KSSU: Revenge of Meta Knight Mafia - Game Over! Has Dreamland been conquered!?

[Tandora]

Says he thinks Gova is gonna mod confirm the message. In case Gova doesn't Kuz says it is from Kuz.

Tells me he picked me over Gheb because he doesn't trust Gheb regardless of faction because even if Gheb is town aligned, Kuz fears Gheb won't pull his head out of his *** and will not respond. Also, he trusts that I am town and knows we've worked well together in the past. Finally, Scum was told Gheb was the target, so it is less likely to be intercepted or redirected.

Shows me the same breadcrumb he posted in thread.

Says he did a reread and discusses his feelings about J. Bascially the fight between J and Gheb felt too personal on J's behalf and J's general attitude is not that of a scumJ. Kuz said he was tunneling until he was willing to take a step back and reevaluate. Primarily J not pushing for Kuz's lynch when Kuz was at L-1 so close to deadline was a factor.

Zen is town because of how he reacted to J and Gheb and Kuz's request to look at J and Gheb when Kuz thought he was the lynch.

Kuz thinks JTB is town, but lazy and not involved in the game.

He's suspicous of Tiger because his activity tapered off.

HL is suspicious because unreadable.

Gheb is suspicious because of his tunneling of Kuz which reminds him of Dissidia where Gheb focused on one post early game. Gheb has mostly coasted by agreeing with Zen. Gheb's activity mostly spiked when J said he may bring a case up on Gheb.

Discusses who he may target on N2. I won't say who, but I agree with his choice.

Says his claim in thread is completely true and restates it for me.

Says he understands if I have my doubts about his claim and I don't have to reply if I'm uncomfortable. Only share with him what I feel comfortable. Only keep in mind I have only one message and it is unlikely he will get to contact me again.

Then he signed it Your Husbando.

Why do I think Kuz is town from this letter?
1) I've done a lot of mason style play with him and this follows his town train of thought. It is a matter of knowing someone well.
2) It's extemely affectionate in the manner of two people sharing an inside joke.
3) He says he was wrong. Admitting he was tunneling on J and it was wrong is a town move.

 

[Xivii]

Kooz what leads you to believe JTB is lazy town over lurking scum?
What about my reaction to your request makes me town?
What about your claim do you think Tandora could have still doubted if you had just proven it to her?

Tandora what specifically follows Koozes town train of thought? How does being affectionate make somone town? You do realize affection can be easily faked?

 

[Hard Lemonade]

Admitting he was wrong isn't a town tell. Being affectionate is surely not a town tell. Back to being distracted.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Man, these are horrible reads wtf. J is the only one he even offered some insight as to how he came to hiss conclusions. The rest is shallow 0815 reasoning and in no way implies pro-town intentions or sincerity. Admitting to be wrong is pro-town now? What? That's a textbook example of a null-tell if anything.
You say he sent it to you because you're more likely to cooperate with him. But you're also a lot easier for him to manipulate than I am. Don't you think it's feasible to assume that this fact helped him a bit making that decision?
And his actions look more like him trying to *look* pro-town the more I think about the situation. Just because you keep on insisting on your town read on him I get the feeling that this was exactly his intention - because him looking townie to you is apparently more important than following a simple plan that in the worst case would've helped us just as much but potentially could've confirmed scum.

 

[#HBC | J]

Before I go, Tanny, after reading what Kuzi has had to say from you I'm more inclined to call him scum and you are being manipulated hard and it seems to be his jokes that is making you believe him more.

Vote: th3kuzinator

I'm leaving this here while I'm away but I'm gonna think about this more. I don't like what Kuzi has done at all and I have to take meta out of the equation. The only thing that saved him was his claim and then he went against town direct orders and I can see why he picked Tanny over Gheb for more then just the BS reasons he gave against Gheb.

 

[#HBC | J]

You're telling me, you asked him to go first for absolutely no reason?

Yup and that's the jist of it.

 

[#HBC | J]

Kuz thinks JTB is town, but lazy and not involved in the game.

He's suspicous of Tiger because his activity tapered off.

HL is suspicious because unreadable.

Scum-buddy lies within these three when Kuzi flips scum.

 

[Tandora]

I give up.

When even J says I'm only being manipulated, then I don't need to be playing this game. I'm a waste of player slot.

REQUEST TO BE REPLACED

 

[#HBC | J]

Tanny, stop.

You know what I'm talking about w.r.t. Kuzi. You two are good game buddies both in and out. However I don't put it past him to choose you to AtE and try and convince you since you are possibly his only outing. I think he choose you because he was afraid Gheb wouldn't believe him after the message but you would.

Basically in the end, I think he choose you because you were his last choice as a person that would believe him. Manipulated is a strong word so I guess tricked would be a better word.

 

[#HBC | J]

I also find his reasoning for people are pretty terrible as well and something he said to you makes me think I know exactly what he was trying to do to you.

Says his claim in thread is completely true and restates it for me.

Says he understands if I have my doubts about his claim and I don't have to reply if I'm uncomfortable. Only share with him what I feel comfortable. Only keep in mind I have only one message and it is unlikely he will get to contact me again.

Why does he have to restate his claim for you? Why did he try and make sure you knew it was him? Why did he re-bring up his quotes to you? Why did he AtE to you saying "If you feel uncomfortable you don't have to reply and I know your skeptical."? Why is his reasoning for choosing Tanny>Gheb so poor and shallow? Why are his reads so shallow? Why did he think to mention his N2 choice to you, what benefit does that have besides buddying you?

These aren't directed at you Tanny, but they are questions that are going into my mind reading his letter sent to you and it bugs me.

 

[Hard Lemonade]

I also find his reasoning for people are pretty terrible as well and something he said to you makes me think I know exactly what he was trying to do to you.



Why does he have to restate his claim for you? Why did he try and make sure you knew it was him? Why did he re-bring up his quotes to you? Why did he AtE to you saying "If you feel uncomfortable you don't have to reply and I know your skeptical."? Why is his reasoning for choosing Tanny>Gheb so poor and shallow? Why are his reads so shallow? Why did he think to mention his N2 choice to you, what benefit does that have besides buddying you?

These aren't directed at you Tanny, but they are questions that are going into my mind reading his letter sent to you and it bugs me.

Eh, nulls abound. That AtE **** is no better than a null tell, look at the beginning of the game.

@Tandora - That's how the game is played. You continue trying to maneuver others into doing what you want done. There should be no hard feelings about someone playing you or someone pointing out that they think you've been played. Stick to your read if you must, but don't replace out because people are saying you're the victim of one of the major tenants of the game.

Reserving my post until I've read what Zen posted for me. V/LA today for a smashfest.

 

[Hard Lemonade]

EBWOP: Reserving my vote on Kuz. It's probably coming. You can halt the wagon and wait on me if you want.

 

[JTB]

commencement day, pretty much v/la until tomorrow

 

[Xivii]

JTB why are you in this game if you don't care about it? Honestly I don't understand why people join games knowing how inactive they will be.


Unvote; Vote: Tiger

Tiger tell me your thoughts on Koozes message. Do you think it points more towards him being scum or town and why? Also what are your reads on Tandora and JTB?

 

[JTB]

Posting on my phone to show that I do care about this game

I disagree with kuz view on the gheb/j debate. Iirc, joey/j pulled the same thing in dkr to distance themselves before the game started and that was a personal argument too.

Saying the mod is going confirm the message is odd, usually mods don't confirm the use of a pr publically.

 

[JTB]

Also, I don't understand why he needed to restate that his claim was true, the fact that tandora receieved the message should be evidence.

Tandora, can you elaborate more on that?

 

[#HBC | J]

I get the feeling JTB's trying to keep all avenues open for a lynch.

FoS: JTB

@Zen: Tiger's V/LA iirc.

 

[#HBC | J]

I'm going to be a bit brusque. We can't keep Kuzi alive anymore. He is too much of a liability especially if he makes it into MYLO or LYLO because he is untrustable. To myself, he has lost all credibility or believablity. The only reason we are keeping him alive is because he claimed a PR. Does this excuse him from all the scummy behaviour especially since the role is not telling of alignment? Also I cannot stress this point because this is the major selling point for me on Kuzi. He lied for his own benefit and not for town's benefit. It would have been more beneficial to message Gheb and listen to what a majority of the town agreed upon instead of doing what he wanted. If we keep him around, who's to say he won't do this again? He's lied, he's played scummy as all else, and there is actually no reason to keep him around besides the scare of losing a PR.

Kuzi needs to die. It is, by far, the most beneficial lynch out of anyone. Can anyone honestly tell me there is something that is more deserving of the lynch based on actual material besides inactivity? Is there someone scummier? Is there someone who has lied more? Seriously, tell me who and I will move my vote to them. Unless you can come up with an answer, I must urge we lynch Kuzi.

 

[th3kuzinator]

Computer still in the shop and I forgot to charge my phone for a few days.

The problem was bigger than they thought and they needed to weekend to work on it. Should be ready by tomorrow or Tuesday at the latest.

 

[#HBC | J]

Zen, you've been all over the place with your vote as of late. Who do you actually think is scum? I'd like 2 names.

Also I really don't think Tiger is scum personally.

 

[Xivii]

You're capable of answering that question yourself by reading my posts.

 

[#HBC | J]

You're capable of answering that question yourself by reading my posts.

Simple question yet you must make it so difficult. You have said Kuzi is scum but you want to lynch one of JTB/Tiger based on inactivity but not because you find them scummy. That's not two names as to who you think is scummy, it's 1 max.

If I thought I knew based on actually reading your posts, then I wouldn't have asked.

So please answer the question. I'd like 2 scum-picks from you and a little reasoning would be nice.

 

[#HBC | J]

V/LA for a day or two.

I need a serious break.

In the quote please.

 

[Xivii]

Tiger is currently my second pick for the reasoning posted in my #526 and the fact that he responded by changing my argument and then when I restated what I was saying in my 547, he just ignored defending against the accusation all together. His supposed soft claim says nothing to me.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Veto Tandora's replacement request
Request Votecount

I get the feeling JTB's trying to keep all avenues open for a lynch.

FoS: JTB

Eh, I don't see how that's the case. Especially since you said that right after his double post, where he took quite a clear stance on not trusting Kuz in regards to the J-Gheb argument. And even if he did keep other avenues open I wouldn't consider it suspect now that a lot of people are suspecting Kuz and the whole discussion is going kind of one-sided.

The problem I currently have is the astounding lack of logic behind the people who agree with Kuz' logic. This is mainly in regards to Tanny [who is taking the emotional approach] and Tiger [who doesn't justify his logic to begin with]. If Kuz flipped scum I'd honestly have no idea what to do with them because logic just SCREAMS that one of them must be scum but I'm afraid I can legit see them being this wrong. And if Kuz flips town he has really not given us a lot to work with at all.

 

[#HBC | J]

Veto Tanny's Replacement Request

See thing is I really really don't think Tiger is scum. Especially if putting it between JTB/Tiger. JTB looks alot scummier then Tiger.

 

[Gova]

 

[Hard Lemonade]

Koozes sudden thought to rethink J is out of place here. His reasoning was because J unvoted him, yet J had been unvoting him through out the game and had even given up on Scum Kooz for a long while so why would this be different. Kooz had been tunneling J all game and had a strong scum read on him. Yet he suddenly rethinks it at this point because he didn't see reason why scum J would have unvoted. There was clear motive for why scum J would have unvoted as I pointed out in that post above. Kooz ignored this despite his supposed strong scum read on J. His switch here doesn't look legitimate to me.

Finally read your explanation and I want to know why people aren't lynching Kuz. The only problem I have is with the above quote. It's fairly obvious that Kuz was talking about the particular instance close to deadline when he was almost lynched, not throughout the game.

 

[Hard Lemonade]

EBWOP:

Vote Kuz

 

[Xivii]

Yes, but Scum J had motive to unvote as I pointed out. J unvoting shouldn't have made Koozes strong scum read of J to come to a wall all the sudden.

I want Tiger to post before the day ends. So far we only have 4 votes. We need one of JTB and Tiger to vote for Kooz for a lynch.

 

[Xivii]

HL which of you has been posting during this phase? Ryker, yes?

@mod: Is Tandora being replaced?

 

[Hard Lemonade]

I've done almost all the posting this game. I have talked with Adumb and EE some about it, but yeah, mostly me. I seem to be getting that a lot.

 

[Xivii]

Who do you think we should look at after Kooz flips scum?

 

[Radical Fiction]

Town flip: Tandora and J

Scum flip: Tiger

 

[JTB]

request replacement

sorry guys, my interest in mafia right now is at an all time low and someone else could be doing much more than me

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Town flip: Tandora and J

Scum flip: Tiger

You don't seem to take much note of JTB. Any reason for you to be indifferent here? How is a Kuz scum flips worse for Tiger than for JTB?

 

[Tandora]

I'm going to try to stay in the game. Given it a lot of thought last couple of days, I feel my request to replace out was a result of me reacting poorly to the game because of mostly out of game reasons. In all fairness, I am generally not having fun with mafia, so maybe I need another break, but I want to finish this out. I've never requested a replacement before, so please understand I was pretty pissed.

 

[Tandora]

As far as Kuz goes, I truly hope he's town. However, I don't like how he's fallen off the face of the earth for D2. It's possible his johns are legit regardless of alignment, but frankly he can defend himself for his actions. I don't know if ultimately he chose me because I was trustworthy or easy to fool, but that's for him to defend, not me.

J, you say Kuz could be manipulating me with buddying me with affectionate tones. Haven't you done the same thing all game? Why should I trust you and not him?

 

[#HBC | J]

J, you say Kuz could be manipulating me with buddying me with affectionate tones. Haven't you done the same thing all game? Why should I trust you and not him?

I'm not manipulating you though or trying to, I mean I guess it's to the eye of the beholder though. Also one big reason to trust me over him is I haven't lied to the entire town to go to you.

But you should know that you shouldn't trust anyone whatsoever unless they are mod-confirmed to you. Otherwise, everything's in the air. Just like I trusted you to save me in DnD and look where that ended up haha.

Tanny, ask yourself this. Was it truly the best choice for town for him to choose you over Gheb? Was it better for him to go on his own will for the reasons he has said?

Also what is your opinion on Zen? Out of Tiger/JTB, who's the better pick for a lynch?

 

[#HBC | J]

Great. I had a pretty important question for JTB but now he's gone.

Also I don't get why people are voting people they aren't even pushing really.

Post lynch: Kuzi=town, Zen would be the person I'd look at and JTB still.