Majoras Mask Mafia! DGames' Longest Game Ends - Who Won?!?!?!?

[Circus]

Fire Emblem mafia had an Indy motivator with being an Abductor. Like not trying to add WIFOM but it;s possible, though Xiivi is super creative and super unpredictable with set-ups. I;ve only played Melee mafia with X1 as the host.

Having not read the game, I don't know how well that worked out, but, as much as I love Xiivi, my understanding is that Fire Emblem was as unbalanced as Mariah Carey. An Independent Motivator makes no sense. What incentive would an Indie Motivator have to motivate anyone?

 

[Raziek]

Player - Will Lynch

Raziek - Acrostic, Inferno, Nabe, Werekill
Circus - Acrostic, Inferno, Dabuz, Werekill
Red Ryu - Acrostic, Inferno, possibly Werekill
Dabuz - Acrostic, Inferno, Nabe

Pool: Acrostic, Nabe, Werekill

Player - Will Lynch

Raziek - Acrostic, Inferno, Nabe, Werekill
Circus - Acrostic, Inferno, Dabuz, Werekill
Red Ryu - Acrostic, Inferno, possibly Werekill
Dabuz - Acrostic, Inferno, Nabe
Inferno - Acrostic, Nabe, Werekill

This, my friends, is what we call progress. GETTING. THINGS. DONE.

 

[Inferno3044]

Raziek definitely isn't playing the same as MMX mafia, but I like it.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Nabe, if you were to hide behind an independent player, would you die? If you don't know, will you ask X1?

He was very specific. If I hid behind a killing indy i.e. SK I'd die, but I don't die behind non-killing indies. The description of my role implies that I get abducted if my target gets abducted, looking at it, because it talks about removal from game rather than specifying death.

Nabe, I read your stuff. What exactly are you looking for in return? I think pretty much all of what you posted about "town points" and "counterweights" is well and good but hard to apply to the situation since we don't know how X1 thinks. We don't know what his idea of balance is (or at least, I don't), so it's hard to try and judge the set-up based on what you're saying.

I want people to take stances on the things I'm saying, so that later they've made a statement and can't just say "I missed it" when asked about my posts.

How about just telling us what conclusions you're coming to. Do you believe Werekill's claim? Do you think your role and his can happily co-exist? Who's your least favorite VT? Who are you thinking of lynching toDay?

I commented on this earlier after you had posted about it. I think a lot of the things you're saying seem valid, but WK's play seems town. I think there's room for both roles to exist and I laid that out in my analysis. The least credible VT is Kuz by claim but dabuz by play. I'd lynch Acrostic, WK or Raz.

I'm irked by the idea WK puts forth about a mafia motivator, because no one else has claimed motivator, meaning the issue falls to whether or not T-block was town. But a mafia motivator doesn't imply that you're mafia, and of course I know you're not. As I've said, the census doesn't seem to inconvenience the mafia, assuming they have a same-race fakeclaim. Maybe they wanted to fill out their information on the other races to know the playing field. They couldn't have known at the time that there was an abductor (unless they have mod info) so I doubt that factored into it. At any rate, I think the idea of a mafia motivator is credible, and it doesn't necessarily have to be T-block either.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

People need to talk more about their specific reasoning for having Acrostic in their pool.

 

[Raziek]

***** claimed scum, son. And then claimed VT. And then scumslip. And then... yeah.

Player - Will Lynch

Raziek - Acrostic, Inferno, Nabe, Werekill
Circus - Acrostic, Inferno, Dabuz, Werekill
Red Ryu - Acrostic, Inferno, possibly Werekill
Dabuz - Acrostic, Inferno, Nabe
Inferno - Acrostic, Nabe, Werekill
Nabe - Acrostic, Werekill, Raziek

 

[Raziek]

Nabe, might I inquire as to specifically why Inferno is not in your lynch pool?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

You were serious about the scumslip, then?

As I've said in like 5 different posts within the last 24 hours, I think he's town.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I also remarked on how lynching a jailer claim is stupid.

 

[Raziek]

Yes, I was serious about the scumslip. Slipping Indy vs. Mafia is why Laundry lost Gurren Lagann.

And why is Jailer not lynchable? Even if it's TRUE, Ragnarok Mafia had a mafia Jailer (Thanks S2 <3)

 

[Inferno3044]

Now we just gotta wait on WK, Acro, and Kuz for results.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Please don't make me say again how no one reads what I post.

 

[Raziek]

I read it. I'm not convinced that Inferno is Town just because his claimed role seems to make sense from a balance perspective. >_>

 

[Inferno3044]

Nabe a lot of your stuff to me seemed really flavor based and I don't really see how much useful content we can really get out of it.

 

[Raziek]

Acrostic, post your lynch pool. I know you're here.

 

[Lore]

A few questions before bed.

@Circus: When exactly did you see my cop signal? The first time I pointed it to you?

@Nabe: Why is a mafia motivator not a reason to believe that Circus could be scum? I'm honestly asking since I can't think of a situation where it wouldn't. Also, who else could be motivator other than T-Block?

Also, general thoughts: We have a jailer, correct? I haven't heard anyone say that they were roleblocked other than the jailed ones (who were VT and dead, so they can't say so), so it is safe to assume that we do not have two roleblockers, correct?

With this information in mind, it's easy to see how a scum motivator would not unbalance the game. With relatively weaker roles like Hobo or a census taker or anything like that, scum would gain information and not completely unbalance the game. The hobo potentially learns roles, and the census gives more possibilities for role claims/ lying about the census to trick people (which is not the case here, I think, since mass claim messed that up).

So yeah, I think that Circus's role fits perfectly into a motivator set up.

Another thing to think on: the two main lynch candidates, Circus and Xastrn, on D1 were both investigatives. If one of them died, the other would still be able to do investigations, and since that person claimed, he would maybe draw doc protection.

Now with that in mind, let's look at Circus. He was the lynch candidate who was pushed by Xastrn (bus both ways), he was never targeted at night for NK (provable by looking at Inferno's results and NK results), and he was the first person motivated (potentially to get scum early info, and then the plan was to do WIFOM shenanigans with townies being motivated). For some reason, all of these things together make me suspicious, especially with the scum motivator.

 

[Raziek]

Werekill, lynch pool. In format.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Nabe at the moment. I don't have two other picks.

 

[Lore]

Oh, **** that. It's too early for lynch pool, but whatever. I might edit this in the morning after sleep (hence the **** that; I'm tired).

I wouldn't mind lynching Circus, Acrostic, Raziek, Dabuz in that order with there being a drop off after acrostic.

Considering the lack of roleblocks, I'm liking Inferno more.

 

[Lore]

Also, I love how all I posted got ignored because Razzy wanted a lynch pool. Bloodthirsty, much?

Acrostic, what do you think about Circus scum via mafia motivator?

 

[Raziek]

Nabe at the moment. I don't have two other picks.

Oh, **** that. It's too early for lynch pool, but whatever. I might edit this in the morning after sleep (hence the **** that; I'm tired).

I wouldn't mind lynching Circus, Acrostic, Raziek, Dabuz in that order with there being a drop off after acrostic.

Considering the lack of roleblocks, I'm liking Inferno more.

Player - Will Lynch

Raziek - Acrostic, Inferno, Nabe, Werekill
Circus - Acrostic, Inferno, Dabuz, Werekill
Red Ryu - Acrostic, Inferno, possibly Werekill
Dabuz - Acrostic, Inferno, Nabe
Inferno - Acrostic, Nabe, Werekill
Acrostic - Nabe
Werekill - Circus, Acrostic, Raziek, Dabuz

Just Kuz left.

 

[Inferno3044]

You didn't post Nabe's choices.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

I read it. I'm not convinced that Inferno is Town just because his claimed role seems to make sense from a balance perspective. >_>

I know you read my analysis, which happens to not be what I'm talking about at all. I said I made like 5 posts on the subject and I mean it. I'll quote it for you, don't bother doing footwork.

I am really, really surprised that you think that was a legitimate scumslip and I'll post on that as well.

Nabe a lot of your stuff to me seemed really flavor based and I don't really see how much useful content we can really get out of it.

I want people to take stances on it. I just said this to Circus.

 

[Lore]

A small question. What happened to finding scum THEN poisoner? I distinctly remember someone saying to do that, so why are we thinking of lynching Acrostic for a joke claim of poisoner?

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

As I stated before, you're seriously reaching if you're substantiating a scum read on me based on meta from another game. The last time I remember someone doing this to me was JTB in FF IX mafia who was trying to justify his scum read based on something that happened in Dissidia.

 

[Raziek]

Werekill, I'm choosing not to respond to what you have to say about Circus because I feel you're reaching so far up your *** that you might come out the other side.

Raziek - Acrostic, Inferno, Nabe, Werekill
Circus - Acrostic, Inferno, Dabuz, Werekill
Red Ryu - Acrostic, Inferno, possibly Werekill
Dabuz - Acrostic, Inferno, Nabe
Inferno - Acrostic, Nabe, Werekill
Nabe - Acrostic, Werekill, Raziek
Acrostic - Nabe
Werekill - Circus, Acrostic, Raziek, Dabuz

Thanks for the correction, Inferno.

Nabe, do you have any idea how goddamn vague "stances" is?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

@Nabe: Why is a mafia motivator not a reason to believe that Circus could be scum? I'm honestly asking since I can't think of a situation where it wouldn't. Also, who else could be motivator other than T-Block?

I just named a situation where it wouldn't, in the post I'm assuming you're responding to. It's the situation where the mafia felt they had something to gain by motivating Circus' role, and I laid out a potential gain as well.

The motivator could be anyone other than T-block, who simply hasn't motivated since N1.

 

[Lore]

Oh **** this, I need sleep, but sleep is for the weak.

I'm against the Acrostic lynch as the play for toDay. We all wanted to find scum first, right? Let's get to that instead of basing a lynch on a single line from J.

Acrostic, opinion on Circus based on motivator? I REALLY feel that I'm on the right track here.

 

[Raziek]

How can you say "lynch scum first, indy second", when the indy is a killing role? I don't understand how you could feasibly pass up something directly in front of you.

How can Circus be scum when Nabe hid behind him and is still alive? Hostile Indy or Mafia would get him killed, so Circus being mafia makes no sense.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

Nabe, do you have any idea how goddamn vague "stances" is?

I want to punch you in the face, oh man.

I would like people to comment on my analysis in general, as there are a lot of polarizing things in there. Each of these specific things could merit a stance for future reference -- naturally I don't know if that's going to be useful, but as I already said, I'm forestalling the future situation where someone says "oh, I just didn't read Nabe's post" when questioned it w.r.t. their motivations in taking some action, citing the idea that my posts were in collapse tags and they missed them, or saying that they didn't agree with Point A that I said and that there's no record of them saying they agreed -- because there is no record since no one forced them to say anything ever and they were free to sit on their *** and fake content.

By getting responses from people in the present, I also get confirmation that people are playing the same game I am and not playing around me, meaning I can continue to post without having to later clarify and requote posts that people somehow missed, like the Jpoisoner post or multiple posts by me saying the same thing. Case and point, you and me right now, mis-communicating because you think you've understood my posts.

 

[Lore]

Werekill, I'm choosing not to respond to what you have to say about Circus because I feel you're reaching so far up your *** that you might come out the other side.

So you see no validity to any of my arguments? I claimed guilty on the person most likely to be motivator, and you think that I have my head up my ***. That's preeeetty logical there, Razzy.

I'm loving the fact that I'm being judged by another player's actions in a completely different game from this.

@Nabe: Ah, I see it now. I misread, sorry.

However, who in their right mind would not motivate? If anything else, motivating Circus again would give at least some info. I just don't see not motivating as a possibility.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

People aside from Raziek need to talk about the reasoning for their suspicion of Acrostic -- listing names is all well and good but results in people not having to take responsibility for their votes, and this one happens to be important in the here and now.

 

[Lore]

@Nabe again: I actually liked your analysis, and it put some ideas about roles in general in my head. Is there anything really that you would like me to comment on?

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

@Nabe: Ah, I see it now. I misread, sorry.

However, who in their right mind would not motivate? If anything else, motivating Circus again would give at least some info. I just don't see not motivating as a possibility.

Maybe it was a one-shot.

 

[Raziek]

Werekill, why Lynch Circus instead of Nabe?

NabeTown would confirm Circus as AT LEAST a non-hostile role. It'd also Confirm Ryu Town.

 

[Lore]

How can you say "lynch scum first, indy second", when the indy is a killing role? I don't understand how you could feasibly pass up something directly in front of you.

How can Circus be scum when Nabe hid behind him and is still alive? Hostile Indy or Mafia would get him killed, so Circus being mafia makes no sense.

I just could have sworn that someone said that was the game plan.

As for your second part, you should remember that Nabe could also be totally lying about his role.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

@Nabe again: I actually liked your analysis, and it put some ideas about roles in general in my head. Is there anything really that you would like me to comment on?

Is there anything you feel compelled to comment on? This is a situation where it doesn't work out if I'm telling you what I think is important. In general I want to hear "I agree with this" or the opposite w.r.t. specific logical lines or statements rather than a general agreement with the post, which means absolutely nothing in any context.

 

[Lore]

Werekill, why Lynch Circus instead of Nabe?

NabeTown would confirm Circus as AT LEAST a non-hostile role. It'd also Confirm Ryu Town.

Because lynching Circus seems like a better choice than killing a more useful pr? Or because I actually want to hit scum? Or maybe even because Nabe could be lying about his role? There's just a myriad of reasons.

@Nabe: It might have been a one shot, but it seems stupid to waste it N1 on a census guy.

 

[#HBC | Nabe]

@Raz:

Wait, what the ****? Do my eyes deceive me? Has Linear algebra actually blown my brain to pieces? Did J really.... I don't... what... BUH?!?

This reads like an entirely fake reaction, and the Linear Algebra mention made me think you were planning to gambit with me.

Eeewww...considering recent flips, I'm not liking Acro from that posted.

But like Raz said...did J just claim a scum role?

Ryu appeared to be doing the same.

I know, right? Pretty incriminating.

Playing along -- it's not incriminating at all, it very clearly looks like J was joking to Kuz.

Forgive me if it's just inexperience but what benefit would someone have in claiming a poisoner? Atm I really don't like it but as I said I want to see WK's claim.

This reaction is entirely unopportunistic from Inferno. He reads shallowly. If he were scum, he should've seen this as an opportunity to raise havoc.

Scumslip. Nobody said he claimed Indy, only that he claimed poisoner.

This isn't a scumslip. 99% of people would assume indy poisoner, and that you're basing your read on this is really really gross.

Good catch!!! I didn't even think of that.

Me playing along. Note the triple exclamation mark ala Spellcasters D1.

 

[Lore]

Is there anything you feel compelled to comment on? This is a situation where it doesn't work out if I'm telling you what I think is important. In general I want to hear "I agree with this" or the opposite w.r.t. specific logical lines or statements rather than a general agreement with the post, which means absolutely nothing in any context.

Then I shall fully comment tomorrow alongside my Circus reply.

I will say, however, that the analysis in general makes me like you more, but I'm seriously considering the possibility that you're a lying indy. For now, however, a null leaning town read will help my sanity for now.

You're still contradicting my read on Circus, though. This whole situation is confusing, to say the least.