Megaman Unlimited Mafia - Day 6 begins! No one killed!

[#HBC | Gorf]

i'm not at all sure what this is directed at

PJB/Rake side of your slot for this game in particular, others for others.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

This place used to be like that too. Look at the really early games in the archive. ****ing HUGE rosters.

I really just personally prefer small, intimate setups. Yeah, you learn to prioritize in larger games because you have to, but it's not a very efficient way to play as either alignment, I think.

Depends on the player. It's burnt me if I guess wrong on newer players but I generally don't. There's only like two that are absolute crapshoots to me and I'll bet you can guess both immediately (if not you then others at the very least).

It's just unfortunate because I have the basis for a ****ing fantastic 16/17 man game that I can GUARANTEE is a legit set-up but we take forever to fill a 14-man game and even that's considered a large just for one additional person.

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

Also I need to learn to investigate votes better before a flip. That's what I'm taking away from this game. I can catch it on obvious **** like scum's lynch on me but I can't catch it before the fact.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Even though your read was technically accurate, it was for very wrong reasons. First off, never once did anyone EVER mention my D2 play which I'll admit had holes. Second off, the turning over my Soup read was easy to read, you literally just kept misinterpreting it.

Actually I did, I did mention about how you handled the Rake/Laundry slot was off to me because it looked like you stopped trying to read the slot.

You're way of handling Soup looked off to me from the wording you put on him based on his freakouts.

 

[Overswarm]

I'll post roles whne I get back to my computer with the word document on it.

My thoughts during the game:

http://quicktopic.com/50/H/8MAkpHJUYaM


First of all, town shouldn't have won this several times over. I don't have all my night action notes with me, but a few fun facts:

1) Badwolf almost used his ability on Gorf on N1. This would have prevented him from giving it to anyone else until Gorf decided to use it, effectively giving mafia another NKill and remove the town doc.
Why didn't it happen?

Gorf blocked it with sandstorm.

2) This right here: http://smashboards.com/threads/mega...ns-no-one-killed.345563/page-52#post-16295652

Red Ryu actually roleblocked Soup, preventing him from killing YOLOSWAG. Funny thing though... Red Ryu's initial PM to me was to roleblock GORF. He changed his mind a few hours later. His action didn't go through because.... Soup hadn't told me if he was using his nail shield or not.

It's a good thing mafia didn't do their math though! Gorf's one-shot charge ability? Removes the vote from two people and prevents their NAs, but that doesn't matter if there's two scum.

With five alive it takes three to lynch. There were 3 townies and 2 scum. If Gorf had used charge, both he and another player couldn't vote. It would have been Yolo's double vote and two townies, meaning town couldn't lynch without YOLO's approval. That would have resulted in a townie dying (4 left) and mafia nightkill (3 left). 2 mafia, one town. Mafia wins.

Town no lynches? YOLO vote blocks one, kills another. 4 left, 3 to lynch. 1 townie that can vote.

So, in other words... mafia literally had this game won, then won again, and then lost.

Gorf was in more trouble than he realize at the end though. Soups NKill with the Nail Shield? It goes BEFORE the mafia night kill in the NAR. This is so when someone uses it, mafia can kill them the same night... unless the townie actually attacks and kills the mafia sending the NKill.

The Night Red Ryu roleblocked Soup and died? Soup was trying to kill YOLOSWAG... who was targeting Red Ryu with a NKill.

But more importantly, rather than just giving town or mafia the win with 1 town 1 mafia remaining, it'd have been a tie if the townie had a nail shield... specifically because I changed mafia's win condition (read carefully) and, for the first time ever, I made an arbitrary change as a mod pre-game that if it came down to a 1 on 1 "who casts the vote first wins" I'd just call it a tie rather than who logged in first. I don't like doing that, but I felt the game would be a bit too silly if that would occur.

All that said, Gorf would have easily won if he didn't charge. Rajam would have been like "Uh, Soup's scum" and Gorf would have said "totally" and that would have been that.

But he didn't.

So gg town.

Game balance:

This game was slightly in town's favor. Not by a ton, but by enough to where I'd weaken town a bit. There was just too much confirmed information by the end. This was primarily scum's fault as they used their "block investigations and tracking/watching/observing/protecting" ability on N1 instead of later when the information was more important AND their main role, the mafia bus driver, got caught cold by Rake early on. That was a great play by Rake, but it totally screwed over mafia after they lost their sandstorm. I put sandstorm in there specifically in case the Jet Man role got killed, but it had been usd already.

Mafia was basically balanced as a swinging pendulum. They had "on days" and "off days", literally. On Odd numbered days they had 4 votes and could remove one vote from an opponent AND had a one-shot charge that could remove a vote from another townie, giving them 3 votes and removing 2 votes from town. With 8 people remaining, 5 to lynch, 3 scum 5 town, mafia could either put whoever they wanted at L-1 on their own or they could remove it to there only being 3 town votes for that phase meaning town could not kill someone.

This is ignoring all of town's abilities of course, but at the core that's what they did.

Even days? Mafia was at the whim of town. Mafia had a grand total of TWO votes, only one if Charge was used, and could easily be held accountable for their previous actions.

I set it up so that Yo-Yo Man was a high profile player right out the gate so town had something to bounce off of ("A double voter, wat do?") and so mafia had a starting point. It's more fun than "this is fun vote whoever time", which was mostly absent in this game. A successful experiment, greatly helped by Yolo leading with a vote. Yo-Yo was also meant to be the indy killer if the indy got "found out" or if it got towards the end of the game. I only suspected one or two shots from Yo-Yo man's voteblock, so it wasn't a huge risk unless the indie announced it out loud! He also balanced Nich's role, which was totally unused, and could prevent Megaman from gaining an ability. In a pinch he could even voteblock a scummate to prevent him from hammering Trinitro man if town tried to plan! Lots of uses for this role, all good.

Jet Man was mafia's ace-in-the-hole and was meant to mess with the amount of "confirmed information". It was partially necessary for scum to have this, but they did pretty good without it.

Tank Man is essentially a goon that can push the pendulum a little bit towards mafia's side on two occasions for two totally different reasons. He's the "town can't have plans" guy and punishes them for claiming. Someone says "I'm Bass! I can check two people! I'll check to see if X and Y are using abilities. Doctor, you use your nail shield on me to protect me! We've got this!" Tank man says SANDSTORM. Hammerman beloved by town and you don't want to waste your NKill on him just yet? Tank man says CHARGE, and hammerman loses his + to his vote.


All in all fairly balanced, but I think town was a little bit too strong towards the end of the game. Granted, the game should have been over given that town lost all their major power roles one after another and mafia had a numerical possibility to win, but eh.



Town's mass claiming hurt them pretty bad. I was stupid surprised when I saw it. Someone said "I know you're excited to be in an OS game, but lay off the claims" and it was exactly what I was thinking.


The talk of "YOLO has to be scum, or the game would be over" was mind boggling to me because it wasn't true. YOLO was voteblocked for that phase as it was even, but he was a double voter in other phases. There were 5 people remaining, 3 to lynch. Assuming YOLO town, that gives town 2 votes and mafia 2 votes. Mafia had to vote on someone to lynch them. So we can assume a town or indy would get lynched. Night phase, someone may or may not die. 4 People remaining, 3 to lynch... YOLO is a double voter and could voteblock mafia. 3 people remaining, 2 to lynch. YOLO is a double voter and could have voteblocked mafia.

Kind of blew my mind that people thought I'd just end the game assuming perfect play from everyone. I let people mess up.


Oh, and the PJB flip?

Nail man had a 'beat" safe claim and Yoku man had a "rush" safe claim and Zero had a "proto man" safe claim. The beat safe claim was because if someone said "hey guys I got nail shield" then someone claiming nail man is killed instantly by mafia. The Rush safe claim is because Yoku man sounds like an indie role. Zero WAS an indie role so he had proto man as a semi-generic safe claim.

Megaman, however, was town. This was kind of a bastardy thing to do, giving 3 megaman-pal safe claims and then having a megaman role. That could cause some serious havoc during claim time when flips aren't what they appear to be, especially if town doesn't know what "infected" means yet!


Shoutouts:

2. Soup - To be honest, you played pretty poorly early and midgame and at the end most of your major decisions were made for you. Your best decision (kill YOLO) was unfortunately blocked by Red Ryu and then Gorf kind of handed you a "I'm scum" platter by not only using a Night Action with you being able to check TWO of THREE people but then didn't have a claim to back it up and left Rajam, the townie of all townies alive!

You pulled it together towards the end and not shooting your nail shield was a very non-selfish, pro-town decision.

Your engagement with PJB was really bad though. Rajam had it right from the start, but you were having panic-attacks in thread about PJB not being lynched. PJB might not have played perfectly, but this game had YOLO and Raziek hiding in the shadows the entire time. You never even got any useful information out of PJB, never tried to goad it. Next time use a carrot instead of a stick. If a player is simply playing "bad town", that doesn't make him scum. Lynching "bad town" is a last resort, not something you rally for. PJB could have easily been talked into giving reads or making his own cases with the right approach, and this entire scenario put your reliability on the line. When PJB flipped town, you were in trouble. You hunting PJB almost cost town the game in the end, so be careful next time you see what you consider a townie playing bad. Unless you think they're also actually scum, get more information until you can convince others he's scum.

You used your role very well, probably about as well as it could have possibly used.


8. Gorf

I wanted to explain your role and wincon SO BAD to you, but couldn't as a MOD. I actually did copy/paste your role when you asked a question about it and re-read it to make sure, but it said right in the opening lines "including the mafia NKill" referring to blocking actions...

This wasn't a fantastic scum performance from you as an individual, but a superb one as part of a team. My scum teams are designed to play as a team or lose, so that was perfect. I felt you kind of looked scummy towards the middle when you didn't pick up the pace, but no one else seemed to suspect you so maybe it was just me knowing your role.

I was confused as hell why you didn't have a safe claim ready. You could have used Jet Man's "guess the lynch, get the player's role" ability or just made something up... or simply told them "I have charge, it prevents two people from voting or using NA for a Night" and play off that. Your claim would have gotten you killed in about every mafia game ever. XD

If you hadn't messed up the Charge action I'm pretty sure scum would have won pretty easily.

9. Rajam

MVP RAJAM

No joke Rajam, I was SUPER impressed. You were far and away the best townie in the entire game. Your thought process, notes, use of ability, and attention to detail were fantastic. You were the sole voice of reason during the PJB bedlam and you used process of elimination effectively to determine who sent in the Night Kill and were able to narrow it down considerably. That's good mafia. I was incredibly, incredibly impressed and was a huge fan of watching you play this game. You've improved drastically since your first game, more than any other player I know.
You ended up switching from "It's YOLO/Gorf" to "Soup/YOLO", so your end result was wrong there, but Soup also kind of gave you a lot of reasons to suspect him and Gorf did a good job hiding it. Even though you were focused on Soup as scum, you made an effort to still "play the game' and get more information. Was just superb play.

Wish you had caught up early game a bit faster though, probably would have helped Town.



Broken Robots:
12. Potassium (lynched D1, Rainbow Man Town)

You didn't play very poorly. You said a few silly things and reacted poorly when the pressure got on you, but the stuff prior to the pressure? Didn't scream "I'm scum" or even a good lynch. This was mostly town being chicken with head cut off mode and scum being very good at being sneaky snakes, you just got the raw end of it.

3. Nicholas1024 (killed N1, Hammerman Town)

I could have easily seen you leading town had you gotten another role or survived the Night. You were killed because you were an EXCELLENT townie and one of the better D1 appearances I've seen .You asked the right questions, got lots of information out, were civil, and didn't tunnel :D

It's a shame your role didn't get to stick around, but the role was kind of designed to by mafia's chew toy. Once mafia found you with vote power they would have put a stop to it or Trinitro man would have.

4. Rake the Lawndry (lynched D2, Trinitro Town)

I really liked your play this game and was very impressed that you caught Circus on a cold read like that. You had strong reasoning, a good explanation, and were able to convince others to join you in it even when people were looking to vote for you! That's some talent. If you hadn't caught Circus, town would have lost without killing a single mafia member. I'd put money on it.

I could see how town could want to lynch you, but I don't feel it was worth the pressure you got. I think you could have stayed alive if you had pushed on Circus instead of gambiting, but your gambit worked.

I was kind of hoping you'd get nail shielded just to see the chaos.

10. Circus (blew up D2, Jet Man Mafia)

You played well but apparently predictably! I enjoy watching you play in my games and thought you did pretty well, but apparently Rake the Lawndry has your number. Good luck switching it up in the future!

11. BadWolf28738 (killed N2, Nail Man Town)

You had a super tough role to play. I don't think i agree with any of your night action choices, but it worked out all right in the end. This was probably the most difficult role in the game to play though as it was essentially a one-shot doc that could MAYBE be used more, but could also lead to 3 townies dead in one Day/Night phase in a 13 man game. Super high stakes.

You weren't active too much in the day hpase, but you were a doc so... good job.

7. PrivateJoker-Brown (lynced D3, Yoku Man Town)

You could have done so much more! Your Yoku man Role could have been used to tell town whatever you wanted, but instead of proving your role or posting who you thought should be lynched you just wrote silly stuff D:

I don't think you were as scummy as other people said, not even close. That was... silly. But you could have done better defending yourself. Always think "Ability, Actions, Connections, Contributions". In that order, you can defend yourself. What abilities did you use, why, and can you prove it? What actions have you taken in thread, why, and can you prove the intent? What connections do you have, if any? What contributions have you made to the thread that others have not? All of these things point towards town.

5. JDietz43 (died D3, Zero Indie)

I was pretty salty when, as an indie role against the entire game, you outed a section of your role that could kill you. I pretty much knew you were sunk then unless YOLO died. That said, you got pretty close to winning. You wouldn't have been lynched I don't think, and both Raziek and Rajam lasted until the end. You would have made it to victory if not for being voteblocked.

Next time, remember all secrets are good secrets.

6. Red Ruy (died N3, Glue Man Town)

You did a good job. You weren't a driving force, but you also weren't sidetracking town with reads that weren't well founded. The talking in pictures was a bit silly, but honestly helped your role quite a bit. Not always a good idea, but this time was a good gambit. Your RB choices all turned out to be good except when you RBed Soup... but roleblocking Soup itself wasn't a bad idea. I might have done it myself in your shoes. Someone who might be mafia with a vig shot? Kill two people would have been 4 left, for all you know that could have been 2 maf vs. 2 town and then "game"! So I don't necessarily disagree with it. I hope you keep playing in my games but I will tell you it is unlikely blackbolt will make a return any time soon

13. YOLOSWAG (lynched D4, Yo-yo Man Mafia)

You sneaky snake. You looked incredibly scummy to me the entire time, but for some reason town didn't care that you didn't contribute little and when you did contribute it never worked in town's favor. You'd just say "I don't care, still a good move" and they'd just agree with you. Good play all around and good teamwork as well. You definitely know how to make a plan, and 30 seconds into the game start you made your super powerful and scummy-sounding role completely okay to all of town. That's some talent right there.

1. Raziek (killed N4, Megaman Infected Town)

You were a bit lurkey this game, I thought you could have contributed more. Asking to hammer to get the double vote though? SUPER BAD. For one, I thought you were going to be lynched as scum because of it. Second, you wouldn't even be a double voter because you only get that ability for the following Night.

Not contributing put town in a bad position towards the endgame with your slot because they had little to base it on. if Gorf hadn't killed you, you could have been a reliable target for scum.










All in all, super fun game. Fun to make, fun to watch, hopefully fun to play. It seemed janky towards the end, but that's mostly because people were using their roles wrong! :D

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

Btw, Ruy.

DEFINITE. That's when something is sure.

DEFIANT. That's the act of going against.

Please english better.

"My wording looked off."

Nah. And even if you saw the right thing in my D2 play, those are the type of things you need to present better.

 

[Overswarm]

This was my first time having a green room, I assume no one spoiled anything anywhere. Was fun reading the green room, will likely do it again.


edit:

Also absolutely no one in the green room can say "I would have done..." or "It was obvious that.." unless they link to a post in the Green Room quick topic. I asked them to post lists in the QT and ZERO OBSERVERS would do it XD

peeps fraid of being called out for bein wrong

it's like drawing a picture and being like "Hey, is this any good? I only spent ten minutes on it."

but really you only spent ten minutes on it to protect yourself

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

This game was slightly in town's favor. Not by a ton, but by enough to where I'd weaken town a bit. There was just too much confirmed information by the end. This was primarily scum's fault as they used their "block investigations and tracking/watching/observing/protecting" ability on N1 instead of later when the information was more important AND their main role, the mafia bus driver, got caught cold by Rake early on. That was a great play by Rake, but it totally screwed over mafia after they lost their sandstorm. I put sandstorm in there specifically in case the Jet Man role got killed, but it had been usd already.

#nocredit

 

[#HBC | Laundry]

ebwop: i kid, mostly because i think os was referring to the both of us by saying "rake"

 

[#HBC | Joker]

By the way, wtf was actually up with PJB's claim?

1. Yoku Man [safe claim: Rush] JOKER-BROWN

a. Town Crier – Each Night, you may choose a message to be displayed to the rest of the town at the next day phase, maximum of 40 words. Standard forum and game rules apply to these messages (no posting role PMs, etc.). If you are killed, no message will be posted. If your message is above 40 words it will not be posted.

If you don't know who Yoku Man is, he's a hidden boss in MMU. Sounds like an indie to me. Feel free to pretend to be Rush if you'd like, as Rush the robot dog is not in this game.

Win condition: You win when your faction (TOWN) is the only remaining faction.

Worst role in any PR game ever. No real power, and flavor so ****ing scummy sounding that the mod had to give me a safe claim?! **** that, I wasn't about to claim something ****ty in the spot I was in.

 

[Overswarm]

ebwop: i kid, mostly because i think os was referring to the both of us by saying "rake"

I refer to the hydra, named "Rake the Lawndry". If it was "Wash the Rake" I'd have called it Wash. :B

 

[Overswarm]

Worst role in any PR game ever. No real power, and flavor so ****ing scummy sounding that the mod had to give me a safe claim?! **** that, I wasn't about to claim something ****ty in the spot I was in.

Your role was actually pretty powerful, especially if Rajam masoned you. You can give an anonymous message to town and say anything you want. It was, in fact, perfect for your exact situation.

Not only could you have proven your role and made people guess about you...

But you could have given your reads to town without them looking through a "PJB" lens. They'd just be like "this floating voice says so-and-so is scum, to look at post #22, #84, and #112 to see conflicting opinions. I agree with this, what's up with so-and-so", but you just put silly stuff instead.

 

[Circus]

Gorf was in more trouble than he realize at the end though. Soups NKill with the Nail Shield? It goes BEFORE the mafia night kill in the NAR. This is so when someone uses it, mafia can kill them the same night... unless the townie actually attacks and kills the mafia sending the NKill.

I was afraid of this.

Town's mass claiming hurt them pretty bad. I was stupid surprised when I saw it. Someone said "I know you're excited to be in an OS game, but lay off the claims" and it was exactly what I was thinking.

That was me. And I was scum. What does that tell you.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

@ Rajam you 120% deserve mvp here if we still had MvP, town's best player.

@ Overswarm Soup was me rethinking with what Rajam said in our QT, and I had to agree with him. Though in the end I guess I did my job, I just wish I could step out more when I have good ideas.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Worst role in any PR game ever. No real power, and flavor so ****ing scummy sounding that the mod had to give me a safe claim?! **** that, I wasn't about to claim something ****ty in the spot I was in.

It's not.

Crier is really useful if you can make town think what you say without a name to it. Yeah Crier can be scum but still it helps make your presence known and prove how you used it to make you town.

 

[Circus]

by the way OS i had fun host more small games

 

[Nicholas1024]

This was my first time having a green room, I assume no one spoiled anything anywhere. Was fun reading the green room, will likely do it again.


edit:

Also absolutely no one in the green room can say "I would have done..." or "It was obvious that.." unless they link to a post in the Green Room quick topic. I asked them to post lists in the QT and ZERO OBSERVERS would do it XD

peeps fraid of being called out for bein wrong

it's like drawing a picture and being like "Hey, is this any good? I only spent ten minutes on it."

but really you only spent ten minutes on it to protect yourself

Reads are hard. I honestly didn't have any of the scum pinned when I died N1, and after I died I wasn't seriously combing through posts looking for tells. TBH, even if I had stayed alive, I'm not sure if I'd have been able to catch this mafia team, they all played really well.

 

[Overswarm]

You did just fine this game Red Ryu. Not everyone should play Chief in every game, there has to be some indians too.



Oh, and Gorf?

Next time you are in a situation where Rajam thinks Soup is scum in a 3 man lylo and both you and Rajam were roleblocked for the preceding Night Phase and no one died?

HAVE A PLAN

You could have at least tried to convince Rajam that Soup simply didn't kill at the end because your secret ability was "I'M FREAKING BULLETPROOF".

"Rajam, Soup pulled a gambit and lost. My ability is that I'm ****ing TANK MAN and I am BULLETPROOF. He tried to shoot me and it didn't work, now he's stuck in this 3 man lylo and claiming because there wasn't a NKill that I'm scum. I'm NOT scum.

Think about it for a second. We were BOTH voteblocked and roleblocked. It INSTANTLY made a Night Phase occur. Then the game starts again? Why didn't one of us just die during the Night and the game end? Who used that ability and why would they use it if it did absolutely nothing?

Soup messed up and tried to alpha us himself and then shot the bulletproof one.

Vote Soup"

Ta da, I just won scum the game.

>:[

 

[Overswarm]

by the way OS i had fun host more small games

You should join my next large. Trust me on this one.

Otherwise the line is preeeeeeetty long for mafia games it looks like.

I think I create more fun/unique setups than most, but it's not fair for me to try to jump ahead a bunch. I might host a private at some point, but if I did it'd be a biggin'.

 

[#HBC | Gorf]

But then a BP role already exists in this setup and you think it's stupid to try and claim BP

 

[Nicholas1024]

By the way, can anyone link to the scum QT? I figure it'd be an interesting read.

 

[Circus]

I was thinking of doing that, but I think Marshy doesn't like revealing those if he doesn't have to, so unless he or OS decides to post it, I think you'll have to do without.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Your role was actually pretty powerful, especially if Rajam masoned you. You can give an anonymous message to town and say anything you want. It was, in fact, perfect for your exact situation.

Not only could you have proven your role and made people guess about you...

But you could have given your reads to town without them looking through a "PJB" lens. They'd just be like "this floating voice says so-and-so is scum, to look at post #22, #84, and #112 to see conflicting opinions. I agree with this, what's up with so-and-so", but you just put silly stuff instead.

Or instead, people could just take their heads out of their asses, and read the things I posted in the thread, without assuming with every fiber of their being that I'm scum. I mean, I can see how anonymity might help with that, but it wouldn't have helped me. If I had written who I wanted to lynch D2 in my N1 message, it would've been Circus, and they lynched him. My N2 message got blocked, and I didn't make it to N3.

I went through the whole game being fine, but every time someone "did a reread", they did it with "PJB is scum" in mind, because Kantrip and soup wouldn't shut the **** up about me for the entire game. What should have happened, is that they actually read my posts, instead of just believing every goddamn word being said about me all game. Soup spent well over half the game just slinging mud at me, and eventually people started believing his bull**** instead of actually reading me. No amount of "but PJB, you were being scummy" will convince me that you were actually reading me, because you weren't. Everyone's accusations against me were just false, and it was ridiculous. It didn't matter how many times I actually pointed to why they were wrong, they were just not prepared to listen. It was infuriating.

This was the least fun I've had in any game I've ever played. That's the reason I gave up. It was not fun, it was torture. Town did not let up on me for even a moment, it was disgusting. The weight that was lifted when I decided to just stop posting? Tremendous. I've never felt good about being a quitter before, but that **** felt good.

 

[Circus]

If I had written who I wanted to lynch D2 in my N1 message, it would've been Circus, and they lynched him.

to be fair

no they didn't

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Or instead, people could just take their heads out of their *****, and read the things I posted in the thread, without assuming with every fiber of their being that I'm scum. I mean, I can see how anonymity might help with that, but it wouldn't have helped me. If I had written who I wanted to lynch D2 in my N1 message, it would've been Circus, and they lynched him. My N2 message got blocked, and I didn't make it to N3.

I went through the whole game being fine, but every time someone "did a reread", they did it with "PJB is scum" in mind, because Kantrip and soup wouldn't shut the **** up about me for the entire game. What should have happened, is that they actually read my posts, instead of just believing every goddamn word being said about me all game. Soup spent well over half the game just slinging mud at me, and eventually people started believing his bull**** instead of actually reading me. No amount of "but PJB, you were being scummy" will convince me that you were actually reading me, because you weren't. Everyone's accusations against me were just false, and it was ridiculous. It didn't matter how many times I actually pointed to why they were wrong, they were just not prepared to listen. It was infuriating.

This was the least fun I've had in any game I've ever played. That's the reason I gave up. It was not fun, it was torture. Town did not let up on me for even a moment, it was disgusting. The weight that was lifted when I decided to just stop posting? Tremendous. I've never felt good about being a quitter before, but that **** felt good.

You played scummy, there was legitimate reasoning to you being scum and you should stop pretending we called you scum because a magic fairy said we should have.

Learn what you did wrong. You spent 2 days focusing on your own damn hide and nothing else. While I agree with Laundry on the D1 stuff a bit, I still think that is grimy even if Ryker does it, your Circus back off was absolutely pig disgusting and even worse when he flipped scum. Granted, D3 I didn't want to lynch you, my roleblock action, but town was going to do it with or without me so I hammered.

But you need to take a step back and take the game off yourself for once and do something to help out instead of, "don't lynch me you are so dead wrong" because that didn't do **** for us in reading you. You didn't once go out to get something out there til Day 3, and when that happened you decided to stop posting and condemned yourself. I can't do **** for you if you won't do anything for yourself and give anything for us in return.

I don't care about meta anymore ever since tranquility, I will lynch you if you play scummy and that includes what you did above. Stop playing for yourself when you refuse to give anything back reads wise, seriously with the "**** you I don't post read lists?" I had no clue where your general head was til day 3.

Learn from this instead of ******** back how we should have read you. I hate this post with a passion and even more so when you try to turn this back on us when you then say, "yeah ditching my faction and flipping the bird at them was the best thing I did and it felt so good"

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Yup, I sure did focus on myself all game. That wasn't soup or kantrip at all, no siree. I didn't call out Circus' play on D1, or push my scumread on you D2, or give a readlist on D3. This is exactly why I bailed. It's like you truly didn't read the things I posted. I may not have played super well, but the insistence that I literally did nothing but talk about myself all game is absurd. I attempted to contribute, but every time I did, soup/kantrip just brought the focus back on me.

 

[Nicholas1024]

PJB, for future games, sometimes it's better to tell the person tunneling you "This is going nowhere. I'm going to reply to your argument one more time, and then I'm going to ignore you unless there's something other people want me to address." It might help keep you from going around in circles in the future.

(Also if you thought dealing with Soup/Kantrip was bad, you should have seen me as of a couple years ago.)

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Town and mafia both played well overall. I think Circus just doesn't ejnoy being scum. Mighty impressed by marshy though, he never seemed to be that comfortable as scum. Had him as "non-mafia" because I think mafia voteblocker is whack ... but I wouldn't have read him correct anyway. Good ****.
Rajam played well, soup improved over the course of the game, Ryu shaped up from D2 onward and Nich was obvtown. That's a very solid basis for a town victory in any setup. Even with a number of unnecessary mislynches - Kantrip in particular - that was enough for town to pull through.

Soup, do you see now what I have told you in the social thread? You started weak and it took you quite a while to get your influence on the game and it wasn't because your reads were wrong [they weren't too off] or because you were so scummy [you weren't].
I don't know why people tend to give Rajam so little credit. I've always been fond of his way to analyze things ever since Walmart Mafia. The only reason why people hate on him is because he plays at his very own pace and doesn't let others impose theirs upon him. That's their fault for being impatient, not his!
Ryu, you need to stop trying to make yourself look special or unique. You are well aware of your strengths and your flaws, so why don't you just play to them? A town can use solid, functional players like you. A town full of "star" players can quickly prove dysfunctional whereas players like you are important for the town's balance. Do your thing and don't worry too much abuot how other people might view you as a player. Most of them aren't that good themselves.

As for my reads I was right and wrong on some crucial ones. I had Raz as scum all game. In the beginning it was his interaction with Kantrip that made me look at him with more scrutinity than normally. I felt like he played exceedingly passive and was just hiding away from the spotlight as the game continued. Would've pushed for his lynch. I was also completely fooled by marshy.
PJB I had as town but his lynch was 100% warranted. Disgusting play by him. It took me a while to develop a solid read on Rajam but in the end I was right on him being town. For some time I had him as a potential mate of Raz, whom I was 100% sure was scum. Gorf I started to read as scummy as the game went on.

Dunno how I would've done this game. Probably decentish because of correct read on Gorf and most townies [RTL and Raz are the ones I was completely wrong about]. But games with all PRs just aren't my cup of tea. But it seems like it was run very wll and the players had fun so props to mod & players.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

I went through the whole game being fine, but every time someone "did a reread", they did it with "PJB is scum" in mind,

Being fair, if you don't give them any kind of footing, they can't reread and find you scummy no matter what their per-disposition is.

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Yup, I sure did focus on myself all game. That wasn't soup or kantrip at all, no siree. I didn't call out Circus' play on D1, or push my scumread on you D2, or give a readlist on D3. This is exactly why I bailed. It's like you truly didn't read the things I posted. I may not have played super well, but the insistence that I literally did nothing but talk about myself all game is absurd. I attempted to contribute, but every time I did, soup/kantrip just brought the focus back on me.

Because you refused to post anything worthwhile and I was getting tired of you coming up with half-assed stances and hardly ever being here. Don't come out of this game thinking you did nothing wrong. Your whole play was focused on yourself, and you were not considerate of the townies trying to read you.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Learn what you did wrong. You spent 2 days focusing on your own damn hide and nothing else. While I agree with Laundry on the D1 stuff a bit, I still think that is grimy even if Ryker does it, your Circus back off was absolutely pig disgusting and even worse when he flipped scum. Granted, D3 I didn't want to lynch you, my roleblock action, but town was going to do it with or without me so I hammered.

What? I'm under fire and I wasn't there. You can't sit there and worry only about yourself. Saving your hide is important, but working at it to the exclusion of contribution is a guaranteed way to die.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

This place used to be like that too. Look at the really early games in the archive. ****ing HUGE rosters.

It seems like that's commonplace literally everywhere else. The only other exception that I can think of is MS.

And OS, can you post the role pms so I can shamelessly plagarize them for my next game?

 

[Rajam]

My masonries:

- Gorf: http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/cqZ8PjwHhhxW
- Raziek: http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/w9VAHbPv3TrX
- soup: http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/tTZM9k6PnbGc
- Red Ryu: http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/hAaTQV9ReLC9

soup, you need to check those; specially the one with Ryu; specially #11 lol

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Don't come out of this game thinking you did nothing wrong. Your whole play was focused on yourself.

You keep saying things, but if you actually read the posts I write, you'd already know that you're wrong. But you don't so what ya gonna do?

 

[#HBC | ѕoup]

Please omit "you're wrong" out of your vocabulary because you keep using it for the basis of every argument against you. Try again.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

dammit rake

Hey, i still dont know why people hated one me man. It was literally force fed to them BY SCUM that i was doing weird **** (and i dont even know why / what people disliked it/me). Gorf calling me scum because i called Nick obvtown after he fought me on that ONLY to completely fold to it ? That's BS to the absolute maximum, Nich was the most derpy obvious town in history. Any scum would have killed him and it was scummy as balls for gorf to say : well wifom but Rake called him town and now he's dead so let's lynch RTL. Like wtf.

The entirety of most of the days we were alive we were being ******* at and called scum by SCUM, literally Luigi's 2.0 where all scum does is mud sling my slot and people eat it up because reading IS JUST TOO HARD.

I liked hydraing with you though and I think we woulda been able to find marshy because me and you discussed him as a scummer but passed over due to circus.

 

[Overswarm]

But then a BP role already exists in this setup and you think it's stupid to try and claim BP

Better than "man I don't understand my role. Also I don't know how to paraphase." Plus there was no BP role, just a role that gave BP with the nail shield.

Or instead, people could just take their heads out of their *****, and read the things I posted in the thread, without assuming with every fiber of their being that I'm scum. I mean, I can see how anonymity might help with that, but it wouldn't have helped me. If I had written who I wanted to lynch D2 in my N1 message, it would've been Circus, and they lynched him. My N2 message got blocked, and I didn't make it to N3.

It's partially up to you to not be a target. Town basically only has two main jobs: Find scum, lynch scum. Anything that detracts from that should be considered a responsibility by town, and that includes "not being a target".

If they wrongly accuse you of being scum then one of three things are happening:

1) Somoene in town is being crazy and calling you scum
2) You're playing poorly and are the most scummy looking to them
3) Scum is manipulating town to make you look scummier

If it's #1, then your job is both to find another target and to show why you aren't scum in a way that town will understand. It's very easy to say "psh, these guys are bad" but it doesn't matter. If you're surrounded by scientists you don't say "let's lynch so-and-so, I have faith he will turn up scum" because it doesn't matter to them. You have to play their ball game because they literally hold your life in their hands.

If it's #2 or #3, it's your job to step it up and look townie. You think scum just randomly picks who they want to look scummy? They pick easy targets. If you're the easiest target, then you've done something to deserve it and have to take steps to rectify the situation.

The entire time you were under fire you could have taken Rajam's approach and did a study of night actions and vote patterns and you could have limited scum that sent the Night Kill down to Soup, YOLO, Rajam, and Gorf. That'd have been a good start.

I went through the whole game being fine, but every time someone "did a reread", they did it with "PJB is scum" in mind, because Kantrip and soup wouldn't shut the **** up about me for the entire game. What should have happened, is that they actually read my posts, instead of just believing every goddamn word being said about me all game. Soup spent well over half the game just slinging mud at me, and eventually people started believing his bull**** instead of actually reading me. No amount of "but PJB, you were being scummy" will convince me that you were actually reading me, because you weren't. Everyone's accusations against me were just false, and it was ridiculous. It didn't matter how many times I actually pointed to why they were wrong, they were just not prepared to listen. It was infuriating.

This was the least fun I've had in any game I've ever played. That's the reason I gave up. It was not fun, it was torture. Town did not let up on me for even a moment, it was disgusting. The weight that was lifted when I decided to just stop posting? Tremendous. I've never felt good about being a quitter before, but that **** felt good.

Yes, Soup played poorly there. But look at his results.

Soup thought you were scum. Soup made other people believe you were scum. Soup made other people believe you were scum SO HARD that you gave up. Soup did to you what Rake did to Circus. Circus literally blew himself up to kill Rake because he knew the position he was in.

If Soup was right on his read of you then he played perfectly. Was it "harassing"? Yes. Was it logical? Not in the slightest. Was most of it even true? Nope! But it doesn't matter because Mafia isn't a game about truth, it is about persuasion and I don't know if you watch politics but the more often you repeat something the more people think it is true. If you can't beat that, you gotta learn how, and don't tell me other players wouldn't have been able to shrug him off

 

[Overswarm]

Soup and PJB both played poorly. PJB not as poorly as people think. He only focused on himself because you didn't give him obvious alternatives and were grilling him. It was like watching a lynch mob scream "prove you aren't a werewolf".

PJB's back off of Circus was incredibly smart and you should have listened to him.

PJB was one of the first to look at Circus-scum seriously, and then noted that suddenly everyone in the game was fine to lynch him and then when a claimed bomb came up Circus was totally fine with hammering.

Everyone in the game, including Circus, was okay with Circus dying.

Logically speaking, at this point any competent player would say "whoa whoa whoa hold the ****ing phone. Everyone wants him dead, including mafia, therefore Circus is either mafia that WANTS to die or mafia wants Circus dead. Figure this out." Circus pretty clearly played himself off as scum wanting to hammer a bomb or as a suicidal townie. The latter shouldn't exist, so you should assume the former. Rake would have survived and you would have had a confirmed-town bomb!

 

[Jdietz43]

Soup and PJB both played poorly. PJB not as poorly as people think. He only focused on himself because you didn't give him obvious alternatives and were grilling him. It was like watching a lynch mob scream "prove you aren't a werewolf".

PJB's back off of Circus was incredibly smart and you should have listened to him.

PJB was one of the first to look at Circus-scum seriously, and then noted that suddenly everyone in the game was fine to lynch him and then when a claimed bomb came up Circus was totally fine with hammering.

Everyone in the game, including Circus, was okay with Circus dying.

Logically speaking, at this point any competent player would say "whoa whoa whoa hold the ****ing phone. Everyone wants him dead, including mafia, therefore Circus is either mafia that WANTS to die or mafia wants Circus dead. Figure this out." Circus pretty clearly played himself off as scum wanting to hammer a bomb or as a suicidal townie. The latter shouldn't exist, so you should assume the former. Rake would have survived and you would have had a confirmed-town bomb!

That's all fantastic except for that part where I was scum and wanted a double kill XP

 

[Jdietz43]

I was sold on Gorf town and soup scum. I also call it now: I deserve the Montgomery Burns Award For Outstanding Achievement In The Field Of Being The Luckiest DGamer Of History, since this is the 3rd time I win as town for pure luck:

- In Mario Kart, last Night it came to Town Doc vs SK vs Mafia. Mafia and SK killed each other, and Town Doc was left alone and made town win. Later the town doc told us that he didn't send a NAction because he was V/LA, otherwise he would've doc'd SK.

- In Celebrity Rehab Mafia, scum had a Day-Vig in LYLO, and I was voting against a townie. All scum had to do was day-kill another townie, and alpha-join my vote to win. They messed up badly and vigged me instead of whatever-other-townie. Scum got transparent for that, so at the end it was GG Town wins.

- ... And this.

I'm telling all of you: being current is overrated, it is not compatible with good luck

I think the Mr. Snrub award is more appropriate

Good job