Majoras Mask Mafia! DGames' Longest Game Ends - Who Won?!?!?!?

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

RR thoughts on Werekill's #324?

I commented on that early in the game I think.

Still OMGUS in my mind at the moment.

Dabuz is not the abductor unless he is immune to night actions. I jailed him N1.

I derped on that part, if your town Dabuz is most likely.

Oh yeah I forgot that's true. He couldn't have poisoned Solid or done jack **** for that matter.

He's clear assuming Inferno is telling the truth.

My thoughts exactly.

I don't see Circus town from his interaction with spellcasters, nor do I see it in his interaction with Frio. Can you explain how you came to this conclusion because I'm having a hard time seeing it from the perspective of your day gambit. I'm also curious who you perceived was "setting up" you up for a lynch, if I interpreted that sentence correctly.

Not setting me up for a lynch, rather setting up my reads for whim I thought were town/scum.

Circus town came from his responses to my gambit.

>> AA VV

<3

 

[Inferno3044]

@Everyone: Compare the Nabe and Acrostic lynches. Who clears more people? Who is scummier? Ect. Basically, explain your reasoning over which lynch you think is best.


I want to see Nabe lynch because his role doesn't sound right to me.

I know I said this but acro's slip is more scummy to me, but nabe's lynch will give us much more information. Nabe scum = WK town = T-block scum. Nabe town = circus town + RR town. So either we clear one person and nail another or we clear two people. Sounds good imo.

 

[Circus]

I think I like Nabe better than Acrostic, but I don't mind lynching Nabe for the insurance money information. But there's gotta be a scummie amongst those VTs, and Acrostic's looking most likely in that department, to me.

I don't see why we're having Raziek play a song at all. Does anyone really doubt his claim?

 

[X1-12]

You hear the sound of pipes playing and strange feeling rushes over you.... It feels like something is affecting the flow of time??

The deadline is changed to 8AM GMT on 2nd November!

 

[X1-12]

Votecount 3.4 - [5/9] - Deadline 2nd November @ 8AM GMT

Raziek [0]
th3kuzinator [2] - MOD, MOD
Red Ryu [0]
dabuz [0]
Nabe [3] - Werekill, kuz, Raziek
Circus [0]
Werekill [0]
Acrostic [0]
Inferno3044 [0]

Not Voting [6] - Circus, Acrostic, Inferno, RR, Nabe, dabuz

 

[Dabuz]

@Circus: If he can prove his claim by playing a song, thats awesome for us.

 

[Raziek]

You hear the sound of pipes playing and strange feeling rushes over you.... It feels like something is affecting the flow of time??

The deadline is changed to 8AM GMT on 2nd November!

And there it is.

Dabuz, I already made my thoughts on the lynch clear, as should be obvious by my vote.

 

[Dabuz]

I skimmed over that, cool, Raziek role claim is true.

 

[Inferno3044]

Should I put nabe at L-1?

 

[Lore]

This post doesn't rub me the right way. How would this not confirm raziek as town? It would say something about deku pipes and the song of double time. No other character has anything to do with the song of double time and I would be very surprised if link was scum.

Scum can have cool pr's too, and if you're making scum judgements based on pure flavor, you're being silly.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

It's very clear I'm being lynched toDay.

It's very clear that people aren't going to be held accountable for their reasoning after that lynch, since everybody except Werekill is saying they want me dead for information.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Vote: th3kuzinator

 

[Inferno3044]

@WK-he just proved his role and race. If you wanna go into flavor he technically proved his name. I don't see him getting lynched right now.

@nabe-why aree you voting kuz?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

If I were in your shoes, I would be grilling Werekill for a town/scum read if I felt uneasy regarding her alignment. On a town read you have mafia narrowed down to me, th3kuzinator, Raziek, and Inferno. You have implied that you find me scummier over Inferno. Therefore I would suspect that your natural inclination would be to fos me, unless you personally find th3kuzinator or Raziek to be more suspicious which you haven't given indication of yet from what I have perceived. Therefore you either doubt Werekill's cop claim, doubt Werekill's reports, or there are extraneous factors that I haven't accounted for in terms of you working out the logic behind the information you have to work with so far.

Is this directed at me?

I do find you scummier than Inferno. Inferno could be scum, my reads are off this game (Circus, Solid, Kantrip). Jailer fits too well with my role -- I could claim hider, claim my targets every Day, and his role could jail my targets, keeping them safe while still allowing me to target them (since his jail only blocks kills). That's broken, and isn't congruent with my role. But his play strongly suggests town, and maybe mafia can offset a jailkeeper via a strongman or something else. You also have to take lovers into account in the balance of these, so overall it's tenuous.


I've said throughout the game that Raziek is scum, and I'd caution people to ignore flavour in this case where it seems to be becoming a strong factor instead, i.e. Link can be scum. What we know of the scumteam so far is that it had Jim in it -- thus there's no reason to exclude Link. We've also only seen him as a Deku now, with no confirmation that he can actually shift races, which regardless is an ability with dubious gain for town. I don't have room to consider him at this juncture with other people on the table, but eyes need to be on him for subsequent Days.

Kuz needs to get his *** in gear and actually play the game. He's currently playing the same role that OS did, the absentee advisor, but he's not as good at it and it shows. And (here's the important part) what's showing looks scummy -- he appears to be maneuvering around the thought processes of the game, where OS simply looked innocuous.


Why do you bring up Werekill? He claimed mafia on T-block (a player I thought and think to be mafia) and not-mafia on dabuz (a player I think is town), so the reports seem entirely legitimate. What's sketchy about Werekill is whether he's actually a cop.

As I've said previously, cop/hider can coexist, but Werekill's reports are dubious. Why did he cop dabuz? I don't recall any scumread from WK in that direction. Same goes with T-block, and then I also have to remember how nasty his interactions with Xastrn were. There's a strong possibility that he called me on my cop claim D1 because he was scum looking for something to rail on, and then took that and ran with it D2 when partner T-block was out of the picture and he needed to strengthen his town holdings.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

@nabe-why aree you voting kuz?

At this point it's clear I'm being lynched, and I want to make sure people see my suspicions and don't ignore them (like half my posts toDay which have been ignored). Hence the vote, and it ties in with my 2934 in that both are my important posts for the Day.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Here's what happens. I get lynched today, I flip town. People go "oh man WK must be scum" and lynch him. If WK flips town, that's two free Days of MLs.

Everybody is citing "information" as their reasoning for my lynch, but the opposite is the case. Without people basing my lynch on reads, we have nothing to work with the following Day, and town has to be content with continuing what's potentially a chain of setup-based mislynches. Regardless of WK's alignment, this is going to be town's ruin, because we have one mafo and the abductor left and we're making uninformed setup lynches.

I've cited reasons above why my scumreads are scummy. I've cited reasons prior why Acrostic is scummy as well, but people are sticking to the "scumslip" idea when it absolutely wasn't a scumslip -- Raziek still hasn't acknowledged this.

Raz is a player who I've cited as scummy, and the reason for that is a combination of these factors and his play throughout the game.

- He started us on the road of listing scumpicks, which leads to the ML-chain I mentioned above
- He's been the driving force behind the scumslip thing and setup-based lynches

This could be opportunism on his part, because he's only fostering the environment that was created when we massclaimed. But this is why I'm wary of Raz, and why other people should have their eyes on him, later. Not toDay, but later when people can actually prove he's done something (if there's something to prove and I'm not blowing wind).

ToDay should see a lynch of Kuz, or Acrostic, or Werekill. That's not going to happen -- instead it'll be the ML chain, as I've said. But later, I want to be able to say I told you so.


I've left questions for everyone to respond to. At the very least, people need to specify their reasoning for suspicion of Acrostic before the end of the Day, and if that reasoning is the "scumslip", (this is important) they need to then counter my reasoning as to why it wasn't a scumslip, the reasoning that 99% of people would've assumed indy poisoner and called poisoner indy as a result.

 

[Dabuz]

Well, I remember expressing suspicion on J before he replaced out, ill do a read on Acrostic when I get the chance, because ignoring setup speculation, J's slot still doesn't sit well with me.

 

[Dabuz]

BTW, now that Raziek has confirmed PR, I am wondering why the song of double time is included, because cutting a Day in half is generally the worst thing for town.

 

[Dabuz]

@Raziek: Just to make sure, you have a song that doubles a Day's length, correct?

 

[Inferno3044]

First of all, I never said nabe town = werekill scum.

Second, what would a kuz, acro, or WK lynch do for us? They don't lead us anywhere. Acro is a lynch I would go with because I think he is scum. Kuz I doubt will happen today (although the question I addressed to him I want answered) and im on the fence on WK atm.

Third anything that happens to your target happens to you right? That would mean if I jailed your target you would also get my protect and would live regardless.

Fourth, if you said the ML chain will come from you getting ML'd followed by WK getting ML'd then why should we lynch WK today? According to your logic its gonna be a ML.

 

[Lore]

Everyone, wait to hammer until tomorrow. I'd rather spend some more time talking before the flip, and I can't type up a decently longer post at the moment.

 

[Raziek]

Double Time adds 48 hours, doesn't double it.

 

[Raziek]

I've cited reasons above why my scumreads are scummy. I've cited reasons prior why Acrostic is scummy as well, but people are sticking to the "scumslip" idea when it absolutely wasn't a scumslip -- Raziek still hasn't acknowledged this.

What exactly is the purpose of me acknowledging this? I understand people are going to cling to an easy reason to lynch someone, but that's why I find Acrostic scummy. Further, why does this even matter if he's not the one getting lynched today? Most people have been fairly clear about why they want YOU lynched.

Raz is a player who I've cited as scummy, and the reason for that is a combination of these factors and his play throughout the game.

- He started us on the road of listing scumpicks, which leads to the ML-chain I mentioned above

Because nobody else could have done that. I'm preventing us from having to scramble for a lynch towards the deadline with no clear idea of where the Town stood other than "Lynch Acrostic".

On top of that, listing the scumpicks did not even lead to a ML-chain. Contrasting claims is what could foster that, and if the lists actually MATTERED, Acrostic would be getting lynched. But it's YOU who's getting lynched. Why? Discussion. Support. Dubious claim. My list has nothing to do with your lynch, and you know it.

- He's been the driving force behind the scumslip thing and setup-based lynches

WHAT? Of course of the driving force on that, but that's because I'm the one who spotted it! And again, as I already mentioned, it's not relevant, because ACROSTIC ISN'T TODAY'S LYNCH.

Further, how am I the driving force between setup-based lynches? You're the one insisting everyone looks at your setup analysis and that we decide based on that. You're the one trying to AVOID your lynch by using your speculation to suggest that your role fits perfectly.

How exactly am I pushing a setup lynch? And LYNCHES? PLURAL? What other lynches?

This could be opportunism on his part, because he's only fostering the environment that was created when we massclaimed. But this is why I'm wary of Raz, and why other people should have their eyes on him, later. Not toDay, but later when people can actually prove he's done something (if there's something to prove and I'm not blowing wind).

Nabe, you have been blowing smoke. All game. Not once have you actually SUPPORTED a scumread on me besides now. You've just been saying "Raz is scum. It's k, you're scum." all game. If I am scum, and you're so sure, why didn't you just hide behind me and then Town would know! All you would have had to do was claim Day 2, say you're hiding behind me, and go from there. You've been constantly going on about how your role gets more dangerous as the game goes on, so why did you wait until now to express suspicion on me? Why did you hide behind Red Ryu instead of me?

Because you're not sure. You don't have anything. Instead you opted for a potential clear on someone who's barely here 90% of the time. Doesn't make sense.

ToDay should see a lynch of Kuz, or Acrostic, or Werekill. That's not going to happen -- instead it'll be the ML chain, as I've said. But later, I want to be able to say I told you so.


I've left questions for everyone to respond to. At the very least, people need to specify their reasoning for suspicion of Acrostic before the end of the Day, and if that reasoning is the "scumslip", (this is important) they need to then counter my reasoning as to why it wasn't a scumslip, the reasoning that 99% of people would've assumed indy poisoner and called poisoner indy as a result.

Again, why is this relevant? Do you assume Acrostic will be lynched tomorrow? I would imagine Night Actions will have plenty to do with what happens, given that we have a claimed cop and a claimed JK.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Werekill is my strongest town read at the moment given reactions to Nabe's cop claim in posts #324, #684, #715, #752, #757, #758, and #811 which fit into perspective given the fact that she was likely convicted that Nabe was scum due to the role claim. I do understand that scum can prepare in advance, but I do not think that Werekill would bluff that hard given circumstances.

Circus|Nabe are on my ISO list when I finish reading due to the fact that I didn't have time to go over most of Circus's defense. At the moment I'm inclined to think he is town due to the fact that Xastrn jumped on his wagon in what seemed to be self-preservation. Nabe on the other hand is difficult to read as Raziek stated due to him not being particularly scummy from what I can discern from D1. However I'm not sure if the questions he asked were actually beneficially towards him getting reads and scumhunting. Frio's slot didn't do much D1, so I don't have any opinions at the moment with regards to Inferno.

I would appreciate suspension of hammer mostly for me to finish reading and to confirm some mechanics such as how importance name/race play a part in the game as we have encountered two roles that mention they have importance i.e. Xastrn's claim and Circus's claim which were both presented during D1.

I'm still re-reading.

Don't put Nabe at L-1.
Don't put Nabe at L-1.
Don't put Nabe at L-1.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Actually no. My thought process is different from Raziek's. Scratch that.

 

[Raziek]

It should go without saying, but the reason none of what Nabe's saying makes any sense is because he's scum.

 

[th3kuzinator]

Raziek, calm down. Nabe is throwing out a last ditch effort of apathy before getting the hammer. Just let him go down swinging.

 

[Raziek]

*grumble grumble calculus midterm grumble nabe grumble*

 

[Inferno3044]

Acro catch up faster

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

First of all, I never said nabe town = werekill scum.

Second, what would a kuz, acro, or WK lynch do for us? They don't lead us anywhere. Acro is a lynch I would go with because I think he is scum. Kuz I doubt will happen today (although the question I addressed to him I want answered) and im on the fence on WK atm.

The idea is that I think they're scummy i.e. they'll flip scum. I'm sure you're not suggesting that lynching scum isn't a benefit.

Third anything that happens to your target happens to you right? That would mean if I jailed your target you would also get my protect and would live regardless.

No, only kills and abducts channel from my target to me.

Fourth, if you said the ML chain will come from you getting ML'd followed by WK getting ML'd then why should we lynch WK today? According to your logic its gonna be a ML.

I said "if WK is town" it's an ML. I don't think he is, as I've made explicitly clear via my reasoning for him being scum. If he's scum, then that means scum can't push through a lynch on him after mine, since he's not going to lynch himself.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Rather than openly antagonizing me, you could consider responding to my posts instead. There's no need to be a **** about it.

 

[th3kuzinator]

I'm only the absentee adviser so I don't really have much say in the matter. Apparently I can't even do that much right/

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

What exactly is the purpose of me acknowledging this? I understand people are going to cling to an easy reason to lynch someone, but that's why I find Acrostic scummy. Further, why does this even matter if he's not the one getting lynched today? Most people have been fairly clear about why they want YOU lynched.

So what you're telling me is that you're not responsible for countering my reasoning as to why it wasn't a scumslip, and that you're planning to ignore me until I go away.

As Raziek has made clear, I'm going to be lynched toDay. When I'm dead, I encourage people to give my arguments a little more thought, since apparently they aren't worth it while I'm alive.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I'm only the absentee adviser so I don't really have much say in the matter. Apparently I can't even do that much right/

You read my post! I'm flattered. But where you're feigning that I was somehow antagonizing you, I wasn't. So I'm asking you for a response to me, please and thanks.

 

[th3kuzinator]

Only the best for you.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I'm also asking you to hold yourself accountable for your statement that you'd be posting about reads rather than setup, and I'd be tickled pink if you could do that prior to Day's end. Again, assuming you're not too busy posting backhanded comments.

 

[th3kuzinator]

Posting backhand comments is a time consuming process.

You have to formulate and type them.

Fact of the matter is I'm feeling really unmotivated to read this entire thread which is 74 pages long, especially during the weekend. I'll try to get as much done as possible I suppose.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Your previous posts suggest that you've already read a significant portion of the thread, both in your words and your actions. You can't have any more than D2 left to read, right?

 

[Inferno3044]

Replies are in red

The idea is that I think they're scummy i.e. they'll flip scum. I'm sure you're not suggesting that lynching scum isn't a benefit.

I figured that, but personally I don't see them as very scummy so I don't see a reason to vote them. It really sounds like you just want to get heat off of you.

I said "if WK is town" it's an ML. I don't think he is, as I've made explicitly clear via my reasoning for him being scum. If he's scum, then that means scum can't push through a lynch on him after mine, since he's not going to lynch himself.

That completely defies your point of a ML chain. According to you we are gonna ML you and end up lynch scum WK. That's not a ML chain. Even if you do flip town and he flips scum, we get circus and RR cleared.

Also I wouldn't support your lynch if I didn't think you will flip scum.

 

[Inferno3044]

Basically nabe I think you are a combination of scummy and giving the most results. I remember OS saying that you have to make plays that will lead to later plays. If there is someone who is scummier than you and what their flip would conclude please speak up.