Q&A Link's Take Over - Q&A and General Link Discussion

[cjugs]

Yeah i have seen skler ledge cancel his hookshot sometimes its kind of neat.

 

[huMps]

try it for your self it's really not that hard.

skler - your the master of spacing the *** end of Link's nair. I'll be working on that.
Just watched your matches vs yedi's falco.
Do you recommend doing that against fox? Or is it possible to space it well enough to not get up-smafuked

 

[cjugs]

It's hard to use it in match. So you don't have to make contact? i guess that means the same steps just faster?
Is WD oos a option of getting out of being pillared or drilled? i think it's either roll spotdodge (BAD IDEA) WD light sheild. I don't understand skler were you saying beofre that jab reset to grab covers two options as in roll away or stand up i jab reset sometimes and it doesn't work

 

[Skler]

no, u dont have to land the attack and u can do it wit his nair n uair. bigy was showing me it, hes a falcon main who prolly has the best link in our state. he grab falco at 20% on yoshi's. uair twice with the platform cncl n then dair'd him

I've never witnessed uairs doing that, it isn't the fastest move in the world. Is there a vid of a Link doing it?

You can space nairs against Fox well enough that he can't just usmash you, but if he sees it coming you're going to eat usmash. I do suggest it against Fox though, just less often than against Falco.

WD OOS is too slow to be useful against pillaring and such. Usmash OOS is decent if you can find a hole in the pillar. Against waveshines just don't get stuck in your shield, Link has no good way to deal with waveshines on his shield.

 

[cjugs]

i've done it with uair and nair but never when i didn't hit anyone. idk what you guys are talking about over there by the way.

 

[cjugs]

playing ganon is sooooooooooo hard. three moves equals death or edguard and the chaingrabs god.... is pressuring ganon a good option because he has a low jump speed and almost no oos option.

 

[Skler]

Link can't keep up quite enough pressure on ganon. If you space moves on his shield you aren't fast enough, if you get too close in front of him you get shield grabbed and if you go behind him you get baired oos (or even upBed). If you're being crafty you might be able to sneak in a grab somewhere. I should try doing that against Ganon more.

 

[cjugs]

bair to grab is really easy, i have so much trouble just getting a attack in it sucks.

 

[huMps]

I just try to combo out of projectiles ,and grab, but I also have trouble with this match up.

 

[_KuyaSombreo_]

i was able to beat linguini at a recent FL tourney through:
-luck
-spacing wit bombs
-pulling a zair to upB edgeguard

 

[stabbedbyanipple]

Can link SH Bair waveland?

 

[huMps]

you betchya

 

[Scabe]

So despite 7 years having passed since Melee came out, is there still room to further progress Link's metagame?

 

[Skler]

There is, sort of. Spacing can always get better, use of the boomerang can always get better, silly platform crap can still get better.

Link's bair -> waveland is really hard to do. You have to DJ out of the bair into a waveland or something like that if I remember correctly.

Also, I played Linguini once. I was under the influence of alcohol at the time but I think we ended up going 2-2 or 1-2. That same night I found somebody who I didn't know was Dr. PP at the time. Never again on the night of a tournament shall I imbibe that vile liquid.

 

[Stos]

Wow, the population is decreasing :'(

 

[cjugs]

I don't think the move does not auto cancel it just has certain frames where it is still in lag but there are frames where you can jump out not airdodge i could be wrong but i'm prolly not, as far as bair dj waveland of course.
Idk there has yet to be a link with absolute perfect spacing and prolly wont be it's to hard because people can do different stuff to mess up your spacing so link is prolly maxed out.
I do however believe he is alot better than low tier

 

[cjugs]

Although you remember what happened in ocarina of time after seven years.......

 

[huMps]

competitive melee is weird. you would think that the low tier characters would be the characters progressing and trying to work themselves back into the scene but it's the total opposite. I think if Link were out there winning tourneys there would be more players trying harder to advance his meta-game. Because foxes and falcos have been at the top forever but there play seems to be advancing so often. I think the community likes to see that there character is capable of winning before they put in all the hours and effort into mastering and improving the character themselves. It's easier to improve a play style that already wins because all you have to do is improve upon whats already working. But with a losing character you have to figure out what the best players of your character are doing wrong and pretty much start from scratch in many aspects.

 

[Linguini]

yeah kuya i played you with jiggs, sheik, and ganon one match while extremely ****ed up haha

skler u looked mad fuked up at the time!!! hahaha

 

[Skler]

Playing you was awesome. We should do it again asap.

Name searcher!

 

[cjugs]

yeah kuya i played you with jiggs, sheik, and ganon one match while extremely ****ed up haha

skler u looked mad fuked up at the time!!! hahaha

noob you died no johns. I was curious as to how that happend, whats the advantage of being ****ed up at tournys? I always hear yeah man i was smoking or i was drinking why would you at a tourny does that help?

 

[Stos]

Drunk players will be harder to predict since their train of thought is tweaked lmaao.

 

[cjugs]

Maybe mango is hammered at every tourny then.

 

[Skler]

Drunk players will be harder to predict since their train of thought is tweaked lmaao.

Harder to predict, but **** does L canceling get hard after the sixth shot.

Edit: Linguini, you should have come into our room that night. We had mad zenka up in there. Just be happy you didn't see me the next night. <dies>

Ask Canada.

 

[cjugs]

Is there a way to get alllllllllot of frame data on link? If so i'm going to need some of that.

 

[Skler]

There is!

http://pubpages.unh.edu/~stp27/smash/link.htm

Yes, that is Pine's SSBM data site.

 

[cjugs]

Wow i'm in over my head.
So basically we need to find link's jab and we need to see if he can jab to grab before the other character can do anything, and sorry to be asking so many questions but where do we find out how much stun link goes in?

 

[Skler]

There's no data for stun times since it depends on factors other than the attack itself. There's shield stun info, but the jab doesn't produce enough (as the earliest frame it can be canceled is 12 frames after the hitbox already ended). I've looked at all of Link's moves, the only one that produces enough stun to grab out of it is the dair. You can cancel the dair lag by catching a boomerang, cancel the boomerang catch animation with your shield and cancel the shield by grabbing.

Too bad that situation never really happens

 

[HiIH]

Whoa when the heck did we get this?
Too cash.

 

[cjugs]

By being geniuses, what about if they don't have they're shield on does the 1st or second jab stun then enough to grab you think? or at least make it close? skler what do you think about upairs into shields? i tried it and it seems like i get shield grabbed every time i guess it's a myth that you can do that into a shield and not get grabbed? when's the next tourny you are going to?

 

[HiIH]

yeah man, ifyou uair into shields, you're gonna have to land behind them, and youxre still gonna get punished. Like the only characters who can really dothings into shields are the top tier characters, and then they have to follow it up with jabs. Like the only way I hit people's shields are with my fh nairs and then dj out of it.

 

[dablackpacman]

iight guys back, have been MIA fo a lil while with work n everythin. havent rlly had time to invite anyone over for smash since i seen bigy doin the platform (not ledge) cncls. skler i dont think theres any vids, but next time i meet up with them, ill recored it n upload on here. i havent had the chance to try n practice it yet but im havin a smashfest this weds so ima try n be on it then

 

[cjugs]

do you every play as any other chars? I'm tryna get my fox going but after i play him i end up messing up everyyything as link it's sad advice? other than just practice more?

 

[Skler]

By being geniuses, what about if they don't have they're shield on does the 1st or second jab stun then enough to grab you think? or at least make it close? skler what do you think about upairs into shields? i tried it and it seems like i get shield grabbed every time i guess it's a myth that you can do that into a shield and not get grabbed? when's the next tourny you are going to?

Uair into shield shieldstabs a crazy amount of the time against Marth, DK and Falco (when his shield is weakened at all). It doesn't do enough stun to prevent a SG unless you land behind them, and even then they can generally bair you OOS.

People need to figure out how to dair into shields, catch a boomerang and cancel that into a grab. It's so sexy. I've also never done it in an actual match.

Link's jab doesn't stun enough to grab, but it can lift floatier characters off the ground so if they don't DJ immediately you can catch them during their landing lag.

 

[cjugs]

Are you sure, because link's sword stays out and doesn't hit the shield until he lands on the ground i saw legan do this to peef back when he mained falcon you're probably right though, i'll play around with it again just in case ok if anyone gets it recorded of canceling the dair into a should and grab GET IT RECORDED SO WE CAN ALL WATCH IT AGREED? But seriously if it was to be tried what is the best way maybe if the rang misses someone and then when it comes back? There also wasn't any data on links grab but i guess it's always like 13 frames something like that?

 

[Skler]

The dair provides just enough shield stun to allow a grab if you do everything with the boomerang frame perfect. I actually practiced it for a while just for ****s and giggles about a year back. It is definitely possible, it's just that the situation will never come up

 

[huMps]

I have pretty much thrown Link's second jab out of my game. It seems useless too me. If I land the first they usually DI away so the second misses anyway. Then I get ****ed. Even when I shield pressure I just space the first jab or go all three and poke a *****. jab-grab, jab-D-tilt, jab U-tilt, jab up-B, jab retreat to projectile. I find no use for Link's second jab. what you guys think?

 

[dablackpacman]

Link's jab doesn't stun enough to grab, but it can lift floatier characters off the ground so if they don't DJ immediately you can catch them during their landing lag.

i'll co-sign that. with amateurs for practice, ive ben able to jab grab a lot. but on a pro-level i have yet to be able to jab-grab falcon or fox before the get away. sped it up as fast as i can, but i eventually do 3 jabs or ftilt if i mess up

 

[Skler]

I find no use for Link's second jab. what you guys think?

Link's second jab is involved in my edgeguards if I mistime my first jab vs a firefox or something. I also use it to get into Link's hilariously effective rapid jab against shields or near walls against Falcon/Marth/Falco (this is actually effective in tournament as I have now done it on three separate occasions against good players).

The thrust is also pretty useful as a damage builder at lower percents against fast fallers (before jab dsmash works) and the second jab leads into that! As a single attack Link's second jab is captain of the failboat.

 

[dablackpacman]

i use the 2nd jab wen doin an infinity wit my teammate lol. i need major falcon advice. aftr playin bigy, shady and juggleguy's falcons, he is my biggest prob. they are better then me, but they kno better to use falco, sheik or marth. im sure a big part was that i was teching to quickly n not doin full jump nairs. but they pressured so much that it was hard for me to get anything going