Marth Counters?

[Virgilijus]

I'm inclined to agree with you on this one, although I am a bit unsure. Falco has his SHL, spike, mobility, and pillaring capabilities while Marth has his chain grab, reach, and edgeguarding (combined with Falco's horrible recovery). While I don't know for certain which one has the definite advantage, my opinion is that Falco still has the upper hand.

 

[Mr.C]

marth does not counter doc, actually it is a very very close match.

Falco does not have horrible recovery.

if anything Marths recovery is 10000x worst then falcos considering u can hit him with about anything while hes in the air not to mention the shield edgeguard trick vs marth

 

[MVPaintballer]

Marth can cg on one stage... FD

to bad fox , falco and sheik also **** FD =(
to bad for marth
idk marth is very simple for me to beat

bc u play marth and those matches are like 1 minute long?

 

[TomH]

ok, the top 5 are Fox, Falco, Marth, Shiek, and Peach. Almost all the pros play these characters. If Marth had a disadvantage against Shiek, Fox, and Falco, which make up about 80% of the tournament scene, then probably much less people would play marth. So i feel that Marth must have an advantage against at least one of them.

From what i can tell after reading the fox/falco/shiek/marth forums...

Shiek has a relatively large advantage. Obviously beatable, but the advantage is there.

Fox has a disadvantage. http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=58719 According to lots of Foxes, Marth has an advantage on FD, and they are about equal everywhere else, which overall gives marth an advantage.

And Falco SHL = disadvantage, but once the horrible approach is over, you can do pretty well against him.

Therefore i say Shiek = semi counter. Falco = you have a small disadvantage. Fox isnt a counter, in fact you have an advantage.

Ive done a decent amount of studying because i was looking for a good Fox counter because i dont like Jigglypuff vs Fox matchup. Marth and falco were both viable, but i dont like falco very much :-P

 

[Virgilijus]

Falco does not have horrible recovery.

He gets very little distance, the start up time helps the opponent prepare and his side b can be easily defended (especially with Marth) and predicted. Being a fast faller doesn't help either.

I'm not saying Marth's is great, but Falco's is pretty abismal.

 

[Deleted member]

for fox and falco l cansel shine marth cant grab and when you sheild dope ***** it and breaks it but thats only an exeptional falco

I didn't say shieldgrab. I said grab.

i disagree. If Marth is such a godlike character that there are only 2 characters that go EVEN with him, and he beats everyone else, then why is he not in the top tier?

cause the tier list is wack. 3 of the top 8 MLG players use marth, and the only lose to KDJ's sheik, each other, or PC's Falco. Which is exactly what I said anyway, sheik falco marth. fox falco sheik and marth should be top tier, they clearly outclass the rest of the cast badly.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

I didn't say shieldgrab. I said grab.



cause the tier list is wack. 3 of the top 8 MLG players use marth, and the only lose to KDJ's sheik, each other, or PC's Falco. Which is exactly what I said anyway, sheik falco marth. fox falco sheik and marth should be top tier, they clearly outclass the rest of the cast badly.

i agree lol. i guess since ur a better player than me ill give u the credit on the other characters, but i wont back down from saying falco has some sort of advantage over marth (even if its very slight).

 

[StripesOrBars]

marth has no real counters, period.

sheik does well against marth, about as well as fox or falco. these matchups aren't "counters" though, they just happen to be the only matchups that marth isn't at an incredible advantage. marth players aren't used to that.

This is funny coming from a shiek player.

Shiek is at an advantage vs Marth.

Fox and Marth are even.

Falco is at a slight disadvantage vs Marth.

Shiek has no real counters if Marth has no "real" counters.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Shiek is at an advantage vs Marth.

Fox and Marth are even.

Falco is at a slight disadvantage vs Marth.

where do u get that marth > falco? i could see your opinion on the other 2 but not that one...

 

[SynikaL]

I still think Falco and Marth is even, but I've been away from the current metagame for a while.

Ken is starting to shake my confidence in the Marth vs. Sheik matchup. I used to consider it a lot closer than most people gave Marth credit for, but watching Isai and KDJ beat up on Ken repeatedly has been scaring me. This is one matchup I'm going to be spending a lot of time with when I come back to this game.


I think Ken's overtly aggressive style might be catalyzing his failures in that matchup.


-Syn

 

[StripesOrBars]

Marth can kill Falco at like 40%. Only C fal can kill Falco easier.

The Marth Falco math is very close. But Marth is sightly better because of gayness.

 

[King Kong]

<3

Donkey Kong is said to be even with Marth. I'm not completely sure why...NEO said DK vs Marth is even, and me and Mew2King thought it was a joke. After M2K faced Captain Jack, he told me that NEO is right. Bum (an amazing DK player, one of the best if you didn't know) has shown me some nice DK vs Marth strats. I'm not completely convinced that DK does well, but I'm just sticking it out there.

.

Yeah, AOB has always said that DK is good vs Marth as well.

The solution to Sheik for all you Marth players is to buy PAL version. Buy it and watch Sheik move like 4 rungs lower in the tier list.

peace out

 

[Nike]

The Marth Falco math is very close. But Marth is sightly better because of gayness.

quoted for truth.

 

[Tian]

Falco, Ganondorf.

Peach and Kirby are also somewhat easier for me.

 

[NJzFinest]

???

Marth> Peach and Ganondorf

I'm not sure why you mentioned Kirby....Kirby is one of the worst characters in the game.... Marth's sword is longer than his body.

Welcome to SmashBoards lol

 

[Tian]

???

Marth> Peach and Ganondorf

I'm not sure why you mentioned Kirby....Kirby is one of the worst characters in the game.... Marth's sword is longer than his body.

Welcome to SmashBoards lol

For me, Peach and Ganon are better.
I don't know why wither, i probabaly meant Fox or something...

Thanks.

 

[StripesOrBars]

....Kirby is one of the worst characters in the game....

No, Kirby IS the worst character in the game.

 

[NJzFinest]

lol my bad.

 

[SynikaL]

Marth can kill Falco at like 40%. Only C fal can kill Falco easier.

Yes, Marth gets low percentage kills on everyone, that's what makes him good. What's your point? Part of fighting an experienced high level Marth is being experienced yourself enough to know how to avoid those gay deaths.

The Marth Falco math is very close.

You mean like, Marth + Falco = Even?

But Marth is sightly better because of gayness.

Your argument is slightly credible because of bias.


-Kimo
(I want my rematch at the Vortex this week Pete. 5 bux)

 

[Mr.C]

kkk is prolly the best kirby in the nation

and he says marth is pretty even match vs kirby lol

u have to see the **** kirb does to marth inorder to understand this lol

 

[The Black Cat]

Ok I main Marth and the toughest matches I've had are against Falco. His SHL kill Marth, and if the Falco definitely knows what they're doing in close-quaters, I'd place all bets on Falco. A friend of mine mains Falco, and I always used to beat him. He got SHL down and it became very difficult but I still usually beat him. He starts to use his shine and Dair in close quaters its about 50/50. Then when he practiced at home, he'd only fight Marth PC's, so at this point going against him with Marth is suicide. Also the first person I ever fought at my first tournament (Viperboy) Pillered me from 0% to a kill twice I think.
But I've heard from just about every pro Marth or Sheik player that Sheik counters Marth bad. Once out of curiosity I actualy played against my little sister who on previous ocasions always picked Zelda/Sheik. I told to to stay as Sheik the entire match and well...it was far more difficult then it should've been. Of course I still one by a large margin, but normally I'd take only 1 or 2 hits against her. It's sheiks Fair, her set-up throws. But the thing that suprised me the most was the length of her tilts. Aparently Marth doesn't do too great against a tilt-spamming Sheik.
Also these comments about C.Falcon I'm not to sure about. I fought 1 before. He tended to spam his Dairs and he didn't really have an upperhand as I recall.

 

[uremog]

playing gay falcos who camp the sides of FD with shl waiting for you to come to them is the worst.

i think falco can be as bad as shiek. they both just can suck really bad to face. i mean, it's like the king of free and/or easy combos vs camping king.

 

[StripesOrBars]

Marth beats Falco like Fox beats Shiek.

 

[Mew2King]

Fox doesn't beat Sheik that's a myth, it's dead exactly even. Marth vs Falco is also even. Trust me I know what I'm talking about.

 

[Mr.C]

i also know how easy it is to laser spam sheik

dair shineshineshine grab upthrow uair and kill sheik at 90%

LOL

 

[Deleted member]

it's hard as hell to laser spam sheik. sheik has an amazing pressure game, as well as range and crouching ability to mess with you.

also, why you you upthrow upair when you can upsmash instead and kill lower and more reliably?

You don't know what you're talking about.

stripesorbars was being sarcastic.

 

[SynikaL]

stripesorbars was being sarcastic.

I doubt it.


-Kimo

 

[StripesOrBars]

I know Fox doesn't beat Shiek. That's why I said the Falco Marth thing.

 

[Mr.C]

fox > sheik

no jons

 

[StripesOrBars]

Fox beats shiek ever so slighty, if that.

 

[flaco]

Well use these has a preference
Top Tier:
Fox
Falco

High Tier:
Sheik
Marth
Peach

Middle Tier:
Captain Falcon
Ice Climbers
Samus
Doctor Mario
Jigglypuff
Mario
Ganondorf

Low Tier:
Link
Luigi
Donkey Kong
Roy
Young Link
Pikachu

Bottom Tier:
Yoshi
Zelda
Mr. Game and Watch
Ness
Bowser
Kirby
Pichu
Mewtwo

 

[Deleted member]

fox > sheik

no jons

you think fox beats everyone. maybe you just suck vs fox, he's incredibly easy to ****.

 

[StripesOrBars]

Marth owns Fox.

 

[ToP CaT]

true dat, my shiek rapzors fox

 

[Tope]

Remember kids.

Mr. C and DooDah only know what they are talking about on Sunday.

Mow knows what he's talking about only on Wednesday and Friday.

Mew2King knows what he's talking about the other days of the week.


Use this guide to help decide who to listen to.

 

[StripesOrBars]

I wanted Friday. . .

 

[Tope]

No Jones son!

 

[AS Money]

man i wish i knew what i was talking about

and there is no answer to this thread cuz there are no counters to marth(which has been said over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again i know)
for marth there is nothing like for lets say peach if a fox runs and lazor spams right there is nothing a peach can do. marth has nothing like that in his matchups no counters there

 

[Amon Yakamoto]

Marth really doesn't have a counter but has a little difficulty with longe-range fighters. Marth doesn't have much a defense against long-range, but thats bout it. so, I would say.....well, he just don't have a counter.

 

[StripesOrBars]

man i wish i knew what i was talking about

and there is no answer to this thread cuz there are no counters to marth(which has been said over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again i know)
for marth there is nothing like for lets say peach if a fox runs and lazor spams right there is nothing a peach can do. marth has nothing like that in his matchups no counters there

You're an AS$.