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Melee: Will people ever really -get it- ?

Proverbs

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 21, 2008
Messages
1,698
Location
Seattle, WA
Link to original post: [drupal=1483]Melee: Will people ever really -get it- ?[/drupal]



For those of you who play Melee, have you ever had someone ask, "What do you do for fun?" Often I leave Melee out of the picture when people ask that type of question, mostly from past experience. Whenever I venture to mention the fact that yeah, I play Melee (and just saying that doesn't even really get across what -playing Melee- means), people just tend to misunderstand. When most people see the amount of time and effort we put into getting better, the fact that we go out of our way to play with people at our skill level, that we watch videos online, use official controllers only, and go to tournaments, there's a word they tend to use for that sort of thing: Obsessed. Then you try to explain it: "It's not obsessive, it's just..." and there you are, at a loss for words.

Every time you try to explain the sincere amount of excitement and joy you get from playing Melee, people just don't get it. Sure if it was something like a -real sport-, people could understand your passion. But "it's just a video game," right? There's no way it could ever mean anything more than just mindless entertainment. But no, you explain, it's much deeper than that. It's all about out-thinking your opponent and--And you've lost them.

"I feel like that's a huge waste of time." "I think one of these days you're just going to realize you're just wasting all of your time on this game." "How can you stand wasting your time for hours on a stupid game?" These are all quotes: One from a girl I like (also a good friend of mine), my roommate, and my dad, respectively. And I'm sure that you have heard the same thing from others.

The thing I'm getting at is, I don't think other people can understand, or at least aren't willing to. "It's just a video game" to them. It doesn't -really- matter in the 'real world.' The thing is, many of these people probably spend just as much time and effort on watching television, and probably more money on buying and seeing movies. Let's handle one at a time, here. Television, 99% of the time, is far less stimulating than playing ANY sort of video game, much less something as mentally demanding as Melee (and let's admit it, for the good players it IS mentally demanding). And yet we're still criticized for doing something that's far more beneficial than just 'vegging out.' I'm sure we all still see movies, but I'd be willing to bet that we, on a whole, watch much less than the average person if you combine T.V. and watching movies.

The time we're not spending in front of some mindless program, we spend working toward something: Getting better at Smash. Now, because this is goal-oriented, we are actually accomplishing something, regardless of whether or not it has bearing in the 'real world'. Even though it might not 'actually' accomplish anything, we are mentally rewarded and feel a greater sense of accomplishment than if we just spent the whole day watching television. This promotes a higher sense of self-worth that those who watch T.V. don't get.

But the sole reason why we're looked down on being so committed to 'a video game' is that it's uncommon. Think about it. I'd be willing to bet that 90% of the hobbies that are looked down on as a waste of time are only viewed as such because they aren't held by the majority of people. As opposed to being viewed as unique, we're rejected for being different. Sounds a lot like racism, doesn't it? I'm not going to push for that analogy, but I think you see what I'm getting at here. We are prejudiced against simply because we've found something that other people don't.

But should we be surprised? Society ALWAYS rejects the minorities. This is why people show hatred for gays (I do believe homosexuality is wrong, but I don't hate these people at all), why 'nerds' or 'geeks' are the lowest social class, and why immigrants were looked down upon. Again, think about it. In the past 5-10 years the view on video games has changed a great deal. They were originally looked at as something 'nerdy', and then they became common among guys and were looked at as 'a guy thing'. And now we have girls playing video games, which is slowly but surely becoming more and more normal. And now people don't care if you play video games. Why? Because it's -NORMAL-.

Now here's the point I get to which is a good deal more cynical: If it is a trend that persists throughout history that those who are in any way different are rejected by 90% of society, will people ever come to terms with playing video games competitively? I definitely think so. But only once it becomes 'normal', which might take 10-20 years. And then we'll be happy because we're finally 'understood' and not rejected, and we think the problem's been solved.

But the problem isn't that Melee isn't accepted. It's that those that are different aren't. And I do think that this is one piece of human nature that the vast majority of people will never overcome. It's only when you ARE different that you accept others that are different. And even then, there's prejudice. "Well, I play Melee and that's a bit different, but this other guy loves entomology, and that's just weird. At least I'm not as weird as him." Unfortunately, the future does look bleak. We're not moving toward greater acceptance, it's just that more things are becoming normal.

So, I do believe that very few of our non-Melee friends will ever come to terms with, accept, or understand why we play Melee. It's sad, because it's just that piece of prejudice ingrained in every one of us.

Sorry for being so negative
It's kinda bleak.
 

Veril

Frame Savant
Joined
Jun 20, 2008
Messages
3,062
Location
Kent Lakes, New York
I've been really surprised at how many people are totally cool with and even understand playing competitively. These aren't just my friends either, or even just people my age. Video games are getting way more mainstream and anyone who can understand competition can understand competitive gaming imo.

Be more optimistic! :)
 

Mith_

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 30, 2008
Messages
2,376
Location
Augusta, GA
Don't play Melee is sux play Brawl instead ^.^I totally get what you mean dude.

Anyways, this is a great blog. I used to never be able to tell people I play games for fun. Because of what they would think, or how they would perceive it rather.
 

bobson

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 28, 2008
Messages
1,674
"I feel like that's a huge waste of time." "I think one of these days you're just going to realize you're just wasting all of your time on this game." "How can you stand wasting your time for hours on a stupid game?"
I always reply with either "How can you stand to waste so much of your time doing <favorite activity here>?" or "A thousand apologies, mein führer! Back to work!"
 

Airwalkerr

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
271
Location
Small Town Alberta, Canada
This is intense and intelligently thought out. All of my friends know I'm a Melee addict, and they're all cool with it. They don't make fun of it or call it a waste of time, but very few of them understand why I would play such a game for 7 years. Which brings me to a conclusion that branches out from yours: some people just don't "get it". No matter how hard I tried to get this one friend to play Melee with me(in fact, my ex-best friend) he just never saw the point of getting good. While me and my other friend were learning wavedashing and l-cancelling, utilizing mindgames, he would just roll around in Yoshi's egg or stand at the edge of the stage inhaling as Kirby. No matter how much I tried to push my views of this amazing game on him, he just never got it. What people like is there business. I hate skateboarding (mostly due to the fact I always hurt myself) and even if I land a kickflip, my busted up shin takes all the satisfaction away. But then I look at my friends, who, even after faceplanting or dislocating a shoulder, keep doing it. And love doing it. Its not so much that our hobby needs to become socially acceptable. People will always have things that cause them that sense of satisfaction, and will hate on things that don't cause them satisfaction. Melee is just our way to get satisfied. Once you explain this point to people who hate on your hobby, it may change their way of thinking.
 

Ace55

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 18, 2008
Messages
1,642
Location
Amsterdam
Nice read.

Can't say that people have looked down on or made fun of my hobby though. Everyone gets their kicks in a different way.
 

Red Arremer

Smash Legend
Joined
Nov 27, 2005
Messages
11,437
Location
Vienna
Why did you have to explicitely add the sentence "I do believe it's wrong" when you swifted to the topic of homosexuality for a small part? I don't really get what your personal attitude towards this topic has to do with the actual topic at hand... It just looks like you felt you had to express your dislike for it, and sneak into this otherwise great text.
Not to mention that noone of those "Homosexuality is wrong"-people ever gave me a good argument why it is wrong.

Anyway, good read.
 

Ishiey

Mother Wolf
BRoomer
Joined
May 20, 2008
Messages
7,292
Location
Land's End (NorCal)
Good blog, and a good post by Airwalkerr. People will be people, there is only so much we can understand that we do not personally experience, but something that (almost) everyone looks for in their life is happiness, or satisfaction as Airwalkerr put it. We can't always really understand why some things that seem absurd to us make other people happy, but the least anyone can do is respect the right of others to pursue their own interests.

:059:
 

Proverbs

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 21, 2008
Messages
1,698
Location
Seattle, WA
Why did you have to explicitely add the sentence "I do believe it's wrong" when you swifted to the topic of homosexuality for a small part? I don't really get what your personal attitude towards this topic has to do with the actual topic at hand... It just looks like you felt you had to express your dislike for it, and sneak into this otherwise great text.
Not to mention that noone of those "Homosexuality is wrong"-people ever gave me a good argument why it is wrong.

Anyway, good read.
Whoa dude, chill out a little bit. It seems like you're getting a tad heated over something small. The reason I include it is because, according to Paul, I am an ambassador for Christ (2 Corinthians 5:20). For that reason I need to be representing Christ adequately, which means not overlooking any part of the Bible, including Leviticus 18:22 or Romans 1:26-27. At the same time I showed the non-judgmental and loving side of Christ by expressing that I did feel that the unbiased and misunderstanding hatred of gays is wrong. I needed to make my stance on both of those things clear, especially in a day and age where most Christians are following their own wishes and thoughts as opposed to the thoughts of God and the words of Christ.

That's why I stuck that in there, because, as someone truly following Christ, I need to be setting the example. If you'd like to discuss why I think it's wrong, I'd be glad to do that somewhere else (perhaps over PM or on AIM if you like, PM me if you're interested), since a religious debate is not what we need here. However, do know that I don't judge gays or think of them as less than human or anything like that. I also don't distance myself from them in any way but see them as no different from my other non-Christian friends. Both groups do things that are wrong in God's sight, but I don't hate either one. And, honestly, accepting that homosexuality is wrong has been one of the hardest things for me to accept in Christianity. I'm not just some bigot trying to push around the idea of what's 'better'. Honestly, I wish homosexuality weren't wrong. I really do. I know many go through much social and spiritual pain due to their orientation, but who am I to defy God? I simply know my place, and that is kneeling before God.
 

Oracle

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 15, 2008
Messages
3,471
Location
Dallas, TX
Human nature tells us to not accept the abnormal, sadly. Things like competitive gaming will never be fully accepted.

But another reason is the whole "nerd" thing. A bunch of my friends have soo much potential in melee, but have it made up in their mind that "Well if i practice and go to tournaments I have no life and am a nerd." It's steryotyping and it's ignorant
 

soap

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 24, 2006
Messages
7,229
Location
Cleveland, Ohio
I tell people. Some think it's weird, others find it interesting.

Don't bother trying to push your hobbies on to your friends. U can tell them about it. If they are interested they will get into it themselves.

I do hate the stereotypes, but i don't pay it too much attention.

Also, many smashers ARE mad obsessed ( I used to be). YOu need to strike a balance in your life with whatever you do.
 

Red Arremer

Smash Legend
Joined
Nov 27, 2005
Messages
11,437
Location
Vienna
And then yet again pops up the age-old question.


Melee, or girlfriend????
Why not both?

I don't get it, are girls really that time-consuming and un-understanding so you can't do anything else? I'm just wondering, because I can play Smash and have a relationship just fine...
 

INSANE CARZY GUY

Banned via Warnings
Joined
May 14, 2008
Messages
6,915
Location
Indianapolis
I have slowly gotten my brother to playing melee like me. Does anyone get that adderine feeling when they melee and you feel like you could rip a bear in half? And if not maybe it's just me and i feel feel this most of the time since i understood life.
 

:034:

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
7,562
Location
Netherlands
Yeah, I've heard that sometimes. If I get the question: "So, what do you do for fun?, I say "Well, I draw a lot, I like to read and I also play video games. Some times, I go to a tournament for a fighting game, it's pretty fun." and generally people say "Wow, you do that? For a video game?" Well, my response is mostly something like this...

Don't forget that while you're saying "why would you waste time on just a game?" I could ask the EXACT same thing for sports. But that is relatively accepted, if you say "I'm gonna go to a chess tournament", people will often wish you luck or anything else. But... It's the same thing. Chess is a game. Soccer is a game. Basketball is a game. Yet this is all widely accepted.

Also, the experience from being there is a lot of fun. You meet a lot of new people and friends, get into social activities and such. You're not just playing a game - you're playing a game with somebody (or in case of a tournament - a lot of somebodies).

If they don't get it afterwards, I usually just do the same thing to whatever their hobbies are. They get pissed and I laugh. It's win-win, baby!
 

Oracle

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 15, 2008
Messages
3,471
Location
Dallas, TX
You can have a girlfriend and play competitively. It just takes good time manegment

It's not that hard to have a life and be competitive
 

Heartz♥

Smash Legend
Joined
May 18, 2008
Messages
10,443
Location
Virginia
Whoa dude, chill out a little bit. It seems like you're getting a tad heated over something small. The reason I include it is because, according to Paul, I am an ambassador for Christ (2 Corinthians 5:20). For that reason I need to be representing Christ adequately, which means not overlooking any part of the Bible, including Leviticus 18:22 or Romans 1:26-27. At the same time I showed the non-judgmental and loving side of Christ by expressing that I did feel that the unbiased and misunderstanding hatred of gays is wrong. I needed to make my stance on both of those things clear, especially in a day and age where most Christians are following their own wishes and thoughts as opposed to the thoughts of God and the words of Christ.

That's why I stuck that in there, because, as someone truly following Christ, I need to be setting the example. If you'd like to discuss why I think it's wrong, I'd be glad to do that somewhere else (perhaps over PM or on AIM if you like, PM me if you're interested), since a religious debate is not what we need here. However, do know that I don't judge gays or think of them as less than human or anything like that. I also don't distance myself from them in any way but see them as no different from my other non-Christian friends. Both groups do things that are wrong in God's sight, but I don't hate either one. And, honestly, accepting that homosexuality is wrong has been one of the hardest things for me to accept in Christianity. I'm not just some bigot trying to push around the idea of what's 'better'. Honestly, I wish homosexuality weren't wrong. I really do. I know many go through much social and spiritual pain due to their orientation, but who am I to defy God? I simply know my place, and that is kneeling before God.
Oh, Lordy Lordy. It's the Word. I can't compete with that.
 

Mardyke

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 8, 2008
Messages
289
Location
Ireland
Human nature tells us to not accept the abnormal, sadly. Things like competitive gaming will never be fully accepted.

But another reason is the whole "nerd" thing. A bunch of my friends have soo much potential in melee, but have it made up in their mind that "Well if i practice and go to tournaments I have no life and am a nerd." It's steryotyping and it's ignorant
I don't know about that. It's not necessarily so much its abnormality as it is its unfamiliarity. Reading a good book isn't complicated, and everyone knows how to watch a movie. Cycling a bike or surfing a wave is something that anyone can understand the immediate fringe benefits of upon simply a first glance, even if they don't understand the intricacies and methods involved in either. Chess is also appealing in a more tranquil, strategic light.

So what differs video games from all of the above? Openness. "But they can see what's going on, they don't have an excuse!" some might say. To be frank, very few of them even have an idea of what it means to use a controller "properly", especially when there are thousands of games out there which all use the controller very differently from one another and therefore require that significant investment be put in simply understanding it. Can I blame them? No. Video gaming isn't easy. It's young, it's underdeveloped compared to literature and sport, it's still awkward for your everyday man to just accept and wind down to. Most games don't consider the average guy who might just walk in and decide to try something out, only to realise that he needs what feel like Spiderman-like reflexes to pass the tutorial. Which is why I'm appreciative of the expansion of the games market into the normal world, and hoping that video games too can be embraced and anticipated just as much as your film blockbuster. Or that even, one day, a really well thought-out and developed game formula can be played with just as much interest as one might view chess with.
 

MoblinMan

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 22, 2007
Messages
168
Location
Denver, Colorado
If only they could keep the depth in while they made it an easier time beginning in the first place. ^

The wii, in my opinion, was an attempt at that. it just sucks because it sort of abandons the people that DO hone their spidey-senses on a regular basis. :p


As for the girlfriend thing, I agree that you can play video games competitively and still have your love life. It's when those two things intertwine that I ask myself the question...
 

MidnightAsaph

Smash Lord
Joined
May 30, 2008
Messages
1,191
Location
Bloomington, MN
It's annoying and very unfortunate. But I tend to make friends with those that care, so, I don't hear a lot of that. I am hesitant when revealing it to people, that I go to tourneys for video games. It's just something you have to deal with.
 

Sean²

Smash Capitalist
Joined
Mar 28, 2008
Messages
1,657
Switch FC
SW-7479-8539-5283
Why would you ever want a girlfriend anyways?
 

INSANE CARZY GUY

Banned via Warnings
Joined
May 14, 2008
Messages
6,915
Location
Indianapolis
EVERYONE IT CAN'T HURT YOU. You want to play yes? Then ask, chances are you won't even look dumb when you ask, unlike walking you could trip and break your knee and why walk when you can drive it's easy and appears faster.

Does anybody esle need a confindents boost and look again i have no idea how to spell that word but i tryed and failed and if not congrats to me
 

Rain(ame)

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 3, 2007
Messages
2,129
Location
I'll take a potato chip....and eat it!!!
I could care less what people say. The point is...I do with my free time what I do. I don't go criticizing what other people do in their free time.

The following is a very biased reaction to what other people do. (Seeing as how they have a very biased reaction to what we do.) I do some of these things on the side, and there's nothing wrong with them. It's more of a sign to see...how dumb they sound criticizing other people.

1.) Some people read books (not all books are exactly a good read), but others may consider wasting money on some books are a waste. (Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings, etc.)

2.) Some people spend countless hours watching TV. That makes them no better. I could care less if they're watching the news. I'd rather play a game to relieve stress than to build up stress by seeing who died and what's going wrong with the world ALL FRIGGIN' DAY.

3.) Some people play sports. That's fine...so do I, but personally, I've got far too many injuries to play as much as I used to.

4.) Some prefer to work...a LOT. That's also fine...just add stress and shorten your life. Make sure your kids don't know you, and you have minimal relationship with your wife.

5.) Some prefer to hang out with friends. That's fine, I do as well. So? I prefer not to waste money all the time when I could stay in and chill with a friend or two. Not much to do there....watch a movie/TV or play games!!!! (be they board or video...still doesn't matter.

6.) Some people play Cards/Boardgames/other kinds of games. Don't even talk to me...you have no real reason to talk to me about what I do with my spare time

7.) Some people have other various hobbies. Again...you're talking because why? I spend my money on games...you spend your money on your hobby which may not even win you money. (that is if you're good) I see no difference how Baseball Card collecting is any more lucrative than Video Games. Considering people NEVER SELL THE FRIGGIN' THINGS. (just an example.) Also..stamp collecting...for what? antique collecting....for what? Decorating...for what?

8.) I have a life. Well guess what? So do I. Actually, I probably have more talent and personality than you do..shame, isn't it?

9.) You can't learn anything from videogames. Really? I've got a MUCH larger vocabluary than you do...got that from play RPGs. That and the fact that I probably read more than you do. (Gaming magazine authors use some really big words, xD.)

10.) I spend my time on Music. So do I...as a matter of fact, I probably have a broader range of music interest than you. I also can sing, rap, dance, and write music of different kinds. I used to play the keyboard and I decided to study the Ocarina. (I'm being a bit lazy about that right now, xD.)

11.) I do things that are useful. I'm a guy and I can clean, do laundry, and am fully capable of cooking full meals that my mom practically begs me to do for her.



Case in point...people are ignorant. Although...you would use a bit more tact in dealing with them, the fact still remains...just because you put time into a video game doesn't mean anything. It's how you spend your "Me" time. Both of my parents play video games in their own spare time. A good chunk of my friends do as well. Oh, and my Ex-girlfriend did, too. When it's your own parents...just nod and smile. Then go about your business. As long as you're doing what you need to...who cares what you do in your free time so long as it's not illegal?
 

INSANE CARZY GUY

Banned via Warnings
Joined
May 14, 2008
Messages
6,915
Location
Indianapolis
(guy makes it illegal then gets shot) Hey in general people are stupid, just piont it out and help them so they aren't as stupid. And the only reason why i picked out melee was when I was in 2nd maybe 3rd grade my friend played the 1st one once(1 match) and 5 years later after i got melee even thought i hadn't seen him for years and i never said dang i should have got piknim instead, still a good game
 

Proverbs

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 21, 2008
Messages
1,698
Location
Seattle, WA
Oh, Lordy Lordy. It's the Word. I can't compete with that.
No, you can't. And sorry if I go a bit on the offensive here, but this seriously deserves it.

Firstly, don't you ever dare disrespect God's Word ever again. I mean that. I have no tolerance for anyone who disrespects the Lord my God. This isn't about my beliefs or whatever. Offend those all you want. But you WILL NOT attempt to mock God--as if He could be mocked.

Secondly, I have my reasons to submit to God. He's done so much in my life while I spat in His face for the vast majority of it. Even now my "righteous acts are like filthy rags" (Isaiah 64:6 NIV) before Him. Yet in spite of His entire foreknowledge of that He descended low to become like us, lived with us, and died for us--and at the same time sacrificed His Son, being Him in essence, accomplishing the greatest act of love. He sacrificed both Himself and the One He loved most, knowing that even if I came to Him, I'd still be the imperfect wretch that I am. I'm completely neglecting the fact that He is the ultimate authority on everything, here, and should be submitted to no matter what--even if out of fear. But the most moving part of it all is that, although we should feel such deep fear before such an awesome and mighty God, we don't have to, for "perfect love drives out fear" (1 John 4:18 NIV). Not our perfect love for Him (as if we do anything), but His perfect love for us.

That is why I submit to Him. Yes, I know my place, but more than that I love Him more than anything on this Earth or outside of it--not because I am or have done anything good, but simply that I've seen such a love to move me to that point. When faced with His love, I am only forced to return it, although nowhere near the same magnitude or perfection.

So go ahead, mock me. Mock me all you like for following the Lord my God, I'll take it. Call me a fool and I'll be a fool for Christ. I'd rather be spat on, whipped, beaten, and killed in the most slow, painful, and torturous death than to hear one word spoken against the Lord my God. So say what you like about me, I'm fair game. But you WILL NOT say one word against Him.
 

Red Arremer

Smash Legend
Joined
Nov 27, 2005
Messages
11,437
Location
Vienna
It's when those two things intertwine that I ask myself the question...
Why? I really see no reason to give up a hobby just for my partner's sake. If that hobby was something illegal, controversial, hurts the relationship, etc., I can see why you would give up that hobby.
But I'd never give up my hobby if all reasoning my partner would have was "I just don't like it" or "It's silly".

If my partner really seeks me to stop playing the game I love, I would ask him why, and if his reasoning was "Too little time for me" or something understandable, I would shift my time management. However, if it's just "I don't like it", I would wave him good bye and wish him a nice life.

My partner has to accept my interests and hobbies. That's part of a relationship, too. If he asked me to stop smoking, I would stop smoking, but if he asked me to stop playing Smash, I would give him the finger.
 

MoblinMan

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 22, 2007
Messages
168
Location
Denver, Colorado
Why? I really see no reason to give up a hobby just for my partner's sake. If that hobby was something illegal, controversial, hurts the relationship, etc., I can see why you would give up that hobby.
But I'd never give up my hobby if all reasoning my partner would have was "I just don't like it" or "It's silly".

If my partner really seeks me to stop playing the game I love, I would ask him why, and if his reasoning was "Too little time for me" or something understandable, I would shift my time management. However, if it's just "I don't like it", I would wave him good bye and wish him a nice life.

My partner has to accept my interests and hobbies. That's part of a relationship, too. If he asked me to stop smoking, I would stop smoking, but if he asked me to stop playing Smash, I would give him the finger.
I like pie.


edit: so I'm actually gonna give this an answer since I think that I irked you in some way, and I feel bad about it.


I agree that you need to hold fast when you can, and compromise when you need to. However, that's a lot more mature than I care to be. - especially in relationships. ( <3 Bill Watterson)

You're right though. I agree completely. Hell, the girl I'm interested currently has problems up to the nose. That really doesn't mean that a good and understanding relationship can't work, though.


To bring it back on topic, I fully flaunt the fact that I play melee at school. My favorite shirt quotes Isai's, "Don't get hit," and I tell anyone who asks all about it.

I'm honestly one of those guys that hates people judging him, but if they're going to they might as well judge someone that I think is worthwhile.
 

Heartz♥

Smash Legend
Joined
May 18, 2008
Messages
10,443
Location
Virginia
No, you can't. And sorry if I go a bit on the offensive here, but this seriously deserves it.

Firstly, don't you ever dare disrespect God's Word ever again. I mean that. I have no tolerance for anyone who disrespects the Lord my God. This isn't about my beliefs or whatever. Offend those all you want. But you WILL NOT attempt to mock God--as if He could be mocked.

Secondly, I have my reasons to submit to God. He's done so much in my life while I spat in His face for the vast majority of it. Even now my "righteous acts are like filthy rags" (Isaiah 64:6 NIV) before Him. Yet in spite of His entire foreknowledge of that He descended low to become like us, lived with us, and died for us--and at the same time sacrificed His Son, being Him in essence, accomplishing the greatest act of love. He sacrificed both Himself and the One He loved most, knowing that even if I came to Him, I'd still be the imperfect wretch that I am. I'm completely neglecting the fact that He is the ultimate authority on everything, here, and should be submitted to no matter what--even if out of fear. But the most moving part of it all is that, although we should feel such deep fear before such an awesome and mighty God, we don't have to, for "perfect love drives out fear" (1 John 4:18 NIV). Not our perfect love for Him (as if we do anything), but His perfect love for us.

That is why I submit to Him. Yes, I know my place, but more than that I love Him more than anything on this Earth or outside of it--not because I am or have done anything good, but simply that I've seen such a love to move me to that point. When faced with His love, I am only forced to return it, although nowhere near the same magnitude or perfection.

So go ahead, mock me. Mock me all you like for following the Lord my God, I'll take it. Call me a fool and I'll be a fool for Christ. I'd rather be spat on, whipped, beaten, and killed in the most slow, painful, and torturous death than to hear one word spoken against the Lord my God. So say what you like about me, I'm fair game. But you WILL NOT say one word against Him.
It isn't like I don't understand, but there are certain ways to be a true follower of Christ, and overdoing it doesn't make you any better than the others. I was raised as a Christian, and part of that doctrine that was given to me was to not show any kind of aggression to those who are ignorant of the Word. Your approach is quite unbecoming, no offense.

btw, you serious cannot just say you would be tortured to death for Christ just that easy, because even Jesus himself was reluctant to be crucified on the Cross.

You sound much like Peter. He said all those things, but in the end, he still denied Jesus, and Jesus knew that he would.

I'll leave it at that. This isn't a religious thread.
 

Proverbs

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It isn't like I don't understand, but there are certain ways to be a true follower of Christ, and overdoing it doesn't make you any better than the others.
Yeah, the way to be a true follower of Jesus is to actually follow Him and His Word.

I was raised as a Christian, and part of that doctrine that was given to me was to not show any kind of aggression to those who are ignorant of the Word. Your approach is quite unbecoming, no offense.
Take a look at what Jesus did when people disrespected His Father.

John 2:12-25 NIV:

After this he went down to Capernaum with his mother and brothers and his disciples. There they stayed for a few days.

When it was almost time for the Jewish Passover, Jesus went up to Jerusalem. In the temple courts he found men selling cattle, sheep and doves, and others sitting at tables exchanging money. So he made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple area, both sheep and cattle; he scattered the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables. To those who sold doves he said, "Get these out of here! How dare you turn my Father's house into a market!"

His disciples remembered that it is written: "Zeal for your house will consume me."

Then the Jews demanded of him, "What miraculous sign can you show us to prove your authority to do all this?"

Jesus answered them, "Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days."

The Jews replied, "It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and you are going to raise it in three days?" But the temple he had spoken of was his body. After he was raised from the dead, his disciples recalled what he had said. Then they believed the Scripture and the words that Jesus had spoken.

Now while he was in Jerusalem at the Passover Feast, many people saw the miraculous signs he was doing and believed in his name.4But Jesus would not entrust himself to them, for he knew all men. He did not need man's testimony about man, for he knew what was in a man.

btw, you serious cannot just say you would be tortured to death for Christ just that easy, because even Jesus himself was reluctant to be crucified on the Cross.

You sound much like Peter. He said all those things, but in the end, he still denied Jesus, and Jesus knew that he would.
Yes, and Peter later went on to be crucified upside-down for Jesus. So if I'm like Peter, I take that as a serious compliment.

Honestly, Heartz, I did not attack you in any way. With zeal, I spoke in defense of my Father. And, I hate to point this out here, but let's be honest: Whose approach was more unbecoming? The one who stood in defense of his faith and his God or the one who decided to insert some snide comment clearly meant to offend?

Think about it this way: If you insulted my wife and I responded this way, you might understand that I acted in such a way because I loved her. How much more should I respond that way if you insult my God, Who is worth more than any man or woman?

I'll leave it at that. This isn't a religious thread.
You really should've left it to begin with and not left any comment at all. You can keep your beliefs and voice them respectfully if you choose when the time's appropriate. That is what I did. But you can't insult someone just because he believes something strongly.
 

AeroMarx64

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Okay, Proverbs and Heartz, this is not a religious thread.

What you believe in is different from what someone else could believe in, so please don't go around claiming your beliefs are concrete. That's what angers me about your posts. (I'm trying to not go on a flaming raid here.)

Anyway, you follow you faith, I follow mine. You don't see me shouting my beliefs upon people and acting like what I think is "just and "righteous." Everyone has a diffent outlook on life than what YOU want. Please don't use non-secular propaganda when commenting. Once again, not a religious thread.


Back on topic, amirite?

No, people will probably never accept video gaming as 'normal,' because sports are more 'manly.' -.-
 

Fenrir

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It's his thread, is it not? I figure if he wants it to be religious it can be. <_<
 

AeroMarx64

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It's his thread, is it not? I figure if he wants it to be religious it can be. <_<
But it's off-topic, is it not? <_<

It doesn't matter if it's his topic; posting religious stuff is generally asking to be hated on by someone eventually. I tried to get it back on topic, bot noooooo...
And if he wants it to be religious , btw, he should change the title. Problem solved.


Anyway, the direction this thread is heading is just...through the fire and flames...
 

Proverbs

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Okay, Proverbs and Heartz, this is not a religious thread.

What you believe in is different from what someone else could believe in, so please don't go around claiming your beliefs are concrete. That's what angers me about your posts. (I'm trying to not go on a flaming raid here.)

Anyway, you follow you faith, I follow mine. You don't see me shouting my beliefs upon people and acting like what I think is "just and "righteous." Everyone has a diffent outlook on life than what YOU want. Please don't use non-secular propaganda when commenting. Once again, not a religious thread.


Back on topic, amirite?

No, people will probably never accept video gaming as 'normal,' because sports are more 'manly.' -.-
Something I want to clear up is this: I wasn't going around shoving my beliefs on anyone. What happened was this:

In passing, I mentioned that I thought homosexuality was wrong. Spadefox took a small offense, and so I explained why I put that in there. He and I later got time to talk and things are fine. Heartz then took that as an opportunity to make an intentionally offensive comment, to which I responded in defense of my Father, which is only natural. Following that, she responded again, sort of 'calling me out' for my response, which was, I'll admit, a bit more intense than it needed to be, but was nevertheless not on the offensive (as I did not attack her personally). To that I also responded, pointing out that even if I had responded inappropriately, she's hardly one to be starting that discussion, as she was the one initially attempting to offend.

But, I do agree, this is not a religious thread nor do I want it to be. I'm just getting sick of being judged for my beliefs wherever I go. Because this happens ALL the time. And now I feel like I can't even post on SWF without getting flak my faith (because this is not the first time it's happened... ). It's kinda sad that this happened in a blog about acceptance...

Back on topic.
 

AeroMarx64

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Sorry, I didn't mean to sound offensive or anything (and I am a Christian too, btw), so I apologize for coming off too harsh. I just don't want other people to start flame wars about religions and stuff... But yeah, there's no problem with you being greatly-religious, I think that's fine. But other people could take it the wrong way, you know?

Anyway, back on topic. ^-^
 

Sanu

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Joined
Dec 22, 2005
Messages
2,179
No, you can't. And sorry if I go a bit on the offensive here, but this seriously deserves it.

Firstly, don't you ever dare disrespect God's Word ever again. I mean that. I have no tolerance for anyone who disrespects the Lord my God. This isn't about my beliefs or whatever. Offend those all you want. But you WILL NOT attempt to mock God--as if He could be mocked.

Secondly, I have my reasons to submit to God. He's done so much in my life while I spat in His face for the vast majority of it. Even now my "righteous acts are like filthy rags" (Isaiah 64:6 NIV) before Him. Yet in spite of His entire foreknowledge of that He descended low to become like us, lived with us, and died for us--and at the same time sacrificed His Son, being Him in essence, accomplishing the greatest act of love. He sacrificed both Himself and the One He loved most, knowing that even if I came to Him, I'd still be the imperfect wretch that I am. I'm completely neglecting the fact that He is the ultimate authority on everything, here, and should be submitted to no matter what--even if out of fear. But the most moving part of it all is that, although we should feel such deep fear before such an awesome and mighty God, we don't have to, for "perfect love drives out fear" (1 John 4:18 NIV). Not our perfect love for Him (as if we do anything), but His perfect love for us.


That is why I submit to Him. Yes, I know my place, but more than that I love Him more than anything on this Earth or outside of it--not because I am or have done anything good, but simply that I've seen such a love to move me to that point. When faced with His love, I am only forced to return it, although nowhere near the same magnitude or perfection.

So go ahead, mock me. Mock me all you like for following the Lord my God, I'll take it. Call me a fool and I'll be a fool for Christ. I'd rather be spat on, whipped, beaten, and killed in the most slow, painful, and torturous death than to hear one word spoken against the Lord my God. So say what you like about me, I'm fair game. But you WILL NOT say one word against Him.
Put a ****ing sock in it already. No one cares about how you specifically feel; so stop spreading your "word" across the board, in any of your posts and otherwise. You mostly took a simple comment on Heartz out of context and blew it up into some huge violation and offense against your one lord floating in the sky.

You are judged for your beliefs because you try to force them down people's throats in all of your messages here on SWF; exactly what Spadefox called you out on regarding the homosexuality bit of your post. Keep your beliefs to yourself and we'll be able to co-exist on a much higher plateau.

I respect Christians. I don't respect you.
 
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