes, but metaknight warrants a serious discussion, not a volley of vague insults.
second: while I hope that some of the newer members have the capacity to think about this rationally, I really dont care if anyone with a late 2007 or a 2008 join date agrees with me or not. Most of you are only familiar with brawl and have no idea what it was like in melee or what it is like in any other community. I was the same way once upon a time. Even if some of you were responding with something other than trite one liners, you really can't make fully informed opinions. This is insulting I suppose but I wish that to be as serious as possible, and not simply a way to anger people.
I want to post an argument I just posted in the back room about the subject. After strong initial opposition months back the discussion to ban metaknight is a very serious one now. So while everyone was angered by my stance back then, I have a chance to express my opinion and have a real disucssion.
my post:
Now that my initial suggestion of banning metaknight is being taken seriously (albeit prompted by other people than myself and after large initial opposition) I'd like to add my serious two cents here.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
I want to say this off the bat:
Brawl will not grow as a fighting game at all until metaknight is banned.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is why:
Metaknight is certainly beatable. I will not argue this. Metaknight is also far and away better than every other character. I think we can all agree on this, with some leeway on the "far and away." But the idea is that its never a bad idea to use metaknight in every match up, where as every other character can not say that.
What has happened now is that the entirety of the metagame has revolved around not necessarily "my chances of winning are so much higher with metaknight than anyone else" and more so of "my character selection is based solely upon how well I can do against metaknight". This issue is only compounded by the fact is that indeed the answer to the second statement is the first.
A lot of proof and what not has been put forth by others using tournament placings showing this and this character beating out metaknight. Rather than supporting the notion that metaknight is not that broken, I think it does quite the opposite. Look at how you divide it. It's Metaknight versus the entirety of the 35 character roster. You have the combined forces of D3, snake, falco, ROB, and reflex's wario to even equate to the dominance of metaknight. At least in melee, when you think about the dominant characters, you have about a third or so of the tournaments dominated by fox and marth, with the other 2 thirds or so with the other 6 or so characters below them. As it is now its just basically half metaknight alone and then half another 5 or so characters.
But even that in and of itself is not needed to warrant a ban. Simply put, the community has already decided the ban long ago. it seems that everyone's answer to their metaknight woes is metaknight. The scene is slowly devolving into MK vs MK tournaments. Anyone remember kish cubed joking about how melee will slowly turn into nothing more than sheik vs sheik final D only? Its like thats really happening in Brawl. Its scary hearing all of your anecdotes on how this and this talented player dropped their main because of metaknight, and thus started to main metaknight!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
To summarize this main point:
---Metaknight is the best character
---There is no situation where picking metaknight is a bad choice
---On top of that there are plenty of situations where you cannot safely resort to a character because of the possibility of metaknight
---This leads to everyone simply not even bothering with that uncertainty
---This leads to everyone picking metaknight
Conclusion: The metagame has successfully devolved into a one character dominated scene, with very little room for other characters to develop simply because metaknight beats them outright.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
The consequence of banning metaknight is that zero incentive is given into developing his metagame, and thus he will not be explored anymore. But this also gives a very large incentive for 10 to 15 other characters to be explored in much further detail than previously would have been desirable for any one player simply because they have become a viable option.
The difference between this and melee is that in melee, if you remove fox and marth, then the best characters are Sheik and Falco, and not much has changed except for removing 2 characters and allowing maybe another one or 2 viable characters (mario and doc come to mind). If you continue to remove Sheik and Falco... Peach, CF, and IC's become the best and you allow maybe another couple of viable tournament characters (Link and ganondorf are 2 prominent ones that come to mind with the removal of the top 4 characters). Removal of characters in melee would only shift the metagame down a couple characters on the tier list. Essentially, low tier tournaments.
In brawl, removing metaknight certainly makes Snake, Falco, and Dedede the best three, but there are so many characters that are now viable options that it more than outweighs the cost of removing metaknight. Granted Ike still basically has about all the chance of beating Falco as Lyman has of trading at 60 dollars again (lawl stock market) but there are certainly many more characters than stand a chance (read: choosing to play as them is not a complete waste).
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Overswarm mentioned something about the distinction between removing metaknight making the community healthier, and have it follow that we should ban metaknight simply because of that. I really dislike this opinion, although I will admit that of all the fighting game communities, smash is definitely the first I'd say where the opinion of the masses matters the least. I say that simply because of the attraction it has to young players who really don't understand anything and have little knowledge on fighting games at all, thus make poorly formulated opinions on many false assumptions. But in this instance, you need the community in order to live. We certainly aren't going to receive any help from the idiots over at SRK. Allowing everyone to slowly spiral down the slippery slope of a one character metagame is not going to strengthen us in the end. Eventually when people realize the large migration over to metaknight, many will be disinterested. Who wants to play in a tournament where its just metaknight after metaknight? Assuming that I am completely wrong and that metaknight is beatable, that isn't the trend that we are seeing with the community. Ultimately, it is the players and the metagame which decide whats good, bad, outdated, the best, the worst, and so forth. To ignore that in this instance will only hurt all of us and possibly lead to the death of the scene.
I am still probably never going to take brawl seriously, since I think there are many more problems with it aside from metaknight. The game to me is just fundamentally broken and has lost my interest as a serious fighter entirely. But I'd hate to see the community that still supports it screw themselves by not removing what is probably the only chance Brawl has at becoming a serious game.
please discuss.
- Joined
- Apr 10, 2008
- Messages
- 6,860
I feel like MK is an 18yr. old playing in a tenis league along with 10-13 yr. olds. MK has never played any sports before though... but he still wins a majority of his matches. The 10 yr. olds are immature and hate seeing this adult win. They don't recognize that he's not completely dominating- the newly teens' grounds to kick him out. Some cry and quit the league. They hate MK. Dumb kids.
Have you ever seen a Ganon player try to get back down to the ground against Zelda on FD? Zelda can chain upsmashes on him until he gets near the edge. When he's off the stage, she can just edgeguard with din's. It still does the same amount of damage as an edge-finite chaingrab, so who cares about whether it's a true combo or not?
Now lets take a look at a common MK v non-MK situation. Olimar is pushed off the stage with fair. He DI-s up so he can recover from above like he's normally supposed to. What is Olimar supposed to do to get back to the ground? "Yah know, MK doesn't have any true combos on Olimar, blah, blah." So he can just get back to the ground right?
Wrong. MK can just spam his upair. None of Olimar's attacks will beat it out. His airdodge is worthless because of how lagless MK's upair is. He can't whistle through the laglessness either. Like many other characters in similar situations, they don't have a choice. It's about waiting for the MK player to mess up. If he doesn't mess up, he's got an infinite juggle trap. You wanna know how many setups he has for this? And that's when interrupt me to say, "lol, just don't get grabbed silly. d
b"
Edit: Great post XIF
Lol, no combos? Metaknight, in himself, is a juggle trap. He doesn't need combos. He's so fast and has so little lag that he can just react and capitalize on most everything his opponents do.
Have you ever seen a Ganon player try to get back down to the ground against Zelda on FD? Zelda can chain upsmashes on him until he gets near the edge. When he's off the stage, she can just edgeguard with din's. It still does the same amount of damage as an edge-finite chaingrab, so who cares about whether it's a true combo or not?
Now lets take a look at a common MK v non-MK situation. Olimar is pushed off the stage with fair. He DI-s up so he can recover from above like he's normally supposed to. What is Olimar supposed to do to get back to the ground? "Yah know, MK doesn't have any true combos on Olimar, blah, blah." So he can just get back to the ground right?
Wrong. MK can just spam his upair. None of Olimar's attacks will beat it out. His airdodge is worthless because of how lagless MK's upair is. He can't whistle through the laglessness either. Like many other characters in similar situations, they don't have a choice. It's about waiting for the MK player to mess up. If he doesn't mess up, he's got an infinite juggle trap. You wanna know how many setups he has for this? And that's when interrupt me to say, "lol, just don't get grabbed silly. d
b"Edit: Great post XIF
Aldwyn McCloud
Smash Ace
yeah lol, that post = epic win
The official title for the poll on the italian boards is "should MK get a ban on the competitive scene?" so most likely people won't play against MK in friendlies either. Anyway there is a point in doing it since there will be tournaments of Brawl (at least that's what I hope..). But anyway, I won't bother attending them because I don't care about Brawl that much. I care about the community though, and I wonder whether they got noobish or not.
Also, XIF's post pretty much summarizes the thoughts of the Italian community on Metaknight's ban.
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I'd just like to emphasize one thing.
Pure MK v MK has not happened yet, but will. When Yuna says, "Only UNTIL it happens will MK be banned" I want to just puke, because by the time that happens, brawl will have died. It's not like pure MK v MK dittos will last for years before MK gets banned. Brawl will never reach that point. As tourneys gradually become this, brawl's competitive scene will break down. I can guarantee I won't be playing this game for much longer if this continues. I guess I'm a scrub Yuna, eh? for not using MK?
Pure MK v MK has not happened yet, but will. When Yuna says, "Only UNTIL it happens will MK be banned" I want to just puke, because by the time that happens, brawl will have died. It's not like pure MK v MK dittos will last for years before MK gets banned. Brawl will never reach that point. As tourneys gradually become this, brawl's competitive scene will break down. I can guarantee I won't be playing this game for much longer if this continues. I guess I'm a scrub Yuna, eh? for not using MK?
![Terywj [태리]](/data/avatars/l/71/71007.jpg?1555906021){kind=avatar}
Terywj [태리]
Charismatic Maknae~
Wow....that sucks...
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Master Raven
Smash Master
lol DanGR stop being so **** ominous over MK. I have yet to see any evidence of the tourney scene devolving into MK dittos for every major tourney. I would like to comment that down in FL, MK almost NEVER wins any tournies, at least most of the ones I've seen.
XIF
Smash Master
FL is not the entirety of the brawl scene.
regardless the point is that a very serious trend is definitely forming for MK becoming THE character for brawl. In my post I already mentioned how there are many players picking up metaknight with the sole purpose of defeating metaknight.
Even in melee your answer for the fox matchup was one of multiple options (Marth, Falco, sheik, Fox, and maybe a couple of other characters).
Master Raven
Smash Master
Help with what cause?
PyroSpark
Smash Apprentice
what cause? ._.
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- 6,860
>_> I want MK banned. You know, the MK banned cause?
I started using him soley to help form MK v MK dittos and nothing else. Until this happens, I'll use MK as a secondary, so every time I place in tourney, I can say that I used this character.
Sadly, he won't get banned until more people pick him up. And when that happens, people will get angry that they even bothered using him. In the long run, more people will quit this game because they wasted their time with MK than they will because he's not getting banned. You know, the longer the sbr waits, the worse the competitive community of this game will get. That makes me sad, because I actually kinda liked this game. It's new and it's different, but it has MK.
I started using him soley to help form MK v MK dittos and nothing else. Until this happens, I'll use MK as a secondary, so every time I place in tourney, I can say that I used this character.
Sadly, he won't get banned until more people pick him up. And when that happens, people will get angry that they even bothered using him. In the long run, more people will quit this game because they wasted their time with MK than they will because he's not getting banned. You know, the longer the sbr waits, the worse the competitive community of this game will get. That makes me sad, because I actually kinda liked this game. It's new and it's different, but it has MK.
NinjaFoxX
Banned via Warnings
ADHD
Smash Hero
Some of the metaknight players that are against banning him just say that he's beatable.
XIF responded well to that and brought up some really good points.
Still, if we ban metaknight, snake is the next in line to dominate and shut lower tier characters down. It's just the two, imagine how great brawl would be without them... King d3? Seriously, that guy should be the best because he's actually on a level close to the other cast.
XIF responded well to that and brought up some really good points.
Still, if we ban metaknight, snake is the next in line to dominate and shut lower tier characters down. It's just the two, imagine how great brawl would be without them... King d3? Seriously, that guy should be the best because he's actually on a level close to the other cast.
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