Marth Q&A-Ask your questions here!!

[JBM falcon08]

this is odd to me, but why do marth's who d-throw to regular slash against falcos who phantasm just sit and wait for them to firebird up to dair when they could easily just go off of the edge and drop down to bair them or fair?

just asking, because i find the way i do it much better. dair sometimes seems to screw me over(basically i'm not consistent with it)

 

[Gian]

this is odd to me, but why do marth's who d-throw to regular slash against falcos who phantasm just sit and wait for them to firebird up to dair when they could easily just go off of the edge and drop down to bair them or fair?

just asking, because i find the way i do it much better. dair sometimes seems to screw me over(basically i'm not consistent with it)

also if u Dair them when they coming up they can edge tech (i hate that)




my question is: wich are best stages for marth? i always play on FD, so i need to get used to other places to be better.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Yoshi's story is a godsend for marth Gian due to tippers and his range.

And JBM,most marths wait for the spike? I figure most of them wait there to go for an f-smash...never seen many marths try spiking like that unless from the ledge or ken combo. Its usually risky and much better options..and the f-air to b-air would surely work as falco's recovery sucks..but most can't get out there in time or decide to wait on the f-smash.

 

[FrostByte]

Because Falco will usually be too close to the wall at this point in time. The only way to hit him is to fast fall a bair, and you cannot get back from that. You can edgehog if they drop too low or counter to fair if they come too high. I think a wavedash off the ledge to ff fair may work too, but I don't know if it'd be quick enough.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

you can get back from fastfalling b-airs easily frostbyte..you can even fastfall a nair offstage if you have your second jump lol..and f-airs may pop them up if you accidently tip it so b-airs are safer.

 

[Aesir]

even if you pop them up, its still giving you an advantage its not like oH SNAP I POPPED YOU UP I DIED NOW D:

However non tipped fairs are amazing off the stage when not tipped amazing. <_<

 

[thebluedeath1000]

Yeah aesir, you gave them more damage but now you are having to make it back to stage with them, thus losing your real edge at edgeguarding.

 

[FrostByte]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Y5iXByT-nI - The last stock

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Zr6t_S_xF0 - Fastfalling a *Fair*(second stock) gets you killed on YS. It will just about get you back on any other stage, but the bair has too much lag on it. Nair? Just look at the first stock.

 

[Perfect Hero]

Having some matchup problems with Link or Y. Link.
Can't get through projectile spam. Nair works I know. Anything else?

 

[thebluedeath1000]

don't fastfall the entire motion and you'll survive, I have.

YS kills you if you make any sort of mistake off the edge so thats not really acceptable lol.

But seriously, it just depends on how close they are to the edge and their height, don't nit pick it too much. I say its better to wait on the edge and try an fsmash most of the time but do as you like.

 

[Aesir]

Yeah aesir, you gave them more damage but now you are having to make it back to stage with them, thus losing your real edge at edgeguarding.

I never really encountered that problem. >____>;

also you're sending htem up and away. it gives you plenty of time to make it back.

however why would you go for the tip? none tippered is the way to go. <.<

 

[thebluedeath1000]

I was saying, by accident if you tipped it lol..never intentionally that way

 

[skip430]

I heard the question I am about to ask has been asked on this thread, so I looked through the first couple of pages and the last two but I couldn't find it so I will reask it if it has already been asked.

I am having trouble with Marth's double Fair, I just cant get the timing. Do you do the second fair as you are falling or right as your about to hit the ground or about when (assuming its short hopped). I also dont possible see how this move could be fast-falled, can it? maybe since I cannot do it yet fastfalling it seems impossible, but is it actually impossible to fast fall the double Fair? Basically, I would appreciate any and all tips regarding Marth's double Fair

 

[LaserBust]

PerfectHero - Try using yur Fair as a wall vs. yur oppenents projectiles. Wit the Fair's range and speed makes the timin none too difficult. Make most of yur approaches in the air, this somewhat limits his projectile options. Once you get in past his projectiles do it like BurgerKing, have it yur way..LOL u get it? BURGER KING (Have it your way.. its like the slogan.. well..)... no seriously, once you get in close its yur match. Space well and just Fair the projectiles. Range wise Marths Fsmash>Link's UpB. Remember that, cuz it hurts.

Skip - No you cannot fastfall a shorthop double Fair. Timing? Just try pullin em both off. Just short hop and as yur rising (pretty much A.s.A.p) Fair then as yur fallin (A.s.A.p..) Fair again. If you cant pull em both off its cuz yur not pullin the 1st 1 off RIGHT after u short hop or yur w8in too long to attempt the 2nd Fair. I suggest Lcancelin the 2nd Fair as well or your follow up options will be a bit limited.

 

[Cactuar]

Just a point of clarification: You can WD off the side of the stage and immediately bair and ff and still survive, assuming there is enough room to do so.

 

[JBM falcon08]

this is the scenario.

you've just d-throwed a falco off of the stage, he jumps, phantasms at you, you do the sword jab to him to cause to fall down, due to the laggyness of the fire bird, you drop below the stage, ff or not, and fair him, or bair him, you will recover much faster than he will which will result in a gimp kill.

Is it risky? yes, but if you can control marth well enough it shouldn't be the problem of SDing or messing it up. you have to ask yourself this, why would you sit there on the edge waiting for an fsmash or a dair when they could tech it, or you could miss when you can drop below, hit them, and not only are they too low to recover but marth's recovery is faster than theirs.

 

[pockyD]

or you can run off (fast-fall if you like), hit them with your forward-b (a floaty one), DJ, hit them with fair/bair or another forward-b, then up-b back

i heard some mew2king guy does this

 

[LaserBust]

Wow. That sounds pretty fancy. I would start praticing that right now but I dont like Airguarding with Marth too much.. Id much rather LedgeHop t3h Dair. Its just TOO DERN SEXY.

 

[Emblem Lord]

WDing off the stage into a shield breaker is too good. Also I go for spikes all the time. it's alot of fun. And I'm accurate so why not. But I'm good with other edge guarding methods too so idk. But running off the satge for a fair works wonders on Falco. So does d-tilt.

I love d-tilt.

 

[Aesir]

If you fair, fair then dair I heard it can kill at pretty low percents. I heard some Ken Guy does this.

 

[pockyD]

Wow. That sounds pretty fancy. I would start praticing that right now but I dont like Airguarding with Marth too much.. Id much rather LedgeHop t3h Dair. Its just TOO DERN SEXY.

it's not fancy at all; the only real set move there is the first hit with the forward-b because it stops your momentum (most importantly, you can fast fall into it and not come close to dying, and it can hit either direction); everything else is gravy after that (and you have plenty of time to recover)

 

[Silver Sytos]

Can someone explain the ganondorf match up?

 

[LaserBust]

I guess, Il work on it tonight. I dont use the ForwardB jabbin method tho, its gonna feel wierd, even if its part of an off the stage airguarding technique.

 

[Ryan-K]

Or you can be amazing like cort and run off and do the strong dolphin slash hit on them :o

 

[RT]

Can someone explain the ganondorf match up?

I don't have too mcuh Ganon experience, but the only thing I can say is to watch ouf for the chain grabbing attempts against you at low percentages. Ganon can get Ken comboed pretty easily, but it only takes a couple hits from him and you're finished since many of his moves have good knockback. Ganon's recovery is predictable for the most part, so you should definitely take advantage. And watch out for the stomp. <_<

 

[Freakin_Lu]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQbzpcCJ0m0
start at 1:20



how do you do the dair on the ledge correctly?
i can never do that.

 

[DuKe™]

is it better to fox trot with marth or just wavedash, and how do i make marth appear faster asside from l canceling properly i mean you know in order to avoid a person to annoy them and does anyone know what percantages when im able up throw f smash fast fallers such as space animals and falcon and from what percentages to u tilt and is there a way i could practice side stepping/ spot dodging and what is the best to way t odp a quick f smash from a dash i normally crouch cancel but idk any ideas, i dont know
if im sounding noobish or not i just want to completely re invent my marth from the f smash ***** i used to be

 

[balladechina212]

Whoa, lots of questions. I'll tackle them briefly and let other people add on to what I've said.

is it better to fox trot with marth or just wavedash

Marth's wavedash is extremely good and it gives you more control than you would have with a fox trot.

how do i make marth appear faster asside from l canceling properly i mean you know in order to avoid a person to annoy them

Fastfall everything. And after FF LC, make sure you do something or else you're wasting the lag frames that you saved.

does anyone know what percantages when im able up throw f smash fast fallers such as space animals and falcon and from what percentages to u tilt

You can upthrow-fsmash many fastfallers at pretty low percents, I've seen tippers done at around 30% on a Fox. All you have to do is pivot-fsmash or step to the side and the fsmash. Utilt is usually around 30-35% on Fox and Falco, I'm not sure about Falcon though (same with the fsmash, I'm not sure).

is there a way i could practice side stepping/spot dodging

Don't, practicing that stuff will make you predictable. Just do it in battle whenever you think you need to (don't abuse it, lest you be punished).

what is the best to way t odp a quick f smash from a dash i normally crouch cancel but idk any ideas, i dont know

I crouch cancel if I've been dashing for a while. I pivot if it's the beginning dash animation. Most of the times, however, I just wavedash out of the dash so I can open up my options (sometimes with a fsmash).

Hope I was able to help.

 

[BBQ]

I have a question about the sh f-air. Facing the left side I can do it fine b/c i sh with x then slide my thumb over and hit the c-stick. Facing the right i sh with x then have to bring my thumb all the way past the c-stick then move it to the right to f-air or I have to awkwardly use the A button which doesnt work so well either....What should I do??


btw i do ff and l-cancel the second f-air facing the left

 

[VA]

In general: avoiding grabs, any specific ways of doing it?

Reason for asking this is I played my first tournament the other day. I only came up against Fox once but when I did I couldn't handle the up throw to Uair, ended up being hit loads by this on low percent. I tried DI obviously but he was able to follow it everytime and he judged it well. I assume the way of avoiding this is to just not be grabbed, maybe I just beat him on grabs and grab him before he takes the initiative? This was my only problem really, I got so many people who tried to edge hog with Fairs and then grabbed the edge myself and spiked or just edge hogged; it was great fun. Help will be appreciated

 

[Aesir]

laern to smash DI the uairs so you get hit with the weak hitbox, also if you feel you're going to get grabbed beginning wiggling instantly *rotate the control stick button mash* so you can get out of the grab.

though in general to avoid getting grabbed you just have to space.
>___>;

 

[FrostByte]

@ BBQ: Use the A button for the fair. If you are quick enough, you can move backwards by using jump + away, towards + A, then hold away. You have to do all of this very quickly.

@ vanityangel: You can avoid grabs by dashing in and out of your opponents grab range. Good spacing prevents shield grabs. As for fox's uair, DI towards him when he grabs, then DI away after the first uair. That way you won't get hit again (unless on certain stages).

 

[thebluedeath1000]

You can smash di out of the u-air vanity angel, the stage doesn't matter as most foxes will u-air you no matter what. Avoiding grabs against fox is hard because if you stay grounded, he grabs, if you stay in air, you get hurt worse.

Retreating f-airs are very defensive but remember, fox has a laser.

 

[FrostByte]

Fox cannot hit you with a uair on Story and FOD's highest platforms, as you will be able to techroll. He *can* hit you after a uair beneath the lower platform though, since he can change direction a lot faster than usual.

 

[VA]

Noted.

Thanks all ^^

 

[Salaad]

I don't know if anyone has asked this before, and if they did, I apologize. Just a couple questions...

1. When my friends are not around, I usually play with random Lvl 9 CPU's. Wavedash usually doesn't work into making them make false moves. DD really wouldn't work against CPU's.

2. I get hit WAY too much against CPU's and can't avoid it.

3. I can't follow up on combos, any advice?

4. This one gets me in a lot of trouble...I do Dair but I mess up on L Cancel. They get the chance to hit me and get stuck in combos.

Pretty much all I do good against friends though xD

Thanks in advance. (Yes, I am a Smash n00b.)

 

[ArcNatural]

Lvl 9 CPUs are useless, They have frame perfect timing, grab you out of everything, etc. You develop bad habits playing them. Lvl 1-5 cpus are much better. You can't work on dash dance camping, wavedashing against comps to trick them. You can practice tech skill on them though shffl combos, ken combos, etc. I tend to just practice against lvl 1 cpus if I feel like playing alone.

 

[Salaad]

Thanks a lot. Many of my friends tell me to play lvl 9's to get better, but I'm gonna take your word for it and practice on lvl 1-5's. I basically have never combo'd a lvl 9 because they are so fast! My brother saw a CPU play for the first time and he was like WTF??

Btw, thanks a bunch.

 

[thebluedeath1000]

lvl 1s are the best for practice as the only thing cpus are good for is combos...maybe practicing on disrupting a certain recovery but nothing more.

 

[Salaad]

Should I be Shffling a lot of Nairs and Fairs?

Is Uair useful?

My main problem is finishing the opponent off. (People always call me "cheap" for Fsmashing them to oblivion xD)