[m-1, 14, 28] avril lavigne mafia - over

[Omni]

u think Tom investigated you even tho both him and Overswarm were completely fine with your lynch yesterDay?

 

[CT Chia]

Omni, I think you need to take a good read at your post history in this game so far. From an outside perspective, what would you think about yourself?

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Uh yes? Why wouldn't he?

If they were both suspicious of me then why wouldn't they want to investigate me to put an end to the debate?

Are you suggesting that both Tom and OS just wanted me out of the game regardless of alignment because I was unhelpful? Because that's not the vibe I got from them at all. If that were the case I could see where you're coming from (i.e. not wanting me in lylo or just being a lategame liability etc. warrants not investigating and just continuing to push for a lynch) but they both came off as just being suspicious and critical of my lackluster performance thus far. As such clearing me so they wouldn't have to worry about my admittedly likely distractingly bad play would be an attractive option to them.

 

[Omni]

im confused. also, dont start points with wifom

so you think that he investigated you, received town results, and both him and OS continued to go after your head?

i, personally, dont think tom would waste an investigation on an inactive player that was on the verge of getting lynched 2 days in a row. macman was also in the same boat. it'd be better to just have u guys lynched/modkilled and use investigations on players that are suspicious because of their behavior but could potentially be helpful to town. even if they got a clear on you, you'd still be an inactive liability for the most part

not sure what we can gain from this question in the first place. what were you trying to get at @ Marshy?

@chibo: wat? from an outside perspective i look like im town's most active inactive whiner. or i can be a very well blended in mafioso. why are u asking me this question

 

[CT Chia]

I find you being incredibly pushy (I can dig up plenty of examples if you'd like) and from past experiences with you matches up just peachy with your normal scum play in games. You say most active whiner, I say you're more loud and aggressive.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

not sure what we can gain from this question in the first place. what were you trying to get at @ Marshy?

i wanted to see if frozen would try to dance around stating who os/tom cleared but it looks like he misread toms flip or is at least giving off the appearance of doing so

i think they investigated zensei innocent which is why they were always defending him for no reason so he can live today

 

[Omni]

I find you being incredibly pushy (I can dig up plenty of examples if you'd like) and from past experiences with you matches up just peachy with your normal scum play in games. You say most active whiner, I say you're more loud and aggressive.

give me a direct example of a game where i am not loud and aggressive.

then tell me does that make me scummy or not.

idk what games u play but with me being loud and aggressive is not abnormal to my town play at all. ur gonna have to make a much bigger case if u want to find my faulty for having behavior that's extremely similar with whatever role i play.

 

[vanderzant]

Back from my holiday. What'd I miss? (rereading)

 

[vanderzant]

I'm unpacking and stuff but at a glance there hasn't been much talk, so I'll try and get this going in the morning.

But one thing I'm confused about is who people are saying Tom investigated, becauase there could only be 1 result I think???. Omni/Marshee when you're saying Tom cleared Zensei you mean just him right? Because there was talk about MarshEE being cleared, but from memory OS wanted Zensei to live for next to no reason, which severely bugged me, but makes sense as a bread crumb.

 

[vanderzant]

EBWOP: Oh shiz just read Day Cop. My bad. But I agree that the notion of MarshEE/Zen makes some sense.

 

[M.K]

give me a direct example of a game where i am not loud and aggressive.

Code Geass lol.

 

[Omni]

i wish mafia games had a courtesy dumb lynch that didnt force days into nights.

mk, for the umphteenth time i came in as a replacement 3/4's of the game with extremely minimal knowledge of the setup, no reads on the players, and complete ignorance to major events that occurred. stop proving my point about how useless you're being

 

[M.K]

Lol Omni stop preaching to me. I don't see you doing anything besides whininh about how useless we are. Oh and last time I checked, when you agree to replace in, you felt confident enough to do so. I don't consider you replacing in to be an excuse since all the data was outlined and easily understood in a reread

 

[Omni]

im not going to get in to it with you. im sure you know by now that i'm not the only want that shares consensus.

i replaced in because jungle said it was an interesting game. it wasn't. replacing in his a valid excuse because when you're not directly involved with the interactions it's like reading a book as a narrator as opposed to actually being one of the characters. the reads become much more different.

we're wasting time today. who do you guys want to push to claim/lynch?

 

[Omni]

*only one that shares that conesus

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

im confused. also, dont start points with wifom

so you think that he investigated you, received town results, and both him and OS continued to go after your head?

i, personally, dont think tom would waste an investigation on an inactive player that was on the verge of getting lynched 2 days in a row. macman was also in the same boat. it'd be better to just have u guys lynched/modkilled and use investigations on players that are suspicious because of their behavior but could potentially be helpful to town. even if they got a clear on you, you'd still be an inactive liability for the most part

not sure what we can gain from this question in the first place. what were you trying to get at @ Marshy?

@chibo: wat? from an outside perspective i look like im town's most active inactive whiner. or i can be a very well blended in mafioso. why are u asking me this question

I didn't start that with WIFOM at all. I asked why he wouldn't do something, I didn't suggest what he would or would not have probably done. Big difference. I simply explained why he would have reason to take a certain action, but did not assert the likelihood of that choice relative to contextual circumstance. All I did was show that that choice has EXISTING MOTIVATING CIRCUMSTANCES to it which would make it a logical option, but not necessarily the most likely one.

The big difference between the way you and I are looking at Tom's likely use of his clear is the prospect of that person being "potentially helpful to the town", in your own words. You, being the activity police and #1 anti-frozen talking head this game obviously do not see me as being of any potential use to the rest of the town this game, but that doesn't mean that Tom/OS would look at inactive frozen and automatically think I'd be completely useless for the game entirety. That is the assumption that your assertion rides on and it simply doesn't have any solid grounding outside of your perspective.

Also where exactly did Tom continue to go after my head after this post?

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=10863537#post10863537

Because after he came back from V/LA he suddenly drops me as a target and goes after a handful of other people trying to put a lynch through starting here: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=10873905#post10873905

So basically @ Marshy no I did not misread the flip though I see where you're coming from thinking that. I didn't properly explain/cite what Tom had done to make me think he had cleared me. Interesting point about Zensei though I'll need to go back and take a look at that.

 

[Steel]

Vanderzant (1) - MarshEE
Zensei (2) : Chibosempai, Nicholas1024
Not voting: Meta-Kirby, Omni, Zensei, frozenflame751, Vanderzant

Deadline is Friday August 20 at 11:59:59 pm est

 

[CT Chia]

Is Zensei's vote count correct?

 

[Steel]

ur moms correct

 

[Omni]

@Frozen: ok

@Chibo:

give me a direct example of a game where i am not loud and aggressive.

then tell me does that make me scummy or not.

idk what games u play but with me being loud and aggressive is not abnormal to my town play at all. ur gonna have to make a much bigger case if u want to find my faulty for having behavior that's extremely similar with whatever role i play.

 

[Xivii]

@Zensei, I wasn't comfortable with the other lynches, and Rockin was seemingly a good choice.

What about him made him a seemingly good choice to you?

@Zensei Who would you lynch RIGHT NOW if you were to die if they weren't scum?

Not sure what you mean "if you were to die and they weren't scum". What do you mean?

 

[vanderzant]

Rockin.

You're like the perfect middleground between Zensei and Vander.

Claim!

Omni care to elaborate on this? I'm a bit wtf, because after I go out and say I think Rockin is town, we lynch him.

Random thought on roles: Gravedigger (Nich) implies Tracker (???), Nurse (Frozen) implies Doctor (???) and we have a confirmed Day Cop + BP lover combo. Does this strike anyone else as off? To me this seems like too many power roles. So I think there might be scum amongst Nich and Frozen. Frozen still taking the cake as the better lynch choice.

we're wasting time today. who do you guys want to push to claim/lynch?

If we're not lynching Frozen, we should be lynching MK or maybe Chibo. MK for same reasons as yesterday and things others have said toDay. I still think Mac was a good lynch choice and if Chibo doesn't improve same goes for him.

@Nich: MarshEE asked you a question about me. So whaddya think?

@Frozen: Do you really think you were investigated? Right now I highly doubt that but I want to hear it from you.

@MarshEE: W.R.T my blabber about roles above, do you think doc/tracker should claim? (you mentioned something like this earlier but i dunno if it was sarcastic or not)

@Zensei: When/if MK flips scum who are his scum buddies?

 

[vanderzant]

Vote: Frozen

 

[Omni]

Rockin just played a very neutral, lurking townie game. He didn't seem to offer much and kinda sat on the sidelines like what Chibo is doing. He didn't fall directly under my scummy radar, but I wasn't comfortable condemning him as town. With Tom wanting to lynch him as well I liked the idea of Rockin dying a lot.

yea i kinda asked what people thought about doc claiming. i still want it. even still, assuming a doc role is in the game makes claiming nurse very safe but the idea of also being mayling the nurse kinda like mehs me cuz it sounds right. meta aside, i think we should get some claims going regardless

 

[vanderzant]

I guess I'm down with claims too.

 

[M.K]

Not sure what you mean "if you were to die and they weren't scum". What do you mean?

If you lynched somebody, and they flipped town, you would also be removed from the game. However, if they flipped scum, you would say in the game.
Hypothetical, of course.

 

[Nicholas1024]

@Nich: MarshEE asked you a question about me. So whaddya think?

I'm not sure on your alignment.

Actually, I'm sort of stalled out on this game right now. I'm in day 3, dealing with day 1 style information. I haven't agreed with either lynch, both of whom I was at least semi-comftorable with, and both of whom flipped town. Which leaves me with a pair of candidates that I want to lynch, but couldn't get lynched earlier, and am unlikely to be able to do so now.

I'm really sure there's scum between Zensei and Meta-kirby, and the little voting analysis I did does nothing to dissuade me from that idea. Still though, no push is generating for either wagon. (Or for that matter, for ANY wagon.)

As far as the role thing goes... I'm guessing said roles do exist. (Although it might be a watcher instead of a tracker). Simply because I KNOW I'm town, and I'm pretty sure frozen's town, so...

Anyway, I guess I'm ok with claims. Might liven up the game a little.

 

[Omni]

I want Chibo and MK to claim.

Or in reverse.

I want doc/watcher/tracker to claim.

 

[M.K]

Can we get an Omni thing going? I'm sure nobody thinks he's obscenely townie, and sorta just brushes off arguments with either "I'm not dealing with you", "you're wrong", or "nah".
Also I sorta feel like town at this point needs to take a step back and reevaluate the situation at hand, something Omni doesn't seem too thrilled about doing.
Also the fact that he's such a loud mouth, hasn't been night killed, and continues to be the most vocal sends flags. If he was hitting the correct points, or the correct people in his analysis, scum wouldve done away with him.

 

[Omni]

both me and marshy are huge doc targets. that's why im alive and tom is dead.

My responses are also lengthy and detailed. my responses to you have been the only exception. that's a bad point to make.

why am I not thrilled with town stepping back and reevaluating? where did this even come from? im happy as long as there is activity

being loud does not make me scummy.
being the most vocal does not make me scummy.
not being killed does not make me scummy.

and i don't know how to explain your last statement to you without teaching you about mafia again

 

[Omni]

an omni wagon isn't happening.

especially with the players we have remaining. mk, who do you think is scum? I don't understand your logic in regards to suspicious players

 

[CT Chia]

give me a direct example of a game where i am not loud and aggressive.

then tell me does that make me scummy or not.

idk what games u play but with me being loud and aggressive is not abnormal to my town play at all. ur gonna have to make a much bigger case if u want to find my faulty for having behavior that's extremely similar with whatever role i play.

A recent example that comes to mind that matches up with what I'm saying is your play in CT Mafia. I know I've seen you be more generally calm in the past more or less, would you mind refreshing me of what games you have been in?

 

[Omni]

what do you mean by calm?

i've been I uh ct, ff6, the ones in the LoD, and replacement for code geass. i think if anyone found my aggressive, loud behavior off it would have been pointed out by mac, Tom, or marshy.

U only used one example. is this just a hunch? because further speculation into my past games will only correct you so I'm wondering if u only derived this point from CT

weren't you in Bad idea mafia 2 with me? I can't remember.

 

[Xivii]

M-K thats a weird question. Why would I lynch someone if I knew they were town and I'd die as well? If you are asking who I think is the most hurtfull even if they are town, then I'd say Chibo. However I don't want to lynch just based off uselessness today, so if we were to lynch right now I would certainly push for you.

And you avoided my question again. You did this same exact stalling biz in Geass.

 

[Xivii]

I agree with Chibo and M-K claiming.

 

[CT Chia]

Yes I was, but that's kind of a :/ example seeing that you were hydra'd weren't you?

I mean like, none of this is enough of a case for me to solidify a lynch for you on, it's just some thing I'm noticing reading through the game.
I've generally found the more aggressive players to flip scum more often than cautious style players

As another thing to note, Zensei said this in the game earlier:

I haven't been able to find any mafia requiter on wiki..

does this mean they they would die during the night?

He doesn't know of anything Mafia Recruiter related... This was posted on July 24th in this thread.

Zensei is also in Taco Mafia, or should I say was. The game just ended the other day. I couldn't talk about the game indepth earlier since it was still going on, but now that it's over and I have the full details...

Zensei was a town role in that game. The mafia was a lone Mafia Mentor, a form of a mafia recruiter. There was a Night 0 in the game where the Mentor (Swiss) was able to recruit someone. On Night 0 Swiss had recruited Zensei successfully. This night 0 in Taco Mafia occured before this July 24th post in this thread, as NIght 0 in Taco Maf ended on July 9th. So by the time of making that post, Zensei obviously knows about some mafia having the power to recruit, and yet in this game he claims to not know about it? Why?

Yea, my vote stands...

 

[CT Chia]

My post was mega ninja'd by both of Zensei's posts. was typing it in class and then had a pop quiz.

 

[Omni]

I think mk made that argument earlier. I forgot Zenseis response

 

[CT Chia]

I mentioned it when I replaced into this game (or the start of the day idk whenever I started posting) and I didn't recall anyone mentioning MK talking about it. I couldn't go into full detail though until Taco Maf ended so I didn't reveal anything about the game. However it doesn't matter who brought it up, I'm just interested in Zensei's response because something obviously doesn't add up.

 

[M.K]

M-K thats a weird question. Why would I lynch someone if I knew they were town and I'd die as well? If you are asking who I think is the most hurtfull even if they are town, then I'd say Chibo. However I don't want to lynch just based off uselessness today, so if we were to lynch right now I would certainly push for you.

And you avoided my question again. You did this same exact stalling biz in Geass.

Wow, I've explained it like twice now and Frozen had no problem getting it the first time. >_>

I'm gonna try to make this very simple:

Who is the person that you would CHOOSE to DIE, that:

A) IF THEY WERE TOWN, you would die as well
B) IF THEY WERE SCUM, you would stay alive.

Basically, the person you are the MOST CONFIDENT lynching, because if they turned up town, you would die as well.
It's a hypothetical situation.

And I'll address questions tonight, I have to make posts throughout my school day and I can't address everything on my phone.